Classic EQ is bad

[pink grapefruit]

Hi, I'm a rogue on green server. It's been super fun and will continue to be, largely because social interaction is so necessary in EQ and it's nice to chat with people. From the standpoint of pve gaming mechanics though, this game sucks hard lol. I never remember it being this bad back in 2000 when I first played the game, but back then I really had nothing else to compare it to and we were all lost newbies.

So when I join a group, it's generally me and 3-5 mages and necros. We might also have a cleric, wizard, or very rarely a tank. The caster pets can't keep agro off of me, so I mostly stand around waiting for the right time to attack, and often don't get to do anything until the mob is running away. Said pets actually seem to be better tanks than my naked elf self too, though maybe it's just that if they die it's no big deal. It's kind of hilarious how useless I am without a tank in the group, and then if we do get a tank they often can't hold agro either. Rogues not having evade in classic, lol.

And it's kind of hilarious that there's a MASSIVE lack of tanks rn, partly due to the classic af hybrid xp penalty, and partly due to casters being so op in this era of the game. Kinda seems like tanks aren't really necessary at all, if you're a necro with a mage or cleric pal. Really you can complete all of the group content in classic without needing a melee character at all.

I'm still making progress and I'm especially enjoying the drama. Just wanted to remind everyone that this game sucks and we're all super weird masochists for playing here <3

[FatherSioux]

It's a strange thing isn't it, objectively the game isn't great. Yet here we are, something draws us back to this game again and again. I've stopped questioning it and just enjoy it for what it is. I could be playing newer games and learning them but at the end of the day a game is a game. Does it matter as long as I'm enjoying it? Nope.

[Roth]

I've been really looking for a place to complain so I'll use this thread. Exp penalties on hybrids/bards, can't play those. No mage/necro pets after level 20? Can't play those. No agro on warriors and crap gear? Can't play a warrior. A million shamans/druids on the server that no one wants in their group? Can't play that. Rogues/wizards? Can't play those - not that great in groups compared to other classes.

So your viable class options if you want to have a normal/easy classic eq life are a cleric, enchanter, or a monk. Aside from that, you have basically 2 viable exp locations at each level, almost no end game at level 50, and you have to stare at a book if you want to get mana.

Classic eq was and is terrible. Kunark and beyond were significantly better, but I never wanted classic eq to begin with. I just wanted a fresh server with corpse runs(pre PoP).

[FungusTrooper]

what makes a game suck? i'd say it's a lack of enjoyment per investment, and i hope most people still playing eq feel their investment is worth the amount of enjoyment they get.

i mean, im sure some don't meet that quota, but i hope most do.

[Tecmos Deception]

I've been really looking for a place to complain so I'll use this thread. Exp penalties on hybrids/bards, can't play those. No mage/necro pets after level 20? Can't play those. No agro on warriors and crap gear? Can't play a warrior. A million shamans/druids on the server that no one wants in their group? Can't play that. Rogues/wizards? Can't play those - not that great in groups compared to other classes.

So your viable class options if you want to have a normal/easy classic eq life are a cleric, enchanter, or a monk. Aside from that, you have basically 2 viable exp locations at each level, almost no end game at level 50, and you have to stare at a book if you want to get mana.

Classic eq was and is terrible. Kunark and beyond were significantly better, but I never wanted classic eq to begin with. I just wanted a fresh server with corpse runs(pre PoP).

Most of this is really, really wrong.

[k9quaint]

Turn off attack on rogue.
Get words/runes.
Druids and shamans are amazing in groups, can aggro kite for rogues.
Hybrid penalty vs ZEM and ZEM wins every time
Don't need to stare at book, just have to have it open ;)

[pink grapefruit]

Last time I did classic EQ (2011 red server, obvs) I played as a cleric and we basically had a static group, which made it easier. Either our paladin or ranger would tank and they held agro super well ofc. There's less reason to play a hybrid on a pve server, now that I think about it. Back on red there were hybrids everywhere, which made for a much smoother grouping experience for everyone I bet.

hmmm :)

[Zeboim]

This seems more like a commentary on how modern powergamer shitlords all rolling pet classes sucks the fun out of the game. People didn't do this in Classic and it wasn't designed for it.

[BlackBellamy]

Those guys are gonna be gone soon. Couple of months, half a year, bored and out. Best time for this server is going to be the three months before Kunark and the three after.

[Tecmos Deception]

This seems more like a commentary on how modern powergamer shitlords all rolling pet classes sucks the fun out of the game. People didn't do this in Classic and it wasn't designed for it.

Mages and necros are under 20% of the server. OP is just exaggerating in an effort to make his claims seem stronger than they really are.

[Videri]

Exp penalties on hybrids/bards, can't play those.

I see this a lot. Why do people not play classes with exp penalties? You just play the game longer. I don't see the problem. Sure we all have jobs (or not), but you don't have to play more hours per week...you just play more weeks. Then, you end up at max level with everyone else.

I just wanna say, guys, you can play classes/races with exp penalties. You can!!

[Roth]

I see this a lot. Why do people not play classes with exp penalties? You just play the game longer. I don't see the problem. Sure we all have jobs (or not), but then it just takes you a longer period of time...and you end up at max level with everyone else.

I just wanna say, guys, you can play classes/races with exp penalties. You can!!

I have no issues taking an exp penalty, but it becomes "is this group going to invite me with my exp penalty?". I wanted to play a bard, but this is a huge factor in skipping it.

[Bazia]

this was ap roblem last week not now

[oldhead]

You picked THE lowest played and arguably the most difficult class to play in classic and one that requires a tank which is the second least played to make it worse and complain about it. :eek:


With that said... spent three hours with a rogue tanking today in CB Worked well.

[oldhead]

I have no issues taking an exp penalty, but it becomes "is this group going to invite me with my exp penalty?". I wanted to play a bard, but this is a huge factor in skipping it.

Yeah, people dont wana take that exp hit.


These things were fixed when discovered for these reasons.

If it just mean I took the hit and had to grind more id be an SK tank right now.

[ScottyC33]

It isn't classic, but god damn I'd love if ZEMs were altered. There are so many dungeons I never experienced in the true classic era, and I likely still won't now because the risk/reward is so borked up in classic EQ nobody wants to do them.

I'd love so much for the ZEMs to be randomized every week(s) between dungeons. Don't even inform the playerbase which is which, make it be figured out just like it was way back when.

[Videri]

Good point about the penalty's effect on a group. :(

You can still play them, though!

[ArunaGreen]

You picked THE lowest played and arguably the most difficult class to play in classic and one that requires a tank which is the second least played to make it worse and complain about it. :eek:


With that said... spent three hours with a rogue tanking today in CB Worked well.

Did you seriously just say that rogues are arguably one of the most difficult classes to play? Lolllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll what? Not even f'n close. In fact, it's probably the easiest.

[tripbunny]

I see this a lot. Why do people not play classes with exp penalties? You just play the game longer. I don't see the problem. Sure we all have jobs (or not), but you don't have to play more hours per week...you just play more weeks. Then, you end up at max level with everyone else.

I just wanna say, guys, you can play classes/races with exp penalties. You can!!

But if I don't hit max level as soon as possible I won't be able to stand around as long!

It's really just the mindset of gamers in mmorpg these days, not focused on the world and journey through it; but instead the concept of "end game"

I blame World of Warcraft, naturally.

[pink grapefruit]

Did you seriously just say that rogues are arguably one of the most difficult classes to play? Lolllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll what? Not even f'n close. In fact, it's probably the easiest.

None of the classes in EQ are difficult. Classic EQ isn't rly difficult at all, just a large timesink.

[excalibur]

I enjoy playing my pally, soloing has been more fun for me atm (only lvl 16), just not worth the head ache to get in a group then listen to ppl bitching about my penalty for 30 minutes straight

[Wwen42]

It isn't classic, but god damn I'd love if ZEMs were altered. There are so many dungeons I never experienced in the true classic era, and I likely still won't now because the risk/reward is so borked up in classic EQ nobody wants to do them.

I'd love so much for the ZEMs to be randomized every week(s) between dungeons. Don't even inform the playerbase which is which, make it be figured out just like it was way back when.

It's more than just ZEM. Unrest has a big chunk of sought after loots. LGUK and Unrest will stay full regardless because people want the items there and they are also easier. Name one item in Befallen? I know a a couple from Runnyeye, but no one ever ran in that zone except to get to the gorge.

[curtischoy]

All these idiots on p99 forums complaining about how the classic game is broken and horrible but refuse to play on any other server that has content that fixed everything they are bitching about.

[Roth]

All these idiots on p99 forums complaining about how the classic game is broken and horrible but refuse to play on any other server that has content that fixed everything they are bitching about.

Two reasons for this - I want to play a fresh server. Two, I don't want to play anything with PoP in it. It's also important to note that I want to play a server with corpse runs, normal looting, non busted classes, and slow exp. So green hits the mark better than most servers will, but it's also not what I wanted so I feel trapped.

[douglas1999]

I wish they'd reitemize cazic thule so people would actually group there. It's classic af in terms of people actually using the dungeon. Yes it's full of healers and is out of the way and nothing good really drops there. But I wanna kill lizards and gorillas god damnit.

[Benanov]

I have no issues taking an exp penalty, but it becomes "is this group going to invite me with my exp penalty?". I wanted to play a bard, but this is a huge factor in skipping it.

If you're a good bard, you'll make it up for your party.

If you're a mediocre bard, you'll slow everyone down a little bit.

[douglas1999]

Why would a bard group? You can just swarm kite like fifty mobs that are mostly yellow and red con.

[cd288]

I wish they'd reitemize cazic thule so people would actually group there. It's classic af in terms of people actually using the dungeon. Yes it's full of healers and is out of the way and nothing good really drops there. But I wanna kill lizards and gorillas god damnit.

On Green/Teal it drops Rubicite, so it's definitely valuable.

Why would a bard group? You can just swarm kite like fifty mobs that are mostly yellow and red con.

On Green/Teal, a 4 mob AoE limit is in place to prevent Bard abuse/zone disruption

[Arentak]

I wish they'd reitemize cazic thule so people would actually group there. It's classic af in terms of people actually using the dungeon. Yes it's full of healers and is out of the way and nothing good really drops there. But I wanna kill lizards and gorillas god damnit.

Rubicite, the lizardscale cloak and mantle, BTC, its not a bad zone for loot. Its not LGUK, but its better then UGUK.

[Mokin]

It's more than just ZEM. Unrest has a big chunk of sought after loots. LGUK and Unrest will stay full regardless because people want the items there and they are also easier. Name one item in Befallen? I know a a couple from Runnyeye, but no one ever ran in that zone except to get to the gorge.

Been xping a lot in befallen, which i never did the first time around. The exp is the best I've seen. Got 8 xp bubbles in 90 mins at 11/12 yesterday in a 2nd floor group. Damask armor too.

[Old_PVP]

This is why the game needs PVP to spice it up. The tedious grind of level after level against completely predictable NPCs using old auto-attack mechanics is nauseating. The unpredictability of PVP makes the game so much more flavorful... it's a travesty more people don't see it that way.

[Wwen42]

All these idiots on p99 forums complaining about how the classic game is broken and horrible but refuse to play on any other server that has content that fixed everything they are bitching about.

/shrug I'm not upset about it or anything. And I don't want the Luclin/PoP changes... p1999 is as close to the sweet zone as I can get AFAIK.

[pink grapefruit]

This is why the game needs PVP to spice it up. The tedious grind of level after level against completely predictable NPCs using old auto-attack mechanics is nauseating. The unpredictability of PVP makes the game so much more flavorful... it's a travesty more people don't see it that way.

best post in thread

[Evia]

I enjoy playing my pally, soloing has been more fun for me atm (only lvl 16), just not worth the head ache to get in a group then listen to ppl bitching about my penalty for 30 minutes straight

I keep hearing this. I'm 18 on my Paladin and haven't heard a single negative thing about my exp penalty. I have taken massive amounts of shit for being so squishy in my banded armor though...lol

[Mirakk82]

This is why the game needs PVP to spice it up. The tedious grind of level after level against completely predictable NPCs using old auto-attack mechanics is nauseating. The unpredictability of PVP makes the game so much more flavorful... it's a travesty more people don't see it that way.

EQ pvp was some of the worst crap ever put up. Class balance was a complete joke.

That said, if they put up a teams pvp server like Sullon Zek, I'd be the first to join, to have a completely different experience, but FFA pvp rules are boring, and Red's pop is anemic.

[opticalshadow]

the reason groups will take exp peanlty with tanks, is because sk and pally can actually tank. wars are great, but they are meatshields, the hybrids are what keeps the hits going where they should be going.

im 12 rog, and so far i have spent a fair bit of my progress as the groups tank, because, well, im melee and tanks are a bit sparese. still loving it.

classic eq doesnt suck, fresh servers have this problem. Many dont want to lvl up a hybrid exp sink, with no gear. They will lvl their caster, then they will twink their tanks.

fine with me, the fewer the rogues the better, just less competition.

[astuce999]

This is why the game needs PVP to spice it up. The tedious grind of level after level against completely predictable NPCs using old auto-attack mechanics is nauseating. The unpredictability of PVP makes the game so much more flavorful... it's a travesty more people don't see it that way.

Hello Troll.

There's nothing unpredictable about PVP in EQ. Anything PVP in EQ ends in the same way, no matter how many tweaks on the server rules.

It's pretty simple; people who like EQ PVP are psychopaths whose only fun is ruining someone else's. You may try to dress up as the grandma as much as you'd like, but we all know you're the wolf, the gig is up.

I know you guys can't help yourselves and you're going to give me great examples of how EQ PVP could be glorious if this, this and that was changed, and the only reason previous attempts failed is because of this and that reason.

But we all know it's bullshit, just so you know. You're a bunch of gankers and griefers looking for fresh meat.

cheers,

Astuce

[pink grapefruit]

lol is he talking shit about our granny panties

[Lone Gnome]

i refuse to believe the 2 best classes in everquest for classic / kunark are 20%

that being mage and necro

[Lulz Sect]

This is why the game needs PVP to spice it up. The tedious grind of level after level against completely predictable NPCs using old auto-attack mechanics is nauseating. The unpredictability of PVP makes the game so much more flavorful... it's a travesty more people don't see it that way.

[Izmael]

The problem is that everyone is rushing to get guised / stoned.

I vote for the next Green server release to have no legacy items dropping at all. This way everyone can play the class they really want to play in classic.

I bet we'd see a lot more tanks and lot less mages because people will play for the fun, without needing to rush and get a legacy item at all cost.

[turbosilk]

It forces people to form groups and get creative with group composition. Love it!

[Jimjam]

On Green/Teal it drops Rubicite, so it's definitely valuable.



On Green/Teal, a 4 mob AoE limit is in place to prevent Bard abuse/zone disruption

Its this way on green because someone found a patch note implying all AoEs were bugged to only affect up to 4 mobs in early classic.

It's not a balance thing, it's a 'shit's classic' thing.

[Malikail]

Its this way on green because someone found a patch note implying all AoEs were bugged to only affect up to 4 mobs in early classic.

It's not a balance thing, it's a 'shit's classic' thing.

Except the servers not classic it's custom rules server so stick that where the sun don't shine. In classic EQ you could two box no one had a problem with it and Sony was happy to take your money. If you want two boxing you can have classic otherwise it's a custom rules server, you can't have both no two boxing and run around saying it's classic all the time because when you do that you're not just a moron you're insulting the intelligence of everyone you say it to.

[Malikail]

It forces people to form groups and get creative with group composition. Love it!

Correct and thats why I am almost as fond of green/teal as i am of the last Jedi or new coke. Never liked xp groups, I solo, the day will never come that I get in an xp group and carry a bunch of losers again, no thanks. Might adjust to it but more than likely I'll get bored and move on, if the points supposed to be to get in groups and XP with people there's no appeal at all.

[Madbad]

sounds like no big loss

[Baler]

Having more fun in classic EQ than I did staring at walls in velious.

[Dolalin]

Classic EQ is great. Super cool to see banded and bronze be relevant upgrades for everyone, and people using smithed weapons!

[Malikail]

Having more fun in classic EQ than I did staring at walls in velious.

Why were you staring at walls in vellios? Serious question I'm not understanding

[Malikail]

sounds like no big loss
I'd miss me, which is more than I can say for you, I wouldn't miss you.

[cd288]

Why were you staring at walls in vellios? Serious question I'm not understanding

Could be wrong, but some people back in the day had computers that couldn't handle the graphics load for things like raids with all the pixels and effects and tons of people. So certain important classes where lag could mean life or death for them/the raid (such as a Cleric in a complete heal chain) would stare at the wall to avoid their computer having to render the raid so that they wouldn't lag.

My buddy back on live was a bard and would have to stare at the ground during planar raids lol

[Wwen42]

Could be wrong, but some people back in the day had computers that couldn't handle the graphics load for things like raids with all the pixels and effects and tons of people. So certain important classes where lag could mean life or death for them/the raid (such as a Cleric in a complete heal chain) would stare at the wall to avoid their computer having to render the raid so that they wouldn't lag.

My buddy back on live was a bard and would have to stare at the ground during planar raids lol

Cool guys don't look at particle effects.

[MrPanther]

But if I don't hit max level as soon as possible I won't be able to stand around as long!

It's really just the mindset of gamers in mmorpg these days, not focused on the world and journey through it; but instead the concept of "end game"

I blame World of Warcraft, naturally.

This is actually me. I literally don't even want to level beyond 40-45. I LOVE the journey up to those levels. Getting attainable gear that still kinda sucks, pulling together rag tag groups to go after new mobs.

[MrPanther]

It isn't classic, but god damn I'd love if ZEMs were altered. There are so many dungeons I never experienced in the true classic era, and I likely still won't now because the risk/reward is so borked up in classic EQ nobody wants to do them.

I'd love so much for the ZEMs to be randomized every week(s) between dungeons. Don't even inform the playerbase which is which, make it be figured out just like it was way back when.

This so much! The primary, #1 driving factor for me wanting to return is to explore all the places I DIDNT way back in the day. I know I still can, but when there is little to no population in these lower ZEM dungeons its hard to actually make it happen. I wish all the dungeons got equal ZEM.

[Albane]

This so much! The primary, #1 driving factor for me wanting to return is to explore all the places I DIDNT way back in the day. I know I still can, but when there is little to no population in these lower ZEM dungeons its hard to actually make it happen. I wish all the dungeons got equal ZEM.

Agreed. It makes no sense for a place like guk and befallen to get a 200% xp bonus while other dungeons just as challenging or more so, are given none.

[jacob54311]

Agreed. It makes no sense for a place like guk and befallen to get a 200% xp bonus while other dungeons just as challenging or more so, are given none.

They are making a few tweaks here and there to things like quest xp, so I don't see why they couldn't make a change like this, especially since no one is sure what the ZEMs were in the early days of EQ.

[danus99]

Those guys are gonna be gone soon. Couple of months, half a year, bored and out. Best time for this server is going to be the three months before Kunark and the three after.

I agree with the OP 100%. So many of the “classic” game mechanics made the game way less enjoyable without adding any sort of depth or meaningful challenge to the game.

A fresh server for progression? Great idea. Intentionally Recreating every bad mechanic for posterity? Pretty stupid.

Also whoever decided target cycling wasn’t classic enough - I hope your computer spontaneously combusts.

[pink grapefruit]

Correct and thats why I am almost as fond of green/teal as i am of the last Jedi or new coke. Never liked xp groups, I solo, the day will never come that I get in an xp group and carry a bunch of losers again, no thanks. Might adjust to it but more than likely I'll get bored and move on, if the points supposed to be to get in groups and XP with people there's no appeal at all.

Wait what’s wrong with the last Jedi? That movie was fantastic!

[Danth]

Also whoever decided target cycling wasn’t classic enough - I hope your computer spontaneously combusts.

You have a bit of a catch-22 there because the person who thinks that is the same person who's largely responsible for P1999 existing at all.

Danth

[Mblake81]

Wait what’s wrong with the last Jedi? That movie was fantastic!

A review (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ)

[Forsh]

You should expect EQ to suck and in fact EQ has always sucked in so many ways even the graphics. It's the overwhelming difficulties combined with the social mechanics that make the experience. From the time I got a PGT (Polished Granite Tomahawk (https://wiki.project1999.com/Polished_Granite_Tomahawk)) to getting an Ifir Dagger of Fire (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=17759)because we had no Rogue in the raid, both brought me the same satisfaction.

[Mblake81]

You should expect EQ to suck and in fact EQ has always sucked in so many ways even the graphics.

I disagree. EQ was good in its day. True it wasn't Unreal levels of graphics but it was still good. The game required a 3D accelerator to play, compare it to other titles released the same year.

The PS1, Nintendo64 and Dreamcast were still being sold in stores.

EQ
https://i.imgur.com/s3NxtNp.gif

System Shock 2
https://i.imgur.com/n3cJIFL.jpg

UT99
https://i.imgur.com/KN3BzcD.jpg

Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Rogue Spear
https://i.imgur.com/ycECfq2.jpg

Aliens vs. Predator
https://i.imgur.com/MFNxjPj.jpg

The Wheel of Time
https://i.imgur.com/bmnoX12.jpg

Quake 3: Arena
https://i.imgur.com/OCTrqY4.jpg

I am responding to a troll post in a troll thread /shrug