Different maps/zonesworld in current line EQ1

[pivo]

Anyone remembers, what was the main reason for zones/maps/world redo as it is now in live EQ1? I can't believe the difference. How much bigger this old world is. And more content. More soul. Was there (I bet) plenty of players upset when it happened?

Once you start playing this old/classic world, you can't go to any other EQ version. Well at least I can't. I'm so glad for this project to be alive.

[pivo]

Sorry for title typo, should be: "Different maps/zones/world in current live EQ1"

Can't edit or delete this post or I would redo it.

[Snortles Chortles]

https://i.imgur.com/c3fcN5H.png

[pivo]

https://i.imgur.com/c3fcN5H.png

LOL! (and has nothing to do with maps/zones/world change) ;)

[mcoy]

My first impression of the new "Freeport" caused me to immediately log out.

-Mcoy

[Phaezed-Reality]

it's part of the reason why we play here, and not on live... they ruined the game in more ways than just zones/maps.

[Izmael]

Didn't they redo commons / fp because they lost the source files for these zones?

A shame they didn't use github or something..
don't think anything existed back then other than setting up your own cvs repos and backup systems

[Mblake81]

I can't believe the difference. How much bigger this old world is. And more content. More soul. Was there (I bet) plenty of players upset when it happened?

It was a computer game that didn't need to take multiplatform into considerations. I can't speak if people were upset, I had already left when they introduced the Moon and Cats.

[Elijah850]

The updated zones are nice in one way, but when I first logged in TLP and realized there was no more Oasis, E/W commons, revamped Steamfont... It was pretty crappy. They claim they cant run the un-revamped zones on the TLPs since they share something inseperable from normal live servers. I say WTF to that. TLP Krono wars is all that keeps Day-Break Games from the Reaper.

[magnetaress]

LOL! (and has nothing to do with maps/zones/world change) ;)

It has plenty to do with you though.

There's plenty of large open world detailed content out there. More so than EQ classic. But EQ has plenty of cool handcrafted stuff and a more freeform FPS targeted level design. No one was afraid to get a players corpse lost in a high lvl maze.

Not sure there's anything quite like it. Definitely not for mmos.

[cd288]

Didn't they redo commons / fp because they lost the source files for these zones?

A shame they didn't use github or something..
don't think anything existed back then other than setting up your own cvs repos and backup systems

I think it was just a matter of advancing technology making it possible to have much bigger zones and therefore you didn’t need two zones for the common lands or three zones for the desert. I actually don’t mind the combining of the zones since it’s nicer to see a bunch of people in the zone than like 5 people in NRo for example. I thought the Freeport redesign was shitty though.

[Kohedron]

I pick my nose and pat myself on the back at the thought of how much time they wasted on new FP, Commons, Nektulos, etc, knowing POK exists

[pivo]

Thank you all, I understand now better, why they decided to do it.

[BlackBellamy]

Thank you all, I understand now better, why they decided to do it.

The primary reason they did that was inertia, which is how 75% of software development is done. No one demanded this, it was simply time to iterate and well we need to do something and this is something therefore this needs to be done.

Every time your favorite platform or software comes up with stuff no one asked for, that's why. Project manager with a schedule to fill.

[pivo]

Every time your favorite platform or software comes up with stuff no one asked for, that's why. Project manager with a schedule to fill.

Yes, so true, but you would expect normal things that usually happens, like balancing classes, better UI, better graphic, new content, new quests... things like this, but not completely re-doing maps that were already created. That's what shocked me. Well, there were (also) technical reasons for it, I understand now.

[greenspectre]

https://i.imgur.com/c3fcN5H.png

I have no idea where you found this image but you are my goddamn hero, man. Please copy on every RnF post until the end of time.

[Swish]

My first impression of the new "Freeport" caused me to immediately log out.

-Mcoy

I saw one of the TLPs being streamed when they first opened and the dude made his character in Freeport. I would have logged out too. Fuck that.

[Tethler]

I really felt like the revamped zones were super similar to EQ2 environments. I wonder if they had any team crossover around that time...

[magnetaress]

They didn't have half the love they original zones had in them. The new freeport is really awful. It's like 3 steps backwards. Like they recieved too many complaints about people on pvp servers exploiting it so they got rid of any ability to jump over any ledges. Or levitate anywhere interesting.

Most probably because they didn't want anyone to get high enough up to see how awful the entire zone was with an overview. I imagine if I was a level builder, I would have been incredibly shameful launching freeport 2.0. If the designer reads this, I am sorry for the harsh criticism, you have my sympathy, there's a few details that were nice.

The original steaming piles of shit probably violated the ESRB rating system.

[Dolalin]

The original zones had a much better and more consistent art style, with a generally lighter and more colorful palette. It 'felt' like high fantasy.

The new art style that began with the Luclin game engine felt like sci-fi. Total immersion breaker.

New character models suffered the same problems. Bad and stilted animations, didn't feel very 'fantasy', generally just plain aesthetically bad. Had none of the character and humour of the original models which was part of the fun of them.

[Dolalin]

EQ2 and WoW came out at more or less the exact same time. Desire being technically better quality, the WoW engine and art style felt more immersive. EQ2 didn't feel immersive at all.

[Dolalin]

All the above to say: aesthetics create immersion. Abandoning them in pursuit of mere technical improvement, ie throwing more polygons around as SoE did was a really terrible idea and hurt both EQ and EQ2 immeasurably. I have no idea why it's not talked about more.

[magnetaress]

Because it's about selling tech to an industry at that point. WoW won by hiring artists that knew you could create steaming piles of dog shit even if you just increased the polygons, so they opted for the more lighthearted far reaching feature complete, it even worked pretty good under wine design.

I agree with the above comments. The way to make a game immersive isn't through the engine, but the art itself, and if the artists are bad, or payed shills from the industry there to sell you pixel shader 3.0... well. That's a problem. I don't think wow relyed heavily on any of the newer stuff, and if they did implement pixel shaders it was much mroe sublte.

[magnetaress]

You can blame the Unreal Engine 2.0 for the advent of static meshes really taking over level design, and any level geomatry which is basically a static mesh should go straight to hell. They are designed to be decorations, but both EQ2 and later Skyrim, and some oblivion to an extent just went with 'lets make a segment of a dungeon and rotate it'. Which was a direct result of this. Because the engines were not optomized for indoor spaces and geometry.

[magnetaress]

None of the major engines are designed the way the earlier quake1-2 or EQ engines were. So you aren't likely to see a move away from this 'tubular' mesh design of rotated segments, as it's very quick to churn out a loot tube vs bug test and develop or server host pathing nodes and line of sight for a 'Sola' type dungeon.

Remember 'bigger is better' complexity and individuality or uniqueness is not cool or OK

[magnetaress]

Wow tries to compromise here, and they do a fair job of almost being OK, but it kills replayability, which has lead to the cycle of 'sub for 3 months of an expansion' then quit until the next rolls around. They have come the closest to being succesfull with mass market tech and production values. But they are still shit. :( Unfortunately the story is lost in the noise and 10th disco floor cut and paste into "The Motherlode".

[magnetaress]

Once you've seen one seaweed patch or volcanic lava field, you've seen em all.

[magnetaress]

Unity is terrible for this, that said some game devs try to work around it as best they can and create a little charm, but it's unfortunate that that is the 'entry level' engine on the market.

[magnetaress]

*wrist*