Critical Fail Combines are Amazing

[Knuckle]

Imagine spending a small fortune to complete a quest and having to organize a raid for a tedious mob all so you can fail a combine at a trivial combine. Yeah sorry you can no longer advance your skills from making this item. Yeah sorry you lacked the skills to fashion the item together. GO FUCK YOURSELF

[Ciderpress]

No see it's teaching you an important lesson about hubris and over-confidence though

[Duik]

You mustn't be tall enough.

[Bardp1999]

What a loser

[WarpathEQ]

Sounds like someone failed a Garzicore combine

[kjs86z2]

shits classic do it again op

[aaezil]

Yes good let the salt flow through you

[Duik]

Can we get total count of the peeps who have also failed a trivial combine from this quest?

[Duik]

Cant believe we didnt get a "sorry you dont got" yet.

Disappointed.

[Jimjam]

Cant believe we didnt get a "sorry you dont got" yet.

Disappointed.

oof. sorry you don't got "sorry you don't got" retort.

[WarpathEQ]

Can we get total count of the peeps who have also failed a trivial combine from this quest?

3548547394

There is a book of the fallen section near the bottom of the page where people are named and shamed.

[WarpathEQ]

3548547394

There is a book of the fallen section near the bottom of the page where people are named and shamed.

https://wiki.project1999.com/The_Spirit_of_Garzicor

[Balimon]

It happens...generally people feel bad for you and help though..keep at it my dude

[Duik]

THIS IS NOT A ROUND ROBIN TURN IN. IF YOU TURN IN AND YOU MISS YOUR ITEM, MUST COMPLETELY REDO THE QUEST

That'd be some oopsies as well wouldn't it?

One page i read made it look lime it was a round robin. Not that I would ever to this quest. It us interesting how much pain this game gives, and we give it the chance.

I cried when i finally got haddin to pop and killed him. No earring.

[Naethyn]

https://wiki.project1999.com/TradeskillTable

[Reiwa]

https://wiki.project1999.com/TradeskillTable

335 is the hardest recipe I've seen.

[Naethyn]

do tell

[Reiwa]

do tell

molym8tAs7E

[Jimjam]

The problem isn’t necessarily the triv/fail system but the recipes.

The system was designed for relatively easily sourced components (steel boning and hq pelts) with low stakes results (leather +2 armour).

The problem is the new quests are using the tradeskill system outside the scope of it’s design.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

The problem isn’t necessarily the triv/fail system but the recipes.

The system was designed for relatively easily sourced components (steel boning and hq pelts) with low stakes results (leather +2 armour).

The problem is the new quests are using the tradeskill system outside the scope of it’s design.

They could have made the quest no fail. They clearly wanted 5% of the playerbase to suffer. Same with the Shawl quest.

[Jimjam]

Maybe they wanted to let people suffer, maybe the guy who made the quest either didn't care or didn't remember about the no fail flag (or perhaps the flag wasn't flaggable for whatever reason). Certainly an interesting point upon which to muse.

[Goregasmic]

I failed the shawl 6th shawl 6 times between 163-168 tailoring. There's like a sub 1% probability of this happening. I did most of it during double drop rate christmas week so it wasn't too bad but still time consuming with how rare the siren hair and wolf whiskers are. I still need a swordfish tooth to finish 7th but I tried SG at 58 and it just wasn't gonna work.

I'm still mad AF at the whole tailoring thing, from 158 you basically have to craft 262 othmir fur caps or 335 wyvern masks unless you're a few select races... and you only have 5% chance to successfully combine until you're 200+. And most of the gear made is garbage anyway or there are much cheaper alternatives out there. I guess if you're one of the first 250 tailors early velious it may be worth it but at this point not so much.

If I'm ever guilded I'd still do spirit of grazicor for the ring because I apparently like suffering.

[Salaryman]

RED99

I have the shawl

RED99

[Cecily]

I knew you failed the Dragonborne Miyazaki just from the thread title.

[loramin]

I'm still mad AF at the whole tailoring thing, from 158 you basically have to craft 262 othmir fur caps or 335 wyvern masks unless you're a few select races... and you only have 5% chance to successfully combine until you're 200+.

Successes don't matter for skill-ups ... or at least they shouldn't (they didn't in classic, and there were massive threads on the EQ Traders forum which proved as much). They do matter for whether you get a piece of worthless gear, but who cares about the gear?

Now, I have heard from people who think successes do matter. I suspect they were just confused, but I guess it's possible if Nilbog coded skillups unclassically.

[Goregasmic]

Successes don't matter for skill-ups ... or at least they shouldn't (they didn't in classic, and there were massive threads on the EQ Traders forum which proved as much). They do matter for whether you get a piece of worthless gear, but who cares about the gear?

Now, I have heard from people who think successes do matter. I suspect they were just confused, but I guess it's possible if Nilbog coded skillups unclassically.

It does according to the eqtraders calculator but it is current for live IIRC so maybe they modified that later in the timeline. If it doesn't that's probably where people get the misconception from.

Tailoring makes some good gear, even some pre-raid BIS but it was so poorly designed it isn't worth working on unless you're doing shawl or you're a completionist.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I failed the shawl 6th shawl 6 times between 163-168 tailoring. There's like a sub 1% probability of this happening. I did most of it during double drop rate christmas week so it wasn't too bad but still time consuming with how rare the siren hair and wolf whiskers are. I still need a swordfish tooth to finish 7th but I tried SG at 58 and it just wasn't gonna work.

I'm still mad AF at the whole tailoring thing, from 158 you basically have to craft 262 othmir fur caps or 335 wyvern masks unless you're a few select races... and you only have 5% chance to successfully combine until you're 200+. And most of the gear made is garbage anyway or there are much cheaper alternatives out there. I guess if you're one of the first 250 tailors early velious it may be worth it but at this point not so much.

If I'm ever guilded I'd still do spirit of grazicor for the ring because I apparently like suffering.

Yeah I tried to level up tailoring past 158, and didn't get any results after thousands of plat. Decided to just do Shawl 6 at 158. Did that on two characters, and I only failed Shawl 6 twice in total I think.

[Goregasmic]

Yeah I've heard a couple times about people spending over 100k to max tailoring. If you don't have cultural tailoring the cheapest way is probably a multi generational genocide of otters. Most other stuff requires a lot of velium tempers and expensive ench vials. If you can't farm otters you're stuck with wyvern hide masks.

[loramin]

It does according to the eqtraders calculator but it is current for live IIRC so maybe they modified that later in the timeline. If it doesn't that's probably where people get the misconception from.

That would make sense. Sadly, the original EQ Traders forums have been lost to time, as they're not on the Wayback Machine. I even emailed the "den mother" of EQ Traders, and she said she'd look and see if she had the old posts ... but then never wrote back, so I assume not even she has them.

Still, I'm 100% certain that tradeskill success (in classic) did not influence skillup success. This was something tradeskillers back then were very keen to know, so one tradeskiller finally did a series of tests, which proved that there was no connection.

At the time, this thread was "big news" among the classic tradeskilling community, so I remember it well, but now that it's lost it's probably the only "proof" that ever existed (because proving it required so much work that only a tradeskill addict on the tradeskill forum would conduct it).

[Goregasmic]

That would make sense. Sadly, the original EQ Traders forums have been lost to time, as they're not on the Wayback Machine. I even emailed the "den mother" of EQ Traders, and she said she'd look and see if she had the old posts ... but then never wrote back, so I assume not even she has them.

Still, I'm 100% certain that tradeskill success (in classic) did not influence skillup success. This was something tradeskillers back then were very keen to know, so one tradeskiller finally did a series of tests, which proved that there was no connection.

At the time, this thread was "big news" among the classic tradeskilling community, so I remember it well, but now that it's lost it's probably the only "proof" that ever existed (because proving it required so much work that only a tradeskill addict on the tradeskill forum would conduct it).

Do you remember what his testing looked like or not at all?

I guess you could add up how many failure/success you get and then check the skill ups proportions. I'm not sure all tradeskills are governed by the same formula though.

[loramin]

Do you remember what his testing looked like or not at all?

I guess you could add up how many failure/success you get and then check the skill ups proportions. I'm not sure all tradeskills are governed by the same formula though.

I don't remember the exact the details (it's been over two decades), but basically he did a bunch of combines with a trivial that was close (eg. tradeskill 100, trivial 110), and a bunch of combines with a trivial that was way far off (eg. trivial 200).

He did a lot of combines (which was a big deal back then: people didn't have the plat/items to just do a ton of combines at once), and found that he got the same skill-up rate regardless of the trivial.

[cd288]

That would make sense. Sadly, the original EQ Traders forums have been lost to time, as they're not on the Wayback Machine. I even emailed the "den mother" of EQ Traders, and she said she'd look and see if she had the old posts ... but then never wrote back, so I assume not even she has them.

Still, I'm 100% certain that tradeskill success (in classic) did not influence skillup success. This was something tradeskillers back then were very keen to know, so one tradeskiller finally did a series of tests, which proved that there was no connection.

At the time, this thread was "big news" among the classic tradeskilling community, so I remember it well, but now that it's lost it's probably the only "proof" that ever existed (because proving it required so much work that only a tradeskill addict on the tradeskill forum would conduct it).

Meaning the trade skill up percentage is just pure RNG? And a failure has just as much chance as increasing it as a successful combine?

[Goregasmic]

Meaning the trade skill up percentage is just pure RNG? And a failure has just as much chance as increasing it as a successful combine?

I don't think skill up chance is pure RNG, it definitely follows a curve. The higher you get the harder it is to skill up. When you first start out it is like 33% chance to skill up and in the 160s its like 12% and in the 200s like 6%. I've observed it through different tradeskills a well.

Your int/wis (or str/dex on some tradeskills) will affect your skill up chance but success rate seems fixed for a given level. What's "debated" is if it is easier to skill up on a success or not.

[cd288]

Yeah sorry I misspoke. Figured there was some scaling with level. Thanks!