Casters vs Melee THE TRUTH (SCREENSHOTS + INFO)

[Lovely]

So after reading several posts on these forums about people crying that root/snare/stun is overpowered and that melee suck ass blablabla. I decided to log on and find a level 50 melee and actually show you the truth.

All these people posting this shit like makeyoumad,Bockscar and several other people they do not have a level 50 melee on beta nor have they tested shit. EVERY single level 50 melee player I had a normal discussion with on beta feel that melee's are strong and not weak in any way.

So anyways. I logged on 5 minutes ago to find a level 50 melee and lucky me I found one right away. Someone who I have had several battles with before and actually never managed to kill. On a side note: EVERY single INT/WIS caster I find die like little bitches. The only people I have issues with are level 50 melee's due to their high fkin HP and that you actually only find them inside dungeons and you really don't have a chance in there. Spells have to long casting time and you'll lose 20-40% just during the cast and then it might even interrupt. + that half of them got slams and the smart ones uses it half way into your cast so they get a lot of damage in before interrupting.

This is me login on after reading ridiculous posts from people on forums.

http://imageshack.dk/imagesfree/xpy30871.jpg

http://imageshack.dk/imagesfree/Fm230876.jpg

The text speaks for itself. Luckily he agreed to me testing some spells on him. More screenshots incoming

http://imageshack.dk/imagesfree/uRO30880.jpg

I decided to try some CC on him first just to show you how it actually is when using CC. During the time of those failed CC attempts he would have hit me several times, used SK spells on me. He would also been able to interrupt them. After my attempts he told me he had 60 MR. So even at a MR that low I'm already having huge issues.

Then he allowed me to Ice comet him 3 times which is the max I can do. If you include a few CC attempts + 3 ICE COMET that leaves me OOM with only mana for gate and yonder left. After my 3 Ice comet he still had 39% hp left and he wasn't even attacking me during it just taking them. So normally he would have hit several lifetaps, other spells and melee swings and probably killed me ages ago since every Comet is 6.3 second cast which is AGES!!!

Screenshots from that.

http://imageshack.dk/imagesfree/fg930886.jpg

This is a guy that doesn't even have HIGH MR, FR or CR. He has bad PVP gear and it would still be 100% impossible for me to kill him. THE BEST GEARED 50 WIZARD ON THE SERVER. No one even has close to the gear I have and yet I'm not even close when he AIN'T EVEN FIGHTING ME BACK!?!?! He can fkin AFK and I can't kill him and if he actually fight I'm toast. Good luck me fighting him inside a dungeon..........

Just some small talk after the "FIGHT"

http://imageshack.dk/imagesfree/SKU30892.jpg


Here you have it, best geared caster on the server vs AFK medium geared 50 melee.

[Aksiom2k]

nice post

[Billbike]

I think a necro wins, vs Any melee.

I think wiz wins vs monk or rog.

Enchanter with hasted pet wins vs any melee, barring a random wearing off of charm.

Great post though.

[MakeYouMad]

Extremely misleading post.

It's an OGRE SK. Guess what? Just about every class in the game has trouble killing those. Why don't you log on a warrior, monk, or rogue and try fighting him next so you can get the same result. He could probably kill 3 rogues at the same time.

SK have a +40 cold resist buff too. It's basically the worst class you could fight as a wizard and you use that as an example. You also have enough mana for at least 4 ice comets while playing a low intelligence race instead of DE.

Anyway, nobody even posted anything about 1vs1 balance. People posted about CC spells being used to zerg down targets for free kills like the Rexx video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uo1hmS4H5Rk

[Palemoon]

Great post, thanks for silencing more trolls bent on just OPing their own prospective class.

[Lovely]

The whole point of this thread is just to show that melee's aren't some baby sheep walking around while all casters are wolfs. That's so far from the truth it's not even funny. Everyone will have an edge towards one and another at different locations. It all depends on the environment of the situation. I'm gonna roll a Monk and I'm not scared of any class anywhere tbh. Especially not when I'll spend most of my time inside dungeons where I basically have an edge vs any class. There is also enough utility items out there to make me comfortable even in the middle of Karana's as a Monk.

It just annoys me so much when people sit and write DUDE as Wizard on beta you rape rogues. MAN... Ill rape a ROGUE WITH ANY CLASS I PLAY. Rogues are shit in pvp and that's no news to anyone. I can be a Warrior, Paladin, Mage, Druid, Enchanter whatever. I will walk over any rogue if not two at the same time with any class I play.

Tanks

Paladin - STRONG in PVP

Shadow Knight - STRONG in PVP

Warrior - STRONG in PVP

Priests

Cleric - STRONG in PVP

Druid - STRONG in PVP

Shaman - STRONG in PVP

Melee

Monk - STRONG in PVP

Ranger - STRONG in PVP

Rogue - SHIT IN PVP

Bard - STRONG in PVP

Casters

Enchanter - STRONG in PVP

Magician - STRONG in PVP

Necromancer - STRONG in PVP

Wizard - STRONG in PVP

If you can't make the classes I wrote "STRONG IN PVP" on then you are just bad and there is no hope for you no matter what class you play.

[MakeYouMad]

Great post, thanks for silencing more trolls bent on just OPing their own prospective class.

Lol? What did he prove besides that Ogre SK's are a good PvP class with a lot of HP which everyone already knew? Other melee classes could make all of the same complaints about Ogre SK's that he just did with his wizard.

Change that SK's race to dark elf and he probably loses 300hp and suddenly becomes killable in 3 nukes.

[Palemoon]

Lol? What did he prove besides that Ogre SK's are a good PvP class with a lot of HP which everyone already knew? Other melee classes could make all of the same complaints about Ogre SK's that he just did with his wizard.

Change that SK's race to dark elf and he probably loses 300hp and suddenly becomes killable in 3 nukes.

He provided a lot more in game data and evidence than you ever have.

/thread

[Lovely]

Extremely misleading post.

It's an OGRE SK. Guess what? Just about every class in the game has trouble killing those. Why don't you log on a warrior, monk, or rogue and try fighting him next so you can get the same result. He could probably kill 3 rogues at the same time.

SK have a +40 cold resist buff too. It's basically the worst class you could fight as a wizard and you use that as an example. You also have enough mana for at least 4 ice comets while playing a low intelligence race instead of DE.

Anyway, nobody even posted anything about 1vs1 balance. People posted about CC spells being used to zerg down targets for free kills like the Rexx video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uo1hmS4H5Rk


You can see what FR he had on the screenshots and that is LOW FR. FR is the easiest resist to get in the game. 4 COMET? Who? You gotta be kidding me, no one can do 4 COMET if they wanna be able to USE A SINGLE OTHER SPELL you dumbshit. Can't you see how many Crowd control spells I need to use to even land anything on him? You wouldn't even be able to use 4 COMET if you have 2k mana and no one will have 2k mana. You make it sound like I can stand and spam 4x 6.3 SECOND SPELLS on anyone in this game lol. To land 4 comet you need like 1k mana of CC. You're an idiot and it seems you know nothing about PVP beside posting bullshit. Either you're just an BEYOND awful player who fail at every class you play or you have no freaking clue about anything.

I've had fights vs 50 monks and 50 warriors on the beta and it's EXACTLY THE SAME THING. The monk will lose some HP then he use mend and I'm oom and this is in an outdoor situation. The Warrior LOL? I'm not even close to doing 100% of his HP alone. Just getting 3 Ice comet on a target outdoor is almost impossible. It won't even happen at all if they got Jboots. You can outrun the cast so fucking easily and it takes forever to keep anyone snared and rooted that many times for you to even land 3 Ice comet. Running away from a solo person is so fucking easy as a melee in EQ. The only people I actually kill when I jump them is other INT/WIS classes cause they die in 1x comet and a small nuke and if they don't do that then they can also flee easily.

You can talk about group pvp as well. If you outnumber someone then you will kill them no matter what class they are. It doesn't matter if they are a Necro stuck in Karana or a Rogue, both will die like a little bitch.

[Lovely]

Lol? What did he prove besides that Ogre SK's are a good PvP class with a lot of HP which everyone already knew? Other melee classes could make all of the same complaints about Ogre SK's that he just did with his wizard.

Change that SK's race to dark elf and he probably loses 300hp and suddenly becomes killable in 3 nukes.

I barely did 1300 damage and getting that much damage alone on anyone is almost impossible unless they are AFK in this first place. Not a single Wizard in this universe will be able to land 3 comet on me if I play a rogue, monk, warrior or any other melee class it just ain't happening in this world. CC isn't strong enough for that to work. You can pumice and run out of range of any big nuke all day long.

[Smedy]

Ouch, good post, i'll drop my new found wisdom @ null

[MakeYouMad]

The whole point of this thread is just to show that melee's aren't some baby sheep walking around while all casters are wolfs.


You have 0 PvP server experience so you totally overlook the fact that casters are usually coming at you in duos or more.

On Sullon Zek, you would see <Darkenbane> duos of wizard/druid everywhere. On VZTZ, you would have 6 mages attacking you all at the same time. Your little screen shots here are nothing like real world PvP.

How much HP does a monk have? Like 1500? Now imagine being sync dumped by two ice comets.

Casters are going to insta gib people, just because you can't solo an ogre SK with your wizard doesn't mean anything. Let's not forget that pure melee won't even see the caster coming with no see invis item. Half the time you'll probably be standing there fighting an NPC then a wizard de-cloaks behind you and you instantly explode.

[gloinz]

You can see what FR he had on the screenshots and that is LOW FR. FR is the easiest resist to get in the game. 4 COMET? Who? You gotta be kidding me, no one can do 4 COMET if they wanna be able to USE A SINGLE OTHER SPELL you dumbshit. Can't you see how many Crowd control spells I need to use to even land anything on him? You wouldn't even be able to use 4 COMET if you have 2k mana and no one will have 2k mana. You make it sound like I can stand and spam 4x 6.3 SECOND SPELLS on anyone in this game lol. To land 4 comet you need like 1k mana of CC. You're an idiot and it seems you know nothing about PVP beside posting bullshit. Either you're just an BEYOND awful player who fail at every class you play or you have no freaking clue about anything.

I've had fights vs 50 monks and 50 warriors on the beta and it's EXACTLY THE SAME THING. The monk will lose some HP then he use mend and I'm oom and this is in an outdoor situation. The Warrior LOL? I'm not even close to doing 100% of his HP alone. Just getting 3 Ice comet on a target outdoor is almost impossible. It won't even happen at all if they got Jboots. You can outrun the cast so fucking easily and it takes forever to keep anyone snared and rooted that many times for you to even land 3 Ice comet. Running away from a solo person is so fucking easy as a melee in EQ. The only people I actually kill when I jump them is other INT/WIS classes cause they die in 1x comet and a small nuke and if they don't do that then they can also flee easily.

You can talk about group pvp as well. If you outnumber someone then you will kill them no matter what class they are. It doesn't matter if they are a Necro stuck in Karana or a Rogue, both will die like a little bitch.

clearly you don't know how to ambush from the top of a tree and blast the helpless melees into submission

if they retreat/you are oom.. gate or yonder and reload

[Lovely]

You have 0 PvP server experience so you totally overlook the fact that casters are usually coming at you in duos or more.

On Sullon Zek, you would see <Darkenbane> duos of wizard/druid everywhere. On VZTZ, you would have 6 mages attacking you all at the same time. Your little screen shots here are nothing like real world PvP.

How much HP does a monk have? Like 1500? Now imagine being sync dumped by two ice comets.

Casters are going to insta gib people, just because you can't solo an ogre SK with your wizard doesn't mean anything.

I probably have more PVP experience on this beta alone then you have over your full EQ career and It's 2011 experience. Not some 2001 experience when no one knew how to play at all.

Yes of course two wizards will drop a Monk if they find him in the middle of Karana. But just 1 little wizard will drop a druid/shaman/necro and many other classes all alone. I'm proof of that cause I'm doing it non stop on this beta easily. Even winning 1v2 vs other INT/WIS users, sometimes even 1v3 as long no melee is involved it's all possible. The second a melee is on me it all goes to shit. So melee's seem to be overpowered in this case and nothing else.

Just let me get this right. So to prevent a zerg of people being able to kill one person you want to change the whole system so it totally ruins Solo pvp, group pvp and raid pvp? If you actually played in 18v18 Test of Tactics pvp you would realize that it was the lamest pvp that has ever been seen in any MMO. You had 18 people in each time, all groups had a bard and everyone was 100% immune to all spells and CC. You had 20 minutes+ fights and at most 1-3 people died in each fight. REALLY GOOD PVP WITH CLASSIC SYSTEM YES YES.. Not.

[Cymbal]

This post is laughable.

First, you claim to have evidence supporting melee. So I'm like ok... maybe she fought some1? maybe it was a close fight? -ill check it out.

You post a CONVERSATION with an ogre sk? are you kidding me? thats like the one of the best classes u can pick for this server. So I was like what the hell ill look at what these fools were talking about. During the conv he ADMITS HAVING TROUBLE WITH YOU.

This post doesn't even do what u set out for, it actually does the opposite, and makes u look like a retard at the same time.

Your guide on pvp is attrocious. How is that there is only 2 categories? Strong classes vs rog? i asure u that everyone in category 1 are not equal.

What a waste of time.

[Lovely]

clearly you don't know how to ambush from the top of a tree and blast the helpless melees into submission

if they retreat/you are oom.. gate or yonder and reload

Thanks but I know how to destroy anyone in a 1v1 with playing any class vs any class combo. But it wouldn't show how the average EQ player plays. This is not a showcase of how well someone play or a showcase how well someone use utility items. It's a showcase how strong just a AFK melee is. And how strong they are in a 1v1 when no one uses utility items.

Like I always say I'm up for a 1v1 vs ANYONE ON BETA ANY DAY and I'm 99.9% sure I'd win every single one and if you don't think so then you can challenge me and prove me wrong.

[Lovely]

This post is laughable.

First, you claim to have evidence supporting melee. So I'm like ok... maybe she fought some1? maybe it was a close fight? -ill check it out.

You post a CONVERSATION with an ogre sk? are you kidding me? thats like the one of the best classes u can pick for this server. So I was like what the hell ill look at what these fools were talking about. During the conv he ADMITS HAVING TROUBLE WITH YOU.

This post doesn't even do what u set out for, it actually does the opposite, and makes u look like a retard at the same time.

Your guide on pvp is attrocious. How is that there is only 2 categories? Strong classes vs rog? i asure u that everyone in category 1 are not equal.

What a waste of time.

You're a fucking idiot. This post wouldn't make a difference if it was a ROGUE or a SK. It's showing what resists he has and how much damage I'm doing and how my mana is after that fight. He is a AFK target with XXX resist and HP that's it.

[Doors]

Casters are going to insta gib people, just because you can't solo an ogre SK with your wizard doesn't mean anything. Let's not forget that pure melee won't even see the caster coming with no see invis item. Half the time you'll probably be standing there fighting an NPC then a wizard de-cloaks behind you and you instantly explode.

This is probably accurate.

[Lovely]

I'm thinking about what I can do to shut you people up.

Does anyone here on beta got a 50 rogue, 50 monk or 50 Warrior with Jboots that I can borrow? If you do please PM me.

If I manage to get one I'm up for a 1v1 vs any of you forum crybabies. Hopefully you got a Caster that you say is so OP. Whoever zones or dies shut up forever.

[gloinz]

Thanks but I know how to destroy anyone in a 1v1 with playing any class vs any class combo. But it wouldn't show how the average EQ player plays. This is not a showcase of how well someone play or a showcase how well someone use utility items. It's a showcase how strong just a AFK melee is. And how strong they are in a 1v1 when no one uses utility items.

Like I always say I'm up for a 1v1 vs ANYONE ON BETA ANY DAY and I'm 99.9% sure I'd win every single one and if you don't think so then you can challenge me and prove me wrong.

well the pvp champ would destroy you 1v1 with a dwarf paladin with a rusty shield and a rusty sword, but alas i didn't take the time to level on beta but i do appreciate your efforts you get the devs attention on things like this which i do agree need fixing

Can't you see how many Crowd control spells I need to use to even land anything on him? You wouldn't even be able to use 4 COMET if you have 2k mana and no one will have 2k mana. You make it sound like I can stand and spam 4x 6.3 SECOND SPELLS on anyone in this game lol. To land 4 comet you need like 1k mana of CC

this alone proves you need some serious coaching if you spend 1k mana on cc'ing
you gotta a lot of heart rocky but you gotta pump the jab or big
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSkZ_k6RNKpQgkiCdY_2MPR3f8cVs6Sy GlEnOgVwtOgkEHFLECS
gunna smack a bitch

[Lovely]

Originally Posted by MakeYouMad View Post
Casters are going to insta gib people, just because you can't solo an ogre SK with your wizard doesn't mean anything. Let's not forget that pure melee won't even see the caster coming with no see invis item. Half the time you'll probably be standing there fighting an NPC then a wizard de-cloaks behind you and you instantly explode.


This is probably accurate.

Yeah cause pure melees like Warrior, Monk or Rogue run around and solo LOL.. Give me a break...................... There is loads of melee's on the beta and I've never ever found a melee like this so far and I've been out hunting in every zone a few hundred times. The only people you find like this are other castes.

Pure melee will be grouped and buffed with see invis and other buffs in any real situation.

[Jirr]

I'm thinking about what I can do to shut you people up.

Does anyone here on beta got a 50 rogue, 50 monk or 50 Warrior with Jboots that I can borrow? If you do please PM me.

If I manage to get one I'm up for a 1v1 vs any of you forum crybabies. Hopefully you got a Caster that you say is so OP. Whoever zones or dies shut up forever.

You seem to be under the illusion that empirical evidence can win arguments in this community. Just post what you can and hope that Null reads it.

[gloinz]

You seem to be under the illusion that empirical evidence can win arguments in this community. Just post what you can and hope that Null reads it.

3 nukes on one ogre is not empircal evidence, its a statistical anomaly with that small of a sample size gtfo

now if he nuked that ogre 50 times it could be taken empirically

[Lovely]

You seem to be under the illusion that empirical evidence can win arguments in this community. Just post what you can and hope that Null reads it.

I guess. Dunno why I even bother. I'll keep making posts with screenshots or logs while these other crybabies just post words.

Gloinz ill take you up on that. I really hope the Devs let people start at level 50 so I can wreck you. If they do I'll be waiting for your little 50 pally anywhere you like.

[ChubbyBubbles]

Sensing alot of anger up in here.
Lets talk about it. Get our feelings out in the open.

http://www.klingon-empire.org/photopost/data/500/DT1.jpg

[Authority]

So let me get this right... Your wiz should beat everyone in one on one peevpees. amiright? Please, stop with these retarded posts.

[valithteezee]

Lovely nearly one shotted me the other day as a rogue. Every class has it's Plus + and minuses. Saying you CAN'T kill an SK is crazy talk. You also have those clicky wands that you can stack up on and take the SK down i'm sure of it.

[Nirgon]

You guys need to get attacked by a rogue with a vox spear and muscle lock IV, esp with a bard.

Makeyoumad, Bockscar etc, I knew they were screamy idiots. Thanks for the post to help persuade anyone who might jump on the screamy dumb train with them.

If there really was a problem, I think the people who post who know absolutely anything would be freaking out more. Maybe I had Null wrong on his resist shit, the problem is, there's so many people clouding up the debate.

[Sprinkle]

some of you guys got 0 caster experience with all your shit talk

i played coz for 5 years + on live in every bracket and let me tell you this

while wizard dps is very high , their defense is low , and they are not meant to sit there and TANK A SK and out dmg him , the class isnt made for that

i can kill any ogre or any melee in time i promise , i fucking promise

but you dont run in there in front of him and say oh hi and start nuking , no

you spy through a wall , get him at half hp , wait till he pulls , or wait till you have line of sight , nail him with one nuke , cloudy pot bail into the dungeon

you work on him , he outside? GAME OVER for him , you lev above him and smash him a few times , yonder , come back

work the hp bar , sometimes you can stay up high and just finish him right off

i dont care what class someone is , only class a wiz cant really just eliminate are clerics cause they use their mana to replace what you did and until geared your like oh im oom now fuck you

clr is like haha basically


Resist system is bias currently , TOWARD MELEES

and im happy with that

roll the red im ready and tired of waiting

[Vohl]

Yeah cause pure melees like Warrior, Monk or Rogue run around and solo LOL.. Give me a break...................... There is loads of melee's on the beta and I've never ever found a melee like this so far and I've been out hunting in every zone a few hundred times. The only people you find like this are other castes.

Pure melee will be grouped and buffed with see invis and other buffs in any real situation.

I've hit 45 with my monk largely through soloing here and there at odd hours in seclusion. This may not be possible afer red goes live, but it certainly happens in Beta.

Also, while I've geared up a little bit, I've found that I can XP solo without gear as a monk. The main concern is stocking bandages, which can be done from dropped loot in many places. Groups are preferable, but definitely not required. I've seen someone named Drizzy doing the same thing.

Also, HP are currently a bit over 1000 without buffs. Adding some jewelry and 1-2 HP items such as the Robe ofhe Lost Circle, I expect to hit roughly 1400. Without HP gear (very likely in PvP), the total is closer to 1150. Nuke for 700, Mend back 280 or so, nuke again for 700 and I'm pretty close to dead. One of my better options in PvP so far has been to pumice PK casters, click an Invis potion, and run like Hell. The few PvP wins I've had have been very near things, with luck on my part -- and friends nearby.

[Nirgon]

He /who's in zone like a non-derp, you can't invis through dungeon to reach him, etc, efforts to lurk through wall in zone fail.

Stick to trolling the devs to roll an unfinished box and/or cats.

[dusk883]

OP has a point. I've totally ruled out Wizard as a pvp class. 3 or was it 4 Ice Comets? ... in 2000, the Ice Comet made EVERYONE FLEE, period end of story. I don't care about 2001-2012, what class you were, what your MR was...

[Softcore PK]

I bet 80%+ warriors and SKs are going to be ogre/troll, so what's the issue with using one as an example? And she had a little low int, but that's to get resist gear which most pvp wizards will do. And of course casters running around in duos are going to be able to kill solo melee classes, how does that make anything OP?

2 casters > 1 melee

[Vohl]

Clearly, every pvp server needs Wizards to have a win button.

[dusk883]

Clearly, every pvp server needs Wizards to have a win button.

If it's a race around Norrath, perhaps yes

[Muaar]

That sk also can't port, go to most cities, and has a gigantic exp penalty. I dislike the trolls in this thread but I don't see why a wizard should be able to trade blows with an Ogre SK and win.

You'd have to kite him around and stuff. Or you could port to somewhere your guild is, group, port your entire group to a zone near the SK and hunt him down in minutes.

Seems like a fair trade that he can survive against you 1v1 when you 2 shot every other class besides warrior. You've admitted to being able to wtfpwn most classes in an open setting (where your class shines and ports to). Isn't that enough considering all of the other things Wizards benefit from? Ports, cc, dd, no exp penalty, good faction, ability to solo or group well, etc.


I like these SS threads. Keep them coming! I think what you showed in this thread was that the system seems to be working for the most part. This thread makes me want to play a Melee Class.

[Lovely]

I think the system is fairly fine. EQ has never ever been a balanced game and that's what makes it so charming. But all these people running their mouths that melee's are awful are so full of it. Just log on the beta and talk to any level 50 melee and I'm sure not a single one of them will say they are shit.

The only people crying are these forums troll that have absolutely zero experience with pvping on this beta. The only thing they want is to have an advantage with the class the play or a boost to their play style that they will use with their friends.

[Lovely]

Lovely nearly one shotted me the other day as a rogue. Every class has it's Plus + and minuses. Saying you CAN'T kill an SK is crazy talk. You also have those clicky wands that you can stack up on and take the SK down i'm sure of it.

I don't remember killing any rogues but If I did then you weren't level 50. Because I don't pay attention or take an SS when I kill people under 50 unless it's a loud mouth in /ooc. Just keep in mind that if you were a WIS/INT user instead of a rogue then instead of me nearly 1 shotting you I would actually have one shotted you.

I don't think I said I can't kill an SK. I can kill anyone but that involves using "utility" items (clickers, charge items). That's also the reason why any class can kill anyone in this game. A halfling rogue can even kill a ogre Sk if he uses certain items while the SK don't. You can even make potions that heal you to full hp over and over by just right clicking them. But that's not the point.

[Darwoth]

the whole issue of late about melees suck if this or that is irrelevant whethr true or not, most people know what their getting into on a classic era eq emulator 12 years later and if they decided to play a melee class they already know what the decision entails.

[mourning]

Like I always say I'm up for a 1v1 vs ANYONE ON BETA ANY DAY and I'm 99.9% sure I'd win every single one and if you don't think so then you can challenge me and prove me wrong.

What if they are melee bro? Thought it was impossible to kill even afk melees Bro? Confirmed Idiot.

[Softcore PK]

The resist system seems pretty good to me overall.

[Softcore PK]

Hey lovely, how much exp do you lose from a pvp death at 50? Curious.

[Hovis]

not trying to flame you lovely but every class in eq has their strong points and their weak points.. obviously a wizard is not going to be able to kill a tank class in a few nukes.. wizards are good versus pure melees that dont have nearly as much hp, and no self buffs to help with either resists or heals (lifetaps or regular heals)..
wizards are great for burst damage..
with that said, you can't say melee's are op..

from the SS you posted it seems that resists are pretty good.. maybe with the exception of wizard (or general-other classes) CC might need some tweaking..
you landed two almost full ice commets in a row.. what's the problem with that? lol --1200 damage in what 7-8 seconds?

[Lovely]

What if they are melee bro? Thought it was impossible to kill even afk melees Bro? Confirmed Idiot.

Then I spam them down with clickers

[Lovely]

Hey lovely, how much exp do you lose from a pvp death at 50? Curious.

I don't know I've never died at 50 :cool:

[valithteezee]

I've hit 45 with my monk largely through soloing here and there at odd hours in seclusion. This may not be possible afer red goes live, but it certainly happens in Beta.

Also, while I've geared up a little bit, I've found that I can XP solo without gear as a monk. The main concern is stocking bandages, which can be done from dropped loot in many places. Groups are preferable, but definitely not required. I've seen someone named Drizzy doing the same thing.

Also, HP are currently a bit over 1000 without buffs. Adding some jewelry and 1-2 HP items such as the Robe ofhe Lost Circle, I expect to hit roughly 1400. Without HP gear (very likely in PvP), the total is closer to 1150. Nuke for 700, Mend back 280 or so, nuke again for 700 and I'm pretty close to dead. One of my better options in PvP so far has been to pumice PK casters, click an Invis potion, and run like Hell. The few PvP wins I've had have been very near things, with luck on my part -- and friends nearby.

Monks are boss man. Are you Mybutthurts? We grouped the other day and i must say monks are extremely viable. I've seen drizzy do the same things, monks are def. not broken and frankly, strong as hell.

[Lovely]

not trying to flame you lovely but every class in eq has their strong points and their weak points.. obviously a wizard is not going to be able to kill a tank class in a few nukes.. wizards are good versus pure melees that dont have nearly as much hp, and no self buffs to help with either resists or heals (lifetaps or regular heals)..
wizards are great for burst damage..
with that said, you can't say melee's are op..

from the SS you posted it seems that resists are pretty good.. maybe with the exception of wizard (or general-other classes) CC might need some tweaking..
you landed two almost full ice commets in a row.. what's the problem with that? lol --1200 damage in what 7-8 seconds?

There is nothing wrong with it! I'm happy with the results I'm getting on beta. I don't think casters or melee's are OP I think both are fine in their own ways. You'll always have classes that are stronger then others in Everquest which is completely fine.

lol --1200 damage in what 7-8 seconds?.

That is way off though man. Each high end nuke has over 5 second cast and Ice comets have 6.3 seconds cast time + recast/ms

[Hovis]

There is nothing wrong with it! I'm happy with the results I'm getting on beta. I don't think casters or melee's are OP I think both are fine in their own ways. You'll always have classes that are stronger then others in Everquest which is completely fine.

.

That is way off though man. Each high end nuke has over 5 second cast and Ice comets have 6.3 seconds cast time + recast/ms

true true.. isnt conflag better though?

[juicedsixfo]

Judging from the screenshots I'd say everything is working as intended.

Thanks for the testing.

[Muaar]

Thread confirms game working as intended. Time to release!

[Mobb]

Too say casters are overpowered cause two can jump you is a stupid fuckin argument... Two rangers could take any spell casters, as long as both arent afk half the fight. Lets not forget on live during classic times a druid could drop ensnares on a person and keep them snared for almost 6 mins each cast. You could root someone for almost the full duration and as long as you didnt use DDs you could keep them rooted the whole fight. If anything this box is more balanced then live. I played war and nec on live and I never got one lifetap resisted til pop era, I was gettin lifetaps resisted here at lvl 10 against people lvl 6 with no gear. On live if you were melee and solo and caught goin from point a to point b by a caster you were dead, hands down. Anybody complaining should be casters, cause once everyone has resists over 100 what is actually gona land in pvp? With no real hp gear til kunark a warrior could drop any caster with an exe axe before he could get two nukes off.

[mitic]

Too say casters are overpowered cause two can jump you is a stupid fuckin argument...

yea, ppl just search for the sake of searching for arguments

2 meles can in fact easily kill 1 caster if they know what they are doing

[Titanuk]

nice job taking SS of some random bad in Angry Wolves saying how you pwn..

[Titanuk]

Ranger - STRONG in PVP

Rogue - SHIT IN PVP



lolololololol yea rangers op as fuk

[Jirr]

lolololololol yea rangers op as fuk

You never know, Null might bring back his custom archery code.

http://i1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa324/vztzscreenshots/EQ000004.jpg

[Bockscar]

1) Most people aren't trying to claim that melees are useless in PvP or anything, just that they have the general advantage indoors while casters have the advantage outdoors.

2) Ice Comet isn't a good spell if you're concerned about mana. You're also playing the one offensive class that seriously struggles with this while other caster classes have various ways around it, whether pets, better mana efficiency, mana recovery tools, or whatever. Plus you're wearing full resist gear against a melee.

3) Some classes struggle in solo PvP. Ask a cleric or enchanter how feasible it was to run around killing people by themselves in classic PvP. It's not as if some grievous injustice has been inflicted by the fact that you sometimes have to give up and flee because your opponent outlasted you. There's not exactly a lot of data in your screenshots, and you do show yourself landing two consecutive nukes for 600+. That alone is enough to straight up kill any caster, and one more nuke will probably take out any rogue or monk as well. Tanks are tanks. You probably wouldn't be able to kill a healer either. Wizards get more flexible in Kunark.

4) The way to counter spells is resists. The way to counter melee is to not stand still. Both can be equally frustrating. You don't strictly have to keep someone rooted to fight them as a wizard - yondering can buy you enough time to get a spell off, but you risk having your target just run off in the opposite direction. Melees have the same problem, they just have even fewer tools to attempt to counter it. You can pretty much counter a warrior, monk or rogue by the simple act of moving, and mostly hybrids as well since stopping to cast root/snare as a hybrid means increasing the distance between yourself and your target and you only really get one or maybe two chances to try before they're out of range entirely. Your tests are all numbers and no real scenarios.

5) Don't really know who you're arguing against at this point. You called me out for basically disputing your claim that one does not encounter melees outside of dungeons, and for wanting the game mechanics to stay classic. It seems to me like you just want validation and will argue against points you've made up yourself and tagged onto the names of whoever wrote more than two lines in your other thread.

[Lovely]

I'm arguing against the people who's been posting about how useless melee's are and how they can't do anything anywhere. Also against people who think that the first resist code that Everquest was a good thing when you basically became immune to all kinds of CC with just having a little bit of MR gear.

But it seems like most people like the current code and that the developers will stick to it so it doesn't really matter anymore.

Also I can't be arsed to argue about minor things anymore cause it won't make a difference anyway. Even if some of the things you just said are totally false like Ice comet not being a mana efficient nuke for Wizards.

[Mobb]

As a necro or warrior in classic wizards sucked until kunark pretty much. Samething with mages til probably aa's were garbage. With long casting DDs u simply went over a hill/ corner / into water and oomed them out ( if you were unable to see target it still took the mana from you). Here and P99 mages are insane what they can do ( earth pet root landing? Lol, Fire pet lasting more then a couple rounds? Lol ). Everyone and anyone who played classic eq knows mages used air pets for a reason, cause the 3 others were completely worthless to use. Thats why except for mages this box is probably 95% legit. And the 5% that isnt is a good thing, cause being a melee and having a druid cast 1) see invis 2) ensnare 3) pick a dot 4) watch you die is fuckin lame.

[Scowl]

What a Lovely sack of shit.

[veto]

Did I read that right? Yummy says he wtfpwns everyone else? Can I remind him how I was wtfpwning him (keep in mind he's always fully shaman buffed cause he boxes vaelel) and he had to use harmtouch to kill me (left me with 50 hp btw)..

If he hadn't harmtouched, his "wtfpwn" skills would have been defeated, and we were in the solb zone out (tight spot).

Get a better example of an SK, even reipin owns yummy.

Hell, drizzy kicked my ass better, even though I wasn't 50 with drizzy than I was with yummy (and had my 49 spells). I mean cmon, you cant really test statistics on a guy that runs around fully shaman buffed anyway.

[georgie]

right yummy brownosing that's why i "wtfpwnt" him outside of guk. idiot was killing my shaman when i said to 1v1 monk vs sk. then he said he was oom.. right he casted darkness on me

[dogbarf]

Hasted melee dominate in dungeons and group pvp. (Where pvp actually matters)

Who gives a shit if you died 1v1 in east commons to a caster.

Anyone who isnt a dipshit will roll a caster at launch, use it as a buff/farmbot and have a melee ready to go for kunark/lategame classic.

Or they will have friends and it wont even matter.

[Galacticus]

What you don't see in this post is the fact that Yummy could not have leveled up his SK to 50 without the help of his shaman friend next to him. I have personally witnessed Yummy pvp on his SK while fully buffed from his shaman.

Everyone on this server says they are bad ass. Why should we believe this guy?

[georgie]

cuz if u r melee and pvp without sow u r stupid otherwise you just get rooted and nuked or just nuked on by a levi caster.

[Not_Kazowi]

This post and the screenshots don't show or prove anything. Casters will fuck things up and have an advantage against melee. So you can't roll in and 2 shot a ogre sk in a dungeon? Boo fucking hoo. You don't remember nuking my monk at 5% while on a mob then bind camping my Cleric? Don't remember you complaining about wizards and spells landing then. Worthless thread.

[Silikten]

What a Lovely sack of shit.

Iksar war??

[ivosik]

known low lifes in this thread time to leave

[Vohl]

Monks are boss man. Are you Mybutthurts? We grouped the other day and i must say monks are extremely viable. I've seen drizzy do the same things, monks are def. not broken and frankly, strong as hell.

Yep, that's me. As often as I've been pwned by wizards, I'm very skeptical of claims that they're underpowered. PvE, monks are fine. PvP against anyone with root or snare, it's a very different story.

[Vohl]

cuz if u r melee and pvp without sow u r stupid otherwise you just get rooted and nuked or just nuked on by a levi caster.

Pumice is a great equalizer here, especially over water.

[lethdar]

Up to 32 int less due to being a human, how much mana is that at 50 pal?

Rly though its pretty easy to be rolling at 2k mana for any int caster in resist gear, and 2.4k for pve preplanar.

[Tamiah2011]

I probably have more PVP experience on this beta alone then you have over your full EQ career and It's 2011 experience. Not some 2001 experience when no one knew how to play at all.

Yes of course two wizards will drop a Monk if they find him in the middle of Karana. But just 1 little wizard will drop a druid/shaman/necro and many other classes all alone. I'm proof of that cause I'm doing it non stop on this beta easily. Even winning 1v2 vs other INT/WIS users, sometimes even 1v3 as long no melee is involved it's all possible. The second a melee is on me it all goes to shit. So melee's seem to be overpowered in this case and nothing else.

Just let me get this right. So to prevent a zerg of people being able to kill one person you want to change the whole system so it totally ruins Solo pvp, group pvp and raid pvp? If you actually played in 18v18 Test of Tactics pvp you would realize that it was the lamest pvp that has ever been seen in any MMO. You had 18 people in each time, all groups had a bard and everyone was 100% immune to all spells and CC. You had 20 minutes+ fights and at most 1-3 people died in each fight. REALLY GOOD PVP WITH CLASSIC SYSTEM YES YES.. Not.


Yes I agree since last patch melee is OP now and it going keep players from rolling casters now.

[Sprinkle]

not rolling wiz cause of all the nerfs now : )

[Wonton]

no1 cares, bro

[Sprinkle]

you should care the pure DD Class in eq is nerfed by 40% + in pvp

thats not something small

[mimixownzall]

The whole point of this thread is just to show that melee's aren't some baby sheep walking around while all casters are wolfs. That's so far from the truth it's not even funny. Everyone will have an edge towards one and another at different locations. It all depends on the environment of the situation. I'm gonna roll a Monk and I'm not scared of any class anywhere tbh. Especially not when I'll spend most of my time inside dungeons where I basically have an edge vs any class. There is also enough utility items out there to make me comfortable even in the middle of Karana's as a Monk.

It just annoys me so much when people sit and write DUDE as Wizard on beta you rape rogues. MAN... Ill rape a ROGUE WITH ANY CLASS I PLAY. Rogues are shit in pvp and that's no news to anyone. I can be a Warrior, Paladin, Mage, Druid, Enchanter whatever. I will walk over any rogue if not two at the same time with any class I play.

Tanks

Paladin - STRONG in PVP

Shadow Knight - STRONG in PVP

Warrior - STRONG in PVP

Priests

Cleric - STRONG in PVP

Druid - STRONG in PVP

Shaman - STRONG in PVP

Melee

Monk - STRONG in PVP

Ranger - STRONG in PVP

Rogue - SHIT IN PVP

Bard - STRONG in PVP

Casters

Enchanter - STRONG in PVP

Magician - STRONG in PVP

Necromancer - STRONG in PVP

Wizard - STRONG in PVP

If you can't make the classes I wrote "STRONG IN PVP" on then you are just bad and there is no hope for you no matter what class you play.

LOLOLOLOL

Magician strong in pvp... that's pretty funny. Leveling up? Yeah they rule. At 50? Farmers and that is it.

[Dontmez_Mebro]

You have 0 PvP server experience so you totally overlook the fact that casters are usually coming at you in duos or more.

On Sullon Zek, you would see <Darkenbane> duos of wizard/druid everywhere. On VZTZ, you would have 6 mages attacking you all at the same time. Your little screen shots here are nothing like real world PvP.

How much HP does a monk have? Like 1500? Now imagine being sync dumped by two ice comets.

Casters are going to insta gib people, just because you can't solo an ogre SK with your wizard doesn't mean anything. Let's not forget that pure melee won't even see the caster coming with no see invis item. Half the time you'll probably be standing there fighting an NPC then a wizard de-cloaks behind you and you instantly explode.

WTF does this prove? You're saying melee is underpowered because 4 Wizards can sync comet on them and kill them? Guess what Sherlock. If I get 6 Warriors we can beat you to a pulp and there is nothing you can do about it. You don't balance PVP by making a class able to fight more than one opponent. I swear every new forum I join is just more and more full of complete idiots. Will someone please unplug the internet already?

[Sprinkle]

same can be said for you

idiots will never see your reason , even trying to convince them or tell them anything is just as stupid as being an idiot yourself

will someone unplug your internet please>?

[Vamael]

I don't think this fool understands that IC is more of a finisher spell against that situation, its better to pop small nukes until hes at like 50% while SSing around, for a SK ogre situation its better to use IC at the last 50%, also as a human, your INT is going to blow with full diamond/ pvp resist armor on almost every slot. Most wizards anti class quickly become Warriors/Rogues/Monks after resists and raiding gear. Don't forget we pretty much rock any mage, with fluxing the pet to push the root buff down the mage can't do much but nuke you, Which you can out nuke him. The best thing to fight off most healers is to toss a rain spell to keep them mobile from being able to heal or cast.

[Galacticus]

Lovely is playing a caster and wants no one to play a Melee which can be a counter to them with resists so he pretends Melee are op so no one plays them when they find out how broken they are.

EVERY 50 Melee was boxed with a caster which won't happen on live.

People will cry it's broken when they see it themselves but the server will already be dominated by casters.

I wanted to roll Melee but I tried it and they are broken before 50. I will be playing a caster until the Kunark damage weapons can balance out Melee a bit.


Melee is tuned for Kunark not classic. It will be possible but much more difficult then it should have been.

[jrwriter]

If u Wana own in pvp be rich Mage will own all best all round class in classic just having the levels over poeple will get u more kills

[Sirbanmelotz]

Its not about whats the best bros its what you will have fun playin