All Players are Raid Suspended Until Further Notice

[Derubael]

CSR wants us to share, not create socialism. It's called compromise. Increasing your kills 400% and decreasing others 75% is not compromise.

Thanks, Phisting. This is 100% true.


20 people in zone to claim a mob
If the force drops below 20 & the next guild has 20 in zone they screenshot it & then claim it...


Er, do you know why we implemented variance in the first place? Ever been to a 'desync party' on Project 1999?

If you want to stop camp out armies simply impliment a code that when removing the character from being active in the game world it checks a flag in the zone.

Have you ever coded for an MMO? Fix one thing, break 10 others. Obviously you already knew that, though, because otherwise you wouldn't be posting here like you do. "Simply code in a fix!" is always going to be our last option, especially when the Development team and Rogean are trying to push out Velious and a whole slew of other things.

Saying you want something to change but unwilling to do something for that change if it impacts you is saying that you don't actually value that change strongly enough to warrant others giving effort since you won't yourself. Leadership 101.

I never made a claim that they did and I am freely aware of their and my own options.

If you don't like the truth that others aren't motivated to act when the person telling them to act is not motivated to do so then you have a problem with basic human psychology.

Hmm, so you're saying if you don't like something, you should do something to change it instead of just complaining about it?

Then...

This is what happens when you have a single-minded authority with no real desire to think about the consequences of their actions and just decides to go with the first thing they think of that seems to be a punishment. I have to keep trying to remind myself to not be surprised when an element of humanity does something stupid and literally agaisnt their stated goals.

Go make your own Everquest server and 'do something for that change'. Come talk to us when it fails, then you can have an opinion on how to manage a server.

Here, I'll help you.

[radditsu]

Radd I don't hate you or tear down your posts.

I even feel like its time to release Velious in a state like Kunark was when it first dropped. Here's what making a compromise looks like. I would HATE to see progression (likely way too easy) through Velious with tainted pixels. I probably would hate that as much as you would like to go back to the old system where TMO got "everything".

My primary concern right now is the division of the player base into a real "haves" vs "have nots" and players quitting. Lots of players when they quit, especially if their guild is disbanded, don't look back (they will still be on the forums tho). That's not good and not what I want.

I think its time for a Velious release that's a little more "project" than "classic" to be honest. For the good of the server, seriously. I know Nilbog wants to do this one perfect, we all do, but... I think it may truly be time to turn us loose and let us wade through the zones and do the pointing out work of NPCs for them as patch as we go.



I knew that would happen.

I would agree, I would just be worried about unforseen circumstances. You know there will be some quest out of sorts and cause millions of pp to be shot into the economy the first day or so. I guess the PEQ code is pretty bug checked by now....just not classic.

[Alarti0001]

Radd I don't hate you or tear down your posts.

I even feel like its time to release Velious in a state like Kunark was when it first dropped. Here's what making a compromise looks like. I would HATE to see progression (likely way too easy) through Velious with tainted pixels. I probably would hate that as much as you would like to go back to the old system where TMO got "everything".

My primary concern right now is the division of the player base into a real "haves" vs "have nots" and players quitting. Lots of players when they quit, especially if their guild is disbanded, don't look back (they will still be on the forums tho). That's not good and not what I want.

I think its time for a Velious release that's a little more "project" than "classic" to be honest. For the good of the server, seriously. I know Nilbog wants to do this one perfect, we all do, but... I think it may truly be time to turn us loose and let us wade through the zones and do the pointing out work of NPCs for them as patch as we go.



I knew that would happen.

This...
Release the Velious Beta!

[Nocsucow]

Havent raided in 3 weeks actually, and I feel great. I get to level my lowbie mage and chill w/ some popcorn till this crap blows over and my guild can dominate again. Tears are classic.

this stupid ass attitude is whats got this server in the shape its in " Oh im just so cool cause im in a over crowded guild with people who have no life so we DOMINATE everything HE............HE ........HE " fucking dumbass

[Alarti0001]

this stupid ass attitude is whats got this server in the shape its in " Oh im just so cool cause im in a over crowded guild with people who have no life so we DOMINATE everything HE............HE ........HE " fucking dumbass

This stupid ass attitude is what is making this server so terrible right now.

[drakelord]

Speaking of Velious, what's left to be done that players can help with?

[arsenalpow]

CSR wants us to share, not create socialism. It's called compromise. Increasing your kills 400% and decreasing others 75% is not compromise.

Thanks, Phisting. This is 100% true.

This narrative is getting tiresome. I'm not even going to give my customary rebuttal because I'm tired of it falling on deaf ears.

[Nocsucow]

This stupid ass attitude is what is making this server so terrible right now.

shut up ... you're a fag ' nobody cares what you go to say anymore

[Rhambuk]

Speaking of Velious, what's left to be done that players can help with?

Id suggest contacting nilbog directly, hes not going to see a 1 line post on the 45th page of general chat )

[Uteunayr]

CSR wants us to share, not create socialism. It's called compromise. Increasing your kills 400% and decreasing others 75% is not compromise.

Sorry, this isn't on focus for the conversation too much, but the political scientist side of me has to say that what is being suggested is not even close to socialism. That's an irresponsible analogy in this case, and has no relevance. If you want to say that the CSRs want us to share, not to share everything evenly, say that. But the definitions of socialism isn't about sharing everything evenly.

Now then, that was all.

[Bones]

this is just sad lol. daddy sirken had to come in and ground you all because you couldnt share your toys. L O fucking L
:D

Sadly everybody is getting fucked over.
I would have loved to see some pick up raids thrown together for once for the people who play video games the way they were meant to be played; casually and in moderation.
It's pretty dumb that everybody is being punished and not just the career virgins.

till this crap blows over and my guild can dominate again.

Your guild and the leaders in it are a joke. You aren't dominating shit except maybe some hotpockets and those underwear you've had on for a week.

[Thana8088]

Go make your own Everquest server and 'do something for that change'. Come talk to us when it fails, then you can have an opinion on how to manage a server.

Here, I'll help you.

Does this mean you banned him?


If so, can you get this chucklehead, too please?

shut up ... you're a fag ' nobody cares what you go to say anymore

[Alarti0001]

shut up ... you're a fag ' nobody cares what you go to say anymore

^^This stupid ass attitude is what is wrong with this server.

[Nocsucow]

^^This stupid ass attitude is what is wrong with this server.

you have forever tarnished the face of george clooney

[Alarti0001]

This narrative is getting tiresome. I'm not even going to give my customary rebuttal because I'm tired of it falling on deaf ears.

Most likely because it doesn't make sense :)

[Rhambuk]

you have forever tarnished the face of george clooney

He's a chump anyway.

Clooney not alarti, im sure a lot of people would argue but im rather fond of the guy.

[Sirken]

Yes, you did! 2,5 years ago ^^

Isn't it sad to make everyone pay for your own mistakes though? I mean .... Velious should be out for 3 years now, and everyone knows these problems wouldn't even exist if you had been able to follow the initial timeline...

I mean... even TMO would probably no longer be on this server if the timeline had been accurate.

"I'm unable to do what i promised, so you all are gonna pay for it! Yaaah!"

p99 staff is the only one to blame here. Everquest had these problems from the beginning, without instancied content, you always have to provide content. You didn't, don't blame players

(give answers instead of suspending me...)
you give us a fully staffed and fully paid dev team, and you can have Velious in 9 months. if it was EZPZ every asshole server would have velious on it. you have no idea how much dev team work you just shit on with that uniformed useless statement you just let drool out of your mouth.

why wouldnt TMO be on the server if velious was here? they did kunark for 3 years, you dont think they would have done velious for 2 or 2.5?

do you think i care if all the ungrateful/entitled brats pack up and leave the server? don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.



Probably easier to do than asking the GM's to increase their workload by 50%.
are u an insane person? do u have any idea how much increase in workload another server would be on the CSR staff? <3

[odiecat99]

^^ this guy had someone pee in his cheerios

[Rhambuk]

^^ this guy had someone pee in his cheerios

yeah he just pointed out the 2 dicks that pissed in his bowl too.

[drakelord]

you give us a fully staffed and fully paid dev team, and you can have Velious in 9 months. if it was EZPZ every asshole server would have velious on it. you have no idea how much dev team work you just shit on with that uniformed useless statement you just let drool out of your mouth.

why wouldnt TMO be on the server if velious was here? they did kunark for 3 years, you dont think they would have done velious for 2 or 2.5?

do you think i care if all the ungrateful/entitled brats pack up and leave the server? don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.




are u an insane person? do u have any idea how much increase in workload another server would be on the CSR staff? <3

You are Anderson. Can't you just duplicate yourself by absorbing everyone on the server and get it done in no time?

(I kid. Thanks for your hard work.)

[fastboy21]

I'm not sure why you quoted me, maybe I need to take a break from forumquest. I'm just thinking that if TMo goes Thurg faction then a different guild could do giants because they don't want to deal with tmo.

obviously theres a best faction and people are going to want the best but there is a viable option to do something else unlike now

I'm also not sure why I quoted you. I think I thought you were saying that more content means less ass-hattery, which it doesn't. It just means its diffused more and allows more guilds to step up to the ass hat level of behavior. The trick of the uber guild is to force the number 2 and 3 guilds to fight each other for the crumbs, not to compete with the top guild. So more content might just mean seeing more TMO like guilds. Hence the reason why Velious itself isn't a cure-all, its a temporary relief if all things stay as they are now in Kunark (which they might not). Which is why I agree with the staff/Rogean for wanting to fix the raid game before Velious is released.

Like you, I prob need a break from forumquest... ;)

There really isn't a best faction. Skyshrine armor is slightly better than Kael for casters; Kael slightly better for melee. You're right, that Velious increases available raid content and time sinks by an order far greater than kunark and classic.

The uber guilds will do all factions, at least as much as they will want to do the bosses in each faction (Dain, Yelinak, and Tormax/Vindi/AoW) and expect you to fix your faction for quest turn-ins on your own time...which isn't really that hard, considering most EQ time sinks.

[odiecat99]

yeah he just pointed out the 2 dicks that pissed in his bowl too.

+100

[OMGWTF420]

i <3 sirken.

[Daldaen]

You are Anderson. Can't you just duplicate yourself by absorbing everyone on the server and get it done in no time?

(I kid. Thanks for your hard work.)

You fail at the Matrix.

Neo = Mr. Anderson
Agent Smith is the duplicating Lord Elrond.

[maximum]

you give us a fully staffed and fully paid dev team, and you can have Velious in 9 months. if it was EZPZ every asshole server would have velious on it. you have no idea how much dev team work you just shit on with that uniformed useless statement you just let drool out of your mouth.

why wouldnt TMO be on the server if velious was here? they did kunark for 3 years, you dont think they would have done velious for 2 or 2.5?

do you think i care if all the ungrateful/entitled brats pack up and leave the server? don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.




are u an insane person? do u have any idea how much increase in workload another server would be on the CSR staff? <3

You need a break (a well-deserved one). Log off the forums for a good 12 hours. A vacation from all these peeps.

[drakelord]

You fail at the Matrix.

Neo = Mr. Anderson
Agent Smith is the duplicating Lord Elrond.

I do. It's been a long time since I watched the movies. My bad <3

[Rhambuk]

only one was worth watching.

[Thulack]

None was worth watching.

Fixed that for ya.

[Daldaen]

They were all worth watching!

Though the first one was definitely the best.

[Sirken]

You need a break (a well-deserved one). Log off the forums for a good 12 hours. A vacation from all these peeps.

you might be the smartest person on the forums

grats on winning ForumQuest today.

[Alde]

'I wish it need not have happened in my time,' said Frodo.
'So do I,' said Gandalf, 'and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.'

[Kaarman]

Some really shallow egos the mods must have, don't even say why I was banned though I violated no site rules.

[drakelord]

Some really shallow egos the mods must have, don't even say why I was banned though I violated no site rules.

I'd be careful. Ban evasion can lead to harsher bans.

[Derubael]

Some really shallow egos the mods must have, don't even say why I was banned though I violated no site rules.

Oh, I was just giving you some time away from forumquest so you could focus on the EQ server you're obviously going to go start now:


If you want to stop camp out armies simply impliment a code that when removing the character from being active in the game world it checks a flag in the zone.

Have you ever coded for an MMO? Fix one thing, break 10 others. Obviously you already knew that, though, because otherwise you wouldn't be posting here like you do. "Simply code in a fix!" is always going to be our last option, especially when the Development team and Rogean are trying to push out Velious and a whole slew of other things.

Saying you want something to change but unwilling to do something for that change if it impacts you is saying that you don't actually value that change strongly enough to warrant others giving effort since you won't yourself. Leadership 101.

I never made a claim that they did and I am freely aware of their and my own options.

If you don't like the truth that others aren't motivated to act when the person telling them to act is not motivated to do so then you have a problem with basic human psychology.

Hmm, so you're saying if you don't like something, you should do something to change it instead of just complaining about it?

Then...

This is what happens when you have a single-minded authority with no real desire to think about the consequences of their actions and just decides to go with the first thing they think of that seems to be a punishment. I have to keep trying to remind myself to not be surprised when an element of humanity does something stupid and literally agaisnt their stated goals.

Go make your own Everquest server and 'do something for that change'. Come talk to us when it fails, then you can have an opinion on how to manage a server.

Here, I'll help you.

Allow me to ban this forum account as well, so you are not distracted. Should I add your in-game account, too, or will you do me the favor of showing yourself the door?

[Rhambuk]

Some really shallow egos the mods must have, don't even say why I was banned though I violated no site rules.

Good id like to see them banning people just for very minor offenses that aren't written down.

I find it funny you immediately mention the rules, trying to get around them somehow and it didn't work out? awww shame. HAMMER

[Thana8088]

Allow me to ban this forum account as well, so you are not distracted. Should I add your in-game account, too, or will you do me the favor of showing yourself the door?

Holy shiznit. Looks like some people can post on other accounts and some can't.

Y'all better watch yo self today.....

[Tiggles]

Oh, I was just giving you some time away from forumquest so you could focus on the EQ server you're obviously going to go start now:



Allow me to ban this forum account as well, so you are not distracted. Should I add your in-game account, too, or will you do me the favor of showing yourself the door?


Didn't read this thread at all but elmarneih is a good guy and not a one of the fe/tmo raiders.

He is just voicing his opinions he shouldn't have his in game accounts banned because he caught a gm in a bad mood.

GMs on this server get shit on in the daily and it takes a big man not to be bitter because of it.

Dont be that guy deru

[kaev]

CSR wants us to share, not create socialism. It's called compromise. Increasing your kills 400% and decreasing others 75% is not compromise.

Bullshit. Where are the logic and the math behind your claim? Percentages are crap, easily abused to deceive and mislead.

What is the objective here? A reasonable opportunity to experience "classic EQ" as Rogean says? If so then 400% and 75% may not even be enough of a compromise, but it's hard to even form an informed opinion with 9+ guilds furiously spinning everything to their specific interests. Time to stop spinning shit and start putting up real arguments with useful (and accurate) info to back them.

The raid-game here is pretty fucked up. AFAICT there's next to nothing "classic" about it aside from the posturing and shit-talking.

[drakelord]

Didn't read this thread at all but elmarneih is a good guy and not a one of the fe/tmo raiders.

He is just voicing his opinions he shouldn't have his in game accounts banned because he caught a gm in a bad mood.

GMs on this server get shit on in the daily and it takes a big man not to be bitter because of it.

Dont be that guy deru

He didn't ban his server account, only that forum account. He was saying he would ban the server account if he kept avoiding bans.

[Rhambuk]

He didn't ban his server account, only that forum account. He was saying he would ban the server account if he kept avoiding bans.

as he should, he shouldn't have to put up with that crap because the guy is bored or pissy or whatever.

Deru warned him if he wants to keep pushing it deru will end it. as he should.

btw I have no idea who he banned for what so I have nothing against that person I just like seeing the gm's stand up and tell people to sit down and shuttup like they should

[Tiggles]

He didn't ban his server account, only that forum account. He was saying he would ban the server account if he kept avoiding bans.

And that's wrong.

Rogean has had a long standing rule that forums and in game are separate.

We have people who have 100+ banned accounts here and could log on and play if they wanted too.

Also we have people who have dispicable things on the forums and still log in daily.

To catch an in game ban because of forum arguing seems kinda lame.

But hey, the server has changed maybe that's how it needs to be.

[Rararboker]

Didn't read this thread at all but elmarneih is a good guy and not a one of the fe/tmo raiders.

He is just voicing his opinions he shouldn't have his in game accounts banned because he caught a gm in a bad mood.

GMs on this server get shit on in the daily and it takes a big man not to be bitter because of it.

Dont be that guy deru

If you actually read the exchange you'd see Deru was perfectly justified.....

[Derubael]

Didn't read this thread at all but elmarneih is a good guy and not a one of the fe/tmo raiders.

He is just voicing his opinions he shouldn't have his in game accounts banned because he caught a gm in a bad mood.

GMs on this server get shit on in the daily and it takes a big man not to be bitter because of it.

Dont be that guy deru

Tiggles, you should know I'm not that guy. I didn't go after his in game account and have no intention of doing so. For the most part, the forums are the forums and in-game is in-game.

Furthermore, there are quite a few of you who know this from personal experience - I will rarely, if ever, ban someone for talking shit to me or about me personally. I have a thick skin and I understand that people can get frustrated and make off the cuff remarks they either don't mean or wish they could take back.

However, if you're going to come at the entire staff - Our development team, Rogean, GM's, and guides, I absolutely reserve the right to ban whatever I feel is necessary to get the message across that this free, volunteer project provided by the good grace and personal pocketbooks of Rogean and Nilbog is a privilege and not a right. If someone feels they can do better, I invite them to go open their own server.

[Rhambuk]

deru why weren't you around back when I played 8((((

[Thana8088]

...provided by the good grace and personal pocketbooks of Rogean and Nilbog...

It might help to know how much is being spent out of these personal pocketbooks so we can have an idea of how deficient we are in donations and such?

[drktmplr12]

I dont know that the funds are really our business.

[Rhambuk]

I dont know that the funds are really our business.

none of our business whatsoever.

just asking seems like a huge slap in the face to me.

[Thana8088]

none of our business whatsoever.

just asking seems like a huge slap in the face to me.


So it can be brought up, but not asked about?

Mmmkay.

[Merekai]

I am a little confused here about something. Dark elves have been mentioned (i.e. do not raid kill the DE's) but my question is this:

It doesn't take a raid force to kill these mobs. When we kill coercer/advisor we have 3-4 people. Are we seriously not allowed to farm non raid mobs in order to get epic pieces/robes for turn in?

I also am a member of a casual guild that has never really touched any of the outdoor dragons/VS/CT etc. but I look forward to our sky raid every week. Glad we all got lumped in this together...

[Rhambuk]

So it can be brought up, but not asked about?

Mmmkay.

anything else you want to put in my mouth?

[SniGlas]

Am i also raid suspended?

[Spitty]

You fucking people can't keep on topic to save your lives.

Seriously, raiding is COMPLETELY TURNED OFF and you're on about personal expenditures? Are you fucking serious?

[Alarti0001]

anything else you want to put in my mouth?

I got something :)

[karanastorm]

We left the terrorists win guys.

[radditsu]

I got something :)

Is it a penis?


a sexy penis?

[Alarti0001]

Is it a penis?


a sexy penis?

haha :P

[radditsu]

You fucking people can't keep on topic to save your lives.

Seriously, raiding is COMPLETELY TURNED OFF and you're on about personal expenditures? Are you fucking serious?

None of that matters on the forums bro.


Land of do as you please.

[drktmplr12]

This thread has been off topic for longer than the past 5 posts.

The community is completely splintered until something is agreed upon. I don't anticipate anything in this thread is going to stay on topic.

And forget about whose fault it is that raiding is turned off. The fact remains that it is. And the community will be better for it.

I guarantee it.

[drakelord]

Maybe more people will level alts giving me more people to group with ;D

[radditsu]

Ooh yeah, ooh yeah
Nothing really matters
Anyone can see
Nothing really matters - nothing really matters to me

[Laugher]

Ooh yeah, ooh yeah
Nothing really matters
Anyone can see
Nothing really matters - nothing really matters to me

my druid demands royalties :p *edit* and my bard

[r0xx0r]

so back on topic- with the raid lockout: doesn't this mean that all these guilds who have been farming the raids for years are the only winners right now? Im really enjoying playing the game but a lil' bummed that my small chance to raid in the future has diminished to a no chance now as well high value items being more over camped now than before.

[Fountree]

this stupid ass attitude is whats got this server in the shape its in " Oh im just so cool cause im in a over crowded guild with people who have no life so we DOMINATE everything HE............HE ........HE " fucking dumbass

LOLOLOL

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/2023/oprah9000ee8.jpg

[Tiggles]

deru why weren't you around back when I played 8((((

You got uthgaard and you LIKED it!

Or else

[radditsu]

my druid demands royalties :p *edit* and my bard

He shall get them, freddy is a god among gay and regular men.

[bomaroast]

To catch an in game ban because of forum arguing seems kinda lame.

But hey, the server has changed maybe that's how it needs to be.

Absolutely that is how it needs to be. The forums bleed over into the game, as does the wiki. People go afk in groups to check stuff on the forums, and people will lazily say "spot #3 on the map, check the wiki."

Absolutely the forum environment affects the in-game environment and for the last few years the forum environment has been toxic.

Just ban people. Do it. Let them come back and harass however they might. The joy of it will fade after they've been banned enough times. This server could be a lot more awesome for a lot more people if there weren't so many self loathing man children spreading their bile filled shit everywhere. Let them live their sad lives somewhere else.

Anything short of this proves one of two things: either the staff loves and fosters drama or there is a lot of real money involved here.

[Llodd]

The release of velious is not the cure all so many of you insist it would be. Thinking so is extremely short sighted. If the status quo had remained I'm certain things would have been better temporarily, but normal toxic monopolistic raid services would have resumed eventually. If you think otherwise you're just kidding yourself.

[Hodge]

http://newsbusters.org/sites/default/files/main_photos/2011/October/Eat%20the%20Rich.jpg

[JayN]

people trying harder then me for stuffs; screw that ban them and give me their stuffs

[Swish]

The release of velious is not the cure all so many of you insist it would be. Thinking so is extremely short sighted.

[bomaroast]

Actually, thinking about it a little more, the forums should just be removed. They are too toxic to clean. The community can exist in game. I've found this approach to playing on p99 more pleasant anyways. Ignore the forums and the server seems pretty good. Read the forums and its shit.

Any server/raid rules should be dictated from the server staff in written form, must be easily accessible and must be kept up to date. Banhammer anyone rulebreaker, period. Do it by IP and account.

[Rhambuk]

Actually, thinking about it a little more, the forums should just be removed. They are too toxic to clean. The community can exist in game. I've found this approach to playing on p99 more pleasant anyways. Ignore the forums and the server seems pretty good. Read the forums and its shit.

Any server/raid rules should be dictated from the server staff in written form, must be easily accessible and must be kept up to date. Banhammer anyone rulebreaker, period. Do it by IP and account.

someone would independently open their own forums if these were taken down, then wed have forums moderated by players and not the devs/gm's

sounds like a cesspool.

but yeah p99 is 100x better if you can stay off the forums, I cant =p

[Kagatob]

Remove FTE. Not classic. Remove variance. not classic.

Gonna let you in on a little secret. Poopsocking is classic.

Top raiders (now known as "Tier 1" /puke) love FTE, know why? Because it allows them to camp alt armies at every spawn point and batphone to win. Everyone else on the server is hurt by it.

Variance only serves to make the problems caused by FTE to be magnified, giving yet a greater advantage to the batphone alt army guilds.

1+1 = 2 you know.

I say let the top two guilds poopsock all day, every day, at least then when a less contested mob spawns other guilds (you know, ones without alt armies camped at every spawn) will have a chance to mobilize and make the trip to actually kill said mob because the top guild is busy holding their contested spot.

All I see is catering to "tier 1" who have proved they can spend 18+ hours a day 7 days a week logged in if they have to but under the current system don't need to any more. It's pretty plain as day.

Anyone have any evidence to the contrary? :)

[drakelord]

someone would independently open their own forums if these were taken down, then wed have forums moderated by players and not the devs/gm's

sounds like a cesspool.

but yeah p99 is 100x better if you can stay off the forums, I cant =p

Forums is where all the juicy stuff happens though!

[Ephi]

~checks watch~

Well it’s about that time little birds.

I see shit got real. Nice job P99 staff. :)

[Rhambuk]

Remove FTE. Not classic. Remove variance. not classic.

Gonna let you in on a little secret. Poopsocking is classic.

Top raiders (now known as "Tier 1" /puke) love FTE, know why? Because it allows them to camp alt armies at every spawn point and batphone to win. Everyone else on the server is hurt by it.

Variance only serves to make the problems caused by FTE to be magnified, giving yet a greater advantage to the batphone alt army guilds.

1+1 = 2 you know.

I say let the top two guilds poopsock all day, every day, at least then when a less contested mob spawns other guilds (you know, ones without alt armies camped at every spawn) will have a chance to mobilize and make the trip to actually kill said mob because the top guild is busy holding their contested spot.

All I see is catering to "tier 1" who have proved they can spend 18+ hours a day 7 days a week logged in if they have to but under the current system don't need to any more. It's pretty plain as day.

Anyone have any evidence to the contrary? :)

I dunno kag, T1 guilds aren't going to sit socking 1 mob when they know another is due in 20 minutes. unless you're talking about the 15 player presence claim rule, otherwise they'll just show up 20 minutes before its due burn it and move on to the next one.

[Derubael]

I see shit got real. Nice job P99 staff. :)

<3

[Hitpoint]

I see shit got real. Nice job P99 staff. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvqJ1mTkEuY

[Kagatob]

I dunno kag, T1 guilds aren't going to sit socking 1 mob when they know another is due in 20 minutes. unless you're talking about the 15 player presence claim rule, otherwise they'll just show up 20 minutes before its due burn it and move on to the next one.

Sorry, I felt that a presence claim went unsaid. I forgot that this was P99 where anything unsaid is automatically exploited.

Meh, I think seeing all wizard/rogue guilds pop up would make things amusing for at least a solid month. /shrug.

[Rhambuk]

Sorry, I felt that a presence claim went unsaid. I forgot that this was P99 where anything unsaid is automatically exploited.

Meh, I think seeing all wizard/rogue guilds pop up would make things amusing for at least a solid month. /shrug.

lol Never forget!

even the simplest typing error could result in a loophole of trains and FTE snipes!

Rogaen is going to need to hire a lawyer to finalize the doctrine of the new raid system.

[Rail]

Sorry, I felt that a presence claim went unsaid. I forgot that this was P99 where anything unsaid is automatically exploited.

Meh, I think seeing all wizard/rogue guilds pop up would make things amusing for at least a solid month. /shrug.

I agree with you (except for the "presence" claim), the FTE rule only helps the elite guilds. Why was it imposed in the first place?

I'm still for a chaos theory. Allow training, sniping, anything goes to get the kill. Let the players fight it out themselves. Take out variance, and you allow a larger number of people to know when the mob will spawn. Which means more competition.

At level 60, you have nothing to lose. You cannot lose your equipment (which is a shame), exp doesn't matter, your new raid loot that gives you an additional 2ac and 3 wisdom is not going to help you kill the raid boss you just killed...

I know, I'm the idiot. Happy no-raid 2014 smart asses.

[Kagatob]

I'm still for a chaos theory. Allow training, sniping, anything goes to get the kill. Let the players fight it out themselves. Take out variance, and you allow a larger number of people to know when the mob will spawn. Which means more competition.

Also not classic. Play nice policy however, is.

[Rhambuk]

I agree with you (except for the "presence" claim), the FTE rule only helps the elite guilds. Why was it imposed in the first place?

I'm still for a chaos theory. Allow training, sniping, anything goes to get the kill. Let the players fight it out themselves. Take out variance, and you allow a larger number of people to know when the mob will spawn. Which means more competition.

At level 60, you have nothing to lose. You cannot lose your equipment (which is a shame), exp doesn't matter, your new raid loot that gives you an additional 2ac and 3 wisdom is not going to help you kill the raid boss you just killed...

I know, I'm the idiot. Happy no-raid 2014 smart asses.

It used to be like this when the server pop was like 300 and 3 guilds were fighting over mobs.

I can't even imagine what kind of shitshow it would be now with 600+ players sitting on a mob spawn point, 6-7 different guilds, and probably...50+ petitions after every mob goes down. It's been a long road to get where we are now I'm glad were taking a step back.

[Rail]

It used to be like this when the server pop was like 300 and 3 guilds were fighting over mobs.

I can't even imagine what kind of shitshow it would be now with 600+ players sitting on a mob spawn point, 6-7 different guilds, and probably...50+ petitions after every mob goes down. It's been a long road to get where we are now I'm glad were taking a step back.

It just doesn't make sense that all the rules implemented to make people play nice, only help the largest guild on the server. And if anything happens to make the guild upset over a spawn, THEY send 50 petitions to have their way.

WHAT ELSE DO THESE GUILDS HAVE TO DO WITH THEIR TIME?!?! Stare at their inventory to drool over the loot? Check their stats every 10 seconds to get a boner?
What good is all this loot if it doesn't get used? Its just sitting, camped out... waiting for more.

If 300 people were sitting at Trak spawn waiting, instead of camped out playing an alt. It would free up all the other camps that non-raiding guilds still enjoy.

[yevea]

Being a casual player who has been on the server less than a year, I want to start by first thanking the staff for providing such a wonderful honeypot thread, and the remainder of the spergs on this forums for the subsequent forum porn that has been spawned.

You 'elite raiders' are all pretty bad at this game sounding, and I (unironically) would like to thank you especially for breaking the server due to your severe stupidity. It's fun ruining the game for other people, isn't it? Now your own game is ruined, and from the sound of it.. I don't expect to see raiding return for a long time, and I'm okay with that. Maybe it'll inspire more people to roll alts and populate some dungeons again. Or, well maybe you'll just PL and pull an entire zone for your fifth or sixth alt.

I like seeing this attitude from the staff. Everyone crying about how unfair this is.. go play on one of Sony's servers. You are playing on someone's hobby and dedicated free time, and you are owed nothing.

[Rhambuk]

try and do a quick history if I can remember anything right now.

at first classic raid rules, then the first to 15 in zone and must maintain presence. so it was like an hour before mod due 15 would be in zone, then 2 hours etc etc. Then variance to discourage people from sitting and waiting for hours on end, original variance was 24 hours +/- I think, it didn't stop people, so variance increased, then they removed the 15 player presence and it went down to 1 or 2 individual trackers waiting up to 48 hours. variance increase variance increase, then it went to FTE and that's about where I stopped playing.

I think its about that but with like a 96hour variance or something and you still have people waiting days on end for a mob.

the deterrents only forced people to play harder and harder into what we have now.

[Rail]

try and do a quick history if I can remember anything right now.

at first classic raid rules, then the first to 15 in zone and must maintain presence. so it was like an hour before mod due 15 would be in zone, then 2 hours etc etc. Then variance to discourage people from sitting and waiting for hours on end, original variance was 24 hours +/- I think, it didn't stop people, so variance increased, then they removed the 15 player presence and it went down to 1 or 2 individual trackers waiting up to 48 hours. variance increase variance increase, then it went to FTE and that's about where I stopped playing.

I think its about that but with like a 96hour variance or something and you still have people waiting days on end for a mob.

the deterrents only forced people to play harder and harder into what we have now.

Thank you, exactly my point.

I know why the GM's are doing this.. because if you think this is bad, just wait until Velious! Haha, people saying Velious will fix things? Try Sleeper's Tomb keying.

Bottom line is, raids in EQ have always been short sighted. The end game was broken from the beginning. And the only crappy solution is instanced dragons for everyone, which is STUPID and ruins immersion.

Chaos may not be a solution, but it would at least make things more interesting instead of CampQuest/PetitionQuest/ForumQuest. It would at least give the players a CHANCE to disrupt these greedy idiots.

[Eloian]

Variance was an attempt at a solution that turned out to only exasperate the problem. Variance was to discourage poopsocking but it only lead to more extreme poopsocking. So variance obv = bad for everyone. Simple nuff? I'm not saying removing variance will solve all our raid problems, but I'm guessing it would certainly help or some other form of control will need to be implemented. Variance = less mobs for everyone = more frustration = more shinanigans = more extreme measures. Or you could all just adopt a personal philosophy of "Just don't be a dick" en mass and get this shit done.

Eloian Bushlover (Be a bush, not a dick)
57 Ranger <BDA>

[Hitpoint]

Variance is absolutely necessary, it DOES stop spawn camping. Once again, the only mob that gets socked is VS and even then it's not nearly as bad as it could be. Variance is just too long right now, especially with extended windows. I'm sure the GMs will tone it down. +- 8 hours with 30% chance of 4 hour extensions. Something like that. I didn't put much thought into these numbers, just an example. People need to be unsure of when a mob will spawn, and the spawn time needs to be long enough that people are unwilling to wait for it.

[Vyal]

try and do a quick history if I can remember anything right now.

at first classic raid rules, then the first to 15 in zone and must maintain presence. so it was like an hour before mod due 15 would be in zone, then 2 hours etc etc. Then variance to discourage people from sitting and waiting for hours on end, original variance was 24 hours +/- I think, it didn't stop people, so variance increased, then they removed the 15 player presence and it went down to 1 or 2 individual trackers waiting up to 48 hours. variance increase variance increase, then it went to FTE and that's about where I stopped playing.

I think its about that but with like a 96hour variance or something and you still have people waiting days on end for a mob.

the deterrents only forced people to play harder and harder into what we have now.

I tried to explain this to people but seems to not be getting through...

The way it was before all the variance was fine & this trash should have never been added (this is why ALOT of players left to begin with & TMO even came to be)

It's almost like it was a total setup they say "Hey man we do this for free we gain nothing" <~~ I promise that is a lie and then some.
Between the accounts trades & donations & the amount of time the server has actually been up
Take for example this:
http://www.uogamers.com/
^^ a website with UO Emu servers by the creators of the EMU..
They bank a hundred thousand a month EASY.

back on track now..

The variance seems like it got all the real competition off the server here so one guild could dominate the raid scene - they even took it a step further and duped all their trash when they got banned for it they cried and got the whole raid scene into a tizzy(at least from my point of view)

Toss it into chaos so they can come back strong and take over and make greedy bank again ---- only doable because of the variance mind you. If there was no variance then TMO would not be the only ones there to get the mob(I think this is why there is variance)

But ya anyone who has played other EMU's that are as large as this one should no for a fact when they say they don't make dick doing it --- that it's a total freaking lie.

(these are some ramblings ATM of someone pretty high)

[Eloian]

Variance is absolutely necessary, it DOES stop spawn camping. Once again, the only mob that gets socked is VS and even then it's not nearly as bad as it could be. Variance is just too long right now, especially with extended windows. I'm sure the GMs will tone it down. +- 8 hours with 30% chance of 4 hour extensions. Something like that. I didn't put much thought into these numbers, just an example. People need to be unsure of when a mob will spawn, and the spawn time needs to be long enough that people are unwilling to wait for it.

Ya, mild variance leaves some surprise but the extreme variance that is in effect now is causing a bottleneck that nobody can be happy with. And as for poopsocking I mentioned in another thread, if a Guild decides they want a raid mob bad enough they can xp in the area with a few groups and basically "lay claim". Not just two or more rival guilds sitting on a spawn point. Taken last VS kill was admirable, they xp'd for a long time, as window got shorter more peeps came in. BDA swung by to see if they would possibly wiped but didn't interfere at all. Taken downed VS, "Grats" were had and everyone left feeling pretty good I think.

Eloian Bushlover (What...was I hiding in the bush? Sure, lets go with that)
57 Ranger <BDA>

[Hitpoint]

I tried to explain this to people but seems to not be getting through...

The way it was before all the variance was fine & this trash should have never been added (this is why ALOT of players left to begin with & TMO even came to be)


How is 200 people sitting on Trakanon spawn with auto attack on fine? Trak spawns, dies in 3 seconds and everyone hope they won the FTE lotto.

Variance might be the best thing that ever happened to the raid scene. They can and should reduce the length of windows, but don't forget how things used to be. And these days with more level 60s, it would be even worse.

[Doors]

So much bitching. Make a calendar and follow it. Worked on live servers for years. No reason it wouldn't work here.

[Seltius]

hope it stays like this for months ... maybe you fuckers will go outside and discover a life and then the toxic trash will be gone off the server

Hey fuk you buddy I'm allergic to the sun!

[Vyal]

How is 200 people sitting on Trakanon spawn with auto attack on fine? Trak spawns, dies in 3 seconds and everyone hope they won the FTE lotto.

Variance might be the best thing that ever happened to the raid scene. They can and should reduce the length of windows, but don't forget how things used to be. And these days with more level 60s, it would be even worse.

Variance is the ABSOLUTE worst thing to EVER happen to this server. Why do you think the server population dropped more then half when it came into full swing?
Because of variance no one really ever will have a chance aside from the true dire hard players, because of variance there can never ever be any real chance of competition it will just be the one guild sitting variance out like it clearly has been for two years.
I remember back when they thought of the idea hardly anyone even wanted it because for one it was so not classic two we all predicted this would happen & I come back two years later to find out all those predictions to be 100% accurate.
I spoken to some TMO guys and they are all for variance because without it they would need to contend with other actual raid groups lined up ready to go after mobs with variance it's just them because no one else is on to contend with them.
I really don't see how this is so hard to figure out. If variance doesn't go it will be nothing but the same thing you have had for two years.

People play here to relive those years gone by and enjoy a simpler version of EQ - you guys are making it complex and nothing like classic. I mean I love the server and I could care less what happens I can go do simple things like camp stun whips in BB and be happy. I am just chiming in here because you guys got some problems & it's because of variance...

[Derubael]

Vyal, do you know what a 'desync party' is?

[Eloian]

Hey fuk you buddy I'm allergic to the sun!

Dunno if you are serious or not. I am very seriously allergic to the sun. To go outside for just a little while I need medication and 120+ SPF or else things get very gross very fast and takes FOREVER to heal. I love the sun, It just doesn't love me.

Eloian Bushlover (Love in the sun)
57 Ranger <BDA>

[Vyal]

Vyal, do you know what a 'desync party' is?

I has no idea what it is.. Sounds like some form of cheating/exploit a guild would use to make people LD.

[Xadion]

Variance is the ABSOLUTE worst thing to EVER happen to this server. Why do you think the server population dropped more then half when it came into full swing?
Because of variance no one really ever will have a chance aside from the true dire hard players, because of variance there can never ever be any real chance of competition it will just be the one guild sitting variance out like it clearly has been for two years.
I remember back when they thought of the idea hardly anyone even wanted it because for one it was so not classic two we all predicted this would happen & I come back two years later to find out all those predictions to be 100% accurate.
I spoken to some TMO guys and they are all for variance because without it they would need to contend with other actual raid groups lined up ready to go after mobs with variance it's just them because no one else is on to contend with them.
I really don't see how this is so hard to figure out. If variance doesn't go it will be nothing but the same thing you have had for two years.

People play here to relive those years gone by and enjoy a simpler version of EQ - you guys are making it complex and nothing like classic. I mean I love the server and I could care less what happens I can go do simple things like camp stun whips in BB and be happy. I am just chiming in here because you guys got some problems & it's because of variance...

Who in TMO did you talk to?! Variance reduced parrallel spawns and having more than one raid target up at a time HELPS the "situation" by letting guilds go after different targets.

Velious with a non-or 3ish hr variance will fix alot if the issues as there literally are more raid targets in vel alone than there are in kunark and classic.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

Vyal, do you know what a 'desync party' is?

It's what happened at CT whenever he went late window :P But yeah...It's a good thing! If the players get tired of desyncing then perhaps they'll come to an agreement of their own. If not, well, they get the server stability they deserve =D

[baalzy]

Variance is absolutely necessary, it DOES stop spawn camping. Once again, the only mob that gets socked is VS and even then it's not nearly as bad as it could be. Variance is just too long right now, especially with extended windows. I'm sure the GMs will tone it down. +- 8 hours with 30% chance of 4 hour extensions. Something like that. I didn't put much thought into these numbers, just an example. People need to be unsure of when a mob will spawn, and the spawn time needs to be long enough that people are unwilling to wait for it.

I kinda think FFXI's way of doing dragons would work.

The ruleset was basically FTE, although the mechanics of the game worked a bit different. When someone attacked a mob it would become claimed and the game prevented anyone outside the group/alliance from being able to perform any action on the mob. People still did stuff to screw with this, all of which were bannable if caught, but it stopped a lot of monopolization from happening. Some guilds would get on hot-streaks and end up claiming 5-6 of the good mobs in a row, but it never lasted for months on end. There was also a random 2-4 second or so period where the mob was untouchable when it spawned (japanese peeps used to have a huge advantage cause of lower ping, this was introduced to give other geographical areas a fighting chance)

Additionally, they had variance but it was limited. Respawns were 21-24 hours after mob death (most raid mobs, not all. Some were 48-72 hour windows if i recall, those were rarely actively camped and people would rush to mobilize for them on pop) and happened in 30 minute 'windows'. 21 hours after the dragon died, it had a chance to pop. If it didn't pop exactly 21 hours later it would have another window in 30 minutes (so 21.5 hours after death) and if it didnt pop then, another chances 30 minutes later. Finally if it hadn't popped prior it would be guaranteed to pop exactly 24 hours after death.

This did multiple things. It allowed casuals opportunities at these mobs because the potential spawn windows were easily tracked and people could do them during the times they played. The FTE system would reward people who had more at the spawn by giving them more chances at getting first engage, but smaller groups still had an opportunity. The window was constantly rotating allowing guilds in different parts of the worlds opportunities (holding the mob to keep its window within a certain time-zone was against the rules, programmed in with a 'rage' mode where the mob went super saiyan if it wasn't dead within 60minutes of being engaged) and it was pretty clear who had the mob. If the people attempting the fight wiped then whoever picked it up after it became 'unclaimed' got to continue the fight.

This could be implemented fairly easily, FTE code would just have to make the mob immune to any additional agro techniques for 5-10 seconds after FTE (still fastest javelin in the west, but at least it keeps people from being added to the hatelist because they were only 1ms slower than someone else). It would also mean there'd be times that mobs had overlapping windows and most guilds would have to pick their more desired target and then race to the next if it hadn't popped yet.

Sure, it's not-classic, but it keeps poopsocks from lasting more than 3 hours in one location. It makes alt-armies less of a requirement for smaller groups of people to attempt to participate and it. It ensures windows occur at least on occasion for people in ALL time zones.

The hardcores who can have kill squads on 24 hrs/day will be getting their large majority of mobs, but you're still competing to get it. Nothing is handed to you. Your opportunity to engage the mob is determined by your 'skill' in clicking throw at the right time coupled with your presence at the target.

This is definitely more hardcore of a solution and I can see many of the casuals not wanting it, but it does prevent monopolization and after the Devs put in a bit of work to set it up it doesn't require much of a hands on approach. A couple seconds of the mob being untouchable (meaning noone gets added to the hate list) after FTE to ensure everyone sees the message and no confusion about which guild has control of the mob should prevent most 'whoops' from happening.

Cries of snipes are lessened because the mob doesn't ping about killing 5-10 other people and never reset because they were added to the hate list milliseconds after FTE was engaged. Meaning if you get FTE but don't have sufficient force to stay alive, FTE will reset when they all die.

[falkun]

Who in TMO did you talk to?! Variance reduced parrallel spawns and having more than one raid target up at a time HELPS the "situation" by letting guilds go after different targets.

Velious with a non-or 3ish hr variance will fix alot if the issues as there literally are more raid targets in vel alone than there are in kunark and classic.

I agree that multiple targets up at the same time helps the situation. I agree that Velious adds more content than Kunark and Classic. But if two forces are going for the same mob, or if there's a situation where people are stumbling over each other (probably NToV), Velious won't fix that. PNP and some general respect will fix that. Sirken's proposal has decent PNP punishments which will hopefully result in more inter-guild respect.

[Kagatob]

Ya, mild variance leaves some surprise but the extreme variance that is in effect now is causing a bottleneck that nobody can be happy with. And as for poopsocking I mentioned in another thread, if a Guild decides they want a raid mob bad enough they can xp in the area with a few groups and basically "lay claim". Not just two or more rival guilds sitting on a spawn point. Taken last VS kill was admirable, they xp'd for a long time, as window got shorter more peeps came in. BDA swung by to see if they would possibly wiped but didn't interfere at all. Taken downed VS, "Grats" were had and everyone left feeling pretty good I think.

Eloian Bushlover (What...was I hiding in the bush? Sure, lets go with that)
57 Ranger <BDA>
Yes, that's EverQuest. Good ol classic everquest. That's how every mob should go down. :)
How is 200 people sitting on Trakanon spawn with auto attack on fine? Trak spawns, dies in 3 seconds and everyone hope they won the FTE lotto.

Variance might be the best thing that ever happened to the raid scene. They can and should reduce the length of windows, but don't forget how things used to be. And these days with more level 60s, it would be even worse.

Read what you posted and try to figure out where the actual problem is...

[Seltius]

Dunno if you are serious or not. I am very seriously allergic to the sun. To go outside for just a little while I need medication and 120+ SPF or else things get very gross very fast and takes FOREVER to heal. I love the sun, It just doesn't love me.

Eloian Bushlover (Love in the sun)
57 Ranger <BDA>

Yes and no I am a very fair skinned Ginger. So along with the lack of a soul I have a severe lack of tolerance to the sun.

So I was joking but at the same time serious.

[Vyal]

Who in TMO did you talk to?! Variance reduced parrallel spawns and having more than one raid target up at a time HELPS the "situation" by letting guilds go after different targets.

Velious with a non-or 3ish hr variance will fix alot if the issues as there literally are more raid targets in vel alone than there are in kunark and classic.

The only people defending variance are from TMO.
The only reason TMO has had the rights to everything here is because all the other guilds disbanded and quit or went to find other servers without variance.
w/e I might give the game a break again come back in 2 more years and hope Vel is out...

I see two guilds that stayed through the launch of variance, IB & Europa....
(was a bad idea then & it still is now)

[falkun]

TMO are not the only ones defending limited variance. I have never proposed less than +/- 4hrs personally, and Europa loves limited variance so mobs aren't ALWAYS on USA times. International players (I am not) of all guilds advocate for limited variance, just not +/-48hrs with the anti-sock code on the end.

[Zalaerian]

The obvious answer here is just to reroll on Red

[Eloian]

Yes and no I am a very fair skinned Ginger. So along with the lack of a soul I have a severe lack of tolerance to the sun.

So I was joking but at the same time serious.

Ahh I'm straight out allergic, I'm half native, brown haired. I can build a slow tan through the summer 5-10 mins at a time...with medication and sunblock and the more tan I can get the better I can also handle things but it's hard to make such a concentrated effort like that. So I'm basically a vampire.

Eloian Bushlover (Vampire of Tunare)
57 Ranger <BDA>

[Rail]

How is 200 people sitting on Trakanon spawn with auto attack on fine? Trak spawns, dies in 3 seconds and everyone hope they won the FTE lotto.

Variance might be the best thing that ever happened to the raid scene. They can and should reduce the length of windows, but don't forget how things used to be. And these days with more level 60s, it would be even worse.

Remove FTE policy also! That is the point, both Variance and FTE together are causing this problem.

Let whoever gets the EXP message decide who gets the loot. End of arguments.

[Azeam]

~checks watch~

Well it’s about that time little birds.

Sadly since no agreement was reached, and since no talks are currently in place, I am raid suspending all guilds, and all players, from ALL raid targets and ALL raid zones.

Until further notice anyone who touches a raid mob (VP Dragons, Trak, VS, CT, Draco, Inny, Maestro, Gore, Fay, Tal, Sev, Noble, OoA, Naggy, Vox, Phinny, Ragefire, Planar Trash, or anything else I forgot) or enters into Plane of Sky, Plane of Hate, Plane of Fear, or Veeshan’s Peak, will be banned until the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, until the seas go dry and the mountains blow in the wind like leaves. Only Then you shall return and continue playing should you break these rules.




http://www.kancelaria.info.kalisz.pl/Temidy/6129lady_of_justice.jpg

LIKE A BOSS

4528

[Hitpoint]

Yes, that's EverQuest. Good ol classic everquest. That's how every mob should go down. :)


Read what you posted and try to figure out where the actual problem is...

So you think FTE is the problem? Guilds should be allowed to form KS groups and 6 people can take loot from 60? Or maybe a guild of 40 can pull a mob, and then a group of 20 can pull it off and kill it. I'm sorry guys, variance and FTE are necessary and they wouldn't exist otherwise. Shit was much worse before.

[Kagatob]

TMO are not the only ones defending limited variance. I have never proposed less than +/- 4hrs personally, and Europa loves limited variance so mobs aren't ALWAYS on USA times. International players (I am not) of all guilds advocate for limited variance, just not +/-48hrs with the anti-sock code on the end.

You are all looking at the situation and making it more complicated though.

How about instead of having a 3 day mob with +/- 48 hours so it will randomly go around random times you have a mob with a 2 day, 23 hour spawn, so it works it's way around the clock every other month?

Classic tracking of a mob isn't about having someone paid DKP to sit in a zone all day every day. Classic tracking of a mob involves a spreadsheet and a note on your raid calander to show up if you don't have other plans that day/hour. If it's a mob of extreme importance then you show up early and sit in force like they did back in the day.

[Hitpoint]

Remove FTE policy also! That is the point, both Variance and FTE together are causing this problem.

Let whoever gets the EXP message decide who gets the loot. End of arguments.

Better work on your KS group of rogues then. And a KS group of wizards for gore, hosh and xygoz. There surely won't be more anger and petitioning than there is now. Surely...

[Kagatob]

So you know FTE is the problem.
fixed
Guilds should be allowed to form KS groups and 6 people can take loot from 60?
Exprain prease.
Or maybe a guild of 40 can pull a mob, and then a group of 20 can pull it off and kill it. I'm sorry guys,
If a guild of 40 people have positioned themselves so poorly that a guild with half as many players can peel a mob and out damage them with half as many players (and not wipe mind you) it only shows that the guild of 40 did not position themselves properly in the first place. Regardless you are completely ignoring zone in force policy with this idiotic example so whatever.
variance and FTE are necessary and they wouldn't exist otherwise. Shit was much worse before.
If it is better now, why did the staff decide to shut down raids entirely? :cool:

[Rail]

So you think FTE is the problem? Guilds should be allowed to form KS groups and 6 people can take loot from 60? Or maybe a guild of 40 can pull a mob, and then a group of 20 can pull it off and kill it. I'm sorry guys, variance and FTE are necessary and they wouldn't exist otherwise. Shit was much worse before.

Yes, this would be better. Not worse. How else can ANYONE compete against a 60 man force? Because then you could use STRATEGY and TACTICS and actually PLAY the damn game instead of sitting around waiting for a handout.

Oh I know the solution:
Why don't we all just form one huge guild. <Popular People's Front>
Then we can distribute all dragon loot in DKP system to the entire server.

[Hitpoint]

Okay. In a system where FTE doesn't exist, then the group which gets the exp is allowed to loot the mob. Therefore, since no raid groups exist. You put the highest dps you have into one group, send them in when another guild engages, and you get the exp/loot.


The next thing you said was asking how a group of 20 can pull a mob away from a group of 40. Well 1 player can do that very easily. Any player trying to build agro on a mob can pull it off someone. Mallet charges, hybrid agro, etc. Other guild pulls talendor, takes the charm, puller brings him to their raid force. I can pull it off him before he even reaches them and bring it to mine, easily. That's what FTE is for. I promise you'd be mad if fay was walking to your raid, then suddenly he turned around and went to another.


If it is better now, why did the staff decide to shut down raids entirely? :cool:

It has absolutely nothing to do with FTE. Not sure why you would even suggest that.

I have no idea what the guy above me is talking about. Rail, FTE allows you to compete with a 60 person force. But your the guy who said exp message = getting the kill so I'm going to just ignore you.

[Kagatob]

Okay. In a system where FTE doesn't exist, then the group which gets the exp is allowed to loot the mob. Therefore, since no raid groups exist. You put the highest dps you have into one group, send them in when another guild engages, and you get the exp/loot.


The next thing you said was asking how a group of 20 can pull a mob away from a group of 40. Well 1 player can do that very easily. Any player trying to build agro on a mob can pull it off someone. Mallet charges, hybrid agro, etc. Other guild pulls talendor, takes the charm, puller brings him to their raid force. I can pull it off him before he even reaches them and bring it to mine, easily. That's what FTE is for. I promise you'd be mad if fay was walking to your raid, then suddenly he turned around and went to another.



It has absolutely nothing to do with FTE. Not sure why you would even suggest that.

I don't even know where to begin with the number of things wrong with this post.

Good job still ignoring force in zone policy though. Troll?

I have no idea what the guy above me is talking about. Rail all that is very vague. But your the guy who said exp message = getting the kill so I'm going to just ignore you.
He makes perfect sense actually, not that I agree with his solution 100% but what he's saying is still zounds more coherent than the idiot-crap you are spewing.

[Hitpoint]

I don't even know where to begin with the number of things wrong with this post.

Good job still ignoring force in zone policy though. Troll?


He makes perfect sense actually, not that I agree with his solution 100% but what he's saying is still zounds more coherent than the idiot-crap you are spewing.

The server WAS like this and it made more problems. What is sufficient force for Draco? He can be duo'd.

VP WAS exp gets loot and it made more problems. They just fucking changed it a few days ago.

Yes, this would be better. Not worse. How else can ANYONE compete against a 60 man force? Because then you could use STRATEGY and TACTICS and actually PLAY the damn game instead of sitting around waiting for a handout.


Can you please translate that shit for me Kagatob? Because I'm not sure where I was asking for a handout or how I'm not playing EQ. It's borderline incoherent.

[Vyal]

The server WAS like this and it made more problems. What is sufficient force for Draco? He can be duo'd.

VP WAS exp gets loot and it made more problems. They just fucking changed it a few days ago.



Can you please translate that shit for me Kagatob? Because I'm not sure where I was asking for a handout or how I'm not playing EQ.

THE SERVER WAS NEVER EVER LIKE THIS BUD. Get your facts straight a bit...
I was around before variance, I was around before all your crazy rules that make no sense whatsoever.
The game was fine, people had fun and we enjoyed it. It was close to classic there was competition yes there may have been a few petitioned here or there but those always got solved. If someone KS'd someones mob then Rogean himself would come down and take loot out of their bags or just respawn the mob for people.

Because now your trying to derail a discussion about it by scaring people with the 6 man TMO VP geared rogues coming to KS mobs from people in the night.

[Kagatob]

The server WAS like this and it made more problems. What is sufficient force for Draco? He can be duo'd.

Again you don't seem to get it. You think in-force is about the mobs? You do it by zone. If you want to hold Draco or Maestro you need a force suffecient to kill CT or Inny respectively if you want to hold claim. If nobody else is in the zone and you get 2 people in to duo Draco there's no problem because nobody is there to dispute.

You are coming up with problems that don't exist because you want to.

VP WAS exp gets loot and it made more problems. They just fucking changed it a few days ago.

VP was no rules, don't try to pick out one sentence out of one sub paragraph and try to pin everything on that. Young lawyer you are not.

Can you please translate that shit for me Kagatob? Because I'm not sure where I was asking for a handout or how I'm not playing EQ. It's borderline incoherent.

What language? It's perfectly fine in English.

[Hitpoint]

THE SERVER WAS NEVER EVER LIKE THIS BUD. Get your facts straight a bit...

The server always had variance? Tell me more.

[Kagatob]

^
Confirmed troll and/or can't read.

What's the next freaking thing he says?

I was around before variance
Go away already hitpoint.

[Hitpoint]

Again you don't seem to get it. You think in-force is about the mobs? You do it by zone. If you want to hold Draco or Maestro you need a force suffecient to kill CT or Inny respectively if you want to hold claim. If nobody else is in the zone and you get 2 people in to duo Draco there's no problem because nobody is there to dispute.

You are coming up with problems that don't exist because you want to.



VP was no rules, don't try to pick out one sentence out of one sub paragraph and try to pin everything on that. Young lawyer you are not.



What language? It's perfectly fine in English.

So if Inny or CT isn't spawned you need a raid force capable of killing them? To kill a duoable mob? I'm sorry, this is not okay. FTE is fine. Who pulls it get's first shot. If you don't pull it directly then you are kiting and the mob is no longer yours. If you pull it directly and don't have a force you will wipe. Could you please reiterate why this is so bad?

VP was no rules, but KS groups were formed and loot was acquired that way. I know you'd hate this more than any problem that currently exists. So would I.

[Hitpoint]

^
Confirmed troll and/or can't read.

What's the next freaking thing he says?


Go away already hitpoint.

That was sarcasm retard. I know there wasn't variance. That's why there's a question mark and a sarcastic comment following it. I'm finished responding to you. Keep replying please, I won't ever see it.

[Rail]

Whatever, this game is just going to become a sit and wait with your thumb up your butt for your handed out dragon loot that is completely useless because you are not playing the game anyway.

That is exactly why Live EQ has instanced all raid encounters. So every guild can feel special and not get their feelings hurt when they are kill stealed/trained/out strategized.

Guilds themselves cannot figure out how to distribute loot fairly, and you want them all to decide how to distribute the mobs? Not going to happen.

When the calendar is implemented, 5 new guilds will spawn. Mark my words.
Zlandicar will be the only dragon worth killing to get keys to ST... and no one will be able to play that content for over 1 year because there will be 15+ guilds cycling zlandicar spawns at up to 7days+96hours each.

It is fascinating to talk about the past as future. I was there once...

[radditsu]

Kagatob....not sure if troll


Have you raided here?

[Vyal]

So if Inny or CT isn't spawned you need a raid force capable of killing them? To kill a duoable mob? I'm sorry, this is not okay. FTE is fine. Who pulls it get's first shot. If you don't pull it directly then you are kiting and the mob is no longer yours. If you pull it directly and don't have a force you will wipe. Could you please reiterate why this is so bad?

VP was no rules, but KS groups were formed and lot was acquired that way. I know you'd hate this more than any problem that currently exists. So would I.

Why is it not okay? It worked fine..
We are not talking about no rules man what are you not getting?
There is rules.

Anyone from back in the day back me up here.....

*cracks open a beer*

FB DA IB Europa any of you left please inform these people how it worked & how much fun it was.

[Neach]

~checks watch~

Well it’s about that time little birds.

Sadly since no agreement was reached, and since no talks are currently in place, I am raid suspending all guilds, and all players, from ALL raid targets and ALL raid zones.

Until further notice anyone who touches a raid mob (VP Dragons, Trak, VS, CT, Draco, Inny, Maestro, Gore, Fay, Tal, Sev, Noble, OoA, Naggy, Vox, Phinny, Ragefire, Planar Trash, or anything else I forgot) or enters into Plane of Sky, Plane of Hate, Plane of Fear, or Veeshan’s Peak, will be banned until the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, until the seas go dry and the mountains blow in the wind like leaves. Only Then you shall return and continue playing should you break these rules.



This has got to be the best fucking thing I have heard come out of P99 in a long time. It actually made me log in and chat with some people to find out some funny information. TMO,Raid,bans,rmt . . .it seems like a FULL strawberry Douche injection to a bunch of Vagina's or buttholes up in here, pardon me if I touch myself in pleasure.

[radditsu]

Fte is fine as a mechanic. The abuse of fte by a raid to grief others is not ok. The problem is that a "pull" of a mob can be easily construed as a "grief". Die to trying to grab a charm, or flopping a trak to get him to banish. Some assholes DO grief the engage. I hate that it is an end all be all solution previously. However it is not feasible to debate and weigh every pulled mob in the world.

A solution (requires a dev so useless idea) tie in a zone /who server side when the fte shout hits. If engage less than 6( or 12) automatically give the mob loot to the 2nd guild on the aggro list.

[Eloian]

The classic experience is many different things to people. For me, I've always been in a family guild that grew to be well honed raiding forces of skilled players. Hardcores had a place as well as casuals. The experience for me was hanging with my family in groups or better, raids...loots was barely a thought. We were a team, moving ahead respecting others. When I was in the hospital and I got phone calls from those dear people, it meant something. I found that place again in BDA. So I have my experience back and mere words can't properly convey how much they mean to me. EQ for some like myself is so much more than a game. I could go on for many pages in the ways that EQ enriched my life. Saved my sanity. Gave me pleasure when all else was brutal crippling physical pain for years on end.

I say all this to point out there is a better way. Start with respect and compassion all else will fall into place. I love p99. It can be better, you have to want it to be better bad enough. Do you?

Eloian Bushlover <I'm from Surefalls, They think I'm slow eh>
57 Half-elf Ranger
<BDA>

[Babayaaga]

Roughly a couple dozen high-value targets, spawning approximately a couple times a week. I'm no mathematician, but this translates into about 1250 spawns per year, not factoring in drop-rate rarity.

P99 blue has over 1000 players online at peak periods and between 400-500 players during lower population periods. Given the server's age and the result is a recipe for disaster: A mature server with high demand and low contested spawn rate, and no new content for over two years.

I understand the Dev's frustration, but there has to be some recognition by those who run this environment of this problem. It is a problem that wasn't experienced in classic Everquest because expansions were far more regular than we will ever experience on P99.

In classic Everquest where expansions were released annually or sooner, the more "established" guilds would progress on to harder targets, leaving older content for younger and newer guilds. This helped contribute to a more balanced raiding environment.

Everyone playing on P99 wants to experience "classic", at their own pace, but some of the "slower progressing" players have caught up to the most established players, and we have reached a boiling point. There just isn't enough content to meet current demand, and a solution is going to require a combined effort of negotiation between the player base and the server admins to work something out. Barring players from content is only going to create frustration, and players will leave. This will change the landscape of P99 indefinitely... for better or for worse.

It needs to be said that the majority of P99's player base truly appreciate the efforts put forth by Sirken, Rogean and his team to provide this venue for those of us who quite frankly don't want to play "modern" games. There is obviously a strong market for people who prefer the classic experience that comes from pre-PoP Everquest without the taint of newer expansions, and right now P99 is the only way to experience it. We also understand that Velious content is being worked on feverishly, but until then... how do we meet demand without bloodshed, and without content bans that punish players from doing exactly what this server was created for?

The answer (to me), seems fairly clear: There needs to be enough content to meet demand.

The players can't create more content, and the developers can't make players who have been forced into content-starvation behave more considerately to each other.

There needs to be a compromise that not only involves guilds, but also involves the Dev team of Project 1999 to come up with a strategy that alleviates content starvation. Current demand has reached critical mass, and this is why we are seeing the intensity of shit-flinging that has brought us to this point.

I would like to request that the Devs to at least consider presenting the population with a content-based solution that will help alleviate some of the stress and strain on demand for spawn rarity.

In turn, guilds need to acknowledge that until Velious comes out, we are all challenged for content in a mature server environment. In addition to ideas that have been presented, it is also going to mean some in-guild restructuring that promotes policies for loot distribution that encourages a main-vs-alt mentality, and enforces zero-tolerance attitude towards non-NBG behaviour (which spawns RMT). This is, after all, what started this debacle. TMO's particular raid-style attracted this kind of player, and this is the biggest problem I feel they faced as a guild. It burned them, badly. Hopefully they have learned from it, as many others certainly have from their tragedy.

As hard as it may be, until new content is available we all have to try to acknowledge that other players who don't share our guild-tags are trying to accomplish the same goals that each and every one of us are trying to achieve. While there may be a market for selling raid content, this behaviour is undermining the entire reason that we all started playing here. If the shoe was on the other foot, would you want to experience project 1999 in any way other than the way you have been? If the answer is "no", then it's time to change your behaviour a little bit, as much as it might suck right now.

Other Suggestions (pipe dreams maybe, but since we're throwing out ideas... why not!):

Open up another blue server... from scratch (this could mitigate some of the demand, possibly permanently.)

Remove Variance (this would decrease the spawn timers enough so as not to be harmful to the "economy", and absolutely would alleviate some of the stress)

Poop-socking ends... period. In fact, if devs could brilliantly figure out a way to detect poopsocking and make it impossible to "camp in" within a certain radius of a contested spawn... this would be ideal! Sure it's not classic, but this situation isn't classic either and needs some patch-fixes to solve our unique problems.

Random "Server Repop" events, at least twice monthly. The one that happened over Christmas has got to be the best demonstration of inter-guild cooperation I have experienced on P99... ever. It also attracted veterans who gave up on the raid environment of blue P99 long ago... which speaks volumes about the critical situation we have here. More events like this will likely create a healthier, happier and friendlier environment.

I look forward to future posts on this thread.

[Babayaaga]

Oh and btw...

/petition to move Pinoit from Plane of Sky, where I logged out last week before hopping on an airplane IRL for the annual ritual of visiting relatives for the holidays.

Definition of suck = trying to log in for the first time in a week to inexplicably inaccessible character. Added suck = losing corpsed keys I'd maintained for months.

[Winter]

WOW almost 40 pages of bickering and fighting and just not agreeing with anything

I can see we're not going be raiding any time soon until we can at least agree on to disagree

[JayN]

we all agree that they should release

http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171http://www.project1999.com/forums/image.php?u=18092&type=sigpic&dateline=1388224171




enough of this pussyfooting around on these bs logistics

[odiecat99]

40 pages of shit. For the most part. Excellent read. Thanks p99 community.

[pharmakos]

in the new season of Futurama, there is a scene where the two kids (Hermes' kid and the Professor's kid) are fighting over a ball. to "solve" the fight, Nixon and the Headless Body of Agnew come over and tear the ball in half.

i watched that episode last night and laughed at the parallel.

[odiecat99]

wonderful show pharmakos.
+1

[odiecat99]

http://www.pictures.desijunks.com/funny1/funnydog47.jpg

mofos be hungry bro.

[Buellen]

Roughly a couple dozen high-value targets, spawning approximately a couple times a week. I'm no mathematician, but this translates into about 1250 spawns per year, not factoring in drop-rate rarity.

P99 blue has over 1000 players online at peak periods and between 400-500 players during lower population periods. Given the server's age and the result is a recipe for disaster: A mature server with high demand and low contested spawn rate, and no new content for over two years.

I understand the Dev's frustration, but there has to be some recognition by those who run this environment of this problem. It is a problem that wasn't experienced in classic Everquest because expansions were far more regular than we will ever experience on P99.

In classic Everquest where expansions were released annually or sooner, the more "established" guilds would progress on to harder targets, leaving older content for younger and newer guilds. This helped contribute to a more balanced raiding environment.

Everyone playing on P99 wants to experience "classic", at their own pace, but some of the "slower progressing" players have caught up to the most established players, and we have reached a boiling point. There just isn't enough content to meet current demand, and a solution is going to require a combined effort of negotiation between the player base and the server admins to work something out. Barring players from content is only going to create frustration, and players will leave. This will change the landscape of P99 indefinitely... for better or for worse.

It needs to be said that the majority of P99's player base truly appreciate the efforts put forth by Sirken, Rogean and his team to provide this venue for those of us who quite frankly don't want to play "modern" games. There is obviously a strong market for people who prefer the classic experience that comes from pre-PoP Everquest without the taint of newer expansions, and right now P99 is the only way to experience it. We also understand that Velious content is being worked on feverishly, but until then... how do we meet demand without bloodshed, and without content bans that punish players from doing exactly what this server was created for?

The answer (to me), seems fairly clear: There needs to be enough content to meet demand.

The players can't create more content, and the developers can't make players who have been forced into content-starvation behave more considerately to each other.

There needs to be a compromise that not only involves guilds, but also involves the Dev team of Project 1999 to come up with a strategy that alleviates content starvation. Current demand has reached critical mass, and this is why we are seeing the intensity of shit-flinging that has brought us to this point.

I would like to request that the Devs to at least consider presenting the population with a content-based solution that will help alleviate some of the stress and strain on demand for spawn rarity.


IT DOES NOT MATTER WHEN THEY RELEASE CONTENT. all player past present and current have been given access to this content. IF the current players reach the point where current content is not enough then we the players need to stop and find something else to do in game or outside of it.

Yes we all like to play this game, but you are not on live , this is not costing you anything. You should play game with the understanding that the content we are blessed with is all you have period. enjoy and when you do not enjoy it anymore , not matter what the situation then move on.

Garue 49th Half Elf Warrior // Buskier 34th Human Cleric // Shoul Der 37th Human Monk
Glunier Emberstone 60th Human paladin Vintage Eqmac
Glunier Emberstone 67th Dwarf Paladin Nameless.

PS its is embarrassing the amount entitlement some players in this game feel they have just because they play this game, as Many have said THE DEVS OWE US nothing .

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

Velious 2015. Revamp Kunark.

[odiecat99]

Velious 2015. Revamp Kunark.

Nahmeen

[il Siciliano]

As someone aspiring to one day see raids, and who is playing a cleric specifically to get the opportunity to do so... This post is freaking me the hell out. It sounds like there is nothing awaiting me because I wont have seniority.

[Buriedpast]

As someone aspiring to one day see raids, and who is playing a cleric specifically to get the opportunity to do so... This post is freaking me the hell out. It sounds like there is nothing awaiting me because I wont have seniority.

IB, TMO, FE are always recruiting blue spell effect kids.

The onus is on the player being good enough. Neither of those three wants guild hoppers and ladder climbers. Apply to IB at 50 if you got what it takes, and we support, encourage, teach and gear appropriately. It's all up to you to perform. Those that don't , don't make the cut as standards are high amongst all three guilds, and none of them (IB TMO FE) particularly NEEDS people.

Don't think there is barriers to entry aside from you.

[Lord_Snow]

IB, TMO, FE are always recruiting blue spell effect kids.

The onus is on the player being good enough. Neither of those three wants guild hoppers and ladder climbers. Apply to IB at 50 if you got what it takes, and we support, encourage, teach and gear appropriately. It's all up to you to perform. Those that don't , don't make the cut as standards are high amongst all three guilds, and none of them (IB TMO FE) particularly NEEDS people.

Don't think there is barriers to entry aside from you.

Why can't there be another server so other guilds can have a shot? Since this one is going to be locked down by all three from the looks of it

[Buriedpast]

Because not enough people donate, and it costs money to host this stuff.

A server with a hard PNP rule set requires very little CSR.

[JerSar]

Because not enough people donate, and it costs money to host this stuff.

A server with a hard PNP rule set requires very little CSR.

i don't know the specifics, but I've heard Dur say that the server can handle a way higher population than current, and I assume, (assume) that you could host multiple servers on one box. Meaning it might not actually cost anything more, see my thread on another server if you want.

[Nune]

Well, where to start on this shit. Firstly, the irony and hypocritical nature of this move disappointing. If you want to flex your authority, show a bunch of elf-dependent nerds "who's boss" the least you could do is call it like it is.

This entire ban is just a fuck you to TMO. During the 2 weeks they were banned from raiding, other raid guilds took the initiative to reach a temporary agreement. The raiding drama was minimal (if at all), competent guilds hit 32k targets, and the up and coming guilds like mine / the casual raid guilds did what their members logged on to do; have fun. 2 weeks later, TMO gets unbanned.... AAAAND ITS GONE. This just comes off as lazy, and to me, seems like the staff got butthurt that TMO was duping / blahblah behind their back and getting away with it. The staff took the time to write their own proposals (lol) but didn't take the time to address the root cause of it all? Guilds got disbanded on live for being fucks: thats a fact jack. I saw it happen in person on Tallon Zek, to which the birth of SZ arose eventually : a place for dumb asses to go grief while the GM staff opted to use minimal intervention. I don't think a second Blue server without any kind of PnP would be the way to go, because there isn't a secondary population to fill it while keeping P99 manned well enough.

So here's my "proposal" - Remove variance.. you know, that non-classic feature on the "classic" server. IT IS THE ROOT CAUSE OF ALL THE DRAMA. My guild doesn't hit 32k targets (yet ;) ), so I don't have a dog in the fight. Nor do I really give a fuck, I work 60 hours a week and so do most of us; there's an accepted reality that we won't ever be top dog thrivers in MMOs when we go outside 7 days a week. Poopsocking is gone, mass training is gone (because there aren't 3/4 guilds trying to ruin the raid for the 1 that got FTE because there's isnt shit up and they're butthurt they stared at a wall for 13 hours straight just for some other guilds monk to walk in 20 minutes ago and get the first shuriken off). THE STAFF would then figure out a rotation for which mobs spawn when, it would take a minimal amount of effort to know which mobs to spawn when, and which mobs to spawn at the same time, to be able to spread out the raiding forces.

Now, this won't happen. Because classic server GMs and devs have all their dogs in the most non-classic mechanic on the server's fight. So..

Just disband TMO. Who has 25x more Kunark raid loot than they need? TMO. Who, time and time again, was at the crime scene when training/greifing/poopsocking/hack/duping/RMT/RL info postings occurred? TMO. Who posted guild bank spreadsheets solely to mock and lord other guilds who attempted the content they did? TMO. Who's absence brought the first ever raid scene agreements/rotations/hand holding? TMO.

May seem like I've got a case of the angerz/jellyz for them, but i don't. There's quite a few people in TMO I enjoy playing with / have on friends list. But it doesn't negate the fact that at the core, there is 1 guild and a fractional chunk of the population, who are perpetuating the problems you want solved. I'm aware in the past IB could have been substituted in for TMO, yadda yadda before this argument hits the time machine, but this is now.

Since TMO got banned for 2 weeks, and this pointed forced agreement bullshit got put on us all, I've NEVER seen the staff mention donations so much. So, by my deductive reasoning, this also won't happen because it's apparent, to me, that TMO was donating their way to the shitmountain they sat upon.

Which btw, locking raids down for an entire server is a great way to get more people to donate money, good look on that one. This post may have seemed bash-the-staff happy, but honestly I have nothing but respect for what they do, and am grateful to be able to play here. I just feel like this decision was the wrong one, and there's a lack of HONEST transparency going on to let a real "agreement" be brought to.

You've created a slippery slope situation, that just gets more lubed the further we slide. Now EVERYONE thinks they've got the proposal that will get this lifted.. for fucks sake people were throwing ideas around in our guild chat last night and we don't even 32k bro. We just have fun clearing planes and doing the little guy stuff like DEs. You want the server to agree on a proposal, but my guild and our officers couldn't even post in the Raid Discussion threads, even though we raid? You cant put duct tape on someones mouth then punish them for not speaking. In your mind, you have set in stone who the "raid" guilds are : band them from raiding, and let us little guy guilds keep doing what we do / take our chances at 32k mobs the right way.

[radditsu]

+-4hours

[sedrie.bellamie]

W
Just disband TMO. Who has 25x more Kunark raid loot than they need? TMO. Who, time and time again, was at the crime scene when training/greifing/poopsocking/hack/duping/RMT/RL info postings occurred? TMO.

You make it sound like TMO is the same 20 people for 3 years. TMO has been a revolving door of players because that is the envirment of p99. Without have to pay for this game monthly, people come and go. People level up to 60, join a raiding guild, get epic, get loot, and then quit. Then TMO/FE/IB have to go out and recruit new players.

At the crime scence? Like every guild can keep track of every guild member they have? The NSA can't stop information leaking and neither can a raid guild. It is true; a few bad apples can ruin the bunch. What happens at a raid is the raid guild's responsibility; punishing a raid guild for what individuals do during non-raid times is a pretty petty response from the server staff.

If the server staff really just wants to summon people's corpses and run GM events without prizes; go for it. If the server staff does not want to deal with the raid scene; just let the raiding guilds go at it. It seems with variance and FTE that the server staff has spread out their problems somewhat. The reason the server staff has to do petitionquest is b/c in 2013 no raid decision was real or cohorrent. If the server staff could decided among themselves how to treat raid guilds then alot of this would not be a problem. (ie. if the staff would actually ban FE/IB as long as they said they would)

[Thulack]

You make it sound like TMO is the same 20 people for 3 years. TMO has been a revolving door of players because that is the envirment of p99. Without have to pay for this game monthly, people come and go. People level up to 60, join a raiding guild, get epic, get loot, and then quit. Then TMO/FE/IB have to go out and recruit new players.

At the crime scence? Like every guild can keep track of every guild member they have? The NSA can't stop information leaking and neither can a raid guild. It is true; a few bad apples can ruin the bunch. What happens at a raid is the raid guild's responsibility; punishing a raid guild for what individuals do during non-raid times is a pretty petty response from the server staff.

If the server staff really just wants to summon people's corpses and run GM events without prizes; go for it. If the server staff does not want to deal with the raid scene; just let the raiding guilds go at it. It seems with variance and FTE that the server staff has spread out their problems somewhat. The reason the server staff has to do petitionquest is b/c in 2013 no raid decision was real or cohorrent. If the server staff could decided among themselves how to treat raid guilds then alot of this would not be a problem. (ie. if the staff would actually ban FE/IB as long as they said they would)

If TMO was a revolving door they wouldnt have shitloads of loot to sell. They would giving it to players to use.... You think it's a revolving door but its the same people walking through the doors just wearing different outfits(alts)

[SeruScars]

Because not enough people donate, and it costs money to host this stuff.

A server with a hard PNP rule set requires very little CSR.

P99 had over 100000 hits in the last 30 days. Money is not a problem.

[Babayaaga]

Because not enough people donate, and it costs money to host this stuff.

A server with a hard PNP rule set requires very little CSR.

You are partially correct. It does cost someone something to be running this environment, yet at no cost to those of us enjoying it. The rub on this is that while a significant portion of P99's player base may agree to some form of regular subscription, technically without copyright agreements the hosts can't ask for that. Instead, they ask for donations.

The risk with this type of payment model is twofold. The hosts have no guaranteed source of income to run the environment, and probably take little to nothing for their time investment. This has potential to create a boiling point of frustration for them. Conversely, the players invest time in an environment that can't be duplicated anywhere else, and become committed to it. They have already invested time (some more than others), and some may even make a financial contribution through donation... but there is no guarantee that this environment will last. It depends on the variables experienced by the host. If the money runs out, there is no funding for the costs... if patience wears too thin, they can walk away with no liability.

It's a relationship that needs double-sided respect. We as players will likely never fully comprehend what is going on behind the scenes in terms of financial obligations or time-investment responsibilities. We have to acknowledge that these things exist, and that it is our responsibility to help them to keep it going.

They've asked for suggestions and perspectives from the player base. My perspective is that there is a huge desparity between content availablity and demand and this is by design. We are all attracted to the idea of stopping content at Velious, which won't be available for some time yet. This is the selling point outlined by our hosts, and they have delivered on this promise. What nobody may have anticipated is the popularity of this project.

Outside of our little community (small by comparison against the huge gaming marketplace), I wonder how many potential sponsors of something like this are aware of what's going on here? IMHO, this project has been a success in terms of identifying what types of games people are prepared to invest in... and it's a far cry from what's on the market. Perhaps even some copyright holders themselves would be prepared to invest in seeing how this thing plays out? A little more financial freedom could go a long way in perpetuating solutions coming to the board.

In terms of CSRs, the cost can be quite minimal because the way the old system worked... the "workers" were volunteers. Unpaid people who were granted access to the tools provided they committed a minimum number of hours per week and followed a strict guideline on how to use them. Minimal supervision is required, but it has to be closely monitored.

If nothing else, I'm grateful for being a part of what got us to this point. It's been a very interesting journey from a market-perspective.

[sedrie.bellamie]

If TMO was a revolving door they wouldnt have shitloads of loot to sell. They would giving it to players to use.... You think it's a revolving door but its the same people walking through the doors just wearing different outfits(alts)

a revolving door means that people come in and take and leave and that new people come in and take and leave and this keeps repeating. These players take the items with them b/c "they will be back for velious"

I cannot name one TMO that quit p99 and came back. TMO does gear up old TMO from fenin ro; and usually those guys burn out at 54.

But your reponse just shows the ignorance of this forums to TMO; glad most you forum people don't actually play p99

[Autotune]

a revolving door means that people come in and take and leave and that new people come in and take and leave and this keeps repeating. These players take the items with them b/c "they will be back for velious"

I cannot name one TMO that quit p99 and came back. TMO does gear up old TMO from fenin ro; and usually those guys burn out at 54.

But your reponse just shows the ignorance of this forums to TMO; glad most you forum people don't actually play p99

I wonder why...

[sedrie.bellamie]

go away stealin

[radditsu]

go away stealin

Go away sedrie

[Thulack]

Go away sedrie

[Arteker]

a revolving door means that people come in and take and leave and that new people come in and take and leave and this keeps repeating. These players take the items with them b/c "they will be back for velious"

I cannot name one TMO that quit p99 and came back. TMO does gear up old TMO from fenin ro; and usually those guys burn out at 54.

But your reponse just shows the ignorance of this forums to TMO; glad most you forum people don't actually play p99

in 3 years of tmo membership i can count very very few tmo from fennin ro compared to the sheer numbers of the guild.
tmo learned back in the day (from ib) to never close his application section , and it have keep a flow of players over the years .

what most people outside FE ib realize is how much costet keep tmo machines working.

Tmo needed hugue ammount of plats for peridots for runes for essence emeralds to recharge from invis rings larrikan masks mallets strings....

infact in teerms of economy and if u dont count some items like thex daggers fungus staff i doubt there is a guild who busted so much platinum in reagents.
Back in the day few traker accounts where buyed for the guild use (when it was legal) but tmo never buyed accounts to raid .

individuals with tons of money did and still not that many .Fazlazen was the first player i think to see how valuable was mq and profit from ragefire and i think first to duo it for profit, nowdays its a very common thing in p99

How many ragefires where done for epics? maybe a 5% the rest went to farm cofs and armour and scales and more shit.

The alt issue with raidin loot? well not everyone in tmo got his bis and left many liked the server and begin to create alts and lvl them, first as nagy vox alts later for more serius raid works .

some tmo as me switched classs, and in general they have shit loads of alts.

was easy to gear them? in term of vp loot it was general loot no that easy .

what i can tell you is in a single repop day after all targets where killed recharge mule used more than 100k .

100 k just in recharge .


about the time and claim of massive time sink is raid? if dont count sky cleans or m vp under train war it was always fast and easy .

[Reguiy]

40 pages of shit. For the most part. Excellent read. Thanks p99 community.

40 pages of garbage. Still more interesting than reddit!

[Buriedpast]

in 3 years of tmo membership i can count very very few tmo from fennin ro compared to the sheer numbers of the guild.
tmo learned back in the day (from ib) to never close his application section , and it have keep a flow of players over the years .

what most people outside FE ib realize is how much costet keep tmo machines working.

Tmo needed hugue ammount of plats for peridots for runes for essence emeralds to recharge from invis rings larrikan masks mallets strings....

infact in teerms of economy and if u dont count some items like thex daggers fungus staff i doubt there is a guild who busted so much platinum in reagents.
Back in the day few traker accounts where buyed for the guild use (when it was legal) but tmo never buyed accounts to raid .

individuals with tons of money did and still not that many .Fazlazen was the first player i think to see how valuable was mq and profit from ragefire and i think first to duo it for profit, nowdays its a very common thing in p99

How many ragefires where done for epics? maybe a 5% the rest went to farm cofs and armour and scales and more shit.

The alt issue with raidin loot? well not everyone in tmo got his bis and left many liked the server and begin to create alts and lvl them, first as nagy vox alts later for more serius raid works .

some tmo as me switched classs, and in general they have shit loads of alts.

was easy to gear them? in term of vp loot it was general loot no that easy .

what i can tell you is in a single repop day after all targets where killed recharge mule used more than 100k .

100 k just in recharge .


about the time and claim of massive time sink is raid? if dont count sky cleans or m vp under train war it was always fast and easy .

TLDR

TMO members not willing to chip in a little themselves for consumables and instead rely on the guild selling epics and mq's and loot from content it doesnt need, to continue recharging to raid content it doesnt need.

IB FE do the same, but the vast majority of members just cover their own costs and consider it part of he game.

[Alarti0001]

If TMO was a revolving door they wouldnt have shitloads of loot to sell. They would giving it to players to use.... You think it's a revolving door but its the same people walking through the doors just wearing different outfits(alts)

Nah we just dont get much in the way of new SK's/Rangers/Bards.
You tried tho !

[Alarti0001]

Go away sedrie

go away tanrin, back to your rnf cave.

[Erati]

in 3 years of tmo membership i can count very very few tmo from fennin ro compared to the sheer numbers of the guild.
tmo learned back in the day (from ib) to never close his application section , and it have keep a flow of players over the years .

what most people outside FE ib realize is how much costet keep tmo machines working.

Tmo needed hugue ammount of plats for peridots for runes for essence emeralds to recharge from invis rings larrikan masks mallets strings....

.

stopped reading there as Rings of Shadows are 14 plat and I think the Mask is less than 20 ?

so yeah......Ok we get it

[Rogean]

I hate when I visit the forum to look at something linked to me, and suddenly my email is like..

Dear Rogean,

Alarti0001 has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to

Dear Rogean,

Alarti0001 has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to

Dear Rogean,

Alarti0001 has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to

Fucking forumquest...

[kotton05]

Splorf is banned>_<

[Fuddwin]

Poor Alarti

[Alarti0001]

stopped reading there as Rings of Shadows are 14 plat and I think the Mask is less than 20 ?

so yeah......Ok we get it

Quick point out the 2 cheap items and ignore all the expensive ones!

[India]

~checks watch~

Well it’s about that time little birds.



You sound like Cersei !!

[Alarti0001]

I hate when I visit the forum to look at something linked to me, and suddenly my email is like..



Fucking forumquest...


I hate when a staff member targets a single player and shows his bias publicly on a forum!

Fucking forumquest!

[Rogean]

Dear Rogean,

Alarti0001 has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to

Dear Rogean,

Alarti0001 has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to

[radditsu]

go away tanrin, back to your rnf cave.

Nope. After ten thousand years I'm free! It's time to conquer Earth!

[Erati]

Quick point out the 2 cheap items and ignore all the expensive ones!

i read the expensive ones, i just enjoyed the fact that to make the list seem longer he tacked on ones that basically recharge for 'free'

[Arteker]

TLDR

TMO members not willing to chip in a little themselves for consumables and instead rely on the guild selling epics and mq's and loot from content it doesnt need, to continue recharging to raid content it doesnt need.

IB FE do the same, but the vast majority of members just cover their own costs and consider it part of he game.

again u just want to troll. most tmo members have their private recharge mules. tmo mules are strickly used by raid toons and if it means we sold epic for it well then yes.

what i can say people here complain alot about spendin so much time about raid mobs but for me always has been worse deal with resellers in ec or trying to camp something for my private camp to find its always perma camped .

while i understand there is people who find amusing and enjoy playing trader and farming i dont usualy have time to spend 5 or 6 hours camping fbss every day or droga .
so i have to grind it old fashion way , doing groups with my toons and praying i can win something.
Most alts i lvled started with little or poor gear wich i upgrade slowly thanks to tmo? yeah while i keep my main for best items i wouldnt mind to try to achieve lots for my alts.

if u think its greddy well its ur opinion ,and i respect it but i dont see the difference btw being a farmer and being a raider player for loot.


both persons spend time for the same reason to gear his chars , while most people can enjoy solo and make money and farm fbss over and over and over and then go ec and play reseller i dont find it appaling for myself . when im not raidin im grouping or lvling my chars and usualy i enjoy such moments because keep me in contact with people from different guilds and their opinions and concerns are very valid to me .

[Erati]

again u just want to troll. most tmo members have their private recharge mules. tmo mules are strickly used by raid toons and if it means we sold epic for it well then yes.

what i can say people here complain alot about spendin so much time about raid mobs but for me always has been worse deal with resellers in ec or trying to camp something for my private camp to find its always perma camped .

while i understand there is people who find amusing and enjoy playing trader and farming i dont usualy have time to spend 5 or 6 hours camping fbss every day or droga .
so i have to grind it old fashion way , doing groups with my toons and praying i can win something.
Most alts i lvled started with little or poor gear wich i upgrade slowly thanks to tmo? yeah while i keep my main for best items i wouldnt mind to try to achieve lots for my alts.

if u think its greddy well its ur opinion ,and i respect it but i dont see the difference btw being a farmer and being a raider player for loot.


both persons spend time for the same reason to gear his chars , while most people can enjoy solo and make money and farm fbss over and over and over and then go ec and play reseller i dont find it appaling for myself . when im not raidin im grouping or lvling my chars and usualy i enjoy such moments because keep me in contact with people from different guilds and their opinions and concerns are very valid to me .

http://stevethomas.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/worlds-smallest-violin.jpg

[Buriedpast]

FE, IB, BDA, Taken have NEVER as a guild, sold an epic MQ to support the guild bank.

Nor would any of those guilds do so, to fund the guild bank, in order to continue farming content they do not need.

Get the fuck out of here.

Not trolling.

[Buriedpast]

Do you not see the circle that has been established here?

[Prismaticshop]

Looks like Alarti really really wants Rogean to disband TMO for good lol. Not like they aren't dead anyways.

[Buriedpast]

Why would they be dead?

TMO has a lot of excellent players, great folk and friends.

Problem with TMO is its face is people like Alarti, Eccezan, Jeremy, Tiggles, Fountree etc. Remove those folk and trim some fat and they're just another friendly bunch o normal folk

[Arteker]

FE, IB, BDA, Taken have NEVER as a guild, sold an epic MQ to support the guild bank.

Nor would any of those guilds do so, to fund the guild bank, in order to continue farming content they do not need.

Get the fuck out of here.

Not trolling.

thats kinda false,m i have see taken selling cleric epics , bda even sold my demon fangs , FE is a raider guild and usualy will keep their epics for their memebrs because they work to imoprove his guild by chosing the path to raid .IB sold more than few mqs of ct sk sword and list goes.

than you are just a troll is evident , and again who says its bad for a guild keep making money for their members?.

did tmo put a gun and make people buy it?.

maybe ur next step is to blame tmo for the fact this server has been in kunark for so long time .
But again while i try to be polite and share my opinion u counter with trolling and harras me , well thats ur option but this a free forum , and untill a mod ban this account for giving my opinion as far it count as much as yours .

Been 4 years readin this forum and sadly u and your kind is why i deem best thing ever could do mods is shut down forums unless its for support and to help the server to get as much as classic mechanics as it could be.

[Thulack]

Splorf is banned>_<

Yeah Bansticks running wild this weekend. People starting to finally see the truth.

[Robbintha Hood]

This situation is awesome, yet kinda depressing all in one. Surprised that this move by staff hasn't inflated the EC market yet.

[Buriedpast]

thats kinda false,m i have see taken selling cleric epics , bda even sold my demon fangs , FE is a raider guild and usualy will keep their epics for their memebrs because they work to imoprove his guild by chosing the path to raid .IB sold more than few mqs of ct sk sword and list goes.

than you are just a troll is evident , and again who says its bad for a guild keep making money for their members?.

did tmo put a gun and make people buy it?.

maybe ur next step is to blame tmo for the fact this server has been in kunark for so long time .
But again while i try to be polite and share my opinion u counter with trolling and harras me , well thats ur option but this a free forum , and untill a mod ban this account for giving my opinion as far it count as much as yours .

Been 4 years readin this forum and sadly u and your kind is why i deem best thing ever could do mods is shut down forums unless its for support and to help the server to get as much as classic mechanics as it could be.

A person in Taken, selling you an epic, that 3 or 4 people worked on and splitting the profits, is not <TAKEN> selling you an epic, to fund the guild bank, to better themselves towards farming content they do not need.

Newsflash, why would taken sell, as a guild, anything when ALL their members need epics?

Demon fangs? I can duo the entire bloody thing. What a shit example.

Not blaming TMO for anything, just pointing out some basic facts and letting the viewing public make their own decisions based on those facts. My point of view is quite neutral considering I have nothing against TMO, and really dont need to blow my own guilds trumpet. IB can do its own PR if it wants.

[Arteker]

stopped reading there as Rings of Shadows are 14 plat and I think the Mask is less than 20 ?

so yeah......Ok we get it

Erati myself i carry as far 8 of them, a mask , a puppet string a mallet , then ad xxxx ammounts of players and players and raid able alts , potions ....... list is kinda hugue .
we are so evil than we even pay our enchanters to keep stock of resists gear in case anyone need them.

enchanters need peridots, clerics need peridots necros need peridots ees and dots, .........


yet i wondder and still ask you if people still deem tmo as evil why buy from them?.

u gonna blame tmo or platinium farmers to willing to buy epic mqs? this server is bloated with loot due to 3 years of kunark. what you expect . there is more dedicate farmers resselers than tmo FE ib or any raid guild combined toether.

[Arteker]

A person in Taken, selling you an epic, that 3 or 4 people worked on and splitting the profits, is not <TAKEN> selling you an epic, to fund the guild bank, to better themselves towards farming content they do not need.

Newsflash, why would taken sell, as a guild, anything when ALL their members need epics?

Demon fangs? I can duo the entire bloody thing. What a shit example.

Not blaming TMO for anything, just pointing out some basic facts and letting the viewing public make their own decisions based on those facts. My point of view is quite neutral considering I have nothing against TMO, and really dont need to blow my own guilds trumpet. IB can do its own PR if it wants.

in terms of pr u should remember biggest rmt scandal on this server was made by such guild. but that is their problem and the staff problem no tmo wasnt our decision.


and i would like u to post examples and please tell me about wich loots doesnt need tmo.

[khanable]

Explains why TMO got super pissy over that Larrikan's mask in that RnF thread

confirmed, TMO duping plat to fund extensive guild-wide larrikan's mask recharging



/troll

:)

[Buriedpast]

and i would like u to post examples and please tell me about wich loots doesnt need tmo.

If you do need them, why do you sell them?

Eyes of innoruuk
CT skin MQ/spawns
VP loot
Po of Seawater
Trak BP's
Traks Teeth
Soulleach


Any and all are buyable from your local TMO outlet

But your members need them? And you sell them for MQ?

[Arteker]

Explains why TMO got super pissy over that Larrikan's mask in that RnF thread

confirmed, TMO duping plat to fund extensive guild-wide larrikan's mask recharging



/troll

:)

well if u wanna go r/f we do it because we are all junkies of iksars stripers Hagglebaron in cabilis have rise the platinium prices on their new batch of iksars .

and dont worry cucu im profitin this raid ban by making enough pps to hire you for one nigth of depravation and lots of slurrps hisssss drool lick lick auuu:o

[Pheer]

and dont worry cucu im profitin this raid ban by making enough pps to hire you for one nigth of depravation and lots of slurrps hisssss drool lick lick auuu:o

wat

[Arteker]

If you do need them, why do you sell them?

Eyes of innoruuk
CT skin MQ/spawns
VP loot
Po of Seawater
Trak BP's
Traks Teeth
Soulleach


Any and all are buyable from your local TMO outlet

But your members need them? So wait, now you're saying to fund rolling content you DO need, you sell epics your members need?

Vp loot: not always root some times does and there is some people willing to pay for it .like there is normal public tv and there is cable, its a option customer choose.

pod of seawater: fewer druid applicants , nowdays wich is sad .

Trak bps:we slowly replace many of those bps with vp robes unless they have some form of utility , myself is a prime example of it, i got a upgrade i handed it to guild because i dont need it if no other claim it will be end in ec unlesss we stock some for future applicants. tmo still recruits u know .

trak teeth : vp is a awesome spell farm zone now than train has been removed a trak tooth no needed opens the zone to peopleinterested in it (most of customers belong to rival guilds but we dont discirimante anyone).

Very rare to see tmo seeling one i can count atleats 3 tmo members needed it .

[Uteunayr]

and dont worry cucu im profitin this raid ban by making enough pps to hire you for one nigth of depravation and lots of slurrps hisssss drool lick lick auuu:o

wat

I think the english translation is something like:

"And don't worry Cucumbers, I'm profiting from this raid ban by making enough money to hire you for one night of depravity and lots of slurps, hisses, drool, and licks. Auuu(?). :o"

That's just a rough translation to help readers here. It may not be totally accurate.

[Arteker]

wat

cucumbers is the most sexy iksars who walks norrath , but he is expensive and consume alot of gnomes, and lately since the guild FBI m was made gnome prices to feed ur local leezard sexual machines are going m higher and higher.

but i can tell you its totaly worth it . He is a beast.

[Arteker]

I think the english translation is something like:

"And don't worry Cucumbers, I'm profiting from this raid ban by making enough money to hire you for one night of depravity and lots of slurps, hisses, drool, and licks. Auuu(?). :o"

That's just a rough translation to help readers here. It may not be totally accurate.

u caugth the idea but im not willing to share him , he is quite expensive and while i pay his tail belong to me .

[Arteker]

i read the expensive ones, i just enjoyed the fact that to make the list seem longer he tacked on ones that basically recharge for 'free'

maybe free for you this paladin still have to loot every fs copper gold and run to north freeport bank to make some pps .

[Buriedpast]

Vp loot: not always root some times does and there is some people willing to pay for it .like there is normal public tv and there is cable, its a option customer choose.

So you raid content you do not need?

pod of seawater: fewer druid applicants , nowdays wich is sad .

So you raid content you do not need, with the express intent to sell and MQ the loot, when there are 6 other guilds on the server who could use it, and it would make zero difference to TMO by allowing this.

Trak bps:we slowly replace many of those bps with vp robes unless they have some form of utility , myself is a prime example of it, i got a upgrade i handed it to guild because i dont need it if no other claim it will be end in ec unlesss we stock some for future applicants. tmo still recruits u know .

Fair call and I agree.

trak teeth : vp is a awesome spell farm zone now than train has been removed a trak tooth no needed opens the zone to peopleinterested in it (most of customers belong to rival guilds but we dont discirimante anyone).

VP is not an awesome farm zone for spells. And since its been PNP, maybe 2 people have gone in there to kill stuff. What a load of shit. TMO hasnt even goten a single trakanon since it went PNP I dont believe.

So why does TMO raid Trakanon, if they have so many teeth, and no longer need the BP's, cloaks mantles and arguably robes?

For the express intent to sell loot they dont need?

Very rare to see tmo seeling one i can count atleats 3 tmo members needed it .

Fair call, its been maybe a year since I've seen one go.

[Arteker]

So you raid content you do not need?



So you raid content you do not need, with the express intent to sell and MQ the loot, when there are 6 other guilds on the server who could use it, and it would make zero difference to TMO by allowing this.



Fair call and I agree.



VP is not an awesome farm zone for spells. And since its been PNP, maybe 2 people have gone in there to kill stuff. What a load of shit. TMO hasnt even goten a single trakanon since it went PNP I dont believe.

So why does TMO raid Trakanon, if they have so many teeth, and no longer need the BP's, cloaks mantles and arguably robes?

For the express intent to sell loot they dont need?



Fair call, its been maybe a year since I've seen one go.

Tmo dont dictate mob drops isnt our fault imo if we want x item and others drop .Tmo still some of the trak bps not all , we have plenty of clerics waiting donald bp(clerics are people to), cloack of piety , manna robes , even poisoned mantles .

i believe one of our last kills before the suspension was exactly a trakanon , a human sk got upgrade with a mantle , and a shaman got a bp , 2 apps where made fms and got their teeths . and we have a eot and torpor droped , eot went to a member alt and torpor w ent to a shaman .

And as someone who have farmed with 2 groups vp for spells i dissagree . (the 2 groups where formed by a mixture of taken, tmo fe and ib ). i lost the dam bedlamd spell random it sells well grr

[Buriedpast]

Wouldnt it be prudent to in that case, start to offer swaps to other guilds and open up the raid scene to them instead of pooping shit you dont need 24/7?

For instance, if TMO gets a druid app and needs a pod for them. Instead of fucking every guild over by shitstomping Faydedar, they could offer to swap a traks tooth or VP loot for it to a keyed person from BDA or Taken for instance.

Just food for thought on how irrational your situation is and how it could be handled better.

[Buriedpast]

Hell the list goes on, need a white scale? Swaps for a green scale.
Etc etc.

[Arteker]

i respect u not agree with meabout the isue to sell loots .by giving you a idea we got offered 1 millon plat from a taken member for the loot rigths about a pd robe and we said no.

the money tmo earns have been used aswell to reward long term valuable members of our guild with items such thex daggers (no paladin usable sigh), immaculate shields,fungus staffs , even in some cases rbgs for members who couldnt afford it but would be willing to pay in dkp for a upgrade dropeable .


u know not everyone have 50 60k to spend in items . some time ago i remember our pp mules where not even in top ten of the richest persons of the server.

[Arteker]

Hell the list goes on, need a white scale? Swaps for a green scale.
Etc etc.

thats why nortlav the scaleekper was added , and vox aswell scales for bard epic drop those rez sticks who are kinda valuable when u wipe in a hard place but yet they damm expensive to recharge.

[Arteker]

Wouldnt it be prudent to in that case, start to offer swaps to other guilds and open up the raid scene to them instead of pooping shit you dont need 24/7?

For instance, if TMO gets a druid app and needs a pod for them. Instead of fucking every guild over by shitstomping Faydedar, they could offer to swap a traks tooth or VP loot for it to a keyed person from BDA or Taken for instance.

Just food for thought on how irrational your situation is and how it could be handled better.

Actualy before the ban happened there where talks to offer such items for some items needed like innoruck staff for mage epic wich lately went to to taken .(btw great job taken steppin up is something i aprove and respect). but it end in nothing because like we do probably taken members need.


and u know a guild should prioritize always theirs members needs over other guilds as should be .

[radditsu]

Arteker, your guild is full of assholes. Stop spinning. Its embarrassing.

[YendorLootmonkey]

and dont worry cucu im profitin this raid ban by making enough pps to hire you for one nigth of depravation and lots of slurrps hisssss drool lick lick auuu:o

This is a great sig quote if someone hasn't already taken it.

[Thulack]

Actualy before the ban happened there where talks to offer such items for some items needed like innoruck staff for mage epic wich lately went to to taken .(btw great job taken steppin up is something i aprove and respect). but it end in nothing because like we do probably taken members need.


and u know a guild should prioritize always theirs members needs over other guilds as should be .

Lol wish we would have gotten some inny staves. 0/5 on inny staves for Taken so not sure how those talks were going.

[Derubael]

Splorf is banned>_<

splorf can come back anytime he wants.

we still <3 him

i won't breach gm-player confidentiality. if he wants to share, he will.

i think we only banned 2 forum accounts, not including red (who get regular banhammers)

ermagahwd forumquest.

[CodyF86]

Splorf is banned>_<

...but it was fine for people to turn the raid forum into rnf for a few hours
the other day. :rolleyes:

But he was trying to get banned anyway lol, so mission accomplished!

Since the A-Team no longer has a representative in that forum, we nominate
the three wise mews to make any further decisions for us. :)

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ5_jCQpEMr1gXrrTKpXYQyEaqKV8is_ CW2Jcr4GLuSsdUuJfMaaQ

Aaradin
The A-Team

[Autotune]

...but it was fine for people to turn the raid forum into rnf for a few hours
the other day. :rolleyes:

But he was trying to get banned anyway lol, so mission accomplished!

Since the A-Team no longer has a representative in that forum, we nominate
the three wise mews to make any further decisions for us. :)

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ5_jCQpEMr1gXrrTKpXYQyEaqKV8is_ CW2Jcr4GLuSsdUuJfMaaQ

Aaradin
The A-Team

The casuals should have known that the hardcores would poopsock harder than them on these raid rules.

[Littlegyno 10.0]

splorf can come back anytime he wants.

we still <3 him

i won't breach gm-player confidentiality. if he wants to share, he will.

i think we only banned 2 forum accounts, not including red (who get regular banhammers)

ermagahwd forumquest.

getting banned on red is like earning ur stripes in a gang. it's part of the culture u kno?

rip littlegyno 1.0 2.0 3.0 4.0 5.0 6.0 7.0 8.0 9.0

[Mezzmur]

splorf can come back anytime he wants.

we still <3 him

i won't breach gm-player confidentiality. if he wants to share, he will.

i think we only banned 2 forum accounts, not including red (who get regular banhammers)

ermagahwd forumquest.


So you won't everyone where i touched you last night?

[odiecat99]

If he don't tell I will.

[Arteker]

Arteker, your guild is full of assholes. Stop spinning. Its embarrassing.

unlike you im not a proffesional troll or forum quester. my english is to bad to playn it , autotune or stealin can confirm it .
im giving my opinion and if my point of view , and anyone who know me in game , know i dont ever shut up or stop saying what i am thinking.


you are more than welcome to log on blue and speak to me .

And by the record, i played eq for longggggggggggggggggggggggg time, i never found a guild who doesnt have asshols, the trick is to play to find and befriend people who are not ones, something u maybe pherhaps with ur forumquest activitys may have forgotten.

[Nirgon]

This thread for me:

http://cutecaptions.com/images/my-friend-had-his-wisdom-teeth-out/ahhhh-yeah-thats-it-this-time-tomo.jpg

[Mac Dretti]

getting banned on red is like earning ur stripes in a gang. it's part of the culture u kno?

rip littlegyno 1.0 2.0 3.0 4.0 5.0 6.0 7.0 8.0 9.0

u arent a part of red forum community until ur on ur 3rd forum account

[Gaffin 3.0]

u arent a part of red forum community until ur on ur 3rd forum account

kaw kaw yaw yaw

[thugcruncher]

http://i.imgur.com/XMajDHy.gif

[Autotune]

u arent a part of red forum community until ur on ur 3rd forum account

What if your main account has been "perma" banned 3 times and your 6 alt accounts have all been perma banned, but you still have your main account active?

Does that make me part of the red forum community i want no part of?

[Elroz]

just thought I'd be the first to bring it up. Quoting Sirken here :

no need to watch saturday. Chiefs and Eagles will win

[Thulack]

just thought I'd be the first to bring it up. Quoting Sirken here :

Just cant pick a winner in anything.

[odiecat99]

didn't watch.. sooo..

[MoonlightStoner]

does this include mobs that are spawned by turning stuff in, like general for rogue epic or the shaman turn in spawned mob in city of mist?

[heartbrand]

Looking to kill raid mobs but can't on blue any longer? Apply to reddawnguild.com today and collect your pixel package there where the players govern themselves. Be a part of the p99 firsts in velious. Bid DKP with honesty and integrity.

[Elroz]

didn't watch.. sooo..

0/2

[Jenni D]

Finally some tasty blue drama

[kphooper33]

Ok, can we just agree that this isn't going to happen? The GMs love hardcore, great. Just give the pasties their pixels back so we all can go back to fighting over Hate and dreaming about how cool it would be to not pay 500k for our epics.

[pharmakos]

all the proposals in Raid Discussion are so convoluted.

can't anyone think of a simple solution? simple solutions are usually the best.

[Rec]

A simple solution would be for anyone to stay out of anyone elses raid business

[Yinikren]

The simple solutions were shot down because they don't award TMOFEIB enough mobs (all of them).

[element08]

nobody seems to bring up the option of spawning raid targets more often. Bump it up 50% and almost any proposel becomes acceptable to accomodate different play styles and still leave enough targets around for both hardcore and casual.

[Vyal]

The simple solutions were shot down because they don't award TMOFEIB enough mobs (all of them).


Doh... Those guilds are making RL bank off this server. 182 accounts banned for duping items & they are back 2 weeks later says about all you need to know for anyone who has ever dealt with brokers before.

Seems to me the mods will only unlock the raid mobs for the rest of the server whenever the TMO guild is happy and sure they can keep all the top kills.

Kinda sad but hey Sony pops emu'd server owners for selling items directly for money one huge guild knowing the exact variance spawn time on what a 4 day variance & knowing how to dupe items then coming back to raid lock the entire server - use your heads... If you know you can make thousands & thousands of dollars you don't just let it pass you by.

If that's really the truth behind the server & how it operates so be it.. There is no point for a 5 week long bitch fest on these forums when none of our opinions matter anyways and won't unless you agree with TMO.

[radditsu]

Doh... Those guilds are making RL bank off this server. 182 accounts banned for duping items & they are back 2 weeks later says about all you need to know for anyone who has ever dealt with brokers before.

Seems to me the mods will only unlock the raid mobs for the rest of the server whenever the TMO guild is happy and sure they can keep all the top kills.

Kinda sad but hey Sony pops emu'd server owners for selling items directly for money one huge guild knowing the exact variance spawn time on what a 4 day variance & knowing how to dupe items then coming back to raid lock the entire server - use your heads... If you know you can make thousands & thousands of dollars don't just let it pass you by.

Lol did not read raid forum. It is ok. Reading is hard.

[kotton05]

going from dam near no mobs to a good bit of mobs yet still complaining not fair... smh, while I raid led full circle i'd blow my load over free merbs.

[Uteunayr]

going from dam near no mobs to a good bit of mobs yet still complaining not fair... smh, while I raid led full circle i'd blow my load over free merbs.

Because it's not about free mobs, it's about being able to play the game in a way you all don't want to. Since you all don't want to change (which is fair), we want to have a share of mobs to play the game in our way.

"I just don't see how any guild, GM or guide can dictate any guild to adapt to a play style they don't want to. Focus on that, figure how the two different sides can adapt it to this problem. Limiting NPCs to one tier or another and forced into the other side's play style is the second biggest issue."

Forcing others to play your version of classic is what has brought about so many conflicts. If these players forced you to play their casual style, conflicts would happen. It is why Rogean's plan provides for separate means for each side to play their own way, without being a detriment on the other.

Further, if you want to mock people saying something isn't fair, define it, and back up why your definition fits. By many definitions in political philosophy of what fairness is, the current distribution is anything but fair, and even Rogean's plan is unfair to the casuals, but it is a level of unfairness that is more fair than the current system. The desire to be left alone from a different raiding style is so extreme, I am sure most are behind giving even more mobs to you all just to let them manage their own business without needing to play the game your way. Let each do their own style in peace from one another.

[Yinikren]

Very eloquently put, Utuenayr.

Its not about the mobs - about about playing how we want to play. All these proposals have been shot down because you can't compete with us -only TMO - and you don't want that.

This is why the top 4 mobs are in contention - because we don't want to compete the same way you do and that, by default, means "we don't deserve those mobs" to you.

[radditsu]

Because it's not about free mobs, it's about being able to play the game in a way you all don't want to. Since you all don't want to change (which is fair), we want to have a share of mobs to play the game in our way.

"I just don't see how any guild, GM or guide can dictate any guild to adapt to a play style they don't want to. Focus on that, figure how the two different sides can adapt it to this problem. Limiting NPCs to one tier or another and forced into the other side's play style is the second biggest issue."

Forcing others to play your version of classic is what has brought about so many conflicts. If these players forced you to play their casual style, conflicts would happen. It is why Rogean's plan provides for separate means for each side to play their own way, without being a detriment on the other.

Further, if you want to mock people saying something isn't fair, define it, and back up why your definition fits. By some of the strongest definitions used today in political science, the current distribution is anything but fair, and even Rogean's plan is unfair to the casuals, but it is a level of unfairness that is more fair than the current system. Let each do their own style in peace from one another.



Yeah, you have no idea how this works, do you? You can tone it down about 10000%. Nobody wants to read dissertations on musings on thoughts on top of erudite quandrys on top of written motormouth.

In forum speak... SOOOOOMANY TLDR LAWL