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  #24531  
Old 07-18-2022, 06:30 PM
Danth Danth is offline
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Originally Posted by robayon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
lets hope it just murders the car itself
Why would you want to do that? Fast and cheap personal transportation has been one of the greatest boons to liberty invented in the past half millennium.

The oil lobby is a problem, sure, but a different problem. You can make a car that runs on anything from kerosene to coal. Emerging technologies point towards several different types of clean fuels, like various synthetics or hydrogen. Congestion is an issue too but that's a function of over-population moreso than mode of transport. I don't know that our nation has the cultural strength needed to face that problem head-on. It could be faced in a variety of ways, ranging from population control to technological advancement so we can get people off this rock, but eventually it must be dealt with whether we want to do so or not. Mother Nature's say is final, she can be argued with for a little while, but in the end she cannot be denied.

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  #24532  
Old 07-18-2022, 06:53 PM
Kaveh Kaveh is offline
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Originally Posted by MrSparkle001 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I've been saying for two years now that as EVs get more and more popular there will be talk of installing mileage meters and moving away from a gas tax to a mileage tax, and getting a tax bill in the mail from it.

Pains me to say this but it does make sense. The more you drive the more tax you'll pay, just like the more gas you use the more tax you pay.
That’s a regressive tax on rural people imo
  #24533  
Old 07-18-2022, 09:25 PM
robayon robayon is offline
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Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Why would you want to do that? Fast and cheap personal transportation has been one of the greatest boons to liberty invented in the past half millennium.

The oil lobby is a problem, sure, but a different problem. You can make a car that runs on anything from kerosene to coal. Emerging technologies point towards several different types of clean fuels, like various synthetics or hydrogen. Congestion is an issue too but that's a function of over-population moreso than mode of transport. I don't know that our nation has the cultural strength needed to face that problem head-on. It could be faced in a variety of ways, ranging from population control to technological advancement so we can get people off this rock, but eventually it must be dealt with whether we want to do so or not. Mother Nature's say is final, she can be argued with for a little while, but in the end she cannot be denied.

Danth
Fine, fine. The gasoline powered car should die. I'm not opposed to cars themselves. I'd be game to get rid of mine, but it's essentially necessary ib my town and so many others. The pollution they yield is awful, though. And designing cities around them has created a lack of walkable spaces in so many cities. Some are creating alternatives over time, I guess, but I still think the car and petroleum companies wield way too much power.

And I want to see better electric cars than overpriced, self-igniting and hand-washing Tesla ones. And electric cars that aren't themselves charged by fossil fuels burning elsewhere. And cars that aren't manufactured in a destructive, awful way that requires exploitation elsewhere by getting rare earth metals out of developing areas, or if these materials must be mined, they should be obtained ethically.

At every layer of this problem, there are massive corruption hurdles to overcome, but that problem isn't even uniquely American.

Even if all cars just ceased to exist, there's still insane amounts of other pollutants in countless industries. And countless more corruption hurdles. Whatever the solution might look like, it's gonna have to be extremely comprehensive, like a sea change in the way billions of people live their lives

Which is why I think nothing really changes much until the shit hits the fan, craploads of people starve or die from otherwise preventable illnesses, and trucks stop shipping goods.
  #24534  
Old 07-18-2022, 09:27 PM
robayon robayon is offline
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Originally Posted by Kaveh [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
That’s a regressive tax on rural people imo
and taxi drivers and delivery drivers in cities, the gig economy companies aren't gonna subsidize any of that potential tax unless they're forced to

which likely means more costs get handed off to consumers, if it happens
  #24535  
Old 07-18-2022, 11:06 PM
Reiwa Reiwa is offline
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Originally Posted by robayon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
At every layer of this problem, there are massive corruption hurdles to overcome, but that problem isn't even uniquely American.
Why does it take 6 years to open a Whole Foods in San Francisco?
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  #24536  
Old 07-18-2022, 11:39 PM
Jibartik Jibartik is offline
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Originally Posted by Reiwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
"So when it came time to approve The City’s tenth Whole Foods"

that's 60 years of whole foods!
  #24537  
Old 07-19-2022, 12:25 AM
robayon robayon is offline
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Originally Posted by Reiwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
1.) Ask a wobblie what they think of the UFCW and their, uh, spotty record of actually representing workers
2.) In this case maybe the UFCW is right
3.) I don't live in California, though it's a nice place to visit, but it is my understanding that 'misapplication and weaponization of weird environmental laws' is kind of a whole cottage industry in the state
4.) (Least confident option) San Francisco is a neoliberal hellscape and I am gonna go out on a limb that the customer base of that potential 10th Whole Paycheck have a significant overlap with the NIMBY San Fran mentality
  #24538  
Old 07-19-2022, 12:27 AM
Reiwa Reiwa is offline
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Originally Posted by robayon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
1.) Ask a wobblie what they think of the UFCW and their, uh, spotty record of actually representing workers
2.) In this case maybe the UFCW is right
3.) I don't live in California, though it's a nice place to visit, but it is my understanding that 'misapplication and weaponization of weird environmental laws' is kind of a whole cottage industry in the state
4.) (Least confident option) San Francisco is a neoliberal hellscape and I am gonna go out on a limb that the customer base of that potential 10th Whole Paycheck have a significant overlap with the NIMBY San Fran mentality
4 is no. The local residents wanted it, quite badly infact.
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  #24539  
Old 07-19-2022, 12:35 AM
robayon robayon is offline
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Originally Posted by Reiwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
4 is no. The local residents wanted it, quite badly infact.
that doesn't NOT make them nimbys

and giving nimbys the reverse of whatever they claim to want is just exquisite

build more rehab centers and homless shelters in rich neighborhoods. ignore objections. actually, don't ignore them. go to the zoning meetings and specifically, loudly mock them and their clutched pearls.
  #24540  
Old 07-19-2022, 01:22 AM
Reiwa Reiwa is offline
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Originally Posted by robayon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
that doesn't NOT make them nimbys

and giving nimbys the reverse of whatever they claim to want is just exquisite

build more rehab centers and homless shelters in rich neighborhoods. ignore objections. actually, don't ignore them. go to the zoning meetings and specifically, loudly mock them and their clutched pearls.
See, you think you're a commie but you'd fit in pretty well on the NL reddit. They hate nimbys too!

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I don't cuz I say the r word sometimes. 😿
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