Semi-Classic

[Secrets]

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

After having played on the server since its first week back in October, I have some observations, and more importantly, a question for the GM's regarding the server's future.

As others have recently observed on these forums, our server has a number of aspects that are not classic, at all, the most immediately noticeable of these being the global ooc and auction channels.

However, there are many, many other non-classic elements, including:

1. Experience gain - group bonuses and dungeon bonuses have been in effect on the server since day 1, these were not classic; also, pets do not leech experience as they did in classic; also, experience penalties are not shared among group members, as they were in classic. This has made leveling up much, much faster than it should be on a classic server.

The pets thing is being worked on, the others cannot be proved.

2. Pets - pets are super-pets, and particularly the magician pets; pets do not draw multiple aggro or generate faction hits the way they did in classic.

DB limitation right now with the way aggro is set up, related to guards further down. You're welcome to tell us which NPCs are not on appropriate factions.

3. Spells - spell resists for npc's are definitely much lower than they ever were in classic, resulting in fewer npc resists and partial resists; spell resists for pc's are much less effective than they were in classic.

Emu-wide issue, requires a revamp of spell resist formulas. Wanna get me them so I can fix it?

4. Meditating - meditation does not require the caster to see only the spell-book while meditating, this is non-classic.

Wanna hack the client to include the needed functions, opcodes, and other things from EQC to make it work, then redistribute the client legally?

5. Factions - starting factions are incorrect for a wide variety of race/class combinations, and they are off on a global scale; merchants are on the wrong factions/no faction, instead of how they were in classic (this is of particular importance for merchants near key dungeons); bankers are on the wrong faction/no faction; faction required to get quests is wrong, making it easier to get certain quests than it should be; faction required to complete quests is wrong.

I'd love to have these pointed out to us. It's not like we're using SOE's source or database and know exactly what is supposed to be what and how it was done.

6. Item and coin drops - coin drops are substantially higher from npc's than they ever were in classic, more on a par with Kunark drops than vanilla drops; item drops are much more common than they were in classic, too, especially rare item drops (a case in point - I tested two well-known drops in Upper Guk, the squire fork drop and the spider armor drop - 23 squire kills yielded 7 forks and 16 collars, while 18 giant spider kills yielded 6 chitin armor and 12 chitin shields - rare drops like the fork were about 1 in 20 or 1 in 50 in classic, not 1 in 3 on a consistent basis).

We'd have to revamp a lot of the loot tables to get through this limitation. Again, this server is made on people's dreams of classic, and *not* the official verant/soe code/db, so of course there are going to be inaccuracies, especially when we started with a base like AX_Classic (which btw you could have helped out back in 2006-2007 with inaccuracies so we didn't have to deal with it)

7. Guards - guard factions and assists are horribly broken, and guards themselves are much less lethal than they were in classic

Get me the NPC hit, damage, hp, etc, exact numbers of guards and i'll fix them. Work is already started on correcting guards; we just dont know what ones to fix. Tell us and ye shall receive.

8. Travel - intercontinental travel was instantaneous from the very beginning of the server, eliminating the need for players to take time to congregate for buying, selling, forming groups, questing, etc.; even the current boat replacement system makes travel much faster than it should be in classic

Well, wanna hack Directx 9 to work with EQT again? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] soe didn't do it for a few years, i'd love to see you try.

9. Tradeskills - items and recipes and combines are available from the beginning that were not available until the Gates of Discord era, allowing more rapid skilling up and nonclassic items to be made and used; vendors sell tradeskill items that they never had in classic, and in many locations in Norrath, tradeskill items are available near one another, whereas in real classic players would have had to travel through various zones even to get basic tradeskill goods.

Tell me what things. Blanket statements are bad.

10. Vendors - besides many vendors being available to hostile factions that would never have had access in classic, there are many vendors with incorrect inventories; some vendors even sell finished tradeskill goods that should never be on any vendor as a standard inventory item, and these finished goods tend to be vital stepping-stone type items for higher-level skillup recipes in tradeskills; some vendors sell items that were strictly foraged or dropped tradeskill items in classic.

See above

These are just a few observations of my own. I have no doubt that others could add many other items to this list. The result of most of these aberrations from classic is a greatly accelerated advancement and leveling curve on the server, making things move much, much more rapidly than they would have on a more classic server. Our server really is at best Semi-Classic, or perhaps Pseudo-Classic, at this time.

What is classic on our server, then? Class restrictions, race restrictions, starting cities, zone graphics are all classic; list of available zones is classic, although some zones have been made available to certain members of the server before they actually should have been, if the server was to have been truly classic.

exploiters have been dealt with

This server is still a lot of fun, that's why we're here playing together.

The question I would like to ask, however, is this:

Will this server strive to become more and more classic, as it continues to move forward? Will some, or all, of the above-mentioned aberrations be changed to classic, over time?

Yes, they will be fixed if they aren't limited by the client.

If so, can we expect a relaunch at some point with a truly classic server, or perhaps a second server to be launched as a truly classic server? I personally feel that a second server might be a better choice, so that those who strive to progress through the server as rapidly as possible can retain the distinctions and advantages for which they have played so hard on the current server, while those who enjoy a more truly classic game could start anew once a classic server is a reality. Perhaps such a second server would not track server-firsts and would not grant titles; in this way the pace-setter types might feel less slighted.

No.

My observations are my own, but I really would appreciate a response to my question from the GMs, so that we all can know what we might expect from Project 1999.

Here's my response.

Thank you GMs in advance for your response, and thank you also for our opportunity to play on this server.

no problem!

.

[Beor]

My main thing is that I feel like the xp is to fast. The only data I have to prove my theory is my previous experience with this game. I don't remember getting levels 14 and 15 in 3hrs, but I could be wrong.

Also, any comments or questions I've had were not an attack on this project or on the Devs. If you told me that exp is staying how it is and to fuck off, I'd say np. I'm grateful with what I have and where this game is, but you guys want info and feedback to improve this game and I was just asking/offering my two cents.

Seriously though, Thank you for giving us this server.

-Beor

[Ferok]

Originally Posted by Beor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't remember getting levels 14 and 15 in 3hrs, but I could be wrong.

3 hours each? That seems about right to me. If you're saying you got to ~14 in 3 hours total, I want to buy a lesson.

[Beor]

No 3 hrs to get both levels...see my concern? Which seems just way to fast.

[Ferok]

Originally Posted by Beor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No 3 hrs to get both levels...see my concern? Which seems just way to fast.

It's fast, but depending on your class and whether or not you were in a good group for the sum of that three hours, I can see it being reasonable.

I think too many of us remember the "hell levels" as the way it should be. It feels like you spent forever in your teens because at the time, it felt like forever. It felt like forever every time, every level. Perhaps simply because you didn't know anything else.

Before I was completely addicted to the game, a 3 hour session was alot of time to devote to the game. Later, 3 hours didn't seem like enough time to bother logging on for. I think alot of people's perceptions of the early level time-sink is skewed by the reality of the time-sink that was the higher levels.

...if that made any sense at all...

[FatMagic]

Originally Posted by Ferok [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's fast, but depending on your class and whether or not you were in a good group for the sum of that three hours, I can see it being reasonable.

I think too many of us remember the "hell levels" as the way it should be. It feels like you spent forever in your teens because at the time, it felt like forever. It felt like forever every time, every level. Perhaps simply because you didn't know anything else.

Before I was completely addicted to the game, a 3 hour session was alot of time to devote to the game. Later, 3 hours didn't seem like enough time to bother logging on for. I think alot of people's perceptions of the early level time-sink is skewed by the reality of the time-sink that was the higher levels.

...if that made any sense at all...

Made lots of sense to me! When I was living at home, going to college and playing EQ Live everyday for hours on end... time was nothing. 3 hours was nothing at all to me (I was addicted to EQ of course). Now being married, having a kid, taking care of a house, and working full time... 3 hours is a huge commitment for me. I get 30 mins here, 30 mins there. Maybe 2 hours on a few occasions. So honestly, I don't think I'll ever get to level 30 before Kunark is released on this server.

So in my mind the leveling is "too hard" - but that's because I've been spoiled by all the other "EZ MODE" leveling games out there. But I want EQ to be as classic as possible, so I'm willing to deal with the way it is.

But is it too fast or slow compared to Live '99? Honestly I don't know. I think we all have skewed perceptions of the leveling curve due to much of the watering down we've felt over the years from other games - and because as other posters said, we are VERY good at maximizing our leveling in EQ now because of all the knowledge out there that can help us (plus our own past experience with it).

[MutualofOmaha]

Thank you to Nilbog and Secrets for your responses to my central question. I appreciate your openness and candor. From your responses, it appears that we should not expect a more classic server with respect to most of the concerns I had mentioned. It would seem that there are no plans to improve the current server, and then open a more refined and more classic version of it anew at some point down the road; probably this is mostly due to an inability to create such a version, rather than an unwillingness to do so.

I will continue to report exploits on these forums as I have from my first day here, but I probably will not devote time to reporting the non-classic items in much detail. The damage, so to speak, that the non-classic items have done to this point, is irreversible, without some kind of relaunch or new server; so to my mind, I would be wasting my time reporting them, all the while knowing my efforts will not lead to a desired result.

I shall continue to reap the rewards of the non-classic issues, as all the other Jones'es are doing. After all, fair is fair.

And I shall continue to enjoy myself on the server, as I have already to this point.

[Nen]

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thank you to Nilbog and Secrets for your responses to my central question. I appreciate your openness and candor. From your responses, it appears that we should not expect a more classic server with respect to most of the concerns I had mentioned. It would seem that there are no plans to improve the current server, and then open a more refined and more classic version of it anew at some point down the road; probably this is mostly due to an inability to create such a version, rather than an unwillingness to do so.

I will continue to report exploits on these forums as I have from my first day here, but I probably will not devote time to reporting the non-classic items in much detail. The damage, so to speak, that the non-classic items have done to this point, is irreversible, without some kind of relaunch or new server; so to my mind, I would be wasting my time reporting them, all the while knowing my efforts will not lead to a desired result.

I shall continue to reap the rewards of the non-classic issues, as all the other Jones'es are doing. After all, fair is fair.

And I shall continue to enjoy myself on the server, as I have already to this point.

Whats with the weird passive aggression?

Couldn't you have just said, "Thank you, but screw you" instead? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Finawin]

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thank you to Nilbog and Secrets for your responses to my central question. I appreciate your openness and candor. From your responses, it appears that we should not expect a more classic server with respect to most of the concerns I had mentioned. It would seem that there are no plans to improve the current server, and then open a more refined and more classic version of it anew at some point down the road; probably this is mostly due to an inability to create such a version, rather than an unwillingness to do so.

I will continue to report exploits on these forums as I have from my first day here, but I probably will not devote time to reporting the non-classic items in much detail. The damage, so to speak, that the non-classic items have done to this point, is irreversible, without some kind of relaunch or new server; so to my mind, I would be wasting my time reporting them, all the while knowing my efforts will not lead to a desired result.

I shall continue to reap the rewards of the non-classic issues, as all the other Jones'es are doing. After all, fair is fair.

And I shall continue to enjoy myself on the server, as I have already to this point.

Dude, anyone else read this and think, "fuck this guy"?

What a pompously venom-lined piece of shit of a post(er).

[Stevebug]

Originally Posted by Finawin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Dude, anyone else read this and think, "fuck this guy"?

What a pompously venom-lined piece of shit of a post(er).

This.

Little surprised the devs felt the need to even respond to the OP. Though their response had some interesting info for sure.