If you think you are cool on Blue

[Rapidwave]

I'd really like to play Red, but I just can't ever get into it due to the population. That added element/sense of danger pvp brings just seem like it could be a lot of fun, but I'm sure it just sounds good in writing. I can't imagine EQ PvP being anything special though.

Wish I could convince some friends to play, they just can't get into EQ due to its simplistic/boring gameplay compared to modern MMOs. Can't really argue it either.

[t0lkien]

Originally Posted by Rapidwave [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'd really like to play Red, but I just can't ever get into it due to the population. That added element/sense of danger pvp brings just seem like it could be a lot of fun, but I'm sure it just sounds good in writing. I can't imagine EQ PvP being anything special though.

Wish I could convince some friends to play, they just can't get into EQ due to its simplistic/boring gameplay compared to modern MMOs. Can't really argue it either.

I don't understand this, honestly. Modern MMO's are dumbed down, cheesed, and trivialized in the extreme, and this by design. They are just much easier to get into (because they are shallower and much easier)! Accusing EQ of being simplistic compared to modern MMOs is the height of irony. No other game before or since has such synchronicity and subtlety of class interaction, and depth of item design. Maybe what they really mean is they find the game's graphics simplistic, don't like that every class can't do everything they want, it's the antithesis of action RPGing, and doesn't hold their hand every step of the way. And fair enough, I wouldn't argue with that either.

The problem with PvP in EQ is that EQ was designed from beginning to end as a PvE experience. PvP was allowed because people asked for it, but it was stated time and again by the devs that there would be no design changes that favoured PvP and simultaneously had a negative impact on the main game (which was PvE). The Zek servers whinged and complained about it constantly back in the day. That's what made EQ great, it knew what it was. You absolutely cannot design a game that satisfies both PvE and PvP. They are different animals and have design imperatives that inevitably work in direct opposition to each other.

[Rapidwave]

Originally Posted by t0lkien [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't understand this, honestly. Modern MMO's are dumbed down, cheesed, and trivialized in the extreme, and this by design. They are just much easier to get into (because they are shallower and much easier)! Accusing EQ of being simplistic compared to modern MMOs is the height of irony. No other game before or since has such synchronicity and subtlety of class interaction, and depth of item design. Maybe what they really mean is they find the game's graphics simplistic, don't like that every class can't do everything they want, it's the antithesis of action RPGing, and doesn't hold their hand every step of the way. And fair enough, I wouldn't argue with that either.

Had nothing to do with graphics or having their hand held, that's the only part they enjoyed. They enjoyed the open world / no maps / danger, ect.. however, the novelty of that wore off by level 25.

They didn't enjoy killing the same creatures hundreds of times per hour with no real threat of dying, combined with only using auto attacks and watching numbers. (let's be honest, it's hard to die outside dungeons in a group)

They've never played Everquest before. They don't count items as abilities, they just found the game simply boring, put on auto attack, click backstab once every few seconds, that's all 1-60. They complained that melee classes have no depth compared to modern MMOs, and I honestly agree. I warned them about making one as their first character, but meh.

I enjoy EQ, but I'm not going to sit here and say it has the highest difficulty cap out of every MMO ever made. IMO, every MMO is pretty damn easy compared to most games.

[t0lkien]

Ah, in relation to melee gameplay, I get what they mean. I'm not being an EQ apologetic, but the shallowness and predictability and total lack of creativity of modern MMOs drives me nuts. To hear someone hold them up as examples of those things is... bizarre. If gamers now think hitting a button to attack instead of pressing autoattack constitutes complexity - I despair for the future of games. It always odd to me when players grandstand about skill in these games too. Skill? It's all knowledge and persistence, and power acquisition through items and level, and understanding of the game systems. If you want skill go to FPS's or RTS's or console style fighting games (not you, just generally). The level of physical "skill" required is really pretty low. They are cerebral more than visceral.

I'm not sure about the danger of dying thing. Either they were playing with twinks, twinked themselves, being babysat by a higher level, or fighting in areas well below their level. EQ has much more danger than other games - that's a defining difference between it and other MMOs. One mob can easily wipe a group if things go bad, let alone a few adds. The danger of dying is always there, and if it happens it actually hurts (especially in either a hell level or the level after it!) Maybe we're playing different games o_O

[heartbrand]

I dunno how else to say this ill try one more time. If you play red for quake style pvp you're prolly going to have a bad time. If you play there to enjoy eq with a dash of pvp over mobs rather than FTE you'll find it refreshing

[Gadwen]

Is there an anti-pk PvE RP guild yet?

[Hailto]

Why is this thread not in RnF?

[Kagatob]

Originally Posted by Hailto [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why is this thread not in RnF?

[heartbrand]

Originally Posted by Hailto [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why is this thread not in RnF?

Because it's pretty tame with no rants or flames contained within, an honest assessment of the differences between red or blue with pros and cons for each. Your post on the other hand prolly should be moved to RNF.

[Hailto]

Originally Posted by heartbrand [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm really butthurt that I play on a dead server.