The Great Red Jailbreak of 2014

[Derubael]

Recently, on February 6th 2014, a number of banned accounts were accessed on Red 1999. These accounts were never unbanned, but were instead able to be accessed via an error that occurred during the February 5th hotfix. This exploit was attended to immediately, and there was approximately a 24 hour window where accounts could be accessed.

During this small window, a number of accounts were accessed and immediately stripped of all items and gear. We believe this firmly implies that the players who logged into these accounts were aware that the ability to access their banned accounts may have been an exploit, but did not report it. Out of all the accounts accessed, only a single person who got gear off an account mentioned it to the staff prior to the bannings.

After much discussion, we as a staff have decided the accounts banned in that wave will remain banned. Any account that received items from a banned account will remain banned.

The exception to this is characters who were merely used in a quick transfer (IE, the items went to you and then were immediately transferred to another character). If you were not the end recipient of a 'banned item', then please petition on the petition/exploit forum and we will provide instructions on how to have your account unbanned.

Thank you, and enjoy your weekend!

[Took]

goog

[Eslade]

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/34/344f148238488166e812cae596a2217438e87396929acf3ec0 df24ebcc6262dc.jpg

[Nyanknits]

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/34/344f148238488166e812cae596a2217438e87396929acf3ec0 df24ebcc6262dc.jpg this reaction image never gets old

[Not_Kazowi]

Lot of respect for the GMs doing this. These people deserve to pay for their damaging intentions.

[Nyanknits]

then again, kind of shitty in a lot of ways - the items were tracked down, so why keep the accounts banned instead of just deleting the items?

edit: or allow for a petition to be made where the player admits they received the items, and lists the items - sort of an admission of guilt and in exchange an account reactivation?

[Eslade]

then again, kind of shitty in a lot of ways - the items were tracked down, so why keep the accounts banned instead of just deleting the items?

Because why would you transfer items off of a banned character without first saying something to GMs unless you know you're doing something you shouldn't be doing? There are probably a couple of exceptions, but for the most part there was a lot of whistles being thrown into doo doo that day.

[mrproudbeard]

then again, kind of shitty in a lot of ways - the items were tracked down, so why keep the accounts banned instead of just deleting the items?

edit: or allow for a petition to be made where the player admits they received the items, and lists the items - sort of an admission of guilt and in exchange an account reactivation?

Or... people could just not be total crapbags and knowingly take advantage of a situation.

[Kazi]

Zero tolerance for deliberate and malignant exploitation. Good on the staff for following through.

[Heywood]

Because they would be sending the message that it's okay to break rules/do things that are obviously wrong, as long as you say you're sorry after you've been caught.

[Derubael]

then again, kind of shitty in a lot of ways - the items were tracked down, so why keep the accounts banned instead of just deleting the items?

edit: or allow for a petition to be made where the player admits they received the items, and lists the items - sort of an admission of guilt and in exchange an account reactivation?

It's not an admission of guilt if you only come clean after you've been sent to jail.

Also, 500+ items were removed in 24 hours, and we don't have unique identifiers on items, meaning we'd have to either:

A) Go through, by hand, logging in each character and deleting all the items or,
B) I'd have to send 30 different SQL delete queries to Rogean for the inventory tables on each character to delete the items.

Neither is worth the effort to get some dirty whistles unbanned, particularly when all that needed to be done was notify the staff prior to jailbreaking your banned toon's items. If the first thing you did upon logging in your banned toon was strip it, you obviously knew something was up.

[Tassador]

/cheer

[Musetii]

Release the names of banned characters stripped and let the community pursue justice!

[DeadlyApostle]

It was a mistake made by server staff. Now you take away months of someones work because its not "worth the effort?" Why not just give an amnesty period where people can petition with what was moved and you delete the items?

[Derubael]

It was a mistake made by server staff. Now you take away months of someones work because its not "worth the effort?" Why not just give an amnesty period where people can petition with what was moved and you delete the items?

So are you saying people who find a dupe exploit, abuse it, and don't report it, should be given an 'amnesty' period where they come clean, simply because there was a mistake in the code?

naw

[vouss]

lol

[mikemandella]

Banned Nihilum members going hard in the paint... Pras GM's for swift and righteous justice.

- Oppressor

[Kazi]

naw

[mrproudbeard]

I think some people on this forum need to go ask their mom & dad to explain actions & consequences to them. Perhaps they can wipe your nose and dry your eyes for you as well.

[Gaffin 7.0]

i know this pain i can relate

[DeadlyApostle]

Most people believed it was the mass unbannings that happened when Kunark was released.

[quido]

pras

[Zihm]

You use the word "jailbreak" like you weren't the ones that unbanned the characters. Most people who had characters banned and still played here apparently had other characters, and were probably just eager to get dropable gear into the hands of their new mains. It doesn't necessarily prove wrong-doing. For instance, if you had a 55 ench banned with an AoN on it and your new main was a 60 enchanter, wouldn't you want that item on the level 60? And wouldn't you be excited to do it?

Also, you banned the accounts, not the items. Most people, even if they felt they were not supposed to be un-banned, had that distinction in mind.

[Colgate]

You use the word "jailbreak" like you weren't the ones that unbanned the characters. Most people who had characters banned and still played here apparently had other characters, and were probably just eager to get dropable gear into the hands of their new mains. It doesn't necessarily prove wrong-doing. For instance, if you had a 55 ench banned with an AoN on it and your new main was a 60 enchanter, wouldn't you want that item on the level 60? And wouldn't you be excited to do it?

Also, you banned the accounts, not the items. Most people, even if they felt they were not supposed to be un-banned, had that distinction in mind.

are you normally this retarded or is this just a flare up?

[Gaffin 7.0]

are you normally this retarded or is this just a flare up?

[Thrilla]

best geared shaman, best of the best winner, been on server since day 1. almost 2 years of work (however long server been live) gone for accepting a manastone.

it was fun server while it lasted

a manastone that was available through a server error mind u. not like you figured out a way to hack a banned account and pull it. they inadvertently enabled the behavior and are now punishing to the highest degree over it, sucks.

[mrproudbeard]

best geared shaman, best of the best winner, been on server since day 1. almost 2 years of work (however long server been live) gone for accepting a manastone.

it was fun server while it lasted

Guess you ain't the best geared shaman anymore!

[Colgate]

best geared shaman, best of the best winner, been on server since day 1. almost 2 years of work (however long server been live) gone for accepting a manastone.

it was fun server while it lasted

you bought that shaman from doors

lying, rule-breaking SCUM

good riddance

[Thrilla]

It's not an admission of guilt if you only come clean after you've been sent to jail.

Also, 500+ items were removed in 24 hours, and we don't have unique identifiers on items, meaning we'd have to either:

A) Go through, by hand, logging in each character and deleting all the items or,
B) I'd have to send 30 different SQL delete queries to Rogean for the inventory tables on each character to delete the items.

Neither is worth the effort to get some dirty whistles unbanned, particularly when all that needed to be done was notify the staff prior to jailbreaking your banned toon's items. If the first thing you did upon logging in your banned toon was strip it, you obviously knew something was up.

while I respect the volunteer work provided here, man can it be harsh sometimes.. the best thing to do is just not do questionable shit, but i feel that there isn't enough of the responsibility being taken on the server part for their part in this, i can guarantee you that not every single person who accepted an item knew the intent, and its just shitty.

[Zihm]

are you normally this retarded or is this just a flare up?

Judging from this and other comments, i take it that nihilum are the ones taking the brunt of these bannings?

If the intent of the bannings was to damage nihilum, then (and i don't mean this sarcastically) job well done. Esp if it was all entrapment from the beginning. I mean damn.

But I honestly don't see the GMs on this server being so unprofessional as to ban accounts rather than correct their mistakes. I just don't. Especially with them trying to jump on the Pantheon coat tails. There had to be ulterior motives.

while I respect the volunteer work provided here, man can it be harsh sometimes.. the best thing to do is just not do questionable shit, but i feel that there isn't enough of the responsibility being taken on the server part for their part in this, i can guarantee you that not every single person who accepted an item knew the intent, and its just shitty.

[Willson-Fisk]

People had differing situations, people who weren't the intended "end recipient" still permabanned. Sux lol. Oh well. Hurray for rl also being fun.

[mikemandella]

Absolutely ZERO Azrael complaints... How odd..

- Oppressor

[Elderan]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.

I thought you were better than this Derubael.

[Zihm]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.

I thought you were better than this Derubael.

That's not going to help.

[mikemandella]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.

I thought you were better than this Derubael.

I know you are mad, but don't insult the staff.. They do an awesome job!

- Oppressor

[Nocsucow]

hahaha here comes mad nihilum members who were banned ... plz be some of wheelchizzar's toons....maybe duke was smart enough to get his peons to do all the transferring for him

[Elderan]

I know you are mad, but don't insult the staff.. They do an awesome job!

- Oppressor

Not an insult. Just a honest response to everything surrounding this "decision".

[Colgate]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.

I thought you were better than this Derubael.

i expected this post to end with another hollow threat of quitting the server

[sprinkle16]

sorry you got banned for accepting a manstone ghost, now log on killjoy and play that shaman

PS To staff,,,

this thread would be MUCH more fun if you listed the names of banned chars

just saying.

[Instagib]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.

I thought you were better than this Derubael.

You don't like it don't play here

[Nocsucow]

i expected this post to end with another hollow threat of quitting the server

could only hope ......

[Nocsucow]

because non-toxic players quitting is exactly what a low pop server needs.

who are you calling non toxic?

[Colgate]

because non-toxic players quitting is exactly what a low pop server needs.

elderan is a known 2boxer who should be permabanned right now

[Slathar]

because non-toxic players quitting is exactly what a low pop server needs.

I am so happy people who abused a mistake are banned forever. :)

Bye Ghost. Abuse-exploiting nerd. Hope you never come back.

[Elderan]

elderan is a known 2boxer who should be permabanned right now

They don't ban for boxing on this server. See lite...

But they do ban for helping people transferring items.

[Colgate]

They don't ban for boxing on this server. See lite...

But they do ban for helping people transferring items.

lite doesn't box

seen this too many times; be a better player than someone, and they'll just cry foul and make up random accusations about you to try and justify their shortcomings

[Derubael]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.


This wasn't something that Sirken and I simply cooked up and threw out because we were 'lazy'. This was the result of an ongoing discussion between the entire staff, including Rogean and Nilbog, that lasted nearly 2 weeks.

Bottom line is only a single person came to us with concerns that something may be wrong. THAT is "really unacceptable", and brings to light an even more destructive issue in the Red community than anything else that could result from this situation.

[Kraftwerk]

But they do ban for helping people transferring items.

You are without a doubt the largest crybaby I've seen in a videogame.

[Colgate]

This wasn't something that Sirken and I simply cooked up and threw out because we were 'lazy'. This was the result of an ongoing discussion between the entire staff, including Rogean and Nilbog, that lasted nearly 2 weeks.

Bottom line is only a single person came to us with concerns that something may be wrong. THAT is "really unacceptable", and brings to light an even more destructive issue in the Red community than anything else that could result from this situation.

would you care to name the guild that harbors a majority of these exploiters?

just out of curiosity

[Elderan]

This wasn't something that Sirken and I simply cooked up and threw out because we were 'lazy'. This was the result of an ongoing discussion between the entire staff, including Rogean and Nilbog, that lasted nearly 2 weeks.

Bottom line is only a single person came to us with concerns that something may be wrong. THAT is "really unacceptable", and brings to light an even more destructive issue in the Red community than anything else that could result from this situation.

Come on. We know this "descison" was the path of least effort. There were multiple other options which were significantly better but they required more work. So the easy one, which was the worst one, was picked.

[Awwalike]

so how much did rettiwalk pay to get his acct back hehehe

[Nocsucow]

Come on. We know this "descison" was the path of least effort. There were multiple other options which were significantly better but they required more work. So the easy one, which was the worst one, was picked.

You have to admit , 500 items in a 24 hr time period shows what ever happened was pre meditated and everyone knew what the fuck was going on... even the people " helping transfer". So pras staff for being "lazy" and still making the right choice

[heartbrand]

Banned Nihilum members going hard in the paint... Pras GM's for swift and righteous justice.

- Oppressor

last I checked Sickpuppy <Azrael> ate the dirt over this ban as well :):):):):)

[Gongshow]

http://25.media.tumblr.com/11a0cdd91ef678224a6915b98f36b951/tumblr_n1f2e9enRr1qf1116o1_400.gif

[Nocsucow]

Back ... sickpuppy got banned? That sucks

[heartbrand]

Back ... sickpuppy got banned? That sucks

Why? He was one of THE most toxic players on the box. Now he's PERMANENTLY banned for this. RIP

/who all sickpuppy
[60 Arch Mage] Sickpuppy <AZRAEL> Zone: BANNED

[heartbrand]

lite doesn't box

seen this too many times; be a better player than someone, and they'll just cry foul and make up random accusations about you to try and justify their shortcomings

http://imageshack.com/a/img163/5205/y0mo.jpg

[Nocsucow]

I liked sickpuppy ... I even have some screenys of me killing him back in the day

[krazyGlue]

Why? He was one of THE most toxic players on the box. Now he's PERMANENTLY banned for this. RIP

/who all sickpuppy
[60 Arch Mage] Sickpuppy <AZRAEL> Zone: BANNED

rly? the second im not guilded with you. all you do is throw me under the buss.

[mrproudbeard]

This response from the GMs is lazy and really unacceptable.

I thought you were better than this Derubael.

You should put the leaderboard back up so you can take it down again in protest.

[Fame]

goog

[Sektor]

its sad seeing people get banned. I just don't believe players should be perma banned for this. I'm not defending nilly or azrael. They should be punished but not like this. :/

[Kergan]

its sad seeing people get banned. I just don't believe players should be perma banned for this. I'm not defending nilly or azrael. They should be punished but not like this. :/

Completely agree.

[Nocsucow]

You should put the leaderboard back up so you can take it down again in protest.

Lmao

[mikemandella]

Why? He was one of THE most toxic players on the box. Now he's PERMANENTLY banned for this. RIP

/who all sickpuppy
[60 Arch Mage] Sickpuppy <AZRAEL> Zone: BANNED

Wanna take the 600k challenge on that big HB?

- Oppressor

[Colgate]

http://imageshack.com/a/img163/5205/y0mo.jpg

all i'm seeing is basiah dead

[heartbrand]

O i c ur just trolling np

[Mac Dretti]

all i'm seeing is basiah dead

look @ chat

[Rallyd]

This wasn't something that Sirken and I simply cooked up and threw out because we were 'lazy'. This was the result of an ongoing discussion between the entire staff, including Rogean and Nilbog, that lasted nearly 2 weeks.

Bottom line is only a single person came to us with concerns that something may be wrong. THAT is "really unacceptable", and brings to light an even more destructive issue in the Red community than anything else that could result from this situation.

Or could it be the FACT that all banned accounts were unbanned for the release of Kunark on blue, and since a lot of the players who play on Red99, used to play on Blue99, one could easily assume that this was the case for upcoming Velious as well.

Bad GM's make bad decisions, kill communities, wonder why nobody plays.

[lite]

all i'm seeing is basiah dead

and that 2nd slot levi Protecting them clickies though, lmfao.

[Elderan]

Or could it be the FACT that all banned accounts were unbanned for the release of Kunark on blue, and since a lot of the players who play on Red99, used to play on Blue99, one could easily assume that this was the case for upcoming Velious as well.

Bad GM's make bad decisions, kill communities, wonder why nobody plays.


Logic is not welcome here, apparently.

[lite]

cept nihilum has a rich history of exploiting everything that presents itself

[Gaffin 7.0]

hahaha here comes mad nihilum members who were banned ... plz be some of wheelchizzar's toons....maybe duke was smart enough to get his peons to do all the transferring for him

your in the wrong forum bro this isnt blue

[still_MORNIN]

ban em all

[fiegi 8.0]

pras the gm's for banishing these scumlord cheaters from the box

[Nocsucow]

your in the wrong forum bro this isnt blue

I've been on red longer than you fucktard so shut the fuck up and don't speak unless spoken to

[Silent]

and that 2nd slot levi Protecting them clickies though, lmfao.

Not everyone has to box a shaman, druid, cleric, enchanter to full raid buff yourself and friends before you go out /oocing for location of nihilum or wander around KC/DL solo til you find someone to disc on. But either way, raid buffs don't help when you kill yourself to 70pt+ DS's.

[lite]

Not everyone has to box a shaman, druid, cleric, enchanter to full raid buff yourself and friends before you go out /oocing for location of nihilum or wander around KC/DL solo til you find someone to disc on. But either way, raid buffs don't help when you kill yourself to 70pt+ DS's.

should stop boxing portahoe and get yourself some better box toons. if you gonna cheat like a scumbag at least do it right.


PS , what does that have to do with a 2nd slot levitate and ur clickies being above it ? lol

[Elderan]

Recently, on February 6th 2014, a number of banned accounts were accessed on Red 1999. These accounts were never unbanned, but were instead able to be accessed via an error that occurred during the February 5th hotfix. This exploit was attended to immediately, and there was approximately a 24 hour window where accounts could be accessed.

During this small window, a number of accounts were accessed and immediately stripped of all items and gear. We believe this firmly implies that the players who logged into these accounts were aware that the ability to access their banned accounts may have been an exploit, but did not report it. Out of all the accounts accessed, only a single person who got gear off an account mentioned it to the staff prior to the bannings.

After much discussion, we as a staff have decided the accounts banned in that wave will remain banned. Any account that received items from a banned account will remain banned.

The exception to this is characters who were merely used in a quick transfer (IE, the items went to you and then were immediately transferred to another character). If you were not the end recipient of a 'banned item', then please petition on the petition/exploit forum and we will provide instructions on how to have your account unbanned.

Thank you, and enjoy your weekend!

So let me get this right..

Someone who has quit the server logs in. They give their items back to the guild. They ask some random guild member to transfer this stuff to the guild. That person takes the items with intention of them giving them back to the guild bank.

The person who just happened to be in TS who took the items to hold them eats a perma ban.

Seems totally justified?

[Nocsucow]

So let me get this right..

Someone who has quit the server logs in. They give their items back to the guild. They ask some random guild member to transfer this stuff to the guild. That person takes the items with intention of them giving them back to the guild bank.

The person who just happened to be in TS who took the items to hold them eats a perma ban.

Seems totally justified?


To bad this didn't happen

[mrproudbeard]

You forgot the part where their account was previously banned.

[Elderan]

You forgot the part where their account was previously banned.

How does that person who is just helping even know that? If they did how do you prove it? You cant, really simple.

[Awwalike]

elderan quit fighting it reroll and pay papa nizzar for pixels like vaporize

[Elderan]

elderan quit fighting it reroll and pay papa nizzar for pixels like vaporize

I don't care if my worst enemy was banned for this. I would fight against it since it is completely and utterly wrong.

[Stasis01]

Wrong, you'd stick to whatever Nizz is saying.

[heartbrand]

o look it's stasis guy who claims about box health but whose actions are completely contradictory

[Colgate]

I don't care if my worst enemy was banned for this. I would fight against it since it is completely and utterly wrong.

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhaahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahhaahahahahahahahahhhhhahahahahahah

[Instagib]

How does that person who is just helping even know that? If they did how do you prove it? You cant, really simple.

Stop trying to lawyer around the rules you piece of shit

[fiegi 8.0]

I don't care if my worst enemy was banned for this. I would fight against it since it is completely and utterly wrong.

http://cdn.arwrath.com/1/133851.gif

[Stasis01]

o look it's stasis guy who claims about box health but whose actions are completely contradictory

I'm not a fucking saint, I just point out bullshit and common sense improvements.

Like boxing trial till pop gets a little higher, no ports, groups, etc, shits just so painful trying to play my monk now.

[Rallyd]

This is a bit like putting a gorgeous naked girl in front of a caveman then putting him in prison for life because she was under 18.. how the fuck is he supposed to know that.

[Nocsucow]

Its more like a armored truck pulls up outside of the bank the arm guard goes in to make a drop off and leaves truck unguarded and open. Then 20 random people jump in the back of the truck and take the cash, get caught and try to lawyer that since the door was open it was fair game

[Sektor]

This is a bit like putting a gorgeous naked girl in front of a caveman then putting him in prison for life because she was under 18.. how the fuck is he supposed to know that.

lol shut up nerd

[Not_Kazowi]

Or could it be the FACT that all banned accounts were unbanned for the release of Kunark on blue, and since a lot of the players who play on Red99, used to play on Blue99, one could easily assume that this was the case for upcoming Velious as well.

Bad GM's make bad decisions, kill communities, wonder why nobody plays.

Free server with volunteer management and this dickwad is calling them out for doing the right thing.


You make me sick. Pretty simple to not do the wrong things while playing here, logic exceeds most of these nerds.

Pras GMs for their holy crusade and cleansing of sinners.

[Fame]

Justice in norrath, pras

[Elderan]

Free server with volunteer management and this dickwad is calling them out for doing the right thing.


You make me sick. Pretty simple to not do the wrong things while playing here, logic exceeds most of these nerds.

Pras GMs for their holy crusade and cleansing of sinners.

There were 3 other options here. All 3 were better than the option picked.

[BrobbVZ]

:)

[Nocsucow]

There were 3 other options here. All 3 were better than the option picked.

Better for who? Pixel hungry fucktards? Get a life bro

[Kraftwerk]

This is a bit like putting a gorgeous naked girl in front of a caveman then putting him in prison for life because she was under 18.. how the fuck is he supposed to know that.

This situation is exactly like a caveman committing statutory rape, I can't believe nobody else saw that before you brought this to our attention.

[Nirgon]

http://www.kibois.org/Images/Emergency%20Services/get%20help.jpg

[Colgate]

This situation is exactly like a caveman committing statutory rape, I can't believe nobody else saw that before you brought this to our attention.

let out a good snortle at this one, people in this pizza place giving me weird looks

[Supreme]

Entrapment in its most basic form.

[oil]

this thread is gold

[oil]

you bought that shaman from doors

lying, rule-breaking SCUM

good riddance

Can we talk about this part again? Also what happened to the original ghost post? and the one where the orig owner chimed in? and did Colgate just get banned b4 my eyes?

this is like primetime special material

[mrproudbeard]

How does that person who is just helping even know that? If they did how do you prove it? You cant, really simple.

I guess you should get more upstanding friends to play Everquest with.

[Nocsucow]

I guess you should get more upstanding friends to play Everquest with.

This^

[karsten]

"the great red jailbreak 2014" is the worst fucking way to explain decisions. Derubael, i've called you on your power tripping/server trolling before (and you've admitted to having done it and said you'd watch it in the future) and you're doing it again.

Decisions are one thing, powertripping those decisions is another. If you wanna be the king of red, act like you deserve it.

[hagard]

"the great red jailbreak 2014" is the worst fucking way to explain decisions. Derubael, i've called you on your power tripping/server trolling before (and you've admitted to having done it and said you'd watch it in the future) and you're doing it again.

Decisions are one thing, powertripping those decisions is another. If you wanna be the king of red, act like you deserve it.

ur salty tears r delicious

[krazyGlue]

Did Noah get banned ?

[oil]

let out a good snortle at this one, people in this pizza place giving me weird looks

this is the real tragedy of this whole situation. man was cut down in the prime of his life, virtually assassinated for whistleblowing while trying to get some damn pizza

[Nocsucow]

"the great red jailbreak 2014" is the worst fucking way to explain decisions. Derubael, i've called you on your power tripping/server trolling before (and you've admitted to having done it and said you'd watch it in the future) and you're doing it again.

Decisions are one thing, powertripping those decisions is another. If you wanna be the king of red, act like you deserve it.

It wasn't just his choice to do this.... this thread title is no worse then every other fucking red thread started and trust me I doubt he wants to be the king of red 99
. This choice was probably voted on by the people above him and due to them being busy he had to be the one who delivered the message. The titles could of been " Hey dumb fucks guess what?" And the outcome would still be the same....

[oil]

trust me

done and done :cool:

[Supreme]

Clearly this is all a setup to rid Red99 of Nihilum. A "glitch" to unban accounts, knowing that most of the banned accounts where Nihilum members, only to see them move items then use that as an excuse to ban even more Nihilum players.

I have played here since the start. Supported the community in every way possible.

But this is bullshit.

The grand contradiction to all of this is that Sirken states on one hand that he wants a healthy server population then on the other hand allows these kind of crap decisions?

This promotes health and encourages new players to want to play here...how?

[Nocsucow]

Clearly this is all a setup to rid Red99 of Nihilum. A "glitch" to unban accounts, knowing that most of the banned accounts where Nihilum members, only to see them move items then use that as an excuse to ban even more Nihilum players.

I have played here since the start. Supported the community in every way possible.

But this is bullshit.

The grand contradiction to all of this is that Sirken states on one hand that he wants a healthy server population then on the other hand allows these kind of crap decisions?

This promotes health and encourages new players to want to play here...how?

To bad, so sad... gtfo if you don't like

[Supreme]

To bad, so sad... gtfo if you don't like

This will be a great quote for you....when you find yourself on the end of these bad decisions.

[Silent]

To bad, so sad... gtfo if you don't like

Probably the most annoying poster to hit the red forums since rellapse, Go back to where you came.

[Nocsucow]

Haha sorry bud I love this shit


Cry about it

[karsten]

dat actually mite B relapsee

[Derubael]

"the great red jailbreak 2014" is the worst fucking way to explain decisions. Derubael, i've called you on your power tripping/server trolling before (and you've admitted to having done it and said you'd watch it in the future) and you're doing it again.

Decisions are one thing, powertripping those decisions is another. If you wanna be the king of red, act like you deserve it.

I respectfully laid out why people were banned, what happened, and our reasoning behind the decision. This decision was made by the whole staff, not just me. If you feel 'the great red jailbreak' is an inaccurate or inappropriate title, take it up with Nilbog and Rogean.

I don't like to ban people. Nor do I like telling people they are banned. Wiping months or sometimes even years of work out of someones life is not something I enjoy doing. Unfortunately, some times it is necessary to do so.

And if you think this is me 'powertripping' you have lost your mind. You had best believe if that ever happens the server won't need you to point out what's going on.

[mrproudbeard]

Clearly this is all a setup to rid Red99 of Nihilum. A "glitch" to unban accounts, knowing that most of the banned accounts where Nihilum members, only to see them move items then use that as an excuse to ban even more Nihilum players.


I'm sure the volunteers who spend all the time on the server dealing with all the crap sit around in their free time coming up with ways to generate more crap to deal with.

You guys are seriously narcissistic enough to think anyone cares if your guild plays here or not? Get a grip.

Also pretty telling that your guild had the most banned accounts, you all know it, and you're shocked that the people banned did something shady and it resulted in more people getting banned. Maybe you should re-evaluate who you are playing Everquest with? Maybe you should re-evaluate your life in general really if you are this worked up over a video game.

[karsten]

You had best believe if that ever happens the server won't need you to point out what's going on.

are you threatening us?

[Quiet]

List of banned players would be nice. Anyone caught PLing their new toons should also feel the icy stone surface of the ban hammer.

[Nocsucow]

This will be a great quote for you....when you find yourself on the end of these bad decisions.

i bet if this were RD or Azrael people getting hit like this i bet you would have a quote about the same in one of these threads

[karsten]

"the great red jailbreak of 2014"

[karsten]

made possible by a GM mistake and the hopes of people for velious

[Elderan]

I respectfully laid out why people were banned, what happened, and our reasoning behind the decision. This decision was made by the whole staff, not just me. If you feel 'the great red jailbreak' is an inaccurate or inappropriate title, take it up with Nilbog and Rogean.

I don't like to ban people. Nor do I like telling people they are banned. Wiping months or sometimes even years of work out of someones life is not something I enjoy doing. Unfortunately, some times it is necessary to do so.

And if you think this is me 'powertripping' you have lost your mind. You had best believe if that ever happens the server won't need you to point out what's going on.

So someone in jail notices the door is left open. So they walk out of jail. Down the road at some point they ask someone for a ride. The person not knowing what is going on gives them a ride. They drop them off where ever and go about their business. Later that day the jail bird gets picked up by the police and sent back to jail.

The police then go find the person who gave them a ride and throws them in jail for the same amount of time the other person was jailed for.

Sounds about right?

[Derubael]

So someone in jail notices the door is left open. So they walk out of jail. Down the road at some point they ask someone for a ride. The person not knowing what is going on gives them a ride. They drop them off where ever and go about their business. Later that day the jail bird gets picked up by the police and sent back to jail.

The police then go find the person who gave them a ride and throws them in jail for the same amount of time the other person was jailed for.

Sounds about right?

No, because those people would be doing the equivalent of a transfer, and are getting unbanned.

It's more like letting that convict live in your house, and not telling the police they were there. Then when they show up to arrest him, you say 'i'm sorry officer, I didnt know he was a convict! I just let strangers stay in my house cause I'm a good person!'

The moral of this story is don't hang out with people who have dirty whistles. They might get your whistle dirty.

[BlkCamel]

No, because those people would be doing the equivalent of a transfer, and are getting unbanned.

It's more like letting that convict live in your house, and not telling the police they were there. Then when they show up to arrest him, you say 'i'm sorry officer, I didnt know he was a convict! I just let strangers stay in my house cause I'm a good person!'

The moral of this story is don't hang out with people who have dirty whistles. They might get your whistle dirty.

If you want to look at real Lawyer'ing, this is it. Derubael is right, ignorance is not an acceptable defense of the law.

Also picking up someone on the side of a road is against the law, for this and similar reasons. Hitchhiking is illegal in most of the USA, too many dumb lawyers arguing for ignorance.

[Elderan]

No, because those people would be doing the equivalent of a transfer, and are getting unbanned.

It's more like letting that convict live in your house, and not telling the police they were there. Then when they show up to arrest him, you say 'i'm sorry officer, I didnt know he was a convict! I just let strangers stay in my house cause I'm a good person!'

The moral of this story is don't hang out with people who have dirty whistles. They might get your whistle dirty.


So what if a old friend shows up at your door and ask if he can stay with you for the day. Being an old friend and not seeing him in a while you say sure. Then later that day the police shows up and arrest him. You do nothing to stop them and explain you had no idea they were escaped from jail. Then you are arrested, convicted and sentenced to life in prison.

See the injustice?

[mrproudbeard]

So what if a old friend shows up at your door and ask if he can stay with you for the day. Being an old friend and not seeing him in a while you say sure. Then later that day the police shows up and arrest him. You do nothing to stop them and explain you had no idea they were escaped from jail. Then you are arrested, convicted and sentenced to life in prison.

See the injustice?

The really critical difference:

1 is real life where there are laws and you have rights.

1 is a free video game where volunteers clean up the messes of ungrateful d-bags and then listen to other d-bags complain about how the mess was cleaned up.

[Nocsucow]

So what if a old friend shows up at your door and ask if he can stay with you for the day. Being an old friend and not seeing him in a while you say sure. Then later that day the police shows up and arrest him. You do nothing to stop them and explain you had no idea they were escaped from jail. Then you are arrested, convicted and sentenced to life in prison.

See the injustice?

its like arguing with my child about why she cant go outside in the rain and play

[mrproudbeard]

its like arguing with my child about why she cant go outside in the rain and play

It's actually kinda funny how bad they are at basic debate & reasoning. It really is like arguing with someone who's about age 10 or less.

[Elderan]

So what if a old friend shows up at your door and ask if he can stay with you for the day. Being an old friend and not seeing him in a while you say sure. Then later that day the police shows up and arrest him. You do nothing to stop them and explain you had no idea they were escaped from jail. Then you are arrested, convicted and sentenced to life in prison.

See the injustice?

I am going to analyze my own situation here..

Yes the person who let them in there house might get arrested (like the chars were temp banned). They might get a small sentence from the judge (like the accounts were banned for 15 days.

But NO WAY IN HELL they would get a LIFE sentence for this.

This is one of my main points. These people have already been banned for 15 days. You don't think that alone is punishment enough?

[BlkCamel]

I am going to analyze my own situation here..

Yes the person who let them in there house might get arrested (like the chars were temp banned). They might get a small sentence from the judge (like the accounts were banned for 15 days.

But NO WAY IN HELL they would get a LIFE sentence for this.

This is one of my main points. These people have already been banned for 15 days. You don't think that alone is punishment enough?


Short answer No! The reason is as Derubael explained the items would still be there on the unbanned characters. The 500+ items that were intended to be removed from circulation were circulated out to these characters. If they unbanned them they would have to do the additional work of identifying and deleting the items. Sure they could do this but why would they? It is more work for them and they already made their decision that enough work had been put in.

[Nekkojakk]

This is awesome, anyone have popcorn?

[Vile]

Elderan's pixel desperation is amazing. Delicious tears and no Erudite shit.

[Vayder]

Posting in this thread so history will show I was here

[Nocsucow]

Elderan's pixel desperation is amazing. Delicious tears and no Erudite shit.

so did elderan get banned in this whole thing .. or is he lawyering for everyone else?

[Heywood]

Is Elderan really comparing getting banned with B&E?


Broski, seems like you need a break for this.

[Kazi]

This promotes health and encourages new players to want to play here...how?

I don't think Sirken is trying to encourage cheaters to play, tho

[Nekkojakk]

This is stupid. The people posting negative comments about what's being argued have no idea whats going on.

So many people 2 box on a regular basis, which is clearly against the server rules but never get banned.

Accepting an item trade where duping or exploiting isn't involved should not be permabanned. Many of the items traded were not items that were duped in the first place and may in 50% of the cases been items that were on loan for the accounts banned.

The people that reported the issue were also Nihilum because they were not sure if this was intentional or not and thought it was intentional due to the Pledge Drive for Pantheon and also as a precursor to Velious to drive the population back up.

This is why the word 'Entrapment' is being used, maybe whoever is involved and is raising this with the 'whole of staff' is putting a spin on what actually happened. I understand this whole situation took such a long time to track and appreciate the time the staff put in this game.

They got a list of accounts involved. Run a cross query for these accounts with any item transfers that occurred in a window deleting any items of those IDs' from the account. I'm sure the community would be more than happy to help you with those queries if it is going to take too long to figure out how to do this.

Perma banning players over stuff like this is only going to suck players out of the R99 community. Nilly will just recruit new members to replace these players meaning the competition would have less players to compete with. This is the bottom line and reality. Nihilum has the best leadership on this server, which is why it thrives.

1. The single person who reported the issue prior to the ban's taking place.

It's not as if all these accounts were randomly logged on. Someone logged one banned account, let everyone else know what was going on. Then people logged other banned accounts and helped transfer items. I'm sure no batphoning for usernames/passwords of banned accounts happened either and they we're all logged in on seperate IP addresses.

2. Its a free server staffed and ran by people that receive nothing for doing so. They should take the easiest path when dealing with this sort of bullshit.

[COLGATETHEGRANDMASTER]

hahahHAHHhhHAHAhaahhahahahhahaa

[COLGATETHEGRANDMASTER]

Can we talk about this part again? Also what happened to the original ghost post? and the one where the orig owner chimed in? and did Colgate just get banned b4 my eyes?

this is like primetime special material

the character Ghost was made by Doors aka Took, and he eventually sold the character(i think at level 50 in classic?) to the current owner of Ghost aka Mrzek who is a member of Nihilum

he was complaining that the character he had put 2 years into and had played since server release got banned, but that's bullshit because he bought the character like a year, maybe a year and a half ago

think i got forum banned for a month because i might-have/probably called someone a faggot

not sure

just says "hatespeech" which gave me a real good laugh

[King Chip]

the character Ghost was made by Doors aka Took, and he eventually sold the character(i think at level 50 in classic?) to the current owner of Ghost aka Mrzek who is a member of Nihilum

he was complaining that the character he had put 2 years into and had played since server release got banned, but that's bullshit because he bought the character like a year, maybe a year and a half ago

think i got forum banned for a month because i might-have/probably called someone a faggot

not sure

just says "hatespeech" which gave me a real good laugh

5 of my accounts have been banned for saying bundle of sticks too. Pretty gay

[COLGATETHEGRANDMASTER]

5 of my accounts have been banned for saying bundle of sticks too. Pretty gay

you missed the guineapig age

this is nothing compared to that

[COLGATETHEGRANDMASTER]

1) I think there were 2 petitions, 1 was from Nilly leadership for clarification. No bat phones were sent out, I can verify that as I am on that list. Nilly is part of a much larger community that encompasses other games, including Taken on blue, so we have multiple channels. It isn't hard for people to pass this information by word of mouth across game channels, this why all the IPs are different.

2) I totally agree, they can run it how they want, I am merely pointing out there are better options to take and I'm sure the community is willing to lend a hand in terms of resources in order to help the enforcement of the fairest and healthiest outcome.

I made a post about GM bannings drive down the server population in the past.

We see trends here:
Server wide repops > Increase Server Population
Exp bonus > Increase Server Population
Unbanning of accounts > Increase Server Population
Widespread account bannings > Decrease Server Population
Excessive Policing > Decrease Server Population
Excessive OOC and Forum garbage/trolls > Decrease Server Population
Excessive PvP and Griefing > Decrease Server Population

Just my opinion based on what I am seeing.

yes, excessive pvp is bad for the server

JESUS YOU'RE DUMB

[Pudge]

about 80,000 nillies crying in this thread (okay, maybe just 8)..................

you 8 deserve it.

retti on the other hand was smarter than yall, and he escaped scot free with his dastardly pixel procurement plans

[COLGATETHEGRANDMASTER]

Excessive PVP stops people from progressing, especially for those that need PvE gains to be competitive in PvP.

Adding you to ignore Colgate. Yet again you fail to provide constructive criticism, you degenerate pile of excretion.

AHAHAHAHHHhHAHAhHAHAHAHAHAHAHhahahahhahahahahHAHHA hHAHAHAHHAHAhahahahahhah

[Cid]

Just so you guys have a much better analogy to use, along with a precedent for unknowingly aiding in a criminal matter, I suggest you look up the expression, "His name is Mudd!"
A doctor has a man show up with a broken leg, so he offers the man medical attention and afterwards the man leaves. The man turned out to be John Wilkes Booth on the run after killing Lincoln. Dr. Mudd was arrested for aiding and abetting a criminal, and though he was eventually released, the doctor lost everything he had for helping a person in need, which doctors swear in their oath to do.

If I had been on, it's quite possible I might have been caught up in this since I like helping people and have no fucking clue who is/was a banned character. It would suck, but justified or tyrannical decision, it's still just a damn game. It's not exactly hard to level a toon, I soloed several.
It's human nature to feel like no one has ever suffered or been oppressed as much as you have, but try to get a little wider perspective on this situation. If the worst thing that happens to you in your lifetime, or even in the last year, occured in the course of playing a video game, I'd say you're a lucky motherfucker.

If all my characters got banned it wouldn't even be the worst thing to happen to me in the last couple weeks. So, let's try and calm down and try collected and well-mannered approach, because insulting people is just going to make them more defiant.

Deru did say in one of his first posts that there will be exceptions for those who merely played middleman and did not receive items for themself. If you are truly innocent you should be confident you will be cleared and playing again soon, and enjoy the vacation from the computer. It is probably long overdue.

[Loto]

If you are truly innocent you should be confident you will be cleared and playing again soon.

Hence the desperation posts from the scum of the server.

[mostbitter]

anyone willing to return backpacks full of items that had been transferred should be unbanned. Plenty easy to trace this stuff with player help. No reason to even set a time line. Just work at it a few minutes a day till it's all done. This info isn't going anywhere, you could take as little time away from whatever to sort through it and fix this mess at your leisure. My friend got banned for this and had no idea what he was doing and I just spent the last two years trying to get him to play here and no he wants to quit.

You guys really need to put some work into red if you want to see red thrive instead of always taking the method of least resistance, imo.

[Loto]

My friend got banned for this and had no idea what he was doing and I just spent the last two years trying to get him to play here and no he wants to quit.

Sounds like you used your friend to do your dirty work. Maybe he doesn't want to be playing video games with you anymore.

[Zoolander]

So are you saying people who find a dupe exploit, abuse it, and don't report it, should be given an 'amnesty' period where they come clean, simply because there was a mistake in the code?

naw

how many of those tmo platdupers have been permanently banned? 1? 2?

and mind you, there is a difference between duping and transfering items

also, how long does it take to strip a character before banning him for a gm? or delete that character completely since its a permaban anyways

i have mixed feelings about this whole issue but permabans for xfering items is clearly way to hard as punishment

[Derubael]

how many of those tmo platdupers have been permanently banned? 1? 2?

and mind you, there is a difference between duping and transfering items

also, how long does it take to strip a character before banning him for a gm? or delete that character completely since its a permaban anyways


Anyone who duped plat had all of their accounts permabanned, every account they logged in even a single time over the course of 3 years was given a minimum two week suspension, and any account they logged in more than a certain number of times was permabanned.

Based on this criteria, I highly doubt there would be a single person in Nihilum left on the server. But I think it's clear that kind of heavy handed intervention would be inappropriate in this instance.

So let's make more thinly veiled suggestions about how this situation is being handled unfairly, yes? Or would you like to stop making statements on situations you know nothing about?

[Zoolander]

Based on this criteria, I highly doubt there would be a single person in Nihilum left on the server.

ive never duped, trained or been banned. i havent even killed naked players on red.

but yes, iam in nihilum. i hope this doesnt get me banned one day.

[Tradesonred]

Enjoy your bans, toxics

Bonus points for extra toxic pathological liar maximilien's tears

[JayN]

Anyone who duped plat had all of their accounts permabanned, every account they logged in even a single time over the course of 3 years was given a minimum two week suspension, and any account they logged in more than a certain number of times was permabanned.

Based on this criteria, I highly doubt there would be a single person in Nihilum left on the server. But I think it's clear that kind of heavy handed intervention would be inappropriate in this instance.

So let's make more thinly veiled suggestions about how this situation is being handled unfairly, yes? Or would you like to stop making statements on situations you know nothing about?

ive never duped, trained or been banned. i havent even killed naked players on red.

but yes, iam in nihilum. i hope this doesnt get me banned one day.

you just got skooliod holmes, dirty whistles all around; pras GMs for finally stepping up

[Tradesonred]

This is stupid. The people posting negative comments about what's being argued have no idea whats going on.

So many people 2 box on a regular basis, which is clearly against the server rules but never get banned.

Accepting an item trade where duping or exploiting isn't involved should not be permabanned. Many of the items traded were not items that were duped in the first place and may in 50% of the cases been items that were on loan for the accounts banned.

The people that reported the issue were also Nihilum because they were not sure if this was intentional or not and thought it was intentional due to the Pledge Drive for Pantheon and also as a precursor to Velious to drive the population back up.

This is why the word 'Entrapment' is being used, maybe whoever is involved and is raising this with the 'whole of staff' is putting a spin on what actually happened. I understand this whole situation took such a long time to track and appreciate the time the staff put in this game.

They got a list of accounts involved. Run a cross query for these accounts with any item transfers that occurred in a window deleting any items of those IDs' from the account. I'm sure the community would be more than happy to help you with those queries if it is going to take too long to figure out how to do this.

Perma banning players over stuff like this is only going to suck players out of the R99 community. Nilly will just recruit new members to replace these players meaning the competition would have less players to compete with. This is the bottom line and reality. Nihilum has the best leadership on this server, which is why it thrives.

Nihilum had the least toxic leadership and zerged, which is why it thrived. At least now theres an alternative with red dawn. Cheerleading on the forums for xp loss in PVP while knowing it allowed Nihilum to stop people from contesting 98% of the time was pretty toxic.

I dont see the problem here. I read the warning about "the staff will figure out if you took items from banned accounts so you better return them", so did you. Please dont make me laugh with plausible deniability claims (about not knowing about this) with Nihi having probably the best intel passed around about whats going on that affects the server.

Again, dont see the problem. People were warned, if a reasonable amount of time was allowed to pass, to let the players the chance to return the items, and you didnt? You cant seriously cry when the ban wasnt effective immediately and had your chance on a silver platter to not get banned.

Good riddance exploiters, IMO.

[dre]

lol, corruption

[Quineloe]

Also, you banned the accounts, not the items. Most people, even if they felt they were not supposed to be un-banned, had that distinction in mind.

There's also this silly notion that when you ban someone, you ban the player.

Count your blessings.

[Tradesonred]

There's also this silly notion that when you ban someone, you ban the player.

Count your blessings.

[Faerie]

Good decision by the devs and GMs here. Don't let the cheaters and their friends get you down, Deru. Many of them are cool people, but if they're not going to take the server seriously then it shouldn't be a big deal when they discover they're banned.

More consistent and harsh punishments across the board would do a lot to increase the average player's faith in the server. Everyone thinks that everyone else is cheating here, and they're sadly often right. For what it's worth, my vote goes to there being no more half measures. A 2 week suspension is like sending your toddler to timeout. We're all adults here (I think), so when we screw up in a significant way we should expect a permaban or a long raid suspension, as a guild.

[Vamael]

Serious question, there was some innocent people in this mix. Some people had items on them not knowing they were dirty, how do they get their account cleared?

[Tradesonred]

Good decision by the devs and GMs here. Don't let the cheaters and their friends get you down, Deru. Many of them are cool people, but if they're not going to take the server seriously then it shouldn't be a big deal when they discover they're banned.

More consistent and harsh punishments across the board would do a lot to increase the average player's faith in the server. Everyone thinks that everyone else is cheating here, and they're sadly often right. For what it's worth, my vote goes to there being no more half measures. A 2 week suspension is like sending your toddler to timeout. We're all adults here (I think), so when we screw up in a significant way we should expect a permaban or a long raid suspension, as a guild.

HOLY SHIT

I think thats the first ever post i agree with Faerie

High five

[Faerie]

HOLY SHIT

I think thats the first ever post i agree with Faerie

High five

How does it feel to be right for once?

[Bazia]

The exception to this is characters who were merely used in a quick transfer (IE, the items went to you and then were immediately transferred to another character). If you were not the end recipient of a 'banned item'

Oh no please don't ban our level 1 freeport mules that the gear ended up on, anything but that!

Ban whoever touched this shit period. No one was dumb enough to not store this stuff on meaningless mules.

[Quiet]

I am going to analyze my own situation here..

Yes the person who let them in there house might get arrested (like the chars were temp banned). They might get a small sentence from the judge (like the accounts were banned for 15 days.

But NO WAY IN HELL they would get a LIFE sentence for this.

This is one of my main points. These people have already been banned for 15 days. You don't think that alone is punishment enough?


I agree. Life sentence is harsh. All sinners shall be punished with 3 years of ban hammer to the face of their account. See you guys in 2017. #Fair

[heartbrand]

Might want to change your password pal before you get deleted / banned. Poor basiah boxed 24:7 naked with corpses all over norrath.

[Vamael]

so if you have a banned bag, you are unbanned?

[Bazia]

Might want to change your password pal before you get deleted / banned. Poor basiah boxed 24:7 naked with corpses all over norrath.

don't care let he rest in Valhalla

3 months till I come back and make cleric #16

[Faerie]

so if you have a banned bag, you are unbanned?

If you had a banned bag for a short while performing a transfer they will unban you. If you have a bag your account remains banned.

[quido]

anyone willing to return backpacks full of items that had been transferred should be unbanned

ya caught me - here you can have the stuff back, I didn't want it anyways!!

also lol @ Elderan

[Bazia]

who got banned for this so far

[Vamael]

Here is the issue i have, I gave innocent people items who had no idea they was anything wrong with the items. I actually feel bad they lost their characters.

[Vamael]

its ok ban my 3rd wizard now, but dont ban the people who had no idea.

[Tradesonred]

Here is the issue i have, I gave innocent people items who had no idea they was anything wrong with the items. I actually feel bad they lost their characters.

That, if true, i will agree is a big problem.

Personally i would only ban the characters directly involved in the transaction with banned accounts. As in, lets say we call the banned accounts "infected"

Only the accounts that directly touch, directly receive items from the "infected" accounts should get banned unless someone can explain to me some ramification from 2nd and 3rd "generation" transfers im missing here.

[Pudge]

Dirty nilly pixel lusters drew like flies to the honeypot once their multitude of banned chars became available for a single day.

Is this entrapment? Was it a setup all along to bring down the most heinous guild to ever plague elf simulator servers worldwide?

I hope so.

[heartbrand]

Dirty nilly pixel lusters drew like flies to the honeypot once their multitude of banned chars became available for a single day.

Is this entrapment? Was it a setup all along to bring down the most heinous guild to ever plague elf simulator servers worldwide?

I hope so.

Hey moran, you realize multiple azrael are banned from this? Your guild has the dirtiest whistle on box pal.

[quido]

Let's make a list! I want to know who to mourn

[mikemandella]

Hey moran, you realize multiple azrael are banned from this? Your guild has the dirtiest whistle on box pal.

600k challenge on that? Which characters are currently banned from this?

- Oppressor

[Silent]

The problem most people are having with this are the ones who were banned for transferring or being given items, were not talking fungi's, hiero cloaks, AON's here. We are talking shitty items like JC wisdom ring/ear 55hp rings, bloodstained mantles. some non bp/leg kunark clicky gear and other items like that. Nothing special, just extra gear no one cared about. I am sure everyone was anxious to risk being banned over 1k of trash gear.

[quido]

So deliberately taking items from accounts you know should be banned is excusable if the items are below a certain value? I don't think so.

[Tradesonred]

The problem most people are having with this are the ones who were banned for transferring or being given items, were not talking fungi's, hiero cloaks, AON's here. We are talking shitty items like JC wisdom ring/ear 55hp rings, bloodstained mantles. some non bp/leg kunark clicky gear and other items like that. Nothing special, just extra gear no one cared about. I am sure everyone was anxious to risk being banned over 1k of trash gear.

I think the value of the items should be of almost 0 weight in the decision to ban or not ban an account. Only the degree to which accounts touch "infected" accounts should be taken into account pretty much.

Shouldnt matter if you duped 2k or 75k. You duped, youre out.

[Elderan]

So deliberately taking items from accounts you know should be banned is excusable if the items are below a certain value? I don't think so.

And how is someone supposed to know that? Do you need to petition a gm every time before a trade to make sure the account it is coming from isn't supposed to be banned?

[Eslade]

These accounts were originally banned for one reason or another, so it's not like there was a bunch of people with clean whistles that did one thing. These people have prior offenses and just added one more and they ALL got caught. It's surprising that only one person decided to ask the GMs what's going on instead of just stripping the characters within a 24 hour window.

Don't do shady shit and the GM's won't do anything bad to your account.
The theory that this is entrapment is stupid and very tin foil btw.

[quido]

Yeah I'm sure you guys had no idea what was going on. Everyone who received an item did so innocently. Ok.

[krazyGlue]

Hey moran, you realize multiple azrael are banned from this? Your guild has the dirtiest whistle on box pal.

0 azrael is banned from this

[Pudge]

Hey moran, you realize multiple azrael are banned from this? Your guild has the dirtiest whistle on box pal.

Not according to Nihilum.

Clearly this is all a setup to rid Red99 of Nihilum.... most of the banned accounts where Nihilum members

[vouss]

favorite part of the thread is where elderan relates having a character of 2 years perma-banned to being put in jail for life. fucking pathetic

[Squire]

at least if elderan was spending life in jail he'd get laid, in a manner of speaking.







































butsecks.

[Pudge]

lol. yea i didnt even realize it. teamspeak confirmed,

we have ZERO.. NONE... NOT ONE banned account from attempts to pixelate off the ghosts of transgressions past.

y'all can say that about RD? didn't think so.

[Tradesonred]

You guys acting like lite and brainz arent big time boxers are giving me the chuckles

Especially Col "immaculate virgin" gate

Whats the name of that cleric Brainz used to box all the time in seb?

Yea, STFU about clean whistles

[Silent]

lol. yea i didnt even realize it. teamspeak confirmed,

I confirmed Lite started 3 boxing when Azrael broke apart to pick up the slack of the lost members, and still does it on a regular basis even when its so obvious in pvp that a selos or healer is boxed cause they just sit there and die while novus makes the run for zone line to plug.
.

[krazyGlue]

lol. yea i didnt even realize it. teamspeak confirmed,

we have ZERO.. NONE... NOT ONE banned account from attempts to pixelate off the ghosts of transgressions past.

y'all can say that about RD? didn't think so.

and azrael is the most toxic guild on red. /shrug

[Supreme]

It is entrapment.

If a player knew that items transferred to them would result in being banned would not have done it otherwise.

While "ignorance" of the law is not a defense the fact that you are held responsible for a situation that you would not have otherwise participated is. Furthermore, it is not YOUR responsibility to know if the person in question is wanted, escaped or engaging in illegal activity.

You knew that player was banned but now is unbanned. There is no rule that states you must confirm former banned player is legitimately unbanned and that any items accepted in trade (or exp gained) is authorized..

By that rational any time a wanted criminal or escaped felon interacts with ANYONE then they could be held accountable for "aiding". Sell food to an escaped felon at a grocery store..go to jail. Give a wanted criminal a ride in your taxi...go to jail.

Trade items from a "GM mistake" unbanned account..get perma-banned.

[Supreme]

Dirty nilly pixel lusters drew like flies to the honeypot once their multitude of banned chars became available for a single day.

Is this entrapment? Was it a setup all along to bring down the most heinous guild to ever plague elf simulator servers worldwide?

I hope so.

It was actually Nihilum that reported it...

AFAIK no one else did.

[krazyGlue]

waah waah my guildies are banned once again for exploiting the server waah waah waahh.

[Slathar]

When I found out people literally lost years of progress by being banned for cheating and abusing administrator mistakes, the biggest smile broke out on my triple-chinned face.

Thank god that people like Ghost are banned forever and can never come back and ruin the server.

[Dacuk]

most of the banned accounts where Nihilum members

why is this?

[Tradesonred]

Cmon someone must remember

What was the name of the cleric Brainz used to box in Seb instead of grouping with guildmates?

[mikemandella]

It is entrapment.

If a player knew that items transferred to them would result in being banned would not have done it otherwise.

While "ignorance" of the law is not a defense the fact that you are held responsible for a situation that you would not have otherwise participated is. Furthermore, it is not YOUR responsibility to know if the person in question is wanted, escaped or engaging in illegal activity.

You knew that player was banned but now is unbanned. There is no rule that states you must confirm former banned player is legitimately unbanned and that any items accepted in trade (or exp gained) is authorized..

By that rational any time a wanted criminal or escaped felon interacts with ANYONE then they could be held accountable for "aiding". Sell food to an escaped felon at a grocery store..go to jail. Give a wanted criminal a ride in your taxi...go to jail.

Trade items from a "GM mistake" unbanned account..get perma-banned.

One problem here... THIS IS A VIDEO GAME and we are not in a court of law?

- Oppressor

[Jenni D]

I remember the cleric, as far as I remember his friend took control of it and had it tagged nihilum for a period of time. Classic red 99

[Faerie]

It is entrapment.

If a player knew that items transferred to them would result in being banned would not have done it otherwise.

While "ignorance" of the law is not a defense the fact that you are held responsible for a situation that you would not have otherwise participated is. Furthermore, it is not YOUR responsibility to know if the person in question is wanted, escaped or engaging in illegal activity.

You knew that player was banned but now is unbanned. There is no rule that states you must confirm former banned player is legitimately unbanned and that any items accepted in trade (or exp gained) is authorized..

By that rational any time a wanted criminal or escaped felon interacts with ANYONE then they could be held accountable for "aiding". Sell food to an escaped felon at a grocery store..go to jail. Give a wanted criminal a ride in your taxi...go to jail.

Trade items from a "GM mistake" unbanned account..get perma-banned.

It's a shame that this happened as it did, but permanently banning players that were looking to capitalize on what was essentially an exploit is a good thing. If you associate with cheaters you probably should be very careful when dealing with them... especially if you know their characters were supposed to have been permabanned.

Maybe in lieu of these bans, Nihilum should be suspended from raiding for 6 months for exploiting.

[Supreme]

One problem here... THIS IS A VIDEO GAME and we are not in a court of law?

- Oppressor

So we should not have any kind if standards or integrity of rule because it is a free server?

Why the fuck would you play here EVER?

[Supreme]

It's a shame that this happened as it did, but permanently banning players that were looking to capitalize on what was essentially an exploit is a good thing. If you associate with cheaters you probably should be very careful when dealing with them... especially if you know their characters were supposed to have been permabanned.

Maybe in lieu of these bans, Nihilum should be suspended from raiding for 6 months for exploiting.

Wait.

You are going to now claim that these players KNEW it was an exploit..was informed that the accounts were not suppose to be unbanned...then proceeded to try and strip their banned accounts by moving items off to their friends accounts?

Sounds legit.

This is really a contradiction to what Durabel said in his opening post...since it was a GM mistake and not a "exploit".

[Faerie]

So we should not have any kind if standards or integrity of rule because it is a free server?

Why the fuck would you play here EVER?

The way I see it, banning a bunch of people for exploiting is an integrity move.

[mrproudbeard]

So we should not have any kind if standards or integrity of rule because it is a free server?

Why the fuck would you play here EVER?

Standards and integrity like not dealing with people who get banned for breaking the rules to begin with?

[Supreme]

The way I see it, banning a bunch of people for exploiting is an integrity move.

I say again...a GM mistake is now an exploit?

Players moving items from their unbanned accounts is an exploit?

:confused:

[Tradesonred]

It is entrapment.

If a player knew that items transferred to them would result in being banned would not have done it otherwise.

While "ignorance" of the law is not a defense the fact that you are held responsible for a situation that you would not have otherwise participated is. Furthermore, it is not YOUR responsibility to know if the person in question is wanted, escaped or engaging in illegal activity.

You knew that player was banned but now is unbanned. There is no rule that states you must confirm former banned player is legitimately unbanned and that any items accepted in trade (or exp gained) is authorized..

By that rational any time a wanted criminal or escaped felon interacts with ANYONE then they could be held accountable for "aiding". Sell food to an escaped felon at a grocery store..go to jail. Give a wanted criminal a ride in your taxi...go to jail.

Trade items from a "GM mistake" unbanned account..get perma-banned.

As much as i hate to, i have to say Supreme has a point.

Beyond the first layer of transfers, no one should be getting banned over this.

It is even arguable that even the first layer of transfer should not get banned, although im not sure of the specifics (AKA how long were the banned toons allowed to roam in the world selling rapidly everything that was on them?).

I bought 3 days ago a spell from Symbioticforks in Nihilum with being only faintly aware of this whole debacle, should i be worried about my account being banned?

Because i was like "well, cheaters get banned" but once u start thinking about all the ramifications its easy to see how many people who basically had nothing to do with this could be banned in the process.

[Vamael]

look, i understand aons and fungis and manastones, but i gave someone a GBS. and they are banned, they weren't aware of this and should be able to delete or give back the GBS and get unbanned. they were completely not involved, other than i was like OH here is an item for you, i wasn't trying to be shady, and OR hide items. I am know well enough items can be traced by item numbers, even if its dropped, given to lvl 1 alts with ip spoofing, thats wasn't the case. It was just HANDED to them. with no intentions of thinking they would lose their account.

[Vamael]

As much as i hate to, i have to say Supreme has a point.

Beyond the first layer of transfers, no one should be getting banned over this.

It is even arguable that even the first layer of transfer should not get banned, although im not sure of the specifics.

I bought 3 days ago a spell from Symbioticforks in Nihilum with being only faintly aware of this whole debacle, should i be worried about my account being banned?

Because i was like "well, cheaters get banned" but once u start thinking about all the ramifications its easy to see how many people who basically had nothing to do with this could be banned in the process.

[Supreme]

Standards and integrity like not dealing with people who get banned for breaking the rules to begin with?

What rule was broken?

Where is the rule that states if a GM makes a mistake and unbans an account that ANY player that associated with that banned account, knowingly or unknowingly, will also be banned?

Your argument is biased because you are unable to compete ingame and have to twist the rules out of game.

[mikemandella]

So we should not have any kind if standards or integrity of rule because it is a free server?

Why the fuck would you play here EVER?

One extreme to the next.. You are comparing a fully functional judicial system we have all come to love to a emulated elf server with 5 - 7 staff members? If this was the great prisoner release in anticipation of velious do you not think it would have been announced?

You guys didn't think you'd get caught.. and you did. Please explain how only Nihilum characters are banned and literally nobody else?

- Oppressor

[Pudge]

supreme, there's nothing you can say here to convince anyone with a clean whistle that these dirty, 6-tooned, 4-chinned, 2-banned, 0-sexed pixel mongers should be unbanned.


there might be one or two ppl who should legit not be banned. but you aint arguing individual cases, you're just blanket defending intentional wrongdoing.

[Faerie]

Wait.

You are going to now claim that these players KNEW it was an exploit..was informed that the accounts were not suppose to be unbanned...then proceeded to try and strip their banned accounts by moving items off to their friends accounts?

Sounds legit.

This is really a contradiction to what Durabel said in his opening post...since it was a GM mistake and not a "exploit".

Yeah, apparently you guys were expecting to have those accounts banned once more and scrambled to get all the gear you knew you shouldn't have handed out to friends and guildmates. You were probably hoping that by including so many accounts in the process that the GM's hands would be tied and you'd get to keep at least some of the stuff. Were the GMs informed before or after all your trading had taken place?

The smart thing to do would be stop talking about it in public, and wait for them to mull over your petition.

[Supreme]

I am not lobbying for the accounts unbanned by the "GM Mistake" to remain unbanned.

I am lobbying for those players that had no knowledge of the "GM mistake" to be given a fair shake in a raw deal. The rhetoric is that we want a "healthy" server but how can we have a healthy server when people must walk on glass and eggshells with fear or being banned by associating with accounts that they unknowingly interact with.

Is the only safe way to never be banned is to NOT play on Red99 anymore?

[Faerie]

I say again...a GM mistake is now an exploit?

Players moving items from their unbanned accounts is an exploit?

:confused:

Capitalizing on a mistake made by a GM while knowing full well the devs and GMs would have a problem with it should be considered an exploit.

[mrproudbeard]

What rule was broken?

Where is the rule that states if a GM makes a mistake and unbans an account that ANY player that associated with that banned account, knowingly or unknowingly, will also be banned?

Your argument is biased because you are unable to compete ingame and have to twist the rules out of game.

The rule that got them banned in the first place? I'm not talking about the follow up situation that resulted in more bans.

It's just great to see people coming out in this thread talking about X prior toons getting banned (with no reasons stated why) and then playing the victim card because they got more people banned.

Hey guys, why were you banned in the first place? Was it for a "bullshit" reason? Or did you break a rule and then just roll another toon to level and gear up? If the later, it's hard to have pity for people who got burned by harboring dirtbags.

Your argument is biased because you are on the receiving end of the punishment.

[mikemandella]

I am not lobbying for the accounts unbanned by the "GM Mistake" to remain unbanned.

I am lobbying for those players that had no knowledge of the "GM mistake" to be given a fair shake in a raw deal. The rhetoric is that we want a "healthy" server but how can we have a healthy server when people must walk on glass and eggshells with fear or being banned by associating with accounts that they unknowingly interact with.

Is the only safe way to never be banned is to NOT play on Red99 anymore?

Ask Ender...

- Oppressor

[Squire]

supreme, there's nothing you can say here to convince anyone with a clean whistle that these dirty, 6-tooned, 4-chinned, 2-banned, 0-sexed pixel mongers should be unbanned.


there might be one or two ppl who should legit not be banned. but you aint arguing individual cases, you're just blanket defending intentional wrongdoing.

new sig.

[Bazia]

Why the fuck would you hand out gear that you knew was from banned accounts?

IRL receiving stolen property is a crime, regardless if you were aware or not.

Something too good to be true? Then it probably is.

Anyone that handed out gear from banned accounts were assholes for involving innocent players into this shit show.

[Nizzarr]

look, i understand aons and fungis and manastones, but i gave someone a GBS. and they are banned, they weren't aware of this and should be able to delete or give back the GBS and get unbanned. they were completely not involved, other than i was like OH here is an item for you, i wasn't trying to be shady, and OR hide items. I am know well enough items can be traced by item numbers, even if its dropped, given to lvl 1 alts with ip spoofing, thats wasn't the case. It was just HANDED to them. with no intentions of thinking they would lose their account.

You're a scumbag, rot in hell and I hope you kill yourself in real?

did I do this right?

I feel you, I accepted items from an "unbanned" character on a guildbank mule. That account is banned because somebody that I helped relevel another character gave the guild bank some of his items as a payback to the guild.

Some random resists gear, a hiero cloak and 1.5k plat. Clearly worth banning my account for forever right?

Poorly managed crisis on an error from administrators of this server. Put that one on your Pantheon resume!

[XiakenjaTZ]

Nizzar is on and ready. You can bring the server back up.

[Tradesonred]

Yeah, apparently you guys were expecting to have those accounts banned once more and scrambled to get all the gear you knew you shouldn't have handed out to friends and guildmates. You were probably hoping that by including so many accounts in the process that the GM's hands would be tied and you'd get to keep at least some of the stuff. Were the GMs informed before or after all your trading had taken place?

The smart thing to do would be stop talking about it in public, and wait for them to mull over your petition.

Still, Supremes point is kinda bullet proof. Theres 2 scenarios here.

1. The unbanning and banning happened super fast, like 1-3 hour window. People who took items from banned toons are probably guilty. Still, that 3 hour window could have been used to OOC and strip the toon selling it to randoms.

2. The unbanning lasted for a while 1-2 days. This means banned toons had 48 hours to run around selling everything they had on them to randoms in OOC. Or giving them to people who might have not even known that these were "illegal" items.

Anyway you look at it, its hard to justify any bannings over this, unless someone can pick my reasoning apart and explain to me what im missing.

I sort of feel bad now at going "lol your tears are so delicious" because i assumed everyone was guilty because lookin at it quickly it looks like it. But when you think it through, theres a fuckton of ambiguity about culpability here, unless again someone can explain to me what im missing.

Ok i think ive found it lol its because no account was banned where plat was involved? Still it can mean that someone with a banned account handed over items without telling the source of the items to someone, and that person is banned? So if that person was extra perceptive, and could have seen coming the fail implementation of bans over this, could have ran around and gave items to his enemies and then go lolurbanned?

[Supreme]

One extreme to the next.. You are comparing a fully functional judicial system we have all come to love to a emulated elf server with 5 - 7 staff members? If this was the great prisoner release in anticipation of velious do you not think it would have been announced?

You guys didn't think you'd get caught.. and you did. Please explain how only Nihilum characters are banned and literally nobody else?

- Oppressor

A functional judicial system should make it absolutely EASIER to administer justice. You already have a basis for a practical system without even writing it up! In addition you have a history of stare decisis which to base judgement.

Since Kunark unbannings was not announced until AFTER the fact then NO i do not believe it would have been announced. Regardless of that, it is not a players responsibility to policy another player that was banned and then "GM mistake" unbanned.

As for not getting caught it was NIZZAR himself that was the first to petition the issue to GMs. No one wants to mention that because they are just too busy tarring the issue with biased rhetoric and half-truths.

[Bazia]

You honestly believe if they decided to unban all accounts intentionally they wouldn't announce it in anyway.

I'm sorry but you're full of shit.

[Faerie]

You're a scumbag, rot in hell and I hope you kill yourself in real?

did I do this right?

I feel you, I accepted items from an "unbanned" character on a guildbank mule. That account is banned because somebody that I helped relevel another character gave the guild bank some of his items as a payback to the guild.

Some random resists gear, a hiero cloak and 1.5k plat. Clearly worth banning my account for forever right?

Poorly managed crisis on an error from administrators of this server. Put that one on your Pantheon resume!

Sounds like Nihilum griefed the server hardcore here, getting innocents banned for their shady actions. If many innocents really were banned for this, then a better solution might be to disband Nihilum.

[quido]

You're a scumbag, rot in hell and I hope you kill yourself in real?

did I do this right?

I feel you, I accepted items from an "unbanned" character on a guildbank mule. That account is banned because somebody that I helped relevel another character gave the guild bank some of his items as a payback to the guild.

Some random resists gear, a hiero cloak and 1.5k plat. Clearly worth banning my account for forever right?

Poorly managed crisis on an error from administrators of this server. Put that one on your Pantheon resume!

I guess that's the liability of enabling some banned jerk to continue to compete here. Not entirely a bad thing imo.

[Supreme]

Capitalizing on a mistake made by a GM while knowing full well the devs and GMs would have a problem with it should be considered an exploit.

Ok Secrets.

Your brain is kinda pickled so I will give you a pass.

By your rationale everyone should be banned on Red99. No one KNEW it was a GM mistake at the time it happened. No one KNEW devs and GMs had/have a problem with it at the time it happened. ALL people KNEW was that their accounts (ergo ALL banned accounts) were not unbanned. ALL people KNEW was that this also happened before KUNARK and anticipated this was just the last step before VELIOUS release.

[Squire]

Sounds like Nihilum griefed the server hardcore here, getting innocents banned for their shady actions. If many innocents really were banned for this, then a better solution might be to disband Nihilum.

These are the kind of outside the box solutions we should be examining.

[Bazia]

Ok Secrets.

Your brain is kinda pickled so I will give you a pass.

By your rationale everyone should be banned on Red99. No one KNEW it was a GM mistake at the time it happened. No one KNEW devs and GMs had/have a problem with it at the time it happened. ALL people KNEW was that their accounts (ergo ALL banned accounts) were not unbanned. ALL people KNEW was that this also happened before KUNARK and anticipated this was just the last step before VELIOUS release.

You honestly believe if they decided to unban all accounts intentionally they wouldn't announce it in anyway.

I'm sorry but you're full of shit.

[MC Epic]

Wait.

You are going to now claim that these players KNEW it was an exploit..was informed that the accounts were not suppose to be unbanned...then proceeded to try and strip their banned accounts by moving items off to their friends accounts?

Sounds legit.

This is really a contradiction to what Durabel said in his opening post...since it was a GM mistake and not a "exploit".

It really doesn't matter at all if they did or didn't know it was an exploit.

If you were to get busted at border patrol for transporting illegal substance that you were "unknowingly coerced into carrying"... you still go to jail.

In this unfortunately common scenario (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/10239430/British-women-accused-of-cocaine-smuggling-in-Peru-protest-innocence.html), the problem is that you've associated yourself with individuals who have exploited you, as they exploit every opportunity to profit.

Morale of the story:
http://cdn6.riftscene.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/ActualAdviceMallardOnExploits.jpg

[Supreme]

You honestly believe if they decided to unban all accounts intentionally they wouldn't announce it in anyway.

I'm sorry but you're full of shit.

Considering that the window that these accounts were unbanned was relatively small how was anyone suppose to know that the unbannings was actually a "GM Mistake"??

[mrproudbeard]

Hey folks, I play with people who knowingly broke the rules! Yeah I didn't question at all that they were re-rolling their 6th rogue or 3rd wizard. It's not my job to police the people I play this game with! I just thought they liked grinding and gearing the exact same class over and over. I definitely should never question when someone I know was previously banned starts doing something shady. Why are there consequences for the bad decisions I make this isn't fair!

:rolleyes:

[Jenni D]

why do guilds re-invite and re-gear banned players? surely this condones cheating/exploiting etc

[Tradesonred]

Still, Supremes point is kinda bullet proof. Theres 2 scenarios here.

1. The unbanning and banning happened super fast, like 1-3 hour window. People who took items from banned toons are probably guilty. Still, that 3 hour window could have been used to OOC and strip the toon selling it to randoms.

2. The unbanning lasted for a while 1-2 days. This means banned toons had 48 hours to run around selling everything they had on them to randoms in OOC. Or giving them to people who might have not even known that these were "illegal" items.

Anyway you look at it, its hard to justify any bannings over this, unless someone can pick my reasoning apart and explain to me what im missing.

I sort of feel bad now at going "lol your tears are so delicious" because i assumed everyone was guilty because lookin at it quickly it looks like it. But when you think it through, theres a fuckton of ambiguity about culpability here, unless again someone can explain to me what im missing.

Ok i think ive found it lol its because no account was banned where plat was involved? Still it can mean that someone with a banned account handed over items without telling the source of the items to someone, and that person is banned? So if that person using a banned account was extra perceptive, and could have seen coming the fail implementation of bans over this, could have ran around and gave items to his enemies and then go lolurbanned?

Can Derubael pick this post apart? What am i missing here?

[Faerie]

Ok Secrets.

Your brain is kinda pickled so I will give you a pass.

By your rationale everyone should be banned on Red99. No one KNEW it was a GM mistake at the time it happened. No one KNEW devs and GMs had/have a problem with it at the time it happened. ALL people KNEW was that their accounts (ergo ALL banned accounts) were not unbanned. ALL people KNEW was that this also happened before KUNARK and anticipated this was just the last step before VELIOUS release.

I refuse to believe that you're all so stupid.

[Bazia]

Considering that the window that these accounts were unbanned was relatively small how was anyone suppose to know that the unbannings was actually a "GM Mistake"??

Because if it was deliberate it would have been announced, like any large scale actions the staff takes here.

This excuse is weak man, you were better off sticking to the "innocent players got banned" angle really.

[Supreme]

It really doesn't matter at all if they did or didn't know it was an exploit.

If you were to get busted at border patrol for transporting illegal substance that you were "unknowingly coerced into carrying"... you still go to jail.

In this unfortunately common scenario (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/10239430/British-women-accused-of-cocaine-smuggling-in-Peru-protest-innocence.html), the problem is that you've associated yourself with individuals who have exploited you, as they exploit every opportunity to profit.

Morale of the story:


By your example the issue would have to be that illegal substances suddenly became LEGAL. Then when you moved your goods across the border and gave them to your friend (because they were legal) the DEA sweeps in and arrest you because "they made a mistake" lifting the law allowing the drugs to be transported in the first place.

Argument by analogy must be consistent and parallel or it is just a bad analogy.

In our example people were banned associating with people they thought were FREE and CLEAR of all wrong doing. This is not a case of Hacker A accessing the database and unflagging all banned accounts then proceeding to try and move his items off.

It is a "GM Mistake" that now several innocent players must pay the price for.

[Supreme]

why do guilds re-invite and re-gear banned players? surely this condones cheating/exploiting etc

Limited server...no player base..people hate poop-socking blue raid content?

[Tradesonred]

Fuck me lol i fail at reading

Its simple. The banned toons were immediately stripped. The account that stripped everything from those accounts got banned.

Sorry for failing at reading the OP

K thx bye

Enjoy your bans

Edit: BUT im still confused about people who posted about how they gave away items to people who didnt know and got banned afterwards. Only one "hop" of toon should be banned, unless a massive amount of items was flipped from account to account in an attempt to whitewash these items like drug money.

[Supreme]

I refuse to believe that you're all so stupid.

I refuse to believe you are also all so stupid.

However your posts confirms the logical truth.

[Bazia]

So if the players assumed they were legitimately unbanned why did they completely strip the banned toons and distribute the loot to non banned toons?

Wouldn't they want to play their now unbanned toons not nude?

It's because they at least had some idea this was not legit, and tried to take advantage of a staff mistake as quickly as possible.

[King Chip]

So if the players assumed they were legitimately unbanned why did they completely strip the banned toons and distribute the loot to non banned toons?

Wouldn't they want to play their now unbanned toons not nude?

It's because they at least had some idea this was not legit, and tried to take advantage of a staff mistake as quickly as possible.

[Slathar]

Feels good logging on all 9 of my level 60s because I've never broken any rules, been suspended or cheated.

:)

[Nirgon]

If you listen to anything Supreme says as a staff member, you need to remove yourself.

[Supreme]

Fuck me lol i fail at reading

Its simple. The banned toons were immediately stripped. The account that stripped everything from those accounts got banned.

Sorry for failing at reading the OP

K thx bye

Enjoy your bans

The banned accounts were stripped and moved to other HIGHER level accounts of the same player.

Just for your information...if the account in question was a 57 rogue with AoN COF RBB TrakBP etc..and was banned. And during that time you REROLLED a rogue that is now 60 with full VP gear etc would you not then log on your old rogue and move the items over to your new rogue?

But i digress. If players knew that transfering items from an account that was unbanned by a "GM mistake" would result in their banning...would they have done it?

[mrproudbeard]

I refuse to believe you are also all so stupid.

However your posts confirms the logical truth.

Supreme logic:
Justify's continuing to play with people who break the rules because of "low population". Can't comprehend how playing with someone who was previously banned (some multiple times) might somehow bite him and his guild in the ass. Outraged when said biting happens.

Some real Mr. Spock shit going on here!

[Faerie]

I refuse to believe you are also all so stupid.

However your posts confirms the logical truth.

Look, Supreme. Just calm down, and think this through. You're not helping your case by arguing with us players. I know you guys have already made a petition or whatever in the forum. Put your reasoned arguments there and pretend you're polite and patient about the whole matter, and act like you want to get things cleared up in a constructive manner.

They're going through and unbanning people that were just involved a little bit, and have no ill-gotten items on them currently. If going through the proper channels, we all know that if there is a good reason for it they will unban accounts. We're all expecting lots of the banned parties to have their bans lifted. Some of you are probably still going to remain banned, but it's not as bad as you're making it out to be.

[Supreme]

So if the players assumed they were legitimately unbanned why did they completely strip the banned toons and distribute the loot to non banned toons?

Wouldn't they want to play their now unbanned toons not nude?

It's because they at least had some idea this was not legit, and tried to take advantage of a staff mistake as quickly as possible.

if the account in question was a 57 rogue with AoN COF RBB TrakBP etc..and was banned. And during that time you REROLLED a rogue that is now 60 with full VP gear etc would you not then log on your old rogue and move the items over to your new rogue?