AW...whelp..here it goes again...

[khanable]

Need to start implementing permanent leadership bans as part of these suspensions - at this point that will be the only way to actually save AW as a raiding entity

[Breaken]

Vulak was clean. Our tank died, and we had no back up, so we tried to run it away. Unfortunately, with AM being on the agro list, we couldn't. How is that not interfering with a conceded mob?

The wipe? Completely Awakened's fault. The validity of a guild who conceded a mob standing where it is being killed, and then complaining that they got wiped out due to their own guild getting on the mob's agro list? Debatable.

Anyway, I never said AM should have left the zone, but you should have no standing on a mob that you conceded and decided to sit at entrance to watch.

[raato]

Originally Posted by BirryDaKir [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This all seems rather cruel to us average players. Feel like I’m being stringed along with a hope of these suspensions ending. Wish they would have just said the 40 day ban was coming immediately after the 30 day ban. Not sure what the reasoning for this is, but I’m just trying to raid and have fun. Oh well, back to playing alts and killing Lodi for 40 days, then maybe 50 more days. If the GMs want is done it would be more humane to just say so.

The moment you decide to raid with either of A/A guild YOU agree that it is alright to cheat and break the raid rules to get yourself pixels, even if you don't do it yourself. By joining you support the leadership and the way they want to play this game. Now when they get caught you also suffer the consequences, because YOU choose to support it. And for that there is nobody else to blame than yourself.

[Dogma]

If Awakened reforms will they be exempt from year-long suspension chain that all stems from one day in February?

[thebutthat]

This basically just ended competitive raiding on this server. Now you have two choices. Play casual and take raid mobs AM allows you to have or log in to the AM batphone and zerg mobs down with the last remaining end game players.

My suggestion would be to tag up with AM if you want to see ToV dragons now before they close their doors to the server.

Regardless of what AW does, they're not coming back 100% from a 30 day and then a 40 day back to back. Plus whatever petitions are still in the queue.

[raato]

Originally Posted by Kluwen1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Raato would you care to cite some specific examples of Aftermath cheating and breaking rules??

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=287229
https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=284291
https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=280607
https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=269930
https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=268709
https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=261899
https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=253736

And this is only to scratch the surface. We all know ALOT of the shenanigans go unpunished, because it is usually very hard to prove that other party has been cheating or because some technicality in ruleslawyering.

[Pheer]

Originally Posted by Kluwen1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Raato would you care to cite some specific examples of Aftermath cheating and breaking rules??

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...archid=8848660

please tell me that even you arent dumb enough to pretend you guys have never broken a rule kluwen

[Pezy]

Originally Posted by Breaken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The Vulak that caused Aftermath to concede two (not the four that Detoxx suggested as standard punishment) wiped out more than one AFK Shaman. It wiped out our raid force that was logging in to entrance to compete.

This Vulak, Aftermath had no business being at entrance during our encounter since they had already conceded it. We pulled vulak out of entrance and you can see it comes back for an Aftermath player. Why? They conceded the mob. Should they be on his agro list? (AEs don't get you on it, so what did he do?)

Sounds like double standard bullshit from staff. Nothing new.

Where can we see it coming back for an AM player? The fraps I just watched (which you and yours had plenty of time to review) to refresh my memory shows it coming back for Tankzor, definitely not a member of Aftermath.

[Mockba1980]

When Pheer is salty as fuck, you know that will be a good day ! Ahah

[Detoxx]

Originally Posted by planarity [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I guess this is as close as we'll come to an admission that you just literally make shit up and aren't afraid to lie about things that can easily be checked.

For the record, I think AW deserved a punishment for when we were careless and accidentally trained CSG. (30 days seems excessive, as many AM people pointed out, but whatever). I remember being surprised at how non-chalant about it AW was when it happened (this is what credibility looks like).

So what actually happened on this 2/25 vulak that warrants a 40-day suspension? As far as I tell can from my recollections and my logs, AM had already conceded it for something they (almost definitely accidentally) did on some other mob. We weren't very good--had a dirty pull and didn't handle it well. We wiped. Some AM people who were just poopsocking at the zonein died. One random non A/A person died (he asked for a rez and I rezzed him).

Being completely sincere here: What do I have wrong? what am I missing? If you let me know I am happy to corroborate it with my logs, even if it's damning of AW (again, credibility).
Obviously it will have to be someone other than Teako, since I'm curious about the actual chain of events as they happened in reality.

As a side note, let me extend the following olive branch for you Teako: If AM wipes to a mob and kills me while I am sitting at the tov zonein doing nothing (it has happened), and my bind point is literally right next to my corpse, I won't expect you to rez, buff, and heal me (I won't even ask once). And you don't even have to apologize. Pretty good, huh?? I feel like we're making progress already.

Ill answer this for you for some perspective. That Vulak was one of 2 we conceded to you guys. The reason those were conceded was because we had pulled in Vulak and it was a botched engage and we would up killing 2? maybe 3 of your members at the zone in. We had a solid argument that one of your druids, cant remember the name, was pet tracking and when Vulak got close, he sent his pet onto it. This made it so when we tried to pull Vulak out of the zone in to prevent a train, our efforts were futile as no matter what we did, it was coming back for that druid who sent his pet on it.

This lead to the whole "no petition agreement" being blown up within the first 3 disputes. The difference is I did all I could to make sure that it was worked out and the didn't want to risk it going to the staff because it was something that could go either way.

Keep this following note in mind: This particular Vulak, you had a max of 24 people log on, 4 clerics and 1 tank. You, in fact, realizing you didn't have a force to kill it, abandoned it and went to kill Golems and Draco in fear.

Fast forward to this current situation. You guys brought in a Vulak, trained us (not just 3 people but out entire raid force was wiped out) and wiped yourselves. I asked Eratani what was going to come of this incident as it is clearly written and a known fact that if you train a guild, it is against the rules. Theres no if, ands or buts to it. it is also a known fact that when you pull to the zone this is a risk you take.

The keyt difference between these 2 events, which are nearly identical, is that I did what I could to make it right and when I talked to Eratani about how to make it right for training us I got "what mobs did you lose?", "you couldn't even compete on this one" (keep my note above in mind), and finally, as Sedyt has said he openly said something to the sort of we aren't doing anything about this and will let it go to the GMs.

I hadn't even asked for a Vulak or anything. Its entirely possible that if he had just said "hey man, listen, were really sorry for training you and we will res and get you back up." I wouldn't even have petitioned it but instead I was met with their cocky, arrogant, we can do whatever we want attitude and this very attitude is coming back to haunt them.

I know Awakened will BP this post as soon as they see it to come and say how much of a lie it is and how terrible of a person I am but this post is 100% pure, unaltered fact. Take it for what its worth.