all i do is log in with multiple accounts

[wuanahto]

not at the same time but all i do these days is just buff people in leveling zones.
just cycling my fucking enchanters/clerics/druids/shaman in highkeep/oasis/mistmoore/leveling highways
i tried porting people for free but they keep giving me money and other shit

someone make this game fun again. i tried pantheon but theres only like 10 people and no tanks

[Tethler]

It's ok to take a break if you aren't having fun. Plenty of other games out there to consume some of your time. I've taken several 6-month breaks in the 10 years since I started on p99. The itch to play always returns and I come back with a kind of renewed purpose.

[zelld52]

Yep. Been there OP. Leveled my third shaman on green and now… I just PL and buff people. Time to start a 4th I guess. Still haven’t done iksar shm. …

[Smoofers]

Level a bard and start swarming in Com and velks

[shovelquest]

p99 gold when

https://i.imgur.com/JqBoYxI.png

[Wakanda]

only like 10 people and no tanks

not to beat the dead horse to death but this is a huge problem and also why pantheon doesnt feel like eq to me

like is not having a tank on eq a huge problem? yeah. but can you still level without a tank? can you still level without a group? absolutely.

Like i dont like how pantheon feels like the entire game is centered around sitting at a camp with a full group (tank and prob 2 healers mandatory) and nothing else.

a huge part of what made eq so amazing was actually the solo experience / adventure / content

like in pantheon it feels like they didnt even have this in mind at all. which again, even with the most populated server, this will automatically become a massive problem when servers become top heavy. it isnt like elves or halflings can just teleport over to the human town where people actually level. needs to be way more solo/duo/trio content.

but also, like why cant we run from mobs? lol. like i can aggro a red in everquest and have a pretty good chance of running away and not dying. in pantheon if you aggro something you can't solo you just die.

[Wakanda]

Like i dont like how pantheon feels like the entire game is centered around sitting at a camp with a full group (tank and prob 2 healers mandatory) and nothing else.

and also an enchanter. i forgot about that. since i main enchanter, my group always has one. but from what i understand groups literally have to have an enchanter as well. again most people in early eq didnt even know the value of enchanters. pantheon should def be playable without one, lol.

like i know its early alpha, but just a terrible design to be like yep, if you dont have a tank, 2 healers, and an enchanter, the game is unplayable. like if cc is that damn important add other classes with hard cc or something. IDEK.

optimal fix would be like... enc cc is a huge quality of life, but not mandatory. but literally if my mez gets broke on my enc and i dont have mana for another one, my group usually wipes in like 10 seconds. really hope they tweak this cuz whacc.

[Wakanda]

like is not having a tank on eq a huge problem?
also another huge problem is like... why dont tanks deal damage on pantheon? Like dude, Warriors are serious DPS on EQ. I prefer duo'ing with Warriors on my Shaman because mobs die so dang fast. But also Paladins have their moment to shine, particularly in pre-kunark when they get a ghoulbane and are destroying stuff in UR and lower guk. SK have their niche too and can actually solo really well and stuff like that.

On Pantheon tanks dont feel like this at all. It feels like the entire purpose of tanks is just to get hit, and pretty much do nothing else. I lol when warrior tanks in my group dual wield because it isn't like they deal damage anyways.

They need to seriously make Tank classes actually fun to play. Like on EQ right now i could make a warrior, paladin, monk or SK and be excited about it playing it even if I never joined a group. On Pantheon tank is literally the most boring thing you could imagine because you don't even do anything.

There's no flavor to it. I don't even know what class the tank in my group is half the time because they are basically all the same thing and do nothing unique or exciting.

[loramin]

but from what i understand groups literally have to have an enchanter as well. again most people in early eq didnt even know the value of enchanters.

That's not how I remember it at all: Enchanters were an essential part of EQ groups: you basically needed the "holy trinity" of a tank, a cleric, and an enchanter. Of course, people were less picky back then, so you settled for a Druid/Shaman if there was no Cleric, a Shaman if no Enchanter, or any non-caster if no real tank ... but the point is everyone wanted an Enchanter.

However, unlike here live Enchanters did almost no charming in groups. It was seen as offering only slightly more DPS, in exchange for a much higher risk of death ... something Nilbog has unfortunately still failed to reproduce after all his work here.

[Salaryman]

RED99

[Wakanda]

That's not how I remember it at all: Enchanters were an essential part of EQ groups: you basically needed the "holy trinity" of a tank, a cleric, and an enchanter. Of course, people were less picky back then, so you settled for a Druid/Shaman if there was no Cleric, a Shaman if no Enchanter, or any non-caster if no real tank ... but the point is everyone wanted an Enchanter.

However, unlike here live Enchanters did almost no charming in groups. It was seen as offering only slightly more DPS, in exchange for a much higher risk of death ... something Nilbog has unfortunately still failed to reproduce after all his work here.
I think part of why I didn't know that Enchanters were extremely useful is because I don't think the class was commonly played (at least on my server). As a Rogue I remember getting annoyed at the healers in my group whining about how they didn't have clarity and I just couldn't understand what the big deal was.

The first time I realized Enchanter was actually a good class was when we were in Plane of Hate and we accidentally pulled too many mobs, and it was surely going to be a wipe. And then it wasn't because of an Enc spamming mez. This completely changed the game for me, although I can't say I remember having an Enc in every group because they were fairly rare.

And my memories of charm are the same as yours. I remember being in a group in KC and me and this ENC in my group had heard of people doing some cool charm stuff in Siren's Grotto or something, and we really wanted to try it. The tank cursed at him after the first charm break and told him not to do it again. We ignored the tank and did it again anyways while he was pulling. Charm broke again before he even got back with a pull and the whole group died.

Also I remember one time in like.. West Commons when someone invited an Enc to my group and being confused. Like why did you invite an Enc? Like in my mind at that time, ENC was just a class that made jewelry and did fun things like turn into a tree or a lamp post, but who otherwise served no purpose to a group focused on EXP etc. :eek:

[Jimjam]

I think there was a big change in the zeitgeist between 1999 and 2002 regarding enchanters.

[shovelquest]

It's "Zweihander"

https://wiki.project1999.com/Gigantic_Zweihander

[Jimjam]

Ah, thank you for that
Point of correction my friend
Won’t happen again

[cd288]

However, unlike here live Enchanters did almost no charming in groups. It was seen as offering only slightly more DPS, in exchange for a much higher risk of death ... something Nilbog has unfortunately still failed to reproduce after all his work here.

Yes because there's nothing to reproduce since the mechanics are classic. The goal isn't to reproduce making people do X because people at the time didn't realize how much of a benefit it would be to do Y. The goal is to reproduce the mechanics

[loramin]

And my memories of charm are the same as yours. I remember being in a group in KC and me and this ENC in my group had heard of people doing some cool charm stuff in Siren's Grotto or something, and we really wanted to try it. The tank cursed at him after the first charm break and told him not to do it again. We ignored the tank and did it again anyways while he was pulling. Charm broke again before he even got back with a pull and the whole group died.

:D That was classic EverQuest.

[Ciderpress]

Yeah, charm never breaks on p99 except all the billions of time it breaks within the first tic on a mob you've tashed and given -40 worth of negative MR gear to.

[cd288]

Yeah, charm never breaks on p99 except all the billions of time it breaks within the first tic on a mob you've tashed and given -40 worth of negative MR gear to.

Sometimes it breaks really quickly sometimes it doesn't, just RNG for ya lol.

I do agree that charm killing wasn't really a thing in the early days of live, although I remember it starting to be done a decent amount in Velious. Charmed pets as DPS in groups also wasn't something that happened frequently until the end of the classic era to my recollection. But as has been discussed endlessly on here, there's no indication that the mechanics we have currently are incorrect...it's just a combo of people learning how to do new cool things with class/game mechanics, Enchanters not being that popular initially, totally unreliable internet service and laggy computers in some cases, etc.

I mean shit I remember a brief period of time where people thought a group would share exp with a pet lol

[Ciderpress]

There's something else I'm unclear on: how come nobody complains that druid animal charm duration or necro undead charm duration is too long\overpowered somehow? It's always just enchanters...

[cd288]

There's something else I'm unclear on: how come nobody complains that druid animal charm duration or necro undead charm duration is too long\overpowered somehow? It's always just enchanters...

I think primarily because Enchanter charm is much more useful rather than limited to certain mob types

[Ciderpress]

I think primarily because Enchanter charm is much more useful rather than limited to certain mob types

Yeah but that's the only dimension in which it's different. The gripe about enchanters here is that charm used to not be so reliable. People always claim: "Well *I* don't remember enchanters charming very much during live!", which is fine, but I also don't remember druids or necros charming like ever, so why isn't their charming ability ever called into question?

[loramin]

People's memories are just signposts saying "maybe there's something here" ... but this place wasn't built on memories, it was based on classic evidence.

If you're convinced Enchanter solo charming (or group charming for that matter) was common in classic, just show me some evidence. I'm probably the most vocal critic of P99's charm implementation on this server, but if you can do that I will switch to your side!

The thing is, I highly doubt you can find such evidence ... because I played (at the end of) the classic era, and as I remember it the vast majority of Enchanters didn't regularly charm back then.

[shovelquest]

Ill add some evidence that proves charm durrations were 12 minuets shorter in classic!

https://project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3700313&postcount=81

[wuanahto]

People's memories are just signposts saying "maybe there's something here" ... but this place wasn't built on memories, it was based on classic evidence.

we didnt know better back then, it was new and after dire charm became a thing we didnt get a chance to give a fuck

we are older, we know better. we noticed things with lower MR are easier to mez, therefore also means charm. then we started testing this in duels with other players with magic resist

its hard to have a memory hole when we didnt even know/when/where to dig back then

[Jimjam]

There are loads of quirks of the client/implementation here too.

No one knew about battle bandaging on p99 for years until I shared it.

No one knew about clicky bandaging until I shared that.

No one cares about bow bandaging.

Those are just bandaging bugs which went undisclosed for years on p99. With only 2 years of classic how many things must have gone undiscovered or undisclosed? There must be so much crazy shit out there people haven’t discovered or shared yet! Ghost stepping? Lag stepping? Stepping through platforms even as large as posky islands? Maybe? Hybrid knights? I’m sure I saw one. Half elf clerics? Perhaps? Npc held item manipulation? Probably loads.

[cd288]

People's memories are just signposts saying "maybe there's something here" ... but this place wasn't built on memories, it was based on classic evidence.

If you're convinced Enchanter solo charming (or group charming for that matter) was common in classic, just show me some evidence. I'm probably the most vocal critic of P99's charm implementation on this server, but if you can do that I will switch to your side!

The thing is, I highly doubt you can find such evidence ... because I played (at the end of) the classic era, and as I remember it the vast majority of Enchanters didn't regularly charm back then.

The thing is though, that's not relevant. The standard on this server isn't "well people didn't do this back then so they shouldn't be able to do it now." The standard is, and has always been, are the underlying mechanics classic. The staff have what they believe are the classic, or closest to classic as they can get, mechanics.

When I say mechanics I mean things like how charisma works, mob magic resist and the effect it has on things, and the effect level difference between you and a mob has on things.

If you don't like how Charm is implemented then it's on YOU to go find actual evidence that the underlying mechanics on P99 are incorrect. You don't get to demand other people find evidence for you (especially not evidence that's tangential to the issue at hand, which is whether the underlying mechanics are accurate for the classic era).

Either go find evidence or stop talking about it.

[Gozuk]

https://heroesjourneyemu.com/

It's still EQ but it's different enough that you don't even feel like you're betraying your loyalties to P99. If you're bored here I'd really recommend giving it a shot

[Ekco]

i had fun on THJ but to paint it as anything other than the complete opposite of p99 is hilarious, it's more like Live than most emu projects available.

for people that want to triple box but on a single character or play at that power level curve its amazing.

[Gozuk]

i had fun on THJ but to paint it as anything other than the complete opposite of p99 is hilarious, it's more like Live than most emu projects available.

for people that want to triple box but on a single character or play at that power level curve its amazing.

That's exactly what I'm saying. It's completely different

[Ekco]

what expansion is it on now? was kunark when i stopped playing

[bcbrown]

No one knew about battle bandaging on p99 for years until I shared it.

No one knew about clicky bandaging until I shared that.

No one cares about bow bandaging.

Could you explain how to do these things? Combat bandaging is gone now, right? Are the other two still possible?

[azeth]

Wakandas posts are very post luclin sounding. No, you couldn't and NO ONE did shit without a tank in classic kunark and velious. Anyone claiming they soloed is a liar or greatly exaggerating what they were capable of

[Gozuk]

what expansion is it on now? was kunark when i stopped playing

Luclin just opened up on Feb. 7th. PoP is coming March 7th and there will be a minimum of 2 months before the next. I've never played past PoP personally.

[Ekco]

I've never played past PoP personally.

hope to goes into Gates of Discord and Depths of Darkhollow i think those expansions lore wise are peak EQ

[Ekco]

Demiplane of Blood and the last fight of Dreadspire fighting Mayong mistmoore is where everquest ends.

[Ekco]

Q4TucXl3_cU

last raid that literally mattered. and figuring out the the title system from it

[shovelquest]

No one knew about battle bandaging on p99 for years until I shared it.

No one knew about clicky bandaging until I shared that.

No one cares about bow bandaging.

king goat

https://i.imgur.com/YjUkkMS.jpeg

[Duik]

Do people still need to use the kite method of run/sit med tic run/sit med tic? Or are we all sufficiently twinked to not need the med tics.
Druid solo early 2000s actually needed the med tics to finish (certain) mobs. Root overwrote snare. Lots of resnaring and sitting/timing etc.

[onmove_broke]

I do not remember chanters charming much on live back in 1999. In fact, now that I think about it, I vaguely remember someone saying they did not use it because it only lasts like 2 minutes. I remember them being pretty much mana batteries in classic. Everyone seemed to think Necro was the most OP due to the lv 49 pet using FS daggers and literally shredding everything.

I wonder if any of those interviews with the devs on YT talks about enchanters and charm. Would have to look and listen.

[shovelquest]

Charm max duration on live is 8 mins at level 60 but its 22 mins here.

https://project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3700313&postcount=81

:o

[Trexller]

Charm max duration on live is 8 mins at level 60 but its 22 mins here.

https://project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3700313&postcount=81

:o

and yet people whine about classic

btw P99 rogues have shroud of stealth

[Ciderpress]

Charm never lasts even close to 22 minutes without a break on any mob worth charming though. I wouldn't even object to changing the max duration to 8 because it rarely lasts that long anyway.

I soloed probably 500 cliff golems on my enc using the undead foreman in OT. Charm would generally break at least once during the roughly 4-minute fight. Usually a quick stun and re-charm would finish it off, but it wasn't uncommon at all for it to break *again* before the end of the fight.

Then I stopped farming cliff golems cause their drop rates are complete shit even during bonus loot.

[shovelquest]

well you should be saying

"charm never lasts close to 8 minuets without a break on any mob worth charming though."

Hope this helps (them nerf charming).

[Ciderpress]

I mean just consider the spell dictate- the whole appeal is that it's guaranteed to last a certain length of time, and that length of time is only 50 seconds. Why then is the spell ever desireable to use? Because other charms often last *less* than 50 seconds.

Being unresistable is another perk, but still point remains with regard to duration.

[shovelquest]

Dictate allows you to charm moves above level 53. Otherwise you use the other charm.

[Ciderpress]

Dictate allows you to charm moves above level 53. Otherwise you use the other charm.

Yes duh but why is the duration only 50 seconds? If other charms can last up to 8 minutes, why didn't they make dictate last like 2 minutes? Because other charms are incredibly unreliable when it counts.

Chanters just got very good at dealing with charm breaks, most people probably don't even notice when a chanter's pet breaks and is quickly re-charmed in a pickup group because it's so routine now. In classic, charming wasn't employed as much because people sucked at managing their charm pets, not because the charm mechanic itself was coded to be less reliable.

Go ahead and change max duration to 8 minutes on p99, it will make basically no difference to 99% of charm scenarios, unless you're charming mobs 30 levels beneath you or something because that's the only time it lasts even close to max duration.

[shovelquest]

Why does rapture behave the same as dictate.

Why doesn't rapture last 6 minuets? Why does it have a slow recast time?

They're just how those specific spells work.

The simple fact is, the average charm should last about 1-3 minuets before needing a refresh.

[Ciderpress]

Why does rapture behave the same as dictate.

Why doesn't rapture last 6 minuets? Why does it have a slow recast time?

They're just how those specific spells work.

The simple fact is, the average charm should last about 1-3 minuets before needing a refresh.

Rapture is a mez not a charm.. I'm not sure I get your hypothetical, it's a completely different type of spell.

And again, I'm saying in practice boltran's (best charm before dictate) very often only *does* last 1-3 minutes. It often breaks within the first two server ticks- that's the tradeoff, and why I do not think chanter charming on p99 is even close to as OP as some people think it is.

[shovelquest]

Nobody is using dictate unless they have to.

Dictates appeal isn't the fixed duration, it's that it can charm mobs you can't with other charms because of the level cap.

You need to gear up your enchanter if you think boltrans lasts 1-3 minuets and often breaks withint he first two server ticks.

[shovelquest]

Also most people use the puppet strings to kill the biggest nameds in the game and aren't even enchanters and are even ugly lizards!

[Ciderpress]

Strings just cast allure though thats 51 max??

The thing about chanters is you can't really gear them beyond just being level 60 with 255 cha when it comes to charm, and the CHA component isn't even that important- it's way more important for paci duration.

Boltran's will certainly last closer to it's max duration if the level differential between you and the mob is larger, but if you're charming lvl 50-53 mobs it's basically a crapshoot when it decides to break.

[Ciderpress]

Sorry paci success chance\lesser crit resist chance, not duration.

I hate that you can't edit posts in r&f.

[shovelquest]

Just take whatever you think charms durations are now, and reduce them by 2/3rds.

I get that you're saying people use dictate effectively to kill difficult mobs.

Im saying that every mob an enchanter solo's should be that difficult.

Currently now, you just dick around in seb with a speed of shissared pet that breaks every 15-20 minuets.

[shovelquest]

I think it would have the largest effect on solo leveling an enchanter.

So calling all loramins to say "it encourages grouping"

https://i.imgur.com/uo0Fplk.png

[Ciderpress]

Just take whatever you think charms durations are now, and reduce them by 2/3rds.

I get that you're saying people use dictate effectively to kill difficult mobs.

Im saying that every mob an enchanter solo's should be that difficult.

Currently now, you just dick around in seb with a speed of shissared pet that breaks every 15-20 minuets.

I don't even have epic and have no interest in one really, like I said encs are super non-gear-dependent. You can die deep within a dungeon and get back in naked easily if there aren't any locked doors in the way. Vog is better than epic haste anyway for pets because of the atk bonus and the fact it's a somewhat slower haste, which means you have a somewhat higher chance of living on breaks.

Once you're 60, and have 255 cha, you're pretty much good to go, especially if you don't roll high elf because the gear required to get 255 cha as a non-high elf will also be giving you tons of int and mana. And also it won't always look like you're wearing white nikes.

[shovelquest]

I don't even have epic and have no interest in one really, like I said encs are super non-gear-dependent. You can die deep within a dungeon and get back in naked easily if there aren't any locked doors in the way. Vog is better than epic haste anyway for pets because of the atk bonus and the fact it's a somewhat slower haste, which means you have a somewhat higher chance of living on breaks.

Once you're 60, and have 255 cha, you're pretty much good to go, especially if you don't roll high elf because the gear required to get 255 cha as a non-high elf will also be giving you tons of int and mana. And also it won't always look like you're wearing white nikes.

Sure, I'm just saying that all that said charm should last 2/3 less long as it does.

[Zuranthium]

there's no indication that the mechanics we have currently are incorrect

Yes there is. Charm and Lull are very unclassic on this server:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=434049

[cd288]

Yes there is. Charm and Lull are very unclassic on this server:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=434049

Hmm interesting. Is that saying that you have to beat a roll of 10 in order to avoid a break and that here you have up to 200 in your roll but there you have 99?