Name Changes

[loramin]

Originally Posted by SunDrake [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

To elaborate, I have always felt there is a privilege given to those who spend more time on the forums than in the game. Don't care how much you edit the Per-Level Hunting Guide [thanks for that, though, Loramin]

I'm glad you've enjoyed the Per-Level Hunting Guide SunDrake. I didn't make it to curry any special favors or treatment, I just did it because I saw a million threads asking where to hunt, and I figured there must be a better way to answer them. But unless you count getting two items that I accidentally lost restored recently (yes, I'm a moron) I've gotten no special privileges here.

Originally Posted by Lhancelot [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That being said, I don't think Loramin has an awful personality or is nasty, I just think his love of his own name has blinded him from reasonable thinking in this circumstance.

I do love my name/character. I mean, I loved him so much I re-created him here exactly as he was on live, with the exact same name/face/race/class/deity. But I don't think I'm blinded by fear of a name change: when I similarly re-created my ranger here his name was already taken, so I added a silent "h" and moved on. I'm sure I could do something similar if I had to with Loramin.

I just think ... look what seems to get forgotten is that the staff are people, not blind rules-following automaton. A staff member can look at a name like Loramin and think "that sounds like a random fantasy name and not anything I've ever heard of in the real world". That same staff member can also look at Winchester (for instance) and think "you know, I think I may have heard of that ..."

So yes, I do understand that the rules say a name can be changed for being the same as a trademark. But as I mentioned before, there are 10k new trademarks issued every quarter in the US alone. If the staff was a bunch of rule-enforcing robots they would write a script to match character names against every new trademark as it comes out ... but that will never ever happen because they aren't robots trying to ban every trademarked name.

What they are is people, people who love this game so much that they volunteer their own free time, spending some of it to change obviously recognizable names that don't belong in Norath so that everyone else can enjoy the game more. That basic fact makes me feel my name is relatively safe, but at the same time it also ensures that I'll feel no ill will if it does get changed. And I really think it would help a lot if everyone else here also tried to keep that basic fact in mind when having these discussions.

[Lhancelot]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm glad you've enjoyed the Per-Level Hunting Guide SunDrake. I didn't make it to curry any special favors or treatment, I just did it because I saw a million threads asking where to hunt, and I figured there must be a better way to answer them. But unless you count getting two items that I accidentally lost restored recently (yes, I'm a moron) I've gotten no special privileges here.



I do love my name/character. I mean, I loved him so much I re-created him here exactly as he was on live, with the exact same name/face/race/class/deity. But I don't think I'm blinded by fear of a name change: when I similarly re-created my ranger here his name was already taken, so I added a silent "h" and moved on. I'm sure I could do something similar if I had to with Loramin.

I just think ... look what seems to get forgotten is that the staff are people, not blind rules-following automaton. A staff member can look at a name like Loramin and think "that sounds like a random fantasy name and not anything I've ever heard of in the real world". That same staff member can also look at Winchester (for instance) and think "you know, I think I may have heard of that ..."

So yes, I do understand that the rules say a name can be changed for being the same as a trademark. But as I mentioned before, there are 10k new trademarks issued every quarter in the US alone. If the staff was a bunch of rule-enforcing robots they might write a script to match character names against every new trademark as it comes out ... but that will never ever happen because they aren't robots trying to ban every trademarked name.

What they are is people, people who love this game so much that they volunteer their own free time, spending some of it to change obviously recognizable names that don't belong in Norath. That basic fact makes me feel my name is relatively safe, but at the same time it also ensures that I'll feel no ill will if it does get changed. And I really think it would help a lot if everyone else here also tried to keep that basic fact in mind.

Yeah I agree with all of this, for the most part. But what about fellow players? I just marvel at how when players detected other players being upset by their names being changed how they got attacked and ridiculed.

Would I personally be upset and quit the game if a name was changed? Probably not.

But saying as Vorhees did above "anyone that is upset over this isn't an adult" (paraphrasing here) is lacking understanding of other people, either due to an inability to empathize or simply being mean for the sake of being mean.

Blah blah blah. I am tired of this topic, I am sure the guides are REALLY tired of this topic, and wish you all well. Going to try to extract myself from it now.

I just get irritated when people start slinging personal insults at others for a good laugh when it's clear the targets are genuinely upset. Pretty cowardly and debased imo.

[Expediency]

Originally Posted by skarlorn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm a little sad that the name gestapo are finished. It was really fun and I enjoyed the time I logged in to inform on people. But too many nerds got out of hand and made a headache for our blessed, immersion loving staff.

I have laid down my laurels but will keep them freshly dusted in case the staff ever needs the List to continue.

KITTENS DELENDA EST

You are missing on some pro roleplaying opportunities here by being the mob leader with a pitchfork instead of giving some of these names deeper consideration. Many names are clear violations (eg austinpowers, loramin) but others are much more arguable. I'd like to hear some skarlorn breakdowns of reasoning behind your choices. Baler wasnt up to the task but you've got more moxie.

For instance, what rule specifically does "kittens who say meow" break? State your case for the record, sir.

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What they are is people, people who love this game so much that they volunteer their own free time, spending some of it to change obviously recognizable names that don't belong in Norath so that everyone else can enjoy the game more. That basic fact makes me feel my name is relatively safe, but at the same time it also ensures that I'll feel no ill will if it does get changed. And I really think it would help a lot if everyone else here also tried to keep that basic fact in mind when having these discussions.

Flattery will get you nowhere. Loramin is the property of the Colgate-Palmolive corporation and has been since the 1970's.

[skarlorn]

[QUOTE=Expediency;2657626]

For instance, what rule specifically does "kittens who say meow" break? State your case for the record, sir.
/QUOTE]

Generally, people are too emotional and reactionary for me to have a SERIOUS and IN DEPTH discussion of this matter; however I have appreciated your in depth exploration of names and am actually very pleased to be sharing forum about this.

I appreciate this first point you have brought up and it is a point upon which I must revise my inflammatory meme shitposting. After extensive review, there is NO clause in naming policy that discusses guild names. As far as I'm concerned at this point, if a GM has approved a guild name, that name is totally acceptable.

I formally lodge an apology for attempting the destruction and salting of the <Kittens Who Say Meow>

Now, as to the individual name petitioning, I agree completely that there are great Roleplay opportunities. In an earlier post in this thread I broke down my system for hunting immersion ruining names. Whenever I see someone, I ALWAYS engage them in roleplay and try to see if they can RP a reason for their name. There were several ppl who were amazing at this and it was really fun.


i gotta get on a call


please reply

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Expediency [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Flattery will get you nowhere. Loramin is the property of the Colgate-Palmolive corporation and has been since the 1970's.

Really? Are you saying that because you're involved in IP law and know it to be true, or because you threw "Loramin" in to Google and some random webpage came up?

Because if you search the actual USPTO search for "Loramin" you get ...

No TESS records were found to match the criteria of your query.

[Expediency]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Really? Are you saying that because you're involved in IP law and know it to be true, or because you threw "Loramin" in to Google and some random webpage came up?

Because if you search the actual USPTO search for "Loramin" you get ...

My RL career is not relevant to the p99 naming policy, sir.

So far nobody has produced a legal notarized trademark application for "Loramin" but several different websites who compile that information for a living all give the same very specific information: Loramin--colgate palmolive corporation-1974. There are also dates of filing and a NYC-based address associated with this info. Anyone properly motivated could get those papers, or you could test this by attempting to sell something branded "Loramin" and you'd find out very quickly whether colgate-palmolive holds this trademark or not.

Your vocal defense in the face of a preponderance of evidence is inspiring but we cant fight reality here.

The only potential defense I see for the name "Loramin" would be to claim that it is two "acceptable" names put together as a compound (such as Lor Amin) but that seems like a stretch after the statements you've made.

[Expediency]

Originally Posted by Expediency [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only potential defense I see for the name "Loramin" would be to claim that it is two "acceptable" names put together as a compound (such as Lor Amin) but that seems like a stretch after the statements you've made.

Upon further inspection, "Lor Amin" may also violate the naming policy.

https://www.elfdict.com/

Lor:

to slumber

lor- "to slumber" (LT1:259; the corresponding abstract noun lórë "slumber" is attested in Tolkien's later Quenya, so this verb must still be valid). Cf. also lor "dream" (Letters:308; probably just an Elvish "element" rather than a complete word)


Amin:

masculine name. hope

A rejected name for Aragorn, changed to Estel (PM/269). It is probably a variant of amdir (MR/320).


You will all have to forgive me, justifying/not justifying these names changes is the most fun I've had on p99 in quite a while. If I had all day I'd rip balers list to pieces.