Game Mechanics: SK's Aggro Spells Not Working

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https://web.archive.org/web/20020703...icID=127.topic

Maldar
Registered User
Posts: 54
(5/10/02 2:38:48 pm)
Reply Disease Cloud Problems
I was in the deep last night with some guildies, where I noticed that keeping aggro seemed to be more difficult. After reading the SK boards this afternoon, I found out why:

forums.shadowknight.org/s...eadid=1544

It seems that the last patch decreased taunt for disease spells, making disease cloud less effective as an aggro builder. Interesting this is that the SK community is now discussing that problem with Absor on the SK boards.

Stay tuned, this one could be interesting . . .

Maldar Nyteblade

Teir'Dal Revenant of the 59th Skull

Diabolical Curse Generator
The Diabolical Curse Generator - Get yours!!!

Daelem
Registered User
Posts: 203
(5/12/02 3:18:08 pm)
Reply Re: Disease Cloud Problems
Yeah, I just went over and posted under it. I think it was BS. While I know it wasn't an intentional nerf, VI refuseing to do anything about it practically makes it intentional. Absors 3 line posts piss me off, I would harmtouch him but hes 300% fortifyed with BS therefor until I am lvl 65 my harmtouch won't overcome his MR..

Frued
Registered User
Posts: 48
(5/13/02 11:22:26 am)
Reply Re: Disease Cloud Problems
This unintentional nerf is going to cause alot of problems for me when there is no Enchanter/Bard in my group.
My INT is pretty low (85) hence my surname. I hope something is done soon otherwise I will be OOM all the time and no one will care until there dead.
CD,SV.and Heart Flutter just ain't DC.

Frued NoEinstein
Corpse for Rallos Zek
Undead Member of Tranquil Domain
Ogre Reaver

Edited by: Frued at: 5/15/02 9:56:02 am

https://web.archive.org/web/20040513...x?PostID=31745

Re: I dont WANT da agro.. YOU keep it! 4/1/2004 5:03:22 PM (Total replies: 1)
Disease Cloud used to be very cheap aggro spell for SKs. Then they added Disease counters to slows for shamans, chanters, and beastlords, so that they couldn't be dispelled, only cured with cure disease. This resulted in so much aggro from slows, that casting them early enough in the fight to be useful ensured that the slower was tanking. The fix? Make disease counters very low aggro. End result? The end of cheap aggro generation by SKs via Disease Cloud.

https://web.archive.org/web/20020724...ID=15866.topic

zagzal
Noble Squire
Posts: 5
(6/21/02 7:20:28 am)
Reply
Re: are paladins tanks or not?.
Well well well lookie here another class envy SK who has no clue on what the subject of the thread was in the first place

Listen up SK boy it's about pallys tanking ring a bell in that clouded mind of yours? ( look above)

Aggro control Facts ( ready?) (yes i am ready)

1)FOL always out taunted your pre nerf disease cloud ( i was in a group once and out taunted two of you chain casting FOL) ( You know it and I know it thats a damn lie, Pre nerf DC owned everything, There is no way a pally could out taunt me when DC was working)

2) now nerfed(cloud) chain stun's is all it takes to keep aggro on us and off you. ( we have other spells Clinging darkness, and our ac taps)

3) and this is a solid fact (ready?) you have only fought pallys that don't know what there doing . ( hmm i have beat some of the uberst poeple lol who knew how to fight)

sorry to shatter your hopes and dreams but hey theres still time to make a pally and lvl him up before eq3). ( sorry but sk forever :b)
Edited by: zagzal at: 6/21/02 7:21:18 am

https://web.archive.org/web/20021030...topic&index=36

Lord Stryph
Young Grasshoppah
Posts: 1
(10/13/02 8:18:50 am)
Reply
ezSupporter

Re: .
I won't go claiming I know all the aspects about monks. I don't play one. I play an SK. What I will do though is show you guys that it's not nearly as bad as you think it is.

SKs got an agro shaft a few months back. Starting with disease cloud, then they worked down the line through shadow vortex and shroud of pain. This right here nearly crippled our taunting abilities. Only the darkness line (Which is resisted 50% of the time in raid situations anyways) and Heart Flutter/Asytole are useful as taunt spells.

"But SKs got new taunt spells, they give you great agro abilities stop whining!!"....Eh no. The terror line is completly useless. It has to be cast within melee range, can't be used very well to peel anything more then melee range off of casters and the agro it gives isin't even all that high. They also created multiple versions of this for a reason, because even terror of death which you have to use from 53-59 is useless on anything over level 54 or so.

The voice line is moderatly useful, adding 6%-10% hate per hit or cast in 50-60 raid situations. This helps us maintain agro better, but still does nothing for our peeling abilties.

SK's tanking roles are similar to a warrior, they have screamed, bitched, whined, moaned, and complained that we can tank just as good or better as they can. Hell me personally I'll take a 250 skill in 1hs and 2hs, lower my defense back to 230, take my pet away and give me dual wield. But wait, were defensive tanks without any sort of defensive discipline that is useful beyond 15 seconds and even then it takes 72 minutes to use it again. Only after YEARS of arguing with developers and people like Absor did we get Harmshield (18 seconds of invulnerability).

So sure, we can MA, we can split tank, tank mezz...but without that agro ability we use to have, might as well permenantly assign a Paladin to do the job for us since they can use a level 9 spell to gain massive agro, but we can't.

I could continue with from here and create a huge amount of broken aspects of the SK class, but that'd take A) To much time B) To much space and C) I'm to lazy to type all that out.

My point of all this rambling? The hits you guys are taking isint nearly as bad as some classes that have been nearly beaten to death by the nerf zweinhander.

Personally I agree with what they did, but I also agree they could have made changes to the warrior class instead of doing what they did, giving the monks the tranq staff up the rear. Blame VI for screwing you guys, not the warriors for it.
Stryph Painscale
58th Revenant of Cabilis, Wielder of Greenmist
Unguilded
Ex-Scale, Lord of Pain

Edited by: Lord Stryph at: 10/13/02 8:26:27 am

https://web.archive.org/web/20020830...picID=26.topic

Kezmer
l33t board camper
Posts: 250
(6/2/02 7:11:34 am)
Reply
Re: Highest Taunting Weapons
LOL we need some weapon that procs that SHITTY ass lvl 9 SK disease cloud... my god that crapp lvl 9 spell out taunts anything.. heard they nerfed it but still


Kez
Kezmer Dahoss

https://web.archive.org/web/20020617...topic&index=58

sob gyer
Knight Saber
Posts: 167
(5/25/02 7:10:45 pm)
Reply Re: ...
This is a serious question - wtf does "proxor" mean??? (Is it American slang for sumthin? I'm British...)

Vengyr Soulstorm 58 sk
Gyer Ogunstorm 54 druid
NINE CLOUDS

P.S. I agree with Yesnomaybeso, SKs suck. The bastards nerfed Disease Cloud.
*CRY*
Edited by: sob gyer at: 5/25/02 7:19:25 pm

[Ennewi]

https://project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175

#1
Old 10-22-2009, 04:50 AM
Danth Danth is offline
Planar Protector


Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,381
Default Flash of Light
Thanks for the recent changes to Flash of Light. The blindness effect now works almost exactly as I remember.

What doesn't seem the same--and the reason I'm posting this thread (a continuation of the thread from the old forums)--is the aggro generated by this spell. Specifically, it feels too low. This is a spell which was second only to a Shadow Knight's Disease Cloud for massive threat generation, and not that far behind. Flash was so strong for threat that it remained useful into the PoP era.

On P1999, however, Flash of Light appears to generate less threat than a single cast of 'expulse undead' (my wife will pull aggro if we each cast one spell, me Flash, and her Expulse). Overall it seems to generate much less threat than I remember; in some cases I've spammed the spell half a dozen times in a row or more and still lost aggro to a groupmate. That experience in no way correlates to anything that I recall from my previous Paladins; only an SK spamming Disease Cloud could out-threat Flash. Flash should generate such substantial threat that a few casts (at most) ought to be sufficient to ensure aggro for the duration of a typical-length encounter even against nuke-happy wizards. In some cases, just a single cast was sufficient to pull off a Warrior who had been building aggro for significant time.

I'm afraid I can't provide hard numbers. Use of this spell was always something of a mysterious art, rather than science. I speak from my experience on many Paladin characters as a dedicated player of the class. I do not expect things to be 100% identical to Live on this server; if it could be made 'close enough' that'd be satisfactory to me.

Danth

[Ennewi]

https://web.archive.org/web/20020107...adowknight.htm

General information about ShadowKnight.

Data Comment Update
Weapons List of Abominable Weapons. 2001/09/03
Armors A list of cursed armor. 2001/08/22
Shields A list of bloody shields. 2001/06/09
Stats A list of hidden abilities. 2001/05/30
Spells A list of evil spells. 2001/06/12
Tips Comment Update
Shadow Knight What kind of class is SHD? 2001/07/01
Jobs Regarding the work of SHD in general. 2001/05/14
pull Regarding Pull, which is SHD's representative work. 2001/05/14
SoV Armor A comparison of the performance of the three SoV Armors. 2001/06/28

https://web.archive.org/web/20020113...ght/spells.htm

"Disease Cloud" is also a good spell for Taunt. Even at High Level, the specification frequency is high.

[Ennewi]

https://web.archive.org/web/20020111...cID=5713.topic

Enyk
Newbie
Posts: 23
(12/24/01 7:14:10 am)
Re: Serious question about agro management (for tanks)
So, if Tash is a great taunt, and procs are a great taunt...does that mean the Jman's Walking Stick is a decent weapon then?

(Yeah, the 9/25 one that procs Tash.)

Just wondering...

-Enyk

EQFranko
Dragon chew toy
Posts: 470
(12/24/01 7:17:43 am)
Re: Serious question about agro management (for tanks)
SK = taunt.

Nice 1st level necro spell called disease cloud, drives mobs nuts for some reason.
El Guapo
Mayor of Rivervale
Endorean

Lord Have Mercy
He of the Nifty Name
Posts: 2739
(12/24/01 7:49:03 am)

Re: Serious question about agro management (for tanks)
because it debuffs thier natural regen.

Cyon S Fayte
knows that Warriors are Superior
Posts: 6
(4/9/02 12:10:25 pm)
Reply Re: re
I do understand that it is a minute buff if that. Just seeing that if it could generate agro once the mob has been engaged, items like the cobalt vam's or staff of shielding or things of that nature could improve our taunting ability.

I find it really hard to gain agro over a shadow knight that likes to dot the mobs to hell, and that damn disease cloud is hellish on agro. I am just trying to find ways to keep the mob on me and not the mob.

That Wizard quest that gains you a instant cold/fire debuff on the mob would be ideal for stealing agro. Just right click the hell out of it to keep the mob on you. Just got me thinking, thanks for the responses.
Cyon S'Fayte
| 30 Dark Elf Warrior - Worshipper of Rallos Zek |
| Tarew Marr Server - Member of Blades of Tyrra - Husband of Sari S'Fayte |

https://web.archive.org/web/20020413...ID=22849.topic

DeAdvocate
Registered User
(3/16/02 11:58:38 pm)
Reply Re: lol, ever been voted out of a group?
SK can't pull aggro? What a crappy SK. I play one, I know how easy it is to get aggro- one Disease Cloud usually does the trick :P

https://web.archive.org/web/20030514...icID=110.topic

Goolak
da Troll !!!
Posts: 111
(10/30/02 12:10:38 am)
Reply Re: Support your fellow monks.
Tanking is all about AC!
I was lvl 57 before i quit and my ac was about 1070 (which is actually too low). But the sk's main job is TAUNT!!! Disease Cloud best spell ever, its uber taunt on almost anymob (except in the PoF and I noticed it sucked againist the snake men in Luclin). Only problem with disease cloud is that it is a dot, so watch out if there are mezzers in the group on multiple pulls. But dont over taunt or you'll end up dead hehe (and let me tell you one sk can out taunt 5 lvl 60 warriors easy with the dots)

Goo

SK the best class ever, total self reliant class. What other class (beside necro) can invis, ivu, FD, dot, lifetap, levitate, snare, fear, deal out a 1k+ Harm touch and more!!

PS. TROLZZZ RULZZZZZ!

https://web.archive.org/web/20021120...cID=1118.topic

Catrekil
knows that Warriors are superior
Posts: 1
(8/25/02 6:23:41 am)
Reply .
I invade your board la~

I honestly think you are on something if you think sks will be replacing warriors as MTs. Who cares who can tank the random yard trash crap, warriors will *always* tank the boss mobs. A very large portion of the sk community complained when disease counter aggro was lowered (making disease cloud ass for taunt after 3 years) so verant gives us direct +hate spells to make up for it. Warriors have complained about not being able to hold aggro... well now you have a 20% aggro increase availiable.