Rogue Evade

[Autumner]

Ever since the last patch, it seems like evades doesn't work very well. I find that on several fights, I pull aggro even without haste. I have to spend some fights just standing there without attacking because I know I can't count on evade.

[hvidhajen]

There is definitely something wrong with evade, feels like the hate dump has been significantly reduced but I don't see it mentioned in any of the recent patch notes.

[Videri]

Hm, you guys are talking about Blue? Because on Green/Teal, Evade doesn't exist yet. I wonder if that disparity is somehow causing an issue.

[Benanov]

Rogue Evade was not in at launch in classic. It was part of the benefits package they gave to rogues around Kunark time maybe earlier.

[Kavious]

Looks like it was added in the Paineel update which was two months before kunark. Should be added here around Sept next year for Green/Teal.

February 17th, 2000 Patch Notes (http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/20000217a.html)


A new rogue-specific ability has been added to the "Hide" skill. It is called "Evade". This skill has the effect of lowering the amount that the targeted NPC hates the rogue, and has the potential of making the engaged NPC switch to another target (preferably a tank) within the rogue's group. It is essentially a "reverse taunt". This ability helps mitigate the negative effects of the rogue's exceedingly high damage-output potential. It also will in-turn help the rogue do even more damage as the NPC is much more likely to expose its back. It is engaged by targeting the NPC you wish to "Evade" and pressing the "Hide" button. As a note, you must not be in combat mode in order to use this ability.

[Zutizutzut]

The issue exists on blue. Lots of rogue deaths happening on raids lately.

[hvidhajen]

Yes I am talking about blue, every rogue I ask says the same.

There is something wrong with evade but it's hard to prove this.

[bivouac]

Perhaps they've adjusted evade on Blue based on the February 21, 2001 patch notes.

NPC AI - Hate (https://wiki.project1999.com/Patch_notes#NPC_AI_-_Hate)
We've also re-evaluated ways that players have to reduce their own hate. While spells in place to allow this are OK, the Evade skill (possessed by rogues) let them out of their damage too easily. A rogue that successfully evaded would immediately drop to a level of hate lower than someone who was in the awareness range, but hadn't done anything to really upset the creature such as damage it or heal its foe. This problem was exacerbated by the increase of the size of the hate list implemented with Velious.

[mmmroo]

is this going to get fixed?

[mmmroo]

why is there no fix for this? kinda making me not wanna play the game anymore.

[mmmroo]

why is this ignored?

[stewe]

Here is an ideal, learn to control your aggro instead of going balls deep right when the tank gets aggro, im so tired of seeing rogues just start going right in on a mob even before the tanks have time to build some aggro, EZ mode rog has been nerfed, to bad.

[mmmroo]

Here is an ideal, learn to control your aggro instead of going balls deep right when the tank gets aggro, im so tired of seeing rogues just start going right in on a mob even before the tanks have time to build some aggro, EZ mode rog has been nerfed, to bad.

here is an idea try playing a rogue before and after the last patch, knob.

[Zutizutzut]

Here is an ideal, learn to control your aggro instead of going balls deep right when the tank gets aggro, im so tired of seeing rogues just start going right in on a mob even before the tanks have time to build some aggro, EZ mode rog has been nerfed, to bad.

Having played high-end rogue on both live and here in Velious, I can say that evade is not classic and not justifiable. If you wait for the tank to get aggro, you will still eventually pass the tank on aggro. Tank swaps are nightmares (even waiting 10 seconds after swaps and tanks using a considerable amount of aggro clickies). Lucky strings of successful evade often still see you pulling aggro within 3 seconds of successful evades. It is not uncommon for monks to pull ahead in DPS since the rogues are either dead or had to back out so much as to hurt their DPS considerably. Monks bring a lot more to the table than rogues other than damage. This is a serious issue.

If you have any recent rogue raid experience that is different, please share.

[mmmroo]

Having played high-end rogue on both live and here in Velious, I can say that evade is not classic and not justifiable. If you wait for the tank to get aggro, you will still eventually pass the tank on aggro. Tank swaps are nightmares (even waiting 10 seconds after swaps and tanks using a considerable amount of aggro clickies). Lucky strings of successful evade often still see you pulling aggro within 3 seconds of successful evades. It is not uncommon for monks to pull ahead in DPS since the rogues are either dead or had to back out so much as to hurt their DPS considerably. Monks bring a lot more to the table than rogues other than damage. This is a serious issue.

If you have any recent rogue raid experience that is different, please share.

Ya i pretty much quit the game until this is fixed.

[Hubble]

Bump, evade still broke.

[mmmroo]

Still not playing till fixed.

[Maitresse]

bump. Hadn't played rogue for a year or so. Evade needs tweaking.

[Baler]

Was curious about this so I hopped on my blue rogue.

What I remember. Hitting evade just worked before.

What I've experienced now. Hitting evade doesn't work like it did before. If I evade and then move my character away from the mob then back into combat range it works.

I think this is an AI bug, not an evade bug.

Edit: ps. you posted this thread in Velious Beta Mechanics. Which is nearly an obsolete forum section.

[Jimjam]

Hmm. Never realised evade only worked on the target.

[Baler]

Hmm. Never realised evade only worked on the target.

Hasn't that always been it's functionality?

[Zutizutzut]

Hasn't that always been it's functionality?

Yes

[Vsai]

Yes

Completely incorrect. You can have no target and still evade agro on everything. You see the success or fail message as per normal with or without targets. This has been used for years to see if the rogue still had agro on a kite/train in zones like PoG/Sky/Fear. This was changed in the last 6 months. Using evade to to clean up a pull was a thing i've done in the past- evade and the train leaves for the kiter to west, and you rip out the target signal - it absolutely worked on all targets on p99 that you had agro on.

[Vsai]

Here are the specifics on Evade from the February 2001 adjustment.

https://imgur.com/a/vbfO2mP

Source Link: Https://web.archive.org/web/20010714195249/http://eq.castersrealm.com/balance/VIEW.ASP?ID=196

[Vsai]

There is no justification for what we are seeing now. This is a bug. Timeline sync's up with the Green and Blue patches being merge (there is no evade on Green) - there was very likely an unintended mix up that is effecting rogues on Blue. Someone really needs to look at this please.

[Vsai]

Bump.

[Vsai]

Before kunark green patch goes out it would be a great time to fix this. Literally dealing with this for a year and its the worst class bug imaginable for rogues.