Your hopes for a 2.0 server?

[pink grapefruit]

Some people are talking about some date in March that corresponds to some live date, so hope is alive and well. We know that the devs have been hard at work coding in stuff for the timeline for next time around, so obviously there will be a next time.

My big hope is for March too, and also some big news:


Red server- played out and finished, merged into blue
Purple server (PvP Teams) announced -OR-
Yellow server (red + green, PvP FFA) announced
Green 2.0 announced


No one needs two servers (blue, red) that are extremely old with broken economies and oversaturation of high-end gear. Blue players would be very upset to be merged into red, and no one on red cares about their characters anymore so this merge makes sense. Hopefully, the plan is still to automate the "recycling" of green, and I would like to see this apply to all future pvp servers as well.

Obviously, the next server will need to be a pvp ruleset, as the previous new server was a pve ruleset. It would be cool if going forward the next server is released at the halfway mark of the last server. So yellow/purple releases March 2023, green recycles ~June 2024, then new pvp server ~September 2025. This would help keep interest in the project, as every 18 months or so one of the servers recycles into blue and starts over.

This could be made infinitely cooler if there is a different PvP ruleset each time it recycles into blue. Maybe some of the green resets could include the FV roleplay ruleset or something, too. A pvp teams ruleset might be able to attract more bluebies, as they will have people they know they are safe with. I ofc like the idea of the pvp server maintaining the "classic" timeline that green will experience too, like no Erudite SKs until x date etc.

Then the project could always have blue, green, and whatever color the recycling pvp server is- maybe just keep it red?

anyway. just the hopes of one elf nerd. what are you hoping for the project going forward?

[wuanahto]

I just want Green merged into blue in march
one year cooldown
then rerelease teal in march 2024

Red has hefty amounts of custom stuff to goad people into playing red

[Hailto]

I feel for you pvp guys, but the truth is there is just not very many of you.

[DeliciousHalflings]

Some people are talking about some date in March that corresponds to some live date, so hope is alive and well. We know that the devs have been hard at work coding in stuff for the timeline for next time around, so obviously there will be a next time.

My big hope is for March too, and also some big news:


Red server- played out and finished, merged into blue
Purple server (PvP Teams) announced -OR-
Yellow server (red + green, PvP FFA) announced
Green 2.0 announced


No one needs two servers (blue, red) that are extremely old with broken economies and oversaturation of high-end gear. Blue players would be very upset to be merged into red, and no one on red cares about their characters anymore so this merge makes sense. Hopefully, the plan is still to automate the "recycling" of green, and I would like to see this apply to all future pvp servers as well.

Obviously, the next server will need to be a pvp ruleset, as the previous new server was a pve ruleset. It would be cool if going forward the next server is released at the halfway mark of the last server. So yellow/purple releases March 2023, green recycles ~June 2024, then new pvp server ~September 2025. This would help keep interest in the project, as every 18 months or so one of the servers recycles into blue and starts over.

This could be made infinitely cooler if there is a different PvP ruleset each time it recycles into blue. Maybe some of the green resets could include the FV roleplay ruleset or something, too. A pvp teams ruleset might be able to attract more bluebies, as they will have people they know they are safe with. I ofc like the idea of the pvp server maintaining the "classic" timeline that green will experience too, like no Erudite SKs until x date etc.

Then the project could always have blue, green, and whatever color the recycling pvp server is- maybe just keep it red?

anyway. just the hopes of one elf nerd. what are you hoping for the project going forward?

Fuck PvP. Entire project would have been better off just ignoring PvP servers to begin with.

[Rivewin]

Sorry to tell you this my man but 95% of peoplle do not want anything to do with pvp. A pvp server would be an incredibly dumb decision. It won’t happen.

[Fammaden]

Ban PvP posting in PvE forum sections.

[Lampolo]

I couldn't read. Too much pvp talk to keep my interest

[Sirquestalot]

... and no one on red cares about their characters anymore ...

If that's true, then deleting Red and having no new pvp servers makes even more sense.

[eqravenprince]

*Yawn* pvp talk.

[Infectious]

Pvp is fun, but it's what a new red server brings that I would vote no. Salty training the ec tunnel for months . Spamming ec tunnel auc channel for a red server.
Trolling rogean and crew.

These people deserve nothing and it's actually nice having them not here.

[loramin]

I think the chances of a new Green anytime soon are small, and the chances of a new Red even smaller.

That being said, as I've said many times before, if P99 is serious about being classic (and thus having a PvP option), that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

[Toxigen]

consider red

[jinxy12]

Pvp is fun, but it's what a new red server brings that I would vote no. Salty training the ec tunnel for months . Spamming ec tunnel auc channel for a red server.
Trolling rogean and crew.

These people deserve nothing and it's actually nice having them not here.

i get that your a fanboi for the gms but....

you think thats a red specific thing? green had people training ec tunnel its first week so idk what you're smoking.

if you're gonna be a yes man, least get the facts str8

[pink grapefruit]

I think the chances of a new Green anytime soon are small, and the chances of a new Red even smaller.

That being said, as I've said many times before, if P99 is serious about being classic (and thus having a PvP option), that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

The real fear with a teams server is that we end up with a Sullon Zek problem where one team dominates the server and the other team(s) don't get any raid content. Or depending on ruleset, having a Tallon Zek problem where crossteaming is so rampant it basically just becomes a FFA server with extra steps.

I believe any issues though would be basically resolved with timely fresh starts. All the red players have been wanting for many years now is a new server where everyone starts at level 1 again. If the server automatically rolled all their characters into blue at the end of the Velious timeline and started again, I think we would see a very healthy population regardless of ruleset.

Red players like to point out specific issues with the ruleset and blame that for the poor population, but what really killed the server is stagnation. Starting things over again on even footing would bring most people back, and again bring in some bluebie types to experience the chaos.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Idk why most bluebies get so mean whenever pvp is mentioned.

[TercerRigo]

...that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

I would very much like to play this.

[Chewybunny]

The real fear with a teams server is that we end up with a Sullon Zek problem where one team dominates the server and the other team(s) don't get any raid content. Or depending on ruleset, having a Tallon Zek problem where crossteaming is so rampant it basically just becomes a FFA server with extra steps.

I believe any issues though would be basically resolved with timely fresh starts. All the red players have been wanting for many years now is a new server where everyone starts at level 1 again. If the server automatically rolled all their characters into blue at the end of the Velious timeline and started again, I think we would see a very healthy population regardless of ruleset.

Red players like to point out specific issues with the ruleset and blame that for the poor population, but what really killed the server is stagnation. Starting things over again on even footing would bring most people back, and again bring in some bluebie types to experience the chaos.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Idk why most bluebies get so mean whenever pvp is mentioned.

I played on Tallon from 2000-2004, crossteaming was largely focused on "Humans, Elves, Shorties" (Lighties) vs the evil team. And there was some cross-teaming guilds that had all of them. There were also some that were team specific. And from what I recall most were okay with pvping other "teams". So I don't recall cross-teaming being a major issue. It created a great dynamic in the game, and I remember my best EQ experiences on TZ.

[pink grapefruit]

I played on Tallon from 2000-2004, crossteaming was largely focused on "Humans, Elves, Shorties" (Lighties) vs the evil team. And there was some cross-teaming guilds that had all of them. There were also some that were team specific. And from what I recall most were okay with pvping other "teams". So I don't recall cross-teaming being a major issue. It created a great dynamic in the game, and I remember my best EQ experiences on TZ.

Seems Pande never got the memo. Also ask the dark team guilds if they thought x-teaming was an issue lol.

I'm VZ, we were very similar but managed to do it better imo.

[Chewybunny]

Seems Pande never got the memo. Also ask the dark team guilds if they thought x-teaming was an issue lol.

I'm VZ, we were very similar but managed to do it better imo.

Yeah but everyone hated Pandemonium, and often were hostile to them.
I was on the Dark Team, my main was an Iksar Shaman. We had a lot of solidarity - a lot more than any other team.

[pink grapefruit]

Yeah but everyone hated Pandemonium, and often were hostile to them.
I was on the Dark Team, my main was an Iksar Shaman. We had a lot of solidarity - a lot more than any other team.

Sorry, I gotta give you some shit bc VZ pride.

Sadly I think the magic we experienced with our soft-coded race-based teams will never happen again. If that exact ruleset was introduced now I feel pretty certain that everyone would just xteam immediately instead of doing the fun RP stuff. Gotta go SZ hard-coded; also deity-based is actually a cooler idea imo.

I was never dark team. Elf purist while leveling, then xteam scum for endgame. Did the dark team people not hate the "lighties" for their xteaming hypocrisy?

[eqravenprince]

I think the chances of a new Green anytime soon are small

What makes you say that? A new green is very much wanted and desired. They have the code. Release new green, worry about the merge from green 1.0 to blue later.

[brokenkiller]

I am betting it has to do with the deal that was made with Daybreak and that's why we haven't heard anything.

[Fammaden]

They are getting everything just exactly perfect on the new red before making any green announcements guys, you'll see, its really happening this time.

[Infectious]

i get that your a fanboi for the gms but....

you think thats a red specific thing? green had people training ec tunnel its first week so idk what you're smoking.

if you're gonna be a yes man, least get the facts str8

Ya. It was red players begging for a new server. Like they did on blue, years ago.

[Infectious]

Yeah but everyone hated Pandemonium, and often were hostile to them.
I was on the Dark Team, my main was an Iksar Shaman. We had a lot of solidarity - a lot more than any other team.

Who was your main on TZ?

[jinxy12]

Ya. It was red players begging for a new server. Like they did on blue, years ago.


in fairness, red blue and green players all want a server, not just red.

so if i got this right.... you like pvp, you seem to think only red wants a new server, and red is the only place people troll gm's, spam chat, or train ec tunnel? and you'd vote no on it?

reasons you're slow
1=u like pvp but vote no anyway (or lied about liking it)
2=you're confused thinking people dont troll gms on green/blue also
3=same goes for spamming chat or training places like tunnel

then again, yes men never been much for using their brains to make a valid point, more of a off the top of the head, not based and fact / whatever the people you're yessin say.

yes men, the Redgren Grumbholdt of logic.

[Swish]

in fairness, red blue and green players all want a server, not just red.

so if i got this right.... you like pvp, you seem to think only red wants a new server, and red is the only place people troll gm's, spam chat, or train ec tunnel? and you'd vote no on it?

reasons you're slow
1=u like pvp but vote no anyway (or lied about liking it)
2=you're confused thinking people dont troll gms on green/blue also
3=same goes for spamming chat or training places like tunnel

then again, yes men never been much for using their brains to make a valid point, more of a off the top of the head, not based and fact / whatever the people you're yessin say.

yes men, the Redgren Grumbholdt of logic.

https://media.tenor.com/CFd73XKouKEAAAAC/troy-point.gif

[loramin]

The real fear with a teams server is that we end up with a Sullon Zek problem where one team dominates the server and the other team(s) don't get any raid content. Or depending on ruleset, having a Tallon Zek problem where crossteaming is so rampant it basically just becomes a FFA server with extra steps.

I believe any issues though would be basically resolved with timely fresh starts. All the red players have been wanting for many years now is a new server where everyone starts at level 1 again. If the server automatically rolled all their characters into blue at the end of the Velious timeline and started again, I think we would see a very healthy population regardless of ruleset.

Red players like to point out specific issues with the ruleset and blame that for the poor population, but what really killed the server is stagnation. Starting things over again on even footing would bring most people back, and again bring in some bluebie types to experience the chaos.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Idk why most bluebies get so mean whenever pvp is mentioned.

You're absolutely right that the team mechanics would need to be well-thought-out. Having rolling restarts is one approach, having a new take on teams and "territory" would be another, /guildwar is another, and there are probably other ways to approach it as well. Personally, I'm 100% agnostic to the approach.

I just think the underying system of "every man for himself" is fine for a game like Quake, but it doesn't work for a MMOG. You need a system that somehow promotes healthy PvP, not one that encourages griefers to grief off all the new folks.

What makes you say that? A new green is very much wanted and desired. They have the code. Release new green, worry about the merge from green 1.0 to blue later.

Because a new server is a lot of work for the staff, and so it would seem to require a lot of motivation on their part.

I'm not saying it will never happen, and I'd imagine that the the longer we go between servers, the more motivated they'll get (if only because they'll forget what a PITA Green 1.0 was for them ;))

... but I just don't see signs of such motivation right now. I'd love to be wrong.

[pink grapefruit]

You're absolutely right that the team mechanics would need to be well-thought-out. Having rolling restarts is one approach, having a new take on teams and "territory" would be another, /guildwar is another, and there are probably other ways to approach it as well. Personally, I'm 100% agnostic to the approach.

I just think the underying system of "every man for himself" is fine for a game like Quake, but it doesn't work for a MMOG. You need a system that somehow promotes healthy PvP, not one that encourages griefers to grief off all the new folks.

oh i don't really disagree, and teams pvp is my jam bc that's what i did on live. and i don't know if anyone remember this, but back before there was talk of a discord server the devs were talking teams pvp. that was back when sirken was on staff.

as a very specific sort of eq nerd i would love it if someone would nerd out with me about potential teams pvp rulesets.

the most important thing imo is to ensure the teams mostly make sense from a RP standpoint. none of this "iksar and gnomes as one team" nonsense. really i think the SZ teams make the most sense, maybe with neutral team able to group (but not guild) with good and evil teams, and maybe let necros worship sol ro or something.

gonna stop myself before i spam everyone with a pointless dissertation on pvp rulesets lol

[HalflingWarrior]

I think the chances of a new Green anytime soon are small, and the chances of a new Red even smaller.

That being said, as I've said many times before, if P99 is serious about being classic (and thus having a PvP option), that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

The problem with Teams is that whichever high-end guild gives in to cross-teaming first, automatically wins.

I remember back on TZ, it went from the intended four Racial Teams, to Good (Elves, Humans & Shorts) v. Evil because the Dark Team alone had such a high population. Then, after Pandemonium, x-teaming became the only viable strategy.

I remember there were some long-term holdouts into Velious, like Human Retribution, but eventually those guilds fizzled out because it just wasn't a viable gameplay strategy.

Server would have to be hard coded both offensively and defensively. No healing or buffing players on another Team, or you end up with OOR healers ruining every PVP encounter

[Trexller]

I am betting it has to do with the deal that was made with Daybreak and that's why we haven't heard anything.

we should expand on this.

that daybreak deal governs literally everything p99 does

you folks remember how green launch got pushed up several months, that was because of a TLP launch.

look at the future for a long break in anything new coming from daybreak, that's where you'll see something new on P99

things look kinda slow for live EQ this year, so looks like june onward is the open window for Project 1999 to make a move.

https://www.everquest.com/news/eq-2023-roadmap

[Castle2.0]

you end up with OOR healers ruining every PVP encounterOne of the many reasons low-level PvP sucked.

Twinks and OOR healers were the worst.

[Jimjam]

The problem with Teams is that whichever high-end guild gives in to cross-teaming first, automatically wins.

I remember back on TZ, it went from the intended four Racial Teams, to Good (Elves, Humans & Shorts) v. Evil because the Dark Team alone had such a high population. Then, after Pandemonium, x-teaming became the only viable strategy.

I remember there were some long-term holdouts into Velious, like Human Retribution, but eventually those guilds fizzled out because it just wasn't a viable gameplay strategy.

Server would have to be hard coded both offensively and defensively. No healing or buffing players on another Team, or you end up with OOR healers ruining every PVP encounter
I liked lights vs darks on TZ and I also liked that the lights could fight among themselves as elves, shorts and humans.

I’d hardcode against heals and buffs from lights to darks and vice versa. I wouldn’t hardcode against shorts/elves/humans healing/buffing each other but i would want to keep them pvp against each other - so a dwarf on elf action would leave the human picking who to toss a heal to.

Ie lights can choose to work together or not based on situation.



I’d be tempted to go deeper by breaking darks into sub teams similar to the lights (maybe lizards vs evil antonicans?). I’d also consider bending the barriers of the teams a little. Putting Cazic Erudites on evil and so on. Perhaps this could be a way to add bards to evil? Idk if bards can be fear/hate/plague. Probs not unfortunately.

[pink grapefruit]

I liked lights vs darks on TZ and I also liked that the lights could fight among themselves as elves, shorts and humans.

I’d hardcode against heals and buffs from lights to darks and vice versa. I wouldn’t hardcode against shorts/elves/humans healing/buffing each other but i would want to keep them pvp against each other - so a dwarf on elf action would leave the human picking who to toss a heal to.

Ie lights can choose to work together or not based on situation.



I’d be tempted to go deeper by breaking darks into sub teams similar to the lights (maybe lizards vs evil antonicans?). I’d also consider bending the barriers of the teams a little. Putting Cazic Erudites on evil and so on. Perhaps this could be a way to add bards to evil? Idk if bards can be fear/hate/plague. Probs not unfortunately.

at this point just go SZ teams imo. they put Rallos Zek on evil team which is how they got bards. official statement from live devs back then:

The 'Teams':

The Good Alliance consists of: Erollisi Marr, Mithaniel Marr, Rodcet Nife, Quellious, Tunare
The Evil Alliance consists of: Bertoxxulous, Cazic Thule, Innoruuk, Rallos Zek
The Neutral Alliance consists of: Brell Serilis, Bristlebane, Karana, Prexus, Solusek Ro, The Tribunal, Veeshan.

There are no Agnostics on Sullon Zek. With the new influence of the gods, those that had not declared for one deity or another have been killed. Everyone now worships a deity, if not out of respect, love or fear of the god, then out of fear for their lives at the hands of fanatics.
Barbarian Shaman and Warriors can choose to worship Mithaniel Marr. Mithaniel Marr was unwilling to abandon all of the noble barbarians that served the good, and many declared themselves in favor of an alliance with Good.
Monks will be able to worship Veeshan. The Temple in Qeynos has discovered some ancient writings that opened up new avenues.
We will be including a method for the Good and Neutral teams to use Summon Corpse or something similar.

i kinda like the softcoding for neutral/good and hardcoding for evil idea, as on live evil team ran the server.

[Berb]

I hope it's a PVE server that goes beyond velious. Maybe something with rotating zems or slightly increased loot.

After spending enough time on blue and green, another velious locked server doesn't appeal to me personally.

[Fammaden]

Hoping for Luclin is the only take more deluded than hoping for a new red.

[loramin]

so a dwarf on elf action would leave the human picking who to toss a heal to.

At first, I misread your post and thought you were talking about a mechanic where a ranged character shooting into combat (or in this case, healing) could miss, and accidentally hit the person they're fighting with instead.

While that would probably be hard to implement, I think it would be awesome if your human was trying to heal their dwarf ally, but because of an unlucky roll they could somehow miss and accidentally heal the elf enemy instead. And if you made the miss chance increase based on how far away the caster was, this could even be a solution to OOR healers ;)

[pink grapefruit]

At first, I misread your post and thought you were talking about a mechanic where a ranged character shooting into combat (or in this case, healing) could miss, and accidentally hit the person they're fighting with instead.

While that would probably be hard to implement, I think it would be awesome if your human was trying to heal their dwarf ally, but because of an unlucky roll they could somehow miss and accidentally heal the elf enemy instead. And if you made the miss chance increase based on how far away the caster was, this could even be a solution to OOR healers ;)

mage bolt heals?

[Jobaber]

anyone who plays pvp knows that the only pvp "encounter" is beastagores face 1 inch from yours as you try to not die.

[loramin]

mage bolt heals?

Conceptually yes! Although, I'd imagine it might be easier to practically implement it without literally making heals a bolt (and instead just add a random chance, based on how far you are away, to hit/heal someone near the target instead).

[Jimjam]

At first, I misread your post and thought you were talking about a mechanic where a ranged character shooting into combat (or in this case, healing) could miss, and accidentally hit the person they're fighting with instead.

While that would probably be hard to implement, I think it would be awesome if your human was trying to heal their dwarf ally, but because of an unlucky roll they could somehow miss and accidentally heal the elf enemy instead. And if you made the miss chance increase based on how far away the caster was, this could even be a solution to OOR healers ;)

Archery and bolts can hit wrong targets, right? It’s a good way to score double damage bow hits while in melee range on ranger.

Just do bolts which heal on impact instead of damage.

[Infectious]

in fairness, red blue and green players all want a server, not just red.

so if i got this right.... you like pvp, you seem to think only red wants a new server, and red is the only place people troll gm's, spam chat, or train ec tunnel? and you'd vote no on it?

reasons you're slow
1=u like pvp but vote no anyway (or lied about liking it)
2=you're confused thinking people dont troll gms on green/blue also
3=same goes for spamming chat or training places like tunnel

then again, yes men never been much for using their brains to make a valid point, more of a off the top of the head, not based and fact / whatever the people you're yessin say.

yes men, the Redgren Grumbholdt of logic.

You type to your mom with fingers like that?

[Cen]

I do hope people call it something besides 2.0

season 2 sounds good but 3 years is long to say "season" but 2.0 sounds like it won't be the same classic experience

[Swish]

Surely its gotta be teal ;)

[Coridan]

The problem with Teams is that whichever high-end guild gives in to cross-teaming first, automatically wins.

I remember back on TZ, it went from the intended four Racial Teams, to Good (Elves, Humans & Shorts) v. Evil because the Dark Team alone had such a high population. Then, after Pandemonium, x-teaming became the only viable strategy.

I remember there were some long-term holdouts into Velious, like Human Retribution, but eventually those guilds fizzled out because it just wasn't a viable gameplay strategy.

Server would have to be hard coded both offensively and defensively. No healing or buffing players on another Team, or you end up with OOR healers ruining every PVP encounter

That's why I liked SZ more, although it still came down to Neutral vs Evil with good only holding Faydark and Everfrost really.