Ranking top 20 War Agro Weapons (any zone)

[Naethyn]

White damage doesn't hold aggro against top end dps with many players. You absolutely have to land procs and let people know when you land them. Weapons sub 20 delay also increase the amount of reposts you experience by a large margin. Think about how many 100 hp items do you need to survive one extra repost. Sure, in small man content with suboptimal dps you may find that white damage is enough. Grouping for example you can use a 2H if you have a better haste item. Many times during fights I'm turning off attack if I see a gap in the chain because I don't want to eat an extra repost and it makes a huge difference. Damage here is very predictable, reposts increase that unpredictability by a large margin. If you can hold damage with white aggro its almost always because dps is not going all out, or you are with people who are not top tier.

[Eisai]

Thanks for all these great posts. Learning a lot about the factors to consider for each type of encounter.

[AEH84]

Originally Posted by Naethyn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

White damage doesn't hold aggro against top end dps with many players. You absolutely have to land procs and let people know when you land them. Weapons sub 20 delay also increase the amount of reposts you experience by a large margin. Think about how many 100 hp items do you need to survive one extra repost. Sure, in small man content with suboptimal dps you may find that white damage is enough. Grouping for example you can use a 2H if you have a better haste item. Many times during fights I'm turning off attack if I see a gap in the chain because I don't want to eat an extra repost and it makes a huge difference. Damage here is very predictable, reposts increase that unpredictability by a large margin. If you can hold damage with white aggro its almost always because dps is not going all out, or you are with people who are not top tier.

I don’t disagree with anything you’re saying. I guess I just look at each weapon having 3 aspects: white hate, proc hate, and stats. If you have a couple weapons that hit two out of three you’re probably in good shape. If proc was the only thing that mattered, this would be a simple answer. Every tank would have a WESS main hand and a red blade in their off hand. I just think it’s a little more intricate than that. If we are going to make a list of the top 20 aggro weapons I find it hard to believe Kflame isn’t on it.

[Naethyn]

The comparison was kflame to trident.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by AEH84 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I’m receptive to this, I’d just like to hear why. I gave some decent reasons why I thought it was on par with trident and haven’t heard anything besides the point about being stunned that would give me reason to reconsider. I really have no vested interest in Kflame, I just want to optimize my aggro setup.

It is not on par with trident, red epic, or willsapper. To what degree it is behind, math facts exist on these forums in other threads that give a break down. Feel free to search.

White threat alone isn’t going to keep a warrior on top. Rangers can use the same white threat weapons and have access to others that are even better (baton of flame). Monks? Much better ratios are possible.

Procs are what allow us to get and stay ahead. Some of the nicest non-threat weapons will work well enough in the offhand for mundane stuff.

Trident or willsapper are in a completely different league compared to Kflame with regards to threat. White threat is important but I think you are overestimating the degree to which a high end 1hander generate more swing threat compared to 13/20 or 14/22.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by AEH84 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

. If proc was the only thing that mattered, this would be a simple answer. Every tank would have a WESS main hand and a red blade in their off hand.

WESS was nerfed HARD. It now does 400 threat per proc and has a crappy ratio to boot. Prior to the broad changes to threat … at 2000 (or more stacking all the sub components of the proc) … it was game breakingly overpowered.

For now it has a middling potency aggro proc and a sub 0.5 ratio (11/23?).

It ranks fairly lowish on the threat list now.

Edit: if you are looking to optimize a high white threat approach but still have good proc potential I would recommend looking into Frostreaver. 42/43 2hander with a 125dd + stun proc. I used it for a long time and still do when the mood strikes. Compared to WS + Red I find it VERY competitive.

-WS/red will perform stronger when you have average to above average luck with procs.
-FR performs better when procs are less lucky.

As both setups perform perfectly well with average or above proc luck, you could make the case FR is actually ideal as it works better in the unlucky moments? It does do quite a bit more dps to boot and a whole hell of a lot fewer ripostes.

[Naethyn]

/gu ASSIST >> %T <<

[AEH84]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

WESS was nerfed HARD. It now does 400 threat per proc and has a crappy ratio to boot. Prior to the broad changes to threat … at 2000 (or more stacking all the sub components of the proc) … it was game breakingly overpowered.

For now it has a middling potency aggro proc and a sub 0.5 ratio (11/23?).

It ranks fairly lowish on the threat list now.

Edit: if you are looking to optimize a high white threat approach but still have good proc potential I would recommend looking into Frostreaver. 42/43 2hander with a 125dd + stun proc. I used it for a long time and still do when the mood strikes. Compared to WS + Red I find it VERY competitive.

-WS/red will perform stronger when you have average to above average luck with procs.
-FR performs better when procs are less lucky.

As both setups perform perfectly well with average or above proc luck, you could make the case FR is actually ideal as it works better in the unlucky moments? It does do quite a bit more dps to boot and a whole hell of a lot fewer ripostes.

I don’t believe you’re correct about the WESS. As far as I can tell, it’s an 800 Aggro proc. As far as I can tell it’s 400 for the -ATK and 400 for the blind making it a pretty potent proc.

[Naethyn]

I have had trident dot tick turn a mob I wasn’t attacking.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by AEH84 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don’t believe you’re correct about the WESS. As far as I can tell, it’s an 800 Aggro proc. As far as I can tell it’s 400 for the -ATK and 400 for the blind making it a pretty potent proc.

I am pretty sure I am not wrong but am willing to admit I possibly could be. I used/abused it like mad before the nerf. I played around with it a lot after the nerf and still carry one around in my bag to play with.

I get that they are supposedly separate SPAs and this should be factored separately but ever real world time I’ve busted it out … the gas simply is not in the tank to support it. Red epic at 600 threat per proc has a really potent punch. I just have not seen anything to support that nerfed whip to put out a whopping 200 more than red blade.

Proc for proc it feels about as strong as willsapper currently … only with a far inferior ratio so functionally much worse. If anyone has actual hardcore data-based testing to show otherwise I am all ears. Before the aggro change, infestation at 900 threat a proc ran circles around red epic and willsapper. If WESS is actually 800 per (only 100 behind where infestation was) … that would be pretty noticeable.