Miscellaneous: Leash dragons to their lairs instead of rooting them to enable archery double damage.

[CrazyPro]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I appreciate the perspective, but this is a bug thread focused on archery mechanics themselves, not raid npc design or tov encounter behavior. Those are valid concerns, but they’re a separate issue and would be better discussed in their own thread. This thread is intended to cover archery as a system, including its impact outside of raids.

Alright Nilbog, here's that thread!

Patch Notes: Sunday, April 7th, 2019
...
Temple of Veeshan
It has been clear for some time that the current situation in Temple of Veeshan has not been optimal. Numerous guilds are flocking to this zone upon repops, causing mayhem with so many players grouped together. To make matters worse, pulling mechanics have been mastered to the point where raid mobs are able to be isolated from any and all trash and brought all the way to the zone in. It is the staff's opinion that these encountes were never designed or intended to be trivialized in such a way. While the act of splitting does take some careful coordination between a team of pullers, this is just one small part of the raid and leaves everyone else from having to do any work or experience the rest of the zone.

NToV Dragons were unclassically permarooted 7 years ago due to zoneline pulls and the chaos of several overlapping raids pulling things over each other being too much for staff to handle. However, the way this was implemented differs from how permarooted mobs behaved in classic.

Back in the dinosaur years, permarooted mobs simply had their runspeed and walkspeed set to zero, so they didn't count as rooted and thus could trigger double damage bow hits for stationary non-rooted mobs from rangers. The way permarooted mobs were implemented on P99 has them counted as rooted and immune to runspeed changes for the purposes of archery hits and spells with snare components (which only really applies to Dozekar, he was snareable and could be slowed with the rogue poison slow, which has a 95% snare component on top of the 50% slow, so this spell is useless on Dozekar now since his permarooting since the change seems to make him immune to runspeed changes)

Rangers and rogues shouldn't have to suffer this unintentional nerf as a consequence of the way this custom change was implemented.

With the archery changes around the corner, I'd like to propose that instead of permarooting these dragons, leash them to their lairs or the general area around their lairs like was done for Zlandicar. This serves the exact same purpose that these mobs were originally rooted for, but this time without the unintentional ranger nerf and rogue slow on doze nerf.

This also alleviates the extra, definitely not classic difficulty added to these mobs as a consequence of rooting them at their spawn points, which, as it turns out for many of them, isn't the ideal spot to tank them at, because you end up having to stand at very specific points just barely in melee range of the mob for the clerics to be able to land CHes on you from their safe spot.

[Doyen]

Ample evidence in various "rooted" threads quoted here: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...ht=ntov+rooted

by Kegluas.

Rooted dragons was an easy escape from significant drama with raid scenes. Times are different now and P99 should restore the dragons to their original glory and simply ban ZL pulls entirely, which is what the purpose of this was.

With the UN and various petition avenues, and the increase of raiding guilds self-policing, it should be an easy choice.

No more emotional appealing - the evidence is presented and I don't want to clutter. Just wanted to add the link to a previous evidence-based post for assistance.

[CrazyPro]

Originally Posted by Doyen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ample evidence in various "rooted" threads quoted here: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...ht=ntov+rooted

by Kegluas.

Rooted dragons was an easy escape from significant drama with raid scenes. Times are different now and P99 should restore the dragons to their original glory and simply ban ZL pulls entirely, which is what the purpose of this was.

With the UN and various petition avenues, and the increase of raiding guilds self-policing, it should be an easy choice.

No more emotional appealing - the evidence is presented and I don't want to clutter. Just wanted to add the link to a previous evidence-based post for assistance.

Actually I like this idea better, just completely unroot 'em, but ban pulling dragons out of their wings. Let Aary be aggro-linked to each of the blockers like he was in ages past, let Vulak call all of the blockers to his location like he's supposed to instead of being invulnerable like he is now.

We have self-enforced player agreements (with staff backing for that extra oomph) for most aspects of raiding now, the players can definitely sort this out themselves. Believe me, people will be swarming around a dragon recording it run to the entrance if a guild tries to perform a ZL pull with this hypothetical rule in effect, and that guild will get in huge trouble.

[Defo]

Some dragons were rooted in 2001, and had the Call of the Zero, namely:
-Lady Mirinella
-Lady Nevederia
-Lord Kreizenn
-Lord Feshlak
-Lord Vyemm

Some were most definitely NOT rooted like they are on p99 (and also did not have Call of the Zero)
-Lord Koi Doken
-Aaryonar
-Dagarn the Destroyer

Trips and Jorll behave like they did in 2001, none of them rooted.

There should be a good balance between the rooted and unrooted dragons. Unrooting all of the dragons would not be classic, but unrooting the 3 above definitely would be.

[CrazyPro]

Originally Posted by Defo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Some dragons were rooted in 2001, and had the Call of the Zero, namely:
-Lady Mirinella
-Lady Nevederia
-Lord Kreizenn
-Lord Feshlak
-Lord Vyemm

Some were most definitely NOT rooted like they are on p99 (and also did not have Call of the Zero)
-Lord Koi Doken
-Aaryonar
-Dagarn the Destroyer

Trips and Jorll behave like they did in 2001, none of them rooted.

There should be a good balance between the rooted and unrooted dragons. Unrooting all of the dragons would not be classic, but unrooting the 3 above definitely would be.

It doesn't look like this is true. These were still unrooted in early Luclin: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...80&postcount=8

[Defo]

Originally Posted by CrazyPro [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It doesn't look like this is true. These were still unrooted in early Luclin: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...80&postcount=8

Ahh, I might be thinking 2002 instead of 2001.

DECEMBER 18, 2001:
[...]
In the next patch, we are making a few changes to the monster population in Temple of Veeshan. Places that were previously safe to camp, may not be any longer. Please be sure to not camp deep within the Temple of Veeshan on Wednesday night, or you may be unpleasantly surprised following the patch.

Not sure if this was the patch, which is a week after this post you linked - but I know for a fact that by later xpacs, the dragons I listed were rooted, and the others weren't. We used to go back for luls on level 70s during Omens of War era to clear VP 2.0, ToV, etc.

I remember being forced to fight Kreizenn in his lair because of root. (must be shortly after Luclin release. Pretty sure it was Summer 2002 - originally I thought it was Summer 2001).

[Awsten_Tx]

Originally Posted by Defo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Some dragons were rooted in 2001, and had the Call of the Zero, namely:
-Lady Mirinella
-Lady Nevederia
-Lord Kreizenn
-Lord Feshlak
-Lord Vyemm

Some were most definitely NOT rooted like they are on p99 (and also did not have Call of the Zero)
-Lord Koi Doken
-Aaryonar
-Dagarn the Destroyer

Trips and Jorll behave like they did in 2001, none of them rooted.

There should be a good balance between the rooted and unrooted dragons. Unrooting all of the dragons would not be classic, but unrooting the 3 above definitely would be.

yah quarken has ss of all those dragons dead in aary pit