Sirken & Zade - City Teams where each Team has each Needed Class

[Ebony]

This is like Aenor's City Teams Split but with 3 Shared cities.

Every Team has Every Needed Class.

Every Team Also Has Four Home Cities.


Evil
----
1. Neriak
2. Oggok
3. Grobb
4. Paineel
5. Freeport - Shares with Neut
6. Cabilis - Shares with Neut

Good
----
1. Felwithe
2. Kelethin
3. Halas
4. Kaladim
5. Qeynos - Shares with Neut

Neut
----
1. Ak'anon
2. Rivervale
3. Erudin
4. Surefall Glade
5. Qeynos - Shares with Good
6. Cabilis - Shares with Evil
7. Freeport - Shares with Evil


SZ teams is a disaster because Evil Team has 4 Team only cities, Neuts have 1 or 2 & Good Team has ZERO Team only cities

Not only is this Extremely better then SZ in City Spit but also a Lot Better in Class Split then SZ.

Neuts do have more starting cities but they are also more spread out.

The only Shared cities are Freeport, Qeynos & Cabilis.

That totally makes sense because Humans are all over the place in their beliefs & letting Neut be Iksar along with Evil keeps evil from Dominating Kunark.

I think something like this is a REALLY Good Team Setup.

Edit: You can also make Ogres the race Neut & Evil share instead of Iksar. Derubael thinks Iksar should be all evil & after thinking about it I think Ogres might be better for Evil/Neut. Neuts get Shamans right from the start in Classic & they just trade a foothold in Kunark for a foothold in South Antonica where Evils had Guk & Cazic-Thule etc. all locked up before.

[Derubael]

ill burn before i let Cabilis be anything but evil.

just my opinion, rest of staff may very well just let me burn, but if we did city based teams i'd fight to the death to keep Cabilis out of neutral/good hands.

[Bazia]

im sorry but these custom team setup threads get more absurd every day

- pick a classic EQ pvp teams server rule set
- hardcode it
- done

[Ebony]

ill burn before i let Cabilis be anything but evil.

just my opinion, rest of staff may very well just let me burn, but if we did city based teams i'd fight to the death to keep Cabilis out of neutral/good hands.

Thank you for the reply, Derubael!

#1 Good will NEVER be able to start in Cabilis, so don't worry about that :D

Neut however needs to be able to have Shamans in some form.

Evil Team does have a CRAZY amount of Shamans so it makes WAY more sense to have Neut Team share one of the Evil Cities then share Halas. PLUS, having Neuts & Good share Halas totally breaks up Each Team having 4 home cities. Evils then have 5 so they need to share 1 with Neuts at least.

Here's what I'd tell the other Devs if I was you, Derubael. Just make Ogres the race Evil Team shares with Neut team. Both Ogres & Iksar have a Big Plus to them when adding them to Team Neut over the other. With Neuts sharing Iksar it does keep Evils from having a big advantage in Kunark BUT having Team Neut share Ogres instead of Iksar gives Neut Team Shamans right at server launch AND it also Gives Neut Team a Foothold in the Swamp area so Evil Team doesn't totally dominate Guk & Temple of Cazic-Thule etc.

I know how you feel about sharing your home city with another Team. I thought it was CRAZY the way SZ had Evil share Neriak & Good share Felwithe. Not to mention Good shared EVERYTHING!! Good should have AT LEAST had Felwithe to themselves. :rolleyes:

Thanks for giving your input, Derubael. Now I think I like the idea of Neuts sharing Ogres more so then Iksar lol

[Ebony]

im sorry but these custom team setup threads get more absurd every day

- pick a classic EQ pvp teams server rule set
- hardcode it
- done

The SZ Teams Split is WAY more "absurd" then this City Split. Both in City control AND Class setup. This City Split has ALL needed classes on EACH Team & that Destroys SZ all by itself.

TZ/VZ Race Split I like however & I'm totally ok with say Humans vs Elves&Shorts vs Evil or something. Even though the Class split needs help.

[Lowlife]

ill burn before i let Cabilis be anything but evil.

Also VZTZ > SZ

[Tassador]

Human necross any good guys?

[Ebony]

Human necross any good guys?

Yes, Human necros are good. Dark Elf/Erudite might be best overall but Humans & the other necro races are right behind them. I'd think a Human necro with say 10% more skill then the other necro would beat the other races just as much as they would if playing another race IMO. So not a huge difference.

[Lowlife]

remove all shared cities, except freeport.

Let freeport be the wildcard-riots in the streets-scum bag city where neutral necros and evil bards come from etc

[Lowlife]

Evil
----
1. Neriak
2. Oggok
3. Grobb
4. Paineel
5. Cabalis

Good
----
1. Felwithe
2. Erudin
3. Halas
4. Kaladim
5. Qeynos

Neut
----
1. Ak'anon
2. Rivervale
3. Kelethin
4. Surefall Glade
5. Freeport

http://cdn-images.hollywood.com/cms/300x375/7120076.jpg

[Kelsar]

Not sure how so many people are SO confused.

Evil
----
1. Neriak
2. Oggok
3. Grobb
4. Paineel
5. Cabalis
6. Freeport (shared with all)
7. Ak'anon (shared with newt)
8. Qeynos (shared with all)

Good
----
1. Felwithe
2. Erudin (Shared with newt)
3. Halas (shared with newt)
4. Qeynos (shared with all)
5. Freeport (shared with all)
6. Kelethin (shared with all)
7. Surefall (shared with newt)
8. Halas (shared with newt)

Neut
----
1. Ak'anon (shared with evil)
2. Rivervale
3. Kelethin (shared with all)
4. Surefall Glade (shared with good)
5. Freeport (shared with all)
6. Kaladim
7. Qeynos (shared with all)
8. Halas (shared with good)
9. Erudin (shared with good)


By continent:
1. Faydwer: Good, newt, evil
2. Antonica: Good, newt, evil
3. Erud: Good, newt, evil

[Versch]

West Antonica - Erudin (w/Paineel), Halas, Qeynos(w/Surefall), Oggok?

East Antonica - Freeport, Rivervale, Grobb, Neriak, Oggok?

Faydwer - Kaladim, Kelethin, Felwithe, Ak'Anon, Cabilis

Allow Human rangers to start in freeport and use the trainer in Kithicor as the GM and all teams have every class. This is no more ridiculous than some of the other suggestions.

[Vamael]

Tallon zek was pretty successful teams, no one xteamed until velious release. I played on tallon zek from the start until about GoD release. People cross teamed anyways, and will for this server. No one will just stack to one side. This opens open so many options for x teaming healers.

[Vamael]

besides who stresses about tanks. we all know its gonna be PET quest. MAge pets druid pets and enchanter pets for everything up to tranix, and phinny. and for major dps for naggy. PET QUEST. Tanks needed for vox....but you can pretty much charm kite fear. Pohate / air is little more tank needed.

[BrobbVZ]

Fuck this Diety thing, go with VZ/TZ Rules. Darks Vs Shorties vs Elfs...

VZ was by far one of the most fun servers to have ever played on and I am glad I did.

[Ebony]

Evil
----
1. Neriak
2. Oggok
3. Grobb
4. Paineel
5. Cabalis

Good
----
1. Felwithe
2. Erudin
3. Halas
4. Kaladim
5. Qeynos

Neut
----
1. Ak'anon
2. Rivervale
3. Kelethin
4. Surefall Glade
5. Freeport

http://cdn-images.hollywood.com/cms/300x375/7120076.jpg

This Team split goes against the 2 points of this thread. All Teams having every needed class & 4 Team only home cities. This Team split has Neut with less home cities & not all Teams have all needed classes. Though it still beats the SZ split easy.

[Ebony]

Not sure how so many people are SO confused.

Evil
----
1. Neriak
2. Oggok
3. Grobb
4. Paineel
5. Cabalis
6. Freeport (shared with all)
7. Ak'anon (shared with newt)
8. Qeynos (shared with all)

Good
----
1. Felwithe
2. Erudin (Shared with newt)
3. Halas (shared with newt)
4. Qeynos (shared with all)
5. Freeport (shared with all)
6. Kelethin (shared with all)
7. Surefall (shared with newt)
8. Halas (shared with newt)

Neut
----
1. Ak'anon (shared with evil)
2. Rivervale
3. Kelethin (shared with all)
4. Surefall Glade (shared with good)
5. Freeport (shared with all)
6. Kaladim
7. Qeynos (shared with all)
8. Halas (shared with good)
9. Erudin (shared with good)


By continent:
1. Faydwer: Good, newt, evil
2. Antonica: Good, newt, evil
3. Erud: Good, newt, evil

That's a Great Joke! That Team Split is so BAD you had me laughing hard ROFL :D

If Sony had tried that on live it would have had the lowest server pop ever, everyone from all the other servers would look down & laugh at anyone player there & it would be the biggest joke ever in EQ history rofl :rolleyes:

[Ebony]

West Antonica - Erudin (w/Paineel), Halas, Qeynos(w/Surefall), Oggok?

East Antonica - Freeport, Rivervale, Grobb, Neriak, Oggok?

Faydwer - Kaladim, Kelethin, Felwithe, Ak'Anon, Cabilis

Allow Human rangers to start in freeport and use the trainer in Kithicor as the GM and all teams have every class. This is no more ridiculous than some of the other suggestions.

That's not bad, I like mine a little better but I'd play this too & it kills SZ teams also.

[Ebony]

Fuck this Diety thing, go with VZ/TZ Rules. Darks Vs Shorties vs Elfs...

VZ was by far one of the most fun servers to have ever played on and I am glad I did.

Yes, VZ/TZ were by FAR the most Fun servers I played on live EQ. :D

[runlvlzero]

I think all the evils should start in plane of fear. And all the goods should start in plane of sky. And all the cities should be turned into undead zones. Maybe make it so Freeport is overrun with undead. Qeynos is invaded by aliens from luclin (flying saucer), and RV is just full of kobolds.

Than we could truly have an epic server.

[Lowlife]

I have been won over to Humans VS Dark VS Shorties+Elves

[liveitup1216]

I think all the evils should start in plane of fear. And all the goods should start in plane of sky. And all the cities should be turned into undead zones. Maybe make it so Freeport is overrun with undead. Qeynos is invaded by aliens from luclin (flying saucer), and RV is just full of kobolds.

Than we could truly have an epic server.

[Ebony]

I think all the evils should start in plane of fear. And all the goods should start in plane of sky. And all the cities should be turned into undead zones. Maybe make it so Freeport is overrun with undead. Qeynos is invaded by aliens from luclin (flying saucer), and RV is just full of kobolds.

Than we could truly have an epic server.

You should code that quick rlz, that way you, who ever the guy with the rainbow unicorn avatar is & the other 3 or 4 have somewhere to play

And the perfect name for that server so everyone knows what to expect:

Sullon Zek (But with FLYING SAUCERS!!1!)

I'm sure Sam will HATE the flying saucers, however it's just ONE non classic SZ change so...

[SamwiseRed]

flying saucer is classic, Rodcet Nife follower here, u mad?

clearly never been to qeynos.

[Kelsar]

Force accounts to an entire faction

[SamwiseRed]

one account per ip/mac address w/e

one team per account

pras

[Lowlife]

one account per ip/mac address w/e

one team per account

pras

pras, people (nihilium) will say how they can build 7 more PCs and box in their basement with 10 phone lines and 4 smart phones to get around it, but thats fine, if your life is that shitty go for it, it would be a reasonable restriction to those of us who have felt breasts irl

[Retti_]

If only there was a way to change ip

[Vexenu]

All the city-based rulesets are silly. Each team on SZ naturally clustered around the cities they controlled. It didn't matter that Evil had numerically more cities, especially since two of them (Grobb & Oggok) are right next to each other and only used for Guk binding melees if anything. What matters is team population, not the numbers of cities naturally controlled.

Also, by limiting Kunark until after server launch, you remove Cabilis and the massive advantage of Evils controlling an entire continent. This is a far bigger impact than anything else that could be done.

[Ebony]

flying saucer is classic, Rodcet Nife follower here, u mad?

clearly never been to qeynos.

Yeah I know about the Saucer in Qeynos, it's the "Aliens from Luclin" in flying saucers I was talking about & that name seemed too long & cumbersome. Plus everyone HATES anything to do with luclin & that could really hurt your server's pop. I was just trying to help. :p

But if you like this better...

And the perfect name for that server so everyone knows what to expect:

Sullon Zek (But with ALIENS FROM LUCLIN IN FLYING SAUCERS!!1!)

I'm sure Sam will HATE the Aliens from Luclin in Flying Saucers, however it's just ONE non classic SZ change so...

Fixed for Sam & Clarity

[Ebony]

I have been won over to Humans VS Dark VS Shorties+Elves

Yeah, there is that glaring missing classes issue for the non Human teams but the added races & Zone control may make up for it AND TZ/VZ were so much FUN on live before the x-teaming a hard coded TZ/VZ could be really Great :D

[SamwiseRed]

the combine and vahshir are from norrath tho :) not aliens.

[Ebony]

the combine and vahshir are from norrath tho :) not aliens.

And that's why "Aliens" are not classic :rolleyes:

[SamwiseRed]

aliens are classic, just not people that live on luclin

[Lowlife]

Nodcet Nife.

http://osanpo.kelethin.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/20121123_rn_1.jpg

Looks like a fucking Alien to me.

[SamwiseRed]

classic

[Ebony]

And that's why "Aliens from luclin" are not classic :rolleyes:

Fixed for Sam and Classic again lol :p

[SamwiseRed]

not saving yourself from this one buddy

[Ebony]

All the city-based rulesets are silly. Each team on SZ naturally clustered around the cities they controlled. It didn't matter that Evil had numerically more cities, especially since two of them (Grobb & Oggok) are right next to each other and only used for Guk binding melees if anything. What matters is team population, not the numbers of cities naturally controlled.

Also, by limiting Kunark until after server launch, you remove Cabilis and the massive advantage of Evils controlling an entire continent. This is a far bigger impact than anything else that could be done.

Kunark was just one problem of many. Three of the evil City/newbie zones were ALL Evil & they could lvl up like they were on a Blue server. Good & Newt were fighting with each other from lvl 1 in most City/newbie zones for neut & fighting in ALL City/newbie zones for Good. That makes a HUGE lvling disadvantage for Good & neut & isn't something you can stop by starting with classic. Either you don't know what you're talking about or you're trying to pretend Kunark was the only huge Flaw in SZ's Team split & that is what's "silly"

Diety could work better but the Devs would HAVE to change some of the Races Diety options, Like say ALL High Elves & Wood Elves follow Tunare. Giving Good Team at least ONE City/newbie area they kinda control like other teams had. Evil having 3 or 4.

It's amazing how much the SZ zealots miss & knowing they only like what they like because that's how Sony did it makes it even more sad if they end up hurting Teams99 also.

The Devs here are really Great & do a LOT of work to let us play free EQ. If they want an SZ server clone that's fine but if there's a chance to change some of the Sony SNAFU's that killed SZ then I'd like to speak up while we have the chance.

I have to go to work now lol :rolleyes:

C U lot Later :)

[pharmakos]

instead of having neutral/evil shared cities for shaman purposes.... just allow Halflings to be Shamans. :)

[runlvlzero]

one account per ip/mac address w/e

one team per account

pras

yissss

flying saucer is classic, Rodcet Nife follower here, u mad?

clearly never been to qeynos.

Samwise knows his stuff. He is going to be the next hobbit god in the next EQNEXT game.

*** I would like the idea of having unicorn mounts for only the good team in order to balance things a bit.

[Kergan]

instead of having neutral/evil shared cities for shaman purposes.... just allow Halflings to be Shamans. :)

While it might solve some problems to open new race/class combos it creates enormous differences with the classic game and presents programming challenges. GMs/trainers/spell vendors, newbie quests, etc. Not to mention modification of lots of items that may be shaman only but only include ogre/iksar/troll/barb as usable racially. It just seems like a ton of effort to add this in without a template to build off of (like halfling rangers/paladins for example, or gnome SKs).

[Dullah]

Create a character /jointeam 1 or /jointeam 2 or /jointeam 3.

Problem solved. Thank me later.

[SamwiseRed]

Create a character /jointeam 1 or /jointeam 2 or /jointeam 3.

Problem solved. Thank me later.

so basically red99 with 3 hard coded guilds. the difference in teams will be what?

[Lowlife]

so basically red99 with 3 hard coded guilds. the difference in teams will be what?

teams 99 and its staff do not revolve around aiding nilly for potential merge complications nor for providing a more beneficial rule set for you, or one that is more to your liking.

[Dullah]

so basically red99 with 3 hard coded guilds. the difference in teams will be what?

Thats just it genius - there is no fucking difference except people within a guild (team) have protection from players on that team... and of course when a small sect within that team decides they want to run the show, the rest of that team gets cut out and forced to use blue mechanics to compete.

[SamwiseRed]

u kinda belong to a zerg, not sure you realize how blue you are

your lack of pvp experience showd

[SamwiseRed]

i think players should be on the teams server round table, they are the ones playing after all and have the most pvp experience

[Aenor]

remove all shared cities, except freeport.

Let freeport be the wildcard-riots in the streets-scum bag city where neutral necros and evil bards come from etc

If you do that, how do you have Shaman on both good and newt teams?

[Ebony]

instead of having neutral/evil shared cities for shaman purposes.... just allow Halflings to be Shamans. :)

Yes, that could work also if the devs like adding classes to races better.

If the Devs don't mind adding a couple classes to more races & we knew we'd have the Pop for a 4 teams server...

A Hard Coded Tallon Zek/Vallon Zek server with better Class Balance among teams would be AWESOME!

Human Team is good as is with all classes

Add Gnome SK, Gnome Monk, Halfling Bard & Halfling Shaman to Short

Add Half Elf SK, Half Elf Shaman & Wood Elf Monk to Elves

Dark Team is OP with 4 races but you could add Dark Elf Bards if you wanted.

That would be a Really Fun server! :D

[Kergan]

Yes, that could work also if the devs like adding classes to races better.

If the Devs don't mind adding a couple classes to more races & we knew we'd have the Pop for a 4 teams server...

A Hard Coded Tallon Zek/Vallon Zek server with better Class Balance among teams would be AWESOME!

Human Team is good as is with all classes

Add Gnome SK, Gnome Monk, Halfling Bard & Halfling Shaman to Short

Add Half Elf SK, Half Elf Shaman & Wood Elf Monk to Elves

Dark Team is OP with 4 races but you could add Dark Elf Bards if you wanted.

That would be a Really Fun server! :D

It would be helpful to know if the devs will even consider this option, as it would require moving miles away from classic EQ.

It doesn't solve a lot of the team balance issues though, as all the inherent locational and statistical bonuses continue to apply for the evil team. Iksar impact is massively downplayed if you release pre-kunark only on a timeline though, to the point it is negligible. However, you're removing monks from the evil team until Kunark then without other modifications.

So essentially you'd have to add the following things, assuming the teams break down how you outlined above:

SK, necro, monk, shaman to elf team
SK, monk, bard to short team
Monk and bard to evil team
Druid to humans

That is 10 new combos, a LOT of work.

Also, I think 4 teams is too much.

[pharmakos]

zomg i just marked out so hard at the thought of Gnome Monk

[Vexenu]

I think it's obvious how these custom team ideas get more and more ridiculous when you actually drill down on them and try to make them balanced.

Gnome monks? Halfling Shamans?

And people tell me that buffing starting stats of Good races is too extreme?

SZ teams with minor tweaks remains the best option by a mile.

[pharmakos]

i still think it should just be boys vs. girls

[runlvlzero]

i still think it should just be boys vs. girls

Boys vs Girls vs Transgendered for 3 teams.

[Kergan]

The minor tweaks are the hard part though. Elegant ideas are more difficult to come up with then crushing the problem with a sledgehammer.

Plus, there isn't even a consensus if some of the problems are problems at all. On top of that without knowing how teams would be divided we don't know what the problems even are yet. But it's sort of a catch 22, you create the teams to try to solve the balance problems, but no matter how you divide the teams up (aside from just having people pick a team and get a different color nametag) you create a different set of balance issues.

You can't just do SZ, give good/neutral some summon corpse potions and call it good. That still does nothing to overcome the racial stat and location superiority posses by the evil team, not to mention they have the only three races that have in-combat based racial abilities (stun immunity, regen). There is no debate, ogres/trolls/iksars are top 3 in every class they can choose. Does buffing up stats solve the problem? I don't know, I guess that is one thing to be debated.

[runlvlzero]

The minor tweaks are the hard part though. Elegant ideas are more difficult to come up with then crushing the problem with a sledgehammer.

Plus, there isn't even a consensus if some of the problems are problems at all. On top of that without knowing how teams would be divided we don't know what the problems even are yet. But it's sort of a catch 22, you create the teams to try to solve the balance problems, but no matter how you divide the teams up (aside from just having people pick a team and get a different color nametag) you create a different set of balance issues.

You can't just do SZ, give good/neutral some summon corpse potions and call it good. That still does nothing to overcome the racial stat and location superiority posses by the evil team, not to mention they have the only three races that have in-combat based racial abilities (stun immunity, regen). There is no debate, ogres/trolls/iksars are top 3 in every class they can choose. Does buffing up stats solve the problem? I don't know, I guess that is one thing to be debated.

I agree with kergans perspective here. Balancing EQ via teams is a bad idea. At least I gather that.

But I think basing teams off of a city vs a racial/religious alignment would be funner than an SZ style system.

I really don't have a problem with some ogres on the good team having to earn faction, and some on the bad team. There's an ogre that hates dark elves in EFP at the docks at the bar. There's a troll on Mithaniel Marrs good side in HHK. It seems fine to just do it that way.

[pharmakos]

^ gives me an idea

would take a lot of work to implement, but it would be neat if there were quests you could do to team jump.

like, an Ogre SK could be on the good team if he farmed enough shit for the Temple of Marr

[Grumppygregsz]

Not everyone immediately chooses ogres or trolls when given the opportunity. They do have weaknesses. A. They are huge and unwieldy, especially in smaller dungeons if they don't have access to shrink. B. They are universally hated everywhere outside of their home cities. Faction can be very useful especially in low-mid level pvp. C. They also incur racial experience penalties, assuming the team is keeping those in place. I think its ridiculous that so many are in an uproar over limiting ogres and trolls to one team. They belong on evil, plain and simple, assuming the team goes the way of alignment/religion separation.

[Tassador]

you learn a lot about nothing in these forums, yet it is toe tingling fun.

[pharmakos]

like drinking light beer

it doesn't get you drunk, it just fills you up

[Aenor]

clearly never been to qeynos.

[Kergan]

^ gives me an idea

would take a lot of work to implement, but it would be neat if there were quests you could do to team jump.

like, an Ogre SK could be on the good team if he farmed enough shit for the Temple of Marr

I posted this in another thread. It's how EQ2 worked. There were two teams (Freeport vs Qeynos). You could betray your team and ended up in a third faction that was KOS to both sides until you finished the betrayal quest. The in between team could attack anyone, even their own team.

[Aenor]

Add Gnome SK, Gnome Monk...

Stopped reading...

[Smedy]

heres my idea for teams, and its the best one

pick team when you start your character, customized buttons in character create with team 1, team 2, team 3

pick any character, any race , any class, any diety combo, play on that team.

no balance issues, teams server. working as intended, not classic, but fuck classic and brad mquaids silly sodomy humor, no one wants to relive the frustration of grinding 3 hours to get 1% xp

[Ebony]

Stopped reading...

Stopped thinking Aenor was smart :p

That was obviously a for Fun server, like a lot of people are posting. I think we all are sure the Devs aren't planning to add all those race/class combos & it seems harder to code then the normal Race/City based servers. It has nothing to do with the City based server setup the thread is about if you couldn't tell.