Quote:
Originally Posted by Crede
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I tried to see your mage opinion, but the more you talk about it I'm convinced that you're actually just making things up now to support your mage claim, lol. Which isn't surprising, we all know you like to spin your opinions as facts, and will defend them to the death. I can respect that in certain scenarios, but I'm not really sure who are you trying to convince here, other than yourself.
This entire paragraph is completely inaccurate, lol. Mages have a toolkit that actually shines the more you know about the game. Getting a max pet & positioning it, Cothing a puller to clear aggro when needed, keeping DS on the tank, providing muzzles to increase dps, debuffing to help charmers maintain charm for more dps/safety, mod rods to assist the healer in getting more mana. A well played mage is really a nice thing to see in the group scene. Nobody cares about their summoned weapons, lol, nor should that be a factor in considering their overall utility.
As others have mentioned, you are putting way too much value on utility/CC when it comes to solo/grouping. You don't need all that to get to lvl 60 quickly solo. You need to just know the right camps, and be efficient at killing quickly. Mages can do this very efficiently, unlike a rogue. Utility comes into play more for experiencing different camps & solo artist stuff, which is really niche and outside the scope of this discussion. And as for grouping, Necros are an amazing class, but honestly nobody really cares about their utility when forming a group. Other classes will cover that utility. They would take a mage 99% of the times for superior DPS. Necros are kinda like paladins in the group atmosphere, they can make up for a lot of deficiencies, but overall not really needed. The formula for forming groups is pretty simple here on p99: get a tank, healer, cc, and fill the rest with the best dps you can find.
This whole section is a stretch and I think you're just making up things to support your mage claim at this point [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]. You are claiming that the Rogue toolkit isn't gimped by p99 knowledge, but improved by it. This makes no sense. Rogue's have no toolkit, everyone knows how to /attack and backstab. Sneak/hide & pick lock have extremely limited use in the group setting. Being a knowledgeable rogue doesn't really make a group better, you might just annoy the tank/healer slightly less when you start using your evade hotkey. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Mage's are certainly not the most underpowered class in the game when looking at all aspects of it. It's more like a close tie between Rangers, Paladins, and Wizards, with Rogues not too far behind that. Ranger's are a perfect example of how worthless utility can be. It doesn't make them good soloers, nor does does it really make them well liked in groups, despite the fact that they can also dps. Same with Wizards, they have a ton of utility, but I have no doubt I could out level one on a mage as knowledge/efficiency/minimizing downtime is the most important thing when leveling up solo. Wizards also are despised in groups, despite having a ton of useful tools. |
I don't spin my opinions as facts. People just think everything that they disagree with are opinions, even when something like math, videos, etc. can objectively prove it. There have been many times where I have been accused of this, even when the math or a video objectively proves otherwise lol. I am sorry people think Everquest is magical somehow, and they can make their opinions work, even though the game is based on an objective set of rules.
Cothing a puller to clear agro is rarely done or necessary in group situations. I don't think I have ever seen a group actively seek a mage for this purpose, unless there are some very specific camps that need it. I am not saying Mages can't do things other than DPS in a group, but generally speaking that's how most groups handle having a Mage. As for muzzles, they are a nice increase in DPS for sure, but this again assumes your group actually needs it. Same with DS, Mages do not have a monopoly on DS, so it isn't like groups often seek them out for that purpose. Mages do not have a monopoly on resist debuffs either.
You are correct that you could level to 60 without CC or utility. But having it allows you to do more camps and also gain more money/items along the journey. Just because you can level to 60 a bit faster doesn't mean you end up in the same place as someone who had better access to camps in terms of having equal money/gear. If you level up to 60 faster and then have to spend more time farming, you end up at the same place in terms of total time spent.
I would take a Necro over a Mage 99% of the time. They still have good DPS and have a lot of utility to help increase kill speed, pull when the puller needs to AFK, etc. You really don't need mega DPS to have a great group.
I think you misunderstood my rogue point. Their toolkit is very simple, and improved by knowledge because you can get the best DPS possible by knowing which items to get and which haste breakpoints will help increase the amount of times you can backstab. Conversely, summoning items get less and less useful as knowledge increases.
Rangers, Paladins, SK, Rogues, and Wizards are lower on the totem pole for sure. I don't think I have ever claimed otherwise. But again, Mages are lower because they don't have good utility overall. Rangers, Paladins, SK's, and Wizards can solo more camps than a Mage could, and they are still great in groups. Rogues are the only ones who can't do this, but again Mages are mostly used for DPS in groups, so you need to compare rogue DPS to Mage DPS to see which one wins out. I wouldn't put as much emphasis on soloing for a rogue as a Mage, because everybody should know that they need to group more for a Rogue. Since Mages can solo much better, soloing becomes a bigger part to consider.