Sky - Overseer of Air

[raato]

Originally Posted by Zemus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This sure was a sweet deal for CSG holding 3 spots in the rotation, and the 7 day noble for the entirety.

You do understand that CSG is actually 3 guilds that only team up for harder targets due to nature of the server environment?

All guilds that are part of CSG alliance raid most of their time by their own scheduled times.

We didn't ask FoH and Anons to share slot even when they had their alliance.

[Zemus]

Originally Posted by raato [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You do understand that CSG is actually 3 guilds that only team up for harder targets due to nature of the server environment?

All guilds that are part of CSG alliance raid most of their time by their own scheduled times.

We didn't ask FoH and Anons to share slot even when they had their alliance.

Yes, however, it still makes the arrangement unpalatable.

[Mythanor]

Originally Posted by Zemus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, however, it still makes the arrangement unpalatable.

Then how *palatable* is the hush hush rotation with non FTE mobs with Aftermath, while you do your own raids / races for other mobs? That's ok. But any agreement that doesnt include A/ A becomes unpalatable. (Ot at the worst, a means to try to justify your crappy guild relations)

[Zemus]

Originally Posted by Mythanor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Then how *palatable* is the hush hush rotation with non FTE mobs with Aftermath, while you do your own raids / races for other mobs? That's ok. But any agreement that doesnt include A/ A becomes unpalatable. (Ot at the worst, a means to try to justify your crappy guild relations)

Not very palatable at all I'm sure. That is a good example of how agreements and alliances make the 3rd parties feel left out. Something to consider when dealing with the issue at hand.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by Mythanor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Then how *palatable* is the hush hush rotation with non FTE mobs with Aftermath, while you do your own raids / races for other mobs? That's ok. But any agreement that doesnt include A/ A becomes unpalatable. (Ot at the worst, a means to try to justify your crappy guild relations)

I don't see you out competeing for those rotated non fte mobs anyway so why does it matter to you? Perhaps if you want into said rotation you should put forth the effort of fighting for the mobs in question rather than stomping your feet demanding to be let in...

[Mythanor]

Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't see you out competeing for those rotated non fte mobs anyway so why does it matter to you? Perhaps if you want into said rotation you should put forth the effort of fighting for the mobs in question rather than stomping your feet demanding to be let in...

And you're not part of the Sky rotation, so why should you (or your guild members to be exact) open their mouth about what it was? Pot... meet... kettle.

Edit: And this isn't about *stomping our feet to be let ...* into anything. It was implied that it sickened someone that guilds made an arrangement for something, and yet we sometimes do stuff together. Not counting today's AoW , I saw the exact same thing on the last AoW between A and A.. you know, the two guild that *love competition*, yet teamed up? yet complain when others guild do it? Again.. Pot.. meet.. kettle.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by Mythanor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And you're not part of the Sky rotation, so why should you (or your guild members to be exact) open their mouth about what it was? Pot... meet... kettle.

Edit: And this isn't about *stomping our feet to be let ...* into anything. It was implied that it sickened someone that guilds made an arrangement for something, and yet we sometimes do stuff together. Not counting today's AoW , I saw the exact same thing on the last AoW between A and A.. you know, the two guild that *love competition*, yet teamed up? yet complain when others guild do it? Again.. Pot.. meet.. kettle.

I don't see anyone in aftermath speaking about wanting nobles ffa. The last AOW AM got to like 10% and AW killed it after we wiped. This week it was beneficial to team up and get one drop rather than run the risk of wiping and losing both drops.

I guess you just don't know what you're actually seeing.

[raato]

Originally Posted by Zemus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, however, it still makes the arrangement unpalatable.

As far as I know the agreement was between the guilds, not between CSG and the other guilds. And everyone involved were happy with the agreement. Also at the time this agreement was in place Europa, Omni and AG all outnumbered the other guilds by atleast double amount of players.

[Zemus]

Originally Posted by raato [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

As far as I know the agreement was between the guilds, not between CSG and the other guilds. And everyone involved were happy with the agreement. Also at the time this agreement was in place Europa, Omni and AG all outnumbered the other guilds by atleast double amount of players.

I'll admit, my argument is more subjective than objective, however, CSG speaks with a single voice and is a single guild de facto. At least from an outsiders perspective.

I don't think it is madness for those interested in nobles to not wish to return to the previous system. The promise of more nobles, up to 1 a day, never really came to be during my time in sky. The timer spreadsheet basically fell apart due to snipe groups/plat farmers holding the timers. That's really the bigger issue. In fact, I was approached yesterday about setting up a team to contest nobles. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[raato]

Originally Posted by Zemus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'll admit, my argument is more subjective than objective, however, CSG speaks with a single voice and is a single guild de facto. At least from an outsiders perspective.

I don't think it is madness for those interested in nobles to not wish to return to the previous system. The promise of more nobles, up to 1 a day, never really came to be during my time in sky. The timer spreadsheet basically fell apart due to snipe groups/plat farmers holding the timers. That's really the bigger issue. In fact, I was approached yesterday about setting up a team to contest nobles. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

CSG is not single guild and does not always speak with single voice, even if we sometimes choose 1 person to communicate with other guilds in some things, that is just because it makes things easier for everyone. Noble has never been one of these cases. Even if we agree upon many things, we also disagree in some. We all have our own cultures, leaders and members. If we wanted to be 1 guild, we would have merged already. And believe me, merge would make alot of things easier, but we choose not to.

We all have our own Sky slots, and we all have had them for several years.

Also Sirken often acknowledges us as 3 different guilds. In all negotiations and talks with Sirken so far each of CSG guilds has had their own seat in the table.

CSG guilds almost always want to be treated as 3 different entities if/when CSG teams up with other guilds like Rustle etc. There is exceptions of course and we can be flexible about this, but usually this is the case. For example on Statue last night CSG was considered as 3 entities when we teamed up with Rustle and later we teamed up again for CT and we were considered as 1 entity, because Rustle basically won nothing valuable on Statue and we wanted to make up for it on CT (in both kills CSG outnumbered Rustle about 4:1).

And it's not unheard of that Europa, AG and Omni has competed against each others on targets that each guild can do by their own easily. Good examples are Noble, Vaniki, Hate minis, RF etc.

A/A has teamed up for many targets lately, should they also be considered as one raiding entity? No.

Timer spreadsheet we had fell apart because guilds didn't hold their part of the agreement where it was stated that "Noble has to die asap" and "Let other guilds know well in advance if you cannot handle Noble that day/time", that gave room for snipe groups and plat farmers to find noble up for several hours and get the timers.

So TL;DR: No matter how hard you want to tells us that we are 1 guild, we are not. We are 3 guilds raid alliance for harder targets due to nature of competitive environment on the server. We share the shame vision how this servers raid scene should be, but that does not mean that we are single guild.