Ok. This is not classic. Why won't you revive the sleeper?

[Beldan4]

Seriously, we came here to re-live the dream of EQ. I thought that was the whole point. Not be screwed by top level players again who literally just want to screw people. The GM's mess with Leash, agro, range, sit casting, ToV mobs rooted, Vender recharge (if your on red).

WHAT IS THE LOGICAL REASON FOR LEAVING THE SLEEPER DEAD? other than to be JUST AS MUCH A TROLL AS THE PEOPLE THAT WOKE IT?

[Xulia]

IIRC, It's supposed to be a 1-time event per server that affects zones outside of Velious, from Permafrost to Naggy's Lair, Skyshrine, etc. That results in a LOT of zone disruption.

The most valuable loot from the Warders (Primal Velium) can be obtained from other boss mobs in Sleeper's Tomb, so there's no reason to respawn them.

I imagine the decision to leave The Sleeper dead is because this is where Project 1999 ends at Velious, and respawning him just to have him wake up possibly less than 24 hours later and begin steamrolling all of creation for the lulz is pretty dumb, but that's just speculation from a broke Lizard.

[Lewkeng]

IIRC, It's supposed to be a 1-time event per server that affects zones outside of Velious, from Permafrost to Naggy's Lair, Skyshrine, etc. That results in a LOT of zone disruption.

The most valuable loot from the Warders (Primal Velium) can be obtained from other boss mobs in Sleeper's Tomb, so there's no reason to respawn them.

I imagine the decision to leave The Sleeper dead is because this is where Project 1999 ends at Velious, and respawning him just to have him wake up possibly less than 24 hours later and begin steamrolling all of creation for the lulz is pretty dumb, but that's just speculation from a broke Lizard.


they drop some amazing stuff other then primals.

[Darkyle]

I think it would be cool if a quest line was put in and not announced and if somehow someone happens to discover / solve it, the sleeper would be revived.

[Xulia]

they drop some amazing stuff other then primals.

True, and they are very nice items - Shroud of Longevity, Shield of the Clawed Guardian etc.

Sucks that they (probably) won't drop again, but plenty of items no longer drop and we have to live with it.

[Crawdad]

Seriously, we came here to re-live the dream of EQ.


Somebody already lived it. Sorry that you missed it, good luck next go around.

[Jimjam]

Try red green.

[indiscriminate_hater]

Awakening the sleeper and keeping the sleeper dead are classic mechanics. OP why do you want to remove classic mechanics? I thought you wanted to relive EQ?

[Jibartik]

Try red green.

:o

[kjs86z]

What is dead may never die.

[gildor]

believe Beldan's point is that with so many unclassic features of this pure classic feature set, why not increase players enjoyment with warders to raid / loot

[matticas]

I've never seen a thought-out, legitimate reason why they shouldn't revive the Sleeper. The most sensible reason I've heard was the programming work it might take, though I don't understand what goes into that to agree or disagree.

[loramin]

Support for keeping the Sleeper gone was always going to wane over time.

Right after it woke no one (well, almost no one) wanted it to respawn. Doing that would have reduced the "epic-ness" of the event. But as time passed and the people involved left the server.
... and even the people who just heard about it left ... naturally fewer and fewer people cared about "the epic-ness".

If you did a poll today I don't know what the results would be, but I know the idea would have more support. And if you did a poll in say ten years, when almost no one will even remember the original waking, I can all but guarantee support would be at 90+%.

Of course, Rogean and Nilbog do what they want, but it's not like they were strongly committed to a one-time Sleeper. During Velious beta they actually did a poll (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128884) asking what the player base thought should happen. It seems to me they're open to the community's opinion, and likely sometime before ten years from now the tide will shift enough that they return the Sleeper.

So, if you look at a timeline you've got the original waking a few years ago, and you have ten years from now when Sleeper will very likely be back. And what's in between those two points, after Green? Custom content.

I think it would be cool if a quest line was put in and not announced and if somehow someone happens to discover / solve it, the sleeper would be revived.

:)

[Dairmuid]

Shroud of Longevity Rotted on TAKP on Tuesday night. I shed a tear for all my old P99 friends.

[Psyborg]

Shroud of Longevity Rotted on TAKP on Tuesday night. I shed a tear for all my old P99 friends.

Christ, don't feel sorry for us. On P99 get the best EQ ever had to offer before Luclin crapped on the game. Though I will admit PoP was great fun!

[btravis1990]

I would be down for the sleeper to come back. I believe a reset every few years would keep server fresh.

Green for full TP but for keeping things interesting that would be cool.

[Heebs13]

The big difference between P99 and actual live servers is that Velious didn't last for 4 years with no end in sight on live servers. Having some of the most valuable raid targets on the box be perma-dead is kind of dumb.

[Jibartik]

I've never seen a thought-out, legitimate reason why they shouldn't revive the Sleeper. The most sensible reason I've heard was the programming work it might take, though I don't understand what goes into that to agree or disagree.

You can try to kill the sleeper every 3 years before your characters are transferred to blue from green, purple, x99, y99, etc99 etc etc on and on for eternity :p

[gutterbrain]

Who wants to be the brave one to explain why the sleeper was awakened on this server in the first place? Maybe Dannyl? He was in that guild after all. Did it feel like the right thing to do? You denied your enemies (Aftermath) pixels, right? Was that all it was about?

[Fammaden]

Make all the original warders/mobs pop with original loot table and drop percentages, on earthquakes and ONLY on earthquakes. Don't reset the sleeper itself and its awakening script.

[kjs86z]

Having some of the most valuable raid targets on the box be perma-dead is kind of dumb.

This.

[Kayso2]

As someone who would love a shroud, I couldn't help but feel my Warder 2.0 shroud would be a charity shroud. I can also think of 2-3 monks whereby me knowing they will never get shrouds makes me not having one much more tolerable. It would obviously mean a lot more to them than me, denial of pixels, all that jazz.

These are probably not the thoughts of a cool and normal BBQing bro in the midst of a summer vacation that prevents my guild from getting loot, but it is what it is.

I'm not proud.

[Psyborg]

As someone who would love a shroud, I couldn't help but feel my Warder 2.0 shroud would be a charity shroud. I can also think of 2-3 monks whereby me knowing they will never get shrouds makes me not having one much more tolerable. It would obviously mean a lot more to them than me, denial of pixels, all that jazz.

These are probably not the thoughts of a cool and normal BBQing bro in the midst of a summer vacation that prevents my guild from getting loot, but it is what it is.

I'm not proud.

SHAME, SHAME.

[Jibartik]

Sleeper not up.

[Evia]

this topic reminds me of all the people in the baseball community who want robot umps
I cant argue that you all make valid points on why resetting sleeper makes sense
but nobody realizes that you also in turn ruin some of the magic and intangible aspects of the game by doing so.

Sleeper was an epic and highly talked about mob from the game. It was a prime talking point I would use when trying to sell people on trying the game out, and it always got them intrigued. The idea of a ultra powerful monster that (supposedly) is unable to be killed and ONLY SPAWNS ONCE is something that (IMHO) should never ever be touched.

it's as close to something being sacred in this game comes

[Jibartik]

Sleeper gets resets in october (2022) :o

[Kayso2]

Sleeper gets resets in october (2022) :o

And then the rest of the Chardok patch?

[Endonde]

This all seems very classic to me.

[Ripqozko]

Sorry you don’t have warder loot (I do)

[fuckshit22]

this topic reminds me of all the people in the baseball community who want robot umps
I cant argue that you all make valid points on why resetting sleeper makes sense
but nobody realizes that you also in turn ruin some of the magic and intangible aspects of the game by doing so.

Sleeper was an epic and highly talked about mob from the game. It was a prime talking point I would use when trying to sell people on trying the game out, and it always got them intrigued. The idea of a ultra powerful monster that (supposedly) is unable to be killed and ONLY SPAWNS ONCE is something that (IMHO) should never ever be touched.

it's as close to something being sacred in this game comes


So convincing poeple to try the game you said... "Heres a cool story about an everquest experience you will never have, come try it out!" They ate it up and they also wanted to join the mass of players who never get to experience this. Fascinating.

[shuklak]

All bosses on 30 minute timers for 48 hours.

[Psyborg]

So convincing poeple to try the game you said... "Heres a cool story about an everquest experience you will never have, come try it out!" They ate it up and they also wanted to join the mass of players who never get to experience this. Fascinating.

Yeah, that does not sound like a very compelling argument.

[Crede]

Curious if the warders are classicly allowed to not be around, then why was the 25 mob AE limit unclassicly implemented?

[Prostatus]

Do it for Ivandyr

[Kayso2]

Sorry you don’t have warder loot (I do)

Great post.

Let this one sink in and imagine. This guy has warder loot. Dannyl has warder loot (I assume). What's next? Tofat? Lazie? Kelz? That reznor guy?

No thanks.

[Ripqozko]

Great post.

Let this one sink in and imagine. This guy has warder loot. Dannyl has warder loot (I assume). What's next? Tofat? Lazie? Kelz? That reznor guy?

No thanks.

none of the others do, sorry you dont have warder loot

[Ripqozko]

dannyl does , rest dont rather

[tompretty]

I looted items off the last warder then my mom yelled at me and hid my keyboard for a week. Worth it. I am unemployed.

[Kayso2]

none of the others do, sorry you dont have warder loot

dannyl does , rest dont rather

So you read that as me thinking the others I listed have warder loot and that I too want warder loot?

Sorry you don't have smart.

[Wonkie]

I looted items off the last warder then my mom yelled at me and hid my keyboard for a week. Worth it. I am unemployed.

hi you sound kewl

[Evia]

So convincing poeple to try the game you said... "Heres a cool story about an everquest experience you will never have, come try it out!" They ate it up and they also wanted to join the mass of players who never get to experience this. Fascinating.

You miss the point. The cool and intriguing part to them (and to me and alot of other people)wasnt that they could necessarily kill sleeper, it was that in the magical world of Everquest there were event type of mobs that differed from your average run-of-the-mill mobs and a lore based event would trigger only one possible time.

The key word here is one possible time. If you start just spawning sleeper you make him just another raid mob and all of that"epicness" that Loramin calls it is essentially ruined.

Sleeper is SUPPOSED to spawn only ONCE that's the whole damn point. All this talk of respawning him is the same type of talk that eventually killed Everquest in later expansions. Turning a 'world within a world' into just another computer game.

[Jimjam]

You miss the point. The cool and intriguing part to them (and to me and alot of other people)wasnt that they could necessarily kill sleeper, it was that in the magical world of Everquest there were event type of mobs that differed from your average run-of-the-mill mobs and a lore based event would trigger only one possible time.

The key word here is one possible time. If you start just spawning sleeper you make him just another raid mob and all of that"epicness" that Loramin calls it is essentially ruined.

Sleeper is SUPPOSED to spawn only ONCE that's the whole damn point. All this talk of respawning him is the same type of talk that eventually killed Everquest in later expansions. Turning a 'world within a world' into just another computer game.

Wasn't there an expansion about what Kerafym did after he woke up?

Recaging The Sleeper is one hell of a plot hook, but let's be honest, we need to take a note from the deep magic of Narnia here; things never happen the same way twice. I.e if you do manage to put Kerafym back to sleep, it's sure as hell not going to be via some 4 warder system like in sleepers tomb.

[Zal22]

OP.

The sleeper is not dead.

The warders are dead.

[Sacer]

Do you know the amount of work reseting the sleeper would bring? We can't even have quakes like we should.

[Ripqozko]

So you read that as me thinking the others I listed have warder loot and that I too want warder loot?

Sorry you don't have smart.

Sorry you don't have warder loot

[Mead]

we going to do it again on green

[Gimp]

Sorry you don't have warder loot

Is Ripgimpster still rocking?

[kaizersoze]

The big difference between P99 and actual live servers is that Velious didn't last for 4 years with no end in sight on live servers. Having some of the most valuable raid targets on the box be perma-dead is kind of dumb.

this is what you signed up for though. You signed up for velious and autistically scream about Luclin ruining the game. If anything be mad at the people who woke the sleeper.

[Ripqozko]

Is Ripgimpster still rocking?

Haha nah I changed it, roll tide gimp

[kjs86z]

we going to do it again on green

Can't wait until they wake him on patch day just for the lulz.

[mattydef]

The sleeper should remain gone but they should at least bring the warders back to open up a little more content for the server.

[derpcake2]

the main point of keeping the sleeper dead is to confront people with the fact that they won't always get what they want

dealwithit.jpg

[reznor_]

Woulda been cool to see, but I missed the boat when I didn't start playing p99 8 years ago, or whatever.

[deezy]

rest sweet sleeper

[nyclin]

Curious if the warders are classicly allowed to not be around, then why was the 25 mob AE limit unclassicly implemented?

asking the deep questions

we've got Luclin-era rooted dragons in NToV, unclassic mob spellbooks, unclassic lifetap resist code to prevent Ivandyr hoop spam, an unclassic 25 mob limit on AOEs

just add in a quest to re-awake the sleeper: turn in 100 (200? 300?) sleeper's keys, and the zone resets to pre-awakening. if 100+ people on the server want to give up their sleeper's key to reset the warders, let them do it. maybe have this only be possible once every 12 months to keep it in line with the classic timeline (Velious out for 1 year, most servers woke sleeper during that time or shortly after).

[Xulia]

So if The Sleeper event is reset, and if the Sleeper is re-awakened by one of the raid guilds leading to multiple zone-wide player deaths - wouldn't they be responsible for rezzing those players who died?

Killing all players in a zone constitutes zone disruption (Rule 10) and the players getting killed wouldn't have anything to do with waking Kerafyrm, they would just be killed off by another guild's actions.

This argument of "It's for the epicness of it!" is also dubious at best. I've got plenty of reasons to believe that people denying other guilds the opportunity to get Warder loot again would be a much bigger motivation than "the epicness".

[Mblake81]

Curious if the warders are classicly allowed to not be around, then why was the 25 mob AE limit unclassicly implemented?

People grumbling on the forums vs. People screaming in game.

Sharing of knowledge, youtube, myself included in this and getting yelled at and threatened with GM action in NK & OT before the change. More people knowing what to do and how to do it means more of them doing it...

*raises hand* only reason I started a bard was I wanted to do the low health agro duo after seeing it on youtube. Was wild and never seen anything like that in classic. Didn't know that could be done. It was changed right when I started my bard, unsure if that was classic as well.

It probably would have never been changed if not for youtube. We wouldn't know but it would still be there for those who do.

Lose lips sink ships.

[Mblake81]

asking the deep questions

we've got Luclin-era rooted dragons in NToV, unclassic mob spellbooks, unclassic lifetap resist code to prevent Ivandyr hoop spam, an unclassic 25 mob limit on AOEs

I think this was to preserve what could be for the server. There were no Ivandyr hoops spams, massive and numerous raid guilds with shared knowledge.. I can't speak as to why the spells act different but iirc that was to provide some challenge but I could be wrong.

basically you have a concentration of the players who knew all the secrets and could break the game. What use is there to play at that point. So they did unclassic things to hobble the game along. It's still running.

[Mblake81]

*triple post triggered*

but seriously though, you can emulate a game but not the time it came from. Once the cat is out of the bag..

Pandora opened a jar releasing all the evils that visit humanity like pain and suffering, leaving only hope inside once it was closed again.

You can't take it back.

[Daldaen]

Curious if the warders are classicly allowed to not be around, then why was the 25 mob AE limit unclassicly implemented?

I think the 25 max limit was a mistake, but it comes from the right place. The 130+ mob trains that people were doing in Chardok were not close to possible due to pathing changes on Live vs EQEmu. Emulated servers have much better pathing than live server do.

A more realistic limitation should be in the 70-90 mob range. Around 50-60 mobs you begun to see a lot of rubber banding. Around 70+ you would lag zones out and mobs would fall off trains.

For Green I hope they up the PBAE target limit towards that higher range to emulate classic behavior a bit better.

Also they should just launch Luclin so that blue players have some good content finally. Velious Raids are all pretty awful and class balance is terrible pre-Luclin.

[Molitoth]

Don't awaken the sleeper... just re-spawn the freaking Warders. It's not that hard to do.

[branamil]

Pre-Sleeper and Post-Sleeper server states are not equivalent. So which one is more classic?

[Endonde]

Don't awaken the sleeper... just re-spawn the freaking Warders. It's not that hard to do.

Might as well just rotate everything while we're at it then.

Everquest love it or hate it was about exclusivity, the best raiders got the best loot and everyone else looked up to them. The server could change to become a sort of time capsule for people to come back and experience the game with rotations, and free dragons, but that isn't what Everquest really was.

I honestly wouldn't mind it if the made Green server a forced rotations server though just so people could experience everything the game has to offer casually.

[nyclin]

man, imagine how terrible rotations would be

- pre scheduled raids so you don't have to wake up at 2am for batphones
- no bullshit lawyerquest because you're either on your turn or you aren't in the zone
- earthquakes could still be FFA for that "competition" that a vocal minority seems to crave

just sounds utterly fucking terrible.

"exclusivity" is some bullshit made up by soyboy manlets to justify clinging on to a sad addiction to a 20 year old game. especially after 4 years of Velious - even having full BiS on your main isn't "cool" at this point, it's just expected if you've been raiding for the majority of the 4 years.

[Psyborg]

man, imagine how terrible rotations would be

- pre scheduled raids so you don't have to wake up at 2am for batphones
- no bullshit lawyerquest because you're either on your turn or you aren't in the zone
- earthquakes could still be FFA for that "competition" that a vocal minority seems to crave

just sounds utterly fucking terrible.

"exclusivity" is some bullshit made up by soyboy manlets to justify clinging on to a sad addiction to a 20 year old game. especially after 4 years of Velious - even having full BiS on your main isn't "cool" at this point, it's just expected if you've been raiding for the majority of the 4 years.


Let us add some more:
- no need to sustain an FTE/tracking infrastructure, which can easily be a dozen people during busy times.
- no need to dole out DKP bonuses for tracking/fte
- no more sitting in front of your computer spamming /pet attack or waiting on that bindsight rush

[deezy]

Killing all players in a zone constitutes zone disruption (Rule 10) and the players getting killed wouldn't have anything to do with waking Kerafyrm, they would just be killed off by another guild's actions.

Non-raiding people were piling into skyshine trying to be killed by Karafyrm a few years ago, so I don't think that part would be such an issue.

[Endonde]

man, imagine how terrible rotations would be

- pre scheduled raids so you don't have to wake up at 2am for batphones
- no bullshit lawyerquest because you're either on your turn or you aren't in the zone
- earthquakes could still be FFA for that "competition" that a vocal minority seems to crave

just sounds utterly fucking terrible.

"exclusivity" is some bullshit made up by soyboy manlets to justify clinging on to a sad addiction to a 20 year old game. especially after 4 years of Velious - even having full BiS on your main isn't "cool" at this point, it's just expected if you've been raiding for the majority of the 4 years.



So first no one is requiring you to do any of those things listed, If you don't wanna wake up for a 2am batphone just don't it's really not that tough. Don't want to lawyerquest, easy don't become an officer or GM in a guild.

But if you don't think exclusivity was a thing in classic Everquest you must not have played much classic Everquest. I get how frustrating it could be to want to experience things but feel like you aren't allowed because your neckbeard isn't long enough but that's really just how Everquest was.

I will say though that I think the idea that you have to be some gigantic neckbeard to experience raiding content on P99 is a myth. It might take you a while to get whatever item you crave but it's possible even as a more casual player.

[nyclin]

"exclusivity" on p99 is nothing like it was in classic, but thanks for taking the time to elfsplain to me about it

[Psyborg]

So first no one is requiring you to do any of those things listed, If you don't wanna wake up for a 2am batphone just don't it's really not that tough. Don't want to lawyerquest, easy don't become an officer or GM in a guild.

But if you don't think exclusivity was a thing in classic Everquest you must not have played much classic Everquest. I get how frustrating it could be to want to experience things but feel like you aren't allowed because your neckbeard isn't long enough but that's really just how Everquest was.

I will say though that I think the idea that you have to be some gigantic neckbeard to experience raiding content on P99 is a myth. It might take you a while to get whatever item you crave but it's possible even as a more casual player.

It currently requires you to join one of two specific guilds, which for some isn't ideal. A raid rotation would open things up to more guilds. My experience on a raid rotation server in classic was amazing.

[Zekayy]

too bad the sleeper cant actually be killed on this server can only be awoken when he was awoken he was quading people for 6k dmg lol

[Nuggie]

All of this re-awaken the sleeper talk has me thinking.... What about for Green99: when the server wakes up green gets merged onto blue and new server pops up? Most epic server troll!

[Mblake81]

"exclusivity" is some bullshit made up by soyboy manlets to justify clinging on to a sad addiction to a 20 year old game. especially after 4 years of Velious - even having full BiS on your main isn't "cool" at this point, it's just expected if you've been raiding for the majority of the 4 years.

Yep, there was no cause to say exclusive back in era because it was self regulating. There were only so many that could per server, only so many that would do what was needed. Exclusivity was a thing in classic era but it wasn't spoken about like it is here. For sure Ring of Valor, Arch Overseers, Club Fu were the envied ones on Bristlebane but they were also the ones figuring things out and doing it. I just logged on when I got home from work, played and was caught up in the 3D revolution of a fully online world occupied by other people.

EQ required, at least in my view, such a substantial difference to be good and have the good things compared to other video games. Sheer love & hate. I still praise it to this day although I don't play P99 or video games much anymore. I can't touch new games that wants to put baby powder and a diaper on me and be considerate of me. Its like placating myself.

[Kayso2]

All of this re-awaken the sleeper talk has me thinking.... What about for Green99: when the server wakes up green gets merged onto blue and new server pops up? Most epic server troll!

The players on the 4th warder encounter log getting merged into red would be a better troll.

[Halfcell]

Somebody already lived it. Sorry that you missed it, good luck next go around.

Classic AF

[Droxx]

Respawn warders but each warder only has a 25% chance to drop 1 item from it's loot table.

[loramin]

Classic AF

Not really though, at least by the P99 definition of classic ("up to but not including Luclin").

Remember, Velious lasted only one year on live. Just to get a enough of your guild keyed to get into ST tooks many months. To then get enough more keyed, and figure out your tactics for how to kill all the warders, took even longer. The absolute very first guild to ever wake the Sleeper did so past the halfway point of Velious, and it took everyone else longer than that.

This means that every server on live spent more time in Velious with the Sleeper than without her. Some servers hadn't even woken the sleeper by the time Luclin came out! On them there literally wasn't a single classic second spent without the Sleeper.

So if P99 was really emulating "how live was", the pre-wakening era should have been at least half the server's time in Velious. No one knows when Blue will end, but we've had what three years so far? Even if you give a pessimistic answer of only a few more years, we still should have had the Sleeper era for way longer.

But, again, the case for bringing back the Sleeper (or at least the pre-wakening era) is only going to get louder louder here over time. If Rogean and Nilbog won't do it now, wait and see what they say in ten years.

[loramin]

P.S. If the devs were really classic they wouldn't have even started coding Sleeper until maybe now ... but they wouldn't tell us that, they'd just let TMO put in all the effort to clear all four warders, only to find bugged code :)

[branamil]

Velious with Warders is more classic than Velious without Warders. Server is gimped

[derpcake2]

Not really though, at least by the P99 definition of classic ("up to but not including Luclin").

Remember, Velious lasted only one year on live. Just to get a enough of your guild keyed to get into ST tooks many months. To then get enough more keyed, and figure out your tactics for how to kill all the warders, took even longer. The absolute very first guild to ever wake the Sleeper did so past the halfway point of Velious, and it took everyone else longer than that.

This means that every server on live spent more time in Velious with the Sleeper than without her. Some servers hadn't even woken the sleeper by the time Luclin came out! On them there literally wasn't a single classic second spent without the Sleeper.

So if P99 was really emulating "how live was", the pre-wakening era should have been at least half the server's time in Velious. No one knows when Blue will end, but we've had what three years so far? Even if you give a pessimistic answer of only a few more years, we still should have had the Sleeper era for way longer.

But, again, the case for bringing back the Sleeper (or at least the pre-wakening era) is only going to get louder louder here over time. If Rogean and Nilbog won't do it now, wait and see what they say in ten years.

If p1999 was classic people like you would be unemployed stay at home sons.

Oh wait.

[fuckshit22]

If p1999 was classic people like you would be unemployed stay at home sons.

Oh wait.

This is the only category of people fit to wake the sleeper...so what?

[Lewkeng]

Seriously, we came here to re-live the dream of EQ. I thought that was the whole point. Not be screwed by top level players again who literally just want to screw people. The GM's mess with Leash, agro, range, sit casting, ToV mobs rooted, Vender recharge (if your on red).

WHAT IS THE LOGICAL REASON FOR LEAVING THE SLEEPER DEAD? other than to be JUST AS MUCH A TROLL AS THE PEOPLE THAT WOKE IT?

Classic.

[Ripqozko]

Sorry you lack warder loot, try green.

[Jimjam]

As attested by Loramin, most servers had woken Sleeper before Luclin. In that regard the state of Blue having had the sleeper being woken is classic, if you don't get tied up in 'percentage of server life with sleeper sleeping/awoke'.

The only real argument on blue for resleeping the sleeper is to allow further testing and troubleshooting of the warder encounters and wakened sleeper rampage in preparedness for green.

[loramin]

As attested by Loramin, most servers had woken Sleeper before Luclin.

Ummm ... I didn't attest that ... and what I did attest was that the Sleeper remained un-woken for far longer on live than it did here:

Not really though, at least by the P99 definition of classic ("up to but not including Luclin").

Remember, Velious lasted only one year on live. Just to get a enough of your guild keyed to get into ST tooks many months. To then get enough more keyed, and figure out your tactics for how to kill all the warders, took even longer. The absolute very first guild to ever wake the Sleeper did so past the halfway point of Velious, and it took everyone else longer than that.

This means that every server on live spent more time in Velious with the Sleeper than without her. Some servers hadn't even woken the sleeper by the time Luclin came out! On them there literally wasn't a single classic second spent without the Sleeper.

So if P99 was really emulating "how live was", the pre-wakening era should have been at least half the server's time in Velious. No one knows when Blue will end, but we've had what three years so far? Even if you give a pessimistic answer of only a few more years, we still should have had the Sleeper era for way longer.

But, again, the case for bringing back the Sleeper (or at least the pre-wakening era) is only going to get louder louder here over time. If Rogean and Nilbog won't do it now, wait and see what they say in ten years.

Nothing in there said:

most servers had woken Sleeper before Luclin

I honestly don't know if that's true or not, so I certainly wouldn't attest it one way or the other!

[Jimjam]

Apologies; please amend my post to 'many (or some?) servers had woken the sleeper before luclin' if 'most' was incorrect. I just wanted to cite, as you say Sleeper did get woken in classic velious. Even if not on all servers.

Point being, best argument to reset the warders is to test them properly ready for green. In my opinion.

Resetting the sleeper wasn't classic.

Except on Tallon Zek?

[tylercanuck]

The Sleeper would have been reset had Braknar made a stink about it.

[loramin]

Apologies; please amend my post to 'many (or some?) servers had woken the sleeper before luclin' if 'most' was incorrect. I just wanted to cite, as you say Sleeper did get woken in classic velious. Even if not on all servers.

Point being, best argument to reset the warders is to test them properly ready for green. In my opinion.

Resetting the sleeper wasn't classic.

Except on Tallon Zek?

I mean you're right: resetting the sleeper wouldn't be classic. But as I said, having it killed so soon after Velious's release also wasn't classic. And not having the Sleeper (or the pre-Sleeper version of Velious) for multiple year of Velious is also not classic.

At the end of the day, Blue is just not classic (in lots of ways (http://wiki.project1999.com/Non-Classic_Compendium), not just the Sleeper). So really it's entirely up to R&N what they want to do, because any decision will be unclassic in some way regardless. All I'm certain of is that they won't make P99 go for another ten years without a chance to see pre-waking Velious, because the goal of the project is to let people re-experience classic EQ, and "pre-waking Velious" is one era of it.

However, when I said before that I think the devs will respawn the Sleeper on Blue someday, I wasn't considering Green. Green will likely "takes the pressure off", and let people re-experience that era of EQ, so on Blue the Sleeper may very well stay dead forever.

And who knows, with custom content coming pre-waking ST loot might not even be desired in the future.

[Tenderizer]

You can try to kill the sleeper every 3 years before your characters are transferred to blue from green

this transferring from green to blue idea cant seriously still be a viable option people believe can it?

[Swish2]

this transferring from green to blue idea cant seriously still be a viable option people believe can it?

Green gets rolled into blue with every reset.

Imagine the horror in the EC tunnel when more potential manastones (etc) enter the market....better save TODAY to buy up the supply TOMORROW!!

Boutikasaurus or whoever is smart.

[aaezil]

1 sleeper wake per server = classic

/thread

[Jimjam]

1 sleeper wake per server = classic

/thread

Not on pvp; IIRC ST kept being reset cos the players kept trying to kill the sleeper and the CSR didn't know what to do about it :p!

[Dark_Magic]

They won't put the Sleeper back to bed for the same reason they rooted ToV dragons. I'll let you come up with your own adjectives for it.

[Lewkeng]

an angry guild awakening the sleeper so other guilds wont get warder loot was as classic as it gets

[Lewkeng]

wasnt the sleeper only reset on 1 server? and that was bc they almost killed it usen a exploit under the bridge?

[NegaStoat]

Level a character from 1 to 60 entirely in Erud's Crossing. Do not even turn in your starting guild note - have every single piece of experience come from Erud's Crossing alone. At level 60, petition to have your character reviewed and politely ask that the Sleeper be respawned as a reward for your noble sacrifice.

Disclaimer - They might actually do it, but only for a 24 hour lifespan.

[Mead]

I heard GMs are really feeling the pressure

Except warder loot to be available real soon