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Old 08-29-2011, 01:05 AM
Maze513 Maze513 is offline
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Give them all the title "Cheater" so when they return we will always know their shame
  #2  
Old 08-29-2011, 11:21 AM
stormlord stormlord is offline
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Originally Posted by Maze513 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Give them all the title "Cheater" so when they return we will always know their shame
+1.

I agree. Put a cheaper tag on their name like "CHTR Bob Smith [Orios]".

Or release the names of the characters on their account.

This way people know who they're and if they make other accounts they will be recognized.

Every single one of these guys/gals knew that they were taking a chance when they were running MQ2 or whatever it was. They did it for the thrill and the potential for an advantage in their game. IF we don't properly apply justice to the matter then it will encourage them to take an even bigger risk. Remember, life to these people is about risk. Lots. If there's no BITE then there's no risk. Therefore, with no risk, there's no fun. They will increase the stakes if the bite is too small. Increasing the stakes will increase the risks for them, and US.

But more important than that, they must know that their actions harm ALL OF US. That's the heart of the matter and it's the current approach some people take to dealing with cheaters. Let me just say to them: you harmed game balance. Game balance is at the core of all games. It ensures that progression and competition are present. It's kind of like a basketball hoop being 10 feet up. That's the game of basketball. But what if each person that plays can make the hoop be at whatever height they want when they take a shot? Every shot in the game would take a minute because they'd have to readjust the height of the hoop for each player. The game would be a lot less competitive because everyone would be playing by different rules. It would be a very different game, one in which everyone can win. Let me ask you: how can a game be competitive and also allow everyone to win? Furthermore, progression is a defining characteristic of games. If you're able break the rules then that means you can skip progression altogether. Your ability to skip progression, via the economy, allows others to skip it as well. This is like a shock wave that spreads all across the game world. Eventually, progression would become zero as the economy is filled with loot that was acquired illicitly. If you could skip from level 1 to 60, then I ask you, where is hte progression? Because that's essentially what cheaters are doing to the game. If there's no 1 to 60 then there's no game! Do you get it yet? You're destroying the game.

By destroying the game, you're reducing the fun you can have in it because you're inevitably eating away at the player base. This reminds me of pvp servers. They have a similar mentality. They think they can remorsely kill each other and that there will be an eternal flow of players to the server. Unfortunately, their careless behavior inevitably adds to server decline in much the same way that hacking or cheating can ruin the core elements of a game and contribute to its eventual decay. When a game decays, YOU will decay too, along with it! There's no thrill or risk when a game is almost dead. That's like winning a match with nobody to cheer.

My guess is a lot of the cheaters are sociopaths/psychopaths or anti-socials. If you research these terms on google you will see what they actually mean. No, psychopath is not a crazy genocidal murderer. Neither is an anti-social a shy person. Rather, these people are smooth criminals that have no shame or guilt when they cheat or lie or steal. The true meaning of anti-social is that of a person whom breaks the social rules and trust without remorse. A pscyhopath can be a serial killer just as much as he can be a kingpin or a car salesman.

Learn more here:
http://www.hare.org/links/saturday.html

It will open your eyes to more than you might have bargained for.

Here are my two favorite sections in the link:
Quote:
It's also found practical applications in police-squad rooms. Soon after he delivered a keynote speech at a conference for homicide detectives and prosecuting attorneys in Seattle three years ago, Hare got a letter thanking him for helping solve a series of homicides. The police had a suspect nailed for a couple of murders, but believed he was responsible for others. They were using the usual strategy to get a confession, telling him, 'Think how much better you'll feel, think of the families left behind,' and so on. After they'd heard Hare speak they realized they were dealing with a psychopath, someone who could feel neither guilt nor sorrow. They changed their interrogation tactic to, "So you murdered a couple of prostitutes. That's minor-league compared to Bundy or Gacy." The appeal to the psychopath's grandiosity worked. He didn't just confess to his other crimes, he bragged about them.

The most startling finding to emerge from Hare's work is that the popular image of the psychopath as a remorseless, smiling killer -- Paul Bernardo, Clifford Olson, John Wayne Gacy -- while not wrong, is incomplete. Yes, almost all serial killers, and most of Canada's dangerous offenders, are psychopaths, but violent criminals are just a tiny fraction of the psychopaths around us. Hare estimates that 1 percent of the population -- 300,000 people in Canada -- are psychopaths.
.................
Hare has co-developed a new treatment program specifically for violent psychopaths, using what he knows about the psychopathic personality. The idea is to encourage them to be better by appealing not to their (non-existent) altruism but to their (abundant) self-interest.

"It's not designed to change personality, but to modify behaviour by, among other things, convincing them that there are ways they can get what they want without harming others," Hare explains. The program will try to make them understand that violence is bad, not for society, but for the psychopath himself. (Look where it got you: jail.) A similar program will soon be put in place for psychopathic offenders in the UK.
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Last edited by stormlord; 08-29-2011 at 12:06 PM..
  #3  
Old 08-29-2011, 12:53 PM
superapan superapan is offline
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Originally Posted by stormlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
McCarthyism
This was top dollar read. Who are the psychopaths again?
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  #4  
Old 08-29-2011, 02:00 PM
Runningfish Runningfish is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stormlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
+1.

My guess is a lot of the cheaters are sociopaths/psychopaths or anti-socials. If you research these terms on google you will see what they actually mean. No, psychopath is not a crazy genocidal murderer. Neither is an anti-social a shy person. Rather, these people are smooth criminals that have no shame or guilt when they cheat or lie or steal. The true meaning of anti-social is that of a person whom breaks the social rules and trust without remorse. A pscyhopath can be a serial killer just as much as he can be a kingpin or a car salesman.

Learn more here:
http://www.hare.org/links/saturday.html

It will open your eyes to more than you might have bargained for.

Here are my two favorite sections in the link:
So the guy who just wanted Ultravision/EB is now a psychopath/sociopath or anti-social. Yes that makes perfect sense!

Another misconception that you all seem to have is that all of these cheaters were equipped with the same tools. Most public releases of MQ for P99 did not include tracking/warping/showing mobs on map/the other actually powerful stuff. Most of them just had the things that were less likely to get you caught. The actual number of the people that had warping/tracking ect is probably much smaller than the 365 who were banned.

A lot of these people were probably working class dudes like you or I. Possibly parents without much time for the game who wanted to make it more convenient. I can understand being mad but calling them ALL psychopaths, sociopaths, or antisocial freaks is a bit dramatic. I'm sure we have some of those people on both sides of this argument.
  #5  
Old 08-29-2011, 02:15 PM
vinx vinx is offline
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Originally Posted by superapan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
This was top dollar read. Who are the psychopaths again?
FEAVERHEADS!
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Originally Posted by Runningfish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I can understand being mad but calling them ALL psychopaths, sociopaths, or antisocial freaks is a bit dramatic. I'm sure we have some of those people on both sides of this argument.
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  #6  
Old 08-29-2011, 03:55 PM
Atmas Atmas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runningfish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
So the guy who just wanted Ultravision/EB is now a psychopath/sociopath or anti-social. Yes that makes perfect sense!

Another misconception that you all seem to have is that all of these cheaters were equipped with the same tools. Most public releases of MQ for P99 did not include tracking/warping/showing mobs on map/the other actually powerful stuff. Most of them just had the things that were less likely to get you caught. The actual number of the people that had warping/tracking ect is probably much smaller than the 365 who were banned.

A lot of these people were probably working class dudes like you or I. Possibly parents without much time for the game who wanted to make it more convenient. I can understand being mad but calling them ALL psychopaths, sociopaths, or antisocial freaks is a bit dramatic. I'm sure we have some of those people on both sides of this argument.
Some of the comments about the cheaters is excessive but I really don't have sympathy for them.

I'm a working class guy with kids and when I wanted an EB item I camped Hadden. Took me about 12 kills to get it and it was pretty disruptive to my sleep schedule, which is already impaired by young children. I'm not complaining about the time I put in cause it was my decision but you got people getting a pretty unfair advantage that is easily translatable into 3.5k plat or several hours just for that one particular hack.

I really started on this server after Kunark launched but still had some hope to make the cash to buy a manastone in future. Just over the course of about the last month the price on it has risen by about 50k and I can't help but wonder if the price has been driven up by the quick cash made/saved by a few people benefiting from external means.
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