Discussion: PvP Deaths (Item/Coin/XP Loot/Gain)

[hagard]

Originally Posted by lethdar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If there is no global ooc then there definitely should be global yellow text. Even is the best of all worlds this server won't have the population of a live pvp server, so yellow text lets you know where hotspots are. I assume given the classic bent of the server there will be no /who'ing zones, so a way to see where fights are happening will be even more vital to the server, yellow text does this.

agreed with no /who and no OOC server wide yellow text is a good call

[lethdar]

People will check it out, yes. However after losing every piece of armor they have they're not going to stick around. Hardcore players might not mind losing a GEB, mith arms, mith legs, fbss, etc, but a casual may just nerdrage right off the server once they see themselves losing items that they've invested dozens of hours farming.

Item loot is the worst thing you could have to keep people playing on the server, particularly when its a single box only environment. Good luck with life as a solo melee / hybrid without caster backup for god knows how long with red99's xp lvl.

[Xantille]

Originally Posted by lethdar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

People will check it out, yes. However after losing every piece of armor they have they're not going to stick around. Hardcore players might not mind losing a GEB, mith arms, mith legs, fbss, etc, but a casual may just nerdrage right off the server once they see themselves losing items that they've invested dozens of hours farming.

Item loot is the worst thing you could have to keep people playing on the server, particularly when its a single box only environment. Good luck with life as a solo melee / hybrid without caster backup for god knows how long with red99's xp lvl.

This.

[Doors]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Only personally advocating. Like I said, I'm indifferent to what happens with the loot. I just can't believe the hard core folks... not wanting their precious droppable pixels to be in the hands of another. Surprised me.

I'm indifferent either way. The only reason I'm not all about item loot is because the players that will want to try red99 are not going to stick around if people are taking their gear.

The hardcore folks could care less about item loot, for the better of the server its best that it isn't put in.

[God-King Abacab]

Item loot becomes moot point come planar, and eventually is phased out by Velious as anyone able to collect thurg armor will have 90% of their slots no-drop by level 40

[Lasher]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Only personally advocating. Like I said, I'm indifferent to what happens with the loot. I just can't believe the hard core folks... not wanting their precious droppable pixels to be in the hands of another. Surprised me.

Put in item loot i love it, i just know it will shit on the potential server population. We as pvpers are wise beyond means and can identify when we need to put our selfish needs before the server, amirite?

[juicedsixfo]

I'm sure this has been covered plenty but, my vote:

Coin loot – yes.

Exp gain/loss seems a little custom and possibly exploitable to me. I know it's always been a dream to level off pvp, but losing exp to repeated ganks is pretty hardcore. People will be running from fights that they may have been likely to stand their ground on. The exp rate is going to be brutal enough.

Item loot – no.

Take out global ooc and yellow text. We all know the hotspots, they aren't going to change. It's only for dick stroking, stop pretending. We all know who's who. Just my opinion.

[Rushmore]

Originally Posted by Bardalicious [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok, let's break this down.

I think exp loss would deter PVP just like item loot.

Why? You are comparing a penalty system to a reward/penalty system. If you only lose xp from PVP and not gain it, how is that in any way similar to being able to both TAKE items and LOSE them too? You also have the option of what gear to wear and when to bag it, controlling to a degree the items you can lose. Exp on PVP death, however, is an entirely unavoidable penalty.

NO Yellow Text would decrease PVP (YT would make people port into fights)

Yellow text does nothing except to boost egos. Let's be serious about this for a minute. How many times in the past few boxes did yellow text end up resulting in more PVP occuring than would have anyways? If you are looking for PVP in classic EQ, shit man, you're gonna find it. Level 35+ ? Hit all the zones those people would hang out in. It's a pretty short fucking list, I assure you. You are unwisely comparing the small populations of the past boxes to what Red99 will surely reach. There will be no issue of not "finding" PVP.

Item Loot would decrease PVP

You are making a claim with absolutely no supporting evidence. Yes, potentially losing items in PVP is a detriment, and to counter-balance that, you can gain them as well. This should be a non-factor if they implement an opt-in system for those of us that want to participate in item looting anyways, so there is no real reason to argue about it.

Being able to /who all zones would decrease PVP

So let me get this straight... you want yellow text to broadcast when someone dies in PVP because it's somehow going to "generate more PVP" for that zone, yet having the ability to see how populated a zone is without being there first will somehow hinder it? No, I don't think /w all zone should show players that have ANON on, but I also don't understand the logic behind your argument.

A leaderboard would increase PVP

Again, another unsubstantiated claim. How exactly will a leaderboard increase PVP? The only thing that YT and Leaderboard systems promote is shady PVP behavior, which we've seen proof of time and time again on EQEmu. Are you really a fan of being ganked with harmtouch on zoning in somewhere just so that shitty SK can get his yellow text and leaderboard position on? Why would a PVP server, that players are electing to play and PVP on, need yellow text or a leaderboard to entice them to PVP?

Anything that would deter PVP is a big failure. Don't we all want the most PVP we can get????

I play EQ PVP because of the difficulty behind it, obviously you play it for an entirely different reason. These talks of respawning with full gear, having no penalties on death etc. remind me of a different game - WoW Arena PVP.

EverQuest was such a good game in its early years because of the constant feeling of danger it created. Because when you died in PVE or in PVP, you paid the price for it. You're proposing that the only thing people want to do is constantly be able to fight each other without having to worry about the penalties for losing - and I'm telling you that you're playing the wrong game man. EQ PVE and PVP started going down the shitter when they started wow-ifying things, and some of the things being discussed on these forums is exactly what's being proposed.

Why don't we just implement out of combat regen rates, health, mana, regen and DS pots and throw in PoKnowledge as well? I mean, all of those things encourage omg-fast-arenastyle-WoW-PVP too right? I'm not trying to sound too flamey about this shit, but honestly, do you guys stop to think about these suggestions before bringing them up?

Whoa Pal. Again you are slandering me. I play EQ because just like you I like a challenge. When did I ever say I want to die and respawn with full gear?

Above you were debating valid points...and then you just shit on a good debate by making up shit and passing judgment.

Your never getting ITEM loot bro. THE END.

I agree with some of your points though but overall I just trying to make a point for the community's sake I don't want anything that would deter someone from at least trying to play here.

And YES my YT idea and not being able to /who zones was kind of whack.

[Bardalicious]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[opinion]Global ooc is a terrible idea for peak populations greater than 250. Believe it or not, not everyone wants or needs to hear everything everyone has to say. It empowers idiots and spammers.

I know, I know. It will be suggested to turn off ooc. However, players shouldn't have to disable native, classic features of eq.. to satisfy the needs of others.

Low population, I'd advocate global ooc on for functionality, but still not for "chat".[/opinion]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well I played with item loot, and I didn't care if I lost my shoes. It also gives reason to complete the obscure, no-drop quests that no one ever does.

It's hard to give my opinion without saying I'm advocating it for the server. I'm just trying to give my opinion as a pvper. :P

Disregard the vocal eqemu pvp crowd and set the server up how you'd envision playing on it imo. You're obviously an old school RZ player and we both know that the RZ pvp system worked just fine.

I'm in the same boat as you. It's pretty funny how many "hardcore PVPers" are advocating against item looting, as if playing on an RZ style server would automatically ensure you're going to get ganked and lose all of your best gear. People would play on the server no matter what, simply because of it being free of cheats and due to the reputation you guys at P99 have for stability. They'd learn the system and adapt to it just like the thousands of players back in '99-'01 did.

[Bardalicious]

Originally Posted by Rushmore [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Whoa Pal. Again you are slandering me. I play EQ because just like you I like a challenge. When did I ever say I want to die and respawn with full gear?

Above you were debating valid points...and then you just shit on a good debate by making up shit and passing judgment.

Your never getting ITEM loot bro. THE END.

I agree with some of your points though but overall I just trying to make a point for the community's sake I don't want anything that would deter someone from at least trying to play here.

And YES my YT idea and not being able to /who zones was kind of whack.

I didn't state YOU wanted people to respawn with full gear. The idea was introduced though and follows the same fucking thought pattern of having instant easy access to PVP with little to no repercussions that you seem to advocate.

Perhaps you should re-read this thread, you dolt. It's pretty clear that even nilbog would advocate for item looting. ITEM LOOTING WORKED. You act as if there isn't a history of a PVP server having those exact rules and pulling a population of THOUSANDS OF PLAYERS over the course of MULTIPLE YEARS.

You don't even seem to have original thought patterns any more. You cling to the ideas of others and regurgitate them without any thought for whether they make sense.