Americans and Guns (post pics of your armory !)

Autotune · #1 07-05-2012, 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenzar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok, WTF would someone want with your wife and children?! I'm assuming in this scenario the attacker who is 'after' your family is out to kill them? If that's the case a house fire would work just as well as storming the door and fighting through you with a lot less effort. Guns don't fight fires last time I checked. Why is it everytime a firearm proponent is setting up a scenario where a gun will be useful its a scenario that is wildly unrealistic. If someone is out to kill you (or anyone for that matter) there are very effective ways to circumvent a firearm (a carbomb can be made by even the most novice person with a little research, a house fire leading to asphyxiation, you can make fucking thermite in any garage in america for fucks sake.) If some idiot is going to come at you from the front door I would argue that they werent serious about actually killing you and that the deadly force you are meeting them with is just unnecessary. But who cares right? You got to kill someone while being within your rights. Hell yeah! American dream!
You want to learn to stop someone from physically hurting you, travel to Israel, train in KM, train with the IDF(there are a ton of schools there run by former IDF instructors, its not fun, its not pretty, it is effective), imo they are the only people who actually use hand to hand combat anymore. You thinking your training will only get you so far is the first indicator that whatever you were trained in is ineffective. If it is an martial art, or based on a martial art, its worthless.

As far as whether or not you think the military would kill its own citizens, if this were 100 years ago where the deadliest thing you had to worry about was a cannon or a gatling gun that a man had to operate on sight, I would agree with you. But it takes a handful of men to press a handful of buttons to more than break any uprising 300,000,000 strong or not. We dont possess the weaponry that our govt possesses...not even fucking close. The 2nd ammendment was a interesting idea when it was proposed. 250 years later its kind of a laughable idea to think 300million people armed with some .223's could fight a war against a govt that can send a missle fired from a fucking submarine straight down your goddamn chimney.

You should have thought longer before you posted.

1) Your fire scenario comparison is just as fucking stupid.
2) No form of Hand to Hand (kungfu included) will stop a bullet. You can train to use a firearm in far less time than train to learn any form of hand to hand, without having to travel across the world.
3) Even people in the military have a conscience.

kenzar · #2 07-05-2012, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You should have thought longer before you posted.

1) Your fire scenario comparison is just as fucking stupid.

My comparison wasn't a comparison, just an observation. If someone wants to kill you a firearm is one of many options. To assume someone would use a firearm is quite narrow minded. There are a ton of other ways to really kill someone w/o a firearm if you really wanted to do something like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

2) No form of Hand to Hand (kungfu included) will stop a bullet. You can train to use a firearm in far less time than train to learn any form of hand to hand, without having to travel across the world.

KM is a defense system that takes about 8-9 weeks to train and become extremely proficient at it. After that initial training people tend to retain about 80-90% of the effective movements. All based on natural reaction, meaning you dont have to necessarily remember a whole lot, just react and muscle memory takes care of the rest. No defense system will stop a bullet; not everyone who wants to hurt you has a gun. Its quite unrealistic to think you will always be armed in any situation that might come along where you would have to defend yourself. It is realistic to believe you will have your arms and legs readily available. Learning to use them effectively could prove useful. Plus KM encompasses an armed fighting system as well, IE fighting with/against someone with a knife/handgun/AR. It's just useful stuff to know, it wont stop a bullet but it's the next best thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

3) Even people in the military have a conscience.

Most do I'm sure. My point was that it doesn't take an entire army anymore. Even if 99% of the military refuses, 1% armed with modern military weaponry can make more than a dent in 100% of civilian population armed with .223's and 7.62's. You're deluded if you think every person in the military is a noble do-gooder. Some are I'm sure, but some just enjoy killing. Having a conscience is not on any military entrance exam I've ever seen.

Maybe you should have thought longer before you posted. Your three points of criticism aren't necessary to anyone with a reading comprehension above that of a 5th grader.

Hitchens · #3 07-05-2012, 11:59 AM

Autotune · #4 07-05-2012, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenzar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My comparison wasn't a comparison, just an observation. If someone wants to kill you a firearm is one of many options. To assume someone would use a firearm is quite narrow minded. There are a ton of other ways to really kill someone w/o a firearm if you really wanted to do something like that.

KM is a defense system that takes about 8-9 weeks to train and become extremely proficient at it. After that initial training people tend to retain about 80-90% of the effective movements. All based on natural reaction, meaning you dont have to necessarily remember a whole lot, just react and muscle memory takes care of the rest. No defense system will stop a bullet; not everyone who wants to hurt you has a gun. Its quite unrealistic to think you will always be armed in any situation that might come along where you would have to defend yourself. It is realistic to believe you will have your arms and legs readily available. Learning to use them effectively could prove useful. Plus KM encompasses an armed fighting system as well, IE fighting with/against someone with a knife/handgun/AR. It's just useful stuff to know, it wont stop a bullet but it's the next best thing.

Most do I'm sure. My point was that it doesn't take an entire army anymore. Even if 99% of the military refuses, 1% armed with modern military weaponry can make more than a dent in 100% of civilian population armed with .223's and 7.62's. You're deluded if you think every person in the military is a noble do-gooder. Some are I'm sure, but some just enjoy killing. Having a conscience is not on any military entrance exam I've ever seen.

Maybe you should have thought longer before you posted. Your three points of criticism aren't necessary to anyone with a reading comprehension above that of a 5th grader.

Go back and reread "a house fire would work just as well as someone going after your wife in kids" (to which you then get off saying guns don't put out fires)

I know what KM is (also thought it was funny you expect people to travel to Israel). The guy expressed that he knew/knows some form of hand to hand or "kungfu". It is retarded to think everyone should travel over seas to learn anything for self defense. Proper training with a handgun and how to use one in self defense is more than enough for the average person. Stop thinking about James Bond scenarios.

Military people use Military equipment. You think after one gives up that he is just going to leave with his rifle? I think the only deluded one is you. The entire Military would split bottom to top. It might not take an entire army to kill people, but they would have to fight their other half that have the same shit they do. Apparently you seem to think once someone in the military defects from the government side they would instantly lose everything they have access to.

I was trying hard not to call you an idiot, but it's pretty fucking apparent now. I like the fact that your snide comments and general way of thought shows how idiotic your mind set is too. "lets take your wife/kids being hunted scenario (not to mention it wasn't a fucking hunted or assassination scenario that the guy said, it was a simple fucking statement you retard) and change it with a burning house scenario b/c it would work just as well. Except the part where guns can't kill fire and they can kill badguys.... hurhur derpdaderp." "Oh you think you know some form of hand to hand, well you don't know wtf you're talking about. Go learn KM from Israel b/c it's the best and you're fucking stupid." "If someone in the military decides to not kills his friends and no longer agrees with the government, he's gonna go home with his .223 and leave all the other equipment behind, b/c that's what half the military would do or even 90%."

You can stop projecting on the interwebs now, it might work on your friends, but here it just looks like advice from a pompous tool.

Someguy1983 · #5 07-05-2012, 01:03 PM

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Kruel · #6 07-05-2012, 01:32 PM

Yea i own guns, so whats it to ya...

Springfield 1911 loaded - 45
Beretta 92A1 - 9
Beretta BU9 Nano - 9 - CCW gun
Walther PK380 - 380
Walther P22 - 22
Remington Spartan side by side 20" Stock - 12g - underbed special

I go to the range all the time with my wife. We find it is a fun way to get out of the house and have some fun. I dont have some dream situation that a gun will protect me in... but we do live in a fucked up world. I would rather have a fun and just enjoy another hobby - than to have some fucker have the upper hand on me because I didnt believe i would ever need one.

doraf · #7 07-05-2012, 02:16 PM

Just a few of the riffles I actually have pics of.

The AR15 is made by LMT with a 2 stage trigger and ambidextrous safety.

The Stevens shotgun for home defense. I am

I picked up the Mossberg tactical .22 for my daughter who thinks daddy's AR is "cute."

Goofier · #8 07-05-2012, 06:07 PM

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Originally Posted by Kruel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I go to the range all the time with my wife. We find it is a fun way to get out of the house and have some fun. I dont have some dream situation that a gun will protect me in... but we do live in a fucked up world. I would rather have a fun and just enjoy another hobby - than to have some fucker have the upper hand on me because I didnt believe i would ever need one.

Very well put.

Harmonium · #9 07-07-2012, 01:40 PM

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I'd rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

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Kimm Barely · #10 07-07-2012, 02:48 PM

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