[jimthayner]

Originally Posted by AimAce [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Okay jim, I really don't want to make this a rant / flame thread. But I have to say, you sound like a high schooler who took one class of philosophy and thinks you're the top dog now.

What you are doing, is ignoring the issue at hand by presenting a different issue. This is a fallacy. To be fancy, some might even say it begs the question, as breaking an EULA of EQLive =/= breaking an EULA of P1999.

You are doing multiple things wrong;

1. You are ignoring the issue at hand;
We don't care we are "cheating Sony out of their money", because we probably aren't (due to the fact that we want a p1999 experience and NOT a live experience). We care about whether or not we are being treated equally. You talking about live / Sony / we are all illegal is a complete diversion from the issue.

For example, "OMG WAR IS BAD GUYS!" And you respond with, "Yea, but are human real? Do we really exist? War is okay, because we don't even exist guys!"

That is stupid. You are stupid.

2. You imply that because we break one rule, all rules must be null and void;
That's even more ridiculous. So since we are cheating Sony of their EULA, we might as well throw caution to the wind about all rules? Lulz I died here. Okay, so I committed robbery the other night, and I knew I was gonna get caught. At this point, I might as well go around murdering people AMIRITE? Look at the different situations of each "law" being broken.

Sony is neither here nor there, since this is p1999 not EQlive. If Sony has an issue with p1999, its Sony's job to act on it, not ours. If we have an issue with P1999's players, its our jobs to act on it.

3. And finally, I'll address your actual claim.


Sony *does* have a right to control its intellectual property. And yes, we MAY very well be violating their wishes. But guess what? Their wishes affect *all* of us whether or not we care. Their decision is almost completely irrelevant to us in the sense that it's not a democracy, we can't choose whether or not to stop it. Further more it affects everyone here *EQUALLY*.

So Sony might as well be an entity like the Emperor of Everquest (including P1999) while this is only ONE of the many towns. If Sony decides to squash our town, then we all lose. Then so be it. But during that time where we are all a part of this community, we will do whatever we can to make it a place that we can all enjoy. If this includes pointless witchhunts or asking for harder punishments for the cheaters, then it's within our right to do so. We aren't forcing anyone to do it, merely asking.


In closing, please learn to argue because you're very bad at it, not playing devil's advocate whatsoever etc~

I find this funny, because I've told high schoolers that have taken 1 philosophy class the exact same thing.

All you've said is "well, I don't care." That's pretty much the same as saying, "do we really exist?"

I think you're pretty bad at this whole debate thing. Primarily, because I have stated fact and cited it, as well as cited case law as decided by the American Judicial branch.

Basically:

ME: Well, I can cite case law and sources to back up my arguments.
YOU: Well, I just don't care that what I'm doing is wrong. You're a towel.

All I've heard are the following arguments:

1. Well, I don't care about the law/EULA/Sony's wishes.
2. Sony isn't offering he exact same thing, so what I'm doing is okay.
3. Because Sony hasn't stopped P1999 yet, we're all not wrong.

AimAce in particular, I'd like you to quote me where I've said we should allow cheating on this server, or that because we're violating EULA and copyright law we should allow cheating on this server. I'm a huge advocate of preventing cheating in MMORPGs.

Had you been paying attention, you would have realized that I'm advocating that people examine their own hypocrisy before sounding like ass clowns.

Sony is neither here nor there, since this is p1999 not EQlive. If Sony has an issue with p1999, its Sony's job to act on it, not ours. If we have an issue with P1999's players, its our jobs to act on it.

You're the dumbest person I know, or you just didn't read the source earlier (I'm going with the latter). MDY Industries vs. Blizzard Entertainment pretty much ruled that we are legally bound to abide by Sony's End User License agreement, regardless if we care, we're hurting Sony, or if Sony is running P1999.

If WoW Glider got shut down because they're providing the means for violating WoW's EULA, then P1999 could get shut down for violating the law (in particular, the Digital Millennium Copyright Act) and providing the means for violating Sony's EULA.

Someone, anyone, please make an argument that is based on case law, legal precedent, and sources...ANY source at this point. Being able to cite sources, even wikipedia (which cites its sources, although anyone can edit) is better than just saying how you feel, or that you don't care.