Munchkin trying to steal EE camp

[Dabamf]

Let me tell you a little story. It begins in guk where I'm camping the frenzy for a solid 3+ hours and getting pretty damn tired of PHs and rings. So, I do a camp check and notice no one is at EE, and no one has been there for over an hour. That simply never happens so I head on over, notice the shaman is up and kill him real quick. I'm sitting there about 20 minutes and decide to run back to frenzy just to see what has spawned. I'm curious. So I run there, notice 3 BTs up, and I run back to EE only to find Munchkin sitting there.

Shaman PH spawns 1 minute later as I'm /telling him, very respectfully, that I had just begun camping EE one spawn prior, and that I only intended to stay for 1 hour so he was welcome to have it after. Well he had none of that, saying I wasn't there when he got there so the camp was his, and he threatened to KS me. "You can try to get the kill, but you will fail," he says.

Now, Munchkin inevitably failed, once to me unfortunately sending my pet on a mino I had targeted previously instead of the evil eye when it spawned (sorry, well sorta), and then once to a roamer that nearly killed me as well as I was looting my corpse (yea I died to my "train" also). He then, after failing to steal my camp twice, accused me of training him repeatedly on purpose.

I have no point to this story, it's just funny. I don't believe in karma...but sometimes you wonder.

Munchkin, maybe you should go level instead of stealing people's camps. If you ask nicely, you can get in line like the rest of civilization. Or, you can continue to die to single urd shamans. Level 30 mobs are tough man.

[Wenai]

If you aren't present at a camp, then you can't claim it. Camp is a funny word in EQ history as there was never officially camps, yet we are all very aware of what they are. If you want to camp something and have people respect your rights to that camp, you better stay put. If you were to put in a petition and tell me exactly what you said here, then you are in the wrong. You left the camp unattended therefore giving up your rights to claim it.

[Dabamf]

In classic you also had to share orc1 if a second group wanted to fight there as well. That doesn't mean any player who did that wasn't a jackass. Gimme a break citing official server rules about "there are no camps" and all that shit. There are. Just because they aren't official doesn't mean they don't exist. It's sorta like, it's not a rule for me to not call my coworker a dumbass because she's slow as shit at everything she does, but I'm not gonna say that to her, and if I did, I'd be a jackass.

There are server rules, and there are also not-being-a-jackass courtesies that every normal person abides by. Not demanding to share orc1 is one of these don't-be-a-jackass courtesies. As is not trying to perch at a clear camp trying to cite proximity as a claim on a mob that has already been killed.

[Wenai]

In classic you also had to share orc1 if a second group wanted to fight there as well. That doesn't mean any player who did that wasn't a jackass. Gimme a break citing official server rules about "there are no camps" and all that shit. There are. Just because they aren't official doesn't mean they don't exist. It's sorta like, it's not a rule for me to not call my coworker a dumbass because she's slow as shit at everything she does, but I'm not gonna say that to her, and if I did, I'd be a jackass.

There are server rules, and there are also not-being-a-jackass courtesies that every normal person abides by. Not demanding to share orc1 is one of these don't-be-a-jackass courtesies. As is not trying to perch at a clear camp trying to cite proximity as a claim on a mob that has already been killed.
Our server rules require players to respect camps. As soon as you decided it was more important for you to check frenzy than stay at EE you decided to forfeit any right you had to the camp. Same goes for druids/wizzies who port out between spawns to do other things, you can't claim a spawn in a zone you are vacant from for 20 mins.

[mylz17]

In classic you also had to share orc1 if a second group wanted to fight there as well. That doesn't mean any player who did that wasn't a jackass. Gimme a break citing official server rules about "there are no camps" and all that shit. There are. Just because they aren't official doesn't mean they don't exist. It's sorta like, it's not a rule for me to not call my coworker a dumbass because she's slow as shit at everything she does, but I'm not gonna say that to her, and if I did, I'd be a jackass.

There are server rules, and there are also not-being-a-jackass courtesies that every normal person abides by. Not demanding to share orc1 is one of these don't-be-a-jackass courtesies. As is not trying to perch at a clear camp trying to cite proximity as a claim on a mob that has already been killed.

You are comparing apples to oranges. Camping a PH/named mob isn't quite the same as camping an XP camp. Either way, it all boils down to you left your camp. That's why it's called a camp in the first place. You don't leave your camp with the fire burning... you'd be starting forest fires!! :P

Maybe it was different on your original Live server, but on the two I played on... if you aren't at your camp, it's not your camp.

What's to say Munchkin wasn't camping EE for 5 hours before you showed up but went LD? Now you took it and tell him you want it for the next hour. He was there first but wasn't there when you were there. What do you say now? Is it your camp or his camp????

[Dabamf]

What's to say Munchkin wasn't camping EE for 5 hours before you showed up but went LD? Now you took it and tell him you want it for the next hour. He was there first but wasn't there when you were there. What do you say now? Is it your camp or his camp????
In this scenario, by the rules it would be my camp. However, by courtesy and playing nice, it would be his camp. No one's arguing rules here. Just because you're following the rules doesn't mean you're not being a jackass. There's a system of etiquette you follow in a community game like EQ. Without fail, those who follow that etiquette are always the ones who know how to get along well with others. Those who ignore it and fall back on technicalities are those inevitably without friends and who don't really grasp the nature of EQ.

Anyway, just stirring the pot as rants & flames has been noticeably empty. He died once to my mistargeted pet train and once to some random act of fail on his part and left the zone, so no harm was done in the end to those on the side of not being a jackass. And it's bed time now so lets get this up to 5+ pages before I wake up shall we?

[Sloth]

You left the camp. That opens it up. No way you should be able to bounce around named camps and claim them all. Sorry bud. Good luck in the future!

[guineapig]

I would say if the camp is empty when you get there it's your camp.
Pretty cut and dry.

When you leave a camp the camp becomes up for grabs, also cut and dry.

[matahari]

This is my new favorite thread.

<3 wenai !

example of what i've seen : , I've seen people gate to go bank and reclaim hot camps". I've exp'd in ishva room , with people coming in 10min before spawns and telling me he's camped! by them cause they know the timing. Even though me and wifes alt been exping there for 4 hours. This has happened 3 times there. Than they all tell me different rules on camps and ischva is different .

This thread lets me know what i thought i did know was right : ) thanks.

[Nizzarr]

You lost right to your camp when you checked on the frenzy spawn, Sorry Dabamf.

I also want to point out -- there's no list in everquest. If you want to claim a camp you better be ready to wait until that first guy camping it is done. Which means you sit your ass somewhere close and twiddles your thumb until that guy leaves. If that guy says theres someone on the list, well - tough luck - they had to sit there to get it.

Although, you can keep a list and be nice about it all as well, but if someones come and sit there and wait -- Well your list doesnt do much anymore!

[guineapig]

I also want to point out -- there's no list in everquest. If you want to claim a camp you better be ready to wait until that first guy camping it is done. Which means you sit your ass somewhere close and twiddles your thumb until that guy leaves. If that guy says theres someone on the list, well - tough luck - they had to sit there to get it.

Although, you can keep a list and be nice about it all as well, but if someones come and sit there and wait -- Well your list doesnt do much anymore!

^^ Emphasis on this! ^^

[Sorbek]

I am the Munchkin Man btw...

So does this mean he was wrong for Training me as well??

Which is what he did to get me to leave the camp.

I have Screen shots of the entire incident and for some reason are getting an error message when trying to load them up to here to show.

He also tried to train me again as I was looting my corpse after he killed me the first time.

[yaaaflow]

I've gotta ask for some clarification, cause I didn't think this was the way it worked. Lets say I'm camping lord and AM in guk, which are right beside each other and have <20 mobs between them. <20 mobs on a 28 minute spawn timer, so there's little chance of falling behind. I can put in the work of breaking the spawns up, and then someone else can just come along and take whichever camp I'm not at at that given time?

[guineapig]

I've gotta ask for some clarification, cause I didn't think this was the way it worked. Lets say I'm camping lord and AM in guk, which are right beside each other and have maybe 20 mobs between them. 20 mobs on a 28 minute spawn timer. I can put in the work of breaking the spawns up, and then someone else can just come along and take whichever camp I'm not at at that given time?


Hmm. If you are alone and can't actually keep all those mobs cleared then you are not truly holding 2 camps.

If you are in control of that entire area and are actually keeping everything dead in between the 2 spawn locations then I'm not so sure.

A different scenario is LGuk Ass/Sup camp. Occasionally that camp will also take Reaver and possibly another camp.
But that's a 6 person group that's keeping every single mob cleared and occasionally medding while waiting for respawns. In this case that group truly has the entire area covered at all times and is pulling to one spot. Also, in the Reaver example, it's within eyeshot of the safe room that people usually do the ass/sup camp in.

In some cases the camp is not the room in which the named spawns so it's slightly different then say waiting for the Jboots mob to spawn behind a locked door.

Of course this is just my opinion, but this has always been my experience in EQemu as well as EQLive.

[yaaaflow]

Ok, but what if I am keeping everything clear?

edit: and would it be any different if I wasn't keeping everything clear, but was keeping both rooms where they spawn clear?



edit2: How about what happened to me the other day: I was camping the assassin for a mask, duoing it, and we had cleared the spawns and were chillin in the safe room nearby. Next time I go to the assassin spawn (well before they were next due to spawn) there were 2 people sitting there directly in the room. I told them that I was camping it and had them leave - but according to the rules I'm seeing here, had I given up the assassin spawn when I left to go meditate in a better spot?

[guineapig]

Ok, but what if I am keeping everything clear?

edit: and would it be any different if I wasn't keeping everything clear, but was keeping both rooms where they spawn clear?

Personally, I would side with you in this case....
If you are constantly clearing the 2 spawn rooms but it is a iffy situation and am glad I don't have to make such rulings.

If people would always do the courtesy of doing a camp check this wouldn't be an issue. Then at least somebody could ask nicely to take over one part of a multi-camp instead of going there unknowingly (or in some cases spitefully).

But we all know this Utopia doesn't exist...

[guineapig]

edit2: How about what happened to me the other day: I was camping the assassin for a mask, duoing it, and we had cleared the spawns and were chillin in the safe room nearby. Next time I go to the assassin spawn (well before they were next due to spawn) there were 2 people sitting there directly in the room. I told them that I was camping it and had them leave - but according to the rules I'm seeing here, had I given up the assassin spawn when I left to go meditate in a better spot?


Yet another scenario and good example!
They were being sneaky and didn't CC. But I am assuming that you guys were also there for exp? Or a quick AFK? Otherwise if you are only in the zone for a specific item and nothing else I would stay put. So not asking for a CC isn't actually breaking any player made rules and this could have been an honest mistake and if they honestly didn't see you at camp, what can you say to that?
It's shitty I know...

(Glad I'm not a GM....)

If I was there for something so rare I would not move until I got it, but that's just me.

I do that camp for exp with 4-5 other people so if I lost a single spawn I wouldn't personally care...

[karsten]

How about what happened to me the other day: I was camping the assassin for a mask, duoing it, and we had cleared the spawns and were chillin in the safe room nearby. Next time I go to the assassin spawn (well before they were next due to spawn) there were 2 people sitting there directly in the room. I told them that I was camping it and had them leave - but according to the rules I'm seeing here, had I given up the assassin spawn when I left to go meditate in a better spot?

this is where the argument of "have to be there the whole time to get the spawn" breaks down, but w/e -- guess it's time to put the evil eye on rotation also

[Ripcord]

Camp check's aren't fool-proof either, because there's always that one guy who thinks he can kill 5 named with his 2 person group and keeps calling all 5 named while his buddy dies and his cousins roomate is logging a cleric on in like 10min BUT I STILL HAVE THE CAMP!!!~

As for the training thing, its not too clear what that was all about but "accidentally targeting a mino" wouldn't really hold up in eq court after the previous events. Imagine eq court on daytime tv? i'd watch that.

[drplump]

If someone shows up to a camp and the mob and ph are MAGICALLY dead or in the case of the Ishva all the mobs on the way are clear and all rooms empty around they know its camped. They are purposely playing dumb and should have extra punishment!

A case were a person could argue legitimate confusion is them going to a mob with all spawns around it up and the actual mob or PH are up. I understand some people are camping things they actually get XP for and need meditate a little bit between some spawns longer then repop.

[guineapig]

If someone shows up to a camp and the mob and ph are MAGICALLY dead or in the case of the Ishva all the mobs on the way are clear and all rooms empty around they know its camped. They are purposely playing dumb

agreed



Imagine eq court on daytime tv? i'd watch that.

Oh dear lord that would be hilarious!!!
(To us...)

[messiah_b]

The original spirit of the camp notion is respecting a spawn that a person or group is specifically sitting at waiting for it to spawn and got there before you.

If you are sitting in Drelzna's room and not leaving only killing the 3 spawns that is a camp.

If you are clearing Najena, Drelz, and Rathyl rooms and someone gets into the drelzna room and sits down you should be sol. You weren't camping at all you were farming.

Camping should be respected. Farming deserves none.

If I roll up to something I need and the PH is down I will begin my camp. If they come back I will usually let them keep it assuming it is understood that they are going to sit there and camp it.

I think it's cool that manastone is in the game but it should probably be changed to No Drop.

[yaaaflow]

Why would you make the guy sit there for the full 18 or 21 or 28 or whatever minutes between each and every spawn? That just seems vindictive. When I am camping a named spawn I am camping everything else in range too - I have one spawn in particular I'm after and I'll give up any of the others, but why make me sit at one spawn for the whole time?

[karsten]

If I roll up to something I need and the PH is down I will begin my camp. If they come back I will usually let them keep it assuming it is understood that they are going to sit there and camp it.

well i disagree, so now EE is on rotation

[Sorbek]

Why would you make the guy sit there for the full 18 or 21 or 28 or whatever minutes between each and every spawn? That just seems vindictive. When I am camping a named spawn I am camping everything else in range too - I have one spawn in particular I'm after and I'll give up any of the others, but why make me sit at one spawn for the whole time?

Read post #2 and you shall have your answers.

[messiah_b]

I am so important at the internet look at me as I make big internet important decisions.

.

[Dabamf]

I've gotta ask for some clarification, cause I didn't think this was the way it worked. Lets say I'm camping lord and AM in guk, which are right beside each other and have <20 mobs between them. <20 mobs on a 28 minute spawn timer, so there's little chance of falling behind. I can put in the work of breaking the spawns up, and then someone else can just come along and take whichever camp I'm not at at that given time?

If you are camping lord and AM, someone is allowed to sneak into one of the rooms while you are gone and claim the camp. The rules have always sided with these jackasses. So yes, if some asshole jumps in and claims one while you are in the other, even if the room is empty, you can't do shit about it.

All the "you gave up the camp when you left" posts are irrelevant. I know, by the rules of the server, that I gave the camp up. I also know, by the rules of the server, that you can't claim AM and lord together with a full group of 6, that you can't claim more than 1 room at a time. I don't give a shit about the rules of the server. I'm not saying Mr. Munchkin can't-solo-a-urd-shaman-without-his-pet broke the rules. I'm saying he's an asshole for appealing to a technicality.

Anyone who plays this game in the upper levels knows that if you don't respect camps, you are simply an asshole and good luck finding a high end guild. Yea there is a point when enough is enough when 2 people are farming lord/am/frenzy/sage/ass/sup and its time to make them choose, but checking on a respawn while your PH is dead is certainly not one of them.

P.S. I got a couple hate tells from Europa after the incident, Munchkin's guild. I wonder, if they knew about his application to another guild while still being tagged with them, would they be so blindly supportive? (http://ib.guildlaunch.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4109886&gid=121531) That's just bad form man.

[Ripcord]

o shi-

[doery]

O shi- indeed!

And yet you are still arguing EVERYTHING people are saying. You left the camp, you fore fitted your right to have that camp, munchkin came and got it. All this below the belt, calling him names, posting his guild app to inglorious bastards while he's in another guild etc. is immature and childish and all it's showing is that you are even more of a child then what your trying to say munchkin is. Grow the fuck up and enjoy the game. All this time you are taking to post childish remarks to something that is done and over with because you don't like that no one is taking your side, you could be.. Oh I don't know.. Camping your mob again?

[Sorbek]

If you are camping lord and AM, someone is allowed to sneak into one of the rooms while you are gone and claim the camp. The rules have always sided with these jackasses. So yes, if some asshole jumps in and claims one while you are in the other, even if the room is empty, you can't do shit about it.

All the "you gave up the camp when you left" posts are irrelevant. I know, by the rules of the server, that I gave the camp up. I also know, by the rules of the server, that you can't claim AM and lord together with a full group of 6, that you can't claim more than 1 room at a time. I don't give a shit about the rules of the server. I'm not saying Mr. Munchkin can't-solo-a-urd-shaman-without-his-pet broke the rules. I'm saying he's an asshole for appealing to a technicality.


You just said it yourself. But yet you were unwilling to leave and felt the need to train me then FD just to kill me the moment the Evil Eye spawned.

The second bold faced piece seems to be the real problem doesn't it?
It shows just what kind of person you really are.

The other part is no one elses business really. Your just picking at straws to attempt make people agree with your actions. Which so far doesn't appear to be happening.

Your the one that came crying on the forums about this not me. Just keep digging that grave a little deeper.

[messiah_b]

Why would you make the guy sit there for the full 18 or 21 or 28 or whatever minutes between each and every spawn? That just seems vindictive...

Personally I would not make you sit there if you claim EE as your primary camp and are taking whatever else the side. I will only take something out of attrition if you are claiming AM / Frenzy / EE and won't give any up when asked nicely. Hopefully that makes sense.

To Dabamf's point a new person coming in should respect that something is camped if a PH is down, but the camper needs to be able to make decisions and start to let go of spawns as business picks up.

[Jify]

Dabamf you seem like a cool guy. But I know Munch, so I have to side with him. I wouldn't have had him as my main man in The Mages Guild if I didn't trust his judgement.

He's right, you leave a camp, it's not camped.

Example: Can I bind a cleric @ the uber long pop in Solb, port in, and if someone else is waiting I tell them it's been camped because I was bound there? No. They had it.

8)

[Ripcord]

I'm sitting there about 20 minutes and decide to run back to frenzy just to see what has spawned.

I'm sitting there about 20 minutes and decide to run back to frenzy

and decide to run back to frenzy

run back to frenzy

back to frenzy

[Goobles]

THIS IS A PERFECT OPPORTUNITY TO BRING OUT THE BITMAPS!

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a74/RiddlN/QQ.jpg

[Dabamf]

Example: Can I bind a cleric @ the uber long pop in Solb, port in, and if someone else is waiting I tell them it's been camped because I was bound there? No. They had it.

8)
No one's talking about long spawn time mobs in this thread, and no one's talking about leaving the zone.

Everyone's welcome to your opinion. But please, if you think poaching the spawn in this case is kosher, please leave your in-game name so that when I see you wipe, res your friend, make a fast trade at zone-in, or kill multiple mobs, I know you'll be perfectly cool with me jumping in and taking one without asking. That way I can distinguish people who do that from those who know how to function in civilization.

[doery]

Waaaaa waaaaaa go cry more please. It's making my food saltier. And I love salt.

[messiah_b]

*posts in rants n flames

*gets mad when other people chime in

*leans back

[Finawin]

If you aren't present at a camp, then you can't claim it. Camp is a funny word in EQ history as there was never officially camps, yet we are all very aware of what they are. If you want to camp something and have people respect your rights to that camp, you better stay put. If you were to put in a petition and tell me exactly what you said here, then you are in the wrong. You left the camp unattended therefore giving up your rights to claim it.

Tell Zylar this.

[Jify]

No one's talking about long spawn time mobs in this thread, and no one's talking about leaving the zone.

Everyone's welcome to your opinion. But please, if you think poaching the spawn in this case is kosher, please leave your in-game name so that when I see you wipe, res your friend, make a fast trade at zone-in, or kill multiple mobs, I know you'll be perfectly cool with me jumping in and taking one without asking. That way I can distinguish people who do that from those who know how to function in civilization.

My ingame name is Jify. And I'm perfectly fine with this. :)

[Zyrek]

Someone else in this thread made a good point if your checking multiple named spawns your farming and not camping, so your rights to the camp go away unless a group is clearing the entire area between the spawns and can keep it clear.

But i would say they would have to pick which camp they want if another group came in that's play nice policy as its one thing to exp and another to monoplize all named in a zone.

You guys remember guk on live you were lucky to even get one camp so don't be greedy and take half of the zone just because there is not 50 people in the zone now.

[Taminy]

Someone else in this thread made a good point if your checking multiple named spawns your farming and not camping, so your rights to the camp go away unless a group is clearing the entire area between the spawns and can keep it clear.

But i would say they would have to pick which camp they want if another group came in that's play nice policy as its one thing to exp and another to monoplize all named in a zone.

You guys remember guk on live you were lucky to even get one camp so don't be greedy and take half of the zone just because there is not 50 people in the zone now.

qft.

I remember dead side guk on live was:

BR
Ass/sup/rit
Cav/sav/sage/exe
Frenzy/sent
Lord/Am (maybe hand)

And a group at safehall cleaning up all the trash (and maybe hand).

[foxdragoon]

Should probably be one named camp per player, none of this Am/frenzy/lord farming crap. That should simplify things.

[karsten]

everyone has a different idea on what is correct in these situations, including the GMs, and due to the fact that the GMs should be doing things other than babysitting, I've decided that there will now be a forced rotation on all named mobs in lguk. you're free to contact me ingame with questions/concerns to this new policy.

[Zithax]

Camp is a funny word in EQ history as there was never officially camps, yet we are all very aware of what they are.

Camps were officially recognized for quite some time, until it was decided that "first to engage" was the new rule as camps were hard to enforce from a GM pov.

[Supreme]

Someone else in this thread made a good point if your checking multiple named spawns your farming and not camping, so your rights to the camp go away unless a group is clearing the entire area between the spawns and can keep it clear.

But i would say they would have to pick which camp they want if another group came in that's play nice policy as its one thing to exp and another to monoplize all named in a zone.

You guys remember guk on live you were lucky to even get one camp so don't be greedy and take half of the zone just because there is not 50 people in the zone now.



Yes i remember when doing Ass/Supplier was a total of like 8 spawns.

And we liked it.

[Kuldiin]

"You guys remember guk on live you were lucky to even get one camp so don't be greedy and take half of the zone just because there is not 50 people in the zone now."

Exactly. People shouldnt take the same attitude on this server this isnt live and people arent flowing through the door. We should all be working as a team building a community, not cockblocking each other over paltry items such as Guk loot.

Every new player through the door is better than 100 pieces of Guk crap.

Im sure one person monopolising the whole zone is not what the admins, or the majority of players want on this server.

[Bakaris]

everyone has a different idea on what is correct in these situations, including the GMs, and due to the fact that the GMs should be doing things other than babysitting, I've decided that there will now be a forced rotation on all named mobs in lguk. you're free to contact me ingame with questions/concerns to this new policy.

Just a question. Will this not hurt your fellow guildies, as they spend alot of time in lguk farming items ?

[Hasbinbad]

Just a question. Will this not hurt your fellow guildies, as they spend alot of time in lguk farming items ?
We have Karsten favoritism, so he will no doubt adjust the rotation so that we get more loots!

[Myrkskog]

I think you should have 1 camp and you can go do other stuff while you are waiting for it to spawn. If you don't make it back by the time the PH/Named spawns and someone else engages it, you lose the camp. If you are camping something while checking on another spawn and someone else moves into your other spawn, you lose it.

[drplump]

I think you should have 1 camp and you can go do other stuff while you are waiting for it to spawn. If you don't make it back by the time the PH/Named spawns and someone else engages it, you lose the camp. If you are camping something while checking on another spawn and someone else moves into your other spawn, you lose it.

Does your new rule apply to the ishva mal?

[Myrkskog]

Of course not.

[Finawin]

Read my signature.

[Hasbinbad]

I think you should have 1 camp and you can go do other stuff while you are waiting for it to spawn.
That defeats the whole purpose of camping something.

Common sense dictates and Wenai has specifically stated that your toon has to be present at a camp in order to retain a legitimate claim to said camp. Otherwise it would be called a "pit-stop," or simply a "desired target." If you're not going to devote your time to making sure you're there to fend off others trying to get the camp, why should anyone respect the fact that you want it? If *I* am willing to spend *my* time camping something, why should *you* get to come in once every 21 minutes and kill the thing *I* need and then just leave? It makes no sense.

Unless of course, you're an egotistical jerk with a small wiener in a position of authority in his teeny-tiny world, and making up some retarded rules on the spot, like: "if it's a friend of MINE, they can attempt a camp, not have the force necessary, wipe, and then retain a legitimate claim to a camp when others who do have the force to hold the camp are ready and present to hold the camp." ..but you know, what moron would do something stupid like THAT??

[Myrkskog]

All *I* am saying is that if there was *someone* alone in Lguk, camping multiple spawns and *I* come in and say "anyone at EE?" and *he* says *I* am, then the EE camp is *his*. But any other camp in the zone is now open to *me* and *he* can't say EE/Frenzy/AM are *mine*.








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[DatThreadNecro]

badump