Suspensions and bans

[Itchybottom]

Why is it that someone gets punished, the community here instantly assumes the player is guilty and begins to berate them?

Another more curious thing is how these people being banned, often supported the "throw him to the lions" methodology, for others' being banned, then go to declare how bad this community is; after the role reversal has taken place.

Is this just a good example of herd behavior, or is there something else at work here that makes this community so consummately cantankerous?

[William_Munny15]

wait...what?

[Lucrio40]

Because to question a GM decision is to get punished as well, so it just became the default response.

[Itchybottom]

Because to question a GM decision is to get punished as well, so it just became the default response.

So what you're saying is... Welcome to the virtual third world country?

[Trimm]

Why is it that someone gets punished, the community here instantly assumes the player is guilty and begins to berate them?

Because the GMs don't ban people on this server for no reason. They have a mountain of logs and server-side tracking tools to investigate each case. If a GM deems something is a bannable offense, chances are it is.

[mitic]

cool down itchy, everything is fine as long as rogean runs P99

[Hasbinbad]

cool down itchy, everything is fine as long as rogean runs P99
i choked on my beer

[Rahnza]

Because the GMs don't ban people on this server for no reason. They have a mountain of logs and server-side tracking tools to investigate each case. If a GM deems something is a bannable offense, chances are it is.

I was presented with logs that had nothing to do with the reason stated for my being banned. When I brought up facts that countered my ban, I was ignored / my thread deleted.

GMs will definately ban/suspend at their will. The project is ran like some sort of corrupt dictatorship out of the dark ages, which is sad because the spirit of the project / server is good.

[KilyenaMage]

A wild White Knight appears!!!!!!

[Itchybottom]

Because the GMs don't ban people on this server for no reason. They have a mountain of logs and server-side tracking tools to investigate each case. If a GM deems something is a bannable offense, chances are it is.

Warp detection for example has quite a few false positives, and there really isn't any type of detection method you can use for "boxing" that is reliable. You have to eye it and guess.

Example: I went to the trouble of writing an MQ2 plug-in that predicted movement on ProjectEQ, and told me which plug-in the user was using to follow their master. But if someone were to adjust the responsiveness or waypoint system used by their plug-in, my plug-in was made unreliable. Same goes for detection methods of common botting scripts, or behavior. Any deviation, and the detection is false, server side or not.

As far as a GM investigating in person, that's also difficult to determine if someone is boxing, or not. It's as I said, a guess at best. I could throw together automation that would fool a "Do this synchronized" test, but I don't think I could find a way to fool a test that pertains to the environment in game, e.g. "What am I standing by?" But you're right, in most cases, chances are... there is a reason for the ban, and it's probably witch hunting. It doesn't mean the entire server has to eat that person for lunch to prove some type of social patriotism. Moo.

cool down itchy, everything is fine as long as rogean runs P99

Wait what, I thought Richardo was running p99?! I think we've lost some Focus here.

[Rahnza]

Warp detection for example has quite a few false positives

Combine this with devs not really understanding how their own (emulated hehe) game works, and yeah, bad times for the playerbase. For example, I was presented with logs of two things for my ban: using a MacroQuest command to succor myself in Lower Guk and using MacroQuest to /target mobs in Kedge. Now, the most important fact is that I wasn't using MacroQuest, but even if you didn't believe that (and I of course have no proof), there were huge problems with the accusation. First of all, I died in Guk, and it wouldn't make sense to die if I just had some magical /succor ability. Second of all, it was over Christmas vacation and as I was on shared internet at the time, I was having horrendous lag issues. This wasn't even the first time I experienced this bug; die in a zone you're bound in with really high latency, and you'll respawn at random locations instead of your bind: succor, 0,0, etc. A bug that I had found, reported, and yet I was banned for it.

The Kedge thing was even more ridiculous. Everyone knew that Kedge was super buggy, apparently besides Rogean. When asked why I would only be loading MQ to /target in Kedge, a zone I only spent time in occasionally to beeline for a Phinny kill and gtfo, Rogean had no response. When asked to present me with logs of other people who had been in Kedge to see if they also had a lot of reported MQ /targeting, Rogean had no response.

So according to Rogean, my only uses of MacroQuest over several months was to /target random hammerheads and shit in Kedge for absolutely no reason, and to /succor once and only once in Lower Guk, after I had died, which would require a MQ plugin I've never even heard of.

As Judge Judy says, if it doesn't make sense, it's horse shit. But unfortunately we don't have Judge Judy on the staff.

[Itchybottom]

Combine this with devs not really understanding how their own (emulated hehe) game works, and yeah, bad times for the playerbase.

It's really not even emulated (such a dumb name choice with how far it's come), it's an codependent game of it's own. I get your point, though.


So according to Rogean, my only uses of MacroQuest over several months was to /target random hammerheads and shit in Kedge for absolutely no reason, and to /succor once and only once in Lower Guk, after I had died, which would require a MQ plugin I've never even heard of.

I wasn't trying to be specific about the bans placed in this thread, I'm more or less trying to figure out the community side of things. Over several months though, sounds a little dubious and weighing towards Rogean's side. A few dozen hackerslog entries can be chalked up to mistakes, but a few months worth of positives is starting to sound like a reasonable ban. I don't know the situation.

As Judge Judy says, if it doesn't make sense, it's horse shit. But unfortunately we don't have Judge Judy on the staff.

Give Tralina a few years!

[Rogean]

@ Rahnza

Yet another person posting under an anonymous name (I found not a single post in the petition forum under it) complaining about their ban providing details about something that never happened. Don't be a Reiker.

I can tell you right now, the reasons you gave for your ban are things we never ban for based on alone. When I ban someone for macroquest, we're pretty damn sure you were using it, more than just some warp and targetting logs. We also don't tell players what those reasons are.. we wouldn't be very good at stopping macroquest if we told everyone the things we caught them doing would we? They would simply tell their friends not to use those features, or change them to be undetectable.

We also have a way of detecting all versions of macroquest using a specific test that is only run once in a while on high levels (mostly during raids). Being banned at level 50 with raid gear gets the point across more than being banned at level 20.

The proof we have that we don't disclose even to bannee's are foolproof server flags, if you were caught, you were using it.

Don't use it imo.

[WorldofWarcraft]

I raged out when I got suspended, and fucked over on a spawn.

Here's what this shit community had to say:

"U mad bro?"

Apparently people think its "hip" to suck ass to the GM's and amongst certain guilds. I think it makes all you people look like a bunch of weak, cock suckers.

I posted this before, because it made complete sense in my head. This is a representation of how this server acts.

http://img573.imageshack.us/img573/7110/orgyphoto1.jpg

Honestly they keep talking shit about EQC and how its heavily moderated and the GMs are going to be too strict....

we already have that here, in my opinion. GM's are too buddy buddy with the "popular people".

Bored.

[Ronas]

Don't be a Reiker.
WTF is reiker?

[Rahnza]

@ Rahnza

Yet another person posting under an anonymous name (I found not a single post in the petition forum under it) complaining about their ban providing details about something that never happened. Don't be a Reiker.

I can tell you right now, the reasons you gave for your ban are things we never ban for based on alone. When I ban someone for macroquest, we're pretty damn sure you were using it, more than just some warp and targetting logs. We also don't tell players what those reasons are.. we wouldn't be very good at stopping macroquest if we told everyone the things we caught them doing would we? They would simply tell their friends not to use those features, or change them to be undetectable.

We also have a way of detecting all versions of macroquest using a specific test that is only run once in a while on high levels (mostly during raids). Being banned at level 50 with raid gear gets the point across more than being banned at level 20.

The proof we have that we don't disclose even to bannee's are foolproof server flags, if you were caught, you were using it.

Don't use it imo.

a) I wouldn't be posting from an "anonymous" account if Uthgaard hadn't forum-banned me for calling him out on fascistly deleting my posts. b) I've stated about a bazillion times that I'm Reiker, if you couldn't tell by the signature. c) No fucking clue what "complaining about their ban providing details about something that never happened. Don't be a Reiker." is supposed to mean. What about what I posted didn't happen? It's funny that you say that, and then go on and on about stuff that never happened in the case of my ban (100% guaranteed you never ran any MQ check on me, or you did and I passed and you felt like banning me anyways).

Basically, all the dumb stuff you typed in that first paragraph just turns the rest into blah blah blah.

[Rahnza]

WTF is reiker?

Reiker is a 30 watt fluorescent bulb. Reiker is a former freelance writer. Reiker is not skilled in the craft of writing. Reiker is also Teacher of the Year at Apopka High School. Reiker is affiliated with 2 hospitals. Reiker is a remote controlled space heater in the winter. Reiker is rated "EXCELLENT" in the following areas:

duh.

[Rogean]

LOL Rahnza == Reiker?

Wow enough said.

[Uthgaard]

If you dont like the server or how it's being run, Itchy, you don't have to come here. You've been lurking on the forums doing a total of two things. Looking for opportunities to share your wiki-genius, and watching for reasons to try to raise questions about how things are handled here.

We actually put time into making sure shit gets done right, and the strangely common assumption that PEQ db/source/tools are anything even remotely similar to this server is about as false as false can be.

If all people can do is bitch about the damned server, locking the shit down and developing it in private is sounding better by the day.