Game Mechanics: Warrior aggro procs are probably wrong

[spoils]

we can theorize numbers for "the magic x" but without concrete evidence, I am 99.9999% sure GM's won't even begin to work on any code relating that due to the huge ramifications...

but i like what i'm seeing and it makes sense

[kaev]

Originally Posted by koros [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No way Kaev.

33/44 with dd proc and stats PRE-Kunark?

It was the best anyone had seen up to that point, except maybe if you won the Butcherblock hammer.

Original (probably long-lost) Paladins of Norrath forum (not the EZBoard) had a thoughtful "open-letter" to the EQ devs, iirc it was posted by the FOH Paladin lead (Kruegan?), explaining how FA compared to equipment then available to the high-end Paladins who raced to be the first to complete the quest. Inferior HP, AC, & Resists to a quality 1h+shield were not made up for by improving Paladin damage output from very weak to still very weak, because, :shock: damage output has nothing to do with tanking. Also, the proc had little agro so no real help when tanking (tho not everybody commenting wanted an agro proc.)

A lot of the Paladins that were not in the guilds dominating high-end content thought it was pretty neat.

Also, my memory ain't what it used to be, but iirc FA quest came out AFTER Kunark release.

[koros]

FA was certainly before by a couple months. It was a lot better than any 1h/shield combo or other two handed that existed Pre-Kunark...

If anything it was probably a letter posted after Kunark, because it wasn't that hot compared to easy Kunark weaponry.

[spoils]

Stay on topic please

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by khanable [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think if we can try to find typical hate generation for a debuff prior to Feb 21st 2001 we'd be in great shape.

I too agree the hate generation for debuffs is probably base+maxhp/x

I believe x to be around 100, though -- so look at it like this

sonic bat hp: 2000, adds 20 hate to base
krup knight hp: 8500, adds 85 hate to base
nagafen hp: 32000, adds 320 hate to base

so if base was say, 200, we'd have 220 hate for debuffing a bat, 285 hate for debuffing a krup knight, and 520 hate for debuffing nagafen

And this is where shit went bad:

velious boss hp: 600,000, adds 6,000 hate to base

which would be a totally dead debuffer

Thoughts?

200 is way too high for a constant base.

How about this: 8*player-level+mob-hp/100

L20 shaman slowing Ambassador Dvinn: 166 hate
L40 shaman slowing sonic bat: 340 hate
L60 shaman slowing krup knight: 550 hate
L60 shaman slowing Cazic Thule: 800 hate

For all I know that's the actual way Nilbog implemented it; those results would be more or less consistent with our tests.

Or maybe a 7x multiplier for debuffs and an 8x multiplier for stuns, since those are supposed to be a little better. That would also mesh well with the data.

[koros]

That sounds potentially accurate, I was playing around with various methods of doing log(level*hp)*constant, but it doesn't scale enough unless you add in an exponent.

[khanable]

just some findings.. I'll post these randomly as I find 'em


https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/alt.games.everquest/tash$20aggro/alt.games.everquest/7H0kxLfiMNo/pCaD5wapWgAJ

old newsgroup posting from feb 25, 2001:

When did they add a re-cast time? I haven't played my wizard much for the
past month, but at that time I didn't notice any re-cast time. I think they
just lowered the aggro of the spell, as they did with tash, as a result of
it taunting too much and being used for unplanned things (warrior dual
wielding tash sticks can't lose the attention of his target, wizard spamming
flux on a HG can't lose the attention as the rest of his groups kites in
ease).

So debuff aggro was stupid high on spells and weapons, then. (I guess this is evidence that we can say it was definitely happening with weapons)

[Splorf22]

So all of the straight up numerical values that I posted in the OP are probably the caps Verant put in place after this patch.

The question is really how much of Verant's bad game design do we really want to replicate.

[khanable]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The question is really how much of Verant's bad game design do we really want to replicate.

All of it! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Nirgon]

Tash was def rather high aggro