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nilbog
12-01-2009, 05:02 PM
This will NOT decide anything. This is to gauge interest in having Luclin models available.

I gave my opinion in another thread, which provoked some responses. Here is my opinion. :P

Given the option, I would disable all luclin models for anyone connecting here, forever. That's the selfish kind of bastard I am :)

Do you believe that Luclin character models should be available for Project 1999?

Tollen
12-01-2009, 05:04 PM
No

sorry I posted this before you had the poll up ~ little board at work my f5 key is getting a work out...

Warton
12-01-2009, 05:05 PM
no, theyre horrible

messiah_b
12-01-2009, 05:06 PM
Offer them as a honey pot that bans the ip and redirects them to eye clinic websites.

Halladar
12-01-2009, 05:07 PM
I wish you could have had an option for a single race.

I really dug the conehead look on erudites. Everything else I preferred the old models.

Though the erudite sense of style didn't really carry over to luclin models, I really grokked that head.

Morfnblorsh
12-01-2009, 05:07 PM
They are fucking ugly and furthermore *ahem* BECAME AVAILABLE WITH LUCLIN which we will not be revisiting as part of Project 1999. That should be the end of the issue and all discussion right there.

Danth
12-01-2009, 05:07 PM
Hmm, what to pick. I think the Luclin models look stupid, and would never turn them on. On the other hand, if someone else wants them on, it doesn't harm me. It's just a cosmetic thing with zero impact on gameplay (even less impact than item linking has). Neither of the options really fit with how I feel, but in the interest of promoting mutual interest, I suppose I'll choose 'yes'.

(edit: in reply to the post below) Yeah, some of the prior responses suggest that some people think they'd be forced-on, which is not at all the case.

Danth

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:09 PM
A poll was as much as I could have hoped for, thanks Nil.

Voted yes, obviously. Wife and I love the luclin models. Albeit some don't, it comes down to personal preference.

Reminder people: you don't have to have them turned on, but they are there for those who want them.

guineapig
12-01-2009, 05:10 PM
It's a shame you can't make stuff like this a reward for some crazy long complicated quest.
So if you REALLY want it...

Morfnblorsh
12-01-2009, 05:12 PM
It's not a matter of being denied some personal freedom, it's a matter of this project NEVER, EVER GOING TO THE FUCKING MOON. Hence, these models should never, ever be available. Simple as that.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:15 PM
Morf, that's besides the point. We're already using features that are from other expansions (maps) etc.

It IS exactly about denying people personal freedom of choice. What possible negative thing could result from my screen showing you as a new model? How would you ever know if you didn't have new models turned on?

nilbog
12-01-2009, 05:18 PM
We're already using features that are from other expansions (maps) etc.

Ok now this isn't fair. We have no means to disable this, or it would be disabled. If means are found, it will be.

Darkn355
12-01-2009, 05:18 PM
I would love to have the option to turn the models on. It sucks that others don't like them and those that want the option suffer...

Why don't they just keep the old models loaded for themselves? Having the option > no option IMO...

Takshaka
12-01-2009, 05:19 PM
Although part of me says that I dont really care what other people see when the y play the game, the other part of me says that if the person cannot play this game without the Luclin models then is classic EQ really that nostalgic for them? Personally I never played Luclin, I quit EQ shortly after Velious came out. From what I understand most of the people who played from launch did not like the Luclin models. This leads me to understand that many of the the people who prefer the Luclin models either A: never played EQ or B: started playing EQ on around or after the time that Luclin came out.

From that crazy short-sighted reasoning that I choose to use I voted that people should not have the option to turn on Luclin models and I wish that the elementals could not be turned on either. When I first logged on and summoned my first pet with my mage I was shocked that the pet looked nothing like what I remembered. I thought it was nice for a while, but I am so much happier now that I have that floating blob of orange mass back instead of the stupid devil-ish thing with horns...

Tollen
12-01-2009, 05:19 PM
if what is said is true (no SoL expansion) then getting them enabled as nil said in another post, would take away from fixing other things... so as you said in the other thread about people being selfish... I see this as a selfish attempt to get them in. Only cause it will take away from other bugs/fix's that are MUCH more important then what you and a hand full of people would Like just for eye candy...

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:20 PM
Ok now this isn't fair. We have no means to disable this, or it would be disabled. If means are found, it will be.


Fair enough - character models have no game affect though, maps do. I would agree with their removal if it were to occur.

Widan
12-01-2009, 05:25 PM
Yes, people should be able to customize their visual game experience however they like.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:29 PM
We're talking about giving players the option *if they wanted it*. It has zero affects on anyone else. What one person believes to be classic 1999 isn't necessarily another's. Give both options, enable the models. It doesn't hurt anyone and it resolves one more conflict. If you don't like them, turn them off, don't demand the entire world follows your preference.

messiah_b
12-01-2009, 05:31 PM
I would love to have the option to turn the models on. It sucks that others don't like them and those that want the option suffer...

Why don't they just keep the old models loaded for themselves? Having the option > no option IMO...

It has nothing to do with making you suffer. It has everything to do with available resources.

I am 100% against dev taking any time at all away from working on needed development for this.

I don't think anyone is against having options, but like other aesthetic things if you want it you develop it.

Danth
12-01-2009, 05:34 PM
That a cosmetic feature might not be worth the opportunity cost is about the best (if not the only) argument against the Luclin models. While we don't know the actual amount of work involved, it's an argument which deserves respect. Perhaps it may be possible for a community member to step up and do the work. I've seen people post code for other issues.

Danth

Aeolwind
12-01-2009, 05:35 PM
It has nothing to do with making you suffer. It has everything to do with available resources.

I am 100% against dev taking any time at all away from working on needed development for this.

I don't think anyone is against having options, but like other aesthetic things if you want it you develop it.


This.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:35 PM
It has nothing to do with making you suffer. It has everything to do with available resources.

I am 100% against dev taking any time at all away from working on needed development for this.

I don't think anyone is against having options, but like other aesthetic things if you want it you develop it.

I agree 100%. I certainly wouldn't want this to budge in line of anything else. If the decision was made to place this at the very bottom of the list of 'to do's', but that it WOULD be done eventually, that would be a monumental success for the folks who want this.

I wouldn't dream of taking away time for the issues already pending. I hope that wasn't influencing people's decisions.

Approve this change, send it to the BOTTOM of the list, it'll be done one day, when they have time.

Otto
12-01-2009, 05:36 PM
There are so many more important things the devs can be working on that involve more than just visual aesthetics.

Wasting time to bring in models from an expansion that isn't even planned to be released on this server is like a slap in the face. "Sure I could be spending this time working on stuff that needs to be fixed, or starting to prepare to fix things in Kunark for however many months away it will be released, but Luclin models for a few people who prefer them is more urgent."

Yes I know I don't have to turn them on. Honestly I thought they were working, I just didn't care. But to even ask for this to be implemented over the things that actually effect gameplay shows (to me) how little you value the Dev team's time.

edit: someone beat me to it.

Torrinn
12-01-2009, 05:36 PM
This will NOT decide anything. This is to gauge interest in having Luclin models available.

I gave my opinion in another thread, which provoked some responses. Here is my opinion. :P



Do you believe that Luclin character models should be available for Project 1999?

I just want to ask out of curiosity, why do polls at all if the opinion of the community means nothing? We could all vote 99%-1% in favor of something and if the devs disagree with the results you'll do what you want anyway so isn't a waste to even ask us what we want?

Maldan
12-01-2009, 05:38 PM
I personally do not like the luclin models (caveat: the male barbarian isn't awful) but this is a personal preference. When they were released I remember thinking "how could this garbage have been passed through?". Not that the classic models are monuments to design, I'm not saying that, it was just very underwhelming and bordered on comical how ridiculous the vast majority of the models appeared to me.
That said, I wouldnt quit if they were enabled and if given the choice lots of folks would enable them simply for the armor varieties. I stand firmly on the fence!

Aeolwind
12-01-2009, 05:39 PM
I just want to ask out of curiosity, why do polls at all if the opinion of the community means nothing? We could all vote 99%-1% in favor of something and you'll do what you want anyway so isn't a waste to even ask us what we want?

Well, we generally DO want to know how folks feel about it. Even though the care-o-meter might actually be next to 0 due to game impact, general balance, or just plain old curiosity.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:40 PM
The bottom line is there NEVER will be an appropriate time. If we don't vote it in now and get it into the pending list, it'll NEVER happen. Temple of Sol Ro is coming in 4/5/6 months and they need to focus on that, as well as current stuff.

That said, if we 'wait' for Temple of Sol Ro, then well also have to wait for kunark, then wait for velious...

These change the entire visual experience from beginning to end for some players, enabling them after velious when they would have come out is senseless, the game is over, classic experience = gone.

Approve this change, do NOT implement or work on them right away. Get your priorty stuff done. This is just to add it to the list so it CAN happen one day. Else it'll honestly never, ever happen.

nilbog
12-01-2009, 05:42 PM
I just want to ask out of curiosity, why do polls at all if the opinion of the community means nothing? We could all vote 99%-1% in favor of something and if the devs disagree with the results you'll do what you want anyway so isn't a waste to even ask us what we want?

Wow. Yeah I guess I'll stop wasting my time on this.

Danth
12-01-2009, 05:43 PM
"Honestly I thought they were working"

Same here. It hadn't even occurred to me that they might not work on P1999 until someone mentioned it in another thread. I have zero interest in using them personally and had not even tried to (I actually turned them all off when I installed Titanium on the assumption that they worked). Funny stuff!

Danth

messiah_b
12-01-2009, 05:44 PM
Damnit why do you sign forum posts they already have your fing user name aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Morfnblorsh
12-01-2009, 05:44 PM
Everyone arguing why we should have Luclin models is totally missing the point that they are never, ever going to be implemented because we are never going to Luclin.

Nilbog has explained to you all already "The reason we have some features from other expansions is because they cannot be turned off, but would be if they could be."

Your "freedom of visual choice" does not exist, because this is 1999 and there was only ONE set of models. That's what you get. Luclin models have not been invented yet, and never will be as far as this project is concerned. Because of this, arguing over it is utterly pointless.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:47 PM
"Honestly I thought they were working"


This is the exact reason they should be implemented. I bet most people probably thought they already were, meaning they don't care if others are using them. They are voicing their opinions now indicating they do, only to stop it now that they know they weren't enabled.

This thread proves my point without me even saying anything, those who don't want them didn't even know they were disabled, they just chose not to use them and away they went.

So really, the only people unable to choose an option they prefer, are those who prefer luclin models.

Danth
12-01-2009, 05:49 PM
I post in the manner I do because I want to, messiah. I don't see why you should care enough to comment on it. Are you really so sensitive and intolerant of anything that isn't done exactly your way?

My turn! Why do you make the effort to type out half-spelled cuss words that only serve to make you look like an easily-aroused kid with a weak vocabulary?

Danth

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:49 PM
because this is 1999 and there was only ONE set of models

This isn't 1999, and we do have more than one set of models. The world we're PLAYING IN is 1999, not the computers we're using. There's a huge difference, one that everyone is clearly unable to define.

Aeolwind
12-01-2009, 05:50 PM
I post in the manner I do because I want to, messiah. I don't see why you should care enough to comment on it. Are you really so sensitive and intolerant of anything that isn't done exactly your way?

My turn! Why do you make the effort to type out half-spelled cuss words that only serve to make you look like an easily-aroused kid with a weak vocabulary?

Danth

ahem, stay on topic or take it to R&F. Same rule applies for Messiah.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 05:54 PM
Aeol, I think the polls are tabulating incorrectly. The tens column in the YES should be a '2', not a '1'. May want to take a look... ;)

Aeolwind
12-01-2009, 05:57 PM
Voters: 39. You have already voted on this poll

28+11=39

Morfnblorsh
12-01-2009, 06:01 PM
Therefore other character models that didn't exist in the world we're PLAYING IN in 1999 cannot exist now, and never will.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 06:05 PM
Voters: 39. You have already voted on this poll

28+11=39


/sigh

Widan
12-01-2009, 06:06 PM
Wow. Yeah I guess I'll stop wasting my time on this.

Yea, you could stop patronizing the community with polls you care nothing about.

Takshaka
12-01-2009, 06:12 PM
Yea, you could stop patronizing the community with polls you care nothing about.

I highly doubt that he cares nothing about the result of the poll. He just says that it doesn't matter in case it results in luclin models being in favor only slightly(say 60/40). If Luclin models were in favor by 90/10(after sufficient time for everyone to vote and there were no voting shenanigans) I am pretty sure he would at least consider it.

nilbog
12-01-2009, 06:43 PM
Yea, you could stop patronizing the community with polls you care nothing about.

You think its patronizing of me to make a poll asking people their opinion? Not often do I pull this card, but damn. I can make any poll I want to make, because it's my project, okay? It's about a luxury feature of the end user client... not about game mechanics.

I prefaced the poll the same way I prefaced all the polls in beta.. "This will NOT decide anything." In case you were unaware, voting on polls on the internet does not produce accurate figures. You can register, and vote.. and register and vote.. and register and vote.

If all the polls I have done up until now fully counted, you would be playing on some abomination of a PVP server with 2-10 boxing based on votes from people named xcm234nv and adfa234.

I made this poll as a courtesy to Jereziah.

Nox
12-01-2009, 06:45 PM
No, thank you.

Aeolwind
12-01-2009, 06:52 PM
If all the polls I have done up until now fully counted, you would be playing on some abomination of a PVP server with 2-10 boxing based on votes from people named xcm234nv and adfa234.



This

Is now

Down there

VVVVVVVVVVVVVV

cassaruby
12-01-2009, 07:36 PM
why you guys messin' w/ Nilbog, and makin' him reply to dumbshit?
have some respect, he's always been mature as far as everyone's seen, and it appears he works hard.

also, i personally wouldn't want anyone using Luclin models, because they don't belong on this server, anywhere.

make a different server if you want classic with luclin and whatever other features.

Swank
12-01-2009, 08:31 PM
Lol, I like how all the "I've been playing EQ longer than you," snobs decide to take away options that wouldn't effect them, then latch on to a "I don't want Devs to waste time" mantra when they realize they're being ridiculous.

So from here on out are we going to vote on everything the devs do, since we apparently know best how to use their time?

Sorry, the new models sucked, except the Iksar, always liked the new ones myself, and regardless of what's done I'm staying with the old models. But to vote to not allow others to use a graphics you don't have to see is just stupid.

Thank you Nil for making this poll, while some whiners may be railing on you, I appreciate the fact that you're willing to listen when the community has an issue. I don't particularly care about this one, but at least I know you'll be around when an issue is raised that does effect me. :D

Oh, and Morfnblorsh, we're aware of your opinion and don't need to hear it again. There is a lot of non-classic elements on p1999, so the tired "It's not classic so it won't be here," argument is moot.

stormlord
12-01-2009, 09:08 PM
Lol, I like how all the "I've been playing EQ longer than you," snobs decide to take away options that wouldn't effect them, then latch on to a "I don't want Devs to waste time" mantra when they realize they're being ridiculous.

So from here on out are we going to vote on everything the devs do, since we apparently know best how to use their time?

Sorry, the new models sucked, except the Iksar, always liked the new ones myself, and regardless of what's done I'm staying with the old models. But to vote to not allow others to use a graphics you don't have to see is just stupid.

Thank you Nil for making this poll, while some whiners may be railing on you, I appreciate the fact that you're willing to listen when the community has an issue. I don't particularly care about this one, but at least I know you'll be around when an issue is raised that does effect me. :D

Oh, and Morfnblorsh, we're aware of your opinion and don't need to hear it again. There is a lot of non-classic elements on p1999, so the tired "It's not classic so it won't be here," argument is moot.

I'd support the option to enable new models IF and only IF others saw me as the old model IF I was using the old model myself. I want others to see me as I see me, as it's a form of my own self-expression. How a race looks is very important. In fact, it's part of my role-playing identity. It plays a part in which race(s) I decide to play. It matters a lot to me. If I am playing a human and you see me in-game as the new model, then that would be because I'm using the new model. If I was using the old model, you'd see the old model. That kind of functionality I would support. The difference(s) between the old models and new models are that big. Ofcourse, this is not how it works on live, but I would prefer it to work that way. The old models and new models should not be used so interchangeably as they're integral to self-expression (just like the weapon you use or the dye's you use) and nothing at all alike. The model you use is like the clothing you wear. What fits on an old model human male, would rip and shred apart on the new model because of the steroids.

I've vote the same way on live, and with the same conditions.

PS: And saying that it's all a matter of perception is stretching it - just as much as the new models are rippling with muscles. Saying that the difference between the old model human and the new model human is just opinion is not a valid/honest argument. One is roughly average looking, the other is thickly muscled and belongs in a wrestling ring - or gym. End of story. If I wanted to look like a wrester while playing a druid, I'd select a barbarian (they can't be druids though). It's denial for you to think this way.

messiah_b
12-01-2009, 09:14 PM
Lol, I like how all the "I've been playing EQ longer than you," snobs decide to take away options that wouldn't effect them, then latch on to a "I don't want Devs to waste time" mantra when they realize they're being ridiculous.

Yes we are all lobbying to have options taken away. Luclin models are 100% available, but the dev team decided to set Luclin_Models = false just to watch people squirm.

Yes I will make fun of people who like them because they are at best mediocre examples of game artwork. This does not affect my vote in the poll what so ever. Hell this could be a poll to change all avatars to naked toons of Katee Sackhoff and Jewel Staite and I would...well I would probably vote for that.

Swank
12-01-2009, 09:15 PM
I want others to see me as I see me, as it's a form of my own self-expression.

So since there's only six or so different faces for each race you just RP yourself as having lots of twins? :D

All joking aside I understand your point, but to me, I could care less how others see me, since I'm never going to be playing from their computer.

Serith
12-01-2009, 09:18 PM
Luclin models look retarded

Swank
12-01-2009, 09:18 PM
Yes we are all lobbying to have options taken away. Luclin models are 100% available, but the dev team decided to set Luclin_Models = false just to watch people squirm.

Yes I will make fun of people who like them because they are at best mediocre examples of game artwork. This does not affect my vote in the poll what so ever. Hell this could be a poll to change all avatars to naked toons of Katee Sackhoff and Jewel Staite and I would...well I would probably vote for that.


I never said you were lobbying to have choices taken away, just simply don't use the devs time as the excuse for your opinion. If you don't want the models on the server vote no and either give the real reason you voted the way you did, or just leave no opinion at all. I may disagree with Stormlords opinion, but at least he gave one beyond, "Well I'd be all for it, but it would waste the devs time."

I'm just sick of seeing the devs become the scapegoat.

And am I the only one who doesn't understand why the general male population finds Katee Sackhoff attractive?

messiah_b
12-01-2009, 09:26 PM
I never said you were lobbying to have choices taken away...

Yes you did. That's exactly what you said.


snobs decide to take away options that wouldn't effect them

Villide
12-01-2009, 09:28 PM
I never said you were lobbying to have choices taken away, just simply don't use the devs time as the excuse for your opinion. If you don't want the models on the server vote no and either give the real reason you voted the way you did, or just leave no opinion at all.

I'm just sick of seeing the devs become the scapegoat
Aren't you just using the alleged scapegoating of the devs as the excuse for your opinion? If you want the models on the server vote yes and either give the real reason you voted the way you did, or just leave no opinion at all.

stormlord
12-01-2009, 09:33 PM
So since there's only six or so different faces for each race you just RP yourself as having lots of twins? :D

All joking aside I understand your point, but to me, I could care less how others see me, since I'm never going to be playing from their computer.

Believe it or not, I actually select my face. They all have their own character and tell a story - this is what people THINK. That story is different from one person to another. What we're talking about in this thread is what people SEE, not what they THINK.

Skeletonya
12-01-2009, 09:41 PM
http://www.webannoyances.com/image-files/thumbs_down.png

Swank
12-01-2009, 09:44 PM
Lobbying implies your saying something soley to sway others opinions, I never accused you of doing that. I merely wanted people to give a valid reason for their argument, not blame the devs.

Villide. If you could quote for me where I used the devs as the basis for my opinion I'd love to read it. I'm pretty sure I said I don't want to use the new models, but I'm not sure why we'd limit others options when it doesn't effect us. But the way you were able to try to use my quote to turn my argument around sure made you look smart. Well done.

And Stormlord, I respect your opinion and the ":D" face was suppose to indicate that the twins comment was made tongue in cheek. I actually choose my face too, as I always figured everyone here did. Not exactly sure why you made that some kind of revelation.

Jereziah
12-01-2009, 09:52 PM
Just got home from work and wanted to say thank you to Nil for posting the poll. While it appears that I obviously misjudged the support for luclin models, I really appreciate you going through the motions.

My opinion still stands that people should have a choice. However, such is life and I still love the game.

Heading out for the night, will be interesting to see if we break 20 =P

stormlord
12-01-2009, 10:22 PM
Lobbying implies your saying something soley to sway others opinions, I never accused you of doing that. I merely wanted people to give a valid reason for their argument, not blame the devs.

Villide. If you could quote for me where I used the devs as the basis for my opinion I'd love to read it. I'm pretty sure I said I don't want to use the old models, but I'm not sure why we'd limit others options when it doesn't effect us. But the way you were able to try to use my quote to turn my argument around sure made you look smart. Well done.

And Stormlord, I respect your opinion and the ":D" face was suppose to indicate that the twins comment was made tongue in cheek. I actually choose my face too, as I always figured everyone here did. Not exactly sure why you made that some kind of revelation.

I wasn't sure what your point was. Just a random post. But since I had already determined that this thread is about what we SEE as opposed to what we THINK, I decided that I'd interject and insert that thought just for reference purposes.

Swank
12-01-2009, 10:25 PM
I wasn't sure what your point was. Just a random post. But since I had already determined that this thread is about what we SEE as opposed to what we THINK, I decided that I'd interject and insert that thought just for reference purposes.

Understood, sorry if you took my post as an insult. It wasn't the way I intended it. I too like to RP, my baby Dwarf Warrior only speaks in Dwarvish and with that Scottish accent all Dwarves seem to for some reason have in popular media.

zionmuffin
12-01-2009, 10:29 PM
honestly I feel the poll is missing a question...
"I'm okay with letting people have a choice"
other possible questions...
"No change, all must see what I like!"
"Luclin had the kittens I can't live without!" < sarcasm
"Everquest can't be fully enjoyed without Luclin"

hrafn
12-02-2009, 02:34 AM
If you dont want to see luclin models dont turn them on. i dont wanna see them but i dont care if other people choose to.

Jereziah
12-02-2009, 12:17 PM
If you dont want to see luclin models dont turn them on. i dont wanna see them but i dont care if other people choose to.

This.

legendbyname
12-15-2009, 02:12 AM
I don't see the harm since they are easily toggled on/off. Unless it's really a hassle to implement them I'm all for em.

Somekid123
12-15-2009, 04:36 AM
When im running around with a Custom Cowl of Mortality and have Gnome bubbly eyes, then I want everyone to know I am running around with a CCoM and have gnome bubbly eyes, which would otherwise not look like that with Luclin models on.

That is all.

dalkice
12-15-2009, 12:58 PM
I'm usually one of the first to start yelling "ZOMG IT'S NOT CLASSIC NO MAKE IT STOP GO AWAY STFU KTHXBAI" but... Luclin models are optional even if enabled (I'll be keeping mine off, tyvm), and if some people want to change it, granted it'll be a less-than-fully-classic experience, but it won't detract from my fun, because I won't ever know. Keeping that in mind... I feel bad not voting yes.

Zarniwooop
12-15-2009, 05:28 PM
I would vote yes in a heartbeat if it wasn't for the travesty that was the troll model in luclin. It's just terrible.

I kinda like the feel of it without the new. I still play live, the models definitely are a differentiator to what I'm doing at that particular moment and keep me set in the old world mindframe.

Slayn
12-15-2009, 07:29 PM
Luclin models just put a face on everything that became known as non-classic content.

abbadox
12-16-2009, 04:13 AM
I only prefer the new models for the LARGE races.

Coridan
02-07-2010, 11:22 PM
When we get to Luclin in the timeline we should just try turning Kerra Isle into a real starting city and using those Kerra models for PCs.

What that should be easy right? =p

Incredible
02-08-2010, 06:39 AM
When we get to Luclin in the timeline we should just try turning Kerra Isle into a real starting city and using those Kerra models for PCs.

What that should be easy right? =p

Luclin isn't going to be implemented on this server, it goes to velious, that's kinda like "It goes to 11" and not back to 5.

I wouldn't mind luclin models though, I liked them.

Valerik
02-08-2010, 10:31 PM
What's the harm in giving the option for people to choose for themselves? Personally I like the Luclin models, and I'd love to have the choice to use them if I wish.

mokfarg
02-08-2010, 11:00 PM
I vote remove forums because forums seem to be the culprit of why all my MMORPGs of the past have been ruined. The vocal minority always run the forums and constantly beg for changes to games to suit their wants without the perspective of developers who see the game as a whole.

Unfortunately games like Everquest and World of Warcraft are influenced by players who no nothing about what makes a great game but want to see changes to it. I have never seen a game become better with these changes. I would really hate for this classic server built for the soul purpose of bringing back the classic game that was changed by all these bad decisions by listening to forum complaints, to be influenced by the same thing.

The fact is the game has the largest population of all emu servers now because people DO miss classic everquest as the way it was and the people who run this game are great for giving us this chance to have this back. They are very generous and apparently are very brilliant with running this show too. This is a very stable classic like experience that thrills me to log into every day. Please relax, log in and just enjoy the gift we have.

Myth
02-08-2010, 11:11 PM
I got it!!
Turn Luclin models on when Luclin is released!
Put it up on front page that will shut everyone up... :)

what else? Shared bank? Zone maps? Key ring? Sony always released little additions with every expansion to get more people to buy it. Shit.. I only got LOY for the extra bank slots.. Game breaking? No, but you got to draw the line somewhere and it has been drawn at Velious.

Get over it, sheesh. Everyone who wants to box and for those that want to turn on luclin models there is the PEQ server. Why not play there? It has everything you want!!

Rael
02-09-2010, 09:50 AM
NO!

Kaleadar
02-09-2010, 02:58 PM
Here is the thing.

The server will not have luclin ever released on it...
Velious has special armor graphics that ONLY display on classic models...
By turning on luclin models you are disabling a core classic piece of history.

Why we are even talking about this is beyond me.

Jinkeybhoy
02-09-2010, 03:10 PM
Why not? If players want to use the luclin models why not let them?

Personally I go back and forth between models and love having the option of doing so. Nobody's forcing anybody to use something they don't want... If you don't like the models dont use them!

Shads
02-09-2010, 03:25 PM
Why not just be happy with what we have :p

Somekid123
02-09-2010, 03:44 PM
Why cant people understand the concept of rebuilding a classic server?

Kaylen
02-09-2010, 04:49 PM
Agree whole heartedly with the post above mine. I understand that for some people those... models... are what they experienced in their version of "classic" EQ. But for the vast majority of EQ veterans the glory days are intricately tired to the classic models.

Another might also argue that if one truely wanted to see the Luclin models and it was that important, then perhaps another emulator or live would better suit their needs as most emulators allow them.

Tenpin
02-09-2010, 04:55 PM
stick with classic

imperial99
02-11-2010, 04:33 PM
Niblig or whatever your stupid name is: is you being a selfish bastard really mean you are either to stupid to figure out how to enable new models on the server or does it just mean you want everyone to see you as the old model character. Either way its stupid as hell, if you want more people to enjoy their stay or even want people to play on this server at least give us the option of using or not using new models. The game itself is classic and great but not everyone likes the blockhead models.

When I read your statement of being a selfish bastard my thoughts of trying your server completely changed. I could care less of what kind of person you are, as long as you were interested in what people that play "your" server think. You need donations right? Why would i donate to this stupid piece of shit that won't give into a suggestion that neither hurts the game or anyone but instead could make everyone happy?

Niblig you sound like a dumb fuck and me, a few others i know for sure and probably several others i dont know about wont play on this server until you get your shit straight and stop being so "selfish" or stupid as it should be pointed out.

Burlyboss
02-11-2010, 04:36 PM
Niblig or whatever your stupid name is: is you being a selfish bastard really mean you are either to stupid to figure out how to enable new models on the server or does it just mean you want everyone to see you as the old model character. Either way its stupid as hell, if you want more people to enjoy their stay or even want people to play on this server at least give us the option of using or not using new models. The game itself is classic and great but not everyone likes the blockhead models.

When I read your statement of being a selfish bastard my thoughts of trying your server completely changed. I could care less of what kind of person you are, as long as you were interested in what people that play "your" server think. You need donations right? Why would i donate to this stupid piece of shit that won't give into a suggestion that neither hurts the game or anyone but instead could make everyone happy?

Niblig you sound like a dumb fuck and me, a few others i know for sure and probably several others i dont know about wont play on this server until you get your shit straight and stop being so "selfish" or stupid as it should be pointed out.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com ;)

imperial99
02-11-2010, 04:41 PM
you should be banned for posting world of warcraft links. and probably shot irl for being a world of warcraft follower

Zithax
02-11-2010, 04:43 PM
you should be banned for posting world of warcraft links. and probably shot irl for being a world of warcraft follower

YEAH THIS

Burlyboss
02-11-2010, 04:47 PM
you should be banned for posting world of warcraft links. and probably shot irl for being a world of warcraft follower

I AGREE

RAGGEEEEEEEE

jelatin
02-11-2010, 06:25 PM
Is it just me or is this one of those problems where everyone can actually get what they want?

Just allow models for the people that want them?

L2Phantom
02-11-2010, 07:00 PM
I don't really see what the big deal is, like the above poster, why not just enable them so everyone wins? Really?

Hasbinbad
02-11-2010, 07:38 PM
..why not just enable them so everyone wins?
..because to Hell with these diptwat Luclin kids, that's why.

PEQ is that way.
-------------------->
Really?
Yes, really.

imperial99
02-11-2010, 08:32 PM
yes everyone can win easily, if you enable the new models.

The players that like your blockhead models can use them and you wont see the new models.

The players that want the new style models that look way better than the old shitty ones could enable this option too if they wanted, and the blockhead players will still see them as blockhead models. But the new model player would see it as a new model.

HEY everyone wins, no one cries!! woot woot!!!

OH wait there is still the dumb fuck niblig who hasnt changed and these retards who think people shouldnt be given the option because they hated luclin arrggg! Gay....

Fix your shit, make everyone happy and lets get down on some old EQ

Myth
02-11-2010, 09:34 PM
I haven't posted on these forums yet, but I have to chime in here.

Regardless of all the opinions of how terrible and rushed the Luclin "Upgrade" was, the fact is they erased the prestige of Velious armor completely. When I had my 60 Rogue decked out in Assassin's armor and other characters with Ry'Gorr and other velious chain/plate and I ticked on the new graphics (which lagged the hell outa my 256MB RAM machine :p) I noticed all the chain/plate looked exactly the same....with different colors. That is why later on, they must have decided to give everyone the option to dye all armor, because they took away the pretty textures that people were so proud of earning. If I have the old models on and everyone else has new models on, or even just my race... I looked like a n00b with dark blue chain on my chest, when in fact it made me really stand out with the old graphics on. And I have to say when my character sat down after the "Upgrade", he wondered from time to time what sausage really tasted like.

Yes, I know there was a way to go into the eqclient.ini and force the velious textures with new graphics, but it didn't match up right and NOBODY actually used that "hack" so I still ran around looking like a moron weather I wanted to or not. Being a Rogue and having cool new armor, I couldn't wait to get new illusion masks and see what the Phase Spider Carapace looked like on a Erudite for instance. They simply needed to implement ALL previous textures if they were going to release higher polygon models. I'm just stating some facts for people who may not have played through Kunark and Velious just to visually be on par with a lvl 5 Vah'Shir who has just started. I now wonder what the playable kitties would have looked like in full armor if they had used the Kerra Isle models.... Might give the devs on this server something to tinker with after Velious is released. A proper Luclin release minus the Bazaar? I won't even get into that argument, lol.

^^^
THIS

mokfarg
02-11-2010, 10:03 PM
Niblig or whatever your stupid name is: is you being a selfish bastard really mean you are either to stupid to figure out how to enable new models on the server or does it just mean you want everyone to see you as the old model character. Either way its stupid as hell, if you want more people to enjoy their stay or even want people to play on this server at least give us the option of using or not using new models. The game itself is classic and great but not everyone likes the blockhead models.

When I read your statement of being a selfish bastard my thoughts of trying your server completely changed. I could care less of what kind of person you are, as long as you were interested in what people that play "your" server think. You need donations right? Why would i donate to this stupid piece of shit that won't give into a suggestion that neither hurts the game or anyone but instead could make everyone happy?

Niblig you sound like a dumb fuck and me, a few others i know for sure and probably several others i dont know about wont play on this server until you get your shit straight and stop being so "selfish" or stupid as it should be pointed out.

Come on, seriously? Is this the gratitude you give after receiving this free gift that has come from others hard work? Unlike these paid to play games that have to put up with customer remarks like this, I don't see that the people who freely give this should give a rat's hiney what you want or say. Believe me, this server being at the top of the emu list has everything to do on how well it runs and the game attempting to emulate classic EQ.

L2Phantom
02-11-2010, 10:35 PM
If I was offering a service (free or otherwise) I'd poll to see what my customer wanted to see, which is exactly what he is doing. And it seems this issue is fairly one sided, just like the boxing issue, so I don't see the rule changing anytime soon.

Finawin
02-11-2010, 10:39 PM
yes everyone can win easily, if you enable the new models.

The players that like your blockhead models can use them and you wont see the new models.

The players that want the new style models that look way better than the old shitty ones could enable this option too if they wanted, and the blockhead players will still see them as blockhead models. But the new model player would see it as a new model.

HEY everyone wins, no one cries!! woot woot!!!

OH wait there is still the dumb fuck niblig who hasnt changed and these retards who think people shouldnt be given the option because they hated luclin arrggg! Gay....

Fix your shit, make everyone happy and lets get down on some old EQ


Leave, noob. No one likes you already and you aren't even in-game yet.

nilbog
02-12-2010, 11:51 AM
Niblig or whatever your stupid name is: is you being a selfish bastard really mean you are either to stupid to figure out how to enable new models on the server or does it just mean you want everyone to see you as the old model character. Either way its stupid as hell, if you want more people to enjoy their stay or even want people to play on this server at least give us the option of using or not using new models. The game itself is classic and great but not everyone likes the blockhead models.

When I read your statement of being a selfish bastard my thoughts of trying your server completely changed. I could care less of what kind of person you are, as long as you were interested in what people that play "your" server think. You need donations right? Why would i donate to this stupid piece of shit that won't give into a suggestion that neither hurts the game or anyone but instead could make everyone happy?

Niblig you sound like a dumb fuck and me, a few others i know for sure and probably several others i dont know about wont play on this server until you get your shit straight and stop being so "selfish" or stupid as it should be pointed out.

This is too funny to delete.

In the event you were addressing me:

I work on classic features for a prekunark-velious server. I don't care what you personally think, either. I do care what the population thinks. Just like the thread BEFORE this one, my opinion on this was that if enough people wanted it, it might be considered. I don't owe you anything, so you can go ahead and stop waiting for that to change. *I* don't need donations, your peers do. Some of you try to hang that over our heads like a threat, seemingly unaware of what "donation" even means.

I spend my time working on fixing priority issues.. like game mechanics. If there comes a point in time where my priority is making Luclin models available for a fraction of the server, we are in good shape!

In the event there is a Niblig:

Please contact me and I will stop this guy from harassing you.

Firrewhisper
02-12-2010, 12:32 PM
I really really disllike them.

Erasong
02-12-2010, 03:03 PM
In the event there is a Niblig:

Please contact me and I will stop this guy from harassing you.

Win.

Aeolwind
02-12-2010, 03:13 PM
yes everyone can win easily, if you enable the new models.

The players that like your blockhead models can use them and you wont see the new models.

The players that want the new style models that look way better than the old shitty ones could enable this option too if they wanted, and the blockhead players will still see them as blockhead models. But the new model player would see it as a new model.

HEY everyone wins, no one cries!! woot woot!!!

OH wait there is still the dumb fuck niblig who hasnt changed and these retards who think people shouldnt be given the option because they hated luclin arrggg! Gay....

Fix your shit, make everyone happy and lets get down on some old EQ

Personal attacks get you everywhere in life. I'm absolutely certain it helps when negotiating the price of a car, house or other item. It must certainly help here as well.

This is the way we make the burgers here, if you don't like them, there are other places down the strip that make burgers different ways. We are not the Burger King of emulators.

imperial99
02-12-2010, 11:07 PM
Not my prob if you can't take a good suggestion and implement it. I think you are just to stupid to figure out, Niblig you dumb fuck hahaha.

Why are you working on game mechanics? Thought the game/server was working fine? Actually dont answer this, i dont want to read your bullshit.

Donating is what people do when they find a good cause to donate towards. In this case, I will not donate to a dumbass piece of shit who won't implement something that would benefit all because he is a selfish bastard. Better yet, I wont donate to a selfish bastard...Little more clear for you? And yes you need donations, does your server produce real life money? I dont think so.

This is so petty, yet such a big issue. It could be fixed so easily, instead people are more worried about my word usage than the point im trying to get across. Why would there be so many threads and posts and people giving their 2 cents if it wasnt a big issue?

And no shit i havent started playing. I read some of the forums and started to understand how much of an immature piece of shit niblig is and decided to not even give it a try. Would rather play SoD, Shards of Dalaya. An oldschool EQ private server. Way more legit than this gay shit.

See how easy it is to drive people away when you are a selfish bastard? Oh well, its only a few people. Shouldnt hurt your peak numbers hahaha.

Ridas
02-12-2010, 11:29 PM
Wow, the irony :eek:

nilbog
02-12-2010, 11:32 PM
Originally Posted by imperial99
Not my prob if you can't take a good suggestion and implement it. I think you are just to stupid to figure out, Niblig you dumb fuck hahaha.

Why are you working on game mechanics? Thought the game/server was working fine? Actually dont answer this, i dont want to read your bullshit.

Donating is what people do when they find a good cause to donate towards. In this case, I will not donate to a dumbass piece of shit who won't implement something that would benefit all because he is a selfish bastard. Better yet, I wont donate to a selfish bastard...Little more clear for you? And yes you need donations, does your server produce real life money? I dont think so.

This is so petty, yet such a big issue. It could be fixed so easily, instead people are more worried about my word usage than the point im trying to get across. Why would there be so many threads and posts and people giving their 2 cents if it wasnt a big issue?

And no shit i havent started playing. I read some of the forums and started to understand how much of an immature piece of shit niblig is and decided to not even give it a try. Would rather play SoD, Shards of Dalaya. An oldschool EQ private server. Way more legit than this gay shit.

See how easy it is to drive people away when you are a selfish bastard? Oh well, its only a few people. Shouldnt hurt your peak numbers hahaha.

http://hissweetheart.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/goodbye1.jpg

Humerox
02-13-2010, 12:57 AM
Some people are just crazy.

Taluvill
02-13-2010, 01:44 AM
Dude, dont get so angry.

If it was a big issue, the poll would reflect it. No reason to piss on the guy who has made the most fun game i've played in years.

Saltinecracker
02-15-2010, 07:31 PM
imperial99 .. is insane... anyone else (like me) that would like to see some new models happening .. talking trash and posts that have name calling all the way through it isnt going to help .. so if your not going to help .. stop ..please ..

Anyway... i think the models should be enabled..even though most people dont want them. is wont affect the ones that do not want it. they can just disable it.

out of 301 .. 78 is a good bit... and there wasnt an option of i dont care or wont effect me .. so most of the people that put no may be saying that is would matter to them .. they just clicked on no ... however that may not be the case lol


I say i want them .. but if there are more important issues that need to be taken care of first ...go with the most important first..then later when little things are being fixed/made to help out the minority groups .. models would be a good issue to enable...

President
02-15-2010, 07:46 PM
HEY SALTINECRACKER STICK TO ONE THREAD AND GO READ MY RESPONSE ON THE OTHER ONE AND STOP BUMPING THESE STUPID THREADS OVER AND OVER.

Saltinecracker
02-15-2010, 07:49 PM
LoL ... there u are again President .. im putting my opinion on all of them so it gets heard.. lol .. maybe you should stop complaining about other people posting .. and not login ... im not going to retype what that other thread says .. since .. this thread has more people and i dont want to make you blush.

But again... simmer down .. its a post

Saltinecracker
02-15-2010, 07:50 PM
Oh yeah i forgot to use caps to make it seems like im being all mad like and scary ... CAPS CAPS CAPS CAPS CAPS CAPS CAps ...dangit .. i used shift :-)

President
02-15-2010, 07:51 PM
Once again, your opinion doesn't fucking matter as the dev's have stated multiple times.

Seriously should a druid be bumping 2 threads in the server chat section because he believe his class should get a fear line of spells?

Or should the warrior be bumping 2 threads in the server chat section because he believes indicolite stats should be changed?

Seriously, this topic is literally as worthless as those, ESPECIALLY since he dev's said NO NO NO.

Saltinecracker
02-15-2010, 08:00 PM
"Seriously should a druid be bumping 2 threads in the server chat section because he believe his class should get a fear line of spells?

Or should the warrior be bumping 2 threads in the server chat section because he believes indicolite stats should be changed?"


maybe not but if i was bumping 2 girls in the same place at the same time .. I would be really happy..... see useing to threads to get my point heard may help

Recyclebin
02-15-2010, 11:01 PM
I would have preferred a option of "It just doesn't mean shit to me"

But on one note : Old OLD OLD models I have known it to turn other players off badly, to not even touch the game.

Let's try not to be too fucken elitist with the 1999 idea, they are PIXELS.

To me, it does not matter. But If you are interested in your server growing as classic beyond your niche poop socking 12 hour a day players, old models turn some players off.

That's all.

Myth
02-15-2010, 11:16 PM
I support no luclin models. I hate them but I do have to agree with the response above me. Two of my close minded friends won't play on this server because they do not have the option to enable the luclin models.

Dac321
02-16-2010, 12:24 AM
Old models all the way. You can tell that the original models had more detail. Unlike the new ones that were all cookie cutted.

Audacious93c
02-16-2010, 04:08 AM
I like a couple models out of them, just not all of them. However, just like others.. Ive got a buddy that wont play this with me cause he hates the old models :(

Morfnblorsh
02-16-2010, 01:52 PM
The only problem I had with Luclin models is that they all had rape-eyes.

Oldschooler
04-27-2010, 01:27 AM
Luclin models look retarded

Luclin models look retarded.*

Just wow man.

USESPELLFTW?

Shurid
04-27-2010, 06:43 AM
after we enable Luclin models we should make all raid zones instanced, then we should put every zone map in the game and adds some form of running faster that can be purchased... perhaps in the shape of a horse.

If someone doesn't want to play on this server b/c their are no Luclin models than I don't think they truly appreciate what this server is about.

Deathrydar
04-27-2010, 07:12 AM
Classic Models > Luclin Models

That is all.....

iamjack
04-27-2010, 07:46 AM
http://hissweetheart.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/goodbye1.jpg

i love that lol

karekiz
04-27-2010, 10:48 AM
Some are hit and miss for me. Luclin Models like *humans* are really good. Ones like ogre /shiver. Most chars such as Human/elf/erudite/barbs looks alright. As for people who like new models, didn't play when it was new. Pffft.

Doesn't impact game play so /shrug.

AR3151
04-27-2010, 10:54 AM
wouldnt bother me if they were implemented

Zephys
04-27-2010, 11:04 AM
I want my classic skellies and wolves. Too bad that's not someting that can be fixed.

jettoki
04-27-2010, 11:35 AM
Luclin GTFO. :)

Azureblaze
04-27-2010, 12:15 PM
I'm sorry but since you can toggle it on and off - I see no reason to not have it an option.

Don't like it, toggle it off. Want it? Toggle it on.

Makes no sense to me to not have the option available.

I know P99 is P99 - but this is a bit too elitist for my taste.

If it is implemented : The default should be with it off though :)

AR3151
04-27-2010, 12:22 PM
I'm sorry but since you can toggle it on and off - I see no reason to not have it an option.

Don't like it, toggle it off. Want it? Toggle it on.

Makes no sense to me to not have the option available.

I know P99 is P99 - but this is a bit too elitist for my taste.

i like this way of thinking, give the people the option and done.

no fuss or fighting.

khanable
04-27-2010, 12:23 PM
I personally think they're absolutely hideous, but if someone else enjoys them and wants to use them .. well .. power to 'em. Doesn't affect me.

jettoki
04-27-2010, 12:32 PM
I personally think they're absolutely hideous, but if someone else enjoys them and wants to use them .. well .. power to 'em. Doesn't affect me.

I totally agree with your sentiment, but I disagree with your conclusion.

Since a lot of what makes EverQuest is its social environment, visual discrepancies between clients lead to things like my character looking awesome with classic models and lame with Luclin models. Since the whole reason I want to look awesome is so I look cooler than you, that affects me.

Now, something like spell icons, UI, or the Velious world re-textures? Use whatever you'd like. Those things really don't affect me or my character.

Azureblaze
04-27-2010, 12:36 PM
I totally agree with your sentiment, but I disagree with your conclusion.

Since a lot of what makes EverQuest is its social environment, visual discrepancies between clients lead to things like my character looking awesome with classic models and lame with Luclin models. Since the whole reason I want to look awesome is so I look cooler than you, that affects me.

Now, something like spell icons, UI, or the Velious world re-textures? Use whatever you'd like. Those things really don't affect me or my character.

Maybe those same people turn them on because they like them better and think you look cooler THAT way. Don't you want people that want the models to like how you look? You are not seeing them if you have them turned off so I don't see an issue.

It's completely user preference since every single model is a toggle, if they like DE better with new models, they will turn it on, thus they will like the way you look better.

Seriously...

AR3151
04-27-2010, 12:38 PM
I totally agree with your sentiment, but I disagree with your conclusion.

Since a lot of what makes EverQuest is its social environment, visual discrepancies between clients lead to things like my character looking awesome with classic models and lame with Luclin models. Since the whole reason I want to look awesome is so I look cooler than you, that affects me.

Now, something like spell icons, UI, or the Velious world re-textures? Use whatever you'd like. Those things really don't affect me or my character.

not sure how someone preference of models effects you? you arent sitting at their computer so as far as you know, they could not be using the updated models. :D


this is all based on the ability to personally change the models not a blanket change across the server.

jettoki
04-27-2010, 12:45 PM
Maybe those same people turn them on because they like them better and think you look cooler THAT way. Don't you want people that want the models to like how you look? You are not seeing them if you have them turned off so I don't see an issue.

Seriously...

Part of what you do when you select the clothes you wear in the morning is to anticipate the impression they will make on people throughout the day. If everyone sees you in whatever clothes they want to see you in, then any expertise you might have at dressing yourself is rendered pointless.

Perhaps if you completely neglect dressing yourself, this principle makes less sense. ;)

guineapig
04-27-2010, 12:45 PM
The one thing I do miss are some of the hairdo and hair color options.
My chanter should be a redhead and my halfling should have hair-chopsticks in her bun!

meh

AR3151
04-27-2010, 12:48 PM
Part of what you do when you select the clothes you wear in the morning is to anticipate the impression they will make on people throughout the day. If everyone sees you in whatever clothes they want to see you in, then any expertise you might have at dressing yourself is rendered pointless.

Perhaps if you completely neglect dressing yourself, this principle makes less sense. ;)

LOL i play EQ to get away from the aspects of real life. my MMO friends dont care what i wear, its all about skillz.

jettoki
04-27-2010, 12:52 PM
LOL i play EQ to get away from the aspects of real life. my MMO friends dont care what i wear, its all about skillz.

Fair enough, but everyone has their own reasons for enjoying classic.

guineapig
04-27-2010, 12:54 PM
LOL i play EQ to get away from the aspects of real life. my MMO friends dont care what i wear, its all about skillz.

My toons never change their underwear, is that why they can't find a group?

AR3151
04-27-2010, 12:57 PM
Fair enough, but everyone has their own reasons for enjoying classic.

exactly, so we all should respect everyones choice on what they want to see.

My toons never change their underwear, is that why they can't find a group?

its an area i would investigate, i dont judge, i would still group :cheers:

Doomapple
04-27-2010, 12:57 PM
I'm afraid that most of the people who say absolutely not to making Luclin models an option sound like crazed zealots. I like playing with the old models that I "grew up" with, but it doesn't make my experience one whit less classic if other people see the models differently than I do. The very nature of this argument shows just how people see the world around them differently anyway, so why get angry about it?

Live and let live plz

P.S. Those of you arguing that you won't look "cool" if your character is not seen using the model you have it set up with....sorry, you're playing EQ, you already don't look cool! :p

jettoki
04-27-2010, 01:06 PM
"Let people play how they want to play! Live and let live! Respect everyone's choices! Just enjoy the game!

P.S. except you people who think style matters. screw you guys!"

Yeah, the irony is thick. :rolleyes:

None of you felt sorry for Erudites after Luclin came out? An entire race of players went from looking awesome to looking like Mr. T on a bad hair day.

guineapig
04-27-2010, 01:06 PM
P.S. Those of you arguing that you won't look "cool" if your character is not seen using the model you have it set up with....sorry, you're playing EQ, you already don't look cool! :p

You have just shattered my reality :(


j/k I'm one of the few that doesn't care either way.

But I really did think I looked cool :cool:

Shurid
04-27-2010, 01:08 PM
Adding non-classic aspects to a game regardless of its aesthetic nature is taking steps (baby steps in this case) towards creating a gaming experience that is neither classlic nor Live EQ. I believe this defeats the whole purpose of dedicating a server to recreating the classic feel and progression of everquest circa 1999.

An example of how adding minor features here and there can drive a game away from its classic feel can be seen in emulated servers such as UO Hybrid (http://www.uogamers.com/) It is a community so hardcore in their beliefs of a classic Pre-Trammel UO experience yet somehow justify a pay for gold service / buying mounts and a PVP EVERYWHERE (except this area) type of mentality. A down with stupid UO live flamboyant cloth colors except for this one rare that I happened to come across. I'm sure they went out of the gate as a dedicated classic experience but every now and then an idea was presented and pushed by the community that could make things nicer/easier/prettier... Am i the only one who sees character models as a degradation to the classic experience?

I understand the counter argument, If I don't like it then I don't have to use them. Agreed, however I do feel that giving in to the demands of changing the game to suit peoples desires for a more Live experience will only hurt the server and the experience of the players in the end. After all, why not add armor dyes into the game? If you don't like it don't dye your armor. Why not put titles back in the game? They don't hurt anyone right? Master Jeweler Baron Ninga Turtle of Tarew Marr the Adventurer...

If it really isn't a big deal then just deal with NOT having the models.

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/2462/eq000092.jpg

/em steps off soapbox

guineapig
04-27-2010, 01:08 PM
"Let people play how they want to play! Live and let live! Respect everyone's choices! Just enjoy the game!

P.S. except you people who think style matters. screw you guys!"

Yeah, the irony is thick. :rolleyes:

None of you felt sorry for Erudites after Luclin came out? An entire race of players went from looking awesome to looking like Mr. T on a bad hair day.


I will say this, even back then you could turn on and off specific race models at will. In PoP many used to turn off new models on those big 72 person raids to help with framerates a little.

Hasbinbad
04-27-2010, 01:16 PM
I can't believe you guys are still whining about this.

I'm starting to change the reason why I like having the old models. It used to be nostalgic; now I just hope it pisses you whiners off.

guineapig
04-27-2010, 01:33 PM
I'm just posting because it's currently an active thread.
Yawn... this day will not end.

Azureblaze
04-27-2010, 01:49 PM
I understand the counter argument, If I don't like it then I don't have to use them. Agreed, however I do feel that giving in to the demands of changing the game to suit peoples desires for a more Live experience will only hurt the server and the experience of the players in the end. After all, why not add armor dyes into the game? If you don't like it don't dye your armor. Why not put titles back in the game? They don't hurt anyone right? Master Jeweler Baron Ninga Turtle of Tarew Marr the Adventurer...

If it really isn't a big deal then just deal with NOT having the models.


I understand what you are saying.

I guess you kind of have to have faith with the dev team on what they do decide to do / not to do. Separate development teams after all.


From what I have seen they take opinions and make their decisions the way they want to for the most part, as this original post says :

This poll will not decide anything.

So basically they asked for opinions so they could see what people think , and I gave mine which is in the minority! Yay!


IMO - Visual changes that have a toggle to be seen or not to be seen and are up to the player is just more options for the player; it does not effect mechanisms of the core game that makes the game great.



Have fun all.

AR3151
04-27-2010, 01:50 PM
I'm just posting because it's currently an active thread.
Yawn... this day will not end.

yep and when this one ends i will go to the other 5 or so message boards and make some rounds :D

Tallenn
04-27-2010, 05:18 PM
I wouldn't care if they were available IF:

1. They don't take any time for the devs to implement, and

2. I don't have to look at them.

nicemace
04-27-2010, 07:55 PM
luclin models are an abomination.

President
04-27-2010, 08:22 PM
http://www.enigmadesign.org/images/DieThreadDie.jpg

Shmeeggeggy
04-27-2010, 10:10 PM
http://www.enigmadesign.org/images/DieThreadDie.jpg

Not gonna happen! Anyone feel inclined to get this puppy to 1000 posts too?

Eh, eh? You know you wanna..

Swindle
04-27-2010, 10:44 PM
I'm firmly against the Luclin models. Though I might support allowing trolls and ogres to be fatter, blockier, and scratch even more.

Audacious93c
04-28-2010, 12:49 AM
I dont see how its that big of deal what other people are using.

Kyronix
04-28-2010, 01:48 AM
Luclin Models brought my Dark elf shadowknight together. It finally game him that sexy yet evil look that he had been lacking. Made the female elven models lithe and agile, humans and barbarians strong. The ogres I personally kept old school along with my gnomies. Halfers I never gave a shit about anyway.

But the Dark elf models were a thing of beauty and I couldn't see myself playing another Darky anything with the current models after having been exposed to the luclin models and using that as my DnD image for so many years when it came to my dark elf characters.

I would like to use the luclin models, if the dev's decide its to much of a hassle believe me, I don't mind at all. But for them to say no cause some asshole thinks it lessens his game experience cause I like to look sexy and evil to my eyes only? I just don't get it.

I came to 1999, not because of the graphics, but the gameplay, type of person who plays, and the progression of this wonderful and classic game. Not to plug another website, but many of you probably know about eqclassic.org. They consider themselves the shit and look down on servers like p99. However with the time they are taking, I was expecting them to have completely revamped the game into an artistic masterpiece (much like the cut scenes added to snes games, when ported to the ps2) but the whole game rather than just some interludes.

Ultimately this late night rambling is brought on because I like detail, I'm tired, and the only reason Everquest didn't have the most stunning graphics ever when it was released was because it was 11 years ago. If they could have made it as pretty as Avatar: The movie, they would have and it still would have been a bomb game... I'm tired :(

nicemace
04-28-2010, 02:27 AM
Luclin Models brought my Dark elf shadowknight together. It finally game him that sexy yet evil look that he had been lacking. Made the female elven models lithe and agile, humans and barbarians strong. The ogres I personally kept old school along with my gnomies. Halfers I never gave a shit about anyway.

But the Dark elf models were a thing of beauty and I couldn't see myself playing another Darky anything with the current models after having been exposed to the luclin models and using that as my DnD image for so many years when it came to my dark elf characters.

I would like to use the luclin models, if the dev's decide its to much of a hassle believe me, I don't mind at all. But for them to say no cause some asshole thinks it lessens his game experience cause I like to look sexy and evil to my eyes only? I just don't get it.

I came to 1999, not because of the graphics, but the gameplay, type of person who plays, and the progression of this wonderful and classic game. Not to plug another website, but many of you probably know about eqclassic.org. They consider themselves the shit and look down on servers like p99. However with the time they are taking, I was expecting them to have completely revamped the game into an artistic masterpiece (much like the cut scenes added to snes games, when ported to the ps2) but the whole game rather than just some interludes.

Ultimately this late night rambling is brought on because I like detail, I'm tired, and the only reason Everquest didn't have the most stunning graphics ever when it was released was because it was 11 years ago. If they could have made it as pretty as Avatar: The movie, they would have and it still would have been a bomb game... I'm tired :(

10 buck says you fap to your luclin model chars.

Kyronix
04-28-2010, 02:34 AM
Back in high school I had an EQ wife... there were times. But she was also in her 40's so the High Elf was super hot in comparison

Metric Ton
04-28-2010, 03:42 AM
Luclin models make me want to die. Immediately.

Omnimorph
04-28-2010, 05:15 AM
Dark elf luclin graphic was probably the best of them all. But luclin graphics reminds me of luclin. And that is a no-no. Classic blocky graphics for characters reminds me of classic, and that's why i'm here :p

km2783
04-28-2010, 01:12 PM
what another player sees doesn't affect me one damned bit. I don't care if they use Luclin models or Classic. Heck, we have to manually turn off the newer pet models, so what's the big deal? There's an awful lot of vitriol in this thread over something that's not a huge issue.

Back in high school I had an EQ wife... there were times. But she was also in her 40's so the High Elf was super hot in comparison

She's hotter than reality by far. :-P

Deathrydar
04-28-2010, 01:38 PM
I am sorry, people can say it doesn't affect gameplay all they want, but it does! This is CLASSIC EVERQUEST! How can anyone justify using the graphic models from the era that most of feel is where our beloved game was ruined, is a good idea?

km2783
04-28-2010, 02:01 PM
And if you ask me, anyone who can't get over it, it's their own problem and not anyone else's. You don't have to ever even know the models are there if you don't want to use them.

ulrich
04-28-2010, 02:11 PM
If you like Luclin's models. You should not be playing on this server.
Yes it is that simple. You are a hypocrite.
"I want the ugly new models that changed classic eq into modern eq".
"I also want item restrictions, global auctions, and pok books"
Yet I still want to play on a classic server?

This is the only Classic Everquest server. Why change it to be like ALL the other Everquest servers?
If you want luclin models go play on ANY other server. The people that like the luclin models are the same people that ruined the game. They cried to SoE for new graphics and more raids. Changing the game into something completely different.

This is just my opinion , but I am always right :P

AR3151
04-28-2010, 02:15 PM
If you like Luclin's models. You should not be playing on this server.
Yes it is that simple.

i like luclin models and im playing on this server, but i like the classic models too.

:eek:

where does that put me!?

km2783
04-28-2010, 02:22 PM
It's hilarious how many people are getting bent out of shape over something they can't even see.

Bumamgar
04-28-2010, 02:22 PM
If you like Luclin's models. You should not be playing on this server.
Yes it is that simple. You are a hypocrite.
"I want the ugly new models that changed classic eq into modern eq".
"I also want item restrictions, global auctions, and pok books"
Yet I still want to play on a classic server?

I fully disagree.

A) Luclin didn't ruin EQ... Yes, cats on the moon is a ridiculous premise, and the Bazaar and Nexus were the beginning of the end, but the rest of the expansion (new models, Alternate Advancement, raid content (Ssra, VT, etc) were very good.

B) Rampant instancing is what ruined EQ. EQ was wonderful through PoP (again, PoK books were a bad idea, but PoP raid progression is some of the best ever). However, after PoP, everything went instanced because SOE didn't like dealing with player disputes over raid targets, and decided to cater to the entitlement crowd (I want my raid target to be available whenever my guild wants to attempt it, wahhhh!). The plethora of instanced group and raid content was the final nail in the coffin that destroyed the community.

In summary, three things destroyed EQ: the Bazaar, Nexus Spires/PoK Books, and Instancing. Each of them acted to remove a reason for players to interact and chipped away at the overall community, which was the true lifeblood of EQ.

New player models didn't destroy EQ. Saying that anyone who likes new models shouldn't play on this server is pretty crappy, imho.


Personally, I'd love for someone to run a classic progression server that didn't stop at Velious, but instead continued to follow the normal expansion release cycle... However, leave out the Bazaar, nexus spires, PoK books, and change all instances to static zones (but leave the content the same). Now that would be a kick-ass server!

AR3151
04-28-2010, 02:24 PM
I fully disagree.

A) Luclin didn't ruin EQ... Yes, cats on the moon is a ridiculous premise, and the Bazaar and Nexus were the beginning of the end, but the rest of the expansion (new models, Alternate Advancement, raid content (Ssra, VT, etc) were very good.

B) Rampant instancing is what ruined EQ. EQ was wonderful through PoP (again, PoK books were a bad idea, but PoP raid progression is some of the best ever). However, after PoP, everything went instanced because SOE didn't like dealing with player disputes over raid targets, and decided to cater to the entitlement crowd (I want my raid target to be available whenever my guild wants to attempt it, wahhhh!). The plethora of instanced group and raid content was the final nail in the coffin that destroyed the community.

In summary, three things destroyed EQ: the Bazaar, Nexus Spires/PoK Books, and Instancing. Each of them acted to remove a reason for players to interact and chipped away at the overall community, which was the true lifeblood of EQ.

New player models didn't destroy EQ. Saying that anyone who likes new models shouldn't play on this server is pretty crappy, imho.

i couldnt agree more. you are 150% correct.

Deathrydar
04-28-2010, 02:53 PM
It's hilarious how many people are getting bent out of shape over something they can't even see.

No, it's hillarious that when you disagree with someone and they come back with the old line of "you're getting bent out of shape".

I am sorry, but I fail to see anyone getting bent out of shape here about it. Sure, there are a few "short" answers that seem kind of rude, but that is what happens when you go against the "purists" of classic.

Accept it. Don't fight it!

Cscott
04-28-2010, 02:55 PM
why are mage pet models in then? I hate them and turn em off but still.

President
04-28-2010, 02:57 PM
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Bumamgar
04-28-2010, 03:14 PM
why are mage pet models in then? I hate them and turn em off but still.

Those are global zone models, so without reverting all the zone files (ie: similar to nektulos and lavastorm) the p99 devs can't really roll those back to classic. Same issue with the skellis and wolves.

km2783
04-28-2010, 04:18 PM
When I see all caps, usually the person is getting upset or "feisty" over whatever it is. Sometimes it's maybe just a bit of emphasis, or perhaps passionate is a better word. But blanket statements about the ruining of the game, and the mentality of the players who want a different graphic, are pretty well, bent out of shape. It's just plain silly to me.

FWIW, I picked yes for Luclin because it doesn't hurt anything, and I'm not forced to use them. And I just might anyway if they were available, who knows? Right now I'm rocking my half elf's face-textured box-head just fine, though :D

One could argue this: "Well, if we do Luclin models, why stop there? Why not start using all the fanciful new graphics SOE did?" And I agree, it could be a slippery slope fraught with peril. But in the end it's all up to the Admins on what they want included on their server.

As long as no one is forced to use one graphic over another, I see absolutely no reason why the Luclin models can't be included if enough people want them and the Admins are okay with it. They hurt no one and no one at all has to see them that doesn't want to.

Those are global zone models, so without reverting all the zone files (ie: similar to nektulos and lavastorm) the p99 devs can't really roll those back to classic. Same issue with the skellis and wolves.

Someone told me in OOC that we can go in and change them back at the character select screen? I haven't messed about with that, yet, though.

AR3151
04-28-2010, 04:26 PM
No, it's hillarious that when you disagree with someone and they come back with the old line of "you're getting bent out of shape".

I am sorry, but I fail to see anyone getting bent out of shape here about it. Sure, there are a few "short" answers that seem kind of rude, but that is what happens when you go against the "purists" of classic.

Accept it. Don't fight it!

when someone repeats themself in multiple posts its obvious they are bent out of shape.

maybe its them that cant accept that not everyone has the same outlook as someone else..

President
04-28-2010, 04:37 PM
For those of you who haven't read the thread or the other GM responses, read this: Nilbog stated that they were not enabled, because the luclin expansion is not enabled (and never will be). They are not "turned off" by the GM's, this is how it works by "default." He said it's "possible" that they might be able to find a workaround for it, but that he probably wasn't going to waste his time on it.

km2783
04-28-2010, 04:47 PM
Well, then. Aren't we all just silly :D

Nocte
04-28-2010, 06:44 PM
Players other than myself are unable to see the models as they are displayed on my screen. If I choose to display dwarves as a pink cube with arms and legs (and a beard, I guess), the person playing that character will never know, and it doesn't affect them at all.

I don't see why this is limited any more than people altering their UI files. I would suggest opening up the ability to display Luclin models (but not Luclin content) and leave the decision on which models to display to the player.


edit: I notice this now has a poll. The selections should be, "I will not activate Luclin models" or "I would like the option to activate Luclin models."

"I don't want other people to have Luclin models even though I will never see them" is really pretty lame.

Aluvin
04-28-2010, 07:42 PM
Players other than myself are unable to see the models as they are displayed on my screen. If I choose to display dwarves as a pink cube with arms and legs (and a beard, I guess), the person playing that character will never know, and it doesn't affect them at all.

I don't see why this is limited any more than people altering their UI files. I would suggest opening up the ability to display Luclin models (but not Luclin content) and leave the decision on which models to display to the player.


edit: I notice this now has a poll. The selections should be, "I will not activate Luclin models" or "I would like the option to activate Luclin models."

"I don't want other people to have Luclin models even though I will never see them" is really pretty lame.
Totally agree, since there is already lots of stuff in this version of the game that isn't classic ;) And none of those things are taking the joy away from me in playing this game again :)

President
04-28-2010, 08:00 PM
For those of you who haven't read the thread or the other GM responses, read this: Nilbog stated that they were not enabled, because the luclin expansion is not enabled (and never will be). They are not "turned off" by the GM's, this is how it works by "default." He said it's "possible" that they might be able to find a workaround for it, but that he probably wasn't going to waste his time on it.

Since the two posted above don't seem to know how to read, ill post it agian.

Bumamgar
04-28-2010, 09:04 PM
seeing as Nilbog posted this poll, your post is out of line, President.

Nocte
04-28-2010, 09:32 PM
Since the two posted above don't seem to know how to read, ill post it agian.

I can read just fine, but I tend to avoid the posts written with inflated self worth via over-sized text. Plus, it was on page 17, and I didn't want to wade through all the other opinions just to chime my 2cp in (y'know, since that was what was asked for).

kisses.

President
04-28-2010, 10:00 PM
seeing as Nilbog posted this poll, your post is out of line, President.

It's really not out of line. I'm not going to sift through what all the GM's said but what I have said is exactly what they said. I'm PRETTY SURE it was nilbog who stated it, but It could have been another. Notice when Nilbog started this poll? yea - 5 months ago.


edit: I notice this now has a poll. The selections should be, "I will not activate Luclin models" or "I would like the option to activate Luclin models."

It's been a poll for 5 months, I would think 1 month would constitute a dead poll.

I can read just fine, but I tend to avoid the posts written with inflated self worth via over-sized text. Plus, it was on page 17, and I didn't want to wade through all the other opinions just to chime my 2cp in (y'know, since that was what was asked for).

kisses.

You use the phrase "inflated self worth" but skip an entire 5 month old thread to post *your* opinion.... hm.....

President
04-28-2010, 10:17 PM
Oh, and the reason I posted it, is because too many people continually go "well i think they should turn them on." It's not a light switch.

Bertl
04-29-2010, 04:33 AM
They work with the SoF client, if it wasn't mentioned already =P

Omnimorph
04-29-2010, 04:51 AM
I voted no, but if other people want it it wouldn't affect me. Can't quite understand why they would want luclin graphics, it wouuld ruin the classic feel for me, but hey, other people might want them.

Keeping in mind the classic graphics make having a plain shitty robe look just like a plain shitty robe :p having a shiny SMR makes you look elite. I don't like the idea of me wearing something which looks badass on my screen but then could look rubbish on someone else's screen (yes... i am vain)

Nocte
04-29-2010, 12:55 PM
It's been a poll for 5 months, I would think 1 month would constitute a dead poll.

You use the phrase "inflated self worth" but skip an entire 5 month old thread to post *your* opinion.... hm.....

I posted my opinion, which was asked for. If they were tired of hearing opinions about this topic, they'd lock the thread. I don't need to justify anything to you. Enjoy dealing with it.

President
04-29-2010, 01:03 PM
I posted my opinion, which was asked for. If they were tired of hearing opinions about this topic, they'd lock the thread. I don't need to justify anything to you. Enjoy dealing with it.

The only reason I posted is to stop the "I think they should turn it on posts" because its not that simple, which is exactly what you put in your post.

1) It's not classic
2) It's not an on and off switch
3) It's not worth the dev's time to figure out how to get them enabled

Enjoy not having Luclin models.

Nano
04-30-2010, 04:11 PM
This was simply an experiment to see how well the luclin model textures looked on the classic models. It takes a little work pick out the appropriate textures and reorient them around and save them as the appropriate format. They are higher resolution though so they do look nice.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Nanosphere/luclin_tex.jpg

Looks like I put the legs on backwards though >.<

jettoki
04-30-2010, 04:17 PM
This was simply an experiment to see how well the luclin model textures looked on the classic models. It takes a little work pick out the appropriate textures and reorient them around and save them as the appropriate format. They are higher resolution though so they do look nice.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Nanosphere/luclin_tex.jpg

Looks like I put the legs on backwards though >.<

Hey, that's pretty cool! I always wished they'd keep making new textures like the Velious ones. I wonder if all the Luclin textures work this well on the classic models.

ChairmanMauzer
05-01-2010, 01:58 PM
Why not have them as an option for those who want? And those who don't want em can keep their settings with the old models? Everyone wins. I hate the old fatty racial models. I want to try an ogre sk (is frontal stun immunity ever going to be implemented?), but ogres look so round and stupid.

nilbog
05-01-2010, 02:01 PM
If someone puts forth all the work to have these non-classic things, on a classic server, the work will not be done by my developers.

Content and mechanics within the scope of the server's timeline will ALWAYS come before Luclin models. FYI.

Weekapaug
05-01-2010, 03:44 PM
If someone puts forth all the work to have these non-classic things, on a classic server, the work will not be done by my developers.

Content and mechanics within the scope of the server's timeline will ALWAYS come before Luclin models. FYI.

Awesome!

I read that as "Why, YES, Weekapaug, when you roll your woodie warrior this time, you should roll a female!" :P

fmarz
06-29-2010, 05:38 PM
Hey all, just joined the server and looking for that 1999 experience, dont wanna start any flames, but is there a way yet to turn on the luclin models? Although I miss the game from 1999, it is hard for me to miss the models hahah

mitic
06-29-2010, 05:42 PM
Hey all, just joined the server and looking for that 1999 experience, dont wanna start any flames, but is there a way yet to turn on the luclin models? Although I miss the game from 1999, it is hard for me to miss the models hahah

0% rezzes on threads wont change anything

Toony
06-29-2010, 05:46 PM
Hells no

Erasong
06-29-2010, 05:47 PM
0% rezzes on threads wont change anything

LoLoLoLoL that was a good one.

abbadox
06-29-2010, 07:34 PM
THe models SUCK

But instead of the models, ADD VELIOUS TEXTURES!

Combo
06-30-2010, 04:16 PM
no

Sarkhan
06-30-2010, 07:15 PM
I actually liked some of the models, or at least some aspects of them... I like having a DE without a mullet which all classic DEs seem to think are the trend **shudders**
I also like Ogre models for obvious reasons. Ogres not being a sac of fat, and instead the muscle and imposing look that they should be. Not only that but fat ogres cause problems, and i hate it when a halfling jumps out of their dead bodies! I like the choice to avoid those little buggers if i can and ogre corpses just give them hiding spots!

after saying that, which i guess was not needed i forgot to say my yes / no... I would have to say Yes for some models, not all... That's what was nice about it -> if they turned it on, you could choose which races and male/female

Damaja
06-30-2010, 08:42 PM
stay OLD models PLEASE, this is a classic server so leave it classic

Daywolf
06-30-2010, 08:52 PM
It does not force you to use them regarding character models and animations, so I go with choice for those that want to. I don't play for nostalgia but for the system features; the difficulty level and 100% persistent world etc. Graphics don't effect any of that.

Dersk
06-30-2010, 09:13 PM
this is a classic server so leave it classic

Do you still type out all the stats for anything you sell in EC and expect others to do the same?

StinkyGreenBud
06-30-2010, 10:33 PM
NO. NO. NO.

vinx
06-30-2010, 11:47 PM
No! for me and anyone else, i am half-elf and this old helm rocks!,
i wouldnt want anyone to see that stoooopid helm luclin has LOL

RKromwell
06-30-2010, 11:53 PM
Do not want.

oldhead
06-30-2010, 11:57 PM
Be that selfish bastard!!!

Luclin.. really? Why shit on your cake?

funhorroryes
07-01-2010, 12:18 AM
I know you've stated that you arent going to implement them, however, they look extremely goofy and the animations really annoy me.

On a different note - You bring the server down to patch small things to bring back the classic vibe.. lame, useless things like batwing merchants, lockjaw or diseased shark spawn rates etc and you're going to jump in and make a CRITICAL change? cosmetic or not. it isnt classic.

If your making the effort to make all these slight changes to the game which will prob effect 10 people maximum, which is fine... i just think its a little retarded and a huge waste of time if you're bringing these models in

If i look at oldschool screenshots i get 0% nostalgia from any screenshots containing the new models

Nuff said.

JackFlash
07-01-2010, 01:31 AM
wow.....nuff said....

Linkamus
07-12-2010, 11:08 PM
Every day that I play on this server all I can think to myself is- "ARGG, this server would be PERFECT if I could just use luclin models!!!!!!." It's beyond frustrating for me at this point. I've tried to tweak with SoF so that I could use luclin models, and I was pretty successful. I got spells working as they should. However, SoF is so plagued with other little bugs it's just not worth it anymore.

Please please make it so that if we want to use luclin models, that we can. This in no way effects game mechanics (obviously), it is just personal preference.

Me, my wife, and my two friends that all play on this server feel exactly the same way about this subject. We all love classic EQ, but we also loved when they released the new luclin models. We would to play with both!!!''

EDIT: After reading a few of the pages of this thread, I Just want to point out that I am in no way angry, or think bad about any of the developers of this project. In fact I am eternally grateful to them for the server I've been waiting for for YEARS. I am simply put: Frustrated that I cannot view my character the way I was used to viewing them after luclin/PoP came out. I think the Luclin models were a huge improvement to the visual aspect of the game, and I love them!

soup
07-12-2010, 11:11 PM
I don't want Luclin models, and voted accordingly, but, I don't care if other people want to use them. Nothing wrong with granting cosmetic options to people.

Uberom
07-12-2010, 11:43 PM
I don't wish to step on anyone's toes, but my live experience BEGAN post Luclin. I was surprised to see the classic models weren't that bad, until I saw trolls. That is fucking ridiculous.

If people, such as myself, would rather install a few files to change what things look like ON THEIR OWN COMPUTER SCREEN!!, then you should allow them to do it. I realize the devs are trying to keep it as classic as possible, which is why they should keep the classic models in the original server files or w/e. It should, however, be an option to those players who are in this shit for the long haul, to have the CHOICE of what they want their shit to look like. Personally, I have a soft spot for Luclin models because that is all I have ever known. I think it kinda sucks that some of you out there want to bash them and ruin the chances of my increased EQ experience just for the sake of .....idealistic bullshit. Thats frankly all it is. "Fuck luclin models, this is classic EQ rawr rawr rawr."

It's one thing to try and keep things "classic", especially when it comes to zones and programming and the numbers behind everything, however all we are talking about is LOOKS. Graphics. Nothing more. Not even server wide stuff, just for those who want to use them.

I beg you, please allow us the option to install Luclin models. That shit would make my fucking day.

Also note, if this were the case, I would IMMEDIATELY re-gear my level 19 Troll Warrior and start playing him again, being that I didn't have to look at his fat fucking ass all day.

Pardon my french. :D

Poeskas
07-13-2010, 12:22 AM
I'd prefer that they're disabled for everyone. Although it doesnt give anyone an advantage, per se, it does create a cosmetic disparity between players.

I kept Classic models til DoN or so, and i was always annoyed by the fact that my toons and the toons I could see looked different to 99% of the EQ population.

Nocte
07-13-2010, 12:31 AM
it does create a cosmetic disparity between players.

So what? My custom UI is a cosmetic disparity, too.

Poeskas
07-13-2010, 12:57 AM
So what? My custom UI is a cosmetic disparity, too.

Eh. It's just my opinion. I don't care about your ugly UI as much as i do different models between different people. But this is a classic server, in case you've forgotten.....

I would be in favor of removing custom UI's, as well, in favor of exact copies of classic-velious era UI's. But in this build, i doubt an exact copy is possible.

Dumesh Uhl'Belk
07-13-2010, 02:29 AM
Although I prefer the status quo...

If there were to be any luclin models at all, then I would want them to show up on everyone's screen, but only for people who want to have the new model represent themselves. Basically, each person chooses to look like the classic model or the new model and that choice is reflected on everyone's screen. Everyone will see whichever model each person they are looking at has chosen.

I pick my race, my weapons, and my armor, partly based on how they look. It's important to me that the choices I make for my avatar are visible to all the people I meet in game. To me, it is part of the integrity of the shared world we play in.

Poeskas
07-13-2010, 03:31 AM
Although I prefer the status quo...

If there were to be any luclin models at all, then I would want them to show up on everyone's screen, but only for people who want to have the new model represent themselves. Basically, each person chooses to look like the classic model or the new model and that choice is reflected on everyone's screen. Everyone will see whichever model each person they are looking at has chosen.

I pick my race, my weapons, and my armor, partly based on how they look. It's important to me that the choices I make for my avatar are visible to all the people I meet in game. To me, it is part of the integrity of the shared world we play in.

Well said, my man. I think i could go for this type of system as well, if it came to that.
But I vehemently oppose the dichotomous implementation of Luclin textures as we experienced on live.
It undermined the significance of the choices we made for our avatars and the detracted from the integrity of our shared world, as you say.

And it was absolutely not, f*cking classic!!

Rasterburn
08-29-2010, 07:45 AM
I voted in favor of Luclin models, for several important reasons:

(1) First of all, it is improper to pretend that Luclin is not "classic EQ." It most certainly is classic, being that it was the last expansion which was fully developed by Verant. It is not a "Sony expansion," so please stop referring to it that way. Verant developed Luclin and in fact, they had even started working on the initial stages of PoP when they finally sold out completely to SOE in mid-2002. I have had this explained to me directly by none other than Brad McQuaid himself, via some casual messages that we exchanged during the beta testing of Vanguard. So perhaps this opens up another issue for the P1999 administrators: why don't you simply continue patching the game right up through Luclin..? That way, all of the legitimate, classic Verant content will eventually will be covered. You may not have cared for Luclin for whatever reasons, but your preference does not make Luclin any less valid as a classic EverQuest expansion. It was a 100% Verant-produced expansion to the classic game, period.

(2) Speaking as a texture artist, the rejection of the Luclin models is irrational, as they are generally superior to the original models. I think what we're seeing here are emotional responses based upon nostalgia, rather than objectivity and common sense. Which is fine... everyone is entitled to their feelings. But claiming that the Luclin models look bad in comparison to the originals is just plain ridiculous. And also, it should be pointed out once again that those upgraded models were developed by Verant... not by SOE.

(3) Lastly... and this has been touched upon many times within this thread... I do not think this issue should be decided by a poll. The results of polls are often dominated by status quo's and cliques. It makes more sense to decide this issue based upon INCLUSIVENESS. Do you want the ENTIRE player base to be happy with their options..? Then enable the Luclin models for those players who desire them. Do you prefer to be dictatorial and insist that everybody MUST be seeing the exact same things as everybody else..? And does everything we see NEED to be compatible with 1999 EverQuest..? Then you can start by forcibly removing the 2005 HUD elements, disabling widescreen graphics options, forcing low-res textures on EVERYTHING, disabling quite a few console commands, and... need I go on..? The entire attitude of "I only want you to see blah blah blah" is utterly ridiculous. Personally, I have the ability to hack into my game files and make sure that all of you appear completely naked on my screen, with big purple smiley faces on your backsides. I could do that in a heartbeat, if I wanted to. Do you really care..? Well, you shouldn't. It's my screen, not yours. The entire "shared experience" argument is thus worthless, as there will always be too many variables... thus it is impossible to ensure it. Let's just give up on that tact -- because it is not valid, nor is it enforceable.


I think we should look at this in the same way that our lawmakers look at the "gay marriage" issue. I personally am not in favor of gay marriages. Lots of other people are in favor of them. And in every state where that issue has been put to the vote, it has been shot down by a small margin. But the law, in its wisdom, realizes that deciding such issues by way of a vote (or a poll) is simply opening the door to unfair discrimination by the majority against a minority. Imagine if we held a poll in some of the more redneck southern U.S. states, and asked the mostly white population if blacks should continue to be allowed to vote, or be able to sit in the front of the bus. You can imagine how such a poll would turn out... but would it be fair..?

To sum it up: I feel that to be as inclusive and as fair as possible to ALL of the players on this server, the players themselves should have the option to select which character models they desire to see on their screens. And if the object of this poll was to "gauge interest in having Luclin models available," then the admin should recognize that according to the results, a full third of the player base has expressed such an interest. That's a very sizable number of players, all thing considered... hence it should be concluded that there is in fact a very strong interest amongst the players to have the Luclin models be made available as an option.

PS -- for the record, I began playing EQ in late 1999 and continued up until mid-2003, at which point I just couldn't take the dumbed-down SOE content any longer. I am as veteran as it gets, pretty much. But I won't allow my nostalgia to blind me to the fact that options are always better than a lack thereof, so long as they do not significantly impact upon the core gameplay.

Kutter
08-29-2010, 08:41 AM
Make some pretty pictures of your luclin models and paste 'em to your screen. cuz that's as close as you're gonna get.

These guys need to be workin' on Kunark and Velious. Not wastin' their time on post-Velious expansion material that's entirely cosmetic. Plenty of other servers you can go to where you can feast your eyes on the Luclin models to your heart's content. This ain't one of them. Period.

Claustaler E.
08-29-2010, 08:46 AM
To give someone the choice is everytime better :)
there is no thing if someone want old models turn them off if someone say "hmm but for me P99 would make more fun if i have the new models on" bump turn them on... and both can be happy :P
sounds good for me that both or better everyone can be happy with his models... if u give him the choice.

Rasterburn
08-29-2010, 08:52 AM
Make some pretty pictures of your luclin models and paste 'em to your screen. cuz that's as close as you're gonna get.

These guys need to be workin' on Kunark and Velious. Not wastin' their time on post-Velious expansion material that's entirely cosmetic. Plenty of other servers you can go to where you can feast your eyes on the Luclin models to your heart's content. This ain't one of them. Period.

Actually, I can do whatever I want. I told you -- I can modify my own game files and I have already done so. Deal with it. Hence your dictatorial attitude is rather laughable in my case. So please just can it, because it is entirely uncalled for. And I have already said why, in my previous post.

I was speaking on behalf of ALL of the players on this server, ALL of whom are just as important as you are... even though you apparently do not think so.

Personally, I think the very best option of all is to simply keep adding to the P1999 server all the way up to Luclin, since it is every bit as "classic" as Kunark and Velious. If you disagree, well then that is your choice... but as if often said these days: you are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts. If the definition of "classic" is "produced entirely by Verant," then your definition must by default include Luclin, as it was Verant's final expansion.

As for the "wasting time on it" argument, I guess that argument would carry some weight amongst people who can't walk and chew gum at the same time. For the rest of us who are capable of actually doing more than one thing at a time, it is moot.

Have a nice day and thank you for sharing your opinions. That's what forum boards are for: sharing different opinions, not dictating to others based upon some perceived status quo. Or at least, that's what they -should- be for.

Taxi
08-29-2010, 09:27 AM
Where is the option:

"I wouldnt turn them on, but if some people want to use them themselves, why not?"

Cause it dont change anything on my screen, why should i give a fuck how the game looks on some other player's monitor?

That being said, if it would eat into dev time for Kunark, id say no. If its like flicking a switch on in the software, id say yes.

internalprime8
08-29-2010, 10:07 AM
As much as I'd like to support giving OTHER people the option to enable Luclin models, I can't bare to imagine someone might see my troll bastardized with those awful textures.

Spud
08-29-2010, 10:30 AM
A If the definition of "classic" is "produced entirely by Verant," then your definition must by default include Luclin, as it was Verant's final expansion.

Yea thats cool except I don't think thats their definition of "classic".

You may define classic as the era when Verant was still running things, but they define it as the time before the Bazaar, Lunar cats, and ugly models were implemented.

Tork
08-29-2010, 11:39 AM
I voted against Lucin models - old school Troll is the best in the entire game!

Jaco
08-29-2010, 11:46 AM
I voted No, cause they're all alike ugly .. now it would be acceptable if it was to ease devs or something technical.

ShadowWulf
08-29-2010, 12:10 PM
Yea thats cool except I don't think thats their definition of "classic".

You may define classic as the era when Verant was still running things, but they define it as the time before the Bazaar, Lunar cats, and ugly models were implemented.

Classic for me is pre pok stones, that what killed the game for ME. I enjoyed Luclin, and do consider it classic as well as imho my favorite expansion.

Yep, i like space kittys.

hedbonker
08-29-2010, 12:11 PM
Voted no. They are not classic.

ShadowWulf
08-29-2010, 12:23 PM
Voted no. They are not classic.

We already established they are classic.

Damn socialists deciding what is best for other people and not giving them equal free choice for themselves. Your socialist EQ agenda will not be ignored, and your ObamaModels will not go unnoticed by the american people. Im sure Glen Beck will do a program soon on the un-american way you think your socialist "classic" world view should look for EVERYONE, without their choice in the matter!

Sarkov
08-29-2010, 12:33 PM
Voted no, but its not strong enough.

So, NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

There, that should express my feelings on the subject.

ShadowWulf
08-29-2010, 12:35 PM
Voted no, but its not strong enough.

So, NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

There, that should express my feelings on the subject.

Socialist.

Rasterburn
08-29-2010, 01:42 PM
You may define classic as the era when Verant was still running things, but they define it as the time before the Bazaar, Lunar cats, and ugly models were implemented.

In other words... 100% arbitrarily and not based upon anything logical. Gotcha.

Well, now that we've cleared that up, I guess I have nothing else to contribute. Peace.

fwaits
08-29-2010, 04:30 PM
No, for the same reason others have stated.

The intent of this server is to recreate the Classic through Velious era to the best of it's ability. Luclin models were not present in that era so I think they should not be present here.

Obviously some things are not classic due to technical issues with reverse engineering certain specifics, but that's not something in the devs full control.

Nineran
08-29-2010, 04:53 PM
Classic Models all the way baby.

I remember reading a review about Everquest, I was playing the Beta at the time, so this was pre-release. One of the reviews of the game talking about the graphics of the characters made me laugh. It stated, "The average Everquest character is comprised of less polygon's than one of Laura Croft's boobs"

Even with that the original models have SOOO much more personality than the Luclin models. Ogres turned into human looking things, it just looks like they used paint and went to that stretch/skew function. Hit 125% and then mushed their face in a bit. Dwarves turned into just looking like midget humans, again just 50%. Gnomes just liked like human babies. All of the sudden all the characters had the same wierdly rounded edges. The attack animations absolutely sucked balls. It looks like they all went through this really wierd training program to make all their actions look like robots. Take a look at the over head two handed swing of Luclin models. For EVERY model, its all the same straight armed, brief chop. Now browse through the fluid motion of a Fat ogre taking a swing, or a dwarf taking a swing. Or the side swing, axe chop of the human model.

I am sure there are some nuances in the Luclin models that set them apart that I am missing. But I have to say, Ogre's stopped being Ogres for me when the new models came out.

I mean the old models go so far as to make me speak differently to the person that is playing that character. I engage a troll, or an ogre, or a dwarf in conversation differently, just because the original models display so much personality.

The luclin models, its all the same robot to me.

Anyways, No.

Great thread.

Old models only all the way.

ojamajoe
08-29-2010, 11:13 PM
I don't know where people are getting their difinitions of "classic" from; but I would point out that by the time Luclin launched Verant / SOE were explicitly labeling the original game "Classic Everquest". This is the only consistent definiton I can see, and by this definition Luclin models are obviously not "classic".

This is hardly an arbitrary definition of classic, as it is the original designers'. It has been noted numerous times since prior to launch by all the people working on this project that this would be a classic / kunark / velious server. None of these expansions include the Luclin graphics, and it is therefore well within the stated goals of this project to exclude them.

It is my understanding that there is a work-around available for those who cannot live without them, but in the end this server reflects the vision of 'classic', 'kunark', and 'velious' which those who work on it have. This is fair, and if you have a different vision of 'classic' there is absolutely nothing (aside from the insane amount of work it takes) stopping you from creating your own server and sharing it with us as well.

Zathael
of the Lodge of the Dead of Neriak.
Gentleman, Scholar, Bane of the Light.

yaeger
08-29-2010, 11:26 PM
I don't understand, if you don't like the ogre or half elf models you can uncheck the luclin model in options. It's fully customizable to whatever YOU want.

Why not have the option?

"I don't like apple pie, so NO ONE ELSE WILL HAVE ANY EITHER!"

Slightly ridiculous opinion.

Sarkov
08-29-2010, 11:56 PM
No, YOU'RE a ridiculous opinion.

...

Anyway, I don't think its outrageous to want to have full control over how others perceive my toon. I chose to have him appear a certain way, and I'll be damned if other people can check a box and have him look like a malformed half-retarded demi-ape because that's what some coked out character modeller thought barbarians should look like when Luclin shipped.

And since we're asking for non-classic things on this classic server, can I have Ssra temple too? I kinda enjoyed that zone. (do you see how stupid this is yet?)

Kutter
08-30-2010, 04:02 AM
Actually, I can do whatever I want. I told you -- I can modify my own game files and I have already done so. Deal with it. Hence your dictatorial attitude is rather laughable in my case...

Then tell everyone else who wants them how to do it, so the devs don't have to worry about it.

Bonehead.

Rasterburn
08-30-2010, 07:59 AM
First, tell everyone why you're abusing this poll by improperly responding to it. Bonehead.

The admin did not ask you people to vote for whether or not you liked Luclin models. We already knew that a lot of you disliked those models. That wasn't even a matter of debate.

The admin asked all of you to vote for whether or not the Luclin models should be an OPTION for those people who DO prefer them.

But that isn't what you voted for, nor is it what you have been commenting on. Instead, you've simply jumped on this thread as an excuse to flame Luclin and the people who enjoyed it.

So basically... you're a worthless troll with a brain the size of a walnut. Have a nice day and please drive through.

As for how to change the models and textures in this game, one of the methods that I prefer is to use an DirectX injector after the fact. This method allows the game files themselves to remain unaltered, greatly simplifying things for the engine. Explaining the procedures for creating such an injector would be lengthy and outside of the scope of this thread, however. And in the case of uni-brows like Kutter, I seriously doubt that he would be able to understand the procedures... not even if I included pictures and wrote out the instructions in crayon.


PS -- here's one of the Luclin models that some of you people are referring to as "ugly." Let's examine this together, shall we..?

http://www.tessmage.com/images/misc/EQ_Luclin_DE_Necro_01.jpg

Yep, she sure is ugly. Much uglier than a pre-Luclin blockhead, who constantly twitches as if she's suffering from rectal itch whenever she sits down to med.

Verant upgraded the models for a reason: it's because the original models sucked and had become obsolete. Later. :rolleyes:

Kutter
08-30-2010, 09:50 AM
I'm not the one asking devs to devote time to something superfluous, cosmetic, and not accepted by the community as something that's classic.

Way to go on not sharing your esoteric knowledge of Luclin models you went out of your way to claim. Not only that, you stubbornly QQ on about a dead horse.

When you call someone a Neanderthal, make sure you pick the right person. I give much more credit to the community - obviously - than you, and there are things known as links. Work as hard on that as you have in decrying how lame it is that I, nor three-quarters of the rest of the pollees, agree with you, and you may have a winner.

"Obsolete", along with beauty, is subjective.

Bonehead.

Rasterburn
08-30-2010, 10:05 AM
I'm not the one asking devs to devote time to something superfluous, cosmetic, and not accepted by the community as something that's classic.

Incorrect.

First of all, it is the ADMINISTRATOR OF THIS PROJECT who asked people to express their opinions. Or have you forgotten who created this poll..?

Secondly, a FULL THIRD of the player base has expressed an interest in having Luclin models available as an option, according to the current poll results. That is not an insignificant number.

Thirdy, I suspect that a lot of the people who voted against the Luclin models did not understand the purpose of this poll... as pointed out in one of my previous posts. I think they were simply voting for whether or not they LIKED the Luclin models... not whether or not they should be an OPTION for those people who enjoy having them.

So if all of the above is indeed true, and if this poll were being conducted and responded to properly, then I suspect that the majority of players would vote in favor of a Luclin models OPTION. Not a requirement... an OPTION. You do understand the difference, right..?

And this is why I began in this thread by saying that this type of issue shouldn't be decided by a poll, due to the fact that a significant percentage of respondents are not voting properly. Including you, Kutter.

PS -- the reason I placed a few words in CAPITAL LETTERS is because long ago, I learned that mentally challenged people such as yourself require additional emphasis, before a particular word or phrase gets through the four-inch thickness of your skull. That's just the helpful sort of guy I am. No charge. ;)

Kutter
08-30-2010, 10:24 AM
Incorrect.

First of all, it is the ADMINISTRATOR OF THIS PROJECT who asked people to express their opinions. Or have you forgotten who created this poll..?

Have you forgotten who answered it? And who consistently reject the idea?

Secondly, a FULL THIRD of the player base has expressed an interest in having Luclin models available as an option, according to the current poll results. That is not an insignificant number.

Roughly as many as want to see the server turn into some distorted version of PvP. Get my point?

Thirdy, I suspect that a lot of the people who voted against the Luclin models did not understand the purpose of this poll... as pointed out in one of my previous posts. I think they were simply voting for whether or not they LIKED the Luclin models... not whether or not they should be an OPTION for those people who enjoy having them.

Re-read all the threads on it. Not only is the community smart enough to understand the poll, they're smart enough to understand that there are things more deserving of the devs' attention. Which you want to ignore. If they were kept busy working on things that didn't contribute to the generally accepted view of classic, we wouldn't see Kunark until 2025.

So if all of the above is indeed true, and if this poll were being conducted and responded to properly, then I suspect that the majority of players would vote in favor of a Luclin models OPTION. Not a requirement... an OPTION. You do understand the difference, right..?

Incorrect. You seem to have a dim view of everyone's intelligence except your own.

And this is why I began in this thread by saying that this type of issue shouldn't be decided by a poll, due to the fact that a significant percentage of respondents are not voting properly. Including you, Kutter.

Did you proofread this before you wrote it? Einstein?

PS -- the reason I placed a few words in CAPITAL LETTERS is because long ago, I learned that mentally challenged people such as yourself require additional emphasis, before a particular word or phrase gets through the four-inch thickness of your skull. That's just the helpful sort of guy I am. No charge. ;)

I already called YOU a bonehead. Come up with your own. Anyway, I improperly expressed views on an improper poll, that people who were too stupid to know what they were voting for, rejected. And we're all too stupid to realize it.

That about sum it up there, Mr. Hawking?

Rasterburn
08-30-2010, 10:35 AM
Have you forgotten who answered it? And who consistently reject the idea?

Then he should close the poll and lock the thread. I would have no problem with that. But since he hasn't closed it, then it is logical to assume that he is still interested in seeing some more comments from the community. Period.

But the last thing in this world that I will ever, ever do is stop telling the truth... just because nitwits like yourself can't handle it. Just buck up and shut up, because all of my points were valid and absolutely all of yours were pure horseshit. You no doubt feel threatened by the important points that I have raised, hence your childish compulsion to launch into personal attacks, in lieu of any actual ability to debate things rationally. Don't try to deny that, because your behavior throughout this thread indicates that you are, indeed, a witless troll.

Now then, Kutter: this is the last response that you will get from me... mainly because in comparison to myself, you have the brain of a maggot and the sophistication of a Harlem crack whore. On the evolutionary scale, you and I are not even members of the same species. "People" such as yourself are of the type that I typically scrape off the bottom of my boots. Hence any further correspondence between us would be completely beneath me. Buh bye, little boy. Run along now and try to stay out of trouble.

...Raren
08-30-2010, 10:37 AM
Then he should close the poll and lock the thread. I would have no problem with that. But since he hasn't closed it, then it is logical to assume that he is still interested in seeing some more comments from the community. Period.

But the last thing in this world that I will ever, ever do is stop telling the truth... just because nitwits like yourself can't handle it. Just buck up and shut up, because all of my points were valid and absolutely all of yours were pure horseshit. You no doubt feel threatened by the important points that I have raised, hence your childish compulsion to launch into personal attacks, in lieu of any actual ability to debate things rationally. Don't try to deny that, because your behavior throughout this thread indicates that you are, indeed, a witless troll.

Now then, Kutter: this is the last response that you will get from me... mainly because in comparison to myself, you have the brain of a maggot and the sophistication of a Harlem crack whore. On the evolutionary scale, you and I are not even members of the same species. "People" such as yourself are of the type that I typically scrape off the bottom of my boots. Hence any further correspondence between us would be completely beneath me. Buh bye, little boy. Run along now and try to stay out of trouble.

I like this guy lol

Kutter
08-30-2010, 10:52 AM
Then he should close the poll and lock the thread. I would have no problem with that. But since he hasn't closed it, then it is logical to assume that he is still interested in seeing some more comments from the community. Period.

I'm sure he would love to spend time doing that with every thread that is basically finished, save for newbs that come in to stir the pot. I know I would.

But the last thing in this world that I will ever, ever do is stop telling the truth... just because nitwits like yourself can't handle it. Just buck up and shut up, because all of my points were valid and absolutely all of yours were pure horseshit. You no doubt feel threatened by the important points that I have raised, hence your childish compulsion to launch into personal attacks, in lieu of any actual ability to debate things rationally. Don't try to deny that, because your behavior throughout this thread indicates that you are, indeed, a witless troll.

Hmmm. When are you going to provide some links for people that want the Luclin models? Or are we all too stupid? Oh wait, you'd rather waste time QQ'ing.


Now then, Kutter: this is the last response that you will get from me... mainly because in comparison to myself, you have the brain of a maggot and the sophistication of a Harlem crack whore. On the evolutionary scale, you and I are not even members of the same species. "People" such as yourself are of the type that I typically scrape off the bottom of my boots. Hence any further correspondence between us would be completely beneath me. Buh bye, little boy. Run along now and try to stay out of trouble.

I've met crack whores that could tap dance all the day long on your pompous pseudo-intellectualism. When the evolutionary tree branched off, your ancestors ended up on a twig. And I'm sure the "people" you scrape off the bottom of your boots are those that disagree with anything you have to say. I can't say it's been a pleasure. Thanks.

Bonehead.

zianlo1
08-30-2010, 11:18 AM
Rasterburn fur prez! Hey, make that injector program for me to use *some* luclin models....Cuz luclin iksar models look queer, the whole change to their swimming animation, srsly, wtf?

Rasterburn
08-30-2010, 11:29 AM
Rasterburn fur prez! Hey, make that injector program for me to use *some* luclin models....Cuz luclin iksar models look queer, the whole change to their swimming animation, srsly, wtf?

Well the point is this: if the Luclin models were enabled, then you could select which models you want and which you do not want, just by going into the Options screen. And that way, everybody is happy.

Kutter
08-30-2010, 11:32 AM
Well the point is this: if the Luclin models were enabled, then you could select which models you want and which you do not want, just by going into the Options screen. And that way, everybody is happy.

The only "injector program" this guy has is a daily rendezvous with his Real Doll.

Still waiting, chief. I may even say something nice about you if you post it.

Tysus
08-30-2010, 12:33 PM
Well the point is this: if the Luclin models were enabled, then you could select which models you want and which you do not want, just by going into the Options screen. And that way, everybody is happy.



This, DO WANT THIS.

Aetherial
08-30-2010, 12:38 PM
You think its patronizing of me to make a poll asking people their opinion? Not often do I pull this card, but damn. I can make any poll I want to make, because it's my project, okay? It's about a luxury feature of the end user client... not about game mechanics.

I prefaced the poll the same way I prefaced all the polls in beta.. "This will NOT decide anything." In case you were unaware, voting on polls on the internet does not produce accurate figures. You can register, and vote.. and register and vote.. and register and vote.

If all the polls I have done up until now fully counted, you would be playing on some abomination of a PVP server with 2-10 boxing based on votes from people named xcm234nv and adfa234.

I made this poll as a courtesy to Jereziah.

Can you code some phat lewtz for my newb chanter? :)

kkthnxbye

PS... I don't see the problem. Other people don't have to look at my screen and vice versa. If you don't like the Luclin models turn them off, no harm in implementing them as far as I can see... unless it keeps the devs from something the community feels is more important.

fwaits
08-30-2010, 12:44 PM
Whatever the devs decide is fine with me, but it seems odd that the whole point of this server is to re-create the game in it's entirety as it was in that time frame (Classic through Velious) to the best of their ability and then add an option that was not available during that time. That being said I liked some of the Luclin models, but they came out with Luclin, which will never see the light of day here.

Sarkov
08-30-2010, 12:48 PM
I want control over how my toon is percieved. One of the major problem with Luclin models is they are tied to the face selection in original models & vice versa. Typically the pairing is really poor... you have a face/appearance you like in one and it looks ghastly in the other.

And lets not forget the most important point...THEY ARE NOT CLASSIC. The only justifiable position for issues like this is to go back to the root of what this server is and has been repped to be... a recreation of the classic EQ experience. A lot of the appeal (and why I've personally been quite successful recruiting others to come and play here) is the purity of the experience. Devs, please don't comrpomise this for the sake of a few malcontents - the poll numbers are overwhelming enough that I hope you guys will respect the wishes of the majority here.

Rasterburn
08-30-2010, 12:51 PM
the whole point of this server is to re-create the game in it's entirety as it was in that time frame (Classic through Velious) to the best of their ability and then add an option that was not available during that time.

We're already seeing some very significant options which were not available at that time, by virtue of the fact that we're using a 2005 client. Updated and improved ground textures, UI features, etc. The whole "if it wasn't there in 1999, then I don't want it" stance is already moot because of this fact.

Notice that nobody is complaining about having an in-game compass, or improved chat features, or a more logical UI arrangement, or nicer looking zones and buildings. I find that glaring lack of consistency in their attitudes to be rather hypocritical.

And I am further amused by the people who in one post say things like "It's just a cosmetic difference and hence it is unimportant." And then in another post, that same person will say "I want everyone else to see the same character on my screen as I do." Well, wait a minute... if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why is there such a concern over what everyone else sees when they look at your toon..? And if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why do you care whether or not other players can have the character models that they prefer..? Again... we see irrational and dictatorial hypocrisy from the status quo.

What we are REALLY seeing in this thread is a lot of "I want everyone else to think, see and do things exactly the same way that I do." Uh huh. So much for individuality. Let's all be single-minded, group-thinking sheeple together. No thanks.


And lets not forget the most important point...THEY ARE NOT CLASSIC.

Luclin is every bit as "classic" as Kunark and Velious. Same exact dev team, same exact era, same pre-SOE rule set.

toddfx
08-30-2010, 12:53 PM
Why in the name of all that is classic would Luclin models even be considered in the first place much less re-considered in this ancient thread brought back from the graveyard?

Humerox
08-30-2010, 12:53 PM
It's about a luxury feature of the end user client... not about game mechanics.

I don't really care what people see me as, lol. I do think any time spent on unnecessary stuff is a waste...maybe later on down the road when content is pretty much wrapped up? I mean the development team here isn't a room full of paid programmers, lol.

We're already seeing some very significant options which were not available at that time, by virtue of the fact that we're using a 2005 client. Updated and improved ground textures, UI features, etc. The whole "if it wasn't there in 1999, then I don't want it" stance is already moot because of this fact.

I don't think they CAN tamper with the client. Copyright issue...and before anyone gets all fired up and runs "copyright" in another direction, the EQEMU servers are in a gray area, and the explanation of why they can run them -at least P99 -is pretty good. Tampering with the client is a clear violation...no gray area at all. They'd have to recreate their own client...something that isn't really feasible.

Sarkov
08-30-2010, 12:54 PM
Not really... in fact you are making an excellent point in favor of not ever allowing anything the devs can control that wasnt there in classic EQ: people will see one minor deviation and start mentally justifying major leaps of discontinuity.

For my part, if we could completely remove everything that wasnt there in the classic experience, I would be 100% in favor. I suspect you would see a similar majority as you see in this poll in favor of the classic experience on every issue, no matter how small.

Do not confuse policy with technical possibility.

Rasterburn
08-30-2010, 01:06 PM
Do not confuse policy with technical possibility.

And what you are forgetting are the very reasons for why those things were changed and enhanced, as each successive expansion was released: it was because the overwhelming, VAST majority of players back then were DEMANDING those upgraded models and UI features. Verant didn't go to all of the trouble of making those revisions for shits and giggles. They did it because back in the classic days that everyone is touting here, the majority of EQ players WANTED those changes to be made.

I'll give you a related example that I remember, from back in early 2003...

A lot of old-timers were complaining that they preferred the animations of the original models to those of the Luclin models. As usual, their nostalgia was clouding their common sense. But in an effort to appease everyone, SOE reprogrammed the Luclin models so that they would run and jump more or less the same as the original models did.

One month later, they restored the Luclin animations. Wanna know why..? Because after seeing the difference, most of the players changed their minds and asked to have the Luclin animations put back. The older animations simply looked lousy.

This is why I am suggesting that many of you are suffering from selective memory. I mean no disrespect when I say that, because I'm guilty of doing the same thing sometimes. But I was there, for the whole deal back in the day. And my memory is still fairly sharp, so far as when and why certain changes were made by Verant. In the majority of cases, those changes were made in response to strong and ongoing requests by the larger EQ player base. And that player base probably included many of the people who are posting in this thread. They are conveniently forgetting what we all went through, back in the day.

fwaits
08-30-2010, 01:12 PM
We're already seeing some very significant options which were not available at that time, by virtue of the fact that we're using a 2005 client. Updated and improved ground textures, UI features, etc. The whole "if it wasn't there in 1999, then I don't want it" stance is already moot because of this fact.

Notice that nobody is complaining about having an in-game compass, or improved chat features, or a more logical UI arrangement, or nicer looking zones and buildings. I find that glaring lack of consistency in their attitudes to be rather hypocritical.

And I am further amused by the people who in one post say things like "It's just a cosmetic difference and hence it is unimportant." And then in another post, that same person will say "I want everyone else to see the same character on my screen as I do." Well, wait a minute... if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why is there such a concern over what everyone else sees when they look at your toon..? And if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why do you care whether or not other players can have the character models that they prefer..? Again... we see irrational and dictatorial hypocrisy from the status quo.

What we are REALLY seeing in this thread is a lot of "I want everyone else to think, see and do things exactly the same way that I do." Uh huh. So much for individuality. Let's all be single-minded, group-thinking sheeple together. No thanks.

Man you are really vehement about having these models aren't you? Anyway, as I said, if it's decided they are allowed then great, I won't cry about it. I gave my opinion on why it makes more sense to not have them. The other items you cited are beyond the devs ability to control so they are not in the same boat as the player models. So why is our opinion so "irrational" and yours is not? Just because it is not yours doesn't make it less valid. And you trying to demean others opinions just makes yours even less substantial because your being an ass about it.


Luclin is every bit as "classic" as Kunark and Velious. Same exact dev team, same exact era, same pre-SOE rule set.That's great and all, but classic as defined by this server is up to Velious as the devs HERE have stated many times. Same reason you won't see Vah Shir players on Project 1999.