Really confused/ticked off about AoEing in zones.

[Morgander]

OK so, I just have to get this off my chest. I currently feel that the current state of the rules regarding AoEing in zones and how those rules are policed is completely backwards at this time.

In Chardok, if I were to show up wanting to kill zone mobs, the AoE group there would disregard me and just pull through me (fight at your own risk), and I bet you anything that the GM's would be on their side as they were there first (there basically perpetually as that group is nearly constant and ever-changing).

But I was recently suspended for a week on a druid in Mistmoore, and I am absolutely irritated about it, and I'll explain the situation first in detail.

So we zoned in to MM with a group including some wizards with which I was going to mass pull mobs and let them aoe down for great xp. So we zone in and first I find out who in the zone is doing what so we don't pull their mobs. Ok great, the pond area all the way to the castle is devoid of groups, so I start pulling and we're pulling a ton of mobs. Now I'm using a druid and I'm double snaring every single thing I pull using my snare gaunts, and I've done this for months so I know 100% that in no case does a double snared mob agro someone who didn't touch them, even if I pull the mob right across a sitting player.

So we're literally doing this for over an hour and people start filtering into the zone. Some people start oocing looking for more for camps that WE'RE ALREADY PULLING.

So fine, I'm not a jerk, I want to let people who want to play in the zone also get mobs, so I stop pulling everything and start getting more selective, even going way deeper in to grab mobs to pull back.

But people are complaining anyways, talking about how we're pulling too many things. One guy in IB for example starts to swear and say he's going to petition us, and I ignore him of course because I THOUGHT I was well within my rights to pull lots of mobs so long as we weren't training anybody, or stealing from another camp of players already established before we started.

Apparently I was wrong.

I go to log in one day a few days later and that account has been suspended and I don't know why. So later I find out it was because of "zone disruption". But "zone disruption" is bogus. That entire ideology is so abstract that it feels like if a cop busted me for "disturbing the peace".

So seriously server, why is this acceptable? I pride myself on being polite and considerate. I don't break rules, I don't kill steal, I don't take other player's mobs, I often give up camps to people (ESPECIALLY if I'm power leveling somebody), and when we AoE in these PL groups, I don't train anybody or take their mobs.

SO WHY WAS I SUSPENDED?

And better yet, why was I suspended without being told what specifically I was even being accused of? Was there a fraps? Can I see it? Do I not even get a voice as to my side of the story? I bet you anything that any fraps on me did not actually show me breaking a single server rule (because I don't break server rules and I know it with complete confidence), but instead probably showed some obscure situation that made me look bad, like showing me telling a mob with my pull train behind me with someone standing there looking like I was pulling from their camp when I wasn't doing that.

Is this the end of the world? Na. But I think it's an injustice. Now half my friends are worried about ever attempting to AoE anything anymore, and some of them were telling me they're worried about all sorts of things if they can just get suspended or maybe even banned without warning for something they weren't even being told they were doing and without having their side of the story told.

This is like having the FBI come to your house and cuff you and lock you up and throw you in prison without a trial of any kind, because someone got a 2 minute video of you at a convenience store two minutes before it got robbed, and just assumed it had to be you.

It's an injustice of the server if you ask me.

Rant off.

[chief]

stfu

[chief]

oh and tl;dr

[Argh]

bold important parts or something, nobody is going to parse your wall

[Heebo]

SO WHY WAS I SUSPENDED?
Probably for being an insufferable cunt. Just a guess.

[Derubael]

Project 1999 Staff will not be defining what constitutes a camp. Instead, Project 1999 Customer Service Staff will arbitrate spawn disputes on a per-case-basis. We greatly encourage players to find their own resolution to spawn disputes, as the solution provided by the staff will at best be a win-lose situation, and possbily a lose-lose situation. No two decisions, even at the same 'camp', are guaranteed to be the same, as we will take into account multiple factors in making a determination on a 'camp'.

That being said, you can absolutely "camp" mobs, and you cannot steal another players 'camp'. In general, if the placeholder or placeholders for a spawn are being killed, that 'camp' can be considered held by the player doing the killing so long as they are keeping the placeholders cleared. You do not necessarily need to be at the spawn point to call it 'claimed' while it is uncontested, however, if someone else wishes to contest the 'camp' you do need to return to the 'camp' and maintain a presence at or very near the spawn(s) in order to hold it. It should also be noted that if you camp out or leave the zone, you have forfeited a camp. You cannot hold multiple 'camps' if another group wishes to contest one that you are holding. The player holding multiple 'camps' retains the right to choose which 'camp' to give up.

[toosweet]

Ooohh such an injustice to the server
Your dear dear friends sooo afraid
An ideology so abstract as to cause confusion
Something MUST be done about this GM's....in the name of all that is good and Just in the world

[Sckrilla]

RnF ALWAYS helps!
ftfy

[Derubael]

Thread is a troll, but quoted PnP; lots of people never read it.

[Morgander]

Fine Derubael, but not once did anybody ever even ask me to give anything up. Not once.

What am I suppose to be doing then? Just sending 50 tells out just in case person A wants mob 01 while persons B and C want to duo mob 04 and 09 and then KNOW what mobs persons D, E, F, and G want to take?

There was no, "hey man I see you're pulling a bunch of stuff, could we maybe get you to leave up this or that for us?"

And like I said already, I did stop pulling places where groups began to form and thus just started to technically TAKE out mobs.

And also, how does this work for Chardok AE? So what you're saying is, if I bring in groups to Chardok every day, the AoE group has to basically leave because they're inevitably going to train us and they MUST give us camps or all they suspended?

Again, it's injustice because there was absolutely no communication. I'm just suppose to assume I know what everybody in the zone wants at all times, or just NOT pull large sums of mobs for aoe.

If that's the case fine, but then make it a ruling server-wide so this can't happen again.

[Morgander]

Ooohh such an injustice to the server
Your dear dear friends sooo afraid
An ideology so abstract as to cause confusion
Something MUST be done about this GM's....in the name of all that is good and Just in the world

Lol, ok I get it, this is the rants and flames section, but do you really have to be such a sarcastic jerk?

Just because I posted in rants and flames doesn't mean I'm trolling or otherwise looking for these kinds of worthless replies. What are you, seven?

[Argh]

Fine Derubael, but not once did anybody ever even ask me to give anything up. Not once.

But people are complaining anyways, talking about how we're pulling too many things.

[Argh]

And also, how does this work for Chardok AE? So what you're saying is, if I bring in groups to Chardok every day, the AoE group has to basically leave because they're inevitably going to train us and they MUST give us camps or all they suspended?

In Chardok, you can occupy any camp you want and the AE group can't take mobs from that camp and has to avoid training you.

[Bruno]

I wouldn't even ask you if I wanted to take a camp that you aren't physically holding down. It usually goes something like what are you camping? Ok I'm taking this camp. Read the server rules and stop being a dumbass.

[Kingore]

The GM's on this server are a little too aggressive in "zone disruption" punishment. I too, have CC'd, found open camps, and then gotten petitioned by people who never answered my CC and mobs were fully spawned claiming I was stealing their mobs. In fact, I left after they complained (without ever /telling me) and went to another area of the zone completely, and still had a GM come interrogate me for quite some time about it. Even though this is RNF - something that should be taken away is the GM's need to do more /invis watching as opposed to direct questioning. Actions speak a LOT louder than words.

[jomjom]

Would all of you like some free play time added to your account for all this emotional suffering?

[Cecily]

I wouldn't even ask you if I wanted to take a camp that you aren't physically holding down. It usually goes something like what are you camping? Ok I'm taking this camp. Read the server rules and stop being a dumbass.

Orly?

That being said, you can absolutely "camp" mobs, and you cannot steal another players 'camp'. In general, if the placeholder or placeholders for a spawn are being killed, that 'camp' can be considered held by the player doing the killing so long as they are keeping the placeholders cleared. You do not necessarily need to be at the spawn point to call it 'claimed' while it is uncontested, however, if someone else wishes to contest the 'camp' you do need to return to the 'camp' and maintain a presence at or very near the spawn(s) in order to hold it. It should also be noted that if you camp out or leave the zone, you have forfeited a camp. You cannot hold multiple 'camps' if another group wishes to contest one that you are holding. The player holding multiple 'camps' retains the right to choose which 'camp' to give up.

[Bruno]

Orly?

Ya rly.

[DetroitVelvetSmooth]

Orly?
Ya rly.

http://data1.whicdn.com/images/58024258/large.gif

[Tecmos Deception]

In Chardok, if I were to show up wanting to kill zone mobs, the AoE group there would disregard me and just pull through me (fight at your own risk), and I bet you anything that the GM's would be on their side as they were there first (there basically perpetually as that group is nearly constant and ever-changing)..

This is wrong.

[Bruno]

This is wrong.

Wrong because he cannot show up in Chardok, he's suspended. Amirite?

[DetroitVelvetSmooth]

The real point is that no one would try because the backlash against them wouldn't be worth it. The ultimate scenario would be for Dolj or some other up and coming guild to decide that they don't like dealing with the crowds and competition in KC and start farming xp in Chardok. Oh, but wait, the ZEM is set up so that the only way chardok is useful is as a AOE plat farm. Polishing my tinfoil hat, sharpening my pitchfork.

[bigshowtime]

Luvin the bluebie tears over ae groups

[HeallunRumblebelly]

Meanwhile, HS sits 100% empty...

[Heebo]

I'm really confused/ticked off.

[Boilon]

unimaginative bad people power-leveling bad people, riding the coattails of those creative minds that started it.

all you gotta do is plop an exp group at the castle in chardok and you are gonna have 18 people freak out and not know what to do with their day.

I think I am going to do this. So what you're saying is if I setup an exp group along the way at a camp that AOE Chardok will not exist due to training?

[Bboboo]

What the fuck is this thread?

[Skittlez]

This is what you get for power leveling in one of the most popular and busy zones of the game.

[SniGlas]

What the fuck is this thread?

+1 for Ryan Davis avatar

[Nirgon]

AoEing allowed because staff (that are bad at EverQuest) characters are finally able to catch up in time for Velious


http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/lillemorr/25024389/38521/38521_900.jpg

[Messianic]

In Chardok, if I were to show up wanting to kill zone mobs, the AoE group there would disregard me and just pull through me (fight at your own risk), and I bet you anything that the GM's would be on their side as they were there first

Stopped reading there due to you already telling me why you're having a problem

[Morgander]

This is what you get for power leveling in one of the most popular and busy zones of the game.

My problem is that the rules aren't clear enough.

If I can't power level like this then fine, but outline better rules.

So many people seem to be missing the point. I didn't get to defend my stance, nor did I even get a tell from a player nor a GM/guide about any of this. I just tried to log in one day to find out I couldn't and without any reasoning, to have to "dig" around to later be told why but without any kind of evidence.

Technically, I was holding down all the mobs we were pulling and people were walking in trying to take our mobs without asking us. Isn't THAT grounds for stealing camps from us? If the rules state that I must concede camps to others if they request, then shouldn't they have to actually REQUEST first? Otherwise there's no discourse going on about it, so they in essence are taking our mobs and that's it.

This is like if I was doing two named camps in sine zine and somebody wanted one but didn't send me a tell asking if I would give them one so just started to try to KS me when the named popped, then petitioning me for it and getting me suspended when I didn't know WTF they were doing, which is blatantly obvious that they are just trying to take my camp from me.

The character is already un-suspended and I have like, 9 characters. This is all principle here, and ranting; nothing more.

Haters can hate, it's cool.

[toosweet]

My problem is that the rules aren't clear enough.

If I can't power level like this then fine, but outline better rules.

So many people seem to be missing the point. I didn't get to defend my stance, nor did I even get a tell from a player nor a GM/guide about any of this. I just tried to log in one day to find out I couldn't and without any reasoning, to have to "dig" around to later be told why but without any kind of evidence.

Technically, I was holding down all the mobs we were pulling and people were walking in trying to take our mobs without asking us. Isn't THAT grounds for stealing camps from us? If the rules state that I must concede camps to others if they request, then shouldn't they have to actually REQUEST first? Otherwise there's no discourse going on about it, so they in essence are taking our mobs and that's it.

This is like if I was doing two named camps in sine zine and somebody wanted one but didn't send me a tell asking if I would give them one so just started to try to KS me when the named popped, then petitioning me for it and getting me suspended when I didn't know WTF they were doing, which is blatantly obvious that they are just trying to take my camp from me.

The character is already un-suspended and I have like, 9 characters. This is all principle here, and ranting; nothing more.

Haters can hate, it's cool.

Just shut the fuck up will you, assholes always wanting rules changed or set up just for them.
Cuntfaced crybaby

[Bruno]

My problem is that the rules aren't clear enough.

If I can't power level like this then fine, but outline better rules.

So many people seem to be missing the point. I didn't get to defend my stance, nor did I even get a tell from a player nor a GM/guide about any of this. I just tried to log in one day to find out I couldn't and without any reasoning, to have to "dig" around to later be told why but without any kind of evidence.

Technically, I was holding down all the mobs we were pulling and people were walking in trying to take our mobs without asking us. Isn't THAT grounds for stealing camps from us? If the rules state that I must concede camps to others if they request, then shouldn't they have to actually REQUEST first? Otherwise there's no discourse going on about it, so they in essence are taking our mobs and that's it.

This is like if I was doing two named camps in sine zine and somebody wanted one but didn't send me a tell asking if I would give them one so just started to try to KS me when the named popped, then petitioning me for it and getting me suspended when I didn't know WTF they were doing, which is blatantly obvious that they are just trying to take my camp from me.

The character is already un-suspended and I have like, 9 characters. This is all principle here, and ranting; nothing more.

Haters can hate, it's cool.

Kid really isn't getting it. No wonder he's suspended.

[Ambrotos]

Collecting AOE Exp right this second. Good call staff!

[Rhambuk]

chardok is an aoe zone

don't even try to group here you will be laughed at don't bother

[myriverse]

trying to take our mobs
Oh brother.

I kind of agree that there could have been better communication (probably on both/all sides), but what you were doing was wrong.

[triad]

QQ

[Susvain2]

people need to stop giving the OP a hard time. OP sounds like the type of dude i want to group with in MM. and people know i am the lord of MM groups

[Nivar Quartz]

unimaginative bad people power-leveling bad people, riding the coattails of those creative minds that started it.

all you gotta do is plop an exp group at the castle in chardok and you are gonna have 18 people freak out and not know what to do with their day.


QFT would read again 9/10

[Swish]

I used to duo in Chardok before the AOE shit became popular. Great zone for a single group.

If a bunch of Europa decided to go into Sebilis off peak and pull a shit ton of mobs for AOE, could we?

If I took a standard group of 6 into Chardok before the AOE party arrived and wanted to XP doing zone in to zone out (and back), could we? Could we tell the AOE group where to go?

Is it "being a dick" to take a group of 6 into Chardok now I wonder? Hmm.

[DetroitVelvetSmooth]

WTS
http://zam.zamimg.com/images/3/4/3460d229fcd727e6ad42ce6d89f0822f.png
At chardok zone in - PST

[Deldanko]

Just shut the fuck up will you, assholes always wanting rules changed or set up just for them.
Cuntfaced crybaby

you have a big heart.

[TrendyDru]

Is it "being a dick" to take a group of 6 into Chardok now I wonder? Hmm.

wrong question for rnf

[Xerxes]

60 monk lfm castle entrance in chardok lol