How long on blue until...

[Natewest1987]

The server didn’t feel like a new Eq server ? I keep seeing posts like, oh man it’s going to be so rough... but realistically, how long will it honestly take for people to trivialize all the end game content ?

Curious how long this lasted on blue and what we can expect from green ? I don’t doubt that there will be 50’s within the first few days

[Halfcell]

There will be 50's more quickly than you think, but very very few of them. A few accounts will have multiple people playing them around the clock, and once you get put ahead of the pack there will be some very high xp camps to be had that can really level a character up quickly. Highkeep guards, then nobles, neriak trolls. The couple of toons that lock these camps down first, and who have more than one person playing them, will reach 50 very quickly.

That in no way answers your real question though. Blue felt like a living breathing server up until just a few years ago really. Once the sleeper was awoken, and everyone knew Luclin would never come, blue lost most of its continuous influx of lower level characters. That is when the server finally felt truly trivialized.

Green will move quickly. Even with the commitment, the knowledge level, and the skills honed over 20 years of EQ, and 10 years slow crawling on P99, I will be surprised if green ever really feels "trivialized". It takes a long time to accumulate the kind of assets that have trivialized blue. Longer than the life of green I think.

Unless you are the kind of whiny tool that thinks putting a fungi on a level 1 monk is game breaking triviality. Then that shit will happen 3 days into Kunark.

[soronil]

Unless you are the kind of whiny tool that thinks putting a fungi on a level 1 monk is game breaking triviality. Then that shit will happen 3 days into Kunark.

to be fair, I think we can all agree that this (and later cheap velious weapons for all the other melees) is game-breaking triviality, but i don't think many people care that much if there's an iksar soloing next to an exp group. doesn't ruin the vibe and doesn't trivialize "end game content' as OP was asking about.

[Halfcell]

to be fair, I think we can all agree that this (and later cheap velious weapons for all the other melees) is game-breaking triviality

This assumes that one is of the opinion that the leveling process is "the game." I tend more towards the opinion that "the game" starts at max level and the leveling process is just the line to get in the door. It will be a very long time until max level content is trivial, if ever.

From the timeline I have seen Green will dissolve into Blue well before Velious becomes trivial.

[Fammaden]

The amount of time blue spent in Kunark is probably the single most deciding factor for what blue became. The disparity in the amount of cleric and rogue epics alone by the time green concludes will be very significant versus what we see on blue.

[aaezil]

Soon you guys will find out that its the knowledge and strats that trivialize endgame - not the wealth or gear

[kaev]

Soon you guys will find out that its the knowledge and strats that trivialize endgame - not the wealth or gear

The more casual player will simply see the endgame has been trivialized and that the characters who've done so are wealthy and well geared. Your knowledge and strats will be indistinguishable to him from cheats and GM favoritism. (And let's face it, the various money-collecting schemes would each and every one have been considered a cheat by Verant back in the day, many such were shut down and players were occasionally punished for exploiting them.)

[Mblake81]

This assumes that one is of the opinion that the leveling process is "the game." I tend more towards the opinion that "the game" starts at max level and the leveling process is just the line to get in the door.

:o

[Halfcell]

Soon you guys will find out that its the knowledge and strats that trivialize endgame - not the wealth or gear

Yes and no.

When I say it takes a long time to accumulate assets, I don't just mean gear. I mean people having enough level 60 toons in raiding gear to be parked at fear, yelinak, dain, and Tormax, with every toon bound at ToV. I mean a Doubles mage, a triples mage, a dagarn mage, 2 Doze mages, a mage at every ST golem, a Zlandi mage, 2 Aary mages, a Trak mage, 2 fear tracker bots, a hate tracker bot, a PoM mage, 10 epic'd level 60 guild bot clerics. Enough tanks, and necros and cleric's in the personal accounts of 60-100 players to adjust raid composition on the fly at 2 am on a Wednesday when Vyemm pops, and entire raid force of VP keyed toons that never ever leave so Hosh and PD die within minutes of spawning, even in the middle of a raid in another zone. Every cleric, rogue, shaman, druid, and wizard with an epic by level 50.

That is what a trivial endgame looks like, and I simply don't think that Green will ever have the time to accumulate that level of top heavy glut.

I mean just think how rare warrior epics will be, or bard epics. Green scales have been dropping for like 8 years on P99, white scales for 10, and yet they are both still 500k+ on the open market and costs as much DKP as Vulak loot if you are in a raiding guild. Green will only ever see what, 150, maybe 200 white scales? And that's counting the one that drops the day before the servers merge.

Sometime inspect a truly old P99 raiding main. The best geared players on the server are still not even full BiS and they have been raiding weekly for nearly a decade. Green will never have the time to trivialize.

[Natewest1987]

Yes and no.

When I say it takes a long time to accumulate assets, I don't mean gear. I mean people having enough level 60 toons in raiding gear to be parked at fear, yelinak, dain, and Tormax, with every toon bound at ToV. I mean a Doubles mage, a triples mage, a dagarn mage, 2 Doze mages, a mage at every ST golem, a Zlandi mage, 2 Aary mages, a Trak mage, 2 fear tracker bots, a hate tracker bot, a PoM mage, 10 epic'd level 60 guild bot clerics. Enough tanks, and necros and cleric's in the personal accounts of 60-100 players to adjust raid composition on the fly at 2 am on a Wednesday when Vyemm pops, and entire raid force of VP keyed toons that never ever leave so Hosh and PD die within minutes of spawning, even in the middle of a raid in another zone.

That is what a trivial endgame looks like, and I simply don't think that Green will ever have the time to accumulate that level of top heavy glut.


omg. is that what blue looks like at this point? lol

[Mblake81]

omg. is that what blue looks like at this point? lol

pretty close to that, yeah.

[Solist]

Locket of Escape is the single most, and only important item on green.

Green's entire raiding future belongs in the hands of the fastest zoning bard to get himself and about maybe 3 people to chief in droga to lock that camp down for his guild. After that point the only thing that happens is potentially that guild also locks down trakanon, or not. But that wont matter as kunark doesn't last long enough to matter to raid DPS or manapool as only maybe 10 PD's will die during kunark.

Anyone who thinks green is about manastones, or rushing to 50 or guises is kidding themselves. Planning and implementing the perfect plan of blowing every possible consumable attainable to reach and lock down chief in droga is all that matters.

[Fammaden]

Mmmk, well we are kinda talking about vanilla here since that's all we will have next month, and not everyone cares that much about how well people can raid sock on a server that will get effectively wiped after Velious, but good luck on the lockets I guess?

[AbstractVision]

Locket of Escape is the single most, and only important item on green.

Green's entire raiding future belongs in the hands of the fastest zoning bard to get himself and about maybe 3 people to chief in droga to lock that camp down for his guild. After that point the only thing that happens is potentially that guild also locks down trakanon, or not. But that wont matter as kunark doesn't last long enough to matter to raid DPS or manapool as only maybe 10 PD's will die during kunark.

Anyone who thinks green is about manastones, or rushing to 50 or guises is kidding themselves. Planning and implementing the perfect plan of blowing every possible consumable attainable to reach and lock down chief in droga is all that matters.

One word for you.
LISTS

[Wenai]

Locket of Escape is the single most, and only important item on green.

Green's entire raiding future belongs in the hands of the fastest zoning bard to get himself and about maybe 3 people to chief in droga to lock that camp down for his guild. After that point the only thing that happens is potentially that guild also locks down trakanon, or not. But that wont matter as kunark doesn't last long enough to matter to raid DPS or manapool as only maybe 10 PD's will die during kunark.

Anyone who thinks green is about manastones, or rushing to 50 or guises is kidding themselves. Planning and implementing the perfect plan of blowing every possible consumable attainable to reach and lock down chief in droga is all that matters.
I am under the impression this is the exact type of item that will be a candidate for the list system. I doubt a single guild will have control of 100% of the lockets.

[Dman2701]

Just make all items from Green no Drop when those toons get moved to Blue...

[Gustoo]

LOL @ guys worried about Blue economy half a decade from now after being a backwater of pharming psycopaths since Green launch.

Make the items no drop? Give me a break. Please explain what you are actually worried about happening? Those players will be bringing their loots and their toons and all of their demand with them, economy will rebalance rapidly.

About lockets of escape and other such things, yeah these mega pro stuff will get lists. It will be interesting. They are a weird game altering item..just really weird.

[Gustoo]

Yes and no.



That is what a trivial endgame looks like, and I simply don't think that Green will ever have the time to accumulate that level of top heavy glut.



It isn't meant to be trivialized, so it will be really cool to see how it goes down on a righteous timeline server.

[Dman2701]

Making items No drop from Green to Blue, would prevent people from just farming those items purely for bringing them to Blue to sell/use rather than use on Green.

I know if the GMs said when Green mergers with Blue they will make all items No drop, i wouldn't try so hard to get a manastone knowing i can only use it on whatever toon had it last on green.

[El-Hefe]

Making items No drop from Green to Blue, would prevent people from just farming those items purely for bringing them to Blue to sell/use rather than use on Green.

I know if the GMs said when Green mergers with Blue they will make all items No drop, i wouldn't try so hard to get a manastone knowing i can only use it on whatever toon had it last on green.

I don't think Green will end up being a farm for blue.

Blue is going to be a ghost town after green goes live. Nobody will care about Blue before Green recycles, nobody will care after.

This is like when Diablo implemented seasonal ladders in their game, people say they're going to play non-seasonal. But that isn't going to be how it shakes out.

[zodias]

I think a lot of people don't realize you can log into Blue and Red at the same time and not require an ip exemption and the assumption is this will continue with Green. Blue won't be a ghost town per say but will be people farming single high value camps on Blue while leveling Green toons. If anything the Blue economy could be even more flooded as people won't get bored sitting for spawns as they will be able to entertain themselves on Green.

I am sure someone will neck beard brag about holding the same spawn on both servers.

[Fammaden]

I think a lot of people don't realize you can log into Blue and Red at the same time and not require an ip exemption and the assumption is this will continue with Green.

Not an assumption, its confirmed.

[Credge]

One word for you.
LISTS

Lists aren't going to work. The same guilds farming the items will have every member in their guild that is online at the time put on the list and rotate it out until every member has what they need. If they try to put a limit on guilds and what not then the people just won't be in guilds.

There is no work around to this tbh.

[El-Hefe]

Lists aren't going to work. The same guilds farming the items will have every member in their guild that is online at the time put on the list and rotate it out until every member has what they need. If they try to put a limit on guilds and what not then the people just won't be in guilds.

There is no work around to this tbh.

I'm sure you've thought this out way more than Rogean and Nilbog have over the last ten years...

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Credge]

I'm sure you've thought this out way more than Rogean and Nilbog have over the last ten years...

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Could be. Or, it could be a way to dissuade casual popsocks because you can't actually stop a group of determined idiots attempting to break a 20 year old pixel simulator. You can't stop poopsocks from breaking a newly released closed beta. That's what people do.

[El-Hefe]

This assumes that one is of the opinion that the leveling process is "the game." I tend more towards the opinion that "the game" starts at max level and the leveling process is just the line to get in the door.

Yikes...

[El-Hefe]

Could be. Or, it could be a way to dissuade casual popsocks because you can't actually stop a group of determined idiots attempting to break a 20 year old pixel simulator. You can't stop poopsocks from breaking a newly released closed beta. That's what people do.

If it doesn't work, Rogean and Nilbog will, hear me out here: Change it.

[AbstractVision]

Lists aren't going to work. The same guilds farming the items will have every member in their guild that is online at the time put on the list and rotate it out until every member has what they need. If they try to put a limit on guilds and what not then the people just won't be in guilds.

There is no work around to this tbh.

The only way what you're saying would work is if you can disconnect and then reconnect from a different IP while on the list to swap players when one goes to sleep AND one guild gets enough people on the list first to effectively lock it forever AND
those characters on the list never leave the zone and always have a non afk person playing them 24/7.

Is it possible? Yes. Realistic? No.

[Sonark]

The only way what you're saying would work is if you can disconnect and then reconnect from a different IP while on the list to swap players when one goes to sleep AND one guild gets enough people on the list first to effectively lock it forever AND
those characters on the list never leave the zone and always have a non afk person playing them 24/7.

Is it possible? Yes. Realistic? No.It's cute, how much faith you have.

[Gustoo]

You can't use 2 accounts.

You can't be afk and on list.

They will find you. It's just like RMT. They have the logs.

Fun times ahead.

[Credge]

The only way what you're saying would work is if you can disconnect and then reconnect from a different IP while on the list to swap players when one goes to sleep AND one guild gets enough people on the list first to effectively lock it forever AND
those characters on the list never leave the zone and always have a non afk person playing them 24/7.

Is it possible? Yes. Realistic? No.

Why are you talking about IP's? I'm talking about guilds owning an entire farm and not allowing anybody to get it. They didn't stop it from happening, they just increased the number of people required for it to happen.

[Vizax_Xaziv]

The only way what you're saying would work is if you can disconnect and then reconnect from a different IP while on the list to swap players when one goes to sleep AND one guild gets enough people on the list first to effectively lock it forever AND
those characters on the list never leave the zone and always have a non afk person playing them 24/7.

Is it possible? Yes. Realistic? No.

Realistic for P99 level 9000+ neckbeards? Yes.

[Jadian]

Lists aren't going to work. The same guilds farming the items will have every member in their guild that is online at the time put on the list and rotate it out until every member has what they need. If they try to put a limit on guilds and what not then the people just won't be in guilds.

There is no work around to this tbh.

You just created an imaginary situation using framework that doesn't even exist in the already proposed stipulations of the list, and then decided that imaginary impossible situation has no resolution.

So grats you I guess?

You're basically ready to start a "skeptic" youtube channel and start making that $$

[aaezil]

Yes and no.

When I say it takes a long time to accumulate assets, I don't just mean gear. I mean people having enough level 60 toons in raiding gear to be parked at fear, yelinak, dain, and Tormax, with every toon bound at ToV. I mean a Doubles mage, a triples mage, a dagarn mage, 2 Doze mages, a mage at every ST golem, a Zlandi mage, 2 Aary mages, a Trak mage, 2 fear tracker bots, a hate tracker bot, a PoM mage, 10 epic'd level 60 guild bot clerics. Enough tanks, and necros and cleric's in the personal accounts of 60-100 players to adjust raid composition on the fly at 2 am on a Wednesday when Vyemm pops, and entire raid force of VP keyed toons that never ever leave so Hosh and PD die within minutes of spawning, even in the middle of a raid in another zone. Every cleric, rogue, shaman, druid, and wizard with an epic by level 50.

That is what a trivial endgame looks like, and I simply don't think that Green will ever have the time to accumulate that level of top heavy glut.

I mean just think how rare warrior epics will be, or bard epics. Green scales have been dropping for like 8 years on P99, white scales for 10, and yet they are both still 500k+ on the open market and costs as much DKP as Vulak loot if you are in a raiding guild. Green will only ever see what, 150, maybe 200 white scales? And that's counting the one that drops the day before the servers merge.

Sometime inspect a truly old P99 raiding main. The best geared players on the server are still not even full BiS and they have been raiding weekly for nearly a decade. Green will never have the time to trivialize.

What if i told you velious was beat in kunark gear and none of that sicko stuff you mentioned really matters you can kill 98% of this game’s content with 25-35 active raiders

Is kind of a shame that the devs here favor a ruleset that rewards big zerg forces though

[AbstractVision]

What if i told you velious was beat in kunark gear and none of that sicko stuff you mentioned really matters you can kill 98% of this game’s content with 25-35 active raiders

:eek: Mind blown.

Last 2% is.. AoW and Sleeper.

[Jimjam]

:eek: Mind blown.

Last 2% is.. AoW and Sleeper.

Tunare wasn't day 1 iirc.

[Halfcell]

What if i told you velious was beat in kunark gear and none of that sicko stuff you mentioned really matters you can kill 98% of this game’s content with 25-35 active raiders

Is kind of a shame that the devs here favor a ruleset that rewards big zerg forces though

What if I told you I have beaten Velious in Kunark gear on 5 different servers, including P99? That wasn't my point, beaten does not mean trivial. And killing AoW in pure Kunark is simply not possible without a massive raid with a list of tanks the likes of which I have never seen on any server.

Velious may have been quickly beaten on P99, though not really that quickly, but it was not even close to trivial until probably even after the Sleeper was awoken.

[Fammaden]

The point was more about the 4.5 years of Kunark and nearly four years of epics being available on blue prior to Kunark, really. The insane socking infrastructure here takes time to create. We might end up with a ton of CotH mage bots on green though.

[soronil]

Why are you talking about IP's? I'm talking about guilds owning an entire farm and not allowing anybody to get it. They didn't stop it from happening, they just increased the number of people required for it to happen.

Can you please explain what you are talking about?

For list, a player has to join the list and stay at their computer non afk until the item drops and it's their turn. How does having friends/guild help at all? no, you can't log onto your buddy's account when he goes to bed. Different IP/mac addres (yes they have that info easily available). You bring 10 people to get on the list? Sure. If they got there before me, and all 10 of them do the wait (for 10 successive items to drop), they deserve the items? why not.

I think you just have a fundamental lack of understanding about how list works

[Jimjam]

I hate to open a can of worms, but each person could be on list, then the computer that toon is logged onto could be remote desktopped to other players to keep that toon logged in / active from the same machine/ip/etc.

[GreldorEQ]

I hate to open a can of worms, but each person could be on list, then the computer that toon is logged onto could be remote desktopped to other players to keep that toon logged in / active from the same machine/ip/etc.

You must be mistaken! Clear circumvention of the server rules would NEVER be permitted and/or encouraged in the spirit of "competition."

[Halfcell]

The point was more about the 4.5 years of Kunark and nearly four years of epics being available on blue prior to Kunark, really. The insane socking infrastructure here takes time to create. We might end up with a ton of CotH mage bots on green though.

This is true, there may be a ton of coth mages. Especially given how powerful they are in classic. I have even thought about rolling a mage to start and just using it to farm plat and gear until Kunark drops and I can leave it at 55 to be a coth bish.

[cd288]

I don't think Green will end up being a farm for blue.

Blue is going to be a ghost town after green goes live. Nobody will care about Blue before Green recycles, nobody will care after.

This is like when Diablo implemented seasonal ladders in their game, people say they're going to play non-seasonal. But that isn't going to be how it shakes out.

Disagree with the ghost town comment. I think Blue will be a ghost town until like the end of 2019. Once people go through the novel experience of leveling up a character at launch when everyone has nothing, I think many will return to Blue. I'm not saying Green will be a ghost town by any means, but I could see it eventually being pretty close to a 50/50 split of the pop. Once the novelty wears off and people hit 50 and start gearing their alts, Green loses some of it's appeal in my personal opinion. At that point, I'd rather just play on Blue.

Then again, maybe both will have high pops since you can be logged into both servers at once. You can level chars on Blue and Green at the same time, so why not?

[El-Hefe]

Disagree with the ghost town comment. I think Blue will be a ghost town until like the end of 2019. Once people go through the novel experience of leveling up a character at launch when everyone has nothing, I think many will return to Blue. I'm not saying Green will be a ghost town by any means, but I could see it eventually being pretty close to a 50/50 split of the pop. Once the novelty wears off and people hit 50 and start gearing their alts, Green loses some of it's appeal in my personal opinion. At that point, I'd rather just play on Blue.

Then again, maybe both will have high pops since you can be logged into both servers at once. You can level chars on Blue and Green at the same time, so why not?

I personally think most will continue on Green after they get their first 50. Green is the “real game” now and time spent on Blue is time that could be spent gearing up for Kunark. The only thing Blue has going for it now is EZ PZ raids now. There is hardly any low or mid game toons around, no reason to do any of the quests or experience any of the under used content. It’s already mostly a ghost town outside of cash camps and raiding. I don’t think that’ll be enough to lure most people back.