Riot praying for raid ban

[tyrant49333]

Knowing its own suspension is forthcoming due to getting caught dispelling slows off of a FRAG Zlandi, on top of losing every major mob last cycle, riot is trying to get the big 3 raid banned to prevent it's full collapse. Interesting strategy, let's see how it pays off for them Cotton

[Francois]

I too am praying for a Riot raid ban so dudes will have time to level alts with me in ToFS instead of hanging out in ToV.

ToV is just the absolute worst now.

[magnetaress]

So are people leveling alts to infiltrate enemy guilds and break teh rules to get the competition raid banned?

This is some epic level insnaity if so

tryred

we can farm thaumaturgists robe together! <3

[Mblake81]

^

Next step after having members in all guild Discords under the guise of competition.

[Twochain]

I too am praying for a Riot raid ban so dudes will have time to level alts with me in ToFS instead of hanging out in ToV.

ToV is just the absolute worst now.

! you're leveling alts in ToFS?

I love that zone. The second floor is probably the hardest mob level to difficulty ratio in the game lmfao. At least anything outside of raiding. I wanna come =(

[regandna]

God, that second floor is a mofo! The spawn rate of the key mob combined with the close placement of the tough mobs is a fun cluster!

[magnetaress]

ya 2cnd floor is scary, i wanted to skip floors to 3rd or 4th but i need gear to do that

[kjs86z]

35 bard lfg tofs

[Fammaden]

You have entered Tower of Frozen Shadow.

Franswa says out of character, 'AG/F officer PST'

[feniin]

Detoxx has been slain by The Avatar of War!

[kjs86z]

concede the next 2 enraged shadow beast or else we're getting CSR involved

[Hideousclaw]

I too am praying for a Riot raid ban so dudes will have time to level alts with me in ToFS instead of hanging out in ToV.

ToV is just the absolute worst now.

TOFS is forever underutilized. The ZEM isn’t great as it’s Velious, but it’s such a great zone. Progress floor by floor, dungeon crawl style. It’s awesome

[magnetaress]

Chasing ZEMs is like chasing Klandicars.

[Danth]

TOFS is forever underutilized. The ZEM isn’t great as it’s Velious, but it’s such a great zone. Progress floor by floor, dungeon crawl style. It’s awesome

True story: I have had random people ask me for corpse summons out of Tower of Frozen Shadow more often than all other zones combined. Place can be somewhat unpleasant for the unwary.

Danth

[Twochain]

TOFS is forever underutilized. The ZEM isn’t great as it’s Velious, but it’s such a great zone. Progress floor by floor, dungeon crawl style. It’s awesome

The 6th floor is actually pretty awesome exp if you're soloing. Basically unlimited non caster mobs. The traps suck tho. I think i did like... 48-50 there? It's been a while.


Holy fuck does dying in tofs suck though

[Nexii]

Hoping both sides get a long ban, more time to play red while everyone cries and suffers

[Fammaden]

Hoping both sides get a long ban, more time to play red while everyone cries and suffers

You really just want an excuse to write another episode of erotic raid ban fic with the GM's.

[Toryas]

Knowing its own suspension is forthcoming due to getting caught dispelling slows off of a FRAG Zlandi, on top of losing every major mob last cycle, riot is trying to get the big 3 raid banned to prevent it's full collapse. Interesting strategy, let's see how it pays off for them Cotton

Sorry you got out of bed to lose AoW.

[greasemonk]

You really just want an excuse to write another episode of erotic raid ban fic with the GM's.

Yes please.

[tyrant49333]

Hoping both sides get a long ban, more time to play red while everyone cries and suffers

Sorry you picked the wrong guild when you came back :(

[magnetaress]

WHy can't nexxi just switch guilds anyone should take her she's p cool

[Twochain]

Sorry you picked the wrong guild when you came back :(

:( yeah nexii come back to us bby u did us dirty WE WAS FAMILY

[Psyborg]

Sorry you got out of bed to lose AoW.

Sorry you got out of bed holding up Vulak blockers only to lose Vulak.

[Toryas]

Sorry you got out of bed holding up Vulak blockers only to lose Vulak.

I didn't, I spent Christmas with my family. Sorry you didn't.

[Psyborg]

I didn't, I spent Christmas with my family. Sorry you didn't.

What wasn't on Christmas, and I absolutely did spend all of Christmas with my family.

[Twochain]

I didn't, I spent Christmas with my family. Sorry you didn't.

Honestly, an hour of two of gaming is one of my most fond Christmas traditions. For my whole life really. Didn't have time to play this year sadly. But Christmas is an awesome day for gaming. Everyone's always cheerful.

[Toryas]

Honestly, an hour of two of gaming is one of my most fond Christmas traditions. For my whole life really. Didn't have time to play this year sadly. But Christmas is an awesome day for gaming. Everyone's always cheerful.

Hey bud, if a standoff in ToV listening to nerds heavy breathe on Discord for 2 hours on Christmas day is your thing then I'm happy for ya.

[Twochain]

Hey bud, if a standoff in ToV listening to nerds heavy breathe on Discord for 2 hours on Christmas day is your thing then I'm happy for ya.

Nah the standoffs are kind of why my RA% is 2

Unrootem Mr. Rogean i'm so sorry and i know u put in all that work to root them... but please. I don't want to see this same shit happen to green. It was so fun and unique before. Now we all stand around like it's ec tunnel. :) love u either way though

[kjs86z]

Nah the standoffs are kind of why my RA% is 2

pras livin that low RA life

https://i.imgur.com/jk3ZZVR.jpg

[Jimjam]

TOFS is forever underutilized. The ZEM isn’t great as it’s Velious, but it’s such a great zone. Progress floor by floor, dungeon crawl style. It’s awesome

I spent months in there on Jimjam, eventually walked out with a couple of skinning knives. Was even a bit of xp, even in 50s.

[lookitsjb]

Now we all stand around like it's ec tunnel. :) love u either way though

WTS NToV Train Set. Comes complete with PST Officer OOC messages and passive aggressive undertones. 50kpp - Trades Accepted

[Confit]

Sorry you got out of bed to lose AoW.

Fake news. I also used the bathroom on top of losing AoW. And got a glass of water.

[regandna]

Dumb question, but the UN part of this forum is only for guild leaders, right?

[Nexii]

:( yeah nexii come back to us bby u did us dirty WE WAS FAMILY

Going up against Jestuh plus being AG pop roll plus no DKP transfer from AM didn't seem promising

[Nexii]

pras livin that low RA life

https://i.imgur.com/jk3ZZVR.jpg

Grats on being an overall net negative asset to Riot via anti-LGBT rhetoric warding potential recruits away

It's okay though I understand where such emotions (usually) come from and forgive it

[Psyborg]

Going up against Jestuh plus being AG pop roll plus no DKP transfer from AM didn't seem promising

Being in it for the pixels is so 4 years ago.

[Nexii]

pras livin that low RA life

https://i.imgur.com/jk3ZZVR.jpg

Being in it for the pixels is so 4 years ago.

Not according to Kabull :)

[Heebs13]

Nah the standoffs are kind of why my RA% is 2

Unrootem Mr. Rogean i'm so sorry and i know u put in all that work to root them... but please. I don't want to see this same shit happen to green. It was so fun and unique before. Now we all stand around like it's ec tunnel. :) love u either way though

The problem with unrooted dragons is that the monks are STAR PLAYERS and everyone else sits at the TOV entrance with their dicks in their hands. Dragons are conveyor belted to entrance and the zone is cleared in 45 minutes with no trash killed. It's a lot easier and it's free pixels, but it's not how the game was meant to be played and while I'm sure it's a lot of fun for the pull teams, it's lame for the other 12 classes in EQ. Rooted dragons forces players to crawl TOV, which was the way the dungeon was meant to be played. It's not the devs' fault the players turned it into leapfrog stalemates.

It doesn't matter though because the larger problem is that no matter what meta the GMs adopt, the raid scene in P99 is always going to be a nightmare. When winning is more important than fun, which to the end-game raid guilds, it is, your raid scene is going to be a toxic mess. P99's raid scene is what happens when a bunch of grown men try to live out their e-sports fantasies in a 20 year old elf sim with refs that are never on the field. There's a reason literally every sport in existence has refs watching and ruling on every play in real time.

I'm not trying to bash staff here, but frankly they're creating more work for themselves by being reactive instead of proactive. It's like instead of washing their dishes after every meal like normal people, they opt to let the dirty dishes fill their entire kitchen and then fight the swarm of cockroaches every day. If it was me, I would disable all automatic respawn of raid mobs, and every Saturday at 3pm my GM team would log onto discord, pop a couple beers, and hit the earthquake button. Then we'd have at least 1 GM in every zone with 400% move speed, no aggro, and no clip mode on watching every raid and issuing penalties in real time. AG, that's a train on Eashen, you're DQed from Eashen for the rest of the day and you get a 15 minute timeout at the zoneline. Better luck next time. The players wouldn't have to deal with boring-ass tracking, parking buffed toons throughout the week, all that stupid crap, and the GMs would only have to deal with the raiders' crap for 3-4 hours a week. It would be win-win for everyone.

But I'm sure some of you would complain because it's "not classic" or some stupid crap like that. I don't care.

[lookitsjb]

The problem with unrooted dragons is that the monks are STAR PLAYERS and everyone else sits at the TOV entrance with their dicks in their hands. Dragons are conveyor belted to entrance and the zone is cleared in 45 minutes with no trash killed. It's a lot easier and it's free pixels, but it's not how the game was meant to be played and while I'm sure it's a lot of fun for the pull teams, it's lame for the other 12 classes in EQ. Rooted dragons forces players to crawl TOV, which was the way the dungeon was meant to be played. It's not the devs' fault the players turned it into leapfrog stalemates.

It doesn't matter though because the larger problem is that no matter what meta the GMs adopt, the raid scene in P99 is always going to be a nightmare. When winning is more important than fun, which to the end-game raid guilds, it is, your raid scene is going to be a toxic mess. P99's raid scene is what happens when a bunch of grown men try to live out their e-sports fantasies in a 20 year old elf sim with refs that are never on the field. There's a reason literally every sport in existence has refs watching and ruling on every play in real time.

I'm not trying to bash staff here, but frankly they're creating more work for themselves by being reactive instead of proactive. It's like instead of washing their dishes after every meal like normal people, they opt to let the dirty dishes fill their entire kitchen and then fight the swarm of cockroaches every day. If it was me, I would disable all automatic respawn of raid mobs, and every Saturday at 3pm my GM team would log onto discord, pop a couple beers, and hit the earthquake button. Then we'd have at least 1 GM in every zone with 400% move speed, no aggro, and no clip mode on watching every raid and issuing penalties in real time. AG, that's a train on Eashen, you're DQed from Eashen for the rest of the day and you get a 15 minute timeout at the zoneline. Better luck next time. The players wouldn't have to deal with boring-ass tracking, parking buffed toons throughout the week, all that stupid crap, and the GMs would only have to deal with the raiders' crap for 3-4 hours a week. It would be win-win for everyone.

But I'm sure some of you would complain because it's "not classic" or some stupid crap like that. I don't care.

Holy shit, Heebs?! How ya been buddy. Haven't seen you in ages!

[Heebs13]

Holy shit, Heebs?! How ya been buddy. Haven't seen you in ages!

Not bad. Played WoW classic with a few RL friends for a couple months when it first came out, got a new job, had a daughter, got kind of bored over Christmas break and decided to check the p99 forums. How are you?

[Fammaden]

Every spawn a quake for blue. Can leave spread out spawn times for green like the old days and call it blue custom content. Not a perfect solution but one of the simplest to implement and execute. Doesn't have to be at the same time every week even, could have variance on the quake time. Still doesn't really help the Vulak problem too much, that's another can of worms.

[Heebs13]

Every spawn a quake for blue. Can leave spread out spawn times for green like the old days and call it blue custom content. Not a perfect solution but one of the simplest to implement and execute. Doesn't have to be at the same time every week even, could have variance on the quake time. Still doesn't really help the Vulak problem too much, that's another can of worms.

Doing it during normal daylight hours on the weekend when the GMs are all awake and available means the GMs can all be around to referee. That's the one huge advantage I see of just doing it every Saturday at 3pm, for example. That and the players can schedule their time around it instead of going through the constant raid preparedness that is the current meta.

[lookitsjb]

Doing it during normal daylight hours on the weekend when the GMs are all awake and available means the GMs can all be around to referee. That's the one huge advantage I see of just doing it every Saturday at 3pm, for example. That and the players can schedule their time around it instead of going through the constant raid preparedness that is the current meta.

Go full custom content mode. Hear me out:

GMs already have discord integration with their EQ server, allowing them to see what GMs summon what items (from the old Braknar/Sirken posts with the Manastone nonsense). So...

Everything spawns invulnerable.
The P99 server posts a message like "Eashen of the Sky raid in 2 hours. Sign up below" where people sign up with an emoji reaction.
Bot messages you so you can register your character's Name/Class/Level
Bot then randomly generates new guilds, equally divvys up the signed-up members across those guilds, and creates the separate voice channels for those guilds
At raid time, everyone joins their teams raid voice channel in P99 and competition begins that way.
"DKP" bidding can then be handled by implementing the in-game Chronos nonsense built into Titanium Client and handed out via the bot as well. The winning guild gets chronos (DKP) for their character, and they can then use that to DKP auction buy the drops in discord.

Sounds extreme right? It's a modern solution that allows everyone to raid regardless of guild tag.

Or... and this one is crazier than the above suggestion... People just act like adults, understand mistakes happen, and own those mistakes. Understand that if someone on your team messes up, you (as a whole) are responsible. It doesn't take a set of "raid rules" to know what you should and shouldn't do in a competition setting. Common sense isn't null and void because there's a list of ambiguously defined, rarely enforced, rules written in 3 different spots of a forum, all containing conflicting information.

[Heebs13]

Go full custom content mode. Hear me out:

GMs already have discord integration with their EQ server, allowing them to see what GMs summon what items (from the old Braknar/Sirken posts with the Manastone nonsense). So...

Everything spawns invulnerable.
The P99 server posts a message like "Eashen of the Sky raid in 2 hours. Sign up below" where people sign up with an emoji reaction.
Bot messages you so you can register your character's Name/Class/Level
Bot then randomly generates new guilds, equally divvys up the signed-up members across those guilds, and creates the separate voice channels for those guilds
At raid time, everyone joins their teams raid voice channel in P99 and competition begins that way.
"DKP" bidding can then be handled by implementing the in-game Chronos nonsense built into Titanium Client and handed out via the bot as well. The winning guild gets chronos (DKP) for their character, and they can then use that to DKP auction buy the drops in discord.

Sounds extreme right? It's a modern solution that allows everyone to raid regardless of guild tag.

Or... and this one is crazier than the above suggestion... People just act like adults, understand mistakes happen, and own those mistakes. Understand that if someone on your team messes up, you (as a whole) are responsible. It doesn't take a set of "raid rules" to know what you should and shouldn't do in a competition setting. Common sense isn't null and void because there's a list of ambiguously defined, rarely enforced, rules written in 3 different spots of a forum, all containing conflicting information.

Any solution that relies on "expect people to be better people" is doomed to failure.

[lookitsjb]

Any solution that relies on "expect people to be better people" is doomed to failure.

Yea I'm leaning more towards the discord raid as well. At least that has a chance at working lol

[Gustoo]

Makes sense for GM to pop mobs when they log on and can watch. Semi classic, since spawn timers shouldn't be 100% on lock, and servers used to go down unexpectedly and have full repop pandemonium.

Obviously dragons are never going to get unrooted that seems like a fully classic inspired fix to p99 players breaking these dungeons.

[adichi]

this kind of bs would never happen on green, just saying ;)

scribe this under beta blue problems

[Viscere]

Bann Arcler

[lookitsjb]

Bann Arcler

I'm curious, in your mind what rule did he break and or reasoning do you have that would warrant that?

[Tunabros]

this kind of bs would never happen on green, just saying ;)

scribe this under beta blue problems

just wait until the server enters velious

[Fammaden]

Go full custom content mode. Hear me out:

...

Sounds extreme right? It's a modern solution that allows everyone to raid regardless of guild tag.

This is far too much overhead, coding, and organization to realistically expect to happen. Plus the "cOmPeTiTiOn" crowd would lose their shit, and keep in mind Rog is on record saying he wants a competitive raid scene.

Quaking every respawn spreads out the opportunities for mobs, reduces GM workloads, eases but doesn't eliminate the toe-to-toe guild conflict, and encourages a more classic feel in the raid scene by encouraging a bit more actual mobilization and target prioritization rather than simply logging in your parks one target at a time.

As someone else mentioned, there were very frequent server resets, much more than we get quakes. If the idea with quakes is to simulate server downtime then ideally we should be quaking every Tuesday at 1PM eastern or some shit. I recall the devs out in Calilfornia bringing servers down for maintenance on weekday mornings. If there was downtime on weekends or primetime it was emergency server issues.

Obviously a Saturday/Sunday or even Friday night schedule would make more sense for our raid meta, but it would still approximate classic raiding better than armies of 60's and bots socking sixteen hour windows all week long.

[magnetaress]

Thread started out fun but devolved into big serious walls of txt.

[Francois]

Thread started out fun but devolved into big serious walls of txt.

For sure. Everyone in this thread talking about non-ToFS business needs to chill.

No one is going to remember who killed Vulak in a particular month. It's like crying about raid shit is more fun than actually playing the game with their friends.

They need to relax and explore the best dungeon that P99 has to offer.

Back on topic. I managed to drag a corpse down from 3rd floor to 1st yesterday. I also managed to swarm the 2nd floor for PLing.

3rd floor is super chill for soloers. Most of the mobs are kind enough to hang out in their own rooms for easy solo pulls. 6th floor too actually.

[Fammaden]

No one is going to remember who killed Vulak in a particular month.

Except when we hear about "Vulak mem blur" like every single day.

[Viscere]

Bann Arcler

[Francois]

Except when we hear about "Vulak mem blur" like every single day.

Start putting shitty people on ignore. It will make you so much happier.

[lookitsjb]

This is far too much overhead, coding, and organization to realistically expect to happen. Plus the "cOmPeTiTiOn" crowd would lose their shit, and keep in mind Rog is on record saying he wants a competitive raid scene.

Quaking every respawn spreads out the opportunities for mobs, reduces GM workloads, eases but doesn't eliminate the toe-to-toe guild conflict, and encourages a more classic feel in the raid scene by encouraging a bit more actual mobilization and target prioritization rather than simply logging in your parks one target at a time.

As someone else mentioned, there were very frequent server resets, much more than we get quakes. If the idea with quakes is to simulate server downtime then ideally we should be quaking every Tuesday at 1PM eastern or some shit. I recall the devs out in Calilfornia bringing servers down for maintenance on weekday mornings. If there was downtime on weekends or primetime it was emergency server issues.

Obviously a Saturday/Sunday or even Friday night schedule would make more sense for our raid meta, but it would still approximate classic raiding better than armies of 60's and bots socking sixteen hour windows all week long.

Not an attack but I think you missed the subtle joke there in my long-winded, over complicated solution... the final part of my statement was simply along the lines of, "stop being shitty, and we wont need to do all this custom nonsense" - That requires 0 coding, and minimal effort. Heebs answered it immediately though; anything requiring people to not be turds is doomed for failure.

[kjs86z]

Grats on being an overall net negative asset to Riot via anti-LGBT rhetoric warding potential recruits away

It's okay though I understand where such emotions (usually) come from and forgive it

lmao

[Mblake81]

Grats on being an overall net negative asset to Riot via anti-LGBT rhetoric warding potential recruits away

It's okay though I understand where such emotions (usually) come from and forgive it

I will remove the tag from my characters the next time I log on.

[Viscere]

you are guild removing yourself from <criot> cause you want to continue being homophobic ?

[Mblake81]

you are guild removing yourself from <criot> cause you want to continue being homophobic ?

Close to your heart?

[feniin]

you are guild removing yourself from <criot> cause you want to continue being homophobic ?

You are/were guilded with a literal nazi and that doesn't bother you :o

[KansasComrade]

I'm not trying to bash staff here, but frankly they're creating more work for themselves by being reactive instead of proactive.

This is at the heart of it all. Had we had clear rules about tracker fte not locking you out of other targets, Riot wouldn't have been pissed off about Lord K. Had we had clear speed limits laid out for ST, FRAG wouldn't have been upset about Riot using scale. Every time Detoxx pulls a screencap of a GM ruling from 3 years ago, I lose faith in the system because everyone should have all the same information laid out clearly.

[kaizersoze]

You are/were guilded with a literal nazi and that doesn't bother you :o

[Heebs13]

This is at the heart of it all. Had we had clear rules about tracker fte not locking you out of other targets, Riot wouldn't have been pissed off about Lord K. Had we had clear speed limits laid out for ST, FRAG wouldn't have been upset about Riot using scale. Every time Detoxx pulls a screencap of a GM ruling from 3 years ago, I lose faith in the system because everyone should have all the same information laid out clearly.

Agreed, it's not helpful that the rules are spread out between 3 or 4 different threads and previous rulings set precedent but aren't easily searchable. The point I was trying to make was more that the GMs expect players to police themselves (via said vague rules) and submit petitions, which leaves the GMs having to spend their time playing "he said, she said" and rooting through logs and 5 different video recordings of a single event days or even weeks after the fact. It introduces a larger chance of them getting it wrong and it creates more work for them in the long run. They'd be much better off if they just actively refereed every contested raid target proactively, and the only way they could feasibly do that is if they quaked every week at a time of their choosing so they could make sure they're available for it.

GMs taking an afternoon to put all the raid rules in one spot would be a nice-to-have but as long as raiders are expected to police themselves, you're going to have a toxic raid environment. P99 has been lawyerquest since its inception a decade ago, through multiple raid rulesets. It's pretty clear that's the inevitable outcome of the self-policing system.

[Twochain]

You are/were guilded with a literal nazi and that doesn't bother you :o

Are you talking about fuckin Sinix?

Sinix was never in Freedom. Sinix was in Aftermath. Sinix also is not that guy that people think he is. Can't think of his name at the moment.

Sinix played a good shaman. He didn't cause any problems while he was in Aftermath. Maybe he said some crazy shit in the past, but he doesn't even play this game anymore. Nor was he a problem starter when he did play with us. /shrug

[Twochain]

Agreed, it's not helpful that the rules are spread out between 3 or 4 different threads and previous rulings set precedent but aren't easily searchable. The point I was trying to make was more that the GMs expect players to police themselves (via said vague rules) and submit petitions, which leaves the GMs having to spend their time playing "he said, she said" and rooting through logs and 5 different video recordings of a single event days or even weeks after the fact. It introduces a larger chance of them getting it wrong and it creates more work for them in the long run. They'd be much better off if they just actively refereed every contested raid target proactively, and the only way they could feasibly do that is if they quaked every week at a time of their choosing so they could make sure they're available for it.

GMs taking an afternoon to put all the raid rules in one spot would be a nice-to-have but as long as raiders are expected to police themselves, you're going to have a toxic raid environment. P99 has been lawyerquest since its inception a decade ago, through multiple raid rulesets. It's pretty clear that's the inevitable outcome of the self-policing system.

I completely agree that the rules are hard to follow because of how many different rulings there have been over the years, and the accessibility finding them in the first place.


But maybe the mf's who spend 10 hours making grand powerpoint presentations about an encounter that happened in 10 seconds took that energy and put it in to... idk.... say putting the raid rulings on the wiki........

[Heebs13]

I completely agree that the rules are hard to follow because of how many different rulings there have been over the years, and the accessibility finding them in the first place.


But maybe the mf's who spend 10 hours making grand powerpoint presentations about an encounter that happened in 10 seconds took that energy and put it in to... idk.... say putting the raid rulings on the wiki........

A raid rules wiki page would probably be a good idea, and every rule needs to be backed up with either a link to a GM post or a screenshot of a GM ruling in game. Pulling out some random rule that isn't on the wiki during or after an encounter wouldn't be valid. A rule with no source wouldn't be valid.

Of course, you'd have to get the three major guilds (and probably the GMs) to agree to what I just said, and good fucking luck with that.

[Naethyn]

I started this.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mxwHeyxIwaYHvdPclP4q8iL5EDTeoMPr0FrWak-ZmGo/edit?usp=sharing

[Molitoth]

I completely agree that the rules are hard to follow because of how many different rulings there have been over the years, and the accessibility finding them in the first place.


But maybe the mf's who spend 10 hours making grand powerpoint presentations about an encounter that happened in 10 seconds took that energy and put it in to... idk.... say putting the raid rulings on the wiki........

Sirken already did this.... (and it's still available).
Some things could easily be edited.

All we have to do is get the current GM's to give a shit about enforcement.
Good luck.

[Kolby]

Imagine farming Velious mobs for 6 years. Imagine still not having Vulak loot. Imagine caring about any of this.

[matticas]

I too am praying for a Riot raid ban so dudes will have time to level alts with me in ToFS instead of hanging out in ToV.

ToV is just the absolute worst now.

Ever seen Crystallized Shadow chest or legs? I've cleared that zone so many times and never seen either drop. Wondering if they're in game?

[imperiouskitten]

imagine even hitting lvl 60 after witnessing the crowding in ur 50s

[imperiouskitten]

imagine closing teal lol ......

[Viscere]

Wait so a pedo and a bigot are in Riot (with evidences in this thread) and you guys wanna deflect about someone that used to play, a long time ago, in a guild now disbanded ?

Lol k

[Twochain]

Ever seen Crystallized Shadow chest or legs? I've cleared that zone so many times and never seen either drop. Wondering if they're in game?

You talking about this? https://wiki.project1999.com/Crystallized_Shadow_Tunic

because i had one rot once

i wonder why i didn't loot it i was on my monk..

[matticas]

You talking about this? https://wiki.project1999.com/Crystallized_Shadow_Tunic

because i had one rot once

i wonder why i didn't loot it i was on my monk..

Yes! DMing you. It's Velious plate graphic wearable by Iksar monk. Very unique look.

[Croco]

A raid rules wiki page would probably be a good idea, and every rule needs to be backed up with either a link to a GM post or a screenshot of a GM ruling in game. Pulling out some random rule that isn't on the wiki during or after an encounter wouldn't be valid. A rule with no source wouldn't be valid.

Of course, you'd have to get the three major guilds (and probably the GMs) to agree to what I just said, and good fucking luck with that.

By 3 major guilds do you mean riot, ag, and kittens? Because freedom hasn't killed shit on their own without ag. The fact that you can have all but 1 guild in the UN agree to something and it doesn't mean shit because the 1 guild that loves to fuck with everyone else unless they get exactly what they want can come in and say nah fuck you all is a big reason rules and player agreements are so jacked and hard to implement. Make it a server rule that an agreement/rule is official when 90% of guilds who can kill X mob agree and the server immediately gets way better. Pick whichever X mob you want. Vindi, ring war, aary, KT, statue... etc.

[Vallaen]

Which members in riot are the pedo and bigot? this thread is lackluster

[Cassawary]

Sinix also is not that guy that people think he is.

finally, closure.

[Heebs13]

By 3 major guilds do you mean riot, ag, and kittens? Because freedom hasn't killed shit on their own without ag. The fact that you can have all but 1 guild in the UN agree to something and it doesn't mean shit because the 1 guild that loves to fuck with everyone else unless they get exactly what they want can come in and say nah fuck you all is a big reason rules and player agreements are so jacked and hard to implement. Make it a server rule that an agreement/rule is official when 90% of guilds who can kill X mob agree and the server immediately gets way better. Pick whichever X mob you want. Vindi, ring war, aary, KT, statue... etc.

Let me rephrase. You'd have to get enough of the major guild leaders to agree that the server staff would be willing to say "okay, this is how it's going to work now and we will enforce it."

Or the GMs could just do what I've been advocating in this thread previously, which is a top-down method of deciding things, since this community has proven time and time again they can't be trusted to handle anything on their own.

[Zoggren]

Grats on being an overall net negative asset to Riot via anti-LGBT rhetoric warding potential recruits away

It's okay though I understand where such emotions (usually) come from and forgive it

This guy doesn't even know what his signature means, he just thought it sounded smart.

[Twochain]

The problem with unrooted dragons is that the monks are STAR PLAYERS and everyone else sits at the TOV entrance with their dicks in their hands. Dragons are conveyor belted to entrance and the zone is cleared in 45 minutes with no trash killed. It's a lot easier and it's free pixels, but it's not how the game was meant to be played and while I'm sure it's a lot of fun for the pull teams, it's lame for the other 12 classes in EQ. Rooted dragons forces players to crawl TOV, which was the way the dungeon was meant to be played. It's not the devs' fault the players turned it into leapfrog stalemates.

It doesn't matter though because the larger problem is that no matter what meta the GMs adopt, the raid scene in P99 is always going to be a nightmare. When winning is more important than fun, which to the end-game raid guilds, it is, your raid scene is going to be a toxic mess. P99's raid scene is what happens when a bunch of grown men try to live out their e-sports fantasies in a 20 year old elf sim with refs that are never on the field. There's a reason literally every sport in existence has refs watching and ruling on every play in real time.

I'm not trying to bash staff here, but frankly they're creating more work for themselves by being reactive instead of proactive. It's like instead of washing their dishes after every meal like normal people, they opt to let the dirty dishes fill their entire kitchen and then fight the swarm of cockroaches every day. If it was me, I would disable all automatic respawn of raid mobs, and every Saturday at 3pm my GM team would log onto discord, pop a couple beers, and hit the earthquake button. Then we'd have at least 1 GM in every zone with 400% move speed, no aggro, and no clip mode on watching every raid and issuing penalties in real time. AG, that's a train on Eashen, you're DQed from Eashen for the rest of the day and you get a 15 minute timeout at the zoneline. Better luck next time. The players wouldn't have to deal with boring-ass tracking, parking buffed toons throughout the week, all that stupid crap, and the GMs would only have to deal with the raiders' crap for 3-4 hours a week. It would be win-win for everyone.

But I'm sure some of you would complain because it's "not classic" or some stupid crap like that. I don't care.

I know this argument and completely disagree with it. (respectfully). Monks were not the best class at pulling to entrance. I'd say mages are. In fact, monks are only critical for tagging out... and even then not really. If I were pulling vulak..... i'd rather be an enchanter, mage, necro, cleric, shaman, druid, bard.. over my monk. The more DA's the better.

And from a classic standpoint, many guilds in era pulled dragons across the zone to kill in different spots.

It's not a loot conveyor belt. I don't give a fuck about the loot. If somebody did nothing but sit at entrance, it was their choice. Which was a fine choice, because not everybody wants to be a playmaker. And that's true even in the current meta. But classes were not pigeonholed.

[Heebs13]

I know this argument and completely disagree with it. (respectfully). Monks were not the best class at pulling to entrance. I'd say mages are. In fact, monks are only critical for tagging out... and even then not really. If I were pulling vulak..... i'd rather be an enchanter, mage, necro, cleric, shaman, druid, bard.. over my monk. The more DA's the better.

And from a classic standpoint, many guilds in era pulled dragons across the zone to kill in different spots.

It's not a loot conveyor belt. I don't give a fuck about the loot. If somebody did nothing but sit at entrance, it was their choice. Which was a fine choice, because not everybody wants to be a playmaker. And that's true even in the current meta. But classes were not pigeonholed.

Anyone with the right gear / clickies / knowledge can do the pulls. It's intimidating to learn them without FD.

Also it doesn't change the fact that regardless of which classes are doing the pull, 90% of your raid is sitting at the entrance waiting for a dragon to be delivered to them. During the era of dragon pulls to entrance, most players never stepped foot past the ToV entrance. That's not how the game was meant to be played, period. That's why as soon as players started figuring out how to do these pulls on live, the devs rooted the dragons to put a stop to it. P99 staff just waited 4 years because reasons.

[Heebs13]

I know this argument and completely disagree with it. (respectfully). Monks were not the best class at pulling to entrance. I'd say mages are. In fact, monks are only critical for tagging out... and even then not really. If I were pulling vulak..... i'd rather be an enchanter, mage, necro, cleric, shaman, druid, bard.. over my monk. The more DA's the better.

And from a classic standpoint, many guilds in era pulled dragons across the zone to kill in different spots.

It's not a loot conveyor belt. I don't give a fuck about the loot. If somebody did nothing but sit at entrance, it was their choice. Which was a fine choice, because not everybody wants to be a playmaker. And that's true even in the current meta. But classes were not pigeonholed.

Forgive the double post. I really didn't want to address you nitpicking the least important part of my OP, but it's just annoying me. We could argue about what class is the 'best' for pulling til we are blue in the face since 'best' is a matter of opinion. But what's entirely objective and demonstrable is 'most common'. Go look at any pull video from the TOV race / pull era and I know what you will see on the starting line - Iksar monks as far as the eye can see. There's a reason for that. Other classes might have been better in theory but in practice there was one class that was far and away the most commonly used for pull teams.

Again though, this is a huge derailing from the 2 main points I was trying to make.

1. Trains to entrance was not the way the game was meant to be played.

2. It doesn't matter what meta you adopt, the p99 raid scene will always be toxic as long as it relies on the self-policing petition system.

[Ennewi]

It's not a loot conveyor belt. I don't give a fuck about the loot.

So then it's Postmates.

If somebody did nothing but sit at entrance, it was their choice. Which was a fine choice, because not everybody wants to be a playmaker. And that's true even in the current meta. But classes were not pigeonholed.

There is such a thing as having too many pullers out. Also, pull teams were generally well established and adding a new member risked interrupting the order/routinization of pulls, giving the opposition an advantage.

Everybody can make plays without aspiring to be "playmakers" when having to react to the unexpected. Those who are wary of taking initiative will see the spam / hear the call from officers to intervene which is easier to do since the pressure's off and shit has already hit the fan. If you fail, no one will fault you for it and if you succeed, everyone will praise you. When camp has to be on the move, anything can happen. But it's next to impossible to contribute anything when the crawl is taken out of the dungeon.

[Mblake81]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TrKMBd5TsI

[imperiouskitten]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TrKMBd5TsI

not very good at taking lines.

[SantagarBrax]

The problem with unrooted dragons is .....

But I'm sure some of you would complain because it's "not classic" or some stupid crap like that. I don't care.

This was spot on.


1. There were lots of petitions going out back then as well, with trains flying everywhere and not being considerate of others. Why would we go backwards? We've done that before.

2. Where can I sign up to be a Real Time Raiding Ref?

[SantagarBrax]

@GM's+

Only 1 GM needs to sit in ToV during a quake and look around for 2-3hrs. Take some notes (Record it), present the problems list up the chain of command, discuss a plan and formulate, provide the guidance back down to the plebes.

/thumbsup

You'd save a ton of man hours if you just got ahead of it all and lay down your laws in accordance with the direction .

[alexdoofaz]

@GM's+

Only 1 GM needs to sit in ToV during a quake and look around for 2-3hrs. Take some notes (Record it), present the problems list up the chain of command, discuss a plan and formulate, provide the guidance back down to the plebes.

/thumbsup

You'd save a ton of man hours if you just got ahead of it all and lay down your laws in accordance with the direction .

That’s a lot of time and effort. We’re lucky they have a presence at all here.

[Vallaen]

The last time i saw a GM it was such a fond memory.

It was during the unrooted dragons and awakened got punted from ToV for training the west exit.

[regandna]

That’s a lot of time and effort. We’re lucky they have a presence at all here.

Tbh it’s a two way street. They’re lucky we keep a presence here too. Without us, they wouldn’t exist, just as we wouldn’t without them. They should probably just add another GM to the roster. I’m sure they have a list of people who would help. Nonetheless, I agree that sitting in ToV to record as a GM is a waist. The players should be able to record their own issue they report. That’s like telling the judge to go find the evidence, submit it, and analyze it, lol !

[Heebs13]

That’s a lot of time and effort. We’re lucky they have a presence at all here.

As opposed to the nonstop petitions they get every single week and the constant babysitting they have to do trying to mediate disputes between the guilds? They've already complained that the raid scene eats up way too much of their time. If they just quaked 1x a week and refereed, handing out decisions on the spot, they'd save themselves time and headaches. None of this lawyerquest bullshit. GM sees you train, GM issues you a DQ. It's that simple. The GMs refereeing the raid scene should be handled the same way a ref in a football game or an ump in a baseball game is. I don't know why P99 was ever turned into a courtroom.

[Loke]

I don't know why P99 was ever turned into a courtroom.

When big Rogean stepped back from anything to do with GMing and Sirken took over, he took a much more active role in raid disputes. Back when Rogean dealt with stuff, rules were limited and simple, and you knew if you brought a dispute to him that wasn't iron clad and waste his time, you were going to have a bad time. Sirken on the other hand seemed to enjoy playing referee and trying to engineer a raid scene using more and more rules. With more rules, came more opportunity to lawyer quest.

I've suggested in numerous posts they should just wipe the increasingly byzantine system of rules currently enforced on the server and start from scratch, but thus far it seems the current server staff has decided to build upon what Sirken left behind. I'm not saying the current GMs enjoy it like Sirken seemed to (although he also protested how much he hated it, despite all evidence to the contrary), but you're not going to solve lawyer questing by perpetuating a system where rules are numerous, complex, and unclear.

Disclaimer: This post is not intended as GM bashing, just my observation of how the server rules have changed throughout the life of the server, leading to our current Judge Judy-esque clown show.

[Fammaden]

As opposed to the nonstop petitions they get every single week and the constant babysitting they have to do trying to mediate disputes between the guilds? They've already complained that the raid scene eats up way too much of their time. If they just quaked 1x a week and refereed, handing out decisions on the spot, they'd save themselves time and headaches. None of this lawyerquest bullshit. GM sees you train, GM issues you a DQ. It's that simple. The GMs refereeing the raid scene should be handled the same way a ref in a football game or an ump in a baseball game is. I don't know why P99 was ever turned into a courtroom.

With this idea the ref GM could also basically have that as his only task. Maybe that GM would choose to help with other stuff all week long, and probably would, but theoretically you could just have a single raid ref GM, or one for each server if they did the quake plan for green also.

[Molitoth]

The problem with unrooted dragons is that the monks are STAR PLAYERS and everyone else sits at the TOV entrance with their dicks in their hands. Dragons are conveyor belted to entrance and the zone is cleared in 45 minutes with no trash killed. It's a lot easier and it's free pixels, but it's not how the game was meant to be played and while I'm sure it's a lot of fun for the pull teams, it's lame for the other 12 classes in EQ. Rooted dragons forces players to crawl TOV, which was the way the dungeon was meant to be played. It's not the devs' fault the players turned it into leapfrog stalemates.

It doesn't matter though because the larger problem is that no matter what meta the GMs adopt, the raid scene in P99 is always going to be a nightmare. When winning is more important than fun, which to the end-game raid guilds, it is, your raid scene is going to be a toxic mess. P99's raid scene is what happens when a bunch of grown men try to live out their e-sports fantasies in a 20 year old elf sim with refs that are never on the field. There's a reason literally every sport in existence has refs watching and ruling on every play in real time.

I'm not trying to bash staff here, but frankly they're creating more work for themselves by being reactive instead of proactive. It's like instead of washing their dishes after every meal like normal people, they opt to let the dirty dishes fill their entire kitchen and then fight the swarm of cockroaches every day. If it was me, I would disable all automatic respawn of raid mobs, and every Saturday at 3pm my GM team would log onto discord, pop a couple beers, and hit the earthquake button. Then we'd have at least 1 GM in every zone with 400% move speed, no aggro, and no clip mode on watching every raid and issuing penalties in real time. AG, that's a train on Eashen, you're DQed from Eashen for the rest of the day and you get a 15 minute timeout at the zoneline. Better luck next time. The players wouldn't have to deal with boring-ass tracking, parking buffed toons throughout the week, all that stupid crap, and the GMs would only have to deal with the raiders' crap for 3-4 hours a week. It would be win-win for everyone.

But I'm sure some of you would complain because it's "not classic" or some stupid crap like that. I don't care.

A+ Post, would read again. This here is a smart man.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/8c/8f/18/8c8f18bec7ba6a1b7ddc2ef76664e9ae.gif

[Twochain]

I think unrooted with a very low number of rules would be the most fair, and the most fun raid environment. No coths on spawn. Get the dragon to aary ramp with your FTE and it's yours. NO rules passed North Door.

Train em, mem blur them, fuck with their pulls. That would be pretty fun. And no petitions. Just a MF thunderdome

[Nirgon]

Beta ended a long time ago guys

[Molitoth]

I've suggested in numerous posts they should just wipe the increasingly byzantine system of rules currently enforced on the server and start from scratch, but thus far it seems the current server staff has decided to build upon what Sirken left behind.

Wait, what? I don't think that is true. If it was, we wouldn't be lawyerquesting and hoping for consequence every cycle.

Sirkens rules are getting blatantly ignored without punishment. Hell, even Rogeans rules.

IE: Mem blurring Vulak and Skipping PoG clear by kiting everything and burning down Tunare.

[Twochain]

Wait, what? I don't think that is true. If it was, we wouldn't be lawyerquesting and hoping for consequence every cycle.

Sirkens rules are getting blatantly ignored without punishment. Hell, even Rogeans rules.

IE: Mem blurring Vulak and Skipping PoG clear by kiting everything and burning down Tunare.

I don't know all the facts about "mem blurring vulak" but from what I heard it didn't sound nefarious in any way shape or form.

Also from what I remember, the Tunare ruling was based on a strat we figured out in AM that had to do with agro. Thats not the current strat.

[kaizersoze]

Tbh it’s a two way street. They’re lucky we keep a presence here too. Without us, they wouldn’t exist, just as we wouldn’t without them. They should probably just add another GM to the roster. I’m sure they have a list of people who would help. Nonetheless, I agree that sitting in ToV to record as a GM is a waist. The players should be able to record their own issue they report. That’s like telling the judge to go find the evidence, submit it, and analyze it, lol !

"Without us they wouldn't exist"

What an entitled way to think of people volunteering their time to resolve our issues.

[alexdoofaz]

"Without us they wouldn't exist"

What an entitled way to think of people volunteering their time to resolve our issues.

Looks like we found the person who says, as their face is getting slammed into the pavement or brick wall, “I PAY YOUR SALARY WITH MY TAX DOLLARS!!”

[Nexii]

I don't know all the facts about "mem blurring vulak" but from what I heard it didn't sound nefarious in any way shape or form.

Also from what I remember, the Tunare ruling was based on a strat we figured out in AM that had to do with agro. Thats not the current strat.

AM was warned after doing the same strategy. You're thinking of the first kill. Though the way Rogean worded the warning, it's hard to say...

[SantagarBrax]

That’s a lot of time and effort. We’re lucky they have a presence at all here.

It's not a lot of time and effort in the grand scheme of things. A few hours or Endless fucking petitions because people are doing whatever the hell they want ignoring all the rules..

It's a no brainer.

[tyrant49333]

AM was warned after doing the same strategy. You're thinking of the first kill. Though the way Rogean worded the warning, it's hard to say...

Nexii how is getting curb stomped with a bunch of PC cry babies going? You ready to come home?

[Nexii]

Nexii how is getting curb stomped with a bunch of PC cry babies going? You ready to come home?

It's crybabies or those that don't believe in elfquest law. Tough pickings

Maybe when the AM > AG > AM 2.0 > AM 3.0... > AM 7.0 (Freedom) pixel transfer package becomes a thing

[lookitsjb]

Nexii how is getting curb stomped with a bunch of PC cry babies going? You ready to come home?

Which home does she have to go to?
Daddy Guard who gets the kills, or the sad offspring that has 0 solo raid kills and originally split from Daddy's balls to form Reedumb but still calls daddy to help take down the bad monsters?

... Asking for a friend ...

[Heebs13]

Which home does she have to go to?
Daddy Guard who gets the kills, or the sad offspring that has 0 solo raid kills and originally split from Daddy's balls to form Reedumb but still calls daddy to help take down the bad monsters?

... Asking for a friend ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOZuxwVk7TU

[lookitsjb]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOZuxwVk7TU

Does Britney play? Probably explains why everyone thinks she's being held captive.. #FreeBritney

[greasemonk]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOZuxwVk7TU

Not sure why you invoked Queen Spears' name to quote something that was not the OP's, but hey, you enjoy that specific circle of HELL!

You mother fucking need Jesus.

[Heebs13]

Not sure why you invoked Queen Spears' name to quote something that was not the OP's, but hey, you enjoy that specific circle of HELL!

You mother fucking need Jesus.

Which circle of hell is reserved for me?

[greasemonk]

Blasphemous Brittney Users, obviously.

[Heebs13]

Blasphemous Brittney Users, obviously.

Was just pointing to a particularly toxic post. Though most posts in this thread qualify, but that one was just... **chef's kiss**

[lookitsjb]

Was just pointing to a particularly toxic post. Though most posts in this thread qualify, but that one was just... **chef's kiss**

Thank you, I'll be here all week **bows**

[greasemonk]

Was just pointing to a particularly toxic post. Though most posts in this thread qualify, but that one was just... **chef's kiss**

Oh I'm sorry, the start of this thread wasn't inherently toxic? My bad.

Guess you need Jesus more than I thought.

[kjs86z]

hit me baby one more time

https://i.imgur.com/WjjSGQB.jpg

[Nirgon]

Alright time to pack it up and play green with the big boys

[Heebs13]

Oh I'm sorry, the start of this thread wasn't inherently toxic? My bad.

Guess you need Jesus more than I thought.

It is only a game. Why you have to be mad?