What is each classes role / responsibilities in a raid?

[Vanessa]

I know that generally speaking, Knights tank, Melee and Casters DPS, and Priests Heal/Buff. But I was wondering specifically, what are some of the responsibilities and jobs of each class in a raid?

For example, I know Rogues do a lot of DPS... but don't they also do some things with Hide and Sneak? Or Wizards, they mostly nuke... but they have stun spells too, right?

I was hoping some of you raiding veterans could explain a little more specifically to me about each class and what they're expected to do in raids?

Thanks!

[Vdaria]

One big class of responsibilities is pulling. A good chunk of the raid and perhaps most of the mental effort of a raid is spent pulling, whether clearing trash or setting up to kill a boss. Monks, Bards, Rangers, Druids, and sometimes Shadow Knights and Necromancers (feign death) are pullers, but mostly it's the first two that do the heavy lifting.

There are several ways to pull but the main two are kite and pick out of the kite, or (harmony and) split. Bards are huge for the first kind of pull - at least one bard will run around gathering mobs, and pullers will get mobs out of that kite and bring them to the raid. For the second kind of pull, you have monks doing their usual feign death and javelin tactics to try to split mobs apart to pull in single. If it's an outdoor zone like Plane of Hate, you can use druids and rangers to harmony the mobs (prevent them from adding when you pull).

[Soothsayer]

After Kunark (just around the corner) and especially Velious, knights will largely be replaced in raid scenarios by warriors, who dramatically outperform them in the tank role thanks to their absurdly powerful post-50 disciplines. As a bonus, warriors also tend to do a lot more damage, which just helps everyone all around.

Knights are in a good spot now and tank pretty much all classic content just fine, but I'd tend to argue that they're sort of a dead end class if you want to do serious raiding going into the expansions. They're still fabulous for group content and decent for offtanking, though.

[cd288]

To be clear they aren’t a dead end class from the perspective of no one wanting them on the raid. There’s no raid size cap so hey another guy whacking the mob with a sword doesn’t hurt. But if you want to be playing a major role than yeah you won’t be on a pally or SK from Kunark on.

Similar issues exist with other classes. Like Druid for example. You’re just a buff bot and technically a backup healer but you can’t really do much as a healer compared to a Cleric. Mage you just summon mod rods because your nukes aren’t gonna stick. Bards you play songs. Etc. Raiding is a pretty boring job for a lot of classes TBH.

[RecondoJoe]

Wait, SKs don't pull for raids in Kunark+? Someone told me that Monks kind of fall off after SK's get the Circlet of Shadows.

[Trexller]

Wait, SKs don't pull for raids in Kunark+? Someone told me that Monks kind of fall off after SK's get the Circlet of Shadows.

will the CoS FD glitch work on green? it got nerfed on blue

[azeth]

A raid is comprised of a couple phases where classes are utilized differently throughout.

Getting FTE - Here bards for their speed, rangers for their track, rogues for their sneak and monks for their FD are used.

Pulling the mob to camp - Bards again for their speed and their ability to AE aggro adds, monks of course

Establishing aggro - Warrior clearly, knights, rangers can do a few things to help here like usage of their weaponshield discipline to make a little speed bump til CH chain is rolling

Fighting the mob - Suddenly the usage of the bard, ranger, monk, and rogue are much different. Rogue primarily will focus on not dying and DPSing - however may perform mid-fight corpse runs with hide/sneak. Rangers again may serve as speed bumps.

Most classes serve niche rolls in niche instances. Its not an all-in-one play style.

[Furitor]

After Kunark (just around the corner) and especially Velious, knights will largely be replaced in raid scenarios by warriors, who dramatically outperform them in the tank role thanks to their absurdly powerful post-50 disciplines. As a bonus, warriors also tend to do a lot more damage, which just helps everyone all around.

Knights are in a good spot now and tank pretty much all classic content just fine, but I'd tend to argue that they're sort of a dead end class if you want to do serious raiding going into the expansions. They're still fabulous for group content and decent for offtanking, though.

For bosses yeah, still want some Knights do some trash tanking and be efficient at it (faster kill of trash == faster to get to boss). Offtanking in crazy situations is underappreciated IMO. Multiple knights won't be super needed but they still bring an OK amount to the table.

Just have multiple characters to swap. If you want to do any serious raiding you need more than one character anyway.

[Furitor]

will the CoS FD glitch work on green? it got nerfed on blue

Pretty sure CoS FD glitch is based off CoS item itself (and the pre-nerf one stays in game). So this wasn't a mechanic change but an item change. New CoS after the nerf won't work.

[7thGate]

I'm not really sure warrior = only raid tank is that accurate anymore. After the clicky aggro nerfs, there's stuff where you really want the snap aggro more than you care about the durability because flipping the dragon into the mana sieving enchanters or DPS. I'm not really convinced you always want warriors over paladins, especially for Gore but also possibly not for VS or Trak.

Like, 25% misses from evasion is good against the 1500 damage lifetap bosses, but so is flat 18 seconds of immunity to lifetap + unbeatable snap aggro. I dunno, doesn't seem that clear cut to me. Guess we'll see what the meta looks like when it drops though.

[Trexller]

Pretty sure CoS FD glitch is based off CoS item itself (and the pre-nerf one stays in game). So this wasn't a mechanic change but an item change. New CoS after the nerf won't work.

like you said The Circlet of Shadow (insta-cast) is not nerfed, but replaced by the item drop Circlet of ShadowS (with a cast time. The Pre-nerf CoS no longer prevents you from re-agroing when you stand from FD

It may have been when all FD gets nerfed (no longer instantly clears agro) i dont recall exactly.

It was such that with the instant cast CoS, one could click it within a fraction of a second after standing from FD and remain without agro.

I recall being able to pull better than monks on my SK. Instant splits, no effort. So was it a mechanic change?

[Furitor]

I'm not really sure warrior = only raid tank is that accurate anymore. After the clicky aggro nerfs, there's stuff where you really want the snap aggro more than you care about the durability because flipping the dragon into the mana sieving enchanters or DPS. I'm not really convinced you always want warriors over paladins, especially for Gore but also possibly not for VS or Trak.

Like, 25% misses from evasion is good against the 1500 damage lifetap bosses, but so is flat 18 seconds of immunity to lifetap + unbeatable snap aggro. I dunno, doesn't seem that clear cut to me. Guess we'll see what the meta looks like when it drops though.


Yeah -- metas change all the time. I think people can be too stuck on the old ways. Not saying it's not efficient, but there are Knights tanking Sky bosses at level 50 on Green just fine right now with a proper CH rotation. Before Sky dropped everyone was saying "time for warriors to shine"... for no real reason even thought discs aren't even out... the snap aggro esp. with the DPS required to down bosses at lower levels really helps here. Better to put some of your warriors on DPS w/ their DPS weapon in some cases as their DPS is very underrated IMO.

A game I like to always refer back to is Super Smash Bros. Melee. The game has been out forever and the meta is still changing. New mechanics/meta characters are being found every few years. For a long time some of the characters thought to be garbage suddenly became meta (with ZERO patches).

Anyway a bit off topic but every class has a role through all the expansions for raiding. IMO just don't corner yourself in and have more than one raid character if you want to seriously raid.

[Keebz]

IMO just don't corner yourself in and have more than one raid character if you want to seriously raid.

Also, make sure you make your mains on different accounts, or else you're gonna be stuck playing your Cleric / Ench / Bard, or whatever the most needed class at the time is.

[Furitor]

Also, make sure you make your mains on different accounts, or else you're gonna be stuck playing your Cleric / Ench / Bard, or whatever the most needed class at the time is.

This. Times 100.

[Blingy]

So I play a mage; been a mage main since late 2000. Good pet that can offtank or dps depending on pet. My nukes are pretty good; coming in at over 800 points of damage every 10 seconds including cool-down.

My first two mini-raids consisted of 3 groups or thereabouts. Assist was called so send in pet, wait a few seconds then start blasting. Lots of fun IMO.

Went to plane of fear with 8 groups or so. I was told to be a vending machine. Make sure all the pets had swords then start summoning mana sticks. Make a stick, drop it on the ground, make another stick, drop it, on and on and on. Watch the sticks poof but am told to continue making them. Boring as hell. Part time vending machine is fine; fudge full time though.

[Coridan]

Also, make sure you make your mains on different accounts, or else you're gonna be stuck playing your Cleric / Ench / Bard, or whatever the most needed class at the time is.

This sounds like a major pain in the ass if you have an IP exemption for playing with your partner. Aren't IP exemptions login account specific not full account specific?

[NPC]

You mean paladins?

Really you need a couple max level alts if your looking to raid, you can still main any class, but should keep either chanter, cleric or warrior(ogre) alts.
Only the best decked BIS warriors are considered for raid MA, an that's who has the most fun. Other than that, any other tank class can MA for the alt groups.

Raid responsibilities-
Chanter - Mez, slow, tash, Buff
Cleric - Complete Heal, Buff
Warrior - Tank

Everyone else is off tank, buff, heal or DPS, that's it. The main raid group does most the work an everyone else is waiting and assisting. So it can get really boring if you're not the main raid group(s), and those are usually reserved for BIS characters an specific classes depending on the raid. Pullers can vary, ranger, bard, monk, SK, but with Mezz an solid competent groups, that doesn't really matter as much either.
The entire strategy for 99% of all raids = CH chains and Ogre warriors that can hold agro makes the world go round. Chanters/shaman slow an haste.
Which is why you want an alt of with chanter, cleric, or warrior, they are the only essential classes.

[Phatez]

Monk = train the raid
Necro = train the raid
Mage = Make mod rods, and send pet in
Enchanter = Maintain high dps pets, buff
Shaman = slow, buff
Ranger = take DT
Paladin/SK = snap agro, can quickly agro mobs onto them
warrior = tank mobs that hit frikkin hard
wizard = kite shit, port people around
rogue = reroll mage
cleric = heal
druid = heal, kite
bard = train the other guilds raid

[Vaarsuvius]

So I play a mage; been a mage main since late 2000. Good pet that can offtank or dps depending on pet. My nukes are pretty good; coming in at over 800 points of damage every 10 seconds including cool-down.

My first two mini-raids consisted of 3 groups or thereabouts. Assist was called so send in pet, wait a few seconds then start blasting. Lots of fun IMO.

Went to plane of fear with 8 groups or so. I was told to be a vending machine. Make sure all the pets had swords then start summoning mana sticks. Make a stick, drop it on the ground, make another stick, drop it, on and on and on. Watch the sticks poof but am told to continue making them. Boring as hell. Part time vending machine is fine; fudge full time though.

Fret not ! You will soon be able to CotH during raids too :)

[turbosilk]

I know that generally speaking, Knights tank, Melee and Casters DPS, and Priests Heal/Buff. But I was wondering specifically, what are some of the responsibilities and jobs of each class in a raid?

For example, I know Rogues do a lot of DPS... but don't they also do some things with Hide and Sneak? Or Wizards, they mostly nuke... but they have stun spells too, right?

I was hoping some of you raiding veterans could explain a little more specifically to me about each class and what they're expected to do in raids?

Thanks!

Rogues aren't real dps yet. That's casters, esp mages.

[turbosilk]

To be clear they aren’t a dead end class from the perspective of no one wanting them on the raid. There’s no raid size cap so hey another guy whacking the mob with a sword doesn’t hurt. But if you want to be playing a major role than yeah you won’t be on a pally or SK from Kunark on.

Similar issues exist with other classes. Like Druid for example. You’re just a buff bot and technically a backup healer but you can’t really do much as a healer compared to a Cleric. Mage you just summon mod rods because your nukes aren’t gonna stick. Bards you play songs. Etc. Raiding is a pretty boring job for a lot of classes TBH.

They are a dead class in that their value is nearly worthless. All they end up doing in Kunark and esp Velious is taking gear that should be going to the classes actually contributing real value in raids.

[hannahgrams]

"real value" --------- "elf simulator"

pick one

[kaev]

Do what you're told, listen on comms, do what you're told, stay in camp, do what you're told, stand on incoming, do what you're told, don't spam the dkp bid channel, do what you're told, send tells for buffs, do what you're told, wait for assist, do what you're told...

[Blingy]

Rogues aren't real dps yet. That's casters, esp mages.

Better not tell my raid leader.....according to them I'm a vending machine.

[cd288]

They are a dead class in that their value is nearly worthless. All they end up doing in Kunark and esp Velious is taking gear that should be going to the classes actually contributing real value in raids.

Actually I don’t think that will fully be the case on Green. I think you’re forgetting all the clicky nerfs

[peterpal]

Also, make sure you make your mains on different accounts, or else you're gonna be stuck playing your Cleric / Ench / Bard, or whatever the most needed class at the time is.

I've heard this a few times but I don't understand the point yet. What's the point of multiple accounts if multiboxing is not allowed?

[cd288]

I've heard this a few times but I don't understand the point yet. What's the point of multiple accounts if multiboxing is not allowed?

You play the character you want to on one of your accounts and a guildy logs into your other one to play the other character during the raid

[Jibartik]

Necro's job: Pissing off raid leader :o

[Jibartik]

Enchanters job: collect DKP while they google solo challenge videos.

[Jibartik]

Warriors job: send tells to enchanter about how they never get to be main tank.

[Jibartik]

Wizard and druids job: ...

"shutup and port me to my next camp."

[Jibartik]

Rogues: stand around not saying anything and then logging off without saying bye immediately after target is killed.

[Jibartik]

First Character Dwarf cleric: speak in broken English and be very impatient.

[Jibartik]

Red99 any class: try to make it seem like all the characters at the raid are not actually you.

[Jibartik]

Shaman: "press hotkey: /rt sorry dont have PE"

(hehe sorry that's blue)

[peterpal]

You play the character you want to on one of your accounts and a guildy logs into your other one to play the other character during the raid

Oh account sharing is allowed?

[Zipity]

Not sure why a warrior would tank any classic or Kunark content,
Knight is superior in everything desired.

[alkalinesky]

Monk = train the raid
Necro = train the raid
Mage = Make mod rods, and send pet in
Enchanter = Maintain high dps pets, buff
Shaman = slow, buff
Ranger = take DT
Paladin/SK = snap agro, can quickly agro mobs onto them
warrior = tank mobs that hit frikkin hard
wizard = kite shit, port people around
rogue = reroll mage
cleric = heal
druid = heal, kite
bard = train the other guilds raid

#accurateaf

[Phatez]

Not sure why a warrior would tank any classic or Kunark content,
Knight is superior in everything desired.

Warrior has a discipline in kunark called evasive that reduces their chance at getting hit by a significant amount. There are some bosses where this is extremely useful!

[cd288]

Warrior has a discipline in kunark called evasive that reduces their chance at getting hit by a significant amount. There are some bosses where this is extremely useful!

Yeah once Warrior get disciplines they are Uber tanks

[greenspectre]

As a shammy, my job tends to be answering buff requests, Malo/Slow on mobs, and Malo'ing any charm breaks, and usually a spot heal on the pet's owner :)

[Ransurian]

Warrior has a discipline in kunark called evasive that reduces their chance at getting hit by a significant amount. There are some bosses where this is extremely useful!

Lol. Doesn't matter if warriors are literally invincible. If they can't hold aggro, they're as useless as a cleric without healing spells. Due to devastating aggro nerfs to clicky items, warriors will struggle for relevance in Kunark and will only really start to shine in Velious.

Never really been able to wrap my mind around some of early EQ's class design choices. Warriors should have gotten Provoke back when the game released in '99. It was years before SOE decided that maybe the main tank class should get a unique ability that... you know... helps him to actually tank? Lmao!!!

[Vivitron]

Enchanters job: collect DKP while they google solo challenge videos.

Lol! My closely related question: is charm viable in Kunark raids?

[Tunabros]

dps: do damage
Tank: take damage
Healer: take away the damage
everyone else: do stuff idk i never raided

[NPC]

Not sure why a warrior would tank any classic or Kunark content,
Knight is superior in everything desired.

By Kunark, top geared Ogre Warriors have 1-2k+ more hps than any other class. Plus free disciplines that mitigate damage better than any other class.

[NPC]

Lol. Doesn't matter if warriors are literally invincible. If they can't hold aggro, they're as useless as a cleric without healing spells. Due to devastating aggro nerfs to clicky items, warriors will struggle for relevance in Kunark and will only really start to shine in Velious.

Never really been able to wrap my mind around some of early EQ's class design choices. Warriors should have gotten Provoke back when the game released in '99. It was years before SOE decided that maybe the main tank class should get a unique ability that... you know... helps him to actually tank? Lmao!!!

New low delay kunark weapons let warriors keep agro pretty easily, Lamentation, jade mace, blood point, tons of weapons, some pretty easy to acquire compared to yaks.
Design? The Devs just buffed the classes they played, that was the 'design'. Anybody could have balanced the game, they were interested in balance.