My proposal for Raiding guilds and GMs of P1999

[xorbier]

Poor poor IB.

You dominate the server then get butthurt when some new guild comes along and starts beating you at your own game. You should keep insulting everyone and cry more. It makes you look good! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It appears to me that DA has put forth more time and effort and has had better strategy to out play you the last several weeks. I believe you've lost 2 out of the last 3 weeks. I'm so very sorry!

Your response is to insult and complain. It's sad really. Especially when you claim to be the better guild who's "morally" superior. You've clearly established the contrary.

I've personally seen people like Alawen flame guilds in OOC on multiple occasions which is great representation for IB.

Over all this is sooo classic EQ and I love it. It was exactly like this on the server I played on and I enjoyed the competition. More playing and less complaining!

[astarothel]

Originally Posted by xorbier [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It appears to me that DA has put forth more time and effort and has had better strategy to out play you the last several weeks.

Can I have some of the fucking drugs you're on?
More time, maybe. It's not strategy to stay logged in and AFK 24/7.

[Erasong]

Originally Posted by xorbier [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Poor poor IB.

You dominate the server then get butthurt when some new guild comes along and starts beating you at your own game. You should keep insulting everyone and cry more. It makes you look good! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It appears to me that DA has put forth more time and effort and has had better strategy to out play you the last several weeks. I believe you've lost 2 out of the last 3 weeks. I'm so very sorry!

Your response is to insult and complain. It's sad really. Especially when you claim to be the better guild who's "morally" superior. You've clearly established the contrary.

I've personally seen people like Alawen flame guilds in OOC on multiple occasions which is great representation for IB.

Over all this is sooo classic EQ and I love it. It was exactly like this on the server I played on and I enjoyed the competition. More playing and less complaining!

we havent lost. we obviously dont have the same level of importance on mobs like maestro.

[G13]

Originally Posted by jilena [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't get what you are saying here. Obviously it takes the same amount of "effort" to move now or move later, to have your resist gear on you, to be ready to kill the boss now or later. However there is no comparing how inefficient one strategy is in terms of time spent. One strategy allows you to play the game 95% of the time, the other strategy tethers your character to a single location.

Let me make it crystal clear for you. To some people, the strategic part of mobilizing in advance for mobs, maintaining numbers in the zone, clearing trash in rotations, and guaranteeing their right to the boss IS playing the game. Not farming in guk. Not crafting. Not sitting in EC tunnel. They don't care if their character is tethered to one location. They want to win.

I don't see how you can even argue that there is a comparable amount of "fun" being had here. If you continue to do so I feel you are just being illogical to make your case sound better. Any 4 year old can be used to prove my point. Ground them to their room for some indefinite period of time until supper is ready or let them go run around doing whatever they want until it's time to eat. Observe and let me know which one looks like more fun.

Your "fun" is not the same as someone else's "fun". You're looking at the situation in "All or Nothing/Black/White" terms. Competing with a guild, gearing your friends, and strategically moving your forces around in anticipation of boss spawns is "fun" to some people. It's not like there isn't something to do when you're sitting in Fear waiting for CT. You coordinate trash clears, get people geared, ect. You don't even need everyone there anyways. You only need 15 people. It's not difficult to get people willing to hold numbers. They want the mobs and killing them is worth it. It's a war against the rival guild. You do what it takes to win. That's the "game" to people in DA and IB right now.

Well I am not trying to be super pro IB here. I am not in either guild and I have friends in both. I do however believe the sincerity of their "if you stop camping a raid force in front of each boss we will too" statements. I know not a single person in any guild who is fond of this situation. I am not saying this doesn't count as competition and doesn't give you guys some means of trying to edge IB out of their control of the server's top end loot. I am however saying that this competition is one that is as heavily reliant on masochism as it is any sort of organization or mobilization ability.

FFA would not stop mob camping. I wouldn't wait for a "on your mark. Get set. GO" as soon as a boss pops. Why bother doing that when you can prepare much farther in advance, and coordinate your moves in anticipation of other spawns? I'm thinking 3-4 boss mobs in advance. Why limit my guild's ability to be successful by getting bogged down waiting for one spawn while I sit where? In a designated "locker room" somewhere like WC to make it fair? What we now have to camp out in WC now? I can't sit my force in the zone and wait? You're now talking about MORE rules, hurting the guild that wants to be proactive and prepare way ahead of time and be ready when the boss spawns and put themselves in the best position possible for potential boss spawns after. FFA would lead to even more camping. Any guild worth it's salt would go the most efficient route, which is preparing way ahead in advance. There is no stopping it.

This will never be an instanced game. I think some people's sense of nostalgia is a bit cloudy. They don't realize that EQ's end game is terribly flawed. Sure it's fine when one guild dominates, but when there are 2 guilds on the same server putting in the exact same amount of effort, and doing anything it takes to kill bosses, the end result is what you now see on P99. Neither willing to blink and falling victim to their egos. Unwilling to admit a compromise needs to be made. That's why rotations were set up on some servers. The overall health and stability of the server became more important than feeding the powergamer egos of a certain set of hardcore players. P99 has a decision to make. Like it or not, you people need to decide the route this server is going to go. Currently, it's being run by powergamers with massive egos, so much so that it has become an unhealthy environment. if IB and DA fade out, other guilds are just going to take their place with the same attitude. "Do whatever it takes to kill the boss"

Haha I dunno man, I see a LOT of people with these tags now. And it is almost impossible to maintain quality when quantity starts becoming more and more important. I see both guilds kicking the obvious fuck ups, but I get the feeling the overall skill in both guilds has diminished significantly (well DA picking up some IV folks prolly was a step up from FB) since camping has become rampant.

You're assuming that everyone playing this game is a newbie. That is not the case. Most people are MMO veterans with many games/raids under their belt. There aren't many people from FB left on this server either. Maybe 5-6. The rest are post FB.

Chopped that up a little bit to be less wall of text quoted moreso than trying to take anything out of context. I am not arguing motivations here. I am arguing that as far as the general health of both guilds is concerned, this camping shit will eventually have to stop. I KNOW both guilds want the loot, and I KNOW that is the reason for the current situation, and I KNOW that so long as it provides the best chance for some guild to get said loot it will continue unless something is done to change it. You can call it being more proactive if you want. To me it's just abusing the spirit of the rules in place to find a way to guarantee yourselves first shot at a boss. *shrug*

There are people in both guilds that agree with you. It's why Nizzarr created the post to begin with. He recognizes that there is a problem. Do you want to know what the real problem is? EGO. IB set the precedent on what other guilds would have to do on this server a long time if they wanted boss mobs. They had a system down, which was relatively easy, that guaranteed them all the bosses. Nobody was willing to put in the effort for a long time to compete with them. Things change though. IB has never handled their position as #1 with any tact or grace. On the contrary, they rubbed it in your face with insults and taunts. They pissed off a lot of people to the point where they are now willing to do whatever it takes to kill a boss. Hence, we now have a standoff.

I don't begrudge IB for doing what they wanted to do. Keep everyone else from engaging a single mob, getting geared, and keeping their iron boot on the content. So another guild came along, and upped the stakes. Instead of a druid, they decided to just be rdy when the mob spawns. It's the inevitable conclusion to using a druid. It's called the "logical next step" to organize and mobilize faster than the other guy. There were many bumps in the road along the way. Failures and successes. Suddenly IB couldn't stay logged off and then login real quick to fight a boss for easy loot. They had to play by someone else's rules, and I understand why they don't like that. Except what you see here are rules they helped design. Not DA. So in reality, they are playing by their own rules, but that's not working out in their favor like it used to, so they want to change it to FFA. The problem is FFA won't make the problem go away. It's going to make it worse.

[G13]

Originally Posted by Erasong [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

we havent lost. we obviously dont have the same level of importance on mobs like maestro.

When DA focused on Vox, which put them at an obvious disadvantage for every other mob, Alawen was here on the boards claiming IB was "kicking DA's ass". You guys set the precedent for "number of mobs = who is the best" when in reality Vox has become a complete cockblock for any guild wishing to focus on her.

You also roll with the variance. Sometimes you get luck with early spawns that catch the other team off guard. Sometimes you don't. So like Nizzarr said, we are already on a rotation. It's just an unspoken one. Egos won't allow for it to become official.

[spoolie]

ding ding ding we have a winner. excellent post

[Phallax]

Originally Posted by xorbier [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Poor poor IB.

You dominate the server then get butthurt when some new guild comes along and starts beating you at your own game. You should keep insulting everyone and cry more. It makes you look good! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It appears to me that DA has put forth more time and effort and has had better strategy to out play you the last several weeks. I believe you've lost 2 out of the last 3 weeks. I'm so very sorry!

Your response is to insult and complain. It's sad really. Especially when you claim to be the better guild who's "morally" superior. You've clearly established the contrary.

I've personally seen people like Alawen flame guilds in OOC on multiple occasions which is great representation for IB.

Over all this is sooo classic EQ and I love it. It was exactly like this on the server I played on and I enjoyed the competition. More playing and less complaining!

ATM both guilds are losing, with the way the current raiding scene is there are no winners, unless its an outside guild getting a lucky spawn and kill.

And how can you say "Poor poor IB" when a DA member started this thread so obviously it was IB crying when a DA member started the thread, right?

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by xorbier [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Poor poor IB.

You dominate the server then get butthurt when some new guild comes along and starts beating you at your own game. You should keep insulting everyone and cry more. It makes you look good! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It appears to me that DA has put forth more time and effort and has had better strategy to out play you the last several weeks. I believe you've lost 2 out of the last 3 weeks. I'm so very sorry!

Your response is to insult and complain. It's sad really. Especially when you claim to be the better guild who's "morally" superior. You've clearly established the contrary.

I've personally seen people like Alawen flame guilds in OOC on multiple occasions which is great representation for IB.

Over all this is sooo classic EQ and I love it. It was exactly like this on the server I played on and I enjoyed the competition. More playing and less complaining!

I'm calling bullshit on you, sir. A little over a week ago, I sat next to DA chatting about things from live while we all waited on draco. Things are only testy now because I disagree with your little carebear plan. I congratulated you on your CT kill and complimented Raren on his robe when I ran into him today in NFP.

If you want to make claims about what I've done, you better back them up with screen shots. I gave you a little grief yesterday after you trained me, but before that things were always friendly between DA and I. I wasn't around for the big conflicts between Transcendence and IB, so there's no bad blood there. I've had no significant issues with Divinity, Remedy, Gothic Circle or any of the up and coming guilds and in this very thread I have been in agreement with the group saying there are more than four guilds to be considered for a rotation.

DA picked this fight with IB. You wanted your share of the raid mobs. Now you have them and you want to reduce the amount of work you do for them. For some reason, you think you get to talk a lot of shit about IB and nothing will come back at you.

That's just too bad, son. If your strategy is unsustainable, you'll just have to come up with a new strategy. If not, your guild will go the way of things like the dodo bird. That's life. Life's not about fair. Life's about the strong eating the weak. That's why your get in line and take your turn plan is so unattractive to some of us. We're strong and we want MORE.

[xorbier]

Woot! Personal insults. I win the argument. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[astarothel]

Originally Posted by xorbier [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Woot! Personal insults. I win the argument. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Uh. You don't win if you started with them. Nice try tho.