Clickie Changes Invalidate some Server First Achievements

[Baler]

With the recent clickie changes some of which add cast time to clickies. Some of the accomplishments achieved such as server firsts are invalid due to this changing the goal line for future achievements.

So before you reply with mad face hear me out. Whether clickies were or were not used in server first achievements does not change the fact that the finish line for these achievements has just been pushed back.

I hope some level headed people can understand the dangerous precedent that occures when these major changes happen mid server progress. It affects the entire future of how players will go about completing server firsts or it can even make it impossible for some due to the changes.

If the finish line keeps getting moved mid progression how can any accomplishment be validated.

This is NOT a rants and flames thread.

[Cen]

I am a little confused about this because the server firsts don't compete with each other across servers or across specific achievements?

Like, how does the fact that innoruuk goes down longer then cazic thule make a difference? etc

[Baler]

I am a little confused about this because the server firsts don't compete with each other across servers or across specific achievements?

Like, how does the fact that innoruuk goes down longer then cazic thule make a difference? etc
Neither of those are what I'm trying to address. re-read the OP
I'm not comparing different servers or different targets.

However I can see how you got that misinterpretation when you only read the first sentence of the OP
To more directly answer you with an example, green server first vox is incomparable to a green server first vox post clickie change.

I know some people will struggle to wrap their heads around what I'm saying here. And the childish replies will come eventually..
But there is legitimacy to what im saying.

---
How can an achievement be valid when the finish line is being moved.
If it was moved by say classic mechanics than that is acceptable. But for staff to decide that the finish line is now further away is invalidating people's achievements.

The clickie change should have happened at green launch. They knew players used these items. Changing it mid progress invalidates the efforts of both the winners and 'losers' of achievements.
To find a middle ground, If they didn't do it at launch. It would have been better if it happened right before kunark rather than Mid-Classic progression.

No i'm not crying about the specific's of the clickie change, rather the effects it plays on the server and how achievements are now invalid due to the decision.

[Cen]

Neither of those are what I'm trying to address. re-read the OP
I'm not comparing different servers or different targets.

However I can see how you got that misinterpretation when you only read the first sentence of the OP
To more directly answer you with an example, green server first vox is incomparable to a green server first vox post clickie change.

I know some people will struggle to wrap their heads around what I'm saying here. And the childish replies will come eventually..
But there is legitimacy to what im saying.

---
How can an achievement be valid when the finish line is being moved.

No man I still don't actually get it. Rephrase or something, I think my brain is fried today. How do you get first if the first already happened?

Ive never been on a raid in any online game so maybe there is terminology I don't get. I assumed it was the yellow text achievement thing

[Baler]

No man I still don't actually get it. Rephrase or something, I think my brain is fried today. How do you get first if the first already happened?

Ive never been on a raid in any online game so maybe there is terminology I don't get. I assumed it was the yellow text achievement thing

Let's say you're playing a game with a really strong character build. You do all the content and get awarded the title of finishing all content first. Then the staff say oh that build is too strong so they nerf it. Now your build can't do all that content. You'd of never been able to complete all that content with that build. Your title of finishing all content first is invalid.

The staff decided to change the finish line for that title. It wasn't a part of the pre-planned game design. The finish line getting moved forwards or backwards affects the significance of that title. In this case it's invalidating the achievement.

note: I'm speaking of a hypothetical staff not the p99 staff in this post

edit: I can understand how some may say 'Oh well it's already happened can't change history'. And people on my side of the topic will say it's changed the ease/difficult of that achievement enough to warrant that the legitimacy of it's completion in the past is invalid.

[Cen]

Gotcha. Actually, I think you've made me realize that the perception of achievements are a little different between folks. I was viewing them as a race to a first goal, not a content difficulty type achievement.

There's actually some real life examples I know of that are legit races like triathlons and ironmen races and OCR type events where in the next years the actual events are significantly harder, but you get the same awards. Now to be fair, in the next years awards, your in competition only with people from that year, but medals and trophies aren't taken away when it gets harder. Likewise, since a different green server will happen in the future, the goals will be different then, since they will probably can those wands right out of the gate.

I mean i'm not worried about it but if you were shooting for something coming out soon with the wands, I guess it makes sense to feel unfair about it.

[Tethler]

I mean, sure the firsts would certainly have occurred at different times without the use of clickies. But also, who cares? Achievements on an old ass emulator don't mean anything.

[ChooChoo Train]

Server first raid kills were just bind rushed I thought? Clickies would have zero effect on the outcome. Wands which could effect leveling speed probably weren’t farmed til after server first 50s. Maybe clickies effected a couple of server first items from camp mobs on solo/group content? You just seem upset you didn’t get enough server firsts and want to claim more via convincing people of your skewed logic. Hate and Solro soon that’s where you’ll get that yellow text fix.

[Baler]

You just seem upset you didn’t get enough server firsts and want to claim more via convincing people of your skewed logic.

Our first troll post, I didn't get any server firsts. I didn't want any and didn't try to get any. Not even a good attempt at discrediting my post.

[drdrakes]

Our first troll post, I didn't get any server firsts. I didn't want any and didn't try to get any. Not even a good attempt at discrediting my post.

You were the first person on my ignore list =)

[Natewest1987]

You were the first person on my ignore list =)

LOL

[Guesty07]

I'm trying my damned hardest to look at this with an open mind but for the life of me I cant come to any other conclusion that "who gives a fuck?".

[douglas1999]

I mean, sure the firsts would certainly have occurred at different times without the use of clickies. But also, who cares? Achievements on an old ass emulator don't mean anything.

Achievements in a new-ass game don't mean anything either

[Swish]

Server firsts mainly matter to those who achieved them (nice for them, sure), to everyone else they're a footnote.

[bluntfang]

I'm trying my damned hardest to look at this with an open mind but for the life of me I cant come to any other conclusion that "who gives a fuck?".

[Taiku]

HUH? So you're saying because of the changes to clickies (or other changes in the future) changed the difficulty of server first achievements, those achievements are now invalid? Wasn't everyone on the same patch, with the same opportunities, at the same time?

Do you mean for the NEXT server? Do you mean that achievements which utilized the clickable items to get should be removed from people who earned them? I'm just a little confused at what this is aimed at, clearly you're unhappy with the changes and now it seems like you're pulling at loose threads to try to get people riled up against the patch(and the staff?)

Unless I'm reading this and your previous posts completely wrong, in which case I retract my questions and agree with you, burn it down. #wipeitclean2̶0̶1̶9̶ 2020

[BlackBellamy]

Wasn't everyone on the same patch, with the same opportunities, at the same time?

On Blue, they killed Kunark Guy using 2641 of Item. When Kunark Guy arrives on Green, he will have to be killed the regular way, with a ranger swarm.

[Vizax_Xaziv]

Move this to RnF pls

[Mblake81]

Achievements in a new-ass game don't mean anything either

Depends on the size of your Funko Pop collection.

[loramin]

Server firsts mainly matter to those who achieved them (nice for them, sure), to everyone else they're a footnote.

[Geomance22]

literally no one remembers or cares about green first and that was like two months ago, file it under no one gives a fuck

[turbosilk]

Great point but won't change the only server first that mattered. Server first manastone crew.

[Arvan]

Who cares?

[Lordgordon]

You are so right Baler A+ thread

[Swish]

Wipe green and start again.

[Castle2.0]

I can't hand over the title for #1 DPS character on Green during Vanilla... But don't worry, it will reset with the next server.

[deadlycupcakez]

wait, did OP watch the server first vox?

[Bardp1999]

This is a really weird thing to get all wrapped up about Baler - seek mental help ASAP

[deadleaf]

oh, so i guess i was part of server first on vox, naggy, and CT post clickie nerf then. gratz to venerate, BL, and kingdom ;)

((and yes... who really cares? it doesn't give you anything right? no title... no special loot... no one remembers any more besides you? so who cares))

[charmcitysking]

Can’t un-ring a bell

[douglas1999]

Just popping in to remind you this game is 20 years old and therefor bad to care about. If it were a new-and-cool game, caring about it would be very important. Get your priorities sorted, you feeble animals.

[Bigsham]

New games are crappy and boring and require 0 thought or skill thats why we still playing EQ

[Bigsham]

oh, so i guess i was part of server first on vox, naggy, and CT post clickie nerf then. gratz to venerate, BL, and kingdom ;)

((and yes... who really cares? it doesn't give you anything right? no title... no special loot... no one remembers any more besides you? so who cares))

im sure those 32k hp bosses were hard with 100+ 30 something stay at home sons spamming buttons soon as they pop

[StinkyGreenBud]

I'm trying my damned hardest to look at this with an open mind but for the life of me I cant come to any other conclusion that "who gives a fuck?".

^^^^

[bubur]

i guess my server first level 2 on alfredo was invalidated by the quest nerf that happened like less than a half hour into the game

but uh, don't tell anyone