Your options are...

[Daldaen]

32k Dragons... Ehh bit less so. With AE damage and AE fear, CH gets used very rarely on outdoor Dragons.

Regardless.

Remove Variance.

[Bristlebard]

Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're either stupid or trolling. I think (and hope) it's the latter... unless you don't consider using a warrior/cleric CH rotation as the traditional way to take down dragon_x/y.

What you're suggesting is a server without GMs. Sirken recently said he was ending the 'wild west' environment on red... imagine what 100s of pixel hungry nerds could be capable of on blue with GMs absent completely.

You're wrong all over.

First off, very little of a DA-initiated, full mallet into the boss, 30-second kill of a Kunark raid boss while the raid is drinking stinging wort pots and clicking reapers/soulfires is "classic" in the sense that it was typically seen in 2000. And that doesn't even get to the number of guilds in the raid scene here, the way races to engage happen, the lack of repops on the server compared to more-than-weekly on live, and all that other stuff. And I think you know this goes on, and I think you know that it wasn't how things went down back in the day, and I think you're just using word "classic" because you think it suits whatever argument you were trying to make.

And I definitely did not suggest a server without GMs. I suggested raid-specific rules (so all of the rotation this, class C that, log out here, you're blacked out, all that crap) be removed. Rules that are always in place, no training, no cheating, etc., would remain. The staff just wouldn't be arbitrating FTEs and watching for stalling and all of that all the time.

[Swish]

No you're wrong all over!

If you're enforcing no training/no cheating you'll need a GM present or at least some fraps evidence for a lengthy ElfQuest lawsuit... and punishing/judging a guild for those actions? Well shit, you'll need a GM son.

next

[Erati]

I know its hard to believe but saying if we want to compete we should join Class C is beyond dumb.

Class C is about VP access period.

No guild would become Class C without first becoming VP ready else you are literally cutting off 6 of the tastiest mobs avail to the Class.

Moving to Class C so we can compete on Talendor 2 out of the 3 weeks is beyond stupid and anyone that keeps suggesting as such needs to rethink what they are saying.

Class C is where the true neckbeards flock, the two guilds there have probably an overwhelming majority of that type of player when compared to Class R guilds- because lets face it- in the past the TMOs and IBs were where all the elite neckbeards defected from their respective leveling guilds for, which is fine thats EQ.

But to expect BDA or Taken to suddenly have a similiar amount of neckbeards ( when many of our most neckbeardy players have long jumped ship ) to compete with TMO/IB on not just a weekly basis but also on nearly 3X as many targets is guild suicide.

No thanks.

[Man0warr]

Personally I would like more competition up here in Class C with us. There are guilds that are ready.

What guilds are ready? BDA has maybe 45 VP keyed characters, and 20 of those are completely inactive. When we were in Class C for the week you guys were suspended, we could barely scrape together 30 keyed characters (and 10-12 of those were active people playing inactive characters that they didn't own and obviously couldn't get loot for their own characters). Even some of those active people with VP keys are only semi-active.

If we can barely field a force for scheduled VP kills with zero competition, we have no chance to field enough characters for random VP pops with 2 other guilds competing. There's no point in going to Class C in that scenario.

Why is this? We have barely gotten any Trak teeth through a year of Class R, and getting Trak through FFA is nearly impossible unless it's a repop. I know Taken is in the same boat.

The rotation doesn't promote going to Class C very well. If it was just BDA/Taken/Div this whole year getting Class R Trak kills then someone might have a good enough force keyed by now but the rotation has mostly just been a way for the smaller guilds to sell their Trak teeth as MQs to TMO/IB hopefuls.

Also what Eratani said^^, moving to Class C is the fastest way to kill our guilds. BDA and Taken playerbase might be 10% neckbeard, the rest would go join a Class R guild.

[Mendo]

Originally Posted by Erati [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know its hard to believe but saying if we want to compete we should join Class C is beyond dumb.

Class C is about VP access period.

No guild would become Class C without first becoming VP ready else you are literally cutting off 6 of the tastiest mobs avail to the Class.

Moving to Class C so we can compete on Talendor 2 out of the 3 weeks is beyond stupid and anyone that keeps suggesting as such needs to rethink what they are saying.

Class C is where the true neckbeards flock, the two guilds there have probably an overwhelming majority of that type of player when compared to Class R guilds- because lets face it- in the past the TMOs and IBs were where all the elite neckbeards defected from their respective leveling guilds for, which is fine thats EQ.

But to expect BDA or Taken to suddenly have a similiar amount of neckbeards ( when many of our most neckbeardy players have long jumped ship ) to compete with TMO/IB on not just a weekly basis but also on nearly 3X as many targets is guild suicide.

No thanks.

IB got their keys through competition, no?

[Swish]

Originally Posted by Man0warr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...the rotation has mostly just been a way for the smaller guilds to sell their Trak teeth as MQs to TMO/IB hopefuls.

Which guilds are doing that? I don't think I've seen a tooth for sale in EC.

[Man0warr]

Originally Posted by Mendo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

IB got their keys through competition, no?

I'd bet the majority of the current active crop of TMO/IB got their teeth from Class R MQ's or were ex-Class R folks who got their teeth from the rotation.

[Mendo]

Originally Posted by Man0warr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'd bet the majority of the current active crop of TMO/IB got their teeth from Class R MQ's or were ex-Class R folks who got their teeth from the rotation.

True, we've lost several members to this very act.

[Swish]

So what you're saying is you want more Trakanon kills to get more VP keys to stick around in whatever Class R turns into?

Can't fault that logic.