Fake EC tunnel prices

[Kron]

So I wanted to take it easy and play my hand at this whole EC tunnel trading.

I figured I take my 2k plat and see what I can do with it over a few days by finding deals and flipping items.

Well lately I've notice that some people will spam for example a Polished Steel Dirk that is roughly valued in the 800-1200 range, but the spam it for 10p or 20p and if you PM them they never reply just keep spaming the item/price.

Is this some type of tactic to force the market down? The other thing I could think of was the tracking sites like say Wiki been hit with these prices and confusing people what the value is.

Maybe since I'm new to playing the market there's something I don't know and out of the loop when it comes to price manipulation in the game.

[Fammaden]

The prices on the wiki are simply from chat logs submitted by players, so it only shows what the items' asking prices are, what people actually pay for them is another matter entirely.

So its possible that people are trying to skew the prices on the wiki this way. I'm not much of a tunnel rat so more detailed reasons and tactics could be in play I guess.

[loramin]

It's worth noting that wiki god Ravhin recently added a way to correct auction logs in the wiki. If you see an item that has clearly false entries in the wiki, PM me and I'll try to fix them.

I've already fixed the Polished Steel Dirk, but the changes aren't showing up in the wiki. I'm guessing Ravhin caches them every night, so check back tomorrow and I'm guessing it will be fixed then.

Hopefully once people learn about this, and that such fake entries don't work, they'll stop wasting everyone's time and give the practice up (I have better things to do in life than clean up some asshole's fake auctions).

[derpcake2]

So I wanted to take it easy and play my hand at this whole EC tunnel trading.

I figured I take my 2k plat and see what I can do with it over a few days by finding deals and flipping items.

Well lately I've notice that some people will spam for example a Polished Steel Dirk that is roughly valued in the 800-1200 range, but the spam it for 10p or 20p and if you PM them they never reply just keep spaming the item/price.

Is this some type of tactic to force the market down? The other thing I could think of was the tracking sites like say Wiki been hit with these prices and confusing people what the value is.

Maybe since I'm new to playing the market there's something I don't know and out of the loop when it comes to price manipulation in the game.

Its a very basic way to try and make people auction items under their value.

It is far beter to OOC in zone 1: WTS SMR 15k, while having your friend OOC in another zone: "WTT Djarns ring + GEBS for SMR", sell the SMR over its value, and have your friend with the fictional deal log off.

Greed is the best thing to exploit when it comes to tunnelcats.

[loramin]

Its a very basic way to try and make people auction items under their value.

It is far beter to OOC in zone 1: WTS SMR 15k, while having your friend OOC in another zone: "WTT Djarns ring + GEBS for SMR", sell the SMR over its value, and have your friend with the fictional deal log off.

Greed is the best thing to exploit when it comes to tunnelcats.

The "tunnel cats" are all well aware of these practices, and set their prices according to what makes them plat, not what's in the wiki. It's naive non-tunnel people who don't know better, and get suckered into selling things below cost or buying them above.

But again ... there's a new sheriff in town:

https://i.imgur.com/RmanwSd.gif

Going forward the wiki is not going to be a place where people can upload fake entries (or rather they can, but when someone notices they'll get deleted). And if they keep doing it anyway and wasting my time, I will start naming and shaming, and maybe even talk to Ravhin about adding a way to block the troublemakers from the system entirely :)

[Swish]

people are trying to skew the prices on the wiki

Sounds like we need to make some more rules to combat these lowlifes.

[cd288]

The "tunnel cats" are all well aware of these practices, and set their prices according to what makes them plat, not what's in the wiki. It's naive non-tunnel people who don't know better, and get suckered into selling things below cost or buying them above.

But again ... there's a new sheriff in town:

https://i.imgur.com/RmanwSd.gif

Going forward the wiki is not going to be a place where people can upload fake entries (or rather they can, but when someone notices they'll get deleted). And if they keep doing it anyway and wasting my time, I will start naming and shaming, and maybe even talk to Ravhin about adding a way to block the troublemakers from the system entirely :)

How do you prove what a fake entry is? Sure if someone is saying WTS at 10pp for an item that's worth several hundred, that's obvious.

But I've seen people legitimately sell items for 40 - 60% of their listed wiki value. Are significant decreases like that just going to get deleted from the log because you think they're fake? If so, that defeats the point of the log.

[Cen]

The line between fake and a good deal is a blurry one, that's for true. Anyway, someone please trade me a ghoulbane for my 150pp+Langseax of the wolves and 2x langsesx combo :p on teal

:D

[TripSin]

The "tunnel cats" are all well aware of these practices, and set their prices according to what makes them plat, not what's in the wiki. It's naive non-tunnel people who don't know better, and get suckered into selling things below cost or buying them above.

But again ... there's a new sheriff in town:

https://i.imgur.com/RmanwSd.gif

Going forward the wiki is not going to be a place where people can upload fake entries (or rather they can, but when someone notices they'll get deleted). And if they keep doing it anyway and wasting my time, I will start naming and shaming, and maybe even talk to Ravhin about adding a way to block the troublemakers from the system entirely :)

The "naive non-tunnel people" aren't obsessed over a fake currency in a fake video game, though. So who's really winning here? The greedy people obsessing over money in an emulator of a 21-year-old video game or the reasonable people who have more important things to care about?

[cd288]

The "naive non-tunnel people" aren't obsessed over a fake currency in a fake video game, though. So who's really winning here? The greedy people obsessing over money in an emulator of a 21-year-old video game or the reasonable people who have more important things to care about?

Yeah at the end of the day all this technically does is help the greedy tunnel questers control the market

[Evets]

Hey if they want to play the eq merchant role who are we to call them greedy ect?

I for one get an item dungeon crawling and head to EC and try to sell the spoils as fast as possible to get to the next adventure.. if a tunnel rat wants to buy an item for 500 plat less than its worth and re sell it for a profit I'll take them up on that just to get out of there asap. My time is worth more than wasting another hour to try to get the full price...

[Kron]

Hey if they want to play the eq merchant role who are we to call them greedy ect?

I for one get an item dungeon crawling and head to EC and try to sell the spoils as fast as possible to get to the next adventure.. if a tunnel rat wants to buy an item for 500 plat less than its worth and re sell it for a profit I'll take them up on that just to get out of there asap. My time is worth more than wasting another hour to try to get the full price...

Quick sellers is what makes the EC Tunnels work but that's not the issue. The issue is people spam say an executioner's axe for 50p over an over but don't actually intend to sell it just causing static with fake prices.

You see it in other direction as well where you might see someone post say a Rubi BP for 30K+ over an over and it becomes the new norm. Seen even manastones at 100k to try an establish a price when there is few other sellers to base it off.

[cd288]

Hey if they want to play the eq merchant role who are we to call them greedy ect?

I for one get an item dungeon crawling and head to EC and try to sell the spoils as fast as possible to get to the next adventure.. if a tunnel rat wants to buy an item for 500 plat less than its worth and re sell it for a profit I'll take them up on that just to get out of there asap. My time is worth more than wasting another hour to try to get the full price...

I didn't say I judged them for it. But that doesn't mean they aren't still greedy

[cd288]

Quick sellers is what makes the EC Tunnels work but that's not the issue. The issue is people spam say an executioner's axe for 50p over an over but don't actually intend to sell it just causing static with fake prices.

You see it in other direction as well where you might see someone post say a Rubi BP for 30K+ over an over and it becomes the new norm. Seen even manastones at 100k to try an establish a price when there is few other sellers to base it off.

True. Although in the latter case I'd say a lot of those people are less trying to manipulate auction logs and more just think they can find a whale to pay a huge price for legacy pixels (because they will find one eventually)

[Kron]

It's worth noting that wiki god Ravhin recently added a way to correct auction logs in the wiki. If you see an item that has clearly false entries in the wiki, PM me and I'll try to fix them.

I've already fixed the Polished Steel Dirk, but the changes aren't showing up in the wiki. I'm guessing Ravhin caches them every night, so check back tomorrow and I'm guessing it will be fixed then.

Hopefully once people learn about this, and that such fake entries don't work, they'll stop wasting everyone's time and give the practice up (I have better things to do in life than clean up some asshole's fake auctions).

Looks like some of the lvl 49 words are also been targeted for spaming.

Words of Grappling is getting spam for 49p over an over.

[loramin]

Yeah at the end of the day all this technically does is help the greedy tunnel questers control the market

I really think you're misunderstanding the system. The wiki provides common knowledge to everyone. "Tunnel fat cats" do not benefit from that ... unless they can somehow manipulate those prices. Otherwise, public knowledge = bad for "fat cats".

Remember, these people know items and prices better than anyone else, because they see them sold every day. They don't need the wiki to tell them what a good price is: they already know how much they can get. The entire way they make their money is by exploiting the difference in pricing knowledge between them and the public.

It's everyone else who benefits from public pricing knowledge. A "fat cat" might know that they can get 2k for some item, and they will do so ... right up until it becomes public knowledge that most people sell that item for 1.5k, at which point they have to match. It's the non-tunnel person who benefits in that case, not the "fat cat".

How do you prove what a fake entry is? Sure if someone is saying WTS at 10pp for an item that's worth several hundred, that's obvious.

But I've seen people legitimately sell items for 40 - 60% of their listed wiki value. Are significant decreases like that just going to get deleted from the log because you think they're fake? If so, that defeats the point of the log.

The line between fake and a good deal is a blurry one, that's for true

This is an excellent point, and I will definitely tread carefully. My plan is to only remove obvious/extreme cases. Does this mean that price manipulators will be able to post "WTS thing that should cost 100p for 90p"? Of course: it's impossible to make the system immune to all manipulation.

But at least I can stop people from trying to sell that 100p item for 2p, because they're trying to abuse the wiki system to misinform others. It isn't perfect, but less manipulation > more manipulation right?

[loramin]

Looks like some of the lvl 49 words are also been targeted for spaming.

Words of Grappling is getting spam for 49p over an over.

I see what you're talking about, but as others have mentioned, it can be difficult to distinguish a "legitimate, but low/high" price, and a "I'm deliberately trying to raise/lower the wiki average" price.

To be safe, I won't remove entries unless they're clearly anomalous, and there just isn't enough pricing data on either server for me to determine that for Words of Grappling.

But thanks for mentioning it, and hopefully in the future as we get more data I'll be able to help with items like those also.

[Reecon]

pretty easy to see which ones are fake on the wiki but there is definitely a fine line, for example the OP mentioned the dirk going for 800-1000 yet i just bought mind for 500pp just yesterday, buyers decide the market in the end, an item will only sell for what ppl are willing to pay for it so in the end the seller might be greedy but it is the buyer that is inflating the values of items by paying the stupidly high prices.

[Siege]

Hey if they want to play the eq (((merchant))) role who are we to call them greedy ect?.

FTFY

[Tecmos Deception]

Hey if they want to play the eq merchant role who are we to call them greedy ect?

I for one get an item dungeon crawling and head to EC and try to sell the spoils as fast as possible to get to the next adventure.. if a tunnel rat wants to buy an item for 500 plat less than its worth and re sell it for a profit I'll take them up on that just to get out of there asap. My time is worth more than wasting another hour to try to get the full price...

Amen.

[TripSin]

It's worth noting that wiki god Ravhin recently added a way to correct auction logs in the wiki. If you see an item that has clearly false entries in the wiki, PM me and I'll try to fix them.
.

Can anyone do this or do you have to have special privileges? Someone recently put an outrageous price on star ruby for green.

[kelsoider]

Whatever happened to p99 Auctions?

[aaezil]

Its not hard separarating an idiot from his wallet in game and out of game

[loramin]

Can anyone do this or do you have to have special privileges? Someone recently put an outrageous price on star ruby for green.

Only wiki admins can (if anyone could, the kind of people that are trying to abuse the system would have a field day). The full list of wiki admins can be found here (http://wiki.project1999.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=sysop&limit=50) ... but as the most active one here in the forums (and maybe even the only active one?), I'm happy to do the leg work when someone contacts me.

I fixed Star Ruby, but again I think you'll have to wait a day to see the fix.

Whatever happened to p99 Auctions?

There have been two 3rd-party auction sites: ahungry's, and the P99Tunnel. The P99Tunnel person (I forget their name) stopped paying for the hosting, presumably because they stopped playing here.

We don't speak the name of the player who ran the ahungry site, because they did something a lot worse when they left ;)

[Frug]

FWIW, my sig shows a (not sexy, granted, and not "live") auction tracker I'm running.

I do run a script to alert me to prices of things that are far beyond "normal" (either high OR low), and I will delete them. This gets rid of most of the mis-parsed prices, and the obvious errors like "10kpp" instead of "10pp", etc.

[fadetree]

So - accuracy. How to tell the difference between a great deal and price fixing? A couple things to do-
1. The info you need is in the game logs on the server. If the devs would publish an RSS feed or something of all trades and /auctions, with player names obscured, it would be very easy to consume and generate accurate lists. It could be behind a password that only the wiki itself has. It should not be particularly hard technically to do for the devs, although they probably never would do it. Even so, maybe ask?
2. A common tactic when averaging noisy data is to discard the high and low ranges, such as throwing out the top 10% and bottom 10%.

[loramin]

It should not be particularly hard technically to do for the devs, although they probably never would do it.

The wiki doesn't really have "devs".

It had a single dev (Ravhin), who gave us stuff like magelos and the auction tracker, and he was even kind enough to "come out of retirement" to patch the auction tracker for Green/Teal ... but like I said he basically retired. Meanwhile, I'm sort of a dev, but I only work on the "front-end": I can change what you see on a page, but can't access the database directly.

That's the bad news. The good news is that if you (or anyone else who can code and either knows PHP, or is willing to learn the basics of it) really does feel that it would "not be particularly hard technically to do" ... you can step up!

All of Ravhin's source code (including all the auction tracker code) is freely available at: http://wiki.project1999.com/utils/wikiUtils.php. Just download the zip file, make the necessary changes to filter out the top/bottom 10% (or whatever), and send them to Ravhin. While he's retired, I'm guessing he'd at least be willing to review/apply such changs. If not, send it to me and I will (I can at least tolerate reviewing PHP code), and then I can beg Lord Rogean to apply them since I don't have that power.

But yeah, ultimately like anything on the wiki, it's not about what someone else ("the devs") can do for you ... it's what you're willing to do for the wiki ;)

https://imgur.com/vFSnCnM.gif

[Doktoor]

I've moved a ton of items over the past three weeks on Teal and I've found that the wiki is pretty accurate.

Yes, people are selling for more and for less. Some people just want to move stuff and you get a deal. Some people really want something and will pay for it - especially camp poop-sockers who don't want to leave, but have mad cash to spend on an upgrade.

[fadetree]

The wiki doesn't really have "devs".

It had a single dev (Ravhin), who gave us stuff like magelos and the auction tracker, and he was even kind enough to "come out of retirement" to patch the auction tracker for Green/Teal ... but like I said he basically retired. Meanwhile, I'm sort of a dev, but I only work on the "front-end": I can change what you see on a page, but can't access the database directly.

That's the bad news. The good news is that if you (or anyone else who can code and either knows PHP, or is willing to learn the basics of it) really does feel that it would "not be particularly hard technically to do" ... you can step up!

All of Ravhin's source code (including all the auction tracker code) is freely available at: http://wiki.project1999.com/utils/wikiUtils.php. Just download the zip file, make the necessary changes to filter out the top/bottom 10% (or whatever), and send them to Ravhin. While he's retired, I'm guessing he'd at least be willing to review/apply such changs. If not, send it to me and I will (I can at least tolerate reviewing PHP code), and then I can beg Lord Rogean to apply them since I don't have that power.

But yeah, ultimately like anything on the wiki, it's not about what someone else ("the devs") can do for you ... it's what you're willing to do for the wiki ;)

https://imgur.com/vFSnCnM.gif

I meant the game devs. They could rig an RSS feed that would be consumed by the wiki.

*edit*
Hmm, well does the feed from the game server logs already exist? I thought the data source was maybe posted player logs or something.

[loramin]

I meant the game devs. They could rig an RSS feed that would be consumed by the wiki.

Right, and that's what I'm trying to explain: the game devs don't "do wiki".

Rogean, Nilbog, etc. do not have anything whatsoever to do with the wiki. The only way they might even tangentially get involved is that Rogean might take five minutes of his time to install some software on the wiki's machine, if people beg him nicely.

That's it: otherwise they don't do anything whatsoever with the wiki. The wiki is 100% player-made, and that includes any dreams or desires you can possibly imagine for it: we have to build them.



*edit*
Hmm, well does the feed from the game server logs already exist? I thought the data source was maybe posted player logs or something.

Yup :) Like everything else, every last data point (of the millions that exist in the wiki pricing data) comes from a player (Ravhin) writing code which parsed logs, which in turn were uploaded by still other players.

[fadetree]

yeah, that's fine. I know the game devs don't do wiki, but they could expose an RSS feed of the server trade logs, which then someone who DOES do wiki could consume. Not gonna happen though, I'm sure, but that would be the most accurate feed.

[mischief419]

Yea, some asshat logged GBS for only 3k. I was asking 8~10k. Traded it for a SMR, in the end. GBS is too rare to even find sales to track, but had too many people try to offer me 3k for the damn stone that people spend months trying to get. "Well, the wiki says it's only worth 3k". Bah.

[DMN]

There are a lot of just clueless people around too, who don' tknow the value of stuff in vanilla. Like the guy who was selling amethyst bracelets for next to nothing. BIS cleric wrist item in the game ATM, and excellent long term twinking item for any priest classes.

[Frug]

Yea, some asshat logged GBS for only 3k. I was asking 8~10k. Traded it for a SMR, in the end. GBS is too rare to even find sales to track, but had too many people try to offer me 3k for the damn stone that people spend months trying to get. "Well, the wiki says it's only worth 3k". Bah.

Not sure if you're on green or teal, but on Teal the GBS was only seen at 3k for awhile, then jumped to 10.

https://unixgeek.com/prices-P1999Teal-AGlowingBlackStone.html

[cd288]

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but wanted to circle back on the whole discussion about people monitoring the wiki for fake prices and editing them out. A couple log entries seem to have disappeared on certain items that didn't seem to be fake at all. For example, just a day or two ago there were multiple different entries on Treant staff of like 800, 850, and 1000 pp (I can't recall if they were all from different sellers or not). Do those get edited out by someone? If so, why? Doesn't seem to be fake price gouging on its face

[Gatorsmash]

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but wanted to circle back on the whole discussion about people monitoring the wiki for fake prices and editing them out. A couple log entries seem to have disappeared on certain items that didn't seem to be fake at all. For example, just a day or two ago there were multiple different entries on Treant staff of like 800, 850, and 1000 pp (I can't recall if they were all from different sellers or not). Do those get edited out by someone? If so, why? Doesn't seem to be fake price gouging on its face

Had to sit and watch something IRL for most of the day Sat so had EC up on a monitor. I saw a few items magically get pushed up by multiple vendors a few hundred plat throughout the day. People are clearly boxing EC and artificially pushing up prices

Edit- only reason I noticed was because a few items went up 300+ over the course of like 2 hours and it was the only item they were selling

[Frug]

FWIW, I go through my auction tracker prices (url in my signature) every couple days. I have a process that both looks for prices that are obviously meant to be in k, but aren't (like a price of 2 for something that normally sells around 2k), prices that are wildly beyond standard devations (if I have enough data points), or prices that are mere fractions or big multipliers of the mean (if I don't).

I remove the prices that are beyond "normal" in these cases, but I try to leave the ones in that are actually advertised as such, even if absurd.

You can't catch them all, and there will be gouging and sellers trying to get a profitable price by starting high and coming down over time. But, I try.

[cd288]

Had to sit and watch something IRL for most of the day Sat so had EC up on a monitor. I saw a few items magically get pushed up by multiple vendors a few hundred plat throughout the day. People are clearly boxing EC and artificially pushing up prices

Edit- only reason I noticed was because a few items went up 300+ over the course of like 2 hours and it was the only item they were selling

I don't think something that is being increased by like 150-300pp for an item that's several hundred pp as is should be considered artificial price gouging if it's at least a few different people selling at that.

The whole editing the auction log based on someone's arbitrary viewpoint that a figure is higher than they think it should be is just as bad as someone artificially inflating prices. If people are willing to pay a price then that's supply and demand in action. I don't think prices should be removed unless they are absolutely egregious and blatantly obvious attempts at price manipulation (for example, someone selling something for 850-900pp that someone else is selling for 650pp is not egregious; someone selling something for 1,600pp that most people are selling for 650pp is egregious).

Edit: Loramin, would welcome your knowledge as to what's been happening with the Wiki logs, if anything.

[loramin]

I don't think something that is being increased by like 150-300pp for an item that's several hundred pp as is should be considered artificial price gouging if it's at least a few different people selling at that.

The whole editing the auction log based on someone's arbitrary viewpoint that a figure is higher than they think it should be is just as bad as someone artificially inflating prices. If people are willing to pay a price then that's supply and demand in action. I don't think prices should be removed unless they are absolutely egregious and blatantly obvious attempts at price manipulation (for example, someone selling something for 850-900pp that someone else is selling for 650pp is not egregious; someone selling something for 1,600pp that most people are selling for 650pp is egregious).

Edit: Loramin, would welcome your knowledge as to what's been happening with the Wiki logs, if anything.

All I can say is "it wasn't me". It's possible another wiki admin did it, but honestly I don't think most (if any) other than me are very active. The full list of people who could have (http://wiki.project1999.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=sysop&limit=50).

If they did, they surely did so on purpose (you can't accidentally remove entries in one click), so it seems either A) there was just some confusion, B) an admin intentionally (and therefore likely correctly) removed some entries ... or very unlikely option C) an admin removed entries incorrectly.

I don't think there's any kind of log of deletions (that would have made even more work for Ravhin, and "bad" wiki admins could do much worse things that remove price entries, so he probably figured it wasn't needed), but if anyone does ever notice a suspicious pattern of removals, I'd ask that they PM me privately so we can try work out a way to test the theory.

[cd288]

All I can say is "it wasn't me". It's possible another wiki admin did it, but honestly I don't think most (if any) other than me are very active. The full list of people who could have (http://wiki.project1999.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=sysop&limit=50).

If they did, they surely did so on purpose (you can't accidentally remove entries in one click), so it seems either A) there was just some confusion, B) an admin intentionally (and therefore likely correctly) removed some entries ... or very unlikely option C) an admin removed entries incorrectly.

I don't think there's any kind of log of deletions (that would have made even more work for Ravhin, and "bad" wiki admins could do much worse things that remove price entries, so he probably figured it wasn't needed), but if anyone does ever notice a suspicious pattern of removals, I'd ask that they PM me privately so we can try work out a way to test the theory.

Is there a way to at least log if someone accessed that page in an editing capacity or is that just as much work as having a log of specific deletions? Seems like if there's no ability to oversee changes people are making, then the edit ability should be removed.

Seems unfair to allow people to affect the market by arbitrarily removing entries that are clearly (or arguably) not egregious price inflation attempts. For example, I would think things should only be removed if you look at the log and see an individual seller clearly spamming egregious prices to try and block out other entries in the log. In that case that person is clearly trying to manipulate things so that the log doesn't show any data to the contrary.

Removing entries because some different sellers want to sell something for a couple hundred pp more and one person thinks that's too high a price should not be happening because it's just as much market manipulation as someone trying to artificially inflate prices on the log.

[loramin]

Is there a way to at least log if someone accessed that page in an editing capacity or is that just as much work as having a log of specific deletions? Seems like if there's no ability to oversee changes people are making, then the edit ability should be removed.

Seems unfair to allow people to affect the market by arbitrarily removing entries that are clearly (or arguably) not egregious price inflation attempts. For example, I would think things should only be removed if you look at the log and see an individual seller clearly spamming egregious prices to try and block out other entries in the log. In that case that person is clearly trying to manipulate things so that the log doesn't show any data to the contrary.

Removing entries because some different sellers want to sell something for a couple hundred pp more and one person thinks that's too high a price should not be happening because it's just as much market manipulation as someone trying to artificially inflate prices on the log.

Again, this is 100% a fan-made thing. Until Ravhin (someone who doesn't even play here) took a far amount of his time to add this feature for all of us, there was literally no way whatsoever to correct even those most egregious wiki auction prices.

To ask him to spend even more time to solve a "who watches the watchmen" problem that doesn't even exist (by logging every price correction), feels ... unrealistic.

Again, I'm quite possibly the only active wiki admin. Zosymandias made a single edit to his own user talk page in November of last year and hasn't done anything since, Ezri hasn't edited since July of last year. As I said Ravhin doesn't even play, and so on.

It is possible that a wiki admin (not easy to become) has "gone to the dark side", and is abusing their powers to manipulate P99 markets ... but I'd be surprised to even hear that any other admin still plays, let alone gives two figs about the market. And I find it truly hard to believe that someone who put so much time and effort into improving the wiki that they got made into an admin, would then exploit that and hurt the wiki with bad information that only benefits them.

I truly don't think we have a problem here ... but again, in the unlikely event that we do, I'd be happy to discuss the details privately (in the super-unlikely event that we have a rogue wiki admin, we wouldn't want to discuss the "investigation" of them publicly).

[Frug]

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but wanted to circle back on the whole discussion about people monitoring the wiki for fake prices and editing them out. A couple log entries seem to have disappeared on certain items that didn't seem to be fake at all. For example, just a day or two ago there were multiple different entries on Treant staff of like 800, 850, and 1000 pp (I can't recall if they were all from different sellers or not). Do those get edited out by someone? If so, why? Doesn't seem to be fake price gouging on its face

Could it be that you're misremembering? And/or, do you have any logs of this? I ask because my tracker has a couple 800s and 900s recently-ish* but no 1000's since Feb 8, and no 850's at all. (I also checked the raw log files.)

It could be that I missed them, but I haven't had any downtime in quite awhile, so if they were in EC and formatted sanely, I would have them.

Another possibility is that someone else uploaded auction logs, although I am providing the bulk of the wiki content.

* 2020-02-22 Somin 800
* 2020-02-22 Somin 800
* 2020-02-15 Faew 900
* 2020-02-14 Burningtree 800
* 2020-02-14 Slott 800
* 2020-02-08 Pedilee 1000
* 2020-02-04 Honko 800


https://unixgeek.com/prices-P1999Green-TreantStaff.html

[Frug]

Had to sit and watch something IRL for most of the day Sat so had EC up on a monitor. I saw a few items magically get pushed up by multiple vendors a few hundred plat throughout the day. People are clearly boxing EC and artificially pushing up prices

Edit- only reason I noticed was because a few items went up 300+ over the course of like 2 hours and it was the only item they were selling

Would love to see some logs of this.

[axisofebola]

Hrm i dunno. Sometimes when i'm selling I have multiple of an item I charge a little bit more for each one I sell.

[BlackBellamy]

Hrm i dunno. Sometimes when i'm selling I have multiple of an item I charge a little bit more for each one I sell.

If I'm not concerned about clearing inventory space my selling strategy is to increase the price if the item doesn't sell right away. This might seem counter-intuitive but what happens is then I stop dealing with value seeking hagglers and then some time later a rich guy pops in who is twinking his alt and they'll just buy in bulk as long as the price is not totally outrageous. My bank account says this works.

[Frug]

If I'm not concerned about clearing inventory space my selling strategy is to increase the price if the item doesn't sell right away. This might seem counter-intuitive but what happens is then I stop dealing with value seeking hagglers and then some time later a rich guy pops in who is twinking his alt and they'll just buy in bulk as long as the price is not totally outrageous. My bank account says this works.

An old psychological trick for selling high value items in real life is to price them VERY SPECIFICALLY. Want $6000 for your car? Price it at $6433.11, for example. Many people see the absurdly specific price and figure it's set to that for a reason that is unlikely to be moveable. Almost no one will ask, and few will haggle. It's an unconscious thing that most people won't even recognize.