Shadows of Luclin server

[jcr4990]

you should keep harping on this, it gives the impression you are really listening to people who don't share your opinionI listened. I just don't think your argument has much/any merit. It's not personal.

[thufir]

I listened. I just don't think your argument has much/any merit. It's not personal.

you don't have to believe it has merit, but setting up strawmen to knock down certainly indicates you don't really care what anyone else says against it. which is probably true, right? so continue if you'd like

[wormed]

you don't have to believe it has merit, but setting up strawmen to knock down certainly indicates you don't really care what anyone else says against it. which is probably true, right? so continue if you'd like

But speaking for the majority of players and saying they all want/appreciate the interaction between porter and player is also pretty asinine.

Truth is there's a large contingent of players that want Luclin/PoP. However, the other truth is that P99 isn't going to Luclin and beyond which makes this whole thread pretty dumb. I'm surprised it's gotten this big.

[Psionide]

Yeah, but that is one of the few dynamics in EQ, a completely player driven aspect of the economy, why would you want to take that out?

[snead]

haha ok i was browsing the web this morning and came across this gem.. so I found another (classic) pic similar to it. It is how you can tell the difference between "classic" and "not classic"..

Classic:

http://i.imgur.com/5UxtfD7.jpg

Not Classic:

http://i.imgur.com/0B51WIc.jpg

hehe welp there u go~ :)

there's shadows on that human. not classic at all. therefore both pictures are not classic.

[thufir]

But speaking for the majority of players and saying they all want/appreciate the interaction between porter and player is also pretty asinine.

Agreed, but that's not what was being said. A lot of people find the process of finding ports irritating, I get that. I found it irritating on Live myself; I played a wizard and loathed being bothered for ports. PoK books were one of the best things that happened to me. (Which doesn't mean I want to see them here.)

Truth is there's a large contingent of players that want Luclin/PoP. However, the other truth is that P99 isn't going to Luclin and beyond which makes this whole thread pretty dumb. I'm surprised it's gotten this big.
yeah, agreed

[AzzarTheGod]

Its possible that it is only a vocal minority who believe there is something cool and meaningful in the find a teleport interaction.

Also should be noted, there is no book for Velious outside of Great Divide. Enjoy running.

[jcr4990]

Its possible that it is only a vocal minority who believe there is something cool and meaningful in the find a teleport interaction.

Also should be noted, there is no book for Velious outside of Great Divide. Enjoy running.Another reason I find the outrage over PoK books to be silly. There were a lot of times that porting was still way faster to get to certain places. Karanas? You're running from Qeynos if u take the book. Velious is another example GD is the only spot. Trying to get to ToV? Enjoy your 40 minute run.

[iruinedyourday]

howbout no

http://i.imgur.com/ZSME4TF.png

[AzzarTheGod]

howbout no




How about we're doing Luclin/PoP custom on another server that has nothing to do with your 50 guildmates on red.

This irrational need to influence and affect content development that has absolutely nothing to do with you is remarkable.

Maybe you missed the thread title? Yeah it says Luclin Server. Key word server. So what is your dissent based on? That the server wouldn't be successful? Its page 27, we went over that and you refuted none of the points raised.

Keep posting away though buddy.

[iruinedyourday]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI2ZcnhlqCY

[AzzarTheGod]

Take your shirt off IRYD were gonna get buff and in shape again with Luclin.

eughhhhh /flex

[iruinedyourday]

Take your shirt off IRYD were gonna get buff and in shape again with Luclin.

eughhhhh /flex

lol no i like my fragile classic flat chest

[Tann]

How about we're doing Luclin/PoP custom on another server that has nothing to do with your 50 guildmates on red.

yep, TAKP and p2002

not P99 <3

[Haynar]

yep, TAKP and p2002

not P99 <3
Can we vote where to send specific people?

[AzzarTheGod]

The people can get what they want, right here at home on the P99 brand.

[Choking Victim]

What happens when Velious has been sucked dry? I hope the devs can come up with some awesome custom content.

[Psionide]

What happens when Velious has been sucked dry? I hope the devs can come up with some awesome custom content.

We had 5 years of Kunark with no lack of players and guild drama bullshit raiding the same mobs over and over for 5 years. Don't underestimate the neckbeardness of the players on this server.

[Arclyte]

Another reason I find the outrage over PoK books to be silly. There were a lot of times that porting was still way faster to get to certain places. Karanas? You're running from Qeynos if u take the book. Velious is another example GD is the only spot. Trying to get to ToV? Enjoy your 40 minute run.

teleport spells are part of why people make druids and wizards


strong utility spells like ports makes the player feel needed and wanted
poor players use it to make money
as an old player, you may have already traveled the world, but newer players havent. Instant and free pok books takes away all traveling and everything that comes with it (exploring an unkown zone, coming across a rare mob, running into a sand giant etc)


How would you like it if the game took a major part of your class design and just gave it to everyone for free? Maybe we should have slow wands on a vendor in every city, because getting a shaman to do it for me is too much of a hassle.

PoK made the game feel cheaper and began the long and shit-strewn walk down the path of making the game easier. Fuck PoK. Fuck Luclin.

[iruinedyourday]

teleport spells are part of why people make druids and wizards


strong utility spells like ports makes the player feel needed and wanted
poor players use it to make money
as an old player, you may have already traveled the world, but newer players havent. Instant and free pok books takes away all traveling and everything that comes with it (exploring an unkown zone, coming across a rare mob, running into a sand giant etc)


How would you like it if the game took a major part of your class design and just gave it to everyone for free? Maybe we should have slow wands on a vendor in every city, because getting a shaman to do it for me is too much of a hassle.

PoK made the game feel cheaper and began the long and shit-strewn walk down the path of making the game easier. Fuck PoK. Fuck Luclin.

As the game grew, there was a decision at SOE to focus on endgame, rather than pre 40's content. This made all the stuff you love, that most of us love, like hailing NPC's in the karanas and chasing Bark Shield drops, traveling through east krana just to get to high hold, all of that became less of the focus for the expanded content.

So yea all the stuff added in luclin and on, specifically was designed to reduce the pre 40's game play and focus on end game raiding, something SOE decided its playerbase was focused on anyway.

So for us old timers that love vanilla, it means we like kunark a little (cus it was an across the board expansion, low and high level quest & content). Velious, was the first to focus more on the high level content, however it did still have that "Brad" required pre 40's content as well.. You'll notice it rapidly dropped off after luclin and the focus is put on end game content.

Say what you will about what is 'right' for eq.. classic is when every zone mattered, not just 1/8th of them ;)

[Daywolf]

teleport spells are part of why people make druids and wizards


strong utility spells like ports makes the player feel needed and wanted
poor players use it to make money
as an old player, you may have already traveled the world, but newer players havent. Instant and free pok books takes away all traveling and everything that comes with it (exploring an unkown zone, coming across a rare mob, running into a sand giant etc)


How would you like it if the game took a major part of your class design and just gave it to everyone for free? Maybe we should have slow wands on a vendor in every city, because getting a shaman to do it for me is too much of a hassle.

PoK made the game feel cheaper and began the long and shit-strewn walk down the path of making the game easier. Fuck PoK. Fuck Luclin.
Yeah pretty much, though not why all play them. Personally, I don't really care for porting people around. Though I really do like having the ability to leave an overpopulated area for a better one at the time, even though my character may not be as good at certain aspects of combat than say a shammy or necro but w/o the ability to port. It's just a trade-off.

Part of the big problem with more modern EQ is it started all going homogeneous. It became more casual and with the blurred definitions of classes. Yeah with porting, but then with C from Enc's but to rather just get that super buff (forget the name now) that lasts a long time. Then heck, why not those followers too? I left live before then and went to the emu but they give heals etc. Then you could buy haste off a vendor, or C or whatever.

It was a gradual slide, PoK books were just a part of it all. As long as it's someone else getting screwed than it's ok. But eventually everyone gets screwed.

[AzzarTheGod]

Yeah pretty much, though not why all play them. Personally, I don't really care for porting people around. Though I really do like having the ability to leave an overpopulated area for a better one at the time, even though my character may not be as good at certain aspects of combat than say a shammy or necro but w/o the ability to port. It's just a trade-off.

Part of the big problem with more modern EQ is it started all going homogeneous. It became more casual and with the blurred definitions of classes. Yeah with porting, but then with C from Enc's but to rather just get that super buff (forget the name now) that lasts a long time. Then heck, why not those followers too? I left live before then and went to the emu but they give heals etc. Then you could buy haste off a vendor, or C or whatever.


Lets not pretend this has anything to do with Luclin or Planes. Good straw tho.

[AzzarTheGod]

Class balance wasn't really achieved until Luclin /Planes, or at least the closest the classes came to being balanced raid reward wise.

[Evia]

Velious gave druids Nature's Touch turning them into somewhat viable healers at endgame. This is the beginning of the end of EQ. Making everything easier and homogenizing all the classes. It's a slippery slope guys. Let's just go back to Kunark.

Nice try. fail post. nobody seeking healing from druids end game people still search for clerics. While I get the point you're trying to make it's not working with the example you're giving. Torpor and shammies would have been a little closer to the mark. Still though, Cleric healing is still elite. Although I CAN skip a cleric on some groups if we have a torpor shaman in grp. So I'd give you that one, maybe.

[AzzarTheGod]

Nice try. fail post. nobody seeking healing from druids end game people still search for clerics. While I get the point you're trying to make it's not working with the example you're giving. Torpor and shammies would have been a little closer to the mark. Still though, Cleric healing is still elite. Although I CAN skip a cleric on some groups if we have a torpor shaman in grp. So I'd give you that one, maybe.

This.

Nobody will EVER, EVER use a druid healer. EVER. It used the same as a Paladin, meaning you require a 2nd healer in the group if you take on a druid.

None of these points are valid Evia, the classes remain very well defined for the next several expansions well through Omens of War.

He is derailing, and most certainly a part of the vocal minority that has irrational nerd-hate for Luclin-- based on what they "heard". "I heard this. I heard that.".

You heard wrong. Many of us actually played this game in classic through Luclin intensively. What an insult.

[thufir]

He is derailing, and most certainly a part of the vocal minority that has irrational nerd-hate for Luclin

There is no way I would go forward with Luclin and beyond. (cat people and aliens? really. It went from a fantasy setting to 1990s scifi.)
keep insulting nilbog pls, this is fascinating

[Tann]

keep insulting nilbog pls, this is fascinating

it was fascinating at first, Azz is getting way more obvious now though.

http://i.imgur.com/O8YVx.jpg

[AzzarTheGod]

keep insulting nilbog pls, this is fascinating

I think it is you that is insulting nilbog by digging up old stuff from several years ago that he no longer stands behind in an attempt to make this some kind of personal argument.

You are also off topic. There goes that vocal minority again.

[thufir]

You are insulting nilbog by digging up old stuff from several years ago that he no longer stands behind.

You are also off topic. There goes that vocal minority again.

nonsense, he still doesn't like it, nothing you have posted disproves that

you posted some vague things wording that he may be open to possibly overseeing development if he can find some dudes who actually want to work on it

in all cases it hasn't been shown that nilbog personally feels that luclin was anything but drek

but please, go on and call anyone who disliked it consumed with irrational nerd-hate(tm)

[AzzarTheGod]

but please, go on and call anyone who disliked it consumed with irrational nerd-hate(tm)

Just the ones making disingenuous contributions to this thread. Druid heals in Velious ruined Clerics role?

The irrational hate is real. Are we supposed to just laugh at you? I haven't figured it out yet.

And none of this changes the fact that you are still off-topic with nilbog's name in your mouth.

[Tann]

http://i.imgur.com/SozIWQ2.jpg

[Speedi]

This.

Nobody will EVER, EVER use a druid healer. EVER. It used the same as a Paladin, meaning you require a 2nd healer in the group if you take on a druid.

None of these points are valid Evia, the classes remain very well defined for the next several expansions well through Omens of War.

He is derailing, and most certainly a part of the vocal minority that has irrational nerd-hate for Luclin-- based on what they "heard". "I heard this. I heard that.".

You heard wrong. Many of us actually played this game in classic through Luclin intensively. What an insult.

Lol when I read this. Really?

I have many examples, but I will use this one because the amount of AE damage going out.

Several times I was the only healer in a all rogue group on many a fast engage Zlandicar. Only time I had someone die was when they forgot to turn walk on and got feared out of range of heals. Then aggro'd rats.

As for grouping it's even easier. You must of grouped with some bad Druids to come to those conclusions.

In Kunark, yea Druids heals wasn't so hot. But now, they can hold their own pretty well

[thufir]

Just the ones making disingenuous contributions to this thread. Druid heals in Velious ruined Clerics role?

The irrational hate is real. Are we supposed to just laugh at you? I haven't figured it out yet.

And none of this changes the fact that you are still off-topic with nilbog's name in your mouth.

please continue, we all find this super fascinating

I personally love how you have convinced yourself you are not insulting every dev on the box every time you open up your mouth about how everyone who hates luclin is irrational

moar pls

[Tann]

Please move to RNF, random new forum members might think:

A) Azzar isn't trolling
B) Luclin is happening

[AzzarTheGod]

Lol when I read this. Really?

I have many examples, but I will use this one because the amount of AE damage going out.

Several times I was the only healer in a all rogue group on many a fast engage Zlandicar. Only time I had someone die was when they forgot to turn walk on and got feared out of range of heals. Then aggro'd rats.

As for grouping it's even easier. You must of grouped with some bad Druids to come to those conclusions.

In Kunark, yea Druids heals wasn't so hot. But now, they can hold their own pretty well

Druids becoming viable in small groups was an improvement to the overall quality of the game, and that was the whole point of the change.

Nature's Touch didn't encroach on Clerics raid defining role.

Druids becoming great patch healers didn't replace Clerics in their primary raid-defining role. And druids still get cooked by Clerics in all areas of healing, yes, even patch healing.

Druids got a buff, and the server gained a net Quality of Life change without taking anything away from Clerics being THE best healers hands down. This is the meaningful class balance that Luclin/Planes brings to the table.

Please raise more examples, as this isn't really the "game-breaking" stuff Thann and thufir were talking about, no?

Discussion ongoing despite trolls attempts to take the thread off topic.

[Tann]

Please raise more examples, as this isn't really the "game-breaking" stuff Thann and thufir were talking about, no?

I was talking about game breaking stuff? Captain Crackers needs to take his meds

move to RNF quick before his mental state collapses further!

[AzzarTheGod]

That one went over your head.

Still on topic.

[Tann]

Still haven't had my meds.

FTFY

[AzzarTheGod]

FTFY

Gloves off. Hit the deck kid.

[Tann]

http://i.imgur.com/e69n7Hj.jpg

[AzzarTheGod]

Trolls might have won this round. But that isn't saying much as the mods would rather RNF than delete off topic posts and issue warnings for flames to keep threads on target. I would do it exactly the same way.

But the fact is you can't change the hundreds of votes, across three separate polls.

Keep working Tann. You got a long road ahead of you to change the minds of the masses.

[Tann]

my work is done

Project 1999 Classic Everquest - 1
Azzar and the 5 others who want Luclin - 0

[Hastley]

my work is done

Project 1999 Classic Everquest - 1
Azzar and the 5 others who want Luclin - 0

Such a successful life you lead

[iruinedyourday]

druids on blue:

http://i.imgur.com/FYznBB5.gif

Druids on red:

http://i.imgur.com/S2dru9T.gif

[Daywolf]

or just auto-move any thread topic to RnF containing the word Luclin.
or auto-delete :p

[Psionide]

I like EQ being unbalanced, its one of the things that makes EQ EQ and not like every other MMO. I do like certain aspects of Luclin and PoP and wouldn't be against another server doing it. But I have a hard time getting past certain negatives like Paludal Caverns or PoK. The bazaar was kind of cool in its own way and it would be cool to experience that again but it doesn't beat EC tunnel. The fact we have a populated EC tunnel in 2016 is one of the greatest things in gaming today imo.

[Haynar]

TL;DR

So when is Luclin coming? Devs have confirmed, right?

Confirmed. Not here on p99 though.

We were discussing plans how to get nexus going last night. And working on logging for the bazaar. Luclin development has begun!

H

[coldslaw]

All you've made so far is vague statements without any proof. You demand proof for statements that do not line up to your opinions and then call them irrelevant or outdated when they are provided.

The vision for the server was stated as far back as 2010 and, unless you can provide evidence to the contrary, that vision has not changed.

TL;DR

So when is Luclin coming? Devs have confirmed, right?

Already here!

They actually started two new progression servers that will go up to luclin/pop!!

http://www.takproject.net/
http://p2002.com/

See you there!

[maerilith]

@ ^ above servers, boxing :( and low pop

[coldslaw]

@ ^ above servers, boxing :( and low pop

You realize if they put a P99 - Luclin Server up on the list it would be low pop as well. I think a lot of people are envisioning a Luclin server with the current P99 population, which just would not be a reality.

I mean do you really want a Luclin or PoP server with 50-100 people scattered all over, or concentrated at max level? What are new players suppose to do in empty zones when the initial rush of people that want the server are all max level with not much reason to reroll because there is still stuff to do? If you dont have people rerolling and new players coming in, what do you think will happen **cough ** look at red99 **cough**

There will never, never ever, be a >= Luclin server with a population like that of P99 or even close. And I mean anywhere, not just here. I understand there may be 100-200 people that REALLY want it to happen, but most of us are here because it's NOT Luclin/PoP.

[DevGrousis]

Coleslaw, you are making an awful lot of assumptions. If I remember correctly, the population of Everquest in during SoL than during RoK of SoV. So there's no basis that the population would be lower, like in red. There were less pvp players on eqlive, so that makes sense for the server here to be lower pop. I think that based on the fact that the people who post on the forum, we draw a consensus of the entire servers opinion. But the casuals don't post on the forum, and I bet for every 10 players online, MAYBE 1 is posting on the forums.

IMO, a luclin server would be populous and would decimate blues healthy population, which is the biggest reason not to do

[DevGrousis]

^population was higher during SoL than during RoK and SoL***

[coldslaw]

Coleslaw, you are making an awful lot of assumptions. If I remember correctly, the population of Everquest in during SoL than during RoK of SoV. So there's no basis that the population would be lower, like in red. There were less pvp players on eqlive, so that makes sense for the server here to be lower pop. I think that based on the fact that the people who post on the forum, we draw a consensus of the entire servers opinion. But the casuals don't post on the forum, and I bet for every 10 players online, MAYBE 1 is posting on the forums.

IMO, a luclin server would be populous and would decimate blues healthy population, which is the biggest reason not to do

If you just say that the population was greater during SoL and PoP, it makes it sound these drove the population rise and were the most popular. If you actually look at the numbers the subscriptions basically flat-lined starting with SoL. The biggest jump was actually GoD which was then followed by a massive crash which correlates to the WoW release.

So no, i don't think that two expansions that saw a 6% increase in population to be as popular as you try to make them sound.

[Speedi]

I liked SoL.

I can remember the undead getting bugged in the grey, at the zone to Ssra temple. They would all sit there and never path back. Then when a guild wiped inside there would be a pile of corpses from people trying to zone back in! Was rather funny! Then they patched and fixed it. The grey wasn't as fun anymore.

I wonder how much RGC would sell for on here? It was a lot back in the day!

[AzzarTheGod]

Coleslaw, you are making an awful lot of assumptions. If I remember correctly, the population of Everquest in during SoL than during RoK of SoV. So there's no basis that the population would be lower, like in red. There were less pvp players on eqlive, so that makes sense for the server here to be lower pop. I think that based on the fact that the people who post on the forum, we draw a consensus of the entire servers opinion. But the casuals don't post on the forum, and I bet for every 10 players online, MAYBE 1 is posting on the forums.

IMO, a luclin server would be populous and would decimate blues healthy population, which is the biggest reason not to do

Great post.

[Daywolf]

Actually, growth stagnated with the release of Luclin in late 2001. 2005 EQ about fell off the chart. There is a sudden peak in 2004, but very likely people coming back from trying EQ2, then leaving EQ1 again after a re-try. Was pretty sad numbers post-lucin.
Here's the chart (http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png) - and these reported numbers, not guess work.

[AzzarTheGod]

Very explosive and aggressive rise all the way into Planes of Power.

WoW was a monster. We played the fuck out of Luclin/PoP then we dipped to WoW beta.

Facts.

[AzzarTheGod]

The death of Warhammer is incredible.

800k++ to zero'd out in 2 years.

[coldslaw]

The death of Warhammer is incredible.

800k++ to zero'd out in 2 years.

No doubt. Age of Conan had an impressive rise and crash in a matter of months.

For those interested, the rest of the charts can be found at http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/

[Daywolf]

Very explosive and aggressive rise all the way into Planes of Power.

WoW was a monster. We played the fuck out of Luclin/PoP then we dipped to WoW beta.

Facts.
what? From wikipedia:
The Shadows of Luclin 2001 December 4
The Planes of Power 2002 October 29

How do you figure aggressive to PoP?? That's a really odd comment, bro.
The increase in subs abruptly stops while all the pre-luclin hype is cast into the machine from SOE - just months before it's release.

http://i.imgur.com/1jh1gU6.jpg

I totally agree though that WoW did a lot of damage, to both EQ1&2 (I only played 4months of WoW years later, hated it, then was hacked too heh). Though that wasn't until end of 2004. That's a stagnate point in 2001 there, that never recovered. :o Luclin.

You might like it, and that's fine, but obviously most didn't, or subs would have kept growing. But... abruptly stopped. Then you figure the turnover numbers, which there would likely still be new players coming in, but old players leaving. That slight increase is very slight, still stagnating, especially considering turnover.

[AzzarTheGod]

How do you figure aggressive to PoP?? That's a really odd comment, bro.
The increase in subs abruptly stops while all the pre-luclin hype is cast into the machine from SOE - just months before it's release.


You aren't reading the graph the same way.

I'm taking into account re-subs and returns. Its open to interpretation.

[AzzarTheGod]

No doubt. Age of Conan had an impressive rise and crash in a matter of months.

For those interested, the rest of the charts can be found at http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/

I'd love to see TESO and SWTOR.

[Doctor Jeff]

Good news, I just got off the phone with my mom she said that Luclin is for sure coming to P99.

[Daywolf]

You aren't reading the graph the same way.
I'm reading it vertically.

[AzzarTheGod]

I'm reading it vertically.

I'm reading it diagonally.

[coldslaw]

http://i.imgur.com/VJBJ2HB.png

[Daywolf]

I'm reading it diagonally.
Ahh yeah I can see how that would change things with a little tilt to the graph. Marvelous idea! :D

But seriously though, I'm being objective here, it's not a good point with the release. Such a release should have spurred continued growth, regardless of the name of the game, but it didn't. There was a paradigm shift there that effected growth. You could apply it to any other game and come to the same conclusion. I've seen this happen to a number of games.

I held on through it, up until just after the platinum box release. I got into the emu when it was nearly unplayable pre-alpha just a little after platinum box release.

[maerilith]

I see another pattern in daywolfs linked chart. around 2003 - 2005 saw the launch of other know which really drove competetion hard and that competition rly accounts for the majority of lost subscribers.

sol + expansions didn't drive away share nearly as much as alternatives which catered to different themes and plays style, not to mention shinier pixel shading

[maerilith]

In fact it chart shows eq was able to maintain good consistent momentum in a heavily fluctuating and highly competitive market

sorry I don't have big econ words, just plebe swype to try n explain.

but u will see it if u haven't already

we aren't judjing eq itself when u look at a chart like that and u can't pretend the market forces aren't there

[Jaleth]

Can we vote where to send specific people?

Already downloaded and started on p2002, but dislike the lack of scroll wheel and forced windowed mode, hope TAKP has mouse scroll and full screen mode. Either way, started there because I miss the superior Luclin models, but still keep a home here for the "classic" feel.

[Pokesan]

Already downloaded and started on p2002, but dislike the lack of scroll wheel and forced windowed mode, hope TAKP has mouse scroll and full screen mode. Either way, started there because I miss the superior Luclin models, but still keep a home here for the "classic" feel.

p2002 server was created to troll TAKP devs, please do not actually play there.

[Haynar]

Already downloaded and started on p2002, but dislike the lack of scroll wheel and forced windowed mode, hope TAKP has mouse scroll and full screen mode. Either way, started there because I miss the superior Luclin models, but still keep a home here for the "classic" feel.
Adding support for mouse scroll wheel is easy. It was asked if it was a feature wanted. It was voted down.

Don't run EQW.exe, and run "eqgame.exe patchme" if u want full screen.

Make sure your UAC settings don't dim the screen on changes. Gamma changes crash it.

[Haynar]

p2002 server was created to troll TAKP devs, please do not actually play there.
And they were quite successful too.

If you rely on another project for the majority of your source code development, I recommend that you don't troll them for the lolz.

H

[Haynar]

That's ridiculous. I'd prolly be playing that server right now if it was implemented :/

.... shits not classic!!!

[Daywolf]

Lack of scroll wheel was basically 99% of the reason I deleted P2002 after playing it for an hour. I just couldn't deal with it.

Logitech trackman FTW. Has no scroll at all :D
But just what I game on, keeps the carpal tunnel syndrome down to a minimum. Good for shooters too.

[Baler]

Have you been Haynar'd today?

[burkemi5]

Lack of scroll wheel sucks at first but I got used to it within the first week of playing on p02. It's not that bad when you use f9 and remap the zoom and zoom out keys.

[maerilith]

Just bind it 3rd and 1st person camera key somewhere handy..... mouse scrolling is a crutch.... tbh I didn't have a wheel mouse till I could afford one in 2002 lol

[vilesid]

I'm playing on an EQEmu Luclin Server that uses the RoF2 client, which has scroll wheel and all the other goodies that go along with it.

We are currently in Luclin, and era appropriate as far as zone's go (No PoK yet, as that wont be implemented until PoP is released on the server).

SSRA Emporer has only been killed a few times, and we are just breaking into VexThall. Check it out!

Vegarlson Asylum (http://www.vegarlson-server.org/index.php?topic=165.0)

[Sodors Finest Poster]

Gordon is a tender engine who doesn't like shunting very much. He also has respect issues when it comes to co-operating with 'silly' little engines.

http://i.imgur.com/RwUHvhe.png

[kernal]

Been reading on the forums luclin will be coming out here in the next few years to come is this true? I sure hope so Everquest didnt even really get good until the luclin era.

[Uuruk]

Luclin will be releasing at the same time as discord

[easy_lee]

Unlikely. Rogean said no, and the short reason why is because of client difficulties. As I understand it, he'd basically have to code a lot of Luclin from scratch. Which wouldn't be fun.

So I doubt it.

[thufir]

http://i.imgur.com/VJBJ2HB.png

That's a pretty interesting chart. The rate of increase in subscribers notably flattened out at Luclin. All the way from release to Velious it was spiking rapidly, and then on the Luclin release the derivative goes way down.

Luclin was "good" at subscriber retention, and not good at attracting new subs, which sounds about right - totally catered to the people already neckbearding, but little to offer to newbies who were trying to get immersed in a fantasy world, and instead found cats on a moon.

[Baler]

http://i.imgur.com/VJBJ2HB.png

Velious is where the peak plateaus.
Depths of Darkhollow is where the population died. (But that may have been related to world of warcraft's growing popularity at that time)

I don't see luclin or pop causing a a increase of players/hype...

[Baler]

Been reading on the forums luclin will be coming out here in the next few years to come is this true? I sure hope so Everquest didnt even really get good until the luclin era.

Stop miss-leading people and spreading false information.

[Daywolf]

Luclin was "good" at subscriber retention, and not good at attracting new subs, which sounds about right - totally catered to the people already neckbearding, but little to offer to newbies who were trying to get immersed in a fantasy world, and instead found cats on a moon.
Well it doesn't really say what was going on there apart from the obvious stall. Were there new players coming into the game? I'm certain there were, it was still a good game for the most part and boxes on shelves to be bought. Were people leaving? Well if there were new players to the game, and I'm sure there were (though maybe less), and then the increase in accounts suddenly went stagnate, that would mean players were leaving as well. This is called "turnover", and it apparently began in the time just leading up to the Luclin release.

[miraclegrow2]

they will do what they want to do with their server

which includes keeping you completely in the dark until such things happen

enjoy !

[SamwiseRed]

luclin already in. just got my epic on my beastlord.

[AzzarTheGod]

luclin already in. just got my epic on my beastlord.

Lets do it.

[jcr4990]

luclin already in. just got my epic on my beastlord.
Paragon plz

Or whatever that dumb Beastlord buff was

[Arclyte]

http://i.imgur.com/VJBJ2HB.png

wow launched in 2004, what the hell happened in EQ at the start of 2006 that killed the game like that?

[Daywolf]

wow launched in 2004, what the hell happened in EQ at the start of 2006 that killed the game like that?
This (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlaBsZlSnqg) :D

[Daywolf]

Oh and you can compare the charts which is pretty obvious:
http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png
http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png

1. wasn't instant
2. takes time for discount long-term subs to go inactive

Me, I had the SOE all access thing, I didn't officially unsub until SWG:NGE was released about that time, though didn't go to WoW :P

[maerilith]

So both wow west and eq peeked at around ~600,000, ~500,000 respectively, I think were looking at more than market forces.

I think were also seeing a look at the actual life expectancy of an MMO and lifecycle. More obvious with the big subscription MMOs.

Personally I would discount the global wow #'s when comparing to EQ because... well chinese, and accurate reporting lol...... (wow east... )

[Kevynne]

http://i.imgur.com/VJBJ2HB.png

lold at who cares, made me giggle.
prophecy of ro ruined game based on graph.

graph also says GoD was best expac?

man i guess i am a minortiy when i say velious/kunark was best

[haytruck]

i loved raiding in velious and kunark but really enjoyed SoL and PoP too.

[Daywolf]

graph also says GoD was best expac?
More like that was just after EQ2 released. Active EQ players played it along with inactive players. Once everyone realized EQ2 was more or less trash, the inactive players tried out EQ1 again, but left :p

[maerilith]

GoD was the pinnacle of EQ. It was all down hill in challenge and poopsock from there.

[AzzarTheGod]

GoD was a hardcore raid expac. If you view it through that lens, its probably good if you are into that sort of thing.

[JurisDictum]

GoD was a hardcore raid expac. If you view it through that lens, its probably good if you are into that sort of thing.

It was popular on Sullon Zek, because the less dominate team (neutrals) were able to get gear just as good as the dominate team (evil) for the first time since the server started.

In the long run though... I think most EQ PvP players consider instancing terrible.

[coldslaw]

So both wow west and eq peeked at around ~600,000, ~500,000 respectively

Slight correction: WoW (west) peaked at 5.5m. The chart WoW is on is in millions, EQ chart is 100,000's

[Stormfists]

Proves only that there are a million reets for every normy.

[Dillian]

lold at who cares, made me giggle.
prophecy of ro ruined game based on graph.

graph also says GoD was best expac?

man i guess i am a minortiy when i say velious/kunark was best

im not sure where your looking but it looks to me like Omens of War was the best expansion. And it was a good expansion TBH

[maerilith]

Slight correction: WoW (west) peaked at 5.5m. The chart WoW is on is in millions, EQ chart is 100,000's

Oh thanks, it's ok i'd rather look like an idiot than be 'right' so yeah nvm my thoughts in this thread are not really valid then.

[jcr4990]

im not sure where your looking but it looks to me like Omens of War was the best expansion. And it was a good expansion TBHI enjoyed the shit out of Omens of War. Anguish is still my all time favorite raid zone in EQ ever.

[maerilith]

I enjoyed the shit out of Omens of War. Anguish is still my all time favorite raid zone in EQ ever.

It was good (and fun!), but it was way easier and way less prestigious and elite feeling than GoD.

[jcr4990]

It was good (and fun!), but it was way easier and way less prestigious and elite feeling than GoD.I basically shit my pants the first time I saw the walls lift up and saw OMM standing there

[jcr4990]

For the plebs that didn't raid in OoW: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iK3JFUwnkg

Walls lift and reveal OMM at :17 sec closeup at :48

[maerilith]

OMM was very very kewl and well done :)

[Monty405]

Should be an Eq reboot in lieu of an Everquest next. keep the spirit if the game more / less classic with todays tech

[Sirban]

Release AAs only

[Kevynne]

im not sure where your looking but it looks to me like Omens of War was the best expansion. And it was a good expansion TBH

meant OoW* mb

[Hyperbase-1999]

I enjoyed luclin raids but didnt like the cats, nor AA but I can understand they made a lot of things better.

I miss the cleric hammers.

[blurrysticks]

I know this thread pretty much died but https://github.com/EQEmu/Server which is what I'm pretty sure p99 is based off of is implemented up to at least Underfoot. It's not like the Devs would have to reinvent the wheel to get Luclin implemented.

[Xaanka]

LUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERDLUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERD
LUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERDLUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERD
LUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERDLUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERD
LUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERDLUCLIN SUCKED, YOU STUPID NERD
http://i.imgur.com/jT6HdIj.gif

[maerilith]

oh hey stay frosty girl.

http://i.imgur.com/jT6HdIj.gif

[WolfsongReborn]

Release AAs only

That would be so great lol. Rangers could actually use bows, Mages would be less of a one trick pony. AA's were OP for some of the classes but in other cases made poorly balanced classes actually viable.

We won't see AA's here I don't think, but I think they'd definitely extend the life of the server as people worked on unlocking the various AA's.

[Troxx]

Release AAs only

[watbab]

OP is heartbrand on another account

[Kevynne]

OP is heartbrand on another account

[AzzarTheGod]

AA's were OP for some of the classes but in other cases made poorly balanced classes actually viable.

We won't see AA's here I don't think, but I think they'd definitely extend the life of the server as people worked on unlocking the various AA's.

Another vocal minority talking point.

"Luclin caused imbalances but it also balanced..." Give me 2 hard examples of Luclin AA's making anyone OP?

I feel you posted negatively based on your impression of a few gimmick parlor tricks that some classes received through AAs, which really amounted to fuckall.

[AzzarTheGod]

This was an amazing thread. I was just glossing back over it. I really took these autists to school over their biased, unfounded Luclin anxieties.

[Kevynne]

Another vocal minority talking point.

"Luclin caused imbalances but it also balanced..." Give me 2 hard examples of Luclin AA's making anyone OP?

I feel you posted negatively based on your impression of a few gimmick parlor tricks that some classes received through AAs, which really amounted to fuckall.

idk man, manaburn is pretty fuckin op. 5 wizards mana burning any velious/kunark/classic raid mob ez.
or on the red server, mana burn is just a super op version of HT.
or was manaburn PoP?

[Thiefboy777]

Release everything except graphics, cats, beastlords

[maerilith]

I was a cleric. I miss my cleric aas :(

[derpcake]

we need fading memories on red

sell off your salt stocks, they about to plummet

[AzzarTheGod]

idk man, manaburn is pretty fuckin op. 5 wizards mana burning any velious/kunark/classic raid mob ez.
or on the red server, mana burn is just a super op version of HT.
or was manaburn PoP?

First, GL burning anything in Velious regardless of gear and number of wizards. Kunark is nothing in Luclin, the wizards put the time in and paid the costs to do it.

Second, it required a full group of wizards in BIS gear to kill a mid-tier Kunark boss during Luclin era. Even then no guarantee.

[Spyder73]

Release everything except graphics, cats, beastlords

WTB Beastlords

[gildor]

custom tuned pop zones would be legit, make the entrances in random places around norrath, this would increase travel classes need and ensure pop in some abandoned areas..

example could be plane of war entrance near the ogres in WK
justice could be inside of Halas (would be fun getting there)
Innovation in steamfont
Fire in the bottom of the lava in lavastorm
Water in OOT
Earth somewhere in the hole

just spitballing and this is in RNF so it likely wouldn't go anywhere..but just an idea

[thufir]

Second, it required a full group of wizards in BIS gear to kill a mid-tier Kunark boss during Luclin era. Even then no guarantee.

for someone who has such nostalgic memories of luclin, you don't remember it very well

manaburn did 2 points of unresistable damage to the target for every 1 point of mana the wizard had

so if you had 16k mana worth of manaburn wizards you could kill anything in kunark

you are correct that it was no good against velious raid mobs, but getting 16k mana worth of wizards is not that difficult and does not require BiS gear by any stretch. worse comes to worse you get slightly more wizards in rags. go to town with your kunark hit squad. it's why it was nerfed.

[heartbrand]

do the staff even care about p99 at this point anymore? they seem completely mia

[arsenalpow]

do the staff even care about p99 at this point anymore? they seem completely mia

What measurement are you using to determine that they don't care anymore?

[arsenalpow]

Obviously them being around and not MIA

Reading comphrension FTW

But they aren't MIA? There was a hard reset a few weeks ago to advance the velious timeline. The devs have plenty of changes to implement if you look at the bug forum, lots of "pending update" notes listed in there. Just because you or HB are bored with the server doesn't mean everyone else is, or that the devs have given up.

[Pokesan]

What measurement are you using to determine that they don't care anymore?

You look ungroomed and hungry. They aren't taking good care of their pets.

[maerilith]

http://i.imgur.com/HmdEMZx.jpg

[Spyder73]

But they aren't MIA? There was a hard reset a few weeks ago to advance the velious timeline. The devs have plenty of changes to implement if you look at the bug forum, lots of "pending update" notes listed in there. Just because you or HB are bored with the server doesn't mean everyone else is, or that the devs have given up.

So are you on the P99 payroll or do you just hold Nilbogs balls for free?

[Spyder73]

do the staff even care about p99 at this point anymore? they seem completely mia

The staff cares very much about P99 still - so much so in fact, that a simple name request will not be granted no matter how reasonable of an argument is presented.

[arsenalpow]

So are you on the P99 payroll or do you just hold Nilbogs balls for free?

We all hold Nilbog's balls in our own ways. Some of us are just really bad at it (terrible p99 themed songs, piss pour p99 themed fan faction, and 0/10 shitposting)

[Spyder73]

We all hold Nilbog's balls in our own ways. Some of us are just really bad at it (terrible p99 themed songs, piss pour p99 themed fan faction, and 0/10 shitposting)

I hate myself when I laugh at one of your posts....but you succeeded...well played

[Haynar]

do the staff even care about p99 at this point anymore? they seem completely mia

I have several things in progress with p99 code, I need to wrap them up.

People have other hobbies too.

But as far as after Velious, it had been made very clear, Luclin is not coming. Any custom content has not been started either.

Next you can expect either a Discord server or a Recycled server starting from the beginning maybe. But no Luclin.

[Troxx]

AA without luclin?

:cough:

[maerilith]

I have several things in progress with p99 code, I need to wrap them up.

People have other hobbies too.

But as far as after Velious, it had been made very clear, Luclin is not coming. Any custom content has not been started either.

Next you can expect either a Discord server or a Recycled server starting from the beginning maybe. But no Luclin.

TBH I'm ok with you recycling R99 and I'm sure most of the Red players are too. (despite a vocal minority consisting of about 10 people from <Empire> and maybe 3 people from <Friends> and 2 people from <Casual Scum> (who will get over their withdrawel symptoms and play on the recycled box anyway because they really have nothing else left to them, so you don't have to worry about pulling the plug on them)

[maskedmelon]

I have several things in progress with p99 code, I need to wrap them up.

People have other hobbies too.

But as far as after Velious, it had been made very clear, Luclin is not coming. Any custom content has not been started either.

Next you can expect either a Discord server or a Recycled server starting from the beginning maybe. But no Luclin.

pras!

"10:18 Righteous among men is he who does not waver astride the path of classic."

-Efanual VI, 10:18

[AzzarTheGod]

for someone who has such nostalgic memories of luclin, you don't remember it very well

manaburn did 2 points of unresistable damage to the target for every 1 point of mana the wizard had

so if you had 16k mana worth of manaburn wizards you could kill anything in kunark

you are correct that it was no good against velious raid mobs, but getting 16k mana worth of wizards is not that difficult and does not require BiS gear by any stretch. worse comes to worse you get slightly more wizards in rags. go to town with your kunark hit squad. it's why it was nerfed.

I'll humor you and pull up a BIS Luclin wizard later and investigate your claim.

Right now I think you are overselling it, more than myself underselling it.

[thufir]

I'll humor you and pull up a BIS Luclin wizard later and investigate your claim.

Right now I think you are overselling it, more than myself underselling it.

if you think I am overselling it you weren't there for the hit squads, simple as that.

[heartbrand]

I have several things in progress with p99 code, I need to wrap them up.

People have other hobbies too.

But as far as after Velious, it had been made very clear, Luclin is not coming. Any custom content has not been started either.

Next you can expect either a Discord server or a Recycled server starting from the beginning maybe. But no Luclin.

was directed more @ the project manager who seems ostensibly to be MIA and not care very much

see: discord
see: teams pvp

I understand that coding on velious is still something that happens.

Personally, as someone who enjoyed Luclin & PoP, the server is kinda dead for me because I did what there is to do in Velious 30 times over now. I love Disney, but there's only so many times you can go on space mountain in a row. Kind of the same thing.

here's hoping for a p2002 that doesn't suck.

[Pokesan]

I'll humor you and pull up a BIS Luclin wizard later and investigate your claim.

Right now I think you are overselling it, more than myself underselling it.

wizards, with a s. that makes it plural. 16k mana across 6 wizards is easy.

[AzzarTheGod]

wizards, with a s. that makes it plural. 16k mana across 6 wizards is easy.

They paid the cost to be the boss. You reduce it down so it takes a full squad of at least 5-6 wizards. Problem is then solved and balanced. Is it meta? No.

No different than a 6-man BIS Luclin group can kill ALL the Dragons, VS, etc.. Is a full group of wizards tank/heal/dps meta? No its not. However, its balanced compared to what a full group can do.

Old expansions are farm status as a function of gameplay due to mudflation. EQ is mudflation. Look at Velious BIS versus Kunark.

He was overselling it. Period.

[AzzarTheGod]

Thanks for the update and clarification that has to be said by a dev and not the plebs saying the same thing hundreds of times over.

No offense but Haynar is not the project manager. So it will need to be said again by nilbog and to a lesser extent, Rogean.

Sorry to disappoint you re: your so-called clarification. He is a senior dev, yes, and his cooperation on any future Luclin 99 project is certainly very valuable, but I didn't see him quote nilbog or claim to speak for him in his post.

[thufir]

No offense but Haynar is not the project manager. So it will need to be said again by nilbog and to a lesser extent, Rogean.

Sorry to disappoint you re: your so-called clarification. He is a senior dev, yes, and his cooperation on any future Luclin 99 project is certainly very valuable, but I didn't see him quote nilbog or claim to speak for him in his post.
curious - if both nilbog and rogean actually tell you it is never coming, will you believe them?

[Big_Japan]

curious - if both nilbog and rogean actually tell you it is never coming, will you believe them?

Depends whether the server ever begins losing players/RMT volume due to content stagnation. The dedication of these nerds would suggest that will never happen. And the dearth of droppable/RMTable loots in Luclin and onward suggests to me that implementing that content would not be a wise investment.

[maerilith]

Depends whether the server ever begins losing players/RMT volume due to content stagnation. The dedication of these nerds would suggest that will never happen. And the dearth of droppable/RMTable loots in Luclin and onward suggests to me that implementing that content would not be a wise investment.

If the server dies others will show up. P99 has enough momentum to go another 10+ yrs as a community probably.

[AzzarTheGod]

Luclin doesn't have to rap, its gonna do numbers regardless.

[Bruno]

No offense but Haynar is not the project manager. So it will need to be said again by nilbog and to a lesser extent, Rogean.

Sorry to disappoint you re: your so-called clarification. He is a senior dev, yes, and his cooperation on any future Luclin 99 project is certainly very valuable, but I didn't see him quote nilbog or claim to speak for him in his post.

The desperation is strong in this one.

Phinny always looking for more players. Kunark released today so Luclin will be out in exactly 6 months from this day.

[PlatLordLoLz2.0]

Also this is classic everquest luclin is not classic the graphics arent classic beastlords arent AAs arent classic Kei isnt classic

the "classic" defense is a very poor one. nothing in p99 is classic. sirken said on stream before velious launched that they were plannong on adding custom content in the future. that statement alone kills any argument about keeping things classic. if you want classic get rid of your custom UI, find a dial up internet provider, get a 56k modem, dont use vent or teamspeak, buy a pager for your batphones and set up conference calls for raids. using modern technology to make your game play more enjoyable is no more different that being able to use luclin character models to to make your game play more enjoyable.

[LostCause]

you won't ever get true 99 classic.

i dont even think the 99 cilent even exists out there anymore maybe it does but oldest ive found is eq mac cilent.

[AzzarTheGod]

the "classic" defense is a very poor one. nothing in p99 is classic. sirken said on stream before velious launched that they were plannong on adding custom content in the future. that statement alone kills any argument about keeping things classic. if you want classic get rid of your custom UI, find a dial up internet provider, get a 56k modem, dont use vent or teamspeak, buy a pager for your batphones and set up conference calls for raids. using modern technology to make your game play more enjoyable is no more different that being able to use luclin character models to to make your game play more enjoyable.

One thing we know from the polls and thread views is...

Luclin does numbers. It doesn't have to rap.

[Spyder73]

i dont even think the 99 cilent even exists out there anymore maybe it does but oldest ive found is eq mac cilent.

Welcome to the entire point of the f#cking project here on P99