Fire , Cold and MAGIC

[Sprinkle]

How many of you know the difference between the 3

apparently most dont , including staff

many of you played eq back when it was young , many played through luclin and pop , and god , dodh , etc etc

i need some people to back me up here so far only person who has is darworth ( SP? )

basically it goes like this

MAGIC has its own resist table

where you start to see massive resists on roots / snares and magic based DD around 100

at 150 it makes you close to immune to these things , but some do land

FIRE / COLD do not share this table , nor did they ever in eq
i talked to several people during the event who were buffed and had bards

even veto will confirm he had 177 cold resist

and 3 ice comets = 59 dmg each


THIS IS WRONG

having 100 to fire or cold made you shave off 30% of the dmg on live , and maybe maybe a 10% total outright resist , if you are lucky

having 150 to either of those resists let you shave off maybe 40 , 50 on some casts , but 20% or so of them got through for a nice hit

with the current system in place right now , i had 14 ice comets hit for 59 fucking damage

yes thats tonight at the event , where alot of people were naked / half geared / using rusty weapons or what not

yes i know what your saying , i did get some kills , and i did 750 quite a few people


but those people were naked practically

with the current system you become a god at 150 resist to spells , and this is just dumb

if things followed through the way they currently are wizards are basically pointless , and while i feel that you have no idea about how tables worked and how to even go about fixing them i dont honestly think anything will change

you can push the server back all you want but it seems the dev's miss the fundamentals of the game completely , meaning none of them even played on pvp when it was classic.

also PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT WITH 150 COLD OR FIRE IF YOU GO TO TOV YOU WILL RESIST MOST EVERYTHING IN THAT TABLE

this is FOR PVP NOT PVE

if you go to seb with 150 to those resists youll be super happy with what your resists are , why?

Because pvp and pve are different tables too ! Yes they are ! wowo

you should not need lures to fucking pvp on classic

lures didnt come till later because shit didnt become resistant till later , excluding plane of sky stuff ( i dont even know if sky was classic )

and yes lovely i saw you got alot of kills , i saw plenty of scrubs to kill too

but you had no big names that were buffed

i was fucked from the start because when i went into the building to get my gear , the gm magically gave me all my spells * i didnt need them *

and reset all my specializations to 1

which made ice comet take 30% of my mana to cast ( super )

[Darwoth]

yeah its pretty retarded, thought i had explained this in detail to good ol null and made some headway but it looks like we are back in retardville where a melee with some shit gear will be immune to everything.

100 resistance shaved off on average 15% - 20%

150 25% - 35%

200 45% - 50%

making it so anyone with 100 resistance is going to take 30 damage on half of the casts is just plain retarded and i dont understand why it seems so impossible to grasp this.

[Lovely]

with the current system in place right now , i had 14 ice comets hit for 59 fucking damage

This happened to me disturbingly often at this event. Run up to a guy and gogo comet.. Boom 59 dmg.. Same deal with Conflag and other nukes.

[Null]

minimum partials are too low at higher levels of resistance, got it.

[Tamiah2011]

yeah its pretty retarded, thought i had explained this in detail to good ol null and made some headway but it looks like we are back in retardville where a melee with some shit gear will be immune to everything.

100 resistance shaved off on average 15% - 20%

150 25% - 35%

200 45% - 50%

making it so anyone with 100 resistance is going to take 30 damage on half of the casts is just plain retarded and i dont understand why it seems so impossible to grasp this.




Think i said this the first day I played after patch and refused to play intill resistance were fixed, I had a sk resti everyone of my 49 lvl DDs and pet could not even root him.I have 148 int and still total restis.

[Darwoth]

minimum partials are too low at higher levels of resistance, got it.

needs to be in the range we tested dude, around 150 instead of 30. while an artificial fix it would at least bring it much more in line with classic in the 140 - 200 resistance range, should obviously be much higher at the lower end.

[Null]

Think i said this the first day I played after patch and refused to play intill resistance were fixed, I had a sk resti everyone of my 49 lvl DDs and pet could not even root him.I have 148 int and still total restis.

You need to try under the most recent patch, you will never got a full resist on your direct damage spells. Also, int has no bearing on your spells landing.

[Darwoth]

with elemental single effect nukes you never got full resists anyway beyond the 5% or whatever default that you got against all spells, i know your trying to get it right but you need to stop thinking that the "no full resists" thing is a buff when instead of a 5% chance to outright resist you have a 40 or 50% chance to do less damage than you could melee for.

[Tamiah2011]

You need to try under the most recent patch, you will never got a full resist on your direct damage spells. Also, int has no bearing on your spells landing.

It should on dmg done,But why is a 50 lvl getting all us 49 lvl DD resisted from a player equal in lvl? I played RZ and I sure dosnt feel right at all.I casted a total of 5 times and was resisted 5 times and pet could not root the player and my earth pet was 49 lvl..Please explain.

[Amuk]

Shit seemed pretty good to me. Hard to tell off one fight but shit seemed to be landing correctly for the gear most of us had - enchanters were effective, necros were very powerful. Hard to tell with wizards, only two i saw instantly yondered for max distance every time I ran into them.

[Tamiah2011]

Null I am not trying to bust your balls, but a total bar of mana wasted at 50lvl and not land 1 hit??? Even if they had 150 resti this should be that way..

[Tamiah2011]

Shit seemed pretty good to me. Hard to tell off one fight but shit seemed to be landing correctly for the gear most of us had - enchanters were effective, necros were very powerful. Hard to tell with wizards, only two i saw instantly yondered for max distance every time I ran into them.

Well I play a mage and there something wrong ..lol

[Amuk]

Well I didn't see any mages, so I can't comment - but it seems like you were playing before the resist patch, and added your completely broken english makes me believe you're playing incorrectly - not trying to be a dick. A lot of mages play well by assisting their pet, dispelling/keeping it buffed etc - I had a necro pet, and an enchanter pet on me at different times, both did really good and the necro pet could have probably soloed me.

[Darwoth]

pretty sure pets dont fall into the whole cold fire magic resistance discussion.

[lethdar]

Well I play a mage and there something wrong ..lol

Can you post screenshots of your nukes getting chain resisted by a level 50 since the latest patch? Seems pretty doubtful.

[Sprinkle]

before the fight i ran into the holo blo0b and g fluxxed for fun , hit everyone for 200

why is it something silly like that lands hehe and not ice comet

im glad to see lovely agreed with me about ice comet , it hit about as hard as the level 8 nuke

perty win

and thanks for not ripping me up guys and supporting me

[Tamiah2011]

Well I didn't see any mages, so I can't comment - but it seems like you were playing before the resist patch, and added your completely broken english makes me believe you're playing incorrectly - not trying to be a dick. A lot of mages play well by assisting their pet, dispelling/keeping it buffed etc - I had a necro pet, and an enchanter pet on me at different times, both did really good and the necro pet could have probably soloed me.

What does this have to do with DD hitting a target? and yes this was right after the v18 patch.I dont give a crap what resist a player has , if there equal lvl with me, I should not have all my spells resisted 100 percent of the time with zero damage to them.

[Sprinkle]

ended up using conflag which reliably hit for 400

wait

400 fire damage i thought i was a wizard not druid#_544434

[Amuk]

After a couple minutes I would almost go as far as saying a good mage, with a pet hasted/sow'd and junk buffed would be fucking OP after that event, when I say the pets were tearing me up it's really an understatement.

I realise it doesn't hit at the cr/fr/mr thing Darwoth but a mage complaining with how shit is currently is just not doing shit right, not to derail the thread.

[Tamiah2011]

Can you post screenshots of your nukes getting chain resisted by a level 50 since the latest patch? Seems pretty doubtful.

I did not take take screen shot, It was first night after patch and I told Null in OOC I was quitting intill resists were fixed and logged out.My earth pet could not even root this SK~~~I was sorta freaking pissed

[Tamiah2011]

After a couple minutes I would almost go as far as saying a good mage, with a pet hasted/sow'd and junk buffed would be fucking OP after that event, when I say the pets were tearing me up it's really an understatement.

I realise it doesn't hit at the cr/fr/mr thing Darwoth but a mage complaining with how shit is currently is just not doing shit right, not to derail the thread.

Dude what lvl are you???Do you even have gear on???What class?

[Amuk]

Well it was for the event so I as 50 with some planar/decent shit yeah, go test your nuke now and post the results with what your resists are - and expecting your pet to root in pvp is lol.

[Amuk]

Think i said this the first day I played after patch and refused to play intill resistance were fixed, I had a sk resti everyone of my 49 lvl DDs and pet could not even root him.I have 148 int and still total restis.

Nvm gona go to bed - the easiest answer is you just need higher int, then your nukes will destroy that sk.

[Null]

Minimum Partials have been increased (thanks Rogean).

In the future though, please remember that this is beta. I shouldn't need to dissect a novel of bullshit to get feedback that could have fit in 2 sentences.

I will throw a thread up for feedback on the Resist System in general, please direct any meaningful info to that thread.

[Knuckle]

Pets are retardedly powerful. Necro pet is better tank than warrior in raid gear.

[Bazia]

uhm we have been doing organized pvp battles in Qeynos Hills.

I have yet to resist IC in anyway at all getting hit for full 750's repeatedly.

Why y'all whining?

[Sprinkle]

whats your name so i know to nuke you instead cause it isnt working on anyone else

[Lovely]

My event was basically like this.

If I found a solo player then my IC and roots seemed to work okay. Most likely cause they weren't buffed or had recently died.

Everytime I nuked a Holocaust member or other people in zerg groups then my IC hit for 60 and my root resisted 29 of 30. Due to them having buffs and most likely 150+ in MR/CR.

I also noticed that my IC almost never had like 30-40-50-60% partials. It either hit for 60 or 750 pretty much.

[Diggles]

out of the event i maybe got one or two 400+ hits on druid, the rest were hitting from 30 to 100.

dots worked fine tho

[Tamiah2011]

Pets are retardedly powerful. Necro pet is better tank than warrior in raid gear.

Pets were always powerful, really what can a mage do really without a pet~~~nothing ty

[Rust1d?]

ITT: Holocost already trying to k&b the server by complaining about pets

[Sprinkle]

does not matter really the basic dmg of high end nukes is just too fucking low

they just making a melee zerg server

[lethdar]

My event was basically like this.

If I found a solo player then my IC and roots seemed to work okay. Most likely cause they weren't buffed or had recently died.

Everytime I nuked a Holocaust member or other people in zerg groups then my IC hit for 60 and my root resisted 29 of 30. Due to them having buffs and most likely 150+ in MR/CR.

I also noticed that my IC almost never had like 30-40-50-60% partials. It either hit for 60 or 750 pretty much.

Everytime you nuked a holocaust member they probably had bard resists on, and 200+ to resists.

[Tamiah2011]

Everytime you nuked a holocaust member they probably had bard resists on, and 200+ to resists.

smart guy did you not even see her demo pics?

[Sprinkle]

only way you should be resisting nukes in the way people are here with 200 resist

is if you had 550

its obviousley not possible to get past 300 till vex thal ,

and you wont touch 400 till psalm of veeshan and elemental gear

but point being

at around 200 on classic you become a god

and thats wrong

new win class of r99 = SK

roll em out ogres n trolls ready to

[Knuckle]

Everytime you nuked a holocaust member they probably had bard resists on, and 200+ to resists.

My MR was around 260 because Cast is a good Bard and Twisted selos/resist song. We had GRM and full resist buffs and people are crying about resist rates at 250+ FR/MR/CR.

Anytime I wasn't in range of bard songs 50-75% of snares and roots stuck, if anything they need to tweak that shit to stop landing so much at the 175 MR range.

[Knuckle]

only way you should be resisting nukes in the way people are here with 200 resist

is if you had 550

its obviousley not possible to get past 300 till vex thal ,

and you wont touch 400 till psalm of veeshan and elemental gear

but point being

at around 200 on classic you become a god

and thats wrong

new win class of r99 = SK

roll em out ogres n trolls ready to

I hate to continually reference this guide, but this is a velious era PVP Guide written in 2002-03 by one of the best PVP rogues on TZ. Look at what he has to say about resists
http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2872
Gear
If you have the prescribed weapons, you are most of the way there. Keep your PvE set of AC/HP gear current and it will do for melee classes. Keep a set of resist gear and wear it constantly. Mix your gear up depending on who you are going to fight, by default wear your resist gear. It is best if your AC/HP gear counts as resist gear as well. A proper list of available resist gear is amazingly long, simply search on any EQ info site. To vaguely get an idea of which item you should wear, sum the total amount of resist it has and compare, giving proper weight to more important resists as needed.

Recommended Resists by Order of Importance:
1. Magic: 160-180+ (minimum 140) At this level it is exceedingly rare to be snared/rooted but it occasionally happens when tashed/maloed. Most magic DDs will be resisted totally or partially. Normal mezzes should be resisted.
2. Heat: 140-180+ (minimum 120) Many classes use fire, and it hits hard.
3. Disease: 130-160+ (minimum 100) Most useful against Pox of Bertoxxulous. Pox will stick a good bit at 80 and the surrounding range. Insidious Malady is highly difficult to resist and will decrease disease resist by a lot. It takes 2 charges of SHM cure disease potion to cure and is fast casting. PoB takes 2 charges as well.
3. Poison: 120-140+ (minimum 100) Most useful vs. Envenomed Bolt (ebolt) and Bane of Nife. Same success rate as PoB, perhaps a little lower.
3. Cold: 120-140+ (minimum 100) Not used very much. Shaman nukes and bracer mostly, occasionally druid, rarely wizard.

[Tamiah2011]

I hate to continually reference this guide, but this is a velious era PVP Guide written in 2002-03 by one of the best PVP rogues on TZ. Look at what he has to say about resists
http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2872
Gear
If you have the prescribed weapons, you are most of the way there. Keep your PvE set of AC/HP gear current and it will do for melee classes. Keep a set of resist gear and wear it constantly. Mix your gear up depending on who you are going to fight, by default wear your resist gear. It is best if your AC/HP gear counts as resist gear as well. A proper list of available resist gear is amazingly long, simply search on any EQ info site. To vaguely get an idea of which item you should wear, sum the total amount of resist it has and compare, giving proper weight to more important resists as needed.

Recommended Resists by Order of Importance:
1. Magic: 160-180+ (minimum 140) At this level it is exceedingly rare to be snared/rooted but it occasionally happens when tashed/maloed. Most magic DDs will be resisted totally or partially. Normal mezzes should be resisted.
2. Heat: 140-180+ (minimum 120) Many classes use fire, and it hits hard.
3. Disease: 130-160+ (minimum 100) Most useful against Pox of Bertoxxulous. Pox will stick a good bit at 80 and the surrounding range. Insidious Malady is highly difficult to resist and will decrease disease resist by a lot. It takes 2 charges of SHM cure disease potion to cure and is fast casting. PoB takes 2 charges as well.
3. Poison: 120-140+ (minimum 100) Most useful vs. Envenomed Bolt (ebolt) and Bane of Nife. Same success rate as PoB, perhaps a little lower.
3. Cold: 120-140+ (minimum 100) Not used very much. Shaman nukes and bracer mostly, occasionally druid, rarely wizard.

Again Resists should work by lower damaging taken, but not totally resisting spells 75 percent of the time.You should alway take alittle damage, would melee like it if they missed 75 percent of the time?That why we AC and it lower dmg taken.

[Knuckle]

Again Resists should work by lower damaging taken, but not totally resisting spells 75 percent of the time.You should alway take alittle damage, would melee like it if they missed 75 percent of the time?That why we AC and it lower dmg taken.

melees pretty much do miss 60% of the time, I don't think there is ANY improvement in the hiterate from level 1 to 50.

[Tamiah2011]

melees pretty much do miss 60% of the time, I don't think there is ANY improvement in the hiterate from level 1 to 50.

I have played many melee classes and don't remimber missing 60 percent of the time, maybe 30 percent if they were a high agi toon.

[mimixownzall]

This is true. Clerics would bitch they could never land a nuke on people who had MR resists that were lower than their MR (MR would be 120 and CR/FR would be 140) while the other classes could land theirs.

This also sucked big time for mages. Their bolts were LoS sensitive (other players could block it) so they had to use their shock line and they would get resisted way easier than their fire nukes.

But this discussion is moot. It has already been said that classic resists are not being taken into account.

[Nirgon]

Gravity flux was another one of those easy as shit to resist spells :P.

[Cymbal]

minimum partials are too low at higher levels of resistance, got it.

I really doubt you should change this too much... yet.

My question to you all is how much resists do you think people will be running around with unbuffed at lvl 50?

i think then we can base a system out of that.

looking forward to some feedback

[Knuckle]

You guys are opening pandoras box, if you are trying to make an argument for spells to land better than classic then you better expect a boost to melee damage/hit rate, otherwise fuck off and get used to bard groups with raid gear resisting ur bullshit spells and stick to ur OP pets. :)

[Tamiah2011]

You guys are opening pandoras box, if you are trying to make an argument for spells to land better than classic then you better expect a boost to melee damage/hit rate, otherwise fuck off and get used to bard groups with raid gear resisting ur bullshit spells and stick to ur OP pets. :)

Knuckle if your sitting there fighting a pet your a complete &^^%^ .How does the pet help a Purecaster in 1v1 melee vs caster fight? A necro don't even need a pet for pvp m vs c fight, Mages need earth pet so they can cast a spell without a strong earth pet a mage has zero chance in pvp.

[gloinz]

Knuckle if your sitting there fighting a pet your a complete &^^%^ .How does the pet help a Purecaster in 1v1 melee vs caster fight? A necro don't even need a pet for pvp m vs c fight, Mages need earth pet so they can cast a spell without a strong earth pet a mage has zero chance in pvp.

learn to kite joust climb trees etc

[Tamiah2011]

learn to kite joust climb trees etc

o please sthu lol..

[Knuckle]

Knuckle if your sitting there fighting a pet your a complete &^^%^ .How does the pet help a Purecaster in 1v1 melee vs caster fight? A necro don't even need a pet for pvp m vs c fight, Mages need earth pet so they can cast a spell without a strong earth pet a mage has zero chance in pvp.

Ok wow, have any clue how hard your pets hit and interrupt casting pumice? not sure if serious or trolling.

[Tamiah2011]

Ok wow, have any clue how hard your pets hit and interrupt casting pumice? not sure if serious or trolling.

you realize your the first player I ever heard complain about a pure caster pet hitting to hard in pvp, and I have been playing since 99.Please stop knuckles your making me laugh so hard.

[Crenshinabon]

Sayin mages have zero chance in pvp if earth pet root doesnt land is fkin crazy. Tamiah stop trollin up the boards with your nonsense. Go buy some freaking shadowstep potions if you are so worried about melee. Cast levitate and go stand on a tree. This guy is fkin crazy.

[Tamiah2011]

Sayin mages have zero chance in pvp if earth pet root doesnt land is fkin crazy. Tamiah stop trollin up the boards with your nonsense. Go buy some freaking shadowstep potions if you are so worried about melee. Cast levitate and go stand on a tree. This guy is fkin crazy.

Yes a melee guy complaining about a pet hitting tooo hard is crazy..

[Sprinkle]

love how people cry about mages high end

when at level 8 they CRIED SO BAD about earth pets just killing them super slow as mages sit at the newbie lift in gfay and just med

i heard so many people cry cause you really cant do anything about the pets

[Darwoth]

You guys are opening pandoras box, if you are trying to make an argument for spells to land better than classic then you better expect a boost to melee damage/hit rate, otherwise fuck off and get used to bard groups with raid gear resisting ur bullshit spells and stick to ur OP pets. :)

nobody is asking for spells to land more than classic, their asking for spells to land at least close to it.

if you think the current system for damage spells is correct you are clearly a resident of emu servers and never the live ones.

[Cymbal]

I know u want star fire to land consistently for 420 in pvp...

its too much damage

[Darwoth]

I know u want star fire to land consistently for 420 in pvp...

its too much damage

it appears we have a freudian slip into why your such a retard.

[Nirgon]

You betta stop Knuckles

[casdegere]

only way you should be resisting nukes in the way people are here with 200 resist

is if you had 550

its obviousley not possible to get past 300 till vex thal ,

and you wont touch 400 till psalm of veeshan and elemental gear

but point being

at around 200 on classic you become a god

and thats wrong

new win class of r99 = SK

roll em out ogres n trolls ready to

It does definitely seem that Disease/Poison Dots and based spells seem to be the least resisted and most effective. Roll up a Dark Elf necro and a Dark Elf wizard in beta with the same Int. ( I did this)Test the dot and Nuke spells against a naked Dark Elf Warrior. You will definitely see a difference in how often the Ice/Fire spells land or get almost completely resisted vs the Disease/Poison based spells.

[Harrison]

love how people cry about mages high end

when at level 8 they CRIED SO BAD about earth pets just killing them super slow as mages sit at the newbie lift in gfay and just med

i heard so many people cry cause you really cant do anything about the pets

Lol at level 8 the only thing you were doing was crying in OOC for 6-8 hours