Game Mechanics: Summon interval (Howling Stones / all world)

[DoucLangur]

pre Planes of Power, summon interval was 11 (eleven) seconds.

While I did not hunt in Howling Stones on live, it would strike me as extremely odd if this was different in here of all Kunark and Velious zones.

This "A helot skeleton" in Howling Stones just summoned me in as low as 6 second intervals, which makes it clearly overpowered.

All summoning mobs in Kunark and Velious that I can remember pre PoP had an 11 seconds refresh on their summon ability. Including raid encounters.

Comments / logfiles of old please, and fix if Howling Stones was never an exception to the rule.

[Wed Dec 21 20:02:39 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:02:54 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:00 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:07 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:13 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:19 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:25 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:31 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:37 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:44 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:03:51 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:04:06 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:04:24 2011] You have been summoned!
[Wed Dec 21 20:04:50 2011] You have been summoned!

[DoucLangur]

bump! This is definitely not okay - same low summon interval in Sebilis crypt as of today. Comments please!

[Uthgaard]

It's a 6 second delay between summons. This is working correctly.

[DoucLangur]

What I mean is - the summon interval is supposed to be 11 seconds. Sadly the only mob that I have such a perfect vivid memory of to know for sure it was >10 seconds is Lodizal, but I am pretty sure I was nastily surprised of the 6 second Planes of Power summon interval *because* I had never seen it before.

For Lodizal: I beat him with my necro at level 65 only because I could summon-kite him: Between summons, I had the time to run ahead of him with SoW potions, and cast exactly *one* spell, before he summoned me - and I had to get the timing exactly right so that he wouldn't interrupt the casting with summon, or catch up to me and melee me first.

I did the sebilite protector with a similar tactic, kiting him underwater near the bridge in Trakanons Lair, but my memory is not nearly as good.

Anyways - that is why I was asking for comments. And I will hope to look up some sources. Maybe someone with an active live account can go to sebilis and other kunark zones that have not been revamped, and check what the summon interval is currently - for verification.

The shorter summon interval is a gamechanger, makes many encounters a lot tougher - I can currently not even step back from a stationary mob to finish casting a spell before I get summoned again. And when tanking a mob, it will often - even when I am in melee range - summon me so far into itself, that it turns around and the rogues can't backstab until I move out again. But that's another issue... not sure if that was classic.

Cheers
Slozem

[nilbog]

Do some research. If you find evidence to support your claim, it will be investigated.

I did one google search.. which yielded results not favorable to your argument.

https://www.google.com/#q=%2B%22summ...w=1184&bih=549

[DoucLangur]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do some research. If you find evidence to support your claim, it will be investigated.

I did one google search.. which yielded results not favorable to your argument.

https://www.google.com/#q=%2B%22summon+every+6+seconds%22&hl=en&prmd=imvnsfd&filter=0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r _pw.,cf.osb&fp=4b3c420078196b39&biw=1184&bih=549

That's what I call selective search approach [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] If you search for "summon every 6 seconds", I am not surprised at the results you get. You can do the same for "summon every 10 seconds" and get results about EQ. Also, in your search results, there is a comment from 2007 on zam, saying "Most mobs these days summon every 6 seconds" which is a good indication that the poster knows previously the summon interval was different.

http://eqbeastiary.allakhazam.com/search.html?id=8667

Check the comment from Dec. 16 2007 No. 2 here:
http://eqbeastiary.allakhazam.com/search.shtml?id=4571

The guy says:

2. If you have an HP buff so you have 4k - 5k HP you wanna get and keep aggro. get summoned, run away, lifetap, and poison nuke when time and HP allow.

Run away & lifetap can not possibly work with a necro: The shortest necro lifetap was 3 seconds cast time in 2007. With 6 second summon interval, you'd have 2 seconds to run away - in which you couldn't even get out of melee range of this guy...

I found a couple more posts on zam indicating that the summon refresh timer was high enough for backing off and casting something/shooting arrows, before being summoned again - but no one talks about an explicit summon interval / refresh timer.

I am gonna dig up my oldest logs and see what I have.

Cheers
Slozem

[Rogean]

I'll save you some time and say now that even if you did find proof that it was 11, it's unlikely I would change it. As we get closer to velious and mobs that will be permarooted, the tactic of summon kiting will be utilized, and increasing the duration would trivialize many encounters. Even without permaroot it would still be an issue for many encounters.

[Autotune]

i've seen tactics posted on other sites for necros similar to what he is saying. The same tactics aren't viable here with mobs that summon, that is for certain. I've never seen anyone list a specific summoning time either tho. Like he stated it's usually "get summoned, back out and cast blah blah, get summoned back away and so forth" On p99 ur almost always being summoned so you're lucky if you can get off one of ur quickest spells.

I've also seen some necro tactics for certain mobs where people are out of melee range but inside of the summoning range. (so they don't get hit, or get summoned) This I've tried once and failed so never tried again lol, i imagine it doesn't work here at all.

Like Rogean says tho, I don't see it getting changed. Many things on p99 will not get changed to make it easier. Pretty much anything that made classic hard stays, anything that trivializes classic goes.

[Uthgaard]

Those tactics are valid in a 6 second interval. I used to do it, that's how I know that the 6 second interval is correct without needing to look it up. The inaccurate portion is the assumption that everyone and their brother should be able to do it effortlessly, with their mouths hanging open and mashing random buttons.

It's hard to do, and not everyone will be able to get the gear to make it possible, and have the reaction time or know all of the tricks necessary to make it work.

[Reikerx]

Originally Posted by Rogean [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'll save you some time and say now that even if you did find proof that it was 11, it's unlikely I would change it. As we get closer to velious and mobs that will be permarooted, the tactic of summon kiting will be utilized, and increasing the duration would trivialize many encounters. Even without permaroot it would still be an issue for many encounters.

Why? That's why they implemented Call of the Zero. Velious raid mobs use that at like 1 second delay, not the generic summon ability. This prevents summon kiting already.