Hitting a snag [Archive]

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Natewest1987

11-09-2019, 03:59 AM

strawman

11-09-2019, 04:07 AM

Necro can group in Guk and druid can do a couple more levels in Unrest yard

Tethler

11-09-2019, 04:46 AM

turbosilk

11-09-2019, 09:02 AM

People aren't twinked. Grouping is needed, I recommend Crushbone, WK, BB, uguk.

zaneosak

11-09-2019, 09:09 AM

Druid 14 is perfect time for East karana. I did 14 to 24 there. Only issue is its crowded with dozens of druids. You can actually solo white and yellow con's with a few methods. Or you can dive right into charming.

Tecmos Deception

11-09-2019, 09:16 AM

Looking for advice on my 16 necro and 14 Druid. Really not sure what to do with them right now. Necro is supposed to be easy soloing, but I still feel like I’m always staring at the spell book. And it takes half my mana bar to kill anything. My Druid? I don’t even know where to start. Shitty heals. Not sure if I’m supposed to LFG as a healer or DPS. Tried charming things... it wasn’t very successful. What am I missing here ? Not sure where to hunt, solo or group... etc.

If you're not experienced with EQ, fighting evens and yellows in solo/duo is probably a bad idea. I'm guessing you're fighting those, or perhaps very high blue cons. Try to find blues that are almost green. Any resisted spells at all before like level 30 (for untwinked characters) are really hard to cope with because of how small your mana pool is and how limited your ability to med during a fight can be.

That duo should be lights out really. The druid can harmony to pull singles of anything you want in outdoor zones. Let the druid snare, then you cast your fire and magic dots and you guys won't have anything resisted. Fear stuff, let the beat beat on it while it slowly runs around being eaten by insect swarms and boiled from the inside out. You shouldn't be using heals because no one should be getting hit.

Grouping is needed

No it's not. Just go play your game and let everyone else do the same.

korzax

11-09-2019, 10:42 AM

He's not playing them at the same time.

Tecmos Deception

11-09-2019, 10:44 AM

Heh. Well I definitely missed that. Half my advice still applies though! Fight low blues! Charm with druid, fear kite with necro (being careful to not let your pet outdamage you if possible).

Danth

11-09-2019, 10:45 AM

My Druid? I don’t even know where to start. Shitty heals. Not sure if I’m supposed to LFG as a healer or DPS.

Druids will normally get groups either as a healer--typically when a group can't find a Cleric--or in a "swing role" where they'll do whatever job the group is otherwise lacking, ranging from damage to crowd control to helping on heals to pulling (in outdoor areas Druids make fine pullers). Once in a group look at what the group is weakest at then do that job. If they seem to have everything under control then you're damage until someone else leaves when you might have to switch roles. The mid/upper teens are a frustrating period for Druids as healers because they're proportionally rather weak during those levels.

Danth

kt1980

11-09-2019, 11:04 AM

Eventually you'll be able to quad kite with the druid!

Bazia

11-09-2019, 11:08 AM

your not doing anything wrong OP thats just a reality of playing a melee character, and it's why when we're all 50 you'll see how few people actually have patience for it prior to item mudflation

Evia

11-09-2019, 11:38 AM

your not doing anything wrong OP thats just a reality of playing a melee character, and it's why when we're all 50 you'll see how few people actually have patience for it prior to item mudflation

Druids and necros classify as a melee character these days?

Lordess

11-09-2019, 05:57 PM

People aren't twinked. Grouping is needed, I recommend Crushbone, WK, BB, uguk.

Twinking a caster doesn’t really make much of a difference as there is no mp/hp regen on gear or focus effects that improve efficiency in Classic.

In regards to the OP: The common misconception on soloing is that XP is faster than in groups, and that’s just not true. The advantage of soloing is you don’t spend time LFG. XP solo might eventually outpace grouping if you spend a lot of time LFG and not killing stuff; that’s really the only advantage soloing has over grouping. But XP per hour is roughly the same at best, but always inferior to a good group with constant pulls.

Enshadowed

11-09-2019, 06:16 PM

The common misconception on soloing is that XP is faster than in groups, and that’s just not true. The advantage of soloing is you don’t spend time LFG. XP solo might eventually outpace grouping if you spend a lot of time LFG and not killing stuff; that’s really the only advantage soloing has over grouping. But XP per hour is roughly the same at best, but always inferior to a good group with constant pulls.

This is just flat out wrong. You can maybe make a case for it being similar in the early levels, when most classes haven't come into their own yet. But once you start getting your staple spells on a necro, enchanter, etc, it's not even close. Solo experience wins every time.

ArunaGreen

11-09-2019, 06:28 PM

This is just flat out wrong. You can maybe make a case for it being similar in the early levels, when most classes haven't come into their own yet. But once you start getting your staple spells on a necro, enchanter, etc, it's not even close. Solo experience wins every time.

You have actually zero clue what you're talking about. A solid group will ALWAYS be better than solo. Sure a mediocre group can't compare but a solid group is going to be significantly better than soloing. It's literally not even close. There is no exp lost for the 6th member of a group so as long as everyone is pulling their weight, there is no question whatsoever that a group is best.

Lone Gnome

11-09-2019, 06:30 PM

you wont be able to eventually quad with the druid because you wont be able to find 4 mobs : )

Lordess

11-09-2019, 06:36 PM

This is just flat out wrong. You can maybe make a case for it being similar in the early levels, when most classes haven't come into their own yet. But once you start getting your staple spells on a necro, enchanter, etc, it's not even close. Solo experience wins every time.

I think you glossed over the part where I said solo XP is only inferior to a good group with constant pulls. Indeed solo XP does get better when classes begin to come into their own, but a lot still depends on the camp you’re able to get, amount of mobs, and the skill of the soloer.

Enshadowed

11-09-2019, 07:03 PM

You have actually zero clue what you're talking about. A solid group will ALWAYS be better than solo. Sure a mediocre group can't compare but a solid group is going to be significantly better than soloing. It's literally not even close. There is no exp lost for the 6th member of a group so as long as everyone is pulling their weight, there is no question whatsoever that a group is best.

Ask a necro in Howling Stones if he misses group exp. If you'd like a classic example, ask a necro in Lower Guk charming his way through the dungeon the same question. It's not even fair to compare. Solo exp, through charm in particular, is leagues ahead of anything you can get with a group.

If you wanted to go the grouping route, you wouldn't use a full group to maximize exp per hour anyways. You don't know what you're talking about.

I think you glossed over the part where I said solo XP is only inferior to a good group with constant pulls. Indeed solo XP does get better when classes begin to come into their own, but a lot still depends on the camp you’re able to get, amount of mobs, and the skill of the soloer.

I didn't gloss over anything. I just disagreed completely with your assertion that a good group with constant pulls beats soloing, because it doesn't. The best soloer beats the best group 100/100 times.

ArunaGreen

11-09-2019, 07:31 PM

Ask a necro in Howling Stones if he misses group exp. If you'd like a classic example, ask a necro in Lower Guk charming his way through the dungeon the same question. It's not even fair to compare. Solo exp, through charm in particular, is leagues ahead of anything you can get with a group.

If you wanted to go the grouping route, you wouldn't use a full group to maximize exp per hour anyways. You don't know you're talking about.

Like I said, big difference between a decent group and a really good group. I would bet my left fucking leg that a group I put together would absolutely shit on any necros ability to solo. The only class that can out solo a godlike group is a bard because they are a broken class and have zero downtime and can kill an absurd amount of mobs simultaneously.

fugazi

11-09-2019, 07:56 PM

Where is your druid? There are quite a few zones where you can charm animals. Charm one, find another animal to fight and let them go at each other. Why another animal? Because you can fear it once your pet goes low. Same, of course, applies to your pet when you break charm. Are you a wood elf or halfling? Use hide to break charm. If the animal you charmed is the same type as the animal you're fighting, root the enemy and back off past 10 meters. Then break charm. Both mobs *should* run if there's enough distance between them. If you're a human of half-elf, well, sucks to be you! You'll have to cast camouflage.

Once you hit 16-18, you can move on over to East Karana. Start with snakes, then eventually move up to gorge hounds. Congrats, you will roughly take 2-2.5 hours per level. While soloing this way is great, you could team up with anyone really to make it less risky *and* so your pet can kill the enemy. Let your pet drop to under 20%, snare the enemy and then fear it, and tada :)

At 19 you get Terrorize Animal and all of this becomes even easier. Honestly, Terrorize Animal is absolutely bonkers.

Lordess

11-09-2019, 08:14 PM

I didn't gloss over anything. I just disagreed completely with your assertion that a good group with constant pulls beats soloing, because it doesn't. The best soloer beats the best group 100/100 times.

Well I guess we’ll have to just agree to disagree. I would point out, however, that in your examples you mention HS which isn’t in game yet, and Lguk which is going to pretty much have every camp filled by groups that the solo necro is gonna be lucky to find anything to solo. That also doesn’t address shaman, mage, bard, wizard, enchanter, and druid.

I also think you’re taking my statements a little too personally. It’s obvious you love Necros and me saying that a good group is better XP than solo is somehow saying that Necros aren’t God tier and that for some reason upsets you. Either way, I think it’s unfair to make wide generalizations. Not every solo class is going to be able to keep up with enchanter and necro. And charm breaks at the wrong time can spell death for an enchanter who can’t just FD. You also say that the best soloer is better than the best group, but to me that’s like the top 10% of Necros basically, not everyone is that good at the game even after all these years.

All of this I say with experience: Gwendolyn 75 Druid (Fippy), Nitasha 85 Mage (Tunare), Nysa 50 bard (Ragefire), Alustra 60 Enchanter (Blue), Akashya 65 Necro (Agnar), Alustra 60 Wizard (Phinigel)

Enshadowed

11-09-2019, 08:51 PM

Like I said, big difference between a decent group and a really good group. I would bet my left fucking leg that a group I put together would absolutely shit on any necros ability to solo. The only class that can out solo a godlike group is a bard because they are a broken class and have zero downtime and can kill an absurd amount of mobs simultaneously.

Then you'd lose your left leg. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well I guess we’ll have to just agree to disagree. I would point out, however, that in your examples you mention HS which isn’t in game yet, and Lguk which is going to pretty much have every camp filled by groups that the solo necro is gonna be lucky to find anything to solo. That also doesn’t address shaman, mage, enchanter, and druid.

I also think you’re taking my statements a little too personally. It’s obvious you love Necros and me saying that a good group is better XP than solo is somehow saying that Necros aren’t God tier and that for some reason upsets you. Either way, I think it’s unfair to make wide generalizations. Not every solo class is going to be able to keep up with enchanter and necro. And charm breaks at the wrong time can spell death for an enchanter who can’t just FD. You also say that the best soloer is better than the best group, but to me that’s like the top 10% of Necros basically, not everyone is that good at the game even after all these years.

I'm using the same criteria that you are. Camps are going to be hard to find for anyone, and most are smaller than they are on Blue. Which honestly just hurts your case even further, because there's nowhere on Green/Teal that you're going to be chain-pulling endless rows of mobs to try and keep up with a competent solo player. That includes all the classes you listed aside from maybe Shaman, which I've never played and can't speak on.

It's not taking anything personally, and I'm not here to defend the honor of the Necromancer class. You're just wrong. You made a statement as an absolute that's undeniably wrong. Bad charm breaks happen, deaths happen, all that's true - that's the risk for the reward.

As much as I personally enjoy grouping, there's a reason you don't see many necros in groups - and it's not because they're not useful. It's just not the best use of time if your biggest interest is in leveling quickly. Soloing wins, period.

Lordess

11-09-2019, 09:08 PM

I'm using the same criteria that you are. Camps are going to be hard to find for anyone, and most are smaller than they are on Blue. Which honestly just hurts your case even further, because there's nowhere on Green/Teal that you're going to be chain-pulling endless rows of mobs to try and keep up with a competent solo player. That includes all the classes you listed aside from maybe Shaman, which I've never played and can't speak on.

It's not taking anything personally, and I'm not here to defend the honor of the Necromancer class. You're just wrong. You made a statement as an absolute that's undeniably wrong. Bad charm breaks happen, deaths happen, all that's true - that's the risk for the reward.

As much as I personally enjoy grouping, there's a reason you don't see many necros in groups - and it's not because they're not useful. It's just not the best use of time if your biggest interest is in leveling quickly. Soloing wins, period.

I’ve played pretty much all the classes I listed as well well into 60+ and I can say with experience that I am NOT wrong. But you appear to need to be right rather than trying to be helpful so I’ll just leave it at that. I’m done replying to you.

Enshadowed

11-10-2019, 04:13 AM

I’ve played pretty much all the classes I listed as well well into 60+ and I can say with experience that I am NOT wrong. But you appear to need to be right rather than trying to be helpful so I’ll just leave it at that. I’m done replying to you.

https://i.imgur.com/CRmeYwr.gif

Uuruk

11-10-2019, 04:32 AM

Well I guess we’ll have to just agree to disagree. I would point out, however, that in your examples you mention HS which isn’t in game yet, and Lguk which is going to pretty much have every camp filled by groups that the solo necro is gonna be lucky to find anything to solo. That also doesn’t address shaman, mage, bard, wizard, enchanter, and druid.

I also think you’re taking my statements a little too personally. It’s obvious you love Necros and me saying that a good group is better XP than solo is somehow saying that Necros aren’t God tier and that for some reason upsets you. Either way, I think it’s unfair to make wide generalizations. Not every solo class is going to be able to keep up with enchanter and necro. And charm breaks at the wrong time can spell death for an enchanter who can’t just FD. You also say that the best soloer is better than the best group, but to me that’s like the top 10% of Necros basically, not everyone is that good at the game even after all these years.

All of this I say with experience: Gwendolyn 75 Druid (Fippy), Nitasha 85 Mage (Tunare), Nysa 50 bard (Ragefire), Alustra 60 Enchanter (Blue), Akashya 65 Necro (Agnar), Alustra 60 Wizard (Phinigel)
Damn this dude whipped out all his life accomplishments

derpcake2

11-10-2019, 04:41 AM

Looking for advice on my 16 necro and 14 Druid. Really not sure what to do with them right now. Necro is supposed to be easy soloing, but I still feel like I’m always staring at the spell book. And it takes half my mana bar to kill anything. My Druid? I don’t even know where to start. Shitty heals. Not sure if I’m supposed to LFG as a healer or DPS. Tried charming things... it wasn’t very successful. What am I missing here ? Not sure where to hunt, solo or group... etc.

If you want to group, Upper guk should be good for both chars, crushbone is good also (except if you have a DE necro), unrest is decent but not as good as the other two.

For soloing, try to be in content that is as low level as you can find, but still gives good rewards. If you don't have the pet of the spell level you are at, its best to avoid soloing.

On the necro you can fearkite, you want to either have your pet do all of the damage besides snare, this will make pet take xp but result in efficient kills, or you want to do >50% of the damage, wich will give you more xp but requires more mana.

Necro's can use their fear undead line, and druids can use their fear animal line, these can be extremely efficient. Outdoors partnered with a druid to pull and snare, your necro only has to fear while pet hammers the mob, this requires very little mana from you and your partner, and since you are duo pet won't be stealing xp.

On your druid you'd want a mage / necro / rogue partner, and use snare and your fear animal line.

There are tons of options but these are some of the better ones.

Natewest1987

11-10-2019, 06:11 AM

Thanks for all the tips. Tried out the Karanas and couldn’t hang lol. Just got hungry earth on my necro. Hoping that will help a lot since it will atleast open up root rotting. Maybe mana gets better once my necro is level 20 with the new lich spell ? Yet to see any solo king Xp :-(

Natewest1987

11-10-2019, 06:14 AM

greenspectre

11-10-2019, 07:30 AM

Question regarding duo vs solo with pet. If the pet does all the damage and takes 50% xp, then that’s essentially the same as having a duo partner right ? So I could basically do over 51% damage for full xp, or only get half xp whether pet or duo partner takes it ?

This is correct. Which is why, if you aren't in the mood to race your pet, it's a complete win/win to duo with someone. Hook up with a priest to keep your HP stocked and you're good to go. The suggestions to do EK with a druid have a lot of merit.

98bcobra

11-10-2019, 08:52 AM

You have actually zero clue what you're talking about. A solid group will ALWAYS be better than solo. Sure a mediocre group can't compare but a solid group is going to be significantly better than soloing. It's literally not even close. There is no exp lost for the 6th member of a group so as long as everyone is pulling their weight, there is no question whatsoever that a group is best.

Group exp sucks if you have ever solo'd or duo'd with a necro/enc or necro/clr or enc/clr and are any good. The way the exp is set up on this server most times when you get over 3 people the exp per kill drops off a ton unless that 4th person is just helping the group a ton. Its not like live exp where each member actually increases your exp and the full group bonus is any good. It is actually a determent most the time.

As for the OP Necros are amazing when they get up there. Best mana regen in the game most spells are self only ect. Have self heals, DoTs, Snare, FD, DA, root, CC/Charm, can heal others and give mana. Its a very high utility class. Druid is good but has a different set of utility.

Khorza

11-10-2019, 10:08 AM

Arguing about solo exp vs. group exp is kinda silly since there are so many variables, but in general solo exp output has a higher ceiling than group exp. Very efficient groups can churn out a lot of exp per hour, but a good soloer can easily surpass that.

Again, there's a lot of variables. When I was leveling my Shaman through Kunark, I'd always go to soloing when I got bored of group exp. It was just faster, even if I had a great group. And sometimes you get a lousy group, and then solo exp is way faster.

But like I said, there's a lot of variables. For one it's extremely camp dependent, and there were only a handful of spots that were worth soloing on my Shaman (Howling Stones and Sol B imps). It also depends on how good the player is, for obvious reasons. Sol B imps is usually not an easy camp for a solo Shaman, and you have to approach it completely differently from soloing HS, but it's potentially some of the best exp per hour in the game. I did 59-60 in a single session there, and I don't know of any standard group that's going to knock out exp that fast.