Rotation on Raid Targets ?

[randomer]

ok before i start i dont want this thread to turn into R&F please just want to have a mature discussion about the current situation and the possibility of having a rotation on the 6 main raid targets.

I dont see why you guys cant work out a rotation on the current raid mobs ? with like 5/6 guilds you each get 1 or 2 a week, it would put a end to all this camping nonsense and fights over targets,i remember on live servers there used to be more 5 or more guilds all in rotation it worked fine and the guilds had more of a respect for each other,you might say wheres the competition in that ? but where is the competition now you just have 1 maybe 2 guilds pretty much camping every target 24/7 with a raid force on call at any moment giving the normal/casual players little or no chance to fully experience eq classic and thats what most play for in the end to have the fun of raiding these targets again.

The real competition will come with expansions when some harder raid targets are available and guilds can gear up to race for them, thats fair enough,but for now cant we let the majority people enjoy the server,
im sure a rotation would benefit more people than it would hinder :).

[Chucck]

I believe they tried it already. But in essence, thats not really classic. Camping was the majority of classic EQ on most servers, but if a rotation was initiated on a server, that was done based on the players doing it, not SOE.

[Zexa]

Search for one of the 10 other threads about this that made it to 20 pages and you'll have your answers.

[Jify]

We will destroy you!

[karsten]

hey I've said it before, we're all adults here and I don't see why we can't figure out a way to share targets also. Possibly something like a staggered rotation or something to spice things up -- that way everyone gets a piece of the nostalgia pie

[Ektar]

Well we're movin' on up, Karsten. To the east side. To a deluxe rotation in the plane of sky. Movin'.. ON up, Karsten, to the east side, in fact. We finally want everyone to have a piece of the nostalgia pie.

[TheDudeAbides]

Some people seem to think these mobs are incredibly important or something

So I seriously doubt you'll be seeing a rotation anytime soon

[guineapig]

Well the simulated patch day respawn of all raid mobs at once was a great idea that everyone seems to have forgotten about.

It's completely classic in feel and the last time all the raid mobs were up at the same time everyone was able to get to at least 1 or 2 raid targets. Timers were called on guilds, etc.

Basically it worked, it wasn't a rotation, and would be in addition to the regular random spawn cycle that's already in effect.

[Slackbadger]

something should be sorted out for the good of the whole server,theres no reason why something cant be figued out at the next guild meeting, how about a rotation and all mobs pop on patch days as well ?

[Dawgrin]

Well the simulated patch day respawn of all raid mobs at once was a great idea that everyone seems to have forgotten about.

It's completely classic in feel and the last time all the raid mobs were up at the same time everyone was able to get to at least 1 or 2 raid targets. Timers were called on guilds, etc.

Basically it worked, it wasn't a rotation, and would be in addition to the regular random spawn cycle that's already in effect.

That sounds like a pretty good idea to me...just need some Dev buy in on it
Of course I am not yet raiding on this server, but I do remember the post patch rush to raid targets and scouting (in kunark and velious). Which I always thought was a blast.

[Bruman]

That sounds like a pretty good idea to me...just need some Dev buy in on it
Of course I am not yet raiding on this server, but I do remember the post patch rush to raid targets and scouting (in kunark and velious). Which I always thought was a blast.

NO I HAVE TO LEAVE CLASS RASTER IS GOING TO BE UP!!!!

Okay, not a raid target, but still. That's how it was for me back in classic.

[karsten]

yeah no, i agree, simulated patch day would be a great addition to any sort of rotation we can come up with here -- we could coinflip for whoever got to start and switch between the major guilds by week, so like, week 1 first guild gets all targets then week 2 second guild etc, that way people could have fun AND have lives at the same time

[Desert]

yeah no, i agree, simulated patch day would be a great addition to any sort of rotation we can come up with here -- we could coinflip for whoever got to start and switch between the major guilds by week, so like, week 1 first guild gets all targets then week 2 second guild etc, that way people could have fun AND have lives at the same time

i'm not raiding, and i haven't raided since i quit live, but to me personally if I was and a rotation was imposed, and I had to sit on my ass for 2, 3...4 weeks? while other guilds down all of their targets I'd be finding a new server/game out of sheer boredom.

That said, how do you handle new guilds that want a piece but can't down their mob (trak for example)? 1 week timer starts and once 1 week elapses they forfeit all remaining mobs? Seems kind of wasteful to me when other guilds could be killing that stuff.

I've been on the giving and receiving end of competitive endgame raiding in eq, and that is what makes raiding in eq different than wow. Healthy competition is good.

[CPTMULLER]

i'm not raiding, and i haven't raided since i quit live, but to me personally if I was and a rotation was imposed, and I had to sit on my ass for 2, 3...4 weeks? while other guilds down all of their targets I'd be finding a new server/game out of sheer boredom.

That said, how do you handle new guilds that want a piece but can't down their mob (trak for example)? 1 week timer starts and once 1 week elapses they forfeit all remaining mobs? Seems kind of wasteful to me when other guilds could be killing that stuff.

I've been on the giving and receiving end of competitive endgame raiding in eq, and that is what makes raiding in eq different than wow. Healthy competition is good.

until you've experienced the end game here, don't try to talk about it... it's something you have to see for yourself

[Bruman]

I think a single "this week all guilds get all targets" would end up not being enjoyed, just because one week you're going to be raiding tons, then doing nothing for a couple of months.

A "roll for target" to start the rotation sounds more interesting to me, so every guild gets a chance at a target. If it's progression for your guild, get a few attempts in, then move out of the way for the next guild. Just be courteous. If there are more guilds than targets, then rotate the "do nothing this week" slots as well.

Or hey, it's a private server, put them on 30 minute spawn cycles. PROBLEM SOLVED.

-.-

[CPTMULLER]

I think a single "this week all guilds get all targets" would end up not being enjoyed, just because one week you're going to be raiding tons, then doing nothing for a couple of months.

A "roll for target" to start the rotation sounds more interesting to me, so every guild gets a chance at a target. If it's progression for your guild, get a few attempts in, then move out of the way for the next guild. Just be courteous. If there are more guilds than targets, then rotate the "do nothing this week" slots as well.

Or hey, it's a private server, put them on 30 minute spawn cycles. PROBLEM SOLVED.

-.-
You're clearly not raiding, go talk about Crushbone.

[karsten]

hmm, you both make valid points. perhaps the solution in that case is, for example, to have a weekly roll-off and let guilds pick their desired target for that week based on how well they roll? that would let certain guilds go for targets that they know they can kill and thus get around the problem of certain guilds not being able to down certain raid bosses.

[logiktrip]

I would like to see a rotation at least attempted again, this time with more than two guilds involved in it. The only reason I believe it was ended when it did was because there were more guilds coming up to raid -- a pretty poor excuse. It was essentially a head-start on the racing, since those guilds had a gear and experience advantage over any others wanting to raid those targets. Now with the timers, these up and coming guilds get one shot -- if they're lucky. The original rotation guilds were not under such pressure.

It's worth a shot I believe, I don't think the previous rotation was given enough of a chance with more guilds.

I wouldn't mind leaving Maestro or Draco off of a rotation, to leave some FFA mobs to race for.

[Bruman]

You're clearly not raiding, go talk about Crushbone.

Yeah, you're right, I've never raided in any game ever. Please quit trolling with your internet tough-guy ePeen nonsense.

[Desert]

until you've experienced the end game here, don't try to talk about it... it's something you have to see for yourself

I was commenting on what Karsten said. Take it for what it is. :rolleyes:

[guineapig]

I would like to see a rotation at least attempted again, this time with more than two guilds involved in it. The only reason I believe it was ended when it did was because there were more guilds coming up to raid -- a pretty poor excuse. It was essentially a head-start on the racing, since those guilds had a gear and experience advantage over any others wanting to raid those targets. Now with the timers, these up and coming guilds get one shot -- if they're lucky. The original rotation guilds were not under such pressure.

It's worth a shot I believe, I don't think the previous rotation was given enough of a chance with more guilds.

I wouldn't mind leaving Maestro or Draco off of a rotation, to leave some FFA mobs to race for.

Basically rotation was just IB and Trans and it only lasted a short while. Divinity was ready to throw their hat in the ring shortly after it was started.
We killed Naggy to prove ourselves on 2/6/10, a day after the new raid rules involving rotation were posted on the forums.
Sadly this also happened to coincide with the kithicor GM event (2/14/10) which signaled the opening of Hate and the end of the rotation.

The rest is history. We're still standing tall though.

[karsten]

lol ok

or what really happened

[guineapig]

lol ok

or what really happened

Wait, what I say wrong? I was there for the whole thing!
Hell it's even all in the forums just like I wrote it.
Hell man, I wasn't even saying anything bad. Your guild even congratulated us on the Naggy kill. /shrug

[vinx]

lol why are you apologizing?

[CPTMULLER]

Yeah, you're right, I've never raided in any game ever. Please quit trolling with your internet tough-guy ePeen nonsense.

Cool retort bro, go strait for my personality.
Seriously, you CAN NOT understand the shitstorm that is the drama in endgame until you've been there/

[Dabamf]

I, for one, think a rotation is a grand idea that has never been considered before, ever. I like the duel for raid choice idea, but that's a little unbalanced by class disparities. Instead, we should find a neutral location and all meet there, and have a RL duel to the death. We can use a megaphone to announce the winners and losers (and flee-ers), and the winner of the RL duel gets first raid choice.

[Desert]

Cool retort bro, go strait for my personality.
Seriously, you CAN NOT understand the shitstorm that is the drama in endgame until you've been there/

don't act as if the drama on this server's endgame is somehow unique, because it was played out on every single server on live as well.

like i said in my post before you shot me down, i've been on the receiving and the giving end of "competition" and all it really comes down to is being faster than the other guy, but to be fair about it. we cockblocked coirnav for 2 months. was it right to do? no. not at all.

[Bruman]

Cool retort bro, go strait for my personality.
Seriously, you CAN NOT understand the shitstorm that is the drama in endgame until you've been there/

don't act as if the drama on this server's endgame is somehow unique, because it was played out on every single server on live as well.

That was basically my point - thanks Desert. CPTMULLER, I have *no doubt* that the endgame is a drama shitstorm - hell, I (obviously) browse the forums. I'm sure there's even more nonsense when 2 guilds show up in the same zone, and all over guild chats. There's enough drama in any zone that is popular (from Crushbone to Unrest to Guks to raiding), that just because the loot is "more important", doesn't mean it's not surround by people basically ready to act like asstards. Hell, it's the same people, just with more /played under their belt.

That *doesn't* mean that people can't calm down, be rational, and just try to enjoy the game realize that sharing is caring!

Although I still stand by making raid targets respawn every 30 :p

[TheDudeAbides]

Cool retort bro, go strait for my personality.
Seriously, you CAN NOT understand the shitstorm that is the drama in endgame until you've been there/

^^^^^^^^

Comparing the end game on this server to live is laughable

[Alawen Everywhere]

^^^^^^^^

Comparing the end game on this server to live is laughable

The end game on this server is very comparable to Kane Bayle (where I was in the #2 guild, Celestial Rapture, and we were cock-blocked for months in Velious and Luclin era by the #1 guild, In Virtue, led by our friend Krimz) and to Stromm (where I was in the #1 guild, Realm of Insanity, and we cock-blocked the hell out of the other guilds for months in Luclin, PoP and GoD era). Every mob was FFA. What is different is that there were far fewer whining posers demanding that their level 43 ranger should get a chance at dragon loot.

Maybe everyone ate flowers and farted butterflies on Jeffrey's server, but I sure doubt it. It seems a whole lot more likely that Jeffrey never played end game on live. That would be consistent with the complete lack of substance in every one of his posts.

[karsten]

wow way to not want to share, alawen

[Alawen Everywhere]

I love to share. I just prefer sharing yours.

[karsten]

mmm, i like that

[TheDudeAbides]

The end game on this server is very comparable to Kane Bayle (where I was in the #2 guild, Celestial Rapture, and we were cock-blocked for months in Velious and Luclin era by the #1 guild, In Virtue, led by our friend Krimz) and to Stromm (where I was in the #1 guild, Realm of Insanity, and we cock-blocked the hell out of the other guilds for months in Luclin, PoP and GoD era). Every mob was FFA. What is different is that there were far fewer whining posers demanding that their level 43 ranger should get a chance at dragon loot.

Maybe everyone ate flowers and farted butterflies on Jeffrey's server, but I sure doubt it. It seems a whole lot more likely that Jeffrey never played end game on live. That would be consistent with the complete lack of substance in every one of his posts.

You're hilarious and you have no idea WTF you are talking about

Things you couldn't do on live

1. Bind in the planes to track 24/7

2. Blatantly train other guilds and get away with it or dot/nuke mezed mobs

3. Charm planar mobs for easy victory

4. Leapfrog other guilds without being reported and there being GM intervention

5. There was no variance in classic. That completely changes the dynamics of a server.

6. If another guild was in a zone clearing towards a boss, it was theirs to engage by rights. None of that gay timer bullshit. It was your guild's mob to engage and kill.

There was/is a lot more hands on involvement on live then there ever will be here. The mechanics on this server are nowhere near classic. It's not even close. Even leveling here is easier. Every server had a different variation of the rules, but generally the Gms didn't tolerate douchebaggery. SOE wanted to keep as many paying customers as possible. If you believe for one second that any developer would allow this type of atmosphere/broken game mechanics on a P2P server you're smoking crack. Trust me, I know a hell of a lot more how SOE operated than you ever will.

You're just a bitter old man past his prime who thinks this server matters or something. This content is yesterday's news and you need to grow the fuck up. You act like a fucking teenager and you're nothing more than a dirty, ugly old man.

[Nedala]

You're hilarious and you have no idea WTF you are talking about

Things you couldn't do on live

1. Bind in the planes to track 24/7

2. Blatantly train other guilds and get away with it or dot/nuke mezed mobs

3. Charm planar mobs for easy victory

4. Leapfrog other guilds without being reported and there being GM intervention

5. There was no variance in classic. That completely changes the dynamics of a server.

6. If another guild was in a zone clearing towards a boss, it was theirs to engage by rights. None of that gay timer bullshit. It was your guild's mob to engage and kill.

There was/is a lot more hands on involvement on live then there ever will be here. The mechanics on this server are nowhere near classic. It's not even close. Even leveling here is easier. Every server had a different variation of the rules, but generally the Gms didn't tolerate douchebaggery. SOE wanted to keep as many paying customers as possible. If you believe for one second that any developer would allow this type of atmosphere/broken game mechanics on a P2P server you're smoking crack. Trust me, I know a hell of a lot more how SOE operated than you ever will.

You're just a bitter old man past his prime who thinks this server matters or something. This content is yesterday's news and you need to grow the fuck up. You act like a fucking teenager and you're nothing more than a dirty, ugly old man.

AND SONOFABITCH

page eighed imo.

[karsten]

proof that you have no clue about classic everquest:

Things you couldn't do on live

1. Bind in the planes to track 24/7


some of the other points you make are seriously LOL also but I thought i'd focus on this one specifically

[Alawen Everywhere]

You're hilarious

Thanks, I try to stay light-hearted about things.

[Kerrik]

Alawen, apparently Dude never played on the Combine (I never played on Stromm to know how things were for top-end raiding there). I pretty much remember every one of his "things you couldn't do on live" happening at various times as the top guilds were competing on Progression.

[randomer]

lets try to keep this clean please guys the flaming doesnt slove any issues, had some decent feedback so far.

[astarothel]

I pretty much remember every one of his "things you couldn't do on live" happening at various times as the top guilds were competing on Progression.

This.

[Zexa]

You're hilarious and you have no idea WTF you are talking about

Things you couldn't do on live

1. Bind in the planes to track 24/7

2. Blatantly train other guilds and get away with it or dot/nuke mezed mobs

3. Charm planar mobs for easy victory

4. Leapfrog other guilds without being reported and there being GM intervention

5. There was no variance in classic. That completely changes the dynamics of a server.

6. If another guild was in a zone clearing towards a boss, it was theirs to engage by rights. None of that gay timer bullshit. It was your guild's mob to engage and kill.

There was/is a lot more hands on involvement on live then there ever will be here. The mechanics on this server are nowhere near classic. It's not even close. Even leveling here is easier. Every server had a different variation of the rules, but generally the Gms didn't tolerate douchebaggery. SOE wanted to keep as many paying customers as possible. If you believe for one second that any developer would allow this type of atmosphere/broken game mechanics on a P2P server you're smoking crack. Trust me, I know a hell of a lot more how SOE operated than you ever will.

You're just a bitter old man past his prime who thinks this server matters or something. This content is yesterday's news and you need to grow the fuck up. You act like a fucking teenager and you're nothing more than a dirty, ugly old man.

Sounds like it's hopeless you'll ever enjoy this server. I'm sorry it didn't work out for you and you feel you need to quit. We will miss you.

[nilbog]

wooohooo, rants and flames.

Bind in the planes to track 24/7haha ok

Blatantly train other guilds and get away with it or dot/nuke mezed mobsHave you tried reporting the people that were training you? That's how we did it in live. It summoned the GMs.

Charm planar mobs for easy victoryWe fix issues based on feedback.... player's feedback. Charm was originally OP, and we nerfed it some more. Haven't heard anything else since. You're saying enchanters couldn't charm things in classic? or just didn't, or its different from here? I know for a fact enchanters on my live server didn't suck.

Leapfrog other guilds without being reported and there being GM interventionDid you miss the raiding experience on p99 *before* there were gm-mandated rules? All people did was report.. and all we were doing is intervening and watching. can't have it both ways. Maybe I should disband your guilds everytime there is an argument? By the way, that's what happend on my live server, circa fall, 1999. Can't get along? Mob is depopped, everyone present is deguilded and sent to your bind. Better luck next time.

There was no variance in classic. That completely changes the dynamics of a server. Well there's a book worth of posts you can read about this topic. I'd prefer it to be 100% classic, but people can't follow what you have listed as # 6 here.

6. If another guild was in a zone clearing towards a boss, it was theirs to engage by rights. None of that gay timer bullshit. It was your guild's mob to engage and kill. rofl. How the fuck do you think people assert those "rights" ? Call a GM and cry? That's all I saw happening prior to raid rules. Still, even now, and every opportunity I get, I say that guilds should work out things between themselves. If a GM is never called, then you won't have to worry about our rules, now will you?

The mechanics on this server are nowhere near classic. It's not even close.The sky is falling. We're doing as well as we can, so I don't see why this was even mentioned :P Do you think we could be doing better or something?

If you believe for one second that any developer would allow this type of atmosphere/broken game mechanics on a P2P server you're smoking crack.Hahhhhhh. *lights up vigorously*

[Desert]

Things you couldn't do on live

1. Bind in the planes to track 24/7 couldn't bind in planes, but you could send somebody up running MacroQuest to /tar the mob you're looking for from across the zone. Can't do that here.

4. Leapfrog other guilds without being reported and there being GM intervention Yes, we could. Wait for X guild to wipe or falter, and pick up their slack while they recover. Technically not a leapfrog, we never got punished for it anyway. GM's came out, and left. 3/5 times we continued killing what we were killing.

6. If another guild was in a zone clearing towards a boss, it was theirs to engage by rights. None of that gay timer bullshit. It was your guild's mob to engage and kill.
please... this is bs for the same reasons we could leapfrog and get away with it.


"You're hilarious and you have no idea WTF you are talking about" ;)

[TheDudeAbides]

proof that you have no clue about classic everquest:



some of the other points you make are seriously LOL also but I thought i'd focus on this one specifically

LOL you're a friggin noob

You couldn't bind in old school planes dumbass. There was no N Wall safe spot to sit afk and track like there is here. This shit is easy mode here compared to how the planes were back in the day. There was one spot NW where you could sit way high on the wall but it was sketchy as hell and not 100% safe. You have no idea WTF you are talking about and it's not surprising.

And Progression servers like combine were not classic.

[TheDudeAbides]

couldn't bind in planes, but you could send somebody up running MacroQuest to /tar the mob you're looking for from across the zone. Can't do that here.

Yes, we could. Wait for X guild to wipe or falter, and pick up their slack while they recover. Technically not a leapfrog, we never got punished for it anyway. GM's came out, and left. 3/5 times we continued killing what we were killing.

please... this is bs for the same reasons we could leapfrog and get away with it.

It's not bullshit. If a guild was clearing towards a mob, another guild couldn't just run by them without getting reported and having some type of GM intervention. At least on the servers I played on back in the day.

You really need to actually get lvl 50 here and raid. It's nothing like classic raiding here.

[nilbog]

You couldn't bind in old school planes dumbass. There was no N Wall safe spot to sit afk and track like there is here.

?? Ok I know for a fact you could bind in fear. As far as N wall camp, that was the preferred strategy up until people realized you could just SW and mez things.

Other planes, I'm not so sure about.

Quick googling of.. +"bind in fear" +everquest

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=%2B%22bind+in+fear%22+%2Beverquest&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=d059ab474882bfe2
I can provide links about the north camp, but hopefully I don't need to!

Erollisi Marr wasn't a candyland server. I remember some great disputes between guilds, that RARELY resulted in GM intervention.

[TheDudeAbides]

[quote]We fix issues based on feedback.... player's feedback. Charm was originally OP, and we nerfed it some more. Haven't heard anything else since. You're saying enchanters couldn't charm things in classic? or just didn't, or its different from here? I know for a fact enchanters on my live server didn't suck.

So maestro was easily taken down with 1 cleric and 1 enchanter back in classic 99. Gotcha. You fixed charm for low lvl chanters being able to perma hold red cons and obliterating zones. You didn't fix it to where chanters can easily hold planar mobs that can quad for 150 with STLW

Did you miss the raiding experience on p99 *before* there were gm-mandated rules? All people did was report.. and all we were doing is intervening and watching. can't have it both ways. Maybe I should disband your guilds everytime there is an argument? By the way, that's what happend on my live server, circa fall, 1999. Can't get along? Mob is depopped, everyone present is deguilded and sent to your bind. Better luck next time.

Gm-mandated rules for a reason. To prevent situations like we see here every single time a raid mob spawns. 100 people in zone squabbling over it. Training. Harassment. Leapfrogging, ect. It's a mess.

Well there's a book worth of posts you can read about this topic. I'd prefer it to be 100% classic, but people can't follow what you have listed as # 6 here.

It's an EQ server with no expansions. The mechanics are nothing like classic.

rofl. How the fuck do you think people assert those "rights" ? Call a GM and cry? That's all I saw happening prior to raid rules. Still, even now, and every opportunity I get, I say that guilds should work out things between themselves. If a GM is never called, then you won't have to worry about our rules, now will you?

So variance/timers/leapfrogging were all classic raiding right? Guilds could just zone into fear when another guild had been clearing there for hours toward draco or CT and just call some stupid 30 minute timer or something? Didn't happen in classic, or there were mass petitions. You're acting like there wasn't a a group of Gms assigned to each server that worked in shifts handling petitions or something. Are you asserting that GM response is the same here as it was in classic or something? I don't understand why you're being so defensive about this shit.

The sky is falling. We're doing as well as we can, so I don't see why this was even mentioned :P Do you think we could be doing better or something?

Again, I don't understand why you are being so defensive about this shit.

For the last time. You could not bind in old school plane of fear. There was no comfy N wall safe spot to sit semi afk either.

[nilbog]

Again, I don't understand why you are being so defensive about this shit. I get defensive about this shit because I work hard on it and it sucks when people spread propaganda lies like its fact. I know thats the nature of the internet, but can't I rant and flame as well?

For the last time. You could not bind in old school plane of fear
Well man, I guess I just have my memories and internet research behind me. Anyone else chime in about binding? I'm positive you could bind in fear, but I'm not sure about hate.

As far as The plane of fear? Yeah I raided fearplane and I'll show you.

Let's do this.

A storyline leading up to a Fear raid and attack on Cazic (bind rush!) would be a nice opening movie for a trilogy ending perhaps in Velious in Temple of Veeshan...or Veeshan's Temple...or even Sleepers Tomb.
http://www.veeshanvault.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=21359&p=376424&hilit=luclin

To go off on a tangent, sometimes you *want* to sit in a fight like that, like when the casters are doing a bind-rush on Cazic Thule or something similar... blow out your mana bar, sit at his feet, and wait for him to kill you (takes a few seconds sometimes). Re-spawn at your nearby bind spot (but not TOO nearby hehe), mem your damage spell, and sprint off for another round. Rinse, repeat until he's dead or all the tanks are. Usually only takes 4 or 5 deaths with a good crew. http://eqbeastiary.allakhazam.com/search.shtml?id=4470&page=4

I used to bind in Fear no problems, that changed? (been 2 years at least since I done that though).When I still played my druid mostly, it was common to bind where ever the raid ended in Fear to make it easier to port a group out and return for more - this was up to a year ago.One thing to consider is that if you end up naked someplace ugly like Fear you won't have your faithstone with you.i'd guess that you can bind in Fear/Mischief but not Hate, because you can technically zone yourself out of those two (but not Hate unless you're a druid/wizard) should you die and not have your faithstone. i once knew an enchanter that was bound in Fear for quite some time to check on the epic spawn there (Shissar).You can still bind in fear or could less than 6 months ago.http://eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?p=208174

Taking over fear is never just "killing the other group", because they bind inside/outside fear and bind rush like there's no tomarrow.3) There is only binding in city zones period. No binding in PoF, no binding anywhere but a city zone.in reference to making it different from eqlive at the time
http://www.lucid-vision.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=5280&view=next

I am pretty sure though that he bound himself in Plane of Fear the day it opened and went to explore it....http://www.erollisimarr.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-26860.html

That halfelf druid was Jangy and he did bind in Fear
I thought Corvid was the one who bound in Fear and lost levels. Wildane, Gopher did it, and I remember that but there was also another incident of deleveling - the druid in Fear. I don't remember any druid named Jangy. Maybe it wasn't Corvid either, since I could've sworn it was a halfling. The only halfling druid I remember from those days was Tyffen and it sure as hell wasn't him.I lost 3 corpses on my first time to Fear because we were told to bind inside. Level aggro made things forget about level 50+ people fighting on the horizon and charge me.lol, i did CT once, we had a lot of high lvls tho and killed him. they had casters bind in fear tho, ZERG! well, wasnt really zerg since only casters, i guess.http://www.diablozone.com/topic/60963/1/Everquest/re-My-twink-ranger.html

[Tudana]

I remember binding in POF up on the North wall.

[Nizzarr]

here is a safe camp. North camp has 1 mob which wanders tehre, a Glare lord, the easiest of the mobs in zone.

I remember this, there was a glare lord that wandered all along the zone wall. I'd like this to be back on this server, and the 2 toads roaming the west wall and that one toad roaming from the north to south, be removed. Those weren't classic 100% sure.

[Nizzarr]

[quote]The slope on the northern wall (not in the trees), where the fire wall and the northern wall are closest together, is pretty safe. The only thing that can kill you is the one wandering glare lord, if its even still there. My druid has been bound there for about 3 years, and have only gotten into a few deathloops You can see Terror, Draco, CT, and Wraith o Shissar from that spot - you can not see Dread, Fright, or Broken Golem. I usually can assume correctly that all 3 golems are up if Terror is... since people usually won't bother clearing to the other 2 and not killing Terror. p/quote]

more about this glare lord

[Gwence]

Dear lord I dont think I've ever seen someone get so completely owned in one thread before.

Poor Jeffrey

[Vyal]

Sorry Nilbog thats a negative on binding in fear in 1999 dood, also you could not bind in hate maybe it was to prevent this type of thing who knows without being able to bind no one single tracker will be able to zone in alone and that is how it was I had this confirm'd on live tonight...

Also SOE has a very good stance on raiding and thats why it works so well.

My memory is still kinda blurry tho..

For instance, the golems in fear should have a chance at dropping items I still remember the first time I saw the amulet on live maybe sometime in dec of 99 and I know that amulet drop'd on a golem.

There are alot of people playing man everyone has like a lvl 50 now there just needs to be more content everything is just way to camped these fights are going to just keep getting worse and worse and worse.

[nilbog]

I'll let someone else take over the linking. I'm not validating myself any more on this topic.

[TheDudeAbides]

I get defensive about this shit because I work hard on it and it sucks when people spread propaganda lies like its fact. I know thats the nature of the internet, but can't I rant and flame as well?

A couple googled message board posts from some anonymous guys and you want to talk about propaganda and lies? There isn't a single time stamped date on any post you provided from 1999. Maybe my memory is blurry and casters could bind there, but as far as I remember that was not possible or people didn't do it because it was suicide to be bound there, since there was no safe spot to just "chill". If you were bound there, you didn't stay bound there.

There was a glare lord or something that pathed right through N Wall safe spot or something. There was no "safe spot" in Fear. That's why "breaking fear" was such a big deal. If you wanted to raid there, you needed to break it or face a horrible CR that could take hours.

If CT spawned while the zone was being cleared, He'd repop the entire zone as well if I remember right which could potentially get very ugly, but we're talking memories from 10 years ago. One thing I know for sure though, is that Fear wasn't a place where you could just go afk and chill solo somewhere.

[Bones]

For instance, the golems in fear should have a chance at dropping items I still remember the first time I saw the amulet on live maybe sometime in dec of 99 and I know that amulet drop'd on a golem.

Pretty sure that wasn't the case till post-revamp of CT.

[Serith]

Ok*

[nilbog]

A couple googled message board posts from some anonymous guys .

Well, there were 15 of them, not a couple. And if it matters, one of those threads had a post from ME in it. I guess I could post 50 more, but it wouldn't make a difference to you.

If you want something changed, make a bug report stating what you believe to be inaccurate about it. I don't see any bug reports about how planar binding should or should not be working. (Like I said, im still of the opinion fear should be bindable, I have no idea about hate, someone bug it if its not supposed to be bindable)I don't see bug reports about that glare lord in fear, (which I'm fixing, thanks Nizzarr.)

I never said that there was a "safe" spot in fear. I said "As far as N wall camp, that was the preferred strategy up until people realized you could just SW and mez things." With enough evidence, like Nizzarr is providing, I can fix it. I'm always down to make things harder, trust me there :D

[Gwence]

Jeffrey is just one of those people that likes to complain about everything, but never has a solution.

AKA a completely useless person

[eqdruid76]

A couple googled message board posts from some anonymous guys and you want to talk about propaganda and lies? There isn't a single time stamped date on any post you provided from 1999. Maybe my memory is blurry and casters could bind there, but as far as I remember that was not possible or people didn't do it because it was suicide to be bound there, since there was no safe spot to just "chill". If you were bound there, you didn't stay bound there.

There was a glare lord or something that pathed right through N Wall safe spot or something. There was no "safe spot" in Fear. That's why "breaking fear" was such a big deal. If you wanted to raid there, you needed to break it or face a horrible CR that could take hours.

If CT spawned while the zone was being cleared, He'd repop the entire zone as well if I remember right which could potentially get very ugly, but we're talking memories from 10 years ago. One thing I know for sure though, is that Fear wasn't a place where you could just go afk and chill solo somewhere.

You realize you're arguing with the guy that's paid hundreds of his own real world dollars to give you something to do on a Saturday night besides masturbate in a tube sock, right?

Perspective.

[Bones]

You realize you're arguing with the guy that's paid hundreds of his own real world dollars to give you something to do on a Saturday night besides masturbate in a tube sock, right?

Perspective.

QFT

[TheDudeAbides]

Well, there were 15 of them, not a couple. And if it matters, one of those threads had a post from ME in it. I guess I could post 50 more, but it wouldn't make a difference to you.

If you want something changed, make a bug report stating what you believe to be inaccurate about it. I don't see any bug reports about how planar binding should or should not be working. (Like I said, im still of the opinion fear should be bindable, I have no idea about hate, someone bug it if its not supposed to be bindable)I don't see bug reports about that glare lord in fear, (which I'm fixing, thanks Nizzarr.)

I never said that there was a "safe" spot in fear. I said "As far as N wall camp, that was the preferred strategy up until people realized you could just SW and mez things." With enough evidence, like Nizzarr is providing, I can fix it. I'm always down to make things harder, trust me there :D

Let me be clear. I'm not trying to argue with you. I do greatly respect the time and effort you folks have put into the server. I want the end game to be enjoyable for people and challenging. I wanted to get to the bottom of this, so I asked some real old school raiding friends what they remember, one was a druid who was one the first players worldwide to set foot in fear. From what he remembers, during the first 2 weeks it was open, anyone could zone in, regardless of level, bind ect.

Then there was a lot of people upset over what was called the "Ogre cam" and then they changed it/tweaked the zone 2 weeks later. Bind may have removed for a time until the fear revamp, at least that's what i remember since nobody back in the day in their right mind actually bound there, since there wasn't a safe spot. My other friend also remembers the same thing. You didn't bind there, especially to sit and track mobs. He absolutely remembers that you could not bind in POH at all, and as a matter of fact, you were only allowed to track Inno from the second floor if I'm not mistaken. The problem is there isn't a complete history of the original EQ patches. SOE's database goes as far back as 2004. FOH and LOS about 2000. I did find one link that had several patch overviews, but the entire history when those fear changes took place are missing which is basically the entire summer of 99.

I'm gonna dig up an old school kunark disk and see if I can dig up some patch history -P

[Dabamf]

Let me be clear. I'm not trying to argue with you. I do greatly respect the time and effort you folks have put into the server. I want the end game to be enjoyable for people and challenging. I wanted to get to the bottom of this, so I asked some real old school raiding friends what they remember, one was a druid who was one the first players worldwide to set foot in fear. From what he remembers, during the first 2 weeks it was open, anyone could zone in, regardless of level, bind ect.

Then there was a lot of people upset over what was called the "Ogre cam" and then they changed it/tweaked the zone 2 weeks later. Bind may have removed for a time until the fear revamp, at least that's what i remember since nobody back in the day in their right mind actually bound there, since there wasn't a safe spot. My other friend also remembers the same thing. You didn't bind there, especially to sit and track mobs. He absolutely remembers that you could not bind in POH at all, and as a matter of fact, you were only allowed to track Inno from the second floor if I'm not mistaken. The problem is there isn't a complete history of the original EQ patches. SOE's database goes as far back as 2004. FOH and LOS about 2000. I did find one link that had several patch overviews, but the entire history when those fear changes took place are missing which is basically the entire summer of 99.

I'm gonna dig up an old school kunark disk and see if I can dig up some patch history -P
First of all: no one cares what you think.

Second of all: Anecdotal memories are absurdly unreliable, as has been proven many times over by psychologists. All this "I remember," "he remembers" bullshit is completely worthless, especially when you are faced against people posting 15 different posts from that era talking about being bound in fear.

You are floating into Siinge-level retardation. I don't think you want to go there.

[TheDudeAbides]

First of all: no one cares what you think.

Second of all: Anecdotal memories are absurdly unreliable, as has been proven many times over by psychologists. All this "I remember," "he remembers" bullshit is completely worthless, especially when you are faced against people posting 15 different posts from that era talking about being bound in fear.

You are floating into Siinge-level retardation. I don't think you want to go there.

You mean like people remembering shit from 4 years previous and posting about it on message boards? That's "absurdly unreliable"? That's why I'd like to get the patch notes. I really want to know.

And yea, I'm not surprised IB doesn't agree with me or something. Big surprise. Plenty of other people do agree with me. /shrug. Either way, the larger point was that there was no safe spot to sit in fear and track. Not at the N wall. Not anywhere. So if they are going to add that roamer, they also need to fix temple aggro as well so you can't sit right within the fire ring and track. There shouldn't be any way to sit in that zone without fear of aggro/death with a full pop. Some mobs were able to even see rogue stealth randomly as well back in the day if I recall.

They also should fix tracking in Hate, to where you can't bind there or track Innorruuk from zone. You guys didn't agree with me that mobs couldn't be harmonied in Hate, or that Maestro couldn't be killed with 1 cleric and 1 enchanter, even though they had been doing it for months.

[karsten]

eventually if you keep backpedaling you'll render your original post so encompassingly null and void that it'll be like it never happened!

ta-daa

[Dabamf]

You mean like people remembering shit from 4 years previous and posting about it on message boards? That's "absurdly unreliable"? .
Yes, it is. Unless you wanna dispute peer-reviewed science.

When a bunch of people come together with the same memory, like those saying you could bind in fear, it is more reliable. But a lone Siinge-esque retard arguing against 8 people and 15 posts from 2000, using only memory as evidence, is the definition of unreliable.

You've gone off the deepend. Didn't you quit like over a month ago? Why do you still care what happens? It's pretty pathetic

[spoolie]

http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/19992002.php

patch history have fun =D

[TheDudeAbides]

Yes, it is. Unless you wanna dispute peer-reviewed science.

When a bunch of people come together with the same memory, like those saying you could bind in fear, it is more reliable. But a lone Siinge-esque retard arguing against 8 people and 15 posts from 2000, using only memory as evidence, is the definition of unreliable.


So remembering content from 10 years ago is now "peer reviewed" science?

Other people agree with me bro. I'm not alone in this recollection. I'll dig up the patch notes. If I'm wrong about the bind, then I'm wrong about it. That doesn't mean I'm backing away shit. You're hilarious. It still doesn't change the fact nobody actually bound there to gate and go sit and track AFK back in the day. There was no "safe spot" to sit and track shit.

Maestro couldn't be duo'd with a cleric and enchanter

Couldn't bind in hate. Couldn't track Inny from ZL (AFAIR). There are lot of mechanics that could be changed here to make the end game a lot more appealing than it currently stands now and you know this. The sit and track without any danger in the planes to summon people" raiding scene here doesn't reflect classic. There needs to be a danger to the planes that is severely lacking atm.

[Dabamf]

So remembering content from 10 years ago is now "peer reviewed" science?
.

What? WHAT? You're trolling, aren't you? Please tell me you're trolling.

[TheDudeAbides]

http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/19992002.php

patch history have fun =D

Yea I saw this already. There is missing data here though that happens to be the patch where they changed rules in fear. For example, you could no longer be level 1 and enter the zone.

[karsten]

ohhhhhhh

I'm glad we cleared that up

[Kinamur1999]

Yea I saw this already. It didn't prove my point so it's obviously inaccurate.

:rolleyes:

[Alawen Everywhere]

It's pretty obvious at this point that Jeffrey doesn't have any memories from live. He has an idea of safe raiding from WoW and an egomaniacal concept of fairness, probably from being the weak younger child of an over-protective mother. Jeffrey was a school boy during live.

I don't address him in the first person because arguing with right fighters is pointless.

[ooantipostoo]

?? Ok I know for a fact you could bind in fear. As far as N wall camp, that was the preferred strategy up until people realized you could just SW and mez things.

Other planes, I'm not so sure about.

Quick googling of.. +"bind in fear" +everquest

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=%2B%22bind+in+fear%22+%2Beverquest&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=d059ab474882bfe2
I can provide links about the north camp, but hopefully I don't need to!

Erollisi Marr wasn't a candyland server. I remember some great disputes between guilds, that RARELY resulted in GM intervention.

This is 100% legit, I played since Beta. Back in the day some guilds would just have a cleric camped there and have rogue drag the whole raid of corpse's to NW. It was part of the game and used as a strategy.

[Isildur]

NOTHING WILL EVER FULLY PLEASE JEFFREY. It's like arguing with Finawin about ANYTHING, it just hurts the brain. "probably from being the weak younger child of an over-protective mother. Jeffrey was a school boy during live." this sums it up perfectly.

[Ektar]

fucking finawin! amirite!

[Kinamur1999]

Finawin has lost his nuts.

Maybe by the time hes done with his broad his ban will be repealed ;p

[Aeolwind]

Around the end of January in 2000 is when I made my first trip into fear, I was level 46 by one kill. I get a tell from Daethdor of Ice Clan, "bind now dude, this will be ugly", I bind, by the end of the 24 hour raid "night" I've been 45 6 times, been 46 7 times.

First month-ish fear was open you could zone in at any level and it was a city zone; bindable by everyone. That got changed cause someone realized that level 1's were getting Russet & could pull with no Risk vs Reward, suck up DT's, you name it... Fear was, prior to 2k6 when I quit, not changed. Casters could still bind there. I distinctly remember getting one of my best RL friends his Wiz Epic, and I bound there so I could bind rush/heal in case shit got ugly, and that was 2k4/5?