The /List is a HUGE FAIL - Remove it

[skorge]

I want to start by saying thank you for working on a solution to the legacy problem. I know it took you guys a lot of time/energy to come up with the list function...but I feel that it is taking away from our loving EQ vibe.

Manastone:

They artificially NERFED the drop-rate to the point we are getting only 1 every 1-2 days or so. What does this mean? It means instead of 5/6 dropping a day we have a fake legacy economy on the server now. With only 1 dropping a day (instead of 5+ like on Red/Blue/Live) that is a HUGE HUGE HUGE difference!

Without this artificial, unclassic, nerfed drop-rate there would currently be 5 or 6x the amount of manastones on the server right now as we speak. Now, take a moment to imagine that.

This means that there would be a lot more out there for trade/sale. Wow, isn't that a good thing for the majority of the server? Who cares if someone hordes 20 of them, with 5x the amount dropping it doesn't even matter. There's nothing else to really spend plat on with account trading gone from the server.

The /list feature promotes people rarely, selling the manastone as it stands now. Good luck trying to get one unless you /list it.

The list not only lead up to a decision that will permanently screw the entire server of manastones it also encourages unhealthy decisions by players. In fact I now know 3 people who have stayed up over 60 hours because of this camp. I feel bad for people putting in that many hours down there. It's not right.

Guise:

We don't really hear about this one too much. Why? Because nobody bothers to /list this vs manastone camp. That's because it's much harder to do at level 35. In fact it's basically impossible to solo it at level 35.

The /list features promotes people going to the camp at level 35 and hitting /list regardless if they can solo it or not. So what we are seeing are level 35 warriors going into Guk and trying to /list a guise with no group.

SO, the /list is essentially promoting this unusual type of behavior. I say unusual because it is for Everquest, a group related game. Let's say you are a level 35 warrior. WITHOUT the list feature in the game, you wouldn't think to do this in a million years. You wouldn't dare even think about camping a guise unless you had a group going down there. Not anymore. The mentality of the player base has changed thanks to the /list feature.

Prove me wrong here.

To make it worse, I am hearing stories of the drop-rate even being reduced on the guise. If this is true, that hurts. It's like a pain the back to the player base.

Rubicite Breastplate:

Same concept as the guise really. Some players even holding the camp hostage at level 35 because they can thanks to the /list.

Drop rate seems to be reduced as well. One not dropping in 24+ hours seems off on the rubicite bp although I can not entirely confirm this, but considering the other 2 legacy items the drop-rate seems off.

Solution:

Remove the /list entirely. Fix drop-rates to classic rates on all 3 items. Let the economy do it's own thing. Who cares if someone hordes some shit...right now we, as a server, will never be able to buy manastones at this rate. Most people on the server can't sit a camp for 70 hours straight. Most people can't sit at a camp for 12 hours straight here, but we can farm plat and other items to buy one.

Communciate. Make a list of your own. Form a line like noobs did for Thex Dagger quest, or how we did back in Red where you wait your turn. No holding the camp for a friend or guild mate...that person needs to be there with you or in line. Devs can keep an eye on the camp if needed.

You know how much the manastone is worth on blue now. Imagine this x 5. In a nut shell, you ain't buying one on these servers.

Yep.

--------------------------------

Summary: Remove /list entirely. Fix drop-rates to classic. Communicate well together. Server now better.

[WaffleztheAndal]

Yea no thanks on upping the drop rates. A server literally filled with fake dark elves sounds dumb as fuck. And I’d rather not see people everywhere spamming their manastones and powering through the already spread thin content.

Having all these camps with high drop rates under 24/7 farm across two servers that will remerge into one sounds like a very bad idea.

[RipVanFish]

Yea no thanks on upping the drop rates. A server literally filled with fake dark elves sounds dumb as fuck. And I’d rather not see people everywhere spamming their manastones and powering through the already spread thin content.

Having all these camps with high drop rates under 24/7 farm across two servers that will remerge into one sounds like a very bad idea.

[shuklak]

Just put all legacy items in /claim.

[skorge]

Yea no thanks on upping the drop rates. A server literally filled with fake dark elves sounds dumb as fuck. And I’d rather not see people everywhere spamming their manastones and powering through the already spread thin content.

Having all these camps with high drop rates under 24/7 farm across two servers that will remerge into one sounds like a very bad idea.

Who said up drop rate? I said make the drop rate classic. The drop rate got nerfed like the noob exp quests did at launch.

[skorge]

Yea no thanks on upping the drop rates. A server literally filled with fake dark elves sounds dumb as fuck. And I’d rather not see people everywhere spamming their manastones and powering through the already spread thin content.

Having all these camps with high drop rates under 24/7 farm across two servers that will remerge into one sounds like a very bad idea.

Also, good luck on ever getting a manastone then at this rate unless you can sit at a spawn for 70+ hours. Who in their right mind would sell/trade a manastone if they had to sit down for 70 hours straight to get one?

[shuklak]

Also, good luck on ever getting a manastone then at this rate unless you can sit at a spawn for 70+ hours. Who in their right mind would sell/trade a manastone if they had to sit down for 70 hours straight to get one?

Now that it's exposed as a team exercise the camp just requires friends willing to go at it together.

[WaffleztheAndal]

Also, good luck on ever getting a manastone then at this rate unless you can sit at a spawn for 70+ hours. Who in their right mind would sell/trade a manastone if they had to sit down for 70 hours straight to get one?

Classic or not, the drop rate should stay low given the circumstances. If not having a manastone or guise is the price I pay to not have the classic server we’ve waited ten years for turn into a clownshow filled with guised dark elves everywhere running around spamming their manastones then so be it. I’m ok leaving these items to the beards.

[WaffleztheAndal]

You act like everyone who wants a manastone should have one.

They shouldn’t.

[Cen]

I think that anyone who wants a manastone doesn't realize the second nerf on it made it a piece of shit lol. The guise is such a cooler item.

[this user was banned]

I think that anyone who wants a manastone doesn't realize the second nerf on it made it a piece of shit lol. The guise is such a cooler item.

For those that don't know or never read the fine print:

It "Only works in Old World (no Kunark, Velious, or Planar zones)."

meaning it's 100% useless in expansion content.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Manastone

[aaezil]

OP sounds mad that he didnt get bad item

[YendorLootmonkey]

The list not only lead up to a decision that will permanently screw the entire server of manastones it also encourages unhealthy decisions by players. In fact I now know 3 people who have stayed up over 60 hours because of this camp. I feel bad for people putting in that many hours down there. It's not right.

Don't feel bad. This is natural selection at work, attemtping to weed out people with poor senses of priorities who are wasting their life and health away on digital trinkets that are not even required to play the game.

They do not need a manastone. They want a manastone.

Probably not even to use.

More likely to sell so they can buy other things they will never have unless the uberguild that will eventually rise up and lock down all content starts selling stuff like dragon haste, epic MQs, etc.

Lets not kid ourselves about how this is all going to end up. Anyone camping manastone that hard plans on it being their ticket to upgrades if they don't plan on being in Seal Team after Green and Teal re-merge.

[kjs86z]

consider blue

[Valeriya]

consider blue

Blues dead

[Videri]

Blues dead

Stop crying, you leftist.

[Madbad]

Stop crying, you leftist.

Chuckled

[Hyjalx]

Drop rate is classic.... it was the same on live and blue if any of yall played either version... its dam close, and not seeing a manastone for 10-30 hours is just how the game is....

However, list is not classic and is a garbage mechanic. Certainly ruins the entire concept of how everquest was designed. It's not designed to be a line at the grocery store....

[RipVanFish]

Drop rate is classic.... it was the same on live and blue if any of yall played either version... its dam close, and not seeing a manastone for 10-30 hours is just how the game is....

However, list is not classic and is a garbage mechanic. Certainly ruins the entire concept of how everquest was designed. It's not designed to be a line at the grocery store....

The staff have stated that list is there primarily to prevent these camps overtaxing GM resources, to prevent them constantly answering petitions etc. Seems a good enough reason to have it in, though I agree the loot welfare that results is dumb.

[enjchanter]

Drop rate is classic.... it was the same on live and blue if any of yall played either version... its dam close, and not seeing a manastone for 10-30 hours is just how the game is....

However, list is not classic and is a garbage mechanic. Certainly ruins the entire concept of how everquest was designed. It's not designed to be a line at the grocery store....

Yeah but imagine if everyone didnt get to have a manastone
What a world that would be

[Hyjalx]

Try WoW classic until lists are removed imo. I'm happily farming mats for my Eye of Sulfuras. Not even worth getting upset at anymore. The best part of classic is not even classic, so who cares.

[Frostback]

I’m ok leaving these items to the beards.

Agreed, because some things will never change. Enjoy the game and if joining lists seems unbearable, then don't do them.

Q: Is EQ still worth buying for people looking for a challenge? I've heard that some people actually got to level 40+ but Verant said it should take a year to get to that point. Has something changed or are these people who have yet to log off for the first time?
A: These people are putting in some serious hours, and likely not enjoying the scenery. Many people will play a game only to "win", so while you cannot win EverQuest, the level 50 goal is calling them. Who knows what they will do after that. The highest level players are those who have been in beta and know the areas and techniques. I believe Verant stated that level 50 should take a year for the average gamer, not for the die hard, Mountain Dew guzzling, red-eyed, hunch-backed, lock-yourself-in-your-room, pizza-ordering, what's-that-bright-yellow-thing-in-the-sky gamer.

https://web.archive.org/web/19991117212042/http://eqx.simplenet.com/Issue71/qanda.htm

[Swish]

No lists on red/blue, don't like them? There's servers available without them.

[Halox]

Yea no thanks on upping the drop rates. A server literally filled with fake dark elves sounds dumb as fuck. And I’d rather not see people everywhere spamming their manastones and powering through the already spread thin content.

Having all these camps with high drop rates under 24/7 farm across two servers that will remerge into one sounds like a very bad idea.

[ZiggyTheMuss]

I know enough about OP to know that if there is something he is complaining about then that means it is being done right.

Well, almost right. They need to tweak the list so that #1 in line gets removed if the PH/named has not been killed for an hour.

[Wallicker]

I know enough about OP to know that if there is something he is complaining about then that means it is being done right.

Well, almost right. They need to tweak the list so that #1 in line gets removed if the PH/named has not been killed for an hour.

Then you’d find out who ya real friends are quick! I like this idea but make it 30 minutes, if you don’t engage and kill within 30 minutes you are not worthy

[Maelstrom]

Devs can keep an eye on the camp if needed.


This is exactly why /list will never be removed.

Who (especially Devs) wants to watch those camps for free?

The Answer: No fuckin' body!

[Fingurs]

Also lets be honest - you got a better chance of getting a Manastone then getting a reaction out of them.

[Tethler]

For those that don't know or never read the fine print:

It "Only works in Old World (no Kunark, Velious, or Planar zones)."

meaning it's 100% useless in expansion content.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Manastone

Is this not common knowledge?

[Bazia]

guildy on teal is on hour 74

[Zekayy]

No matter what system they go with nobody will be happy you cant please everyone

[A_Bomb]

Is the fact that they added something in game to help with lists what's not classic? Because people certainly used lists when the game launched. I started playing as soon as the game came out in 99 (yeah I was a pally it was a horrible choice but I was playing none the less).

The first thing I would do when I zone into guk is a cc (camp check). Next I would pick the camp I wanted to go to if none were open and send the leader a tell asking if there was a list. If there was not one I would ask to be next on the list. When someone logged out of the group I would get a message telling me to come on down.

People have been using lists since the game came out. It's not that it's not classic. There's just now a feature in game to help people do it and ensure they are properly honoring the list.

[shuklak]

Is the fact that they added something in game to help with lists what's not classic? Because people certainly used lists when the game launched. I started playing as soon as the game came out in 99 (yeah I was a pally it was a horrible choice but I was playing none the less).

The first thing I would do when I zone into guk is a cc (camp check). Next I would pick the camp I wanted to go to if none were open and send the leader a tell asking if there was a list. If there was not one I would ask to be next on the list. When someone logged out of the group I would get a message telling me to come on down.

People have been using lists since the game came out. It's not that it's not classic. There's just now a feature in game to help people do it and ensure they are properly honoring the list.
The huge aspects of lists in classic that you are skirting is that they could, and certainly were, abused in classic. With the modern 2019 /list, the playing field erodes the edge that liars could easily maintain.

[Nirgon]

It only needs a feature to take people off the list that dont engage the mob or placeholder within 10minutes

[wagorf]

lol sad people trying to re-live the past and trying to do the things you never did

it's 2019 not 1999, live with it and stop crying

grats you are player_15445 who got a manastone while everyone on teal/grean has one

[A_Bomb]

The huge aspects of lists in classic that you are skirting is that they could, and certainly were, abused in classic. With the modern 2019 /list, the playing field erodes the edge that liars could easily maintain.

Right so why's it a bad thing that it "erodes the edge that liars could easily maintain"

Are we supposed to be backing liars now?