Stormfeather rules need to change

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No they aren't. Instancing means everyone does content separately, whenever they want to. Rotations mean you're still in the game world with everyone else (will hear talk, need to react to trains) and you need to kill the spawn exactly when it comes up, and if you fail to get the kill, then the next group available gets their chance.



Very few people were boxing back then and 12 people joining forces is not at all a monopoly, ANYONE else can gather that same force together if they want to, and there's never going to be the same 12 people continually spending all of their time at a camp like this. It's not lucrative and having more than 6 doesn't help much.

My previous post mathematically showed an example where instancing and rotations produce the same number of uncontested Vulak kills per year for all interested guilds. People can just read that and see you are wrong here.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A simple example is let's say 3 guilds are on rotation for Vulak, and Vulak has his normal 7 day timer:

1. Guild A gets Vulak Week 1
2. Guild B gets Vulak Week 2
3. Guild C gets Vulak week 3
4. Guild A gets Vulak Week 4
5. Guild B gets Vulak Week 5
6. Guild C gets Vulak week 6

If you had guild specific instancing on a 42 day cooldown:

1. Guild A gets Vulak Week 1
2. Guild B gets Vulak Week 1
3. Guild C gets Vulak week 1
4. Guild A gets Vulak Week 6
5. Guild B gets Vulak Week 6
6. Guild C gets Vulak week 6

I had 2 accounts in 1999.

If you could get all of the original source code for Everquest from 1999 and run that server in 2026, people would play differently, and the content would be monopolized by neckbeards. I don't know why you keep appealing to how people played in 1999. You cannot force people to play that way anymore. Nor can you wipe their memories.

[BradZax]

imagine an in game election in rivervale every year.

There is no fate but what we make for ourselves.

[vales]

Originally Posted by Ashland [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Something has to change. If you ban selling loot rights these people that take camps for 90% of the time will just corpse the item and sell the MQ.

the solution is to stop buying the loot rights and socially stigmatize people who do

the map can't be mq'd

[Ennewi]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

imagine an in game election in rivervale every year.

There is no fate but what we make for ourselves.

Alternatively, a UN meeting in TD with each "nation" represented at the firepots.

[BradZax]

Originally Posted by Ennewi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Alternatively, a UN meeting in TD with each "nation" represented at the firepots.

I nominate those guys that were screaming at each other over VoG to be on the council.

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My previous post mathematically showed an example where instancing and rotations produce the same number of uncontested Vulak kills per year for all interested guilds.

Stop repeating the same wrong nonsense.

Rotations = any failure to kill a target opens the opportunity to another group. It also means that any guild in the zone is impacted by the environmental difference of sharing that space with other people. Instances = no penalty for failure, aside from losing a bit of time needing to rez people and do it again, and it makes zones more predictable and less social.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you could get all of the original source code for Everquest from 1999 and run that server in 2026, people would play differently, and the content would be monopolized by neckbeards.

It would be impossible to monopolize content, especially for a single player. And ofc people play differently, that's irrelevant.

DPS racing inherently means that people need to work together more. Anyone trying to solo monopolize a spawn will lose when a capable duo shows up. 2 people lose to 3 capable people, etc. No matter what, if someone really wants a spawn, they have the ability to gather friends and go fight for it.

The best the neckbeards can do is try to put 6 people at a camp. But that merely gives them an equal chance against another 6 people (who can have minimal playtime, instead of playing all day), and it's not lucrative. When we look at the current state of things, with 6 individuals being able to monopolize 6 camps, if those same people instead would have to work together to monopolize a single camp, it either wouldn't happen or it would mean more camps in the game would be open as a result.

The other nice thing about DPS racing is that it disincentivizes zerg guilds. DPS is capped at 6 people, so a 20 person raid force with 6 Wizards or 6 Rogues (depends on the target which is best) has a pretty good chance of beating an 80 person raid force. The other fun thing: this could create a meta of small raid forces being prevalent, but not actually able to beat some of the targets on their own, because it's assumed another guild will be competing with their own DPS at the same time. Since neither group can kill Vulak or whoever on their own, they can play chicken with each other and see who tries to jump on it first, and just let the people who jumped on it first die.

[Duik]

Isnt instancing like you can have 4 concurrent alternate universe Vulaks up on the IRL date july the 1st? Assuming there are 4 raid guilds ready to engage and Vulak is in window.

So rotations are absolutely nothing like instancing.

The dumbarse who said thay should stop playing.

[Doomchild2]

I've clearly struck a nerve here with a lot of players. And I hope Grim can forgive me for putting him on blast. I don't have anything against grim. But, just like mage epic, and every other quest mob that has been exploited obviously there needs to be a fair way that doesn't involve paying one person to get an item.

While I trust the GM's to make the right call on the change that best fits their goals. My main objective of this post was to air my greivence with a legal monoply. IMO all loot rights selling should be banned.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Stop repeating the same wrong nonsense.

Rotations = any failure to kill a target opens the opportunity to another group. It also means that any guild in the zone is impacted by the environmental difference of sharing that space with other people. Instances = no penalty for failure, aside from losing a bit of time needing to rez people and do it again, and it makes zones more predictable and less social.

Plane of Sky is already in a rotation on P99, and does the exact opposite of all the rules you just described. Each guild has sole access to sky during their rotation for X hours. They can wipe as many times as they want in those X hours, and no other guild is in the zone doing content. Gwan is the one occasional exception to that, but Island 1.5 is off to the side, and doesn't affect the main sky raid.

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It would be impossible to monopolize content.
...
The best the neckbeards can do is try to put 6 people at a camp.

It wouldn't. You are making arbitrary rules that neckbeards wouldn't have to follow. Guilds on P99 perma camped Shiny Brass Idol for raids, and gave people DKP as a reward for camping it. You could have 18 Shadowknight guild bots at Shiny Brass Idol camp soaking DKP. They wouldn't need to be max level guild bots, as the mob is like level 20. Using live's rule of allowing boxing, you could box a lot of those Shadowknights.

Originally Posted by Duik [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Isnt instancing like you can have 4 concurrent alternate universe Vulaks up on the IRL date july the 1st? Assuming there are 4 raid guilds ready to engage and Vulak is in window.

So rotations are absolutely nothing like instancing.

The dumbarse who said thay should stop playing.

You are getting hung up on technical details of what instancing is, rather than why instancing exists.

The reason why instancing exists is so everybody gets the same uncontested chance at loot.

Lets say there is a P99 clone with instancing and the following parameters:

1. Each guild can create an instance of ToV. Once they do this, the guild has a 1 week cooldown on creating a new instance. The instance is open for 24 hours.

2. There are 7 guilds on the server that can kill Vulak, and they kill Vulak every week.

3. Vulak is getting killed 7 times per week.

On regular P99, you could get the same results with this rotation setup:

1. You have 7 guilds in a ToV rotation.

2. Each guild is allowed in to ToV for 24 hours to do whatever they want.

3. ToV fully respawns every 24 hours.

4. Vulak is getting killed 7 times per week.

That is why rotations are pseudo instancing on P99. P99 cannot support 10000 players, so there isn't a scenario where you would be running 200 concurrent instances of ToV. Rotations break down at that scale, but P99 would never get to that point. If P99 added instances tomorrow, you'd have 5-10 guilds at most creating ToV instances regularly.

[CrazyPro]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

On regular P99, you could get the same results with this rotation setup:

1. You have 7 guilds in a ToV rotation.

2. Each guild is allowed in to ToV for 24 hours to do whatever they want.

3. ToV fully respawns every 24 hours.

4. Vulak is getting killed 7 times per week.

That is why rotations are pseudo instancing on P99. P99 cannot support 10000 players, so there isn't a scenario where you would be running 200 concurrent instances of ToV. Rotations break down at that scale, but P99 would never get to that point. If P99 added instances tomorrow, you'd have 5-10 guilds at most creating ToV instances regularly.

Yes, that would result in 7 vulaks per week with rotations if it was true, but it's not. Vulak is a 7 day respawn and you'd have to batter down Rogean's door and hold up a printed screenshot of Luclin models like a cross to a vampire to get him to change that.

With weekly instances, assuming 7 guilds, that'd be 7 vulaks per week.
With rotations, there'd be 1 vulak per week, or 1 vulak every 7 weeks for each individual guild, which is way less than if it were simply a weekly resetting instance for each guild.