Iksar Shaman - Solo Challenges?

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Averages are how this game works.

Wait a second... you just told me that averages were meaningless and my calculation of expected values didn't make sense!

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You lose a debate when you realize you cannot rebut points made, and thus must resort to insults, lies, and trolls in an attempt to win through underhanded methods.

Indeed.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait a second... you just told me that averages were meaningless and my calculation of expected values didn't make sense!

This is a poor attempt at a troll. It shows you are grasping for straws.

The reason why you do not average out the damage that FSI prevents is because we are talking about a specific time period during individual fights, not overall damage prevented in an hour. We were discussing the first 17 seconds of a fight when the mob has not been slowed yet.

FSI prevents hundreds of damage when it triggers within the first 17 seconds of an encounter when the mob has not yet been slowed. Conversely, Troll/Iksar Regeneration will always provide 24 HP in the same timeframe of 17 seconds.

You essentially tried to pull a fast one and average out FSI's damage across an hour to make it seem similar to what you get from Regeneration in 17 seconds lol. It was very sad to see.

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You essentially tried to pull a fast one and average out FSI's damage across an hour to make it seem similar to what you get from Regeneration in 17 seconds lol. It was very sad to see.

The expected damage mitigated by FSI in the first 17 (pre-slowed) seconds is 23, according to the calculations I posted (using numbers you provided). You're welcome to contest those calculations; there's several areas of wiggle room I can identify. But you have yet to do so.

I honestly did not expect it to come out exactly one less damage than regen does in the same period. That was pure coincidence. But it does bring a smile to my face.

 

I still think Ogre is probably the best choice if the most important aspect of gameplay you care about is endgame soloing

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The expected damage mitigated by FSI in the first 17 (pre-slowed) seconds is 23, according to the calculations I posted (using numbers you provided). You're welcome to contest those calculations; there's several areas of wiggle room I can identify. But you have yet to do so.

I honestly did not expect it to come out exactly one less damage than regen does in the same period. That was pure coincidence. But it does bring a smile to my face.

I just said why this incorrect. You are basically taking the average damage FSI reduces in an hour when taking into account the 8.5% trigger rate per fight, and then comparing it to an individual fight where FSI actually triggered. That is clearly incorrect. That is like saying Ice Spear of Solist only does 78 damage when you cast it in an individual fight, because spamming that spell over an hour is only 13 DPS. Icy Spear of Solist still does 1200 damage to an individual monster, even if the average spam DPS is 13. This is why Wizard nukes are still useful. Their average DPS is low, but they can kill an individual mob quickly.

The same logic with Wizard nukes applies to FSI. You aren't worried about the average damage that FSI reduces over an hour. You specifically want FSI's ability to reduce hundreds of points of damage within a short time period when it does trigger in an individual encounter.

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The expected damage mitigated by FSI in the first 17 (pre-slowed) seconds is 23, according to the calculations I posted (using numbers you provided). You're welcome to contest those calculations; there's several areas of wiggle room I can identify. But you have yet to do so.

I honestly did not expect it to come out exactly one less damage than regen does in the same period. That was pure coincidence. But it does bring a smile to my face.

 

I still think Ogre is probably the best choice if the most important aspect of gameplay you care about is endgame soloing

I don’t think FSI is about mitigation anyway - opposite to you I’m a little surprised the calculated average benefit is so high. My perception of FSI value is the benefit it provides at the extreme end of the normal - where that bash stun initiates a sequence of catastrophic failure. Obviously, by definition, that is more of a fringe occurrence, but for someone who is failure adverse (perhaps they like to kill rare, highly competed mobs - something OP wonders whether lacking JBB may make a difference) that may be a decisive benefit. For me, someone who likes to deal with the spice of things going a bit pete tong from time to time it’s not very enticing.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My perception of FSI value is the benefit it provides at the extreme end of the normal - where that bash stun initiates a sequence of catastrophic failure. Obviously, by definition, that is more of a fringe occurrence, but for someone who is failure adverse (perhaps they like to kill rare, highly competed mobs - something OP wonders whether lacking JBB may make a difference) that may be a decisive benefit. For me, someone who likes to deal with the spice of things going a bit pete tong from time to time it’s not very enticing.

I literally do not think this could be said better.

Pras

To bcbrown: thanks again on a lot of fronts:

-Thanks for doing all that math.
-Thank you for the detailed discussion.
-Thank you for ensuring your target audience was following your logical steps between posts.
-Thank you for the valiant effort to lead your target audience by the nose to the mathematical results for his hand picked, worst case scenario npc encounter
-thank you most of all for demonstrating overwhelming restraint and an abundance of maturity when your target audience bit your finger while you led him (by the nose) to the inevitable conclusion that upset him

Do you work in higher education (undergrad, masters or doctoral level)? You carry yourself like a seasoned professor that is perhaps overly patient.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I literally do not think this could be said better.

Pras

To bcbrown: thanks again on a lot of fronts:

-Thanks for doing all that math.
-Thank you for the detailed discussion.
-Thank you for ensuring your target audience was following your logical steps between posts.
-Thank you for the valiant effort to lead your target audience by the nose to the mathematical results for his hand picked, worst case scenario npc encounter
-thank you most of all for demonstrating overwhelming restraint and an abundance of maturity when your target audience bit your finger while you led him (by the nose) to the inevitable conclusion that upset him

Do you work in higher education (undergrad, masters or doctoral level)? You carry yourself like a seasoned professor that is perhaps overly patient.

BcBrown has proven himself to be a troll at this point unfortunately. It's been obvious for a while now. There are a few easy giveaways. The first is his signature. No normal poster changes their signature simply to reference a discussion they thought they won.

Second was when he admitted to trolling in another thread. This shows his willingness to do so, and will not admit it unless called out.

Third, his math is not actually impressive, as he makes mistakes often. His tactic is to use math terms that most people don't know in an attempt to impress.

His latest mistake is trying to compare averages of different timescale. You do not use a hourly average of DPS to look at the benefit of wizard nukes, for example. Average DPS of spamming Icy Spear of Solist is 80 in a minute. Average DPS of the same spell over an hour is 13. You cannot directly compare the two.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

BcBrown has proven himself to be a troll at this point unfortunately. It's been obviois for a while now.

You know, that actually doesn’t mean anything coming from you. You have always labeled anyone who doesn’t agree with you a “troll”. You are most likely to do so once you’ve lost an argument. I honestly question if you understand the meaning of the word at this point.

Bcbrown has been really mature in his interactions with you. His posts are tempered and intelligent.

Sorry he used math to hand you your ass on a silver platter.

It happened.

You’re butt hurt.

We get it.