JBB, is it really that good?

[Toxigen]

oy m8 wot the fok u just say?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Penish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Silky still doesn't understand how to solo efficiently at 60, but I'm glad to see a vast majority of the crowd here does

cannis + torpor will outweigh any instance you could literally ever click a JBB at 60
Lay down the mental gymnastics for a day and just admit you're wrong Silky (not that it will ever happen) lawl

what a fuckin mook

We are still waiting for you to show us how to play the game. Unfortunately you continue to concede that you have no idea what you are talking about. Insults are not an argument, nor are they tips for how to play. I doubt you will show us anything, since you are probably too scared to post a video.

There's no reason not to have and use JBB at 60 if you are not an Iksar. I am sorry you are unable to think about how to play the game in ways other than your narrow incorrect assumptions.

[Snaggles]

DSM, can you run a 2+ min parse showing how to mix in debuffs, dots, canni, torp, and JBB without letting them expire?

It should be as simple as copy/pasting your log file here.

For full disclosure I have my doubts the mix of clicks is as efficient as you think. I hope I’m wrong but rather than just taking something as truth we should probably see all the messages for ourselves.

[sajbert]

Well to be fair, selling JBB is pretty common and it's more important to have spells like torpor, malo, your dots and the like. After that I'd still understand someone wanting to get WR bags or MQ a pegi cloak or somesuch before rebuying their JBB.

[Crede]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We are still waiting for you to show us how to play the game. Unfortunately you continue to concede that you have no idea what you are talking about. Insults are not an argument, nor are they tips for how to play. I doubt you will show us anything, since you are probably too scared to post a video.

There's no reason not to have and use JBB at 60 if you are not an Iksar. I am sorry you are unable to think about how to play the game in ways other than your narrow incorrect assumptions.

you’d have to prove using jbb is somehow resulting in more kills per hour considering that’s how you seem to measure dps value in other threads frequently writing off minor dps gains.

You can’t say things like 20 extra str isnt worth it while also saying having jbb is good to have to mix in 1-2 clicks without providing actual evidence of real value.

We will await your defense of your contradicting claims.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by Crede [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

you’d have to prove using jbb is somehow resulting in more kills per hour considering that’s how you seem to measure dps value in other threads frequently writing off minor dps gains.

You can’t say things like 20 extra str isnt worth it while also saying having jbb is good to have to mix in 1-2 clicks without providing actual evidence of real value.

We will await your defense of your contradicting claims.

+1 for fun crowd

[Troxx]

Let’s do some math!

In 8 seconds you could
-click JBB once for 263 dmg
OR
-cast torpor and have 2 seconds left over
OR
-cast canni 4 2-3x

In 32 seconds you could …

Click JBB 4x (1052 damage)
OR

-cast torpor once (1200-1500 heal) subtract 200 mana
AND
-cast canni4 8x (656 mana for 1184hp) - net positive 455 mana and 16-315 health
AND
-cast bane, pox or Ebolt once with mana left over

Dmg per mana with those spells range 3.88-4.86 damage per mana yielding 1789-2216dmg for the surplus mana you generated.

That’s why I sold the JBB. Between managing debuffs and frankly having better returns on time invested by casting actual spells … there are much better uses of your time as a shaman than clicking your JBB at level 60.


… unless you’re trying to put out damage in a fast paced xp group with 2 charm pets failing miserably at trying to keep up with a mage pet.

(Ps: or farm low level greens)

[greatdane]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't have a problem using Pox without Insidious Decay in most cases. It really doesn't get resisted that often from my experience.

If you're 60 and casting on low blues, sure. In the kinds of situations that OP is likely to end up in - and OP said he's "high enough level to use JBB," so take from that what you will - tossing out disease dots without the DR debuff is a very poor choice. While you could book-swap it between melee swings of a slowed mob, that's a bit much to include as a matter of course. In anything but fringe cases (like a 60 shaman easyfarming with epic and all spells), devoting two spell slots/swaps to the disease dot is not really going to be worth the hassle it takes unless one specifically derives enjoyment from maximizing one's DPM. Hell, even then, it's only good DPM on mobs unusually high HP.

In very nearly all cases that are relevant to OP's question, you're better off just sticking with poison dots and JBB spam (though there won't be time for many casts of it even pre-60) because a single cast of Malowhatever will cover that, and the mobs that someone is likely to kill if they say that they're "high enough level to use JBB" will not live long enough to where it makes any sort of sense to work a DR debuff and disease dot into the rotation. That is, as you cherrypicked for your example, only worth doing if you're a level 60 shaman soloing dragons and things like that.

You do have a tendency to campaign for the fringe cases, and while I'm also a great lover of the extreme ends of this old game's mechanical spectrum, it's not always the right answer to give. OP is (or was, when he posted in fucking July) probably in his late 40s wondering if JBB is worth getting. Telling him what you can do at level 60 doesn't give him a very good answer, and that's a thing that happens too much around here.

This thread has a hell of a lot of "you can do this at level 60" theorycrafting for a guy who said he's just high enough level to use JBB. If he's like level 50, the best way to kill shit is malosimsalabim, slow, poison dot, and JBB spam, while dogdog gnaws away from behind.

[Snaggles]

I’ve just always seen the shaman game as pretty basic. Don’t die (pre-slow), don’t run out of mana (canni/torp constantly), NEVER let Bane or Epic linger without reapplying.

In theory JBB is good dps. You just basically have to do nothing else and ideally take no damage. To keep up with bane assuming no free server tick (7 only) a JBB has to click 6x at 8 seconds vs bane 1x at 5 seconds. Even then, the JBB is 48 seconds where bane is only 42 for that damage duration so you can cast again to refresh.

[zelld52]

JBB is okay if you're not tanking.

If you're tanking you need to keep Torpor up.

Torpor is 200 mana for 4 ticks. (24s)

Need to cast Cannbalize IV 4x to get enough mana for Torpor.

Canni 4x = 2 ticks (12s)

So you have 12s leftover before you NEED to Torpor again, and need to start canni'ing again for the next Torpor. Do you re-slow, refresh DoTs, , get a few extra cannibalize in, or click JBB? Hrmmm