yay for obama care!

[greenblze420]

obama care is the best thing 2 ever happen 2 U S OF A

[Susvain2]

sick thread

[Shamalam]

sick thread

[phacemeltar]

pity reply

[Glenzig]

Someone has to pay for monkeys healthcare.
Should of never freed the slaves.

Should have*.
Learn to write honkey.

[Archalen]

Should have*.
Learn to write honkey.

^^ban plz racial slurs

[r00t]

Obama care has been detrimental for my former employer and my current one. Our premiums are twice that of last year's while the benefits were slashed.

But what do you expect when corporations ghost wrote the bill?

[Glenzig]

I think its going to be hilarious to see what the next president does to screw things up even further. And then listen to all the talking heads defend/blame.

[Tankdan]

Thank you Obama for holding a gun to my head forcing me to buy something that I can't afford. You are a savior. My life is so much better now.

[DeruIsLove]

Obama care has been detrimental for my former employer and my current one. Our premiums are twice that of last year's while the benefits were slashed.

But what do you expect when corporations ghost wrote the bill?

Source?

Last independent report I read showed that some 8 million Americans who didn't have health insurance now do. Some 20 million are paying significantly less than they used to and are getting better service now.

[r00t]

Source?

Last independent report I read showed that some 8 million Americans who didn't have health insurance now do. Some 20 million are paying significantly less than they used to and are getting better service now.

Source: my paycheck

[moklianne]

Obama care has been detrimental for my former employer and my current one. Our premiums are twice that of last year's while the benefits were slashed.

But what do you expect when corporations ghost wrote the bill?

That's the employer pushing you onto the exchanges because they don't want the cost.

Our's have gone up every single year for the past ten years. When you break down the causes, most of it is because hospitals have been allowed to merge all across the country. There are 33% less hospitals than 5 years ago, meaning less competition, etc.

Another big part of it is that new testing procedures such as DNA sequencing in the office, etc are covered when they never were in the past.

New very expensive equipment and doctors prescribing them too frequently, such as MRI's, using surgery machines, etc. Mainly because we demand them to.

The new requirements of Obamacare add a small amount to this as well, but its no where near all of the other factors.

When it comes down to it, costs continue to rise and all of us demand the best possible (meaning most expensive) care available in the modern world. Someone has to pay for that.

[Glenzig]

Source?

Last independent report I read showed that some 8 million Americans who didn't have health insurance now do. Some 20 million are paying significantly less than they used to and are getting better service now.

I'm sure there are "independent" reports that show that Obamacare will give you Hep C and kill your grandmother too.

[r00t]

All I see are excuses not results

[Champion_Standing]

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[Champion_Standing]

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[Champion_Standing]

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[Champion_Standing]

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[BigHurb]

i got united healthcare for free, no co pays. working as intended for me, i suggest you all stop being so gay.

[BigHurb]

also just got my ebt card, 189$ a month. going to go for SSDI next.

my grandfather was in the army. my dad the navy. all paid their way. it came to me, and ive ruined it all because of my mental health and waiting to get care so long.

its not obamacare, its ignorance that is ruining this country.

[r00t]

I'm glad you're finally getting the help you so desperately need

[BigHurb]

yea maybe yer gf can get help for her alcoholism and you for your closest gay

[Thulack]

Thank you Obama for holding a gun to my head forcing me to buy something that I can't afford. You are a savior. My life is so much better now.

Ehh i'm just paying the fine. Still cheaper then getting insurance that i dont use. 12 years without insurance and i've spent 6k on medical bills. WAY cheaper then actually having insurance for all that time.

[Ahldagor]

Ehh i'm just paying the fine. Still cheaper then getting insurance that i dont use. 12 years without insurance and i've spent 6k on medical bills. WAY cheaper then actually having insurance for all that time.

luck is a two way street

[Glenzig]

luck is a two way street

True. But you should still have the choice of whether or not to purchase. If you end up getting screwed, that's on you.

[BigHurb]

whoa hold on dont make sense.

also, you people only work to buy stuff. money cant feed you. you are the ones dependent on the govt handouts, lol.

[Shamalam]

True. But you should still have the choice of whether or not to purchase. If you end up getting screwed, that's on you.

Okay. So you choose not to buy insurance. What happens when you get hit by a car one day? Someone calls 911 and the ambulance comes, they have to take you to the ER and give you thousands of dollars worth of medical care to save your life... but you have no insurance. Are they supposed to just sit there and let you die in the ER waiting room if you can't pay? Surely you don't expect the hospital itself to foot the bill for every patient that strolls through without insurance? Maybe they could save even more money and not even send an ambulance, you could just bleed out in the street! I'm no huge fan of Obamacare either, but come on.

[Glenzig]

Okay. So you choose not to buy insurance. What happens when you get hit by a car one day? Someone calls 911 and the ambulance comes, they have to take you to the ER and give you thousands of dollars worth of medical care to save your life... but you have no insurance. Are they supposed to just sit there and let you die in the ER waiting room if you can't pay? Surely you don't expect the hospital itself to foot the bill for every patient that strolls through without insurance? Maybe they could save even more money and not even send an ambulance, you could just bleed out in the street! I'm no huge fan of Obamacare either, but come on.

Is this in America, or Canada? Or one of the other dozen or so countries that provide free healthcare?

[BigHurb]

similar to arguments against CCTV cameras that will prevent crime.. the criminals have convinced the public it will hurt them to have help.

curious world.

[Glenzig]

Plus I work with health insurance quite frequently at my job. And one thing that you always can be sure of when verifying patient benefits is that you will get a disclaimer telling you that even though patient X is eligible for X treatment, that is no guarantee of payment or coverage from the insurance provider.

[Ahldagor]

Plus I work with health insurance quite frequently at my job. And one thing that you always can be sure of when verifying patient benefits is that you will get a disclaimer telling you that even though patient X is eligible for X treatment, that is no guarantee of payment or coverage from the insurance provider.

thought that was changed with the affordable care act.

[hatelore]

Plus I work with health insurance quite frequently at my job. And one thing that you always can be sure of when verifying patient benefits is that you will get a disclaimer telling you that even though patient X is eligible for X treatment, that is no guarantee of payment or coverage from the insurance provider.

Quit trying dude, most on p99 are liberal red star wielding fuckin commies~ It's a losing battle to try to change liberals, it's a mental disorder.

[DeruIsLove]

Okay. So you choose not to buy insurance. What happens when you get hit by a car one day? Someone calls 911 and the ambulance comes, they have to take you to the ER and give you thousands of dollars worth of medical care to save your life... but you have no insurance. Are they supposed to just sit there and let you die in the ER waiting room if you can't pay? Surely you don't expect the hospital itself to foot the bill for every patient that strolls through without insurance? Maybe they could save even more money and not even send an ambulance, you could just bleed out in the street! I'm no huge fan of Obamacare either, but come on.

They treat you and send you the same bill that they would get if you had insurance only without the insurance deductions. I'm insured now which costs me roughly $1000 a year, I wasn't for the first 5 years after graduating high school, I went to the ER and received treatment during that time, total cost $2700. Not having insurance that 5 years saved me over 2 grand.

Nobody should be forced to buy insurance (health or car). That's one part of the affordable care act that I don't agree with. I do agree however that there should be a minimum of coverage that companies are allowed to offer. Going for the lowest bidder for the sake of the budget never works.

[DeruIsLove]

Quit trying dude, most on p99 are liberal red star wielding fuckin commies~ It's a losing battle to try to change liberals, it's a mental disorder.

You realize that American "liberals" are more conservative than right wing European fascists, don't you? They're about as communist as a McDonald's.

[Glenzig]

Quit trying dude, most on p99 are liberal red star wielding fuckin commies~ It's a losing battle to try to change liberals, it's a mental disorder.

I really don't care about politics either way. I'm just stating the facts.

[Shamalam]

They treat you and send you the same bill that they would get if you had insurance only without the insurance deductions.

Right, but what if that bill is $10,000+ and you can't afford to pay it? What if it never gets paid? They are just supposed to eat the loss and hope that the next patient has the ability to pay, or spend even more money to send collections after you? This is far from my area of expertise, but I just don't see how a hospital could sustainably operate like that.

[Circa.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GmY8KH03rM ???

[DeruIsLove]

Right, but what if that bill is $10,000+ and you can't afford to pay it? What if it never gets paid? They are just supposed to eat the loss and hope that the next patient has the ability to pay, or spend even more money to send collections after you? This is far from my area of expertise, but I just don't see how a hospital could sustainably operate like that.

As someone who works for a non for profit hospital (most hospitals are non nor profit) I'll tell you. They eat it.

In a perfect world that would be the end of my story but it's not. There's a reason you get charged $120 for a medical suture and $10 for a can of soda if you can afford to pay it/if your insurance covers you. Hospitals don't turn people away if they need treatment. Anything you may hear that's the opposite is far from the norm (though I do imagine it happens once in a while).

[BigHurb]

its the same denial as with cannabis and alcohol prohibition, only this way you are giving insurance companies PROFITS, because they are FOR PROFIT.

Not the drug cartels, like with pot. The CEO's.

Do you want to just give them money for nothing??? Ok if thats a mental disorder I would argue you are worse off than me.

[DeruIsLove]

Aren't you taking advantage of mental health services now? You think you'd be thankful of others who are paying into the system allowing you to benefit from it.

[BigHurb]

no thanks, fuck all ya'll :)

[DeruIsLove]

At least you're honest.

[stonez138]

Originally Posted by hatelore
Quit trying dude, most on p99 are liberal red star wielding fuckin commies~ It's a losing battle to try to change liberals, it's a mental disorder.

OMG so funny! How original too! I don't think Ann Coulter has ever said any thing like that 1000 times.

[Glenzig]

Right, but what if that bill is $10,000+ and you can't afford to pay it? What if it never gets paid? They are just supposed to eat the loss and hope that the next patient has the ability to pay, or spend even more money to send collections after you? This is far from my area of expertise, but I just don't see how a hospital could sustainably operate like that.

I guess most people haven't heard of indigent care. That's what you would do in this situation.

[BigHurb]

see all these retards acting like money can just materialize a physician... newsflash some of them work for free, not everyone wants money in life

[DeruIsLove]

see all these retards acting like money can just materialize a physician... newsflash some of them work for free, not everyone wants money in life

We're not talking about the civilized world. We're talking about the former democratic republic now capitalist oligarchy, the United states of America.

[BigHurb]

http://www.emailjokes.co.za/images/440621-naggers_56470_44062_1.jpg

[Tasslehofp99]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the absurdly weird/unnecessary questions they ask you on the exchange when you're signing up for your obamacare. Sign up for Obama care OR pay the penalty. Oh, and when you sign up make sure you let us know all this private information about your health/habits (that is no one's business but your own) so we can store it somewhere in some government computer.


Who really cares about the politics involved when our constitutional rights are being infringed upon? The government has no right to force/tax us us into submitting any private information about ourselves/our health. That is unconstitutional. When will the American people wake up and do something about this?

I would say probably never. It's too far gone now; I mean these people (you know, the one's "we" elected) have signed LAWS that allow them to assassinate/order drone strikes on American citizens at will. Meanwhile you people sit here and argue over obamacare? lol


This is what happens when people vote for the lesser of two evils.

[hatelore]

OMG so funny! How original too! I don't think Ann Coulter has ever said any thing like that 1000 times.

Really? I didn't know he congregated here... I would like to meet him.

[DeruIsLove]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the absurdly weird/unnecessary questions they ask you on the exchange when you're signing up for your obamacare. Sign up for Obama care OR pay the penalty. Oh, and when you sign up make sure you let us know all this private information about your health/habits (that is no one's business but your own) so we can store it somewhere in some government computer.


Who really cares about the politics involved when our constitutional rights are being infringed upon? The government has no right to force/tax us us into submitting any private information about ourselves/our health. That is unconstitutional. When will the American people wake up and do something about this?

I would say probably never. It's too far gone now; I mean these people (you know, the one's "we" elected) have signed LAWS that allow them to assassinate/order drone strikes on American citizens at will. Meanwhile you people sit here and argue over obamacare? lol


This is what happens when people vote for the lesser of two evils.

You don't and never have worked in the private sector, have you?

First, it's not get obamacare or pay the fine, it's be insured or pay the fine, the only difference is that your insurer needs to have certain things covered to keep people from being stuck with shit insurance because the company you work for went to the lowest bidder.
Secondly, if you ever worked a day in your life you'd know that all health insurance companies ask those questions, this is not new, I'd explain why but it'd obviously be over your head.

[Orruar]

OMG so funny! How original too! I don't think Ann Coulter has ever said any thing like that 1000 times.

Ann Coulter has talked about P99 1000 times? Didn't know she was a fan.

[mtb tripper]

see all these retards acting like money can just materialize a physician... newsflash some of them work for free, not everyone wants money in life

[Tasslehofp99]

You don't and never have worked in the private sector, have you?

First, it's not get obamacare or pay the fine, it's be insured or pay the fine, the only difference is that your insurer needs to have certain things covered to keep people from being stuck with shit insurance because the company you work for went to the lowest bidder.
Secondly, if you ever worked a day in your life you'd know that all health insurance companies ask those questions, this is not new, I'd explain why but it'd obviously be over your head.

Do you not see the fact that Americans are being forced into buying something (or paying the penalty if they don't) as unconstitutional?

How about the fact that the past two(3, really...) administrations have done everything possible to usurp power from the people and squash American freedom/rights? The democrats and republicans are working together against the American people and its never been more obvious than the last 2 decades.

War waged across the world in dozens of nations without any declaration of war
Patriot act
National defense authorization act
NSA warrantless surveillance of citizens
Obamacare
Bankers and wallstreet tycoons running wild because they're the ones putting presidents in office

Im not even into politics or debating them but its beginning to become very clear the direction this country is heading. Its alarming how many people have their in the sand until elections come around and MTV tells them who to vote for.

Its not about republicans vs dems or left vs right anymore, they are now part of the same team. Their job used to be to represent the american voters who elect them but now their job is to oppress you. They have successfully divided the american people(by distracting you with meaningless debates about gun control, abortion, immigration, etc), and now all that's left is for them to conquer.

Its about a legitimately tyrannical government slowly taking root in this country.

[BigHurb]

bro if you cant afford it, then you qualify for free. and if not, you can easily, EASILY pay the "fine" or MAN UP and buy insurance.

you have it for your car. get it for your body and stop fucking complaining, its a better deal than dying from a bacterial infection that costs pennies to cure.. jeez fucking violins for your "poor" oppressed rich people what do you work for the insurance companies??

[DeruIsLove]

Do you not see the fact that Americans are being forced into buying something (or paying the penalty if they don't) as unconstitutional?

How about the fact that the past two(3, really...) administrations have done everything possible to usurp power from the people and squash American freedom/rights? The democrats and republicans are working together against the American people and its never been more obvious than the last 2 decades.

War waged across the world in dozens of nations without any declaration of war
Patriot act
National defense authorization act
NSA warrantless surveillance of citizens
Obamacare
Bankers and wallstreet tycoons running wild because they're the ones putting presidents in office

Im not even into politics or debating them but its beginning to become very clear the direction this country is heading. Its alarming how many people have their in the sand until elections come around and MTV tells them who to vote for.

Its not about republicans vs dems or left vs right anymore, they are now part of the same team. Their job used to be to represent the american voters who elect them but now their job is to oppress you. They have successfully divided the american people(by distracting you with meaningless debates about gun control, abortion, immigration, etc), and now all that's left is for them to conquer.

Its about a legitimately tyrannical government slowly taking root in this country.
So TL;DR: you don't have a job.

[Tasslehofp99]

bro if you cant afford it, then you qualify for free. and if not, you can easily, EASILY pay the "fine" or MAN UP and buy insurance.

you have it for your car. get it for your body and stop fucking complaining, its a better deal than dying from a bacterial infection that costs pennies to cure.. jeez fucking violins for your "poor" oppressed rich people what do you work for the insurance companies??

I've purchased health insurance for myself..


Unfortunately though this is about a much larger issue than simple health care reforms.


Equally unfortunate is the fact that most folks are either blind to the reality of whats happening to our country or they just don't care. I mean people are happy giving away their rights and allowing themselves to be taken advantage of as long as they can get their starbucks, have their reality TV shows, listen to their government-regulated news, and own their ipads and iphones.


You are being duped into relinquishing control of your government. You get all the nice structure that makes you feel safe and satisfied (distracted), and the government knows you won't ask questions about why they're passing laws allowing the government to detain / kill American citizens without any legal process. YES, your government can legally spy on you/murder you using drones without a warrant or charges filed against you.


Scary:
Federal agencies (social security administration, homeland security, among others) are continuing to stockpile hollow point amunition for what they claim is "strictly for training purposes" (lol @ hollowpoints for target practice) and no one even gives this a second thought. This in combination with these "FEMA camps" that have been constructed all over the country is enough to scare the shit out of me.


I can remember a few times in history when things like this happened, can you?

Bet you also didn't know that Obama wanted to implement a conscription system in America to serve as a "civilian counterpart" to our military. Bush started this round of infringement on American rights, and obama continued it. I'm honestly scared to see whats next if people don't pull their heads out of their asses.

Shit is going down hill so fast and when people start to realize whats happened it will already be too late.





Yeah yeah /tinfoil hat off

[Tasslehofp99]

So TL;DR: you don't have a job.

Posted from work, sorry to disappoint you blind man.

[Barkingturtle]

How do you cope with living in constant fear of forces which are far beyond your control?

[Tasslehofp99]

How do you cope with living in constant fear of forces which are far beyond your control?

I come on elf sim forums and try to open da people's eyes to tyranny, dog.

[phacemeltar]

http://techcrunch.com/2014/04/25/a-word-with-the-creator-of-the-autoblow-2/?ncid=rss

[Sidelle]

I come on elf sim forums and try to open da people's eyes to tyranny, dog.

Good posts. /agree

[Jarnauga]

hi, im a euro

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130927215834/happytreefanon/images/0/0c/MJ_Popcorn.gif

[BigHurb]

At current graduation and training rates, the nation could face a shortage of as many as 150,000 doctors in the next 15 years, according to the Association of American Medical Colleges.

That shortfall is predicted despite a push by teaching hospitals and medical schools to boost the number of U.S. doctors, which now totals about 954,000.

The greatest demand will be for primary-care physicians. These general practitioners, internists, family physicians and pediatricians will have a larger role under the new law, coordinating care for each patient.

The U.S. has 352,908 primary-care doctors now, and the college association estimates that 45,000 more will be needed by 2020. But the number of medical-school students entering family medicine fell more than a quarter between 2002 and 2007.

---

not so funny that we de-emphasized math and science for so long, is it.. oh well, the rich will still get the best care and essentially money buys time on this planet... so hope is not lost for you rich assholes!

[BigHurb]

as long as you're better than a poor person, isnt that what its all about

[DeruIsLove]

Doctors in the US are slaves to the pharmaceutical companies. They are no better than lawyers.

[BigHurb]

are you poor? if so, please shut up

[Softcore PK]

The Affordable Care Act is a good thing, though it really doesn't go far enough. USA needs to get over itself and join the rest of the first world in taking care of its sick and poor.

[radditsu]

How do you cope with living in constant fear of forces which are far beyond your control?

[mtb tripper]

The Affordable Care Act is a good thing, though it really doesn't go far enough. USA needs to get over itself and join the rest of the first world in taking care of its sick and poor.

[Nikon]

Nothing like a bunch of people that spend all day on video games and emulator forums talking politics when they have no idea what they are talking about.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx2scvIFGjE

And these people actually leave the house...

I'm fairly certain 90% or better of ANYONE that talks politics has no idea what they are talking about. Everyone just regurgitates something they heard on TV or from some unreliable source.

I own part of a small business (less than 50 employees). It's not mandatory that I provide healthcare for my employees because of this, but I do. And I happen to have a side-by-side comparison sheet in front of me for one of my admin employees.

Same plan before and after ACA:

HMO
Deductible: $500/$1,000
Office Visits: $20/$40
Inpatient Hospital: 20%
Out of Pocket Limit: $6,350/$12,700
Prescription Drug Tiers: $15/$45/50%/20%
Includes basic dental

Monthly Premium before January 2014: $565.48
Monthly Premium after January 2014: $754.67

Now while that may not seem like much of an increase to some people, when you're trying to make money running a business and you're paying on average $189.19 more per month per employee for what they've already had for years, it doesn't make you very happy. That's $2,270.28 per year extra per person. I have an admin staff of 8 which puts me at $18,162.24 extra for the year just for healthcare that I didn't have to spend last year.

And to whomever mentioned premium increases, yes, that is standard in the industry. But our increases up until this point had been +dollars per year, not +100's of dollars. I am sure some employers do exaggerate the increases from ACA, but think if I had double, triple, or even four times as many employees. The costs add up quickly. I have heard stories of larger increases from other business owners but this is personally what I'm experiencing. Now I'm not directly carrying any costs over to my employees, but I can say that when it comes time for reviews for raises, it will definitely factor in.

What I've heard some companies in my situation (small business not required by law to provide healthcare) mulling over is the possibility of discontinuing healthcare coverage and raising the employee hourly rates by a fraction of what the new health care would cost. So say I'm paying a total of $754.67 per month per employee (translates to ~$4.72/hr), I could discontinue the healthcare coverage and pay my employees an extra $3.00-$3.50 per hour to 'compensate'. While it wouldn't cover their total cost of healthcare, it would still cost the company less in the long run and we could say that we were compensating for the difference. Bigger companies are simply slashing hours so that employees don't meet the minimum hours-worked requirement for the healthcare. Like it or not, this is the new reality.

TL;DR: ACA/Obamacare costs your company more money = FACT.

[radditsu]

I'm fairly certain 90% or better of ANYONE that talks politics has no idea what they are talking about. Everyone just regurgitates something they heard on TV or from some unreliable source.

I own part of a small business (less than 50 employees). It's not mandatory that I provide healthcare for my employees because of this, but I do. And I happen to have a side-by-side comparison sheet in front of me for one of my admin employees.

Same plan before and after ACA:

HMO
Deductible: $500/$1,000
Office Visits: $20/$40
Inpatient Hospital: 20%
Out of Pocket Limit: $6,350/$12,700
Prescription Drug Tiers: $15/$45/50%/20%
Includes basic dental

Monthly Premium before January 2014: $565.48
Monthly Premium after January 2014: $754.67

Now while that may not seem like much of an increase to some people, when you're trying to make money running a business and you're paying on average $189.19 more per month per employee for what they've already had for years, it doesn't make you very happy. That's $2,270.28 per year extra per person. I have an admin staff of 8 which puts me at $18,162.24 extra for the year just for healthcare that I didn't have to spend last year.

And to whomever mentioned premium increases, yes, that is standard in the industry. But our increases up until this point had been +dollars per year, not +100's of dollars. I am sure some employers do exaggerate the increases from ACA, but think if I had double, triple, or even four times as many employees. The costs add up quickly. I have heard stories of larger increases from other business owners but this is personally what I'm experiencing. Now I'm not directly carrying any costs over to my employees, but I can say that when it comes time for reviews for raises, it will definitely factor in.

What I've heard some companies in my situation (small business not required by law to provide healthcare) mulling over is the possibility of discontinuing healthcare coverage and raising the employee hourly rates by a fraction of what the new health care would cost. So say I'm paying a total of $754.67 per month per employee (translates to ~$4.72/hr), I could discontinue the healthcare coverage and pay my employees an extra $3.00-$3.50 per hour to 'compensate'. While it wouldn't cover their total cost of healthcare, it would still cost the company less in the long run and we could say that we were compensating for the difference. Bigger companies are simply slashing hours so that employees don't meet the minimum hours-worked requirement for the healthcare. Like it or not, this is the new reality.

TL;DR: ACA/Obamacare costs your company more money = FACT.

Cause they dont want you to provide it. They want you to punt it over to the exchanges. That and insurance companies love to nickel and dime people in situations like this. I hate buying insurance....

[Shamalam]

The Affordable Care Act is a good thing, though it really doesn't go far enough. USA needs to get over itself and join the rest of the first world in taking care of its sick and poor.

This is the obvious truth of the situation. A single-payer system is the only thing that makes any fucking sense, but it will never happen here because money. So tired of hearing obamacare-this, obamacare-that when the real solution has been in front us the whole time.

[r00t]

Nikon hit the nail on the head. Small businesses have suffered immensely under health care and wall street reform. Another one of the scams was "no new taxes on small businesses that make under $250,000!"

Besides the fact that promise has been broken in other ways, unless the company is only like 3 people, you're going to be pulling in way more than that, so it was kind of a moot selling point

[r00t]

This is the obvious truth of the situation. A single-payer system is the only thing that makes any fucking sense, but it will never happen here because money. So tired of hearing obamacare-this, obamacare-that when the real solution has been in front us the whole time.

Single payer socialism has no place in our republic

[Shamalam]

Right, because money. Like I said.

[Ahldagor]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNTBb1u6UGg

[Ahldagor]

Scandinavian Socialism in the US would do more for the world than anyone knows.

[Glenzig]

Its funny to me that people still think that somehow humans are on the edge of being led into a golden age where all of our needs will be met by a world government in a utopian type setting. But the governments can't even agree on how to meet basic human needs. Like health care. What a scam!

[Ahldagor]

Its funny to me that people still think that somehow humans are on the edge of being led into a golden age where all of our needs will be met by a world government in a utopian type setting. But the governments can't even agree on how to meet basic human needs. Like health care. What a scam!

because most people don't know what they want and are stupid. world gov will happen eventually tho. there's some groups of people being "progressivised" in some desert regions of the world atm.

[r00t]

World government is the stupidest idea liberals have come up with to date. Imagine if Hitler had been on charge of such an entity. A future tyrant could just quell dissent with neutron bombs.

[Shamalam]

I was wondering how long it would take the conservitards to bring up Hitler. Nine pages in, not bad.

[DeruIsLove]

I'm fairly certain 90% or better of ANYONE that talks politics has no idea what they are talking about. Everyone just regurgitates something they heard on TV or from some unreliable source.

I own part of a small business (less than 50 employees). It's not mandatory that I provide healthcare for my employees because of this, but I do. And I happen to have a side-by-side comparison sheet in front of me for one of my admin employees.

Same plan before and after ACA:

HMO
Deductible: $500/$1,000
Office Visits: $20/$40
Inpatient Hospital: 20%
Out of Pocket Limit: $6,350/$12,700
Prescription Drug Tiers: $15/$45/50%/20%
Includes basic dental

Monthly Premium before January 2014: $565.48
Monthly Premium after January 2014: $754.67

Now while that may not seem like much of an increase to some people, when you're trying to make money running a business and you're paying on average $189.19 more per month per employee for what they've already had for years, it doesn't make you very happy. That's $2,270.28 per year extra per person. I have an admin staff of 8 which puts me at $18,162.24 extra for the year just for healthcare that I didn't have to spend last year.

And to whomever mentioned premium increases, yes, that is standard in the industry. But our increases up until this point had been +dollars per year, not +100's of dollars. I am sure some employers do exaggerate the increases from ACA, but think if I had double, triple, or even four times as many employees. The costs add up quickly. I have heard stories of larger increases from other business owners but this is personally what I'm experiencing. Now I'm not directly carrying any costs over to my employees, but I can say that when it comes time for reviews for raises, it will definitely factor in.

What I've heard some companies in my situation (small business not required by law to provide healthcare) mulling over is the possibility of discontinuing healthcare coverage and raising the employee hourly rates by a fraction of what the new health care would cost. So say I'm paying a total of $754.67 per month per employee (translates to ~$4.72/hr), I could discontinue the healthcare coverage and pay my employees an extra $3.00-$3.50 per hour to 'compensate'. While it wouldn't cover their total cost of healthcare, it would still cost the company less in the long run and we could say that we were compensating for the difference. Bigger companies are simply slashing hours so that employees don't meet the minimum hours-worked requirement for the healthcare. Like it or not, this is the new reality.

TL;DR: ACA/Obamacare costs your company more money = FACT.
Exceptions do not make the rule. Stop projecting your personal experience on the entire system.

For every 'story' like yours, there are 100 saying the opposite.

Remember, people don't cry out when they are satisfied.
Nikon hit the nail on the head. Small businesses have suffered immensely under health care and wall street reform. Another one of the scams was "no new taxes on small businesses that make under $250,000!"

Besides the fact that promise has been broken in other ways, unless the company is only like 3 people, you're going to be pulling in way more than that, so it was kind of a moot selling point
You are sixteen, what the fuck do you know? You don't even know what type of government the United states is.
Single payer socialism has no place in our republic
The United states is an oligarchy. Get with the times kid.
because most people don't know what they want and are stupid. world gov will happen eventually tho. there's some groups of people being "progressivised" in some desert regions of the world atm.
A person is smart, a group of people are stupid. The fewer people in charge the better, the issue at hand is having standards and practices in check to keep those in charge from becoming the next Stalin, GWB or Hitler.

[r00t]

Well it was already commonly known Obama care is similar to Hitlers t4 health plan

[Ahldagor]

World government is the stupidest idea liberals have come up with to date. Imagine if Hitler had been on charge of such an entity. A future tyrant could just quell dissent with neutron bombs.

hitler's a bad example for that due to cultural norms and philosophical shifts that have taken place in the past century. it's proly going to take a few hundred years and we'll be long dead, but a world gov is going to be be more for resource distribution than anything. the imf and world bank already have authority over participating parties to enforce fair trade which is more to prevent violence between nations and promote talking. it's tedious and drawn out for some photos, but in the long run it's more stable than saber rattling.

[DeruIsLove]

World government is the stupidest idea liberals have come up with to date. Imagine if Hitler had been on charge of such an entity. A future tyrant could just quell dissent with neutron bombs.

Everyone in charge is Hitler and every unborn baby is Mozart. How conservative of you.

[r00t]

Hitler example was quite astute. Anyone wanting world government is a tyrant who wants others to conform to their policies.

Deru I am infinitely better educated, accomplished, and better looking than you so the logical fallacies are only hilarious :)

[Ahldagor]

A person is smart, a group of people are stupid. The fewer people in charge the better, the issue at hand is having standards and practices in check to keep those in charge from becoming the next Stalin, GWB or Hitler.

GWB= george w bush?

[Mandalore93]

World government previous to the internet was impossible due to communication issues. With the internet, it's really just a matter of people pulling their heads out of their asses and realizing that drawn up lines on a map that you happen to be born in don't really mean that much.

As for healthcare
It was fucked before Obamacare
It still seems to be fucked now, but we also need to remember that most plans need time to mature. while I don't like some provisions in Obamacare, I do like others.

[BigHurb]

lol this goon is better looking than what a dogs asshole...

also, any amount of money you can pay to NOT DIE is good.

pss: administrative overhead, PROFITS, should not be part of insurance at the level it is... there are your hidden costs right there.

[DeruIsLove]

Hitler example was quite astute. Anyone wanting world government is a tyrant who wants others to conform to their policies.

Deru I am infinitely better educated, accomplished, and better looking than you so the logical fallacies are only hilarious :)
Makes the broadest possible generalizations and insists their factuality, immediately claims superior education/learning which would imply understanding.

Yup.
GWB= george w bush?

Yes, but more specifically referring to his administration as a whole.

[Ahldagor]

Hitler example was quite astute. Anyone wanting world government is a tyrant who wants others to conform to their policies.

Deru I am infinitely better educated, accomplished, and better looking than you so the logical fallacies are only hilarious :)

i'm coming from a democratic outlook of world gov. which would be a hell to collect ballots for. i'm more a reproachful fool on this topic with some utilitarian notions.

[r00t]

Arguing for a singular point of power ignores everything we have learned about history and the corruption and sickness elites contract from their ivory towers. Every civilization has gone to tyranny where the elite have total immunity (including the current US govt)

[Ahldagor]

[QUOTE=DeruIsLove;1433312
Yes, but more specifically referring to his administration as a whole.[/QUOTE]

gotta disagree because they didn't systematically administer a genocide while enforcing public perception with persecution. they did some shady shit that should be prosecuted but no where near the unethical actions of stalin, hitler, franco, mao, pol pot etc.

[DeruIsLove]

gotta disagree because they didn't systematically administer a genocide while enforcing public perception with persecution. they did some shady shit that should be prosecuted but no where near the unethical actions of stalin, hitler, franco, mao, pol pot etc.

I draw my line for heinous tyrants a bit earlier than you, that's all.

[r00t]

You ppl are basically arguing my points against world government now. What makes you think it would be sunshine and roses?

[Ahldagor]

Arguing for a singular point of power ignores everything we have learned about history and the corruption and sickness elites contract from their ivory towers. Every civilization has gone to tyranny where the elite have total immunity (including the current US govt)

agree with you there and waiting for the crash and burn because it's more the US having to deal with fascism, but, unfortunately, fascism will be cemented in. compare the late weimar republic with our current one....there's some parallels and a cycle's repeating.

[r00t]

Yes Weimar republic is a good analogy. I've been prophesizing for years that hyperinflationary holocaust KS imminent

[Ahldagor]

I draw my line for heinous tyrants a bit earlier than you, that's all.

that doesn't make the comparison valid tho

[DeruIsLove]

that doesn't make the comparison valid tho

We're you asleep when Bush left office? Not trying to be offensive here. The worldwide celebration of GWB leaving the white house was something not seen since the Berlin wall fell.

[greenblze420]

seriously i made this as a troll thread and it got 103 replies? .....sad just sad

[Old_PVP]

Insurance is one of the greatest scams pulled on our society. These big insurance companies get to steal your money and get away with it, and you are bound by law to play ball. It is all just gambling when you boil down to it, and I would personally rather take the risk and save myself money, rather than throwing my money into these black hole companies.

How does it make any logical sense that an individual health insurance plan costs $50 per month, and a family plan exponentially increases to $700 a month. (these are real numbers from the place I work)

How does it make any logical sense that a "family plan" could theoretically include 3 people or even 15 people, and still be the same damn price? Like what the fuck, how hard is it for these insurance companies to say, well we will cover you, your wife, and your kid for $50 a pop which = $150. But of course not, that would just make too much sense.

Why should someone be forced to buy insurance if they are young, healthy, and never in need of it? To prepare for some "what if" scenario that may never happen?

[Nikon]

seriously i made this as a troll thread and it got 103 replies? .....sad just sad

It's RnF, man. Anything can happen!

[BigHurb]

You ppl are basically arguing my points against world government now. What makes you think it would be sunshine and roses?

you are a sociopath and a goon

[DeruIsLove]

seriously i made this as a troll thread and it got 103 replies? .....sad just sad

Pras for a successful thread. No reason to dial it back yet!

[DeruIsLove]

you are a sociopath and a goon

It took me several times to actually get your sig. The mere fact that faux news Latino exists was joke enough for me. :)

[r00t]

you are a sociopath and a goon

I did not know that people this stupid existed until I unfortunately came into contact with you

[baalzy]

Nikon hit the nail on the head. Small businesses have suffered immensely under health care and wall street reform. Another one of the scams was "no new taxes on small businesses that make under $250,000!"

Besides the fact that promise has been broken in other ways, unless the company is only like 3 people, you're going to be pulling in way more than that, so it was kind of a moot selling point

Not even remotely true dude. Unless the person running your business is an idiot and paying themselves 250k a year and then paying you out of his pocket. Wages are an expense and are not included in taxes on profits.

Payroll taxes also weren't increased, the temporary tax break on them expired. Saying Obama increased payroll taxes is like saying Walmart increased the price of Monster because it's not longer on sale.

I also fail to see how small businesses are hurt by the ACA when the only requirement most of them had to fulfill was simply TELLING their employees that the health exchanges exist.

Here go read some facts:
http://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/vb8vs/eli5_what_exactly_is_obamacare_and_what_did_it/c530lfx

[BigHurb]

I did not know that people this stupid existed until I unfortunately came into contact with you

so you're not a goon? just a sociopath sucking up little african baby tears with your arduino? sick!

[BigHurb]

besides it would be quite fortunate.. you dont like learning shit? thought you were about computer science ya heard?? got learn what to compute before computing it nurga

[DeruIsLove]

BigHurb sending the boy back to school.

[r00t]

Go read some facts *links known socialist propaganda website reddit as if it's an academic source*

As for the other two morans, your level of intelligence is so below me I have difficulty deciphering the nonsense you call insults

[r00t]

Literally no coherent thought to be found in this entire reply besides it would be quite fortunate.. you dont like learning shit? thought you were about computer science ya heard?? got learn what to compute before computing it nurga

[DeruIsLove]

I find Reddit to be lame on a greater level than most people but this is the first time I've seen someone refer to it as a "socialist propaganda website".

Good troll, good troll.

[radditsu]

I find Reddit to be lame on a greater level than most people but this is the first time I've seen someone refer to it as a "socialist propaganda website".

Good troll, good troll.

Have you met h00t?

[Rellapse40]

http://i.imgur.com/dLT5VSm.jpg

looks like this pedo is jealous of a happy couple

that dating site not working out 4 u?

[Rellapse40]

"I'm a huge fan of Japanese Animation and I love going to conventions, (panels, cosplay the whole nine yards) it's easily my favorite topic to discuss.

If you like anime, sci-fi, video games, or dislike Apple products, that's enough for me to know we'll at least 'get along'. Something good has got to start somewhere."

gl getting laid tho

[DeruIsLove]

https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/1380259_438207519631824_136333668_n.jpg
Still not an image released by its owner on these forums, unlike yours which you had publicly invited the members of these forums to.

It is a pretty picture though.
"I'm a huge fan of Japanese Animation and I love going to conventions, (panels, cosplay the whole nine yards) it's easily my favorite topic to discuss.

If you like anime, sci-fi, video games, or dislike Apple products, that's enough for me to know we'll at least 'get along'. Something good has got to start somewhere."

gl getting laid tho

This again? That profile became useless two years ago after I found someone and even between girlfriends since, I didn't need to use a dating site.

[Rellapse40]

https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/1380259_438207519631824_136333668_n.jpg

HOLY FUCK LOL WTF BBQ HAHA LULZ LAWLZ SHIT FUCK GODAMN

that is you

god damn you look like a full blown fagt

[r00t]

You're such a puss

[Bardalicious]

Note the awkward distance between him and the other cosplayers. Ouch.

Whose camera is laying on the ground? That of the sorry sucker you approached to snap the pic for you?

[DeruIsLove]

Note the awkward distance between him and the other cosplayers. Ouch.

Wouldn't expect someone on 24/7 Dragon alert to understand the concept behind photography etiquette and not getting in others'space when someone asked them for a shot.

[Rellapse40]

You should come out the closet.

Full blown fgt

[Bardalicious]

Wouldn't expect someone on 24/7 Dragon alert to understand the concept behind photography etiquette and not getting in others'space when someone asked them for a shot.

Gotta be pretty shitty to be socially outcast in a function full of a bunch of social outcasts. Do you have even one cosplay picture taken of you with friends to prove otherwise?

[Rellapse40]

100% he does not lol

[DeruIsLove]

You should come out the closet.

Full blown fgt
Tells man in dress in a public forum to "come out of the closet".

I realize it means little to you, that doesn't make my pointing out the ignorance of the statement any less enjoyable for me.
Gotta be pretty shitty to be socially outcast in a function full of a bunch of social outcasts. Do you have even one cosplay picture taken of you with friends to prove otherwise?

Ha ha. I see what you did there.
Yes I do and no I won't post them. The second I do is the second I stop getting to watch you idiots get banned over and over again for posting them.

[Rellapse40]

Tells man in dress in a public forum to "come out of the closet".


Any man who wears a dress out in the public is a full blown fgt

[Bardalicious]

Ha ha. I see what you did there.
Yes I do and no I won't post them. The second I do is the second I stop getting to watch you idiots get banned over and over again for posting them.


100% he does not lol

[Ahldagor]

We're you asleep when Bush left office? Not trying to be offensive here. The worldwide celebration of GWB leaving the white house was something not seen since the Berlin wall fell.

i was glad when his second term was over. filled with hope and clamoring for change...no. i only voted obama cause he didn't sell himself out to the religious right. W is still not comparable to those guys tho.

[DeruIsLove]

i was glad when his second term was over. filled with hope and clamoring for change...no. i only voted obama cause he didn't sell himself out to the religious right. W is still not comparable to those guys tho.

I see where you're coming from. In my eyes he was still a radical genocidal tyrant. The fact that he nearly destroyed this country in the process is what separates him from the successfully genocidal tyrants.

[Rellapse40]

You stroll around outside in a dress pretending to be a beautiful butterfly or some shit

lol

get real fgt

[Bardalicious]

idiots get banned over and over again

Yeah, I mean, what kind of sad degenerate would get banned on elf sim forums and just remake a new forum account to keep posting shit nobody cares about? ;)

[Ahldagor]

I see where you're coming from. In my eyes he was still a radical genocidal tyrant. The fact that he nearly destroyed this country in the process is what separates him from the successfully genocidal tyrants.

he was nowhere near destroying the country. you're delusional. the patriot act (been sliced and diced by the supreme court), deregulation of housing and banking (started under clinton), iraqi freedom was a clusterfuck but sadam didn't want to use the dollar to trade oil and we couldn't let that happen, and afghanistan was a legitimate response to an attack (i just wished we nuked 'em but them poppies are nice)

[DeruIsLove]

Is there a 4chan meme for constantly replying to someone while at the same time saying nobody cares?

[Bardalicious]

https://warosu.org/data/cgl/img/0068/36/1368474931425.jpg

[Rellapse40]

yea its called walking around in a park looking like a fgt

Google it

[DeruIsLove]

he was nowhere near destroying the country. you're delusional. the patriot act (been sliced and diced by the supreme court), deregulation of housing and banking (started under clinton), iraqi freedom was a clusterfuck but sadam didn't want to use the dollar to trade oil and we couldn't let that happen, and afghanistan was a legitimate response to an attack (i just wished we nuked 'em but them poppies are nice)

6 years have passed and it's still extremely sad to hear people making excuses for if not for Nixon, the worst president in modern history.

[DeruIsLove]

https://warosu.org/data/cgl/img/0068/36/1368474931425.jpg

I don't do Meguka cosplay.

[Bardalicious]

Not enough children to prey on at "Meguka" functions or what?

[DeruIsLove]

Not enough children to prey on at "Meguka" functions or what?
Nice try.

It's still in top 5 for popularity so that's not it.

[Ahldagor]

6 years have passed and it's still extremely sad to hear people making excuses for if not for Nixon, the worst president in modern history.

see, that's a 3/10. you got the angle on your shot fade i'm guessing.

[DeruIsLove]

see, that's a 3/10. you got the angle on your shot fade i'm guessing.

There was nothing redeemable about that 8 years. Everyone was worse for it who didn't have their hands in it. You know there would have been no chance in hell of him getting that second term if we weren't at war (and if they didn't rig Florida)

[r00t]

Nixon was nowhere near as bad as the Clinton or Carter crooks. He was a pretty swell guy overall in comparison.

[DeruIsLove]

Clinton.
Shut up kid.
You aren't old enough to remember the best 8 years since Kennedy.

[r00t]

lol dude Im older than you

and more like worst years. firebombing waco, removal of glass stegall, tyranny after okc, bombing more 3rd world countries than Bush... list goes on and on

[Barkingturtle]

We also lost Tupac on Clinton's watch.

[r00t]

PS: Here's a list of the nations Bill Clinton bombed:

Somalia (inherited from Papa Doc Bush)
Yugoslavia (inherited from Papa Doc Bush)
Bosnia 1993
Haiti 1994
Croatia 1995
Zaire 1996
Liberia 1997
Albania 1997
Sudan 1998
Afghanistan 1998
Iraq 1998
Yugoslavia 1999
Yemen 2000

[DeruIsLove]

My ass. Look at this slanderous bullshit. Inb4 you claim the Cuban missile crisis was propaganda while you slam JFK.

[Ahldagor]

There was nothing redeemable about that 8 years. Everyone was worse for it who didn't have their hands in it. You know there would have been no chance in hell of him getting that second term if we weren't at war (and if they didn't rig Florida)

dude, ohio for the past three presidential elections. and the supreme court decided 2000's.

Nixon was nowhere near as bad as the Clinton or Carter crooks. He was a pretty swell guy overall in comparison.

nixon's egregious (non archaic) ethical violation was what led to carter, clinton, reagan, bush 1, bush 2, and obama to be crooks. the inherent distrust and disengagement of the american people of and from the government has enabled that. we focus on the president more when congress is the body of gov that has to do the work to make the laws etc. while the president is the figure head, now anyway, and the supreme court broadens interpretations of words based upon shady rhetoric that enables the buying and selling of the government more than ever. shit's crazy now.

[DeruIsLove]

bombed:

Learn2crusemissile kid.

[r00t]

youre mad I pointed out your idol Clinton has bombed like 420x the countries you were just calling Bush the worst tyrant ever over

[BigHurb]

lol dude Im older than you

and more like worst years. firebombing waco, removal of glass stegall, tyranny after okc, bombing more 3rd world countries than Bush... list goes on and on

you werent alive for nixon or you would know ur talking out your ass, again

[r00t]

You don't have to be alive during the era to know things about history, its kind of the point

[r00t]

You could invade 1 country and do more damage to humanity than fire bombing 10 or so countries so it is always a matter of perspective. I think most presidents have been horrendous pawns of the banking cartels and the military industrial complex since the early 1900's.

1913 to be precise

[DeruIsLove]

youre mad I pointed out your idol Clinton has bombed like 420x the countries you were just calling Bush the worst tyrant ever over

Ever meet anyone from any of those nations? Guess what, the nations Clinton 'bombed' don't consider him a tyrant. In fact a good number of them requested those payloads themselves. If you were around for Yugoslavia for example, you'd know this.

[r00t]

Ever meet anyone from any of those nations? Guess what, the nations Clinton 'bombed' don't consider him a tyrant. In fact a good number of them requested those payloads themselves. If you were around for Yugoslavia for example, you'd know this.

plenty of people actually do like us in Iraq and Afghanistan too, nothing is unanimous

[DeruIsLove]

plenty of people actually do like us in Iraq and Afghanistan too, nothing is unanimous

Yeah, the ones we're paying for their oil!

[r00t]

or the ones who realized the fundies were ruining their advancement as a people

[r00t]

tru

[DeruIsLove]

or the ones who realized the fundies were ruining their advancement as a people

You mean the same ones who wanted us to get the fuck out 3 years later when it was clear stabilisation was not happening? That I will agree with.

[DeruIsLove]

The key difference is the people Clinton assisted were and still are thankful for his assistance. Last I checked GWB is still banned from a few countries.

[r00t]

It's hard to argue against the validity that Clinton's later acts to distract Americans from his extramarital affair were truly criminal and impeachable, causing thousands of deaths

The day before the House impeachment vote, Clinton bombed Iraq, delaying the impeachment vote. He continued the bombing throughout all the days of the impeachment vote. Only an hour or two after the House impeachment vote ended, Clinton ended the bombing, saying, "We have achieved our objectives." Of course, because the objective was to delay and distract from the impeachment vote

[DeruIsLove]

It's hard to argue against the validity that Clinton's later acts to distract Americans from his extramarital affair were truly criminal and impeachable, causing thousands of deaths

The day before the House impeachment vote, Clinton bombed Iraq, delaying the impeachment vote. He continued the bombing throughout all the days of the impeachment vote. Only an hour or two after the House impeachment vote ended, Clinton ended the bombing, saying, "We have achieved our objectives." Of course, because the objective was to delay and distract from the impeachment vote

Look at the tinfoil hat on that one!

[Lune]

I'd let slick willy father my children

[DeruIsLove]

Naez just jelly that Ol' Billy C. is loved round the world. It's ok, I am too, that *****'s straight.

[r00t]

Look at the tinfoil hat on that one!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Iraq_(1998)#Distraction_from_Clinton_im peachment_scandal

[r00t]

the false left vs. right paradigm distracts from the substantive debate of what policy is liberty vs. tyranny

so unfortunately the nanny state liberals and the big government neocons are all tyrants

[Barkingturtle]

Its sad that there are young people, in the information age of the internet, that still live in a left vs right paradigm.

The alternative is to grasp at unattainable political ideals, ultimately leading to total disenfranchisement and probably social anxiety, too.

[DeruIsLove]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Iraq_(1998)#Distraction_from_Clinton_im peachment_scandal

Desert Fox? Yes, tinfoil hat.

[DeruIsLove]

I think the unattainable idea is to keep voting in democrats and republicans to "change" the country when they are responsible for the countries atrophy.

Do go gather up all of the Bildarbergs and pretty much every CEO who isn't Bill gates and kill them off French revolution style if you want change. Otherwise, shut up because change ain't gonna happen.

[r00t]

Bill Gates is a bilderberger

[Barkingturtle]

The pedophile kinda has a point. You're blaming politics for the evils of capitalism.

[r00t]

capitalism is the best way to advance the species. we invent, commies build

[BigHurb]

id rape last three posters

[DeruIsLove]

Bill Gates is a bilderberger

What part of 'except Bill gates' didn't you understand?

[Tann]

What part of 'except Bill gates' didn't you understand?

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/3a/3ae8a4fa1b60547fba9ea264d1cd3cb76d3ce3a323ccf66756 023aabd0aaa506.jpg

[BigHurb]

oooohhuuh gonna stick it in lrons hot tunnel so deeeeep

[Barkingturtle]

Seems you need to know the difference between crony capitalism and free market capitalism.



I know the difference. Only one of them actually exists; the latter is just a flowery notion used to enable to former.

And capitalism is not the best way to advance anything but profits, you fucking dummies. Capitalism actually restricts tech by withholding advancements till the last product has been milked till dry.

[DeruIsLove]

final thought.

Voted for Hillary 6 years ago (primary obv), Obama was merely the (far) lesser of two other evils. in 2016 I do plan on voting for the hero of Benghazi, the great Hillary Clinton who took the fall so that the Mormon man would not get elected.

[r00t]

Capitalism restricts ingenuity implementation into the market place or government? I think you are mistaking "capitalism" for government.

If me and a group of friends can produce a product that is better, more efficient and more desirable than another company, what stops us from delivering that product to the public for profit other than the miles of red tape in the way put there by corporations who lobby to have laws passed to stop competition?

yet another argument against world government. I read an article a few years back in the Economist about the 4 different ways the future could go. They were all pretty dystopic except the one where life remained as is, spread out across sovereign nation states with their own local policies. It was the one with the most technological advancement.

[BigHurb]

im going to write Brad McQuaid

[BigHurb]

yet another argument against world government. I read an article a few years back


lol nurgas dont read nice try

[r00t]

Oh Im sorry, it was a Rockefeller foundation report. Was thinking Economist cuz of Rothschilds

http://www.rockefellerfoundation.org/uploads/files/bba493f7-cc97-4da3-add6-3deb007cc719.pdf

[Barkingturtle]

If me and a group of friends can produce a product that is better, more efficient and more desirable than another company, what stops us from delivering that product to the public for profit (are) the miles of red tape in the way(,) put there by corporations who lobby to have laws passed to stop competition

I took the liberty of removing the question mark from the end of your sentence.

Read it again now, I'll wait.

What you just read was an accurate description of how capitalism functions.

I don't confuse capitalism for government. I recognize government as a means to capitalism's ends.

[r00t]

itt

corporate communism != capitalism

[Barkingturtle]

You are responding to me as if i am someone who thinks that our current government is one represented by free market capitalism, its not and I dont think that.

So now that you have altered my sentence to address that our current government structure is indeed a system of cronyism, do you mind addressing my actual question?

Your question is just some theoretical exercise. I'm not into mental masturbation. I'm into rubbing my dick on things. I'm into reality, because I don't see any value in fantasizing about the ideal economic policy.

People who resort to unattainable ideals do so because they are cowards. It's easy to hold opinions that will never be tested.

[phacemeltar]

i cant believe that you filthy humans are capable of having a 20-page discussion without it spiraling into accusations of RMT and faggery. the world appreciates your service.

[Tann]

http://thecityconnects.org/uploads/2/9/5/4/2954900/5171700_orig.jpg

[BigHurb]

and now ill put my seed in you, lron

[radditsu]

Big hurb is stealing my gimmick.

[Glenzig]

I think this topic is a pretty good commentary on just how divisive politics and government are in general.

[Ahldagor]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_United_v._Federal_Election_Commission

http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/09pdf/08-205.pdf

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCutcheon_v._Federal_Election_Commission

http://images.politico.com/global/2014/04/02/12-536_e1pf.html


the US government is for sale now, and corruption has been defined as a strict quid pro quo. more money means more words even though we speak a common language, but that is the innovative drive that makes free market capitalism triumph, right? barkingturtle is right about the restrictions that companies place on each other that stifle innovation along with the milking-dry of every cheaply made product. so now i ask what's the difference between a nanny state and a country entirely dependent upon the products of the companies selling products within it?

[Tasslehofp99]

The Affordable Care Act is a good thing, though it really doesn't go far enough. USA needs to get over itself and join the rest of the first world in taking care of its lazy and unmotivated.

ftfy

[radditsu]

ftfy

Check your privilege