I been playing Pantheon BTW

[Wakanda]

I was the highest level Enchanter on my server, but haven't played for 3 days because it's really hard to find a group when everyone is lower level than you are + there's a major shortage of tanks, and unlike EQ, if you don't have a tank, you literally cannot do anything.

That's my main complaint about the game honestly. Like you know how on EQ, 2 random players could group in GFAY or NRO and just start killing stuff? Maybe even go to Oasis and duo some crocs, pick up a 3rd or 4th player here and there, and exp away?

That's not a thing in Pantheon. You cannot really do anything meaningful without a full group that has a tank in it. Someone told me you also can't do anything without an Enchanter (IDK how accurate this is since I always play Enchanter, but I do know if a single mob doesn't get CC'd or someone breaks it, it's almost a guaranteed wipe).

I'm still hopeful for the game, but that's the main things I want to see changed

like make it to where solo'ing sucks, but is still a viable option for non summoner/necromancers. make it to where duo'ing and trio'ing is still a viable form of exp'ing. make it to where groups can still kill some stuff without tanks.

like my group was full except for a tank when someone in our group decided they wanted to try killing a single mob that we normally kill with ease with a tank in the group. despite having two healers, the group completely wiped in like 20 seconds.

i feel like also:

1) make tanks deal more damage. like you know how warriors in EQ are also kind of damage dealers? Well tanks in Pantheon are basically worse versions of prot warriors in WoW, they literally do less damage than healers, and no one wants to play them.

2) make some of the other melee dps a little bit tanky so groups can pull single mobs while looking for a tank. like it actually blows my mind how rangers and rogues get melted as fast as a wizard. ive never seen a monk in my group btw because they dont start near the elves and halflings.

https://i.ibb.co/v3RWBP4/yepz.png

game is still great and promising, but those are two things i would like to see changed. like i havent actually quit, im just hoping people will catch up to me in level so i can get more groups, and maybe ill play p99 for the xmas bonus. what was happening to me when i was playing, i was having to group with people way lower level than me doing content way too low level for me since they were the only people online, and when we died, i was losing more exp than i was gaining since the exp in those groups was terrible for me.

and dying in pantheon is really easy, even if mobs are low level. Like it's very believable that a level 15 enchanter would easily get killed by a gray con level 4 elite. Maybe something they also need to address in the future.

[Wakanda]

Also the logical solution was... okay I will make an alt... there seems to be a shortage of tanks, so I'll make a Halfling Dire Lord. After an hour of having every name rejected, I found out through other players that they banned making new characters on well populated servers... so I was stuck being forced to play my character who had no one to play with

And meanwhile the noob area in our zone is dead with players complaining that there's no one to group with, so I think most of them just decided the game was boring and quit, and I personally talked to so many people who wanted to make a tank to solve the tank shortage, but they couldnt because it was banned, so I think the decision they made was actually a terrible business move since it made new players think the game was a dead ghost town that sucked since there's no other noobs to group with and the higher level people who realize we needed more tanks can't even re-roll

but also it completely ignored the fact that the elf starting area wasn't over-populated at all, and had a huge shortage of players (most tank players start in the human/dwarf/ogre area for obvious reasons, ogres make much better dire lords than halflings and elves can't be monks).

So like they made the elf starting area basically feel really dead because an area really far away was allegedly over populated lol

i better solution would have been to allow players to create elves / halflings, and/or tanks/clerics (theres a ton of shamans, but not that many clerics). but also like communicating that the server is locked because i dont think most people even realized it and just thought the game was dead.

Also again, terrible business move because I had two friends who never even played EQ before watch me stream pantheon on our discord server and both of them wanted to buy it and i told them not to because i knew they couldnt play with me and i wasnt about to start over on a dead server because i made that mistake on classic WoW and ended up on an unplayable server 2 months later. so nah. ill take the high population server, thank you lol.

[Wakanda]

also yeah, the fact you cant progress in the game without a full group is also going to become even more problematic as the game becomes top heavy. like i dont think people who play in thronefast realize how sparse players are in wild's end even though i personally prefer wild's end over TF.

most players would be forced to quit at level 5 (exp starts to slow down quite a bit once bogbellied frogs green out and you almost have to start grouping)

game still has a ton of potential and is the most EQ-like game ive ever played other than EQ.

[Eisai]

I hope you are posting this stuff to their forum as well. :P I'd play a tank for sure but if no-one can even create one on a server that is lacking them.. It's worse then a game with inviable character builds that don't allow respec. The whole server is screwed lol.

[Ekco]

that's a wild design choice, i assume the idea was you don't have to worry about class balance as much if nobody can do shit without a group anyway

just gonna lead to the meta of if you aren't playing whatever the correct dps class is fuck off or you get carried through the content as a favor after it's already trivial to the tank / healer like how it worked on shards of dalaya with 6man raid content

[NachtMystium]

not a post in sight that is readable. i aint reading dat shit

[Wakanda]

I hope you are posting this stuff to their forum as well. :P I'd play a tank for sure but if no-one can even create one on a server that is lacking them.. It's worse then a game with inviable character builds that don't allow respec. The whole server is screwed lol.

i would like to :p but you cant if you werent a pledge from years ago ! lol

[Duik]

Originally Posted by Eisai

I hope you are posting this stuff to their forum as well. :P

Originally Posted by Wakanda
i would like to but you cant if you werent a pledge from years ago ! lol

Haha. Sounds like no makei bad posts so the griftie can continue.

Love to be proven wrong.

[Ekco]

Haha. Sounds like no makei bad posts so the griftie can continue.

Love to be proven wrong.

people should fund it just to beat Duke Nukem Forever's record of 14 years in development.

[Duik]

People should just play only the freebie releases and string those bitches along.

Better?

[Eisai]

There will probably be a pantheon emulator server before it releases :P

[Duik]

Emu-Later bitches!

[Eisai]

I like the idea of every xp mob being a mini raid but turning off new chars while simultaneously disallowing feedback sounds like a terrible way to test anything but patience. Maybe they have a reddit or twitter feed or something where you can enlighten them.

[aaezil]

people should fund it just to beat Duke Nukem Forever's record of 14 years in development.

Pretty sure Star Citizen is gonna beat that in around 2 years haaaa

[eisley]

correct dps class is fuck off or you get carried through the content as a favor after it's already trivial to the tank / healer like how it worked on shards of dalaya with 6man raid content


I played Shards of Dalaya a little bit and my experience was actually the exact opposite. Class didn't matter much at all, all that mattered was the combination of gear, tomes, and skill. Maybe throw in Vah Back for early 4.3. I can't think of a single 6 man in that game that requires a certain class, outside of needing either a Cleric or Druid for group heals. I guess maybe you "need" a Monk/SK for the 3 pull after Baphomet towards Melek Taus.

[Ekco]

i was playing when like unless you were friends with Lleoc you weren't doing 4.3

whatever era that was.

[eisley]

I tried to rotate people in every kill for 4.3, at the very least having someone play their toon for the weapon, despite the hassle. After I got banned there was a changing of the guard though, and it sounds like you played SoD after I was gone.

But yeah, knowing Lleoc, I'm not at all surprised. Sorry you ever had to interact with him. I endured it for 5+ years.

[Knuckle]

Crafting system is awful right now. Game needs a lot of work. Game is kind of fun. Feels like a weird EQ WOW hybrid. Lot more focus on active/reactive abilities than EQ.

[Neno]

That's my main complaint about the game honestly. Like you know how on EQ, 2 random players could group in GFAY or NRO and just start killing stuff? Maybe even go to Oasis and duo some crocs, pick up a 3rd or 4th player here and there, and exp away?

That's not a thing in Pantheon. You cannot really do anything meaningful without a full group that has a tank in it.

Quite a few members of old school gaming communities/devs love gas lighting themselves that harder = better until their games flop and die. People that played EQ and walked away thinking it was popular for its time because of week long raid lock outs and 10min of down time between pulls should be locked up.

[Reiwa]

I played Shards of Dalaya a little bit and my experience was actually the exact opposite. Class didn't matter much at all, all that mattered was the combination of gear, tomes, and skill. Maybe throw in Vah Back for early 4.3. I can't think of a single 6 man in that game that requires a certain class, outside of needing either a Cleric or Druid for group heals. I guess maybe you "need" a Monk/SK for the 3 pull after Baphomet towards Melek Taus.

Server was better when the original devs, who hated kitty cats, were in charge.

They'd put you in jail for linking [Squirrel].

Really too bad it turned into a Brazilian ladyboy fund for Woldaff after they left.

[Reiwa]

Curiosity demands me to ask what happened with the Mormons!

I assume they left immediately after fully realizing the impending depravity.

[azeth]

I played Shards of Dalaya a little bit and my experience was actually the exact opposite. Class didn't matter much at all, all that mattered was the combination of gear, tomes, and skill. Maybe throw in Vah Back for early 4.3. I can't think of a single 6 man in that game that requires a certain class, outside of needing either a Cleric or Druid for group heals. I guess maybe you "need" a Monk/SK for the 3 pull after Baphomet towards Melek Taus.

I played on SoD for about 6 months in 2005-2006. Frauzen the cleric and my 2box was a Warrior that ended up with a title - Lequox the Nuisance.

I really enjoyed that server, wish I could remember more of my time there.

[Ekco]

I really enjoyed that server, wish I could remember more of my time there.

only thing worth remembering about that server.
https://i.imgur.com/blH0qHE.jpeg

Free Vagpounder

[Reiwa]

I played on SoD for about 6 months in 2005-2006. Frauzen the cleric and my 2box was a Warrior that ended up with a title - Lequox the Nuisance.

I really enjoyed that server, wish I could remember more of my time there.

First Whitebear got a forced name change then he got banned for putting rings in every equipment slot.

[cd288]

i would like to :p but you cant if you werent a pledge from years ago ! lol

Post it on the sub reddit then. VR monitors it.

In any case, this is basically Beta. I'm sure plenty of balance changes will be forthcoming.

[WarpathEQ]

Sounds a lot like the sentiments people would have had about EQ out of the box in 1999. Its a scary and dangerous world that will likely become much more trivial with community knowledge.

[Knuckle]

This is EQ if the entire world was: Greater Faydark, Crushbone, Butcherblock mountains, East commonlands, West Commonlands, Kithicor Forest, and Everfrost. With 6 races, 16 half implemented classes. Also if EQ used WoW like cooldowns for every class forcing you to constantly react to bullshit abilities. Also if EQ had the downtime of WoW. This game is a boring grind as a tank, soloing is mostly pointless with some exceptions beyond the obvious leveling aspect. There is no realistic power scaling against these stupid elite mobs they've tagged as 50% of the mobs in the game, you either waste hours forming a 6 person group, or solo useless trash animal mobs. Also rogues steal all the good shit from chests, so your dungeon labors are even less lucrative. This is essentially a stripped down game that will never develop into a world the scale of everquest, and will not really have the "chill" group aspect of EQ due to constant cooldown mashing. I don't think I'll even want to come back to this game until "1.0" when they have 12 finished zones or whatever.

[cd288]

Well, again, you're playing the Beta build so some of these things shouldn't be surprising

[Estrang87]

Well, again, you're playing the Beta build so some of these things shouldn't be surprising

Is this considered a beta? This is much closer to early alpha with the current content level.

[cd288]

/shrug

point is it's not an early access build

[cd288]

It IS an EA build*

[Estrang87]

And I think you are all apologists if you consider this content level anywhere near "early access" / Beta levels. They plan to launch 1.0 within 2 years. Their team is comically small to make a game anywhere near the scope of an EQ type MMO. It will lose its luster quickly because they simply are 5% the size of a traditional MMO like vanilla wow or classic EQ.

[cd288]

There's technically no definition for what an "early access" level of content is

[shovelquest]

I've watched like 9 hours of live streams and all I see are people enjoying the game.

Fuck them, and fuck the creators! Right?

[wuanahto]

we might of thought we did but we dont

[shovelquest]

we might of thought we did but we dont

its not fun now? What's the latest news?

[Duik]

its not fun now? What's the latest news?

Its called sunk cost fallacy. They so desperately want brads love child to be good they will literally ignore the grift going on.

Art for arts sake? Nope that right there is art for moneys sake. It may have begun as an actual game (i really do) but it has decended into a joke. And you all are the butts.

Sorry. I hope it turns out. All six zones.

[Wakanda]

Its called sunk cost fallacy. They so desperately want brads love child to be good they will literally ignore the grift going on.

Art for arts sake? Nope that right there is art for moneys sake. It may have begun as an actual game (i really do) but it has decended into a joke. And you all are the butts.

Sorry. I hope it turns out. All six zones.
Not true at all for me. I was a huge hater of Pantheon. For years I've been complaining about how it was a WoW clone and had nothing in common with EQ. I never had any interest in playing it, but I had extra time off for X-mas, and someone gave me a steam card for my birthday. I already had most of the games I wanted, so I was like... okay I'm going to grab Pantheon since it literally came out on the same day, just so I can confirm that it's a terrible WoW clone.

As soon as I logged into Pantheon I was like okay this looks rough (I said the same thing after logging into P99 after not playing EQ for 20 years). But over the next few hours and several days I was extremely addicted to the game. It's not believable that anyone could enjoy P99 or classic EQ and not enjoy Pantheon because the games feel very, very similar, but Pantheon is more active and it's also more exciting because you have no clue where to go or what's going on. Sort of like with EQ in 1999.

There are things that are problematic, or that make it feel less like EQ, namely the fact that you need a tank / full group to do anything -- but they specifically addressed that in the last patch that came out. Another thing I liked better about EQ was how a lot of noob zones had actual dungeons nearby (befallen, runnyeye, crushbone, blackburrow etc.) Maybe these also exist in Pantheon and I'm just unaware of it?

I've only played elf characters, and you could make an argument that the zone elves start in actually has a ton of dungeon content in it, but that it doesn't require it's own separate zone due to how large the zones are (like for instance, in 2025, would Crushbone actually need to be it's own separate zone? Same with Unrest.)

But yeah I definitely don't have a lot invested in Pantheon and I feel like it's important to let people know that if they enjoy P99 then they willl probably also really find themselves drawn into Pantheon because it plays and feels so similar. To the point where people are actually complaining a lot about the CRs, XP loss, dark nights, getting lost etc.

I have seen a lot of people I know personally whining about how you have to be rich to play Pantheon (I'm guessing they play P99 on a really old e-machine, no hate?). But Pantheon seems to run fine on average PCs. My girlfriend's 1660 super gets the same FPS as my 3080.

IDK why but it kind of triggered me when these people I know were trying to tell me that you didn't need a high end PC to play EQ. Like yes, you literally did. We couldn't even buy a computer that could run EQ, we had to build one, and spend a lot of money on a graphics card, which we drove for hours to find since ordering one off the internet wasn't really a thing. Most of my friends didn't have household internet in 1999, or any PC, nor would their parents let them use their credit cards to play a video game.

Like to me EQ was always an expensive game to play and it really pushed the limits of hardware at the time. I kind of wish PC games would do that still instead of catering to console gamers. Like I'm getting ready to upgrade to a 4080, meanwhile I'll be playing the same games as most of my friends who are using a playstation.

[Wakanda]

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=436621

This is just one thread I made talking crap about Pantheon before it came out BTW. I can prob find more. Especially if I dig deep on Reddit :p But yeah, I for sure was not a fan boy who spent thousands of dollars. The game is good. It needs a lot of work, but it's for sure playable and enjoyable. It's also super social BTW, which can be a good thing or a bad thing. I've been part of some pretty wild Discord calls where you can tell it's a bunch of late 30s, early 40s males drunk AF exploring a new dungeon, dying repeatedly because the Ranger accidentally tab targets and breaks mez etc and having to do a million CRs.

[Wakanda]

Also another thing that I forgot to address is... I'll be honest I don't know how many zones are in the game, but it doesn't seem to be an issue because of how MASSIVE the zones are. I remember trying to run from Wild's End to where the human's started. I watched a guy on YouTube and ran the same way as him. 25 minutes later and I'm not even in the next zone. (Apparently it's an hour+ run). I wouldn't know though because I got about 200 feet into the connecting zone and decided I'm not attempting that run again. I'm just grateful I had the foresight to put my stuff in the bank so I didn't have to spend another 30 minutes TRYING to get my corpse, lol. But yes the game feels massive.

It's not riddled with mobs like WoW zones either BTW. Like there are huge spaces of vastness and emptiness, but at the same time it feels like the zones were set up in a way that there would almost always be something worth camping if your usual spot is taken. Like Wild's End could probably legit have 300 players grinding away in it, but when you travel around you'll come across huge areas where you don't see another player or mob. It's just massive really.

I love when I turn LFG on and people 2 zones away ask me to join. Like dude, that's a 2 hour run, assuming I don't die. I don't think so ;(

[eisley]

Server was better when the original devs, who hated kitty cats, were in charge.

They'd put you in jail for linking [Squirrel].

Really too bad it turned into a Brazilian ladyboy fund for Woldaff after they left.

Yep, now even people on the new server do the Squirrel shit in OOC. We didn't know how good we had it.

Ultimately, the game went in the shitter when Woldaff and Slaariel held the Admin positions hostage and ran off all the talented devs (Marza). Woldaff's semi-annual appearance from the ether to nerf a bunch of shit and disappear again took a toll on everyone.

Still, Shards of Dalaya was the alpha EQEmu game, with custom content, lore, and encounters totally untouched by anything else in the scene, in terms of both sheer amount of encounters/lore and the quality of it all.

I mean, they turned Skyshrine into a 7-tier spanning raid zone with all custom Lore and secret dragons in disguise. *chefs kiss*

[eisley]

I played on SoD for about 6 months in 2005-2006. Frauzen the cleric and my 2box was a Warrior that ended up with a title - Lequox the Nuisance.

I really enjoyed that server, wish I could remember more of my time there.

That's awesome you got a title, back in the early days things like titles and race changes were actually possible since there was Dev interaction. My shaman was turned into a Dark Elf.

Fomelo confirms your story :] https://shardsofdalaya.com/fomelo/fomelo.php?char=Lequox (and mine (https://shardsofdalaya.com/fomelo/fomelo.php?char=alkesh))

It was such a blast in the early days when we had 600 people online, and dozens of people contributing in their own little way. It's really a testament to what a passionate community can create.

A few months ago they started a new fresh Dalaya server with new admins if you're interested. https://dalaya.org/

Cheers Azeth, hope you're doing well.

[Ekco]

I mean, they turned Skyshrine into a 7-tier spanning raid zone with all custom Lore and secret dragons in disguise. *chefs kiss*

Prison was a remarkably well-developed zone. Marza did it right? I hold Outer Sanctum and acquiring a Masalavir for my ranger to be the pinnacle of my EQ experience. I was fortunate enough to join Pheonix Rising as an applicant just before things went to shit. I experienced that sweet spot when players like Nuchre and Lleoc were in the same guild, before everything fell apart, and had to raid with Sema, Jarh, and Vitali in Chaotic Winds and be in a guild that exploited Forest Gloom to keep up with Exodus in Spire.

[shovelquest]

Servers are maxed out in both paccific and eastern during prime time.

Not bad. Looks like Pantheon's back on the menu!

[Duik]

Just checked out a unity 6 demo.
They got 3d graphics engine covered.
Many scripting lingos are in widespread use. Perl, lua and go to name 3.

The eqemu devs have cobbled together a great hook system that allows even dumbies like me to make indepth quests/encounters possible, my mediocre skillz not withstanding. Better peeps would yield better results.

It seems to me that it's ideas that are lacking in this game.

Here is a model proposal. Release an API that hooks into their game engine with various lvls of access.

Need tradeskill recipe ideas? Give a speci sheet out outlining the goals of tradeskills. How strong they should be. How difficult they should be etc. No access to combat manipulation, factions etc.

Release that and pay (or freeplay options for) open source devs with actual imaginations to make them. NDA's etc blah and blah. Then release that.

Zone design?
Speci sheets. Frigsample, Make like eq unrest. Make like zoneA in wow.
Come up with something new! Losely based on:
Aquatic. Underground. Desert. Tundra. Alien.

Quest ideas? See hook system above. There are alot of DMs out there with shit hot ideas. Then they may release more than 6 zones and a few concepts of a plan for classes.

[Reiwa]

Then they may release more than 6 zones and a few concepts of a plan for classes.

Is this about Pantheon or M&M? :o

[Ekco]

Is this about Pantheon or M&M? :o

https://media0.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExOTNsdDhqZDB2Y2VmdWV3czY3MWw1OXF pNmx1bnBsdHpsNjRvNXYzeCZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfY nlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/h2WEVxehGXMniB2exA/giphy.gif

WHERE'D ALL THE FUCKING MONEY GO LEBOWSKI