A Plea to the Staff of Project 1999

[Otto]

To the GM Staff of Project 1999:

I understand all of the hard work you've put in for this server to be what it is.

Actually, I don't. And I sincerely doubt ANYONE here can fully understand the amount of work you have put in for well over a year on this project. I would like to think that everyone is grateful for your work, but as we have seen over the past 2+ months, some people don't care.

There are your MacroQuesters, your Dupers, your two-boxers, your exploiters & cheaters. These individuals are specifically going against your wishes and destroying the integrity of the server. You have dealt with many of them, and some have been given second chances. However, some have not been dealt with. This is where the issue arises.

If you would stop sticking your heads into the raid target situation, you could deal with factual evidence of people exploiting, server development, and maybe even have a moment or two of relaxation!

Lets look at how this developed:

1. Raid targets begin as IB downs naggy 2x.
2. Server attack, Trans gets a shot at naggy.
3. Aeolwind pulls myself and Allizia aside to see if we can come to agreement.
4. One is not set in stone, but an idea is layed out.
5. IB moves on to kill vox, clear fear, kill Draco + CT. IB then downs naggy again.
6. Trans moves in to Permafrost for 14 hours.
7. Trans wipes to Lady Vox.
8. We were prepped and ready to go should this be the case, but we decide against it due to lag from DDOS (in good faith, in the spirit of fairness, and against our own self-interest).
9. After 3hours of patiently waiting for them to have a fair attempt, we leave. The ddos lag was too bad.
10. I receive a call at 1ish in the morning saying Trans had just killed a Vox that wasn't AEing. Rather than Tibador logging on his GM and reloading the PL (as has been done with us SEVERAL times), they just kill him.
11. They act as if its a legit Vox kill, and don't petition until afterwards. Whatever, deep breath, moving on:
12. Fear goes down for maintenance.
13. Trans moves into solb for 14 hours.
14. We decide to move in and attempt to be first to engage as the rules imply that we should.
15. Wenai steps in and sets up a server rotation with Aeolwind.

At no point in that pile of nonsense was there ever word to me about a rotation being enforced. I don't know who were the ones QQing and whining to you, but it certainly wasn't IB. It was a one sided complaint that you gave in to. It was only after this stupid rotation that you've implemented in which we started to bring our concerns to you. It seems to me that rather than dealing with the problem properly, you gave into people whining about not getting content handed to them. If you left it to the guilds, it would always be a competition for mobs; first prepared and first to engage.

I don't understand why the rotation was such a priority. We had shown good faith when we dealt with Lady Vox during the DDOS. On the other hand, there has been documented proof presented of Allizia and Tibador exploiting after specifically being warned about the Phinny pull. Then, on top of that, not fixing an obviously broken Vox before they downed her.

These issues have been brought to your attention as of one week ago today. A Whole week, and no repercussions. This is _sad_ when you consider the fact that we now have a 14 day MINIMUM ban hammer over our heads for handling raid targets in the classic manner.

Rather than giving it time to play out and see where it would lead, we've had to watch the GM's waste huge amounts of their time developing a very poor rotation which we are forced to follow for fear of a 14 day ban. This is just causing more ungratefulness for the server, and even more complaints. Please focus on the server, the broken content, and those who are exploiting it rather than the guild drama that is extremely one sided.

[Hasbinbad]

Instead of moving otto's post without addressing it, can we take a minute and address these very valid concerns?

[Wenai]

-Timeline is missing the fact that IB also showed up to Nagafen 5 hours early and claimed Nagafen. Proving that they were willing to operate under the system as long as it benefited them.
-Timeline is missing the fact that IB also showed up to Nagafen after Trans had been there for 14 hours early. Also missing the fact that you guys decided that the system that you guys were operating under should no longer apply to you.

At no point in that pile of nonsense was there ever word to me about a rotation being enforced.

When it became apparent that you guys were unable to co-exist we decided that something had to be done. It was decided that the only fair way to handle it was to ensure that both guilds split everything 50:50. So that meant that a rotation would be going in.

I don't know who were the ones QQing and whining to you, but it certainly wasn't IB.

I heard plenty of whining from IB when Trans started showing up 8++ Hours in advance for a spawn. In fact, that was the entire reason you guys decided you didn't want to follow the system anymore. You guys decided that the rules didn't apply to you anymore and wanted to just "engage first." You decided you wanted to write the server rules, sorry that isn't going to fly.

The implementation of the rotation solved two issues:
1) No longer need to show up 14 hours in advance.
2) No longer afraid of another guild rushing your target and KSing you.

The only way to get you guys to abide by these rules is with some form of leverage. That leverage was a 14-day ban. Ever since the rotation was announced, I have been very clear that we would be open to further suggestions and systems that people wanted to propose. Up until today the only suggestions we have really been told were, "Who ever engages first and does the most damage should get it!" Uhhh. Ya. No.

It seems to me that rather than dealing with the problem properly, you gave into people whining about not getting content handed to them.

Not at all. I feel the rotation fixed both of the gripes that both sides had. (See Above)

It seems to me that rather than dealing with the problem properly, you gave into people whining about not getting content handed to them.

First of all, don't assume your opinion is the only answer. Second of all we came up with a system that fixed both of the major issues that both sides were having. We are a PVE server, we need some form of order here on this server. It sounds to me like you have a severe case of PVP-Mentality. As far as I know, VZ/TZ is doing a fresh wipe. I suggest you guys check it out because your ethics aren't going to fly here. KSing, not respecting camps and not respecting your fellow players are not viable options here.

If you left it to the guilds, it would always be a competition for mobs; first prepared and first to engage.

No. If I left it up to the guilds, and your "first to engage" system, we would have 50-60 people sitting on top of Naggy's spawn point. With no one sure who really tagged it first. Then when it is all said and done, it turns out one Guild KS'd the other, you call for a GM to come revoke and re-distribute the loot dropped. Seriously dude, if you think everything would be roses; you are dead wrong.

I don't understand why the rotation was such a priority. We had shown good faith when we dealt with Lady Vox during the DDOS.

Yet you showed such bad faith when you attempted to go outside the current system and basically told me directly that you didn't care and that the guilds were "even." That is the thing about a system. If you start following it, you have to keep following it. Unfortunately you decided (as a guild apparently) that it was alright to go outside of the system that both guilds had been following for a few weeks because it no longer benefited you. That is why the rotation went into place. We need some form of order.

Want to know why the rotation was a priority? I have had a rather peaceful week and a half because there was no fighting over the spawns. There was no one asking me to come watch the raid and make sure nothing shady happened. I don't even know who has been killing what. That is how it should be. If it is FFA, it CAN'T be like that.

On the other hand, there has been documented proof presented of Allizia and Tibador exploiting after specifically being warned about the Phinny pull. Then, on top of that, not fixing an obviously broken Vox before they downed her.

What does this have to do with the rotation?

Rather than giving it time to play out and see where it would lead, we've had to watch the GM's waste huge amounts of their time developing a very poor rotation which we are forced to follow for fear of a 14 day ban.

Lol? Rather than giving it time to play out? We gave it probably three weeks or more. What more do you want? I had enough of asking you guys to play nice. Both parties have acted like complete children at one point or another. I guess this is your guys' turn to wear the tin foil hat. Enjoy it while you can, it seems to change heads quite quickly on this server.

Please focus on the server, the broken content, and those who are exploiting it rather than the guild drama that is extremely one sided.

I will. With the rotation in place, perhaps I will actually have time to look at issues at hand instead of babysitting you guys every few nights whenever a mob spawns.

It is really getting old. You have a chance to get rid of the rotation. You have a chance to help develop a system that we feel is fair. Grasp that chance. Embrace it. Make it the best you can that emphasizes competition and fairness.

[Wonton]

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When it became apparent that you guys were unable to co-exist we decided that something had to be done.

blah blah blah blah blah. lets the players play. you're only making a headache for yourselves by interfering.

[Otto]

You keep painting the picture as if we had an agreed set of rules as to *whoever gets their first* gets the first shot.

Once again, it was an idea, a framework. It was never agreed upon and I wish you'd stop painting the picture that way.


You said, "-Timeline is missing the fact that IB also showed up to Nagafen after Trans had been there for 14 hours early. Also missing the fact that you guys decided that the system that you guys were operating under should no longer apply to you."

You missed quit a bit there. Not only was that in my post (IE numbers 13 and 14), I had informed Allizia over 5 days before that naggy kill that we would not be following the framework we had started working on.

You demean myself and my guild and our concerns and say we are missing all the facts. Don't get so high and mighty... you're missing them too.



As far as the rotation fixing both the gripes, you are sorely mistaken.

You stepped in the moment our first framework had failed. You didn't even give us the time to try out another solution.

I had my qualms with first to engage to begin with as well, but the more I looked back at live, the more I realized it was and is the way things were intended to be. For some reason though we are stuck on this idea that it'll just be a massive zerg fest in which we can't police ourselves on the first to engage thing.

On live this is exactly how it was. Guilds A, B, and C have their tracker locate a mob. Guild A and B mobilize instantly, C is late. Then, Guild A and B begin to buff. Guild A finishes first and engages. Guild B then has to wait, and C is just finally zoning in. Should Guild A wipe, Guild b gets a shot, if guild b wipes, then guild C (So long as they are prepared before guild A finishes their corpse run).

Anything short of this is not live-like. If you truly feel you have to police us, put in variance and remove the rotation. You'll be proven wrong.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

-Timeline is missing the fact that IB also showed up to Nagafen 5 hours early and claimed Nagafen. Proving that they were willing to operate under the system as long as it benefited them.
-Timeline is missing the fact that IB also showed up to Nagafen after Trans had been there for 14 hours early. Also missing the fact that you guys decided that the system that you guys were operating under should no longer apply to you.

We never agreed to any system. There was one talked about but it was never agreed to because Allizia wanted the second guild to wait outside the zone and we wouldn't agree to that (as a guild).

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I heard plenty of whining from IB when Trans started showing up 8++ Hours in advance for a spawn. In fact, that was the entire reason you guys decided you didn't want to follow the system anymore.

There was no system, we never agreed to any system.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You guys decided that the rules didn't apply to you

There was no system, we never agreed to any system.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

..and wanted to just "engage first." You decided you wanted to write the server rules, sorry that isn't going to fly.

Maybe if *you* had written some server rules, we wouldn't have had to.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only way to get you guys to abide by these rules is with some form of leverage. That leverage was a 14-day ban. Ever since the rotation was announced, I have been very clear that we would be open to further suggestions and systems that people wanted to propose. Up until today the only suggestions we have really been told were, "Who ever engages first and does the most damage should get it!" Uhhh. Ya. No.

I honestly have nothing to say about this, as it is pretty much on target.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We are a PVE server, we need some form of order here on this server.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It sounds to me like you have a severe case of PVP-Mentality.

Wenai, honestly, if you think the mentality we've shown is severely PvP, you're a carebear. We're trying to compete with, not kill, trans. I think you're under a lot of false assumptions as far as what our positions are, and if you had ever bothered to talk to us, you would know that. Unfortunately our only communications with you has been you joining our guild to inform us of how it was going to be.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

As far as I know, VZ/TZ is doing a fresh wipe. I suggest you guys check it out

I herd that advertising for other servers wasn't allowed here. BAN!!

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

because your ethics aren't going to fly here.

FUCKING ROFFLECOPTERS!!! You are SERIOUSLY accusing _US_ of having faulty ethics while you ignore and defend PROVEN EXPLOITERS ON YOUR GM STAFF AND IN THE LEADERSHIP OF THE GUILD YOU ARE CATERING TO?!?!? Sounds like YOU need to put the pocket dictionary down and maybe attend a class on ethics so that you might have the hope of having some clue of the meaning of the words you throw around in ignorance.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

KSing, not respecting camps and not respecting your fellow players are not viable options here.

We do NOT KS, we DO respect camps, and we DO respect our fellow players to the extent that they respect US. This has been shown time and time again and if you cannot see that you are BLIND. If there has been issue, it is because the GM staff has dragged ass on giving us some server rules and forced us to try and help shape them ourselves and THEN RIDICULES US FOR ATTEMPTING TO DO SO. We are sorry we haven't come to the forums to engage in your carebear tea party, but we've been busy levelling, farming, raiding, and helping people to bother. We've preferred to lead by precedent in the past, but obviously that is not going to work, so I for one will be much more vocal on the forums from now on to try and work this out. But Wenai do not fucking accuse us of shit that didn't happen. If you do, bring proof. Oh, wait, you have NONE, so tits or gtfo imho.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No. If I left it up to the guilds, and your "first to engage" system, we would have 50-60 people sitting on top of Naggy's spawn point. With no one sure who really tagged it first. Then when it is all said and done, it turns out one Guild KS'd the other, you call for a GM to come revoke and re-distribute the loot dropped. Seriously dude, if you think everything would be roses; you are dead wrong.

Honestly, I completely agree.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yet you showed such bad faith when you attempted to go outside the current system

Every time you try and say there was a system from now on, I am going to retort that there was no system.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That is the thing about a system. If you start following it, you have to keep following it. Unfortunately you decided (as a guild apparently) that it was alright to go outside of the system that both guilds had been following for a few weeks

There was no system. We never agreed to any system.
The facts HAPPEN to have fallen into place as if we were following a system, and so your timeline elements are correct, but no such system existed.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Want to know why the rotation was a priority? I have had a rather peaceful week and a half because there was no fighting over the spawns. There was no one asking me to come watch the raid and make sure nothing shady happened.

Cute.
I guess when it's your buddies doing the shady shit (exploiting encounters, GM's not repopping mobs that are obviously broken) then it's not worth your time to look in to?

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Lol? Rather than giving it time to play out? We gave it probably three weeks or more.

This was none of our faults, but it needs to be recognized that those two weeks were fraught with issues on the spawns and ddos attacks. We didn't really get a fair shake to work it out on an even playing field.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What more do you want?

I want you to do your job. Punish the people taking unfair advantage of the system and blatantly scoffing at GM edicts while simultaneously blaming us for their issues.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I had enough of asking you guys to play nice. Both parties have acted like complete children at one point or another.

You're right, and some of us in Inglourious Basterds who have been letting our less restrained members speak for us are acting now for change. I can only say wait and see to this, but I hope for better in the future.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I guess this is your guys' turn to wear the tin foil hat.

You can't seriously be implying that there is some kind of similarity between the kind of completely unfounded, totally baseless, and 100% unsupported slew of outright lies and blatant speculation that trans harped on for WEEKS about GM favoritism, hacks, and exploiting and the EVIDENCE we have provided to the leadership of this server regarding the obviously exploitative methods that GM-led trans used in the recent past to obtain loot from at least two boss encounters. I really thought your critical thinking skills were better than this Wenai, your posts are usually pretty well thought-out.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I will. With the rotation in place, perhaps I will actually have time to look at issues at hand instead of babysitting you guys every few nights whenever a mob spawns.

By your own admission, you had a half a week of peace before evidence was placed at your feet on a silver platter and you've had a week of peace since, and yet nothing has been done.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It is really getting old.

I agree.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You have a chance to get rid of the rotation. You have a chance to help develop a system that we feel is fair. Grasp that chance. Embrace it. Make it the best you can that emphasizes competition and fairness.

I've posted an alternative system here. Please review it and say what you think.

[Wenai]

Originally Posted by Hasbinbad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We never agreed to any system. There was one talked about but it was never agreed to because Allizia wanted the second guild to wait outside the zone and we wouldn't agree to that (as a guild).


There was no system, we never agreed to any system.


There was no system, we never agreed to any system.

Both guilds were asked to respect each other if they were there first. Both guilds were asked not to engage if the other guild was there first. Both guilds followed these instructions up until a point.

Maybe if *you* had written some server rules, we wouldn't have had to.

Server rules were written a long time ago. They were on the original forums in the News section. Basically that entire forum was deleted some how (no idea how, I had no control over this) and they never got migrated to the new forums. All we had was an older rough draft of the rules which actually to be honest, I wrote the majority of the rules which were then passed on to and approved by Nilbog.

Wenai, honestly, if you think the mentality we've shown is severely PvP, you're a carebear. We're trying to compete with, not kill, trans. I think you're under a lot of false assumptions as far as what our positions are, and if you had ever bothered to talk to us, you would know that. Unfortunately our only communications with you has been you joining our guild to inform us of how it was going to be.

If I had bothered to talk to you guys? I tried to talk to Otto on a few occasions, never really got anywhere. I know Aeolwind had tried to talk to Otto as well and also got no where. Talking to 20+ people at one time is really not efficient nor effective. It is up to your leader to go into discussions with myself or another member of the team and speak for your guild as a whole. Otto has talked to many of us on the team. It seems that your guild's opinion is that you are not happy with anything.

FUCKING ROFFLECOPTERS!!! You are SERIOUSLY accusing _US_ of having faulty ethics while you ignore and defend PROVEN EXPLOITERS ON YOUR GM STAFF AND IN THE LEADERSHIP OF THE GUILD YOU ARE CATERING TO?!?!? Sounds like YOU need to put the pocket dictionary down and maybe attend a class on ethics so that you might have the hope of having some clue of the meaning of the words you throw around in ignorance.

Not even going to address this as it is really not relevant at all. If you feel that you need to attack me personally then so be it, but not relevant to this thread whatsoever.

We do NOT KS, we DO respect camps, and we DO respect our fellow players to the extent that they respect US. This has been shown time and time again and if you cannot see that you are BLIND. If there has been issue, it is because the GM staff has dragged ass on giving us some server rules and forced us to try and help shape them ourselves and THEN RIDICULES US FOR ATTEMPTING TO DO SO. We are sorry we haven't come to the forums to engage in your carebear tea party, but we've been busy levelling, farming, raiding, and helping people to bother. We've preferred to lead by precedent in the past, but obviously that is not going to work, so I for one will be much more vocal on the forums from now on to try and work this out. But Wenai do not fucking accuse us of shit that didn't happen. If you do, bring proof. Oh, wait, you have NONE, so tits or gtfo imho.

You guys did respect myself and your fellow players up to a point. It got to a point where it was apparent that your group was not willing to follow directions anymore and wanted to write your own rules basically. Dragged ass on giving you server rules? I am not really following what you are talking about. The rules were posted during the beta for weeks, and then they were posted on these forums.

I have said time and time again that you guys never KS'd. The issue was that you were threatening to. You can call foul and say that it isn't KSing and it isn't camp stealing or whatever. Fact of the matter is that you were going outside the realm of what this server is about. That is not conduct we condone nor allow. We stepped in and stopped you from even having a chance to do that.

I guess when it's your buddies doing the shady shit (exploiting encounters, GM's not repopping mobs that are obviously broken) then it's not worth your time to look in to?

My buddies? Lol. Do you realize that I have been duoing/soloing ONLY for the past month and a half or more? I have one person on the server that I am in contact with regularly. I really have no ties and for the time being that is how it has to be.

If you want the truth, I have a hell of a lot more ties in IB than I do in Trans. I don't talk with anyone in Trans at all. I am really not sure if you were intending to suggest I have friends in Trans or not. But if you were you are severely mistaken.

This was none of our faults, but it needs to be recognized that those two weeks were fraught with issues on the spawns and ddos attacks. We didn't really get a fair shake to work it out on an even playing field.

You guys still can work something out. I think the spawn variation is a good starting point and we will need all the input we can to make that work. Until then the rotation is staying.

I want you to do your job. Punish the people taking unfair advantage of the system and blatantly scoffing at GM edicts while simultaneously blaming us for their issues.

Ok?

You're right, and some of us in Inglourious Basterds who have been letting our less restrained members speak for us are acting now for change. I can only say wait and see to this, but I hope for better in the future.

I hope that the future is better than the past month or so has been. I defended you guys for weeks when you guys were being slandered for everything. I stood up and answered the call whenever GM favortism claims came into play. You guys had no favortism and I know it was driving you guys nuts when people made these claims. The exact same situation is happening here. Claims that Trans wrote the rules etc etc etc. It is all the same repeated bullshit.

You can't seriously be implying that there is some kind of similarity between the kind of completely unfounded, totally baseless, and 100% unsupported slew of outright lies and blatant speculation that trans harped on for WEEKS about GM favoritism, hacks, and exploiting and the EVIDENCE we have provided to the leadership of this server regarding the obviously exploitative methods that GM-led trans used in the recent past to obtain loot from at least two boss encounters. I really thought your critical thinking skills were better than this Wenai, your posts are usually pretty well thought-out.

Yep. I am implying that this is the exact same completely unfounded, totally baseless, 100% unsupported slew of outright lies and blatant speculated bullshit.

Sorry if you feel that my posts are not well thought-out but there is an easy explanation why you are feeling this way. When your group of individuals are the ones being on the other side of the argument you are going to get defensive. When I was defending you and sticking up for your group of people you thought it was great. When you guys disagree with my stance on anything I am the devil and I should go die. Whatever.

By your own admission, you had a half a week of peace before evidence was placed at your feet on a silver platter and you've had a week of peace since, and yet nothing has been done.

I am in the middle of exams. Kind of not really in the mood to deal with this stuff and decide which brand of diapers I need to wrap around your soft, delicate, slightly rashed bottom. I am not sure if you guys are still rockin' the Huggies or if you are ready for the Big Boy Pullups yet.

I've posted an alternative system here. Please review it and say what you think.

Going to be honest. I don't think this really has any place on our server. I haven't really read it in full detail at this time.

[Wonton]

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Server rules were written a long time ago. They were on the original forums in the News section. Basically that entire forum was deleted some how (no idea how, I had no control over this) and they never got migrated to the new forums. All we had was an older rough draft of the rules which actually to be honest, I wrote the majority of the rules which were then passed on to and approved by Nilbog.

So where are they?

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I hope that the future is better than the past month or so has been. I defended you guys for weeks when you guys were being slandered for everything. I stood up and answered the call whenever GM favortism claims came into play. You guys had no favortism and I know it was driving you guys nuts when people made these claims. The exact same situation is happening here. Claims that Trans wrote the rules etc etc etc. It is all the same repeated bullshit.

Added headache?

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sorry if you feel that my posts are not well thought-out but there is an easy explanation why you are feeling this way. When your group of individuals are the ones being on the other side of the argument you are going to get defensive. When I was defending you and sticking up for your group of people you thought it was great. When you guys disagree with my stance on anything I am the devil and I should go die. Whatever.

Added headache?

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am in the middle of exams. Kind of not really in the mood to deal with this stuff and decide which brand of diapers I need to wrap around your soft, delicate, slightly rashed bottom. I am not sure if you guys are still rockin' the Huggies or if you are ready for the Big Boy Pullups yet.

Added headache?

[Wenai]

Originally Posted by Wonton [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So where are they?

http://project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1057

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Both guilds were asked to respect each other if they were there first. Both guilds were asked not to engage if the other guild was there first. Both guilds followed these instructions up until a point.

Granted.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Server rules were written a long time ago. They were on the original forums in the News section. Basically that entire forum was deleted some how (no idea how, I had no control over this) and they never got migrated to the new forums. All we had was an older rough draft of the rules which actually to be honest, I wrote the majority of the rules which were then passed on to and approved by Nilbog.

Regarding raid encounters, I have not been made aware either through my own research or the company of my peers of any guidance previous to the enforced rotation of vox and nagafen. Maybe this is my failure, but I consider myself a fairly thorough person, and if I missed it, many others may have as well.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I had bothered to talk to you guys? I tried to talk to Otto on a few occasions, never really got anywhere. I know Aeolwind had tried to talk to Otto as well and also got no where. Talking to 20+ people at one time is really not efficient nor effective. It is up to your leader to go into discussions with myself or another member of the team and speak for your guild as a whole. Otto has talked to many of us on the team. It seems that your guild's opinion is that you are not happy with anything.

I think this is unfair. Unless Otto has been less than truthful, the times he has been contacted have been more about informing him as opposed to seeking input. Otto can you speak to this? Other GM's?

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not even going to address this as it is really not relevant at all. If you feel that you need to attack me personally then so be it, but not relevant to this thread whatsoever.

I apologize for the enthusiasm with which I responded to that comment, and you're right it does resemble a personal attack and I am wrong for that. That being said, I do think it is relevant to the topic because I am directly replying to your accusation against our ethics.

Our ethics are fucking unquestionable dude.

Reiker is the example brought up over and over but we almost didn't take him over that MQ shit. The guy did some stupid shit a long time ago when he was an officer in <Fine Steel Long Swords>, which was a different organization with different goals and different leadership. We gave him a chance, with the express knowledge that if such an incident happened in the future there would be a guild ban with no questions asked. If you don't have more evidence than that please stop beating that drum once and for all, it's getting to be like we're a married couple bringing shit up from 10 years ago.

People also talk about rogues using poisons.. All rogues used poisons up to a certain point. It was accepted. I talked with several GM's about it. They all seemed fine with it, and I was never told to post about it being bugged. Several GM's beisdes Xzerion have GLADLY benefitted in groups with their play-characters while I was using poisons. The very instant Xzerion said that the word came down that they were not to be used by anyone else, I as well as all IB rogues stopped using poison. Period. End of discussion. ..and we continued to not use them as per GM orders. This is more than I can say for some rogues in other organizations.

So yeah, excuse me for the tone of my voice, that was wrong, but do not dismiss the content of my words please, you questioned our ethics. I may tend to get heated when people question my ethics, and I apologize, but let me be absolutely clear:

We are an honorable organization that seeks to play this game by the rules as set out for us by the original intent of the developers of everquest as merged in philosophy with the GM team led by Nilbog. If we do something and you don't like it, give us options or tell us to stop. We will. We may fight like raptors to find some workaround, but we will stay within the lines when we color. Please stop trashing ethics without evidence. It's libel and we don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You guys did respect myself and your fellow players up to a point. It got to a point where it was apparent that your group was not willing to follow directions anymore and wanted to write your own rules basically. Dragged ass on giving you server rules? I am not really following what you are talking about. The rules were posted during the beta for weeks, and then they were posted on these forums.

Your directions were allowing trans sick advantage and everyone knows it. This is the ugly elephant in the room that everyone is ignoring. You gave them power, without any agreement from us, to camp dragons for 14 hours. It's the end of the world, and Kutles is going to gate.

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have said time and time again that you guys never KS'd. The issue was that you were threatening to. You can call foul and say that it isn't KSing and it isn't camp stealing or whatever. Fact of the matter is that you were going outside the realm of what this server is about. That is not conduct we condone nor allow. We stepped in and stopped you from even having a chance to do that.

We were under no circumstances threatening to KS. We were intending on engaging the mob first as per our understanding of the rules of engagement on this server. Do we really need to argue out the semantics of KSing or can you concede that this was a solid premise to operate under given the lack of other guidance? If they were there doing the same thing, that is fine, but if the group that engaged first is not the group that got the kill, then a KS would have involuntarily occurred and it would require GM intervention to sort it. Yes we were trying to force your hand, but we knew that trans was about to start doing exactly what they proceeded to do and camp mobs for insane amounts of time because they recruit any scrub in ec tunnel without a tag (no offense to the good members of trans, but you know damn well what I'm talking about).

Originally Posted by Wenai [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My buddies? Lol. Do you realize that I have been duoing/soloing ONLY for the past month and a half or more? I have one person on the server that I am in contact with regularly. I really have no ties and for the time being that is how it has to be.

Ok, maybe buddies was off target, but you can't tell me that you really don't see how biased this whole "system" is.

I generally hate entitled people, but we did kick ass in this server to be first with the gods and the dragons, and we really did get the rug pulled out from under our feet. We were raid ready and stuck farming rubi for weeks while the rest of the server caught up to dragon and possibly planes ready. For a new guild to just demand equal treatment right away when we were stripped of the rights at our first shot is demoralizing frankly. I think a little acknowledgment is due here. Look the fact is that while many of our guild are clamoring for pvp or whatever, a lot of us really don't mind sharing, but let's get real. We're the lion, trans is the hyena. Yeah, a pack of hyenas can kill a lion, but there is only one king of the jungle.

We have dominated every shred of content presented to us in a matter of fact way that speaks of skill. We've worked with every extra limitation you've placed on us and followed the rules. We've gone the extra mile in many cases and shown respect where no respect has been shown.

We've seen trans flounder even while exploiting and zerg every moderate success they can lay claim to. We've seen them endlessly troll, whine, beg, snivel, enter contortions of self-loathing, and generally squeak a lot over a long period of time. We've seen a few members of Trans show remarkable patience with the rest of their guild, seriously we don't understand how you guys put up with it.

The point is that you're showing favoritism to them by treating them fairly. They don't deserve it. They have lied, cheated, and stole their way to #2, and they will be #3 very quickly when Divinity spreads it's wings. They deserve suspensions or even bans in my opinion, although I hesitate at the brink of telling you how to do your job. Although we have butted heads, we deserve your respect Wenai, we have earned it, and you know it, which is the infuriating thing.

I had a lot more to say to the rest of your posts, but I think that last paragraph about does it for me today. I hope something comes of this.