FSI is overrated garb

[Allishia]

Originally Posted by bobjonesp99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i main a gnome warrior and id never change that to be a big ugly ogre.

that said, you cant drink wort/bark pots when youre stunned.

reducing your chances of being stunned is pretty valuable as a raid tank.

Ogres try to push this fsi thing like it matters but it doesn't, not even a little bit. Tanked and instant engaged everything (that a war can) in game (except warders) and never had an issue chugging wort pots or hitting reaper. Play what you like /nod.

[ya.dingus]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hehe unfortunately you won't be getting that award. OP is really talking about Shamans. He is bringing a conversation from the Priest forums over to here for some strange reason. I guess he didn't think the discussion was getting enough attention since it was off topic from the thread at hand. It became off topic due to him.

To further expand upon how FSI should work, I have included some code from the EQEMU GitHub within the spoiler below. The important code is marked in bold:

 

		bool can_stun = false;
		int stunbash_chance = 0; // bonus
		if (attacker) {
			if (skill_used == EQ::skills::SkillBash) {
				can_stun = true;
				if (attacker->IsClient())
					stunbash_chance = attacker->spellbonuses.StunBashChance +
					attacker->itembonuses.StunBashChance +
					attacker->aabonuses.StunBashChance;
			}
			else if (skill_used == EQ::skills::SkillKick &&
				(attacker->GetLevel() > 55 || attacker->IsNPC()) && GetClass() == WARRIOR) {
				can_stun = true;
			}

			bool is_immune_to_frontal_stun = false;

			if (IsBot() || IsClient() || IsMerc()) {
				if (
					IsPlayerClass(GetClass()) &&
					RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityClasses) & GetPlayerClassBit(GetClass())
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}


				if (
					(
						IsPlayerRace(GetBaseRace()) &&
						RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityRaces) & GetPlayerRaceBit(GetBaseRace())
					) ||
					GetBaseRace() == RACE_OGGOK_CITIZEN_93
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}
			} else if (IsNPC()) {
				if (
					RuleB(Combat, NPCsUseFrontalStunImmunityClasses) &&
					IsPlayerClass(GetClass()) &&
					RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityClasses) & GetPlayerClassBit(GetClass())
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}

				if (
					RuleB(Combat, NPCsUseFrontalStunImmunityRaces) &&
					(
						(
							IsPlayerRace(GetBaseRace()) &&
							RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityRaces) & GetPlayerRaceBit(GetBaseRace())
						) ||
						GetBaseRace() == RACE_OGGOK_CITIZEN_93
					)
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}
			}

			if (
				is_immune_to_frontal_stun &&
				!attacker->BehindMob(this, attacker->GetX(), attacker->GetY())
			) {
				can_stun = false;
			}

			if (GetSpecialAbility(UNSTUNABLE)) {
				can_stun = false;
			}
		}
		if (can_stun) {
			int bashsave_roll = zone->random.Int(0, 100);
			if (bashsave_roll > 98 || bashsave_roll > (55 - stunbash_chance)) {
				// did stun -- roll other resists
				// SE_FrontalStunResist description says any angle now a days
				int stun_resist2 = spellbonuses.FrontalStunResist + itembonuses.FrontalStunResist +
					aabonuses.FrontalStunResist;
				if (zone->random.Int(1, 100) > stun_resist2) {
					// stun resist 2 failed
					// time to check SE_StunResist and mod2 stun resist
					int stun_resist =
						spellbonuses.StunResist + itembonuses.StunResist + aabonuses.StunResist;
					if (zone->random.Int(0, 100) >= stun_resist) {
						// did stun
						// nothing else to check!
						Stun(2000); // straight 2 seconds every time
					}
					else {
						// stun resist passed!
						if (IsClient())
							MessageString(Chat::Stun, SHAKE_OFF_STUN);
					}
				}
				else {
					// stun resist 2 passed!
					if (IsClient())
						MessageString(Chat::Stun, AVOID_STUNNING_BLOW);
				}
			}
			else {
				// main stun failed -- extra interrupt roll
				if (IsCasting() &&
					!EQ::ValueWithin(casting_spell_id, 859, 1023)) // these spells are excluded
																	  // 90% chance >< -- stun immune won't reach this branch though :(
					if (zone->random.Int(0, 9) > 1)
						InterruptSpell();
			}
		}

		if (spell_id != SPELL_UNKNOWN && !iBuffTic) {
			//see if root will break
			if (IsRooted() && !FromDamageShield)  // neotoyko: only spells cancel root
				TryRootFadeByDamage(buffslot, attacker);
		}
		else if (spell_id == SPELL_UNKNOWN)
		{
			//increment chances of interrupting
			if (IsCasting()) { //shouldnt interrupt on regular spell damage
				attacked_count++;
				LogCombat("Melee attack while casting. Attack count [{}]", attacked_count);
			}
		}

As you can see, if you have FSI, the stun and extra interrupt check are bypassed completely. There is no other code in this function that calls the InterruptSpell() function. This means there is no special code to force interrupt a spell after a stun has been resisted via FSI.

Now, people are going to say "P99 has custom code changes that aren't in the EQEMU repository!", and that is true. But P99 is based on this code, and P99 didn't change every single line of code. If you want to claim that spells always get interrupted after FSI prevents a stun, you need to provide evidence to suggest the P99 developers changed this portion of code. Finding a discussion based on FSI where the developers contributed would be a great piece of evidence to suggest they at least looked at this section of code and made a decision about it. I haven't seen that, but I haven't scoured the forums either.

When it comes to Monks/Shadowknights/Warriors, racial Regeneration is a much bigger helper when it comes to soloing. It will significantly reduce your down times. Outside of soloing, it doesn't really do much. Most racials operate this way: you get the best utility from them when soloing, and lose most of their utility outside of that. FSI is specifically very good for Shamans, because it can save you during the pre-slow period of the fight (the first minute or so), where racial Regeneration is just too slow to save you. You will get a total of 80HP in that minute. When fighting mobs that hit for 140+, that isn't even 1 hit saved. Once the mob is slowed, no racial really matters since the fight is under control, barring any extreme exceptions like getting attacked by other mobs or something.

Is that C or C++ it's hideous looking.

[ya.dingus]

If you're at 10% hp on a failed FD split, you know that regen makes life way easier when you're separated from the group.

Like, way easier. Don't have to wait a billion years or take a risky pop if you just squat for a while and let that 2x regen kick in.

That said, I'm making an erudite SK on green, IDGAF anymore. I want to be fashionquest all the way.

[Jimjam]

 

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hehe unfortunately you won't be getting that award. OP is really talking about Shamans. He is bringing a conversation from the Priest forums over to here for some strange reason. I guess he didn't think the discussion was getting enough attention since it was off topic from the thread at hand. It became off topic due to him.

To further expand upon how FSI should work, I have included some code from the EQEMU GitHub within the spoiler below. The important code is marked in bold:

 

		bool can_stun = false;
		int stunbash_chance = 0; // bonus
		if (attacker) {
			if (skill_used == EQ::skills::SkillBash) {
				can_stun = true;
				if (attacker->IsClient())
					stunbash_chance = attacker->spellbonuses.StunBashChance +
					attacker->itembonuses.StunBashChance +
					attacker->aabonuses.StunBashChance;
			}
			else if (skill_used == EQ::skills::SkillKick &&
				(attacker->GetLevel() > 55 || attacker->IsNPC()) && GetClass() == WARRIOR) {
				can_stun = true;
			}

			bool is_immune_to_frontal_stun = false;

			if (IsBot() || IsClient() || IsMerc()) {
				if (
					IsPlayerClass(GetClass()) &&
					RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityClasses) & GetPlayerClassBit(GetClass())
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}


				if (
					(
						IsPlayerRace(GetBaseRace()) &&
						RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityRaces) & GetPlayerRaceBit(GetBaseRace())
					) ||
					GetBaseRace() == RACE_OGGOK_CITIZEN_93
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}
			} else if (IsNPC()) {
				if (
					RuleB(Combat, NPCsUseFrontalStunImmunityClasses) &&
					IsPlayerClass(GetClass()) &&
					RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityClasses) & GetPlayerClassBit(GetClass())
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}

				if (
					RuleB(Combat, NPCsUseFrontalStunImmunityRaces) &&
					(
						(
							IsPlayerRace(GetBaseRace()) &&
							RuleI(Combat, FrontalStunImmunityRaces) & GetPlayerRaceBit(GetBaseRace())
						) ||
						GetBaseRace() == RACE_OGGOK_CITIZEN_93
					)
				) {
					is_immune_to_frontal_stun = true;
				}
			}

			if (
				is_immune_to_frontal_stun &&
				!attacker->BehindMob(this, attacker->GetX(), attacker->GetY())
			) {
				can_stun = false;
			}

			if (GetSpecialAbility(UNSTUNABLE)) {
				can_stun = false;
			}
		}
		if (can_stun) {
			int bashsave_roll = zone->random.Int(0, 100);
			if (bashsave_roll > 98 || bashsave_roll > (55 - stunbash_chance)) {
				// did stun -- roll other resists
				// SE_FrontalStunResist description says any angle now a days
				int stun_resist2 = spellbonuses.FrontalStunResist + itembonuses.FrontalStunResist +
					aabonuses.FrontalStunResist;
				if (zone->random.Int(1, 100) > stun_resist2) {
					// stun resist 2 failed
					// time to check SE_StunResist and mod2 stun resist
					int stun_resist =
						spellbonuses.StunResist + itembonuses.StunResist + aabonuses.StunResist;
					if (zone->random.Int(0, 100) >= stun_resist) {
						// did stun
						// nothing else to check!
						Stun(2000); // straight 2 seconds every time
					}
					else {
						// stun resist passed!
						if (IsClient())
							MessageString(Chat::Stun, SHAKE_OFF_STUN);
					}
				}
				else {
					// stun resist 2 passed!
					if (IsClient())
						MessageString(Chat::Stun, AVOID_STUNNING_BLOW);
				}
			}
			else {
				// main stun failed -- extra interrupt roll
				if (IsCasting() &&
					!EQ::ValueWithin(casting_spell_id, 859, 1023)) // these spells are excluded
																	  // 90% chance >< -- stun immune won't reach this branch though :(
					if (zone->random.Int(0, 9) > 1)
						InterruptSpell();
			}
		}

		if (spell_id != SPELL_UNKNOWN && !iBuffTic) {
			//see if root will break
			if (IsRooted() && !FromDamageShield)  // neotoyko: only spells cancel root
				TryRootFadeByDamage(buffslot, attacker);
		}
		else if (spell_id == SPELL_UNKNOWN)
		{
			//increment chances of interrupting
			if (IsCasting()) { //shouldnt interrupt on regular spell damage
				attacked_count++;
				LogCombat("Melee attack while casting. Attack count [{}]", attacked_count);
			}
		}

As you can see, if you have FSI, the stun and extra interrupt check are bypassed completely. There is no other code in this function that calls the InterruptSpell() function. This means there is no special code to force interrupt a spell after a stun has been resisted via FSI.

Now, people are going to say "P99 has custom code changes that aren't in the EQEMU repository!", and that is true. But P99 is based on this code, and P99 didn't change every single line of code. If you want to claim that spells always get interrupted after FSI prevents a stun, you need to provide evidence to suggest the P99 developers changed this portion of code. Finding a discussion based on FSI where the developers contributed would be a great piece of evidence to suggest they at least looked at this section of code and made a decision about it. I haven't seen that, but I haven't scoured the forums either.

When it comes to Monks/Shadowknights/Warriors, racial Regeneration is a much bigger helper when it comes to soloing. It will significantly reduce your down times. Outside of soloing, it doesn't really do much. Most racials operate this way: you get the best utility from them when soloing, and lose most of their utility outside of that. FSI is specifically very good for Shamans, because it can save you during the pre-slow period of the fight (the first minute or so), where racial Regeneration is just too slow to save you. You will get a total of 80HP in that minute. When fighting mobs that hit for 140+, that isn't even 1 hit saved. Once the mob is slowed, no racial really matters since the fight is under control, barring any extreme exceptions like getting attacked by other mobs or something.

Even eq emu isn’t classic. Classic eq was janky!

The way bypassing stun checks in classic would work often returned an autointerrupt.

I think the best known one is landing a bash on a giant with a rune would auto interrupt it (because no stun check and no damage done bypassed all the checks so eq went ‘herp derp no checks passed so spell casting is interrupted).

FSI on a sk that would use rune for aggro/damage absorb was actually a draw back!

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by ya.dingus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you're at 10% hp on a failed FD split, you know that regen makes life way easier when you're separated from the group.

Like, way easier. Don't have to wait a billion years or take a risky pop if you just squat for a while and let that 2x regen kick in.

That said, I'm making an erudite SK on green, IDGAF anymore. I want to be fashionquest all the way.

The trick with an erud is to blame every resisted slow, snare, root, stun, charm, etc on that +5 sv magic and be like “an ogre wouldn’t have resisted that (:”.

[Snaggles]

Or the very likely getting stuck in a hallway or zone exit while you die ironically trying to flee and getting stunned.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by bobjonesp99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i main a gnome warrior and id never change that to be a big ugly ogre.

that said, you cant drink wort/bark pots when youre stunned.

reducing your chances of being stunned is pretty valuable as a raid tank.

i have an ogre warrior that i wish was gnome or halfling

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i have an ogre warrior that i wish was gnome or halfling

It’s not the same with nerfs to sneak pulling, 360 sow speed sneak, etc

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by ya.dingus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Is that C or C++ it's hideous looking.

It's C++, but I agree I am not a fan of the coding style lol.

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

 

Even eq emu isn’t classic. Classic eq was janky!

The way bypassing stun checks in classic would work often returned an autointerrupt.

I think the best known one is landing a bash on a giant with a rune would auto interrupt it (because no stun check and no damage done bypassed all the checks so eq went ‘herp derp no checks passed so spell casting is interrupted).

FSI on a sk that would use rune for aggro/damage absorb was actually a draw back!

Of course EQEMU isn't classic. But that is what we have to work with, and that is the codebase P99 is based off of. I don't think we will ever get the actual server-side codebase for a build of Everquest in the Classic-Velious era. EQEMU is basically rebuilt from the ground up using packet sniffers as far as I am aware.

I am simply pointing out that the EQEMU codebase doesn't have special spell interrupt code for stuns specifically resisted by FSI. Occam's razor is currently on my side, since the assumption should be the code hasn't changed significantly. Until P99 releases the source code we will never know for sure, but if someone wants to assert the code works differently, they will need to provide some evidence as to why they think that. As I said, a thread discussing FSI where a developer responded would show they were at least thinking about changing the code. Or perhaps patch notes discussing FSI.

[Sizar]

Originally Posted by Encroaching Death [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Regen doesn't really do anything past level 20.

Never used a fungi? They must be a real bad item in your view then